[deleted]

Yep, the best mods are completely and utterly invisible

That's pretty much the mods here then. They rarely removing anything, and the only drama they're involved with is when people pick it with them.

What was the reason behind the departure?

DISCLAIMER: In this comment I am quoting from a PM from sunshine-x, NOT from modmail (which would be a violation of reddit policy). I don't think sunshine-x, being the open and honest person he has always tried to be, would object to me sharing this with you. It's very creepy and everyone should know about it. He was just in a hurry to close this chapter and GTFO (as you'll see below).

So,....

What was the reason behind his departure?

Several things, actually. He and I have been having some long chats both publicly and in PM.

MrDong has the important part right (at least for the sake of sunshine-x and his family). However, there are some other points he mentioned to me in our discussions.

To verify what I'm writing, below, feel free to see his last (and only remaining) comment in his overview here: /u/sunshine-x

In the r/InternetAMA, he and I had a long discussion about what the mods are/aren't doing, what they can/can't do, what they should/shouldn't do, etc. Apart from the one or two comments he made a few short weeks ago in the frenzy of drama, he's been a very diplomatic individual to me. And, if you look through my comment history you'll see that very aspect of his character in the portions of his messages which I quoted in my own responses (almost all of his comments I quoted, for what it's worth).

That having been said, ...

The following is copy/pasted from the last PM I received from him late yesterday evening (around 8pm or so, US/Canada central or eastern time).

• seeing VA get exposed like that gave me concern the same could happen to me, as a mod of /r/conspiracy, and though I'm not antisemitic and have done my best to manage that issue, mere association with a group seen as being antisemitic exposes me and my family to too great a risk

VA == violentacrez who was doxed by gawker. sunshine-x lives in a country where anti-Semitism is illegal. I'm pretty sure this is the biggest issue he's concerned about, above and beyond all else... well, except the 10.x thing, below.

• I've re-read our discussion re mods in general, and agree with you. The community will either manage the issue, or not. Either way, it's something mods cannot control given their current minimal influence over a subreddit.

This is the discussion I mentioned above, in the r/InternetAMA, and the final comment he left in his overview.

• The 10.x IP are no bug, IMHO. Hope to prove that out shortly. I don't like that someone has had their feet in my shoes, so to speak.

Someone accessed his account a few weeks ago when someone was impersonating HGT with Windows 7 screencaps. He requested the admins to investigated the specific users in question, instead they investigated him? Not sure how that worked, actually. But someone at reddit logged into his account from a private (internal) IP address.

For the non-technical-savvy, 10.x.x.x addresses are reserved for local area networks. An access from such an address means it was accessed from the LAN (somewhere AT reddit.com HQ and/or amazon's server clusters or whatever), not from the internet. It only happened once, but it happened at a very suspicious time.

In my response to him about this specific issue in previous PMs, I mentioned several possible options for how this could have happened - none of which was a "bug", all of which were nasty, ugly, covert, sneaky, underhanded options, most notably related to recent US Gov't actions to enable them to have backdoor access to all social media.

• I feel like a change. Reading reddit as much as I do takes my mind off higher priorities, like advancing my career and my hobbies.

I left him a response indicating that I hoped he'd join me on Everquest when I get my new PC (hopefully in a week or two).

And, his closing statements...

I'm deleting all my posts and comments because they're too difficult to sift through for identifiable information, and because it feels cathartic to do. A bug in my script has temporarily delayed this, but will be fixed as soon as the kids are sleeping.

He showed me the perl script he used to process this procedure, 500 comments at a time, and 500 submissions at a time once the comments were finished. It was actually a very clean perl script. I don't understand why he's so ashamed of his perl-ing capabilities.

And, then the last thing in that message was...

Make sense?

I knew immediately that he was bailing out on reddit and the exact reasons why.

And I have never respected anyone more than I respect sunshine-x for this decision. His family deserves him.

Wow! Thanks for the reply! :)

Got a link to that script?

It appears sunshine-x hasn't completely disappeared. You should contact him directly. I asked him if he was offended about me posting the PM contents, and he said he wasn't - in fact he was glad I did (as I thought he would be). However, I also know he's somewhat protective of his code (seems, IMO, more along the lines of timidity, rather than protectiveness, but still). Without explicit permission (and I'm not going to ask, because I really don't give a shit), I won't share it.

(and I'm not going to ask, because I really don't give a shit

That's harsh, you could have just left that off and said no...

Sorry about that. Allow me to rephrase.

No. I will not share someone else's Intellectual Property without their permission. And, I will not seek that permission when I have no need for it, myself.

