Guilty or not, the mob mentality and blood lust in this country scares the shit out of me.

Word.

Excel.

PowerPoint.

Access.

OneNote.

Outlook.

And with our powers combined we are MS OFFICE PROFESSIONAL 2003!

What about Publisher?

Nobody mentioned Encarta.

Charmander.

They're behind you. Just saying. I am sure this is a joke, I don't get.

Hey guys don't forget about me: Microsoft Draw.

Thunderbird

Paint

Project

Clippy

Front Page

Bob

edit I'm glad that at least one other person remembers Microsoft Bob.

Front Page.

Silverlight.

Bob.

Exchange.

Publisher.

You've gone too far.

Oh sure, everybody just wants to hate on Publisher!

Publisher

Visio.

Publisher.

Clippy!

Uh....Paint?

Tom Cruise.

Internet explorer!

don't forget Lync!

Publisher.

Outlook.

Outlook

The decline of /r/conspiracy

I did what I could

Paint.

Notebook

By your applications combined, I am MICROSOFT OFFICE!

Chicken nuggets.

One Mic?

Lync

Groove

Outlook

Upvote for capitalizing the P in point.

Publisher

please downvote this post and the one directly above; it's in the greater good of reddit.

Outlook.

I love that after this comment (the "I see what you did there" comment), you can observe a relatively linear decrease in upvotes as the thread continues.

Worksheet.

[deleted]

RichText.

OneNote

Adjective.

Letter.

Pixel

Photon

Quark.

Agreed. Maybe optimistic but I suspect it as more of an obnoxious, vocal minority. And I don't think the mob mentality is exclusive to the US.

Oh. I agree. It's worse in other countries. I've seen a lot of demonstrations, but not one like this.

I would have to argue that all humans are, in a general sense, evil motherfuckers.

meowth thats right

A hamster that meows...I smell a conspiracy.

It's a small minority of evil motherfuckers. They unfortunately control governments, media, and more.

George motherfucking Soros.

That's us.

Way I look at it: IF all humans are evil mofos, we can't trust anyone with the power to launch bombs and send armies (President, etc.). If humans are inherently good, we don't need to grant anyone the power to do so.

Could you name a worse first world country (other than Isreal if you want to count them in).

Is America still a first world country? I seriously gave up that belief when I found out our Boston bomber victims are responsible for their own medical bills. "It ain't me. I ain't no fortune one. I ain't no senator's son."

Yes, like when the find a "witch" in some parts of West Africa. Let's just say the whole village comes out for a barbecue.

At work after we close we have 5 minutes to wait around for our manager to lock up all the register money. All but two exclaimed a desire to just kill the suspect tonight.

I don't think it's "minority".

Democracy is mob rule- Socrates (iirc)

It is truly.

If you ask people if we are a republic or a democracy, guess what the overwhelming majority of sheep say?

"Democracy is two wolves and a sheep deciding what's for dinner" - ?

[deleted]

Well if it was 5 sheep and one wolf were voting on what's for dinner, that's still be one fat wolf.

American Werewolves in Boston. And his hair was perfect.

Not to put to fine a point on it. Say I'm the only bee in your bonnet. Lalalala.

the wolf convinces the sheep that they are sooo tasty, that the wolf cant be held responsible for eating them, and in fact sheouyld let him eat them.

Good thing we're a Republic, eh?

That we elect democratically ;)

I guess that really depends on what you think about the electoral college and "first past the post"

Might as well go back to the "fart vote" that I just invented while I'm typing this comment.

Ah, the good old days.

Indeed

This may give an unfair advantage to the lactose intolerant, though.

Still a democracy, retard.

Never said it wasn't, dipshit.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ochlocracy

But we don't live in a democracy in America, we are a constitutional republic

We are a "constitutional democratically electected republic"... Is what we're led to believe. However, IMO we are more of a oligarchy or plutocracy.

Tyranny of the majority

Good thing we're not a democracy then.

the mob mentality and blood lust in this country scares the shit out of me.

Glad I'm not the only one. It's like watching the two-minutes-of-hate with drunk idiots chanting U-S-A, U-S-A! wrapping themselves in flags. Why? An disturbed murderer has been taken into custody—nothing more.

What ever happened to the admiration of the British motto "Keep Strong, Carry On?" This cretin isn't worth wasting breath over, much less anything related to patriotism.

'Keep calm and carry on' is now a trade mark, it is despised here in Britain, but you know us, we shall stiff upper lip our way through anything. Tea?

Indeed, I've had to resort to telling myself to remaining relaxed whilst going about my daily business.

