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I too appreciate it. I'm pretty sure I've been labeled as a shill on here by a few people because I ask questions about theories that people come up with. It's really odd for the people that post saying question everything don't believe what you're told you ask one question about a hole or clarification in their theory and it's shut the fuck up you government pawn.

I have learned the drugs and the CIA go hand in hand. The US gov. does not even try to hide it anymore.

We have been in Afghanistan for 10+ years. Around 90% of the world's heroine comes from Afghanistan. In the last 10 years drug exports out of the country haven't gone down at all. How is that possible when American soldiers are patrolling around it and essentially guarding it. Who is letting it through? How are the drugs getting out of Afghanistan?

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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Afghanistan_opium_poppy_cultivation_1994-2007b.PNG

Amazing.

1. Afghanistan cultivation of poppies drops to almost 0.

2. U.S. invades

3. Poppy cultivation nearly triples in 5 years.

Thank you for this information!

hence why we are still in afghanistan stealing their opium fields. Same with the invasion of Laos, Cambodia, and Vietnam during the 60s/70s. Harvesting narcotics.

it's why karzai comes out saying that the u.s is working alongside with the taliban. because what he is saying is actually true.

There are incorrect assumptions and conclusions all over the place. No proof of any grand conspiracy.

why are we being bombarded with this information now, and not 2, 5, 10 years ago?

Have you been asleep? These stories have been going on for a long time. There were the kidnappings in the 70s which were huge news. The axe murder incidents, the s. korean director kidnapped in the late 70s, the signing and breaking of the non proliferation pact.

This has been talked about for a very long time. There doesn't need to be a grand show about the DPRK. We've been toe to toe with them for decades.

These stories have been going on for a long time

There has undeniably been more press coverage in the last few months than any extended period in the past. Just look at the front page of reddit! North Korea and their atrocities are on everyones mind, which is exactly what they want to happen. Make no mistake, we are preparing for war.

As far as a grand conspiracy, the fact that North Korea is run by criminal drug interests should be enough to question the isolation of the DPRK. Drug cartels have no national allegiance. I understand there is no smoking gun for this argument, which is why I say, "decide for yourself"

Are you 15 years old? There was way more coverage when like 30% of north koreans were starving to death in the mid-90s. Clinton even agreed to build them a light water reactor at one point.

There was also enormous coverage when they reactivated their nuke program in 2003 and when they tested their first successful nuclear device back around 2006.

did you just start reading the news yesterday?

North Korea has always made all kinds of threats for years. This didn't all of a sudden blow up the past week or so. They are known to make retarded statements, and then the U.S news picks it up to get the war drumbeats going.

The NK regime are nothing more than puppets to the Chinese, and the global criminal enterprise we call the illuminati.

In essence, countries like North Korea and Iran are 'controlled opposition.' aka 'Hegelian Dialectics.' They have to eat the whole pie you know, not just take half of it.

I agree with you completely, but IT IS ABSOLUTELY TRUE that the rhetoric and coverage has been stepped up significantly, recently.

oh without a doubt. i agree with you the rhetoric has gone up again. NK is firmly in control of the illuminati (occult secret societies).

And it's not just NK under the influence of occult societies whether they be Chinese societies or western secret societies. I mean look at South Korea, for cryin out loud. They call their white house the 'Blue House.'

Then you have all the occult references being spread throughout their movies, music, and tv shows just like in America.

Yeah again I agree 100%. When I make posts I try to avoid tying things into the illuminati because I feel it turns people new to conspiracies off, who would otherwise be receptive to an argument. The hope is that they continue to do research and stumble upon this information when they are ready.

Now that you say that, I was actually hesitant to say the term 'illuminati' over the fear I'd lose people.

As long as it's getting out there. that is all that matters. A lot of my buddies are waking up to it and it's sobering to see.

NK is firmly in control of the illuminati (occult secret societies)

I don't get this.

That probably has to do with the fact that NK is threatening NUCLEAR WAR. Of course this is newsworthy.

'controlled opposition.' aka 'Hegelian Dialectics.'

lol. Go read a few (real, non-conspiracy) books on the subject please. You don't understand it.