That sounds much better :) and thanks anyway.

Correction, btw. It's a python script, not perl. sunshine-x recently started learning python.

Me too

Hello. /r/GoodbyeWorld

Thanks!!!

Tell your friends.

I will!

You should know that SubredditDrama hаs wrіtten about you.

A moderator in /r/conspiracy has stepped down because of the subreddit's association with anti-semitism; The reaction is just what you would expect.

As of now, yоur comment has a score оf 11 (13|2). The submission has a score of 20 (41|21).

SRD has no еnforced rules against invading or voting in linked threads, and threads linked by them havе а tendency to suddenly acquіre large amounts of votes and derailіng comments.

^{Tired of SRD's invasions and downvoting? Join us at /r/SRDBroke!}

also got removed.

So one day after doing an IAMA for r/conspiracy he quits being a Mod because of threats or intimidation that he will be reported in his country for being associated with so called anti-semtic information?

So basically is worried about his freedom, safety, and well being?

I think it's the 10.x issue in combination with that, yeah.

This is all very disturbing don't you think?

none of which was a "bug", all of which were nasty, ugly, covert, sneaky, underhanded options, most notably related to recent US Gov't actions to enable them to have backdoor access to all social media.

That kind of says it all. We are moving towards becoming a ruthless police surveillance state, that only allows "approved speech". Looks like sunshine-x's country is already there.

"Disturbing" is one way of describing it. Another is "not surprising", considering the topics he and I discuss in PM. (I've discussed them with you in PM, too, but nowhere near the same extent, due to your self-confessed lack of understanding of the subject matter. Make sense now?)

It is starting to now. The fact is we are all being manipulated by a ruthless and subversive group of people.

[deleted]

Who are you afraid of, mate?

[deleted]

I understand that. Would there be anyone who would target you over your association with /r/conspiracy?

Conspiratard, governments, socialist, capitalist, and every other group that doesn't appreciate being put under the magnifying glass.

[deleted]

It seems almost inevitable given the nature of the evolving domestic intelligence paradigm that by trickle down eventually all forums of significant draw are at risk to the whimsy arbitration by "hate group watchdogs." There will be a time when we as a community have to make some serious decisions about how to resist and defend our mods. However, the infiltration of our community will no doubt continue, so I am on the fence about how much commitment is worth it. All the same, if we let these forces win by this mechanism, it will be vetted for them as a useful one, and will become standard operations. In any case, I hope that this dox scandal encourages the conversation on anonymity and the philosophical questions of Internet behavior.

There will be a time when we as a community have to make some serious decisions about how to resist and defend our mods rights.

FTFY. Because you (generic, not specific) can't say "mods are people just like us" and then turn around and give them special privileged status. There are people out there who'd like to out a great many commenters and submitters, as well. We should be protecting OURSELVES, across the board.

I agree,

All commenters, submitters and mods should be protected from this kind of attack. As nasty as it seems to ban a website reddit wide, what other recourse do we have? It's true that Gawker wasn't directly censoring anyone from speaking their mind, but in the same breath if they intimidate people out of speaking by threatening to out them publicly then why do they even deserve to play here?

Just like SRS who happily has a home to spew their hatred of all things that don't align with the cult of feminism, they active want to purge reddit of opposing view points. It shouldn't be tolerated for the sake of the greater good.

Now we've lost sunshine-x to this witch hunt, I hate to say "I told you so" mods... but I did.

Anti-censorship is great. Its fucking fabulous. But it doesn't mean NO RULES and NO LEADERSHIP.

But it doesn't mean NO RULES

I have arguments against this.

But it doesn't mean [...] NO LEADERSHIP.

I concur. However, I don't necessarily (as I mentioned in another comment) believe that having one's name in the mod box makes one a leader.

Here is the discussion which convinced sunshine-x that moderators are not having any positive effect, cannot have any positive effect, and never will be able to have any positive effect (in the current paradigm). They are my comments which include quotes from his (now deleted) comments. Pay extra close attention to the arguments about rules - and shed your personal bias. This is pure logic, friend. And logic will win this, regardless of whether or not you agree with the facts.

There are a few people (a small handful) who have figured out who I am. And, who have figured out that (despite my sometimes abrasive means of dealing with certain issues) I do have the best interests of this community at heart. I have free speech at the top of my agenda.

So, while I agree with much of what you've said about defending everyone, that's not what the current mods are doing in their current approach. And, while I know first-hand that they all want this to be a great subreddit (don't we all? at least all of the regular, loyal participants?), you can't force it to be great with moderator tools (the ban hammer against people who aren't behaving the way you'd like).