Just chill and do what you do

Not my kind of party. I can understand somewhat. But it ain't me, babe.

right there with you, so fascinated with the current image for the washington post

That's sickening, that dude is drinkin a beer watching this shit like it's a sports game.

No one in that picture will have an American flag on their house 6 months from now.

Because this is America?

I feel the same way. The crowd was willing to lynch the suspect right then and there! Whatever happened to innocent until proven guilty? It's disgusting how badly this country wants blood. We could so easily go back to colonial america circa 1600s where people burned woman who were merely accused of witchcraft or blasphemy.

When Osama was "killed" the behavior of so many citizens was vomitous.

"killed"

That's the funniest part: dude had been dead for a decade.

You have no proof of that.

And YOU have no proof that he was killed except for hearsay.

You're right: only logic.

I agree in principle, but it has nothing to do with "this country". Nations that don't experience/suffer from violence like this regularly all react the same way. It shocks them, scares them, makes them contemplate their own safety and mortality, and it all results in blood lust and a desire for vengeance before the facts have all presented themselves. Many react that way, wherever they live, but many feel like you do. Neither phenomenon knows borders.

Norway?

There was a small sect of society who vocalised that they wanted Breivik killed. But the overwhelming humanity we saw even right after the massacre really comes down to the way Norwegians see justice; it's centred around rehabilitation and measured by societal gain. Perhaps only in more individualistic societies - where retribution is the forethought - does sorry_to_say's argument stand true.

So absolutely true. Remarkable reflection on the human condition.

It reminds me of the days leading up to the Iraq invasion. That's the only time I've feared speaking out against what was going on in this country.

I'm feeling a lot of that tonight.

And you never know whos gonna be in the crosshair next for that bloodthirsty mob.

Fuckin scary is right

Could be me.

Why would it be you?

Because conspiracy

Because. Because I .....can't tell you what it's like to be different and pressed like ham. It ain't as hard as you think.

This is probably the worst subreddit of all. So long yall.

Come again?

Americans claim to be the authority on freedom and rights, but when shit falls over they are just one pitchfork away from a lynch mob.

They are a hypocrisy.

If only we could somehow harness its energy and use it for our own purposes oh wait thats politics.

Haha!

[deleted]

Well on terms of Reposts i would have to say Reddit and the House are about even. I mean really you just rename the bill Cispa and then it passes what is this like the 4th attempt?

in every aspect of our society

It's as old as the country itself. We just like to pretend it's all dressed up and civil now with all these "laws" we have.

this is the sentiment I most agree with!

Americans love to find and fight enemies whether they are guilty or not. This might be why we cannot pass any gun legislation.

All I heard yesterday was a bunch of people happy he was taken alive. Give some credit.

And I do. The comparison of this event with the manhunt of Officer Dormer is profound. I'm just sad that these kids came to a place where they could have everything and they end up, one dead, one in prison at 19. Fuck me, but that's sad, too. I always wanted a friend named Tamerlane.

if you were here for what happened you might understand the want/need to get this guy. someone who does what they did does not deserve to be treated like a human...when they placed bombs in a crowd they gave up their right to be treated civil

I get you. Still scary to me. Glad y'all are safe now.

I understand it may be scary...but i can guarantee you Monday was much scarier I witnessed it

No idiotic emotional reactions like yours are why we have due process. Did a horrible thing happen Monday? Yes. Was this guy part of that incident? Maybe even most likely but our prisons are full of truly innocent people who got caught up in emotional reactions and stereotyping ....

maybe? be real. they arent throwing out random pictures....do you fully understand what happened last night? most of this city wants him alive so he can be tried and brought to justice...but if you seriously think he may be innocent then theres something wrong with you. hopefully something like this never happens again, but if it does you better hope it doesnt happen in you community...then you might understand how we feel

How do you know he's guilty?

[deleted]

How does it scare people? Well, after 9/11 there were literally groups of people in the streets being interviewed saying they want 'towel heads' to be bombed irrespective of whether certain people did anything wrong or not. That kind or knee jerk anger and reaction helped to gain support for an illegal war in Iraq with young kids signing up for war because they wanted to 'strike back at the enemy'. Some of those kids are in a box six foot under ground now a long with 100,000's of other people that died either as a direct result of US and coalition forces or indirectly because of the sectarian violence that went out of control when the US turned up.

It scares people because it was so easy to whip people up into a murderous frenzy its a worrying possibility it might happen again.

And also, people wonder why bombs go off in the US and why its a target for terror. Why is there so much anti US sentiment? Ask yourself that question. Why is Germany or Japan not a target for multiple terror attacks?