There has undeniably been more press coverage in the last few months than any extended period in the past. Just look at the front page of reddit! North Korea and their atrocities are on everyones mind, which is exactly what they want to happen. Make no mistake, we are preparing for war.

How exactly? Any big carrier movemetns? Any large scale troop movements? No. This is the same old same old bullshit we've seen over and over again.

But If you are confident lets make it official. I'll bet $1,000 in one year that we aren't at war with the DPRK.

http://longbets.org/ We can set it up and put the money in escrow. Winner take all.

Again, these threats and this sort of stuff has happened over and over and over again. Either you weren't paying attention the past 15 years, or you're too young to remember.

the fact that North Korea is run by criminal drug interests

How exactly? They are run by the military, not criminal drug interests. If there are drugs being produced in the DPRK, it's entirely with the knowledge of the government.

Also, it's worth noting that the book you mention does not once link the CIA to the DPRK for drug enterprises. It talks about other well known programs, but there is no link to the DPRK.

Why would the need to? If the CIA and the DPRK were in cahoots none of that is necessary. Just good ol saber rattling would be plenty.

Your conclusion is also in conflict with itself. Why would the CIA conspire with the DPRK. To go against China? WTF? Or you think China and the US and DPRK?

This is nonsensical.

military, not criminal drug interests

These are one and the same. Intelligence agencies, an arm of the military, are the largest drug runners in the world. This was the point made in "The Politics of Heroin", and by multiple whistleblowers.

Why would the CIA conspire with the DPRK

For profits. The drug running will continue after US intervention, as it did with Afghanistan and Vietnam (increased in both instances, actually).

If the US, NATO and UN aren't involved in the DPRK within a couple years, it will be because they found an excuse to invade Syria or Iran instead. They need war to keep the gears churning. If the rhetoric surrounding North Korea was heavy 15 years ago (and I was indeed young then, 8 or 9), it was likely a similar situation. They found someone else to invade, in Afghanistan and Iraq.

p.s. I am not interested in monetary bets. Donating 100$ to charity or something like that, I could get behind.

These are one and the same. Intelligence agencies, an arm of the military, are the largest drug runners in the world. This was the point made in "The Politics of Heroin", and by multiple whistleblowers.

This is not true at all. They are separate and they compete for resources and power.

The problem with some of these more vast and coordinated conspiracies is that they demand the highest level of coordination and cooperation which hardly happens at the national level much less internationally. If you read the most interesting manning releases it supports that over and over and over again.

You don't need war for profiteering to occur. The cold war saw a massive expansion in the period of non-combat. It also gives you plenty of money for toys instead of spending to support expensive weapons systems which are the bread and butter of the large defense contractors.

Even more lucrative for many are the other contracts with other countries when the economies of scale for weapons systems kicks into gear. They can make a whole lot more arming Iraq, Turkey, SAE, UAE, Qatar over the next two decades than they do taking out Iran over the next 3-4 years.

I think your basic premise of war profiteering is in conflict with your other conclusions.

In all likelyhood, North Korea will be linked to Iran and The Powers That Be will push for two birds with one stone.

This is what makes the most sense to me. They already co-operate with each other's nuclear programs.

I'm not sure about the whole thing. I don't know enough to get into specifics, but i don't know if you saw the thread of the front page the other day, asking South Koreans how they felt about the situation. They basically said nothing has changed, and everything is carrying on as normal. It certainly seems like the Western media is totally overplaying the situation, even if it has escalated somewhat.

I'm not sure why they're doing it. Personally, i think it's far too convenient that Iran's 3 biggest allies (NK, Venezuela, Syria) are having some serious issues for it to be total coincidence.

On the other hand, North Korea is a crazy fucking place. If anyone has earned the name 'rogue state', it's them. Do i think the threat is being overplayed? Totally. Is it overly convenient? Absolutely. Would it really be a bad thing if the South Koreans resigned the North to the history books? Not at all.

I guess we'll have to wait and see; although i very much doubt there will be a sizeable US presence on the ground, even if the situation does get volatile. Could be wrong though.