It's an interesting idea, I must admit.

I just don't have the same faith as you that all hell wouldn't break lose in the absence of moderation.

Remember how bad the meme pollution was before rule #8?

I think rules are important to shape the community, and without that shape then we just become another shapeless blob of ideological vomit where people with something to say get shat on for "being anti Semitic" or racist or stupid or GASP a conspiracy theorist.

I think we fundamentally disagree on this but I'm not shitting on the idea. It would be interesting to see how a mod free conspiracy community of 80k users worked out.

Someone, I won't mention any names, said this once, possibly in modmail or something, back when several people were selected to become r/conspiracy moderators:

"Welcome to the world of having a target painted on your chest, back, and forehead."

It won't go away, regardless of whether or not I agree/disagree with you, like/dislike you, trust/distrust you. That target is part of the official moderator uniform.

i thought you were resigning a month ago?

What are you scared of? Didn't you dox yourself?

[deleted]

I've already changed quite a few of my settings and screen names.

Smart move. :)

Such pernicious little men. Don't let them label you or marginalize you.

So he's a spineless pussy. Got it.

Use of his spare time, he's a family man and chose to moderate originally to help out the community. He's one of the good guys and hopefully he will drop by from time to time.

There goes yet more balance.

Its truly a shame to see you go sunshine.

[deleted]

It's troubling, take it or leave it i can vouch that non of the current moderators are racist in any respects to my knowledge. Look at our current front page, look at top submissions - zero race hate.

We constantly ask readers to report inappropriate material and comments, what else can we do? The mods do this voluntarily, subreddit is growing and for that reason we are getting shit slung our way.

Sins is tired of it, so am i. The community has to work with us on these issues. sunshine is a big loss as far as i'm concerned and personally i'm not sure it's worth the effort any more.

The community has to work with us on these issues.

I humbly request that you revisit the comments I made in the r/InternetAMA about how to get the community involved. I honestly believe that this community is capable of self-policing, but that the (current) moderators aren't actually helping that happen. The current problem is the false-trust relationship that currently exists (this is the point I want you to revisit in the ama). The mods (9000sins quite often) keep saying "we're on top of things. trust us.", when... in actual fact, you're not (not because you don't want to be, but because it's not possible - these are social problems which have existed since the dawn of man and they cannot be solved with technological authority).

On a related note (re the antisemitism issue), I've been taking some heat over this comment, which I still feel is a troublesome issue. We've put great effort into making a distinct separation between persons of Judaic heritage/faith and the global Zionist agenda. And that post (in my opinion) blurred that distinction all over again - i.e., not only are we not allowed to be antisemitic, but we're not allowed to be antizionist either because that's the same thing (the implication being that there are some "totally innocent" Zionists). WTF? It's a no-win situation on this topic. Any opposition to the Israeli political agenda (beating the war drums against Iran/Islam) is forbidden?

This is just one more example of why I'm making plans to retire my remaining years to Everquest and let the world go to hell in a hand basket.

EDIT: tl;dr: we're not allowed to talk about Jews, we're not allowed to talk about international banksters, and we're not allowed to talk about Zionists, because all of those things are lumped into the perception of antisemitism. <-- This is a rigged game.

EDIT2: For some of you fogies/geezers/crones out there, here's a song originally written by Laura Nyro (you'd be surprised at all the stuff she wrote that became hugely popular) and originally performed by Peter Paul and Mary (serious political activists) -- performed here by the group which took it to the top, Blood, Sweat, and Tears -- And When I Die.

I'm making plans to retire my remaining years to Everquest and let the world go to hell in a hand basket.

Ditto

Refresh. I added EDIT2.

Honestly, I think the 10.x issue is just as important. reddit lurking around (or allowing others to lurk around) in our personal accounts.

Would you like me to sing Aloha oe'?

good riddance.

[deleted]

Hear, hear! You forgot supercede though, 9000's and sunshines bastard child.

9000sins will never leave. Even when he said he was leaving. He is here to haunt you forever! Bwahahahahaha

It appears sunshine-x hasn't completely disappeared. You should contact him directly. I asked him if he was offended about me posting the PM contents, and he said he wasn't - in fact he was glad I did (as I thought he would be). However, I also know he's somewhat protective of his code (seems, IMO, more along the lines of timidity, rather than protectiveness, but still). Without explicit permission (and I'm not going to ask, because I really don't give a shit), I won't share it.