The cooperation has more to do with "the enemy of my enemy" logic than some massive behind-the-scenes orchestration. There was actually very little cooperation until they were all put on the "Axis of Evil" and force-separated from the "world community" for disagreeing with US policy...

Oh i agree. It's not exactly some covert operation, it's probably more like a "hey, look at my new friend" type deal, but they still consider themselves allies.

While I appreciate a well executed arguement I think you're failing to take into account one thing. No one on this planet could ever tell the United States military how to operate in a pawn like fashion. The US may be corrupt and evil grossly in debt and everything but the US miltary can bring serious hurt to the entire planet if it wanted to do so.

I understand the sentiments but disagree! I am on my phone and can't link, but google CIA involvement in foreign coups. There have been 30!! since the CIA was founded and they consistently overthrow democratically elected leaders in favor of authoritarians who protect economic interests. In this sense our intelligence agencies and special forces are essentially acting as pawns for corporate interests, with little to no input or oversight from elected officials. As far as full scale involvement goes, Vietnam, the Gulf War, Iraq War, were all largely motivated by economic interests despite official military and government officials telling us otherwise.

There is Guatemala, Operation Condor (all South America), failed attempt at Cuba...

Kind of a rant, but here goes:

Very interesting argument, but there is no conclusive proof that NK is growing poppies for heroine. North Korea's ideology is completely about self sufficiency, and very little activity goes on that is not "beneficial to the population", "beneficial to the state", or both.

North Koreans are starving because they are forced to grow "north korean" food on north korean soil (not great, hard winters) with north korean tools (REALLY not great), and a large part of what they do grow is appropriated by the state, not leaving very much for the people themselves.

In terms of the state profiting from illegal activities, right now the North Korean state makes the best counterfiet money seen anywhere in the world (see Superdollars), while also engaging in other legal (and semi-legal) enterprises to generate additional slush funds (look up Room 39 - the "organization" that manages these slush funds).

Much has been made about suposed links to drugs and drug trafficing, but I have seen virtually no CONCLUSIVE proof of it, especially when drugs like Opium & Heroine are produced large scale at utterly cheap prices nearby in the golden triangle all the way across to the middle east. It seems like too much of a market for them to compete on, let alone in a big way that no one has concretely caught them doing it (unlike in Burma & Afghanistan where poppy production is in full public view, not even hidden).

This latest round of "drama" comes from the South Koreans electing a right wing nut as their new president (Korean Sarah Palin if you will), who immediately ramps up the sabre rattling, along with the US, to quite alarming levels. Are the North Koreans going to get pissed? Fuck Yes! Imagine if the chinese, russians and North Koreans all started a massive, coordinated war exercise drill in what SK claimed to be it's territorial waters. Fit would hit the shan HARDCORE.

In this case, all NK is doing in retaliation is launching it's own military training excercise, at the same time, but confined within it's own territory. Completely within it's rights as a soverign state to do, but of course we all know US is always looking for another war to fight, and would just love the opportunity. War in Korea would be quite good for business costly.

This latest round of "drama" comes from the South Koreans electing a right wing nut as their new president (Korean Sarah Palin if you will), who immediately ramps up the sabre rattling, along with the US, to quite alarming levels. Are the North Koreans going to get pissed? Fuck Yes! Imagine if the chinese, russians and North Koreans all started a massive, coordinated war exercise drill in what SK claimed to be it's territorial waters. Fit would hit the shan HARDCORE.

Thanks for this insight. And I agree with the state appropriation, they grow enough for the elite and the military and the rest scrape by. I cannot be 100% certain about the heroin claims but there certainly is some evidence.

In terms of the state profiting from illegal activities, right now the North Korean state makes the best counterfiet money seen anywhere in the world (see Superdollars), while also engaging in other legal (and semi-legal) enterprises to generate additional slush funds (look up Room 39 - the "organization" that manages these slush funds).

More good points.

North Korea's ideology is completely about self sufficiency, and very little activity goes on that is not "beneficial to the population", "beneficial to the state", or both.

This is the statement I do not quite agree with, if drugs have been caught on a North Korean vessel headed for Australia, as I think was mentioned in my wikipedia link, there is clearly involvement in drugs at some level, and the purpose would not be for the populace or the state, but likely individuals

This is the statement I do not quite agree with, if drugs have been caught on a North Korean vessel headed for Australia, as I think was mentioned in my wikipedia link, there is clearly involvement in drugs at some level, and the purpose would not be for the populace or the state, but likely individuals

Agree. If drugs are found on N Koreans, then they most likely came from North Korea. I'm not saying there aren't drugs there, I'm just saying that I don't think they capitalize on them NEAR as heavily (or as singularly) as places like Afghanistan/Myanmar/Laos do (a source of profit, as opposed to THE source of profit).

If your interested in other "semi-legal" activities that the NK's do, look up an international resteraunt chain called "Pyongyang". They are owned and operated by the NK government (allegedly Room 39, although they do sometimes have local partners where they operate), and staffed by North Koreans. The workers wear north korean clothing, are "chosen" to serve at these resteraunts abroad, and are never allowed to leave the resteraunt (they sleep under the tables at night). I actually visited one in Phnom Penh, Cambodia once. All the prices are in USD, and it's quite expensive (~$40 for lunch in a country where people barely earn that in a good month). I've heard they operate worldwide, and they are one of many sources the NK's use to obtain legitimate foreign currency...

Am I missing something here? Two people had a slight difference of opinion and neither one has insulted the other... am I on the right internet?

Also, thank you for some good points to research, both of you.

I was literally just thinking today about North Korea being a test for the rest of the world.

Jonestown with national sovereignty!!

Apparently there's even a good deal of Japanese gangsterism behind the scenes in NK. SK as well but in much different ways. The Japanese are in the meth game in NK.

If invading NK was profitable at all, it would have happened already.

Okay how do you jump from the government runs drugs to it's an "inside job." News flash the US gov't runs drugs, the British empire was based on the drug trade, etc etc drugs and power are nothing new.

Then branch out, as the statement could apply to nearly every war since Napoleon.

Since universal suffrage, where the manipulation of people became far more important than before.

North Korea has had violent rhetoric and abused its people for decades. Why are we being bombarded with this information now, and not 2, 5, 10 years ago?

We have been bombarded with North Korea "stuff," for lack of a better term, when something significant happens.

Check out the Google Trends graph of "North Korea" Google searches. They spike every time something happens, and otherwise maintain a relatively constant level.

Recently, some important events have occurred. NK "revoked" their cease fire with the South, Dennis Rodman wormed his way to a visit with their President, and their state news has indicated they are going to test a nuclear weapon. Those things have caused a recent surge. In a few weeks or months it will die back down.

It has everything to do with our news cycle, and nothing to do with some giant military-industrial complex conspiracy.

i always felt like north korea w as being kept alive just to keep its current slave model alive, in case (or when) the west needs to emulate someone in the future

OP, i suggest researching which surviving countries do not have privately owned central banks issuing the supposedly-sovereign currency for their nation. It will be another 'dot' to help connect things.

They look exaclty like nazis before ww2.

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While I like how you gave sources, I hugely disagree.

Firstly, whenever there is war SOMEONE SOMEWHERE always profits. This isn't a new concept. All the way back to the first person hitting another guy over the head with a club, whenever two people fight someone will profit. If we're suggesting that WWII was faked then you really have to ask yourself why did the war end the way it did? Surely rather than a nuke the long drawn out war with Japan would have not only been more profitable, but the lack of nuclear weapons would have made a war between USA and Russian inevitable. If anything every day we're entering a more and more peaceful time overall.

And yes, kim is a puppet. But not to the CIA or illuminati, but to the military elite in NK. Not to mention outside of the 'war machine' (More on that later), why the hell would America want a nation that makes China look good on a international scale?

The reason we are only hearing about all this stuff now? Because it's now that North Korea trying to wave its dick around. Nuclear attack sounds more interesting than 'Country does terrible things to its people, but we can't stop it without another war', and so the information is only being spread around now.

You're really overestimating how much money the 'war machine' makes from these wars. The real money makers are the machinery, but a war with NK would last a month, tops, like the war with Iraq and Afghanistan did. Not to mention that a 'join MILITARY OF EVILZ' is stupid considering that only America really spends that much on military in the first place, and while the USA military is due to corruption (Or as you yanks call it, 'lobbying'), it's the good old fashioned local corruption.

Also the linking it to Iran is retarded. The main differences between Iran and NK is Iran is still supported by China and Russia, meaning an invasion is 100% out of the question without Iran itself doing something like nuking or invading another country. NK on the other hand, has screwed up enough to make even China wash its hands of the country.

Here's the thing. Countries have been able to screw themselves up this badly without American help for the past 7 thousand years. Not every action that happens is a conspiracy. And while your 'solution' is technically correct, so are the theories that it's actually aliens doing all this, or me titty fucking your mum is creating vibrations that cause Kim to do all this. All three of these are 'technically' valid solutions, however realistically it's a simple case of a rogue runaway state believing its own hype created by the dominant ruling military elite in the country.

Firstly, whenever there is war SOMEONE SOMEWHERE always profits

This statement shouldn't be used to dismiss my argument, but validate it. Without private enterprise pushing for conflict, the world would be a much more peaceful place.

Countries have been able to screw themselves up this badly without American help for the past 7 thousand years.

Much of the suffering and corruption in the world today is the direct result of deliberate destabilization from the Western world. Much of the terrorism can be attributed to the CIA. The wikipedia page of Operation Gladio is only the tip of an iceburg of arming radical and dangerous groups throughout the world and spanning decades to present day. Much of the economic devastation can be linked to CIA coups that are irrefutably protecting corporate interest and neoliberalism at the expense of the citizens of that country. Most of the problems in this world can be linked to Western power structure, military and economic, hegemony!

If we're suggesting that WWII was faked then you really have to ask yourself why did the war end the way it did

Because Europe was devastated and the United States, along with Russia, emerged as the sole world powers. This was golden for The Powers That Be because our military industrial complex has been used vastly for the protection of the interests of the elite, and the convenient enemy of communism provided plenty of manufactured support for militarization and patriotism.

If anything every day we're entering a more and more peaceful time overall.

But are we really? The United States and the United Nations are occupying more and more countries every month. The US has military bases in 63 countries and we are right now deploying troops to 35 more countries in Africa!!

You're really overestimating how much money the 'war machine' makes from these wars.

Every dollar spent by every nation is directly coming from a privately owned central bank, and then those nations owe the central banks back that money, at interest! The Powers That Be make immense amounts of money off of wars.

Also the linking it to Iran is retarded

Is it really? The media is doing it every day.

High five!!

One of your main sources is the dailymail. Seriously, need I say more?

The context of my linking to the daily mail was to show the quotes from officials and acquaintances of Un. Google any of the quotes to find many more sources that list them.

I think there needs to be more argument in this sub. I have just Ccome here through random and all it is, is a bunch of guys rubbing each other and groaning to the same beat. Any comment that has a conflicting logical argument, well there normally is not one but they get downvoted to fuck and back.

"a bunch of guys rubbing each other". Isn't that most of reddit anyway? I get what you're saying but this sub is like any other sub our there. From what I've heard, r/conspiracy used to have more relevant debates, it's just been overrun by the hivemind. I wish it wasn't so.

I disagree, I read bikes, android, environmental pages and people will allow criticisms and respond in the correct manor. 'Lovely bike but I dislike the color scheme' 'well I guess its down to personal preference, how would you do it'. Not 'I disagree' ' down vote go away'.

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then gtfo

or tits.

Nope, not even tits. Just GTFO

Then I`m struggling to work out why you came here let alone posted... though it does highlight an issue I have some concerns over, the fact that the adults of the world are being dumbed down and simply dont care about important issues like this, but, will vote on what flavour of crisps walkers (non uk = Lays) are going to put out next, or obsessing over a dancing pony from an advert (non uk = commercial). That is why illegal wars and such like are so easy for them (whoever "they" are) to get away with, people simply dont give a shit until it affects their ability to watch tv and buy shiny things.

I'm not "dumbed down", I just don't care.

Poor child.