The celebrations. Is this really time for a big party?

Right, because no other country celebrates what they perceive to be justice.

Indoctrination. Which is, in itself, evidence of mind control. Pls don't give me that quirk. You know it's the truth.

It should. Even sheep attack when frightened.

Implying it's different in other countries.

Lol

mob mentality and blood lust is in every country...has nothing to do with boarders has to do with people..

You're right.But I am a very introverted person. I lived most of my life on a mountain in Alaska. So, I don't identify with a region of New England. So, maybe my vote don't count.

Video games, hip hop, Hollywood should scare the shit outta you too then? Since that's the reason we have such a blood lust. Conditioning works well eh?

Art imitates life.

Yeah? See, I get that because I'm a little older than I used to be. I want you to explain that though to the impressionable young boys and girls who don't.

Art INFLUENCES life more than it imitates for them.

Scary to put yourself in his shoes if he is innocent. Everyone cheering for u getting captured and calling for your death. A living nightmare I imagine. To the most literal extent.

I was thinking of how I would treat him if I was a nurse or doctor. Made me sad.

Pussy. Dont drop bombs around and you will be fine.

I think it is all sentiment regarding exacting justice in a way that requires no consumption of resources and very little time. I personally believe that sending a person convicted of terror or mass murder to prison for the rest of their lives is not enough to ensure justice was served for survivors or families of the deceased.

Fortunately the US is a country where that behavior /u/Kilgore-troutdale describes toward a criminal never truly transpires.

Yeah I get wanting justice. But I don't have blood lust for even the most twisted serial killers. Evil makes me more sad than angry. Whenever I hear someone say let's torture him or anything... It's just so ugly to me.

But don't you realize that by hurting and/or killing the suspect, the people he killed will raise up from the dead, and those that were maimed will be completely healed?

I do now.

I see your point, but someone who would kill people in cold blood randomly scare me more. I agree in due process, but his brother was already processed. This kid will get his too.

I agree. I just have trouble getting happy about it today. But, I've been told if I lived in Boston I'd understand. Having a cigarette? Catch a terrorist. I'm flummoxed.

[deleted]

Namaste.

[deleted]

Things are black and white for you, or you're just stupid? I can't tell what you're point is.

Things are black and white for you, or you're just stupid? I can't tell what your point is.

And the 24hr media news cycle and social media mob mentality only amplifies this. This whole event has become more than just a marathon bombing and a manhunt.

I have nothing to be proud of behind this. I am just confused. Is the pressure for some Americans and Immigrants so great that your choices are doctor, or mad bomber?

I feel like I'm the only one. In my whole town that is scared of this and actually keeping a open mind to it all..

Today, I pity the man who knows how to think. It would be so much easier if I could just go crack some beers and fall in with a party/parade.

Ill go do something

Good answer. Very Zen.

[deleted]

An unruly populace of two, that we know of. How could two boys from another country bring out the beast in me? Or, better question, why?

It's a human element; it doesn't just belong to the US

Several people have mentioned this to me. I'm just waiting for the dead goats. Then I'll know the life I was striving for in 1968 is truly impossible.

it's not bloodlust if he and his brother shot a couple cops and threw pipe bombs during the pursuit. whether they planted the bombs or not, they're still guilty of murder.

Yea, it is. I can't celebrate a couple of kids losing their lives. One dead, and a nineteen year old living his life in prison. Don't care what they did. Not a time for me to celebrate.

oh is this what the post is about? i thought it was whether these guys deserve to be treated as though they were innocent until a trial can show they were guilty.

Well, one guy. maybe.

And this has been proven in a court of law?

you mean when someone shoots at a cop and the cop shoots back and kills him, it needs to be proven that's he's guilty? even a citizen has the right to shoot back if someone was shooting at him. also i'm pretty sure the fbi wanted those suspects alive if possible so they can interrogate them.

[deleted]

Lindsey Graham is already running his fat mouth saying he shouldn't get Miranda rights and should be treated as an enemy combatant. Sorry, he's a US citizen and therefore needs a trial (assuming he lives).

Legit question...if one is charged with a terrorist act, does that not constitute treason and thus you revoke your rights as a citizen? I don't think we will do this to this guy, but just wondering of the legal consequences.

Treason you go to open court. Enemy Combatant you go away quietly. What is new with the war on terror is citizens as enemy combatants.

Treason you go to open court. Enemy Combatant you go away quietly.

That is somewhat false. Hamdi v. Rumsfeld requires that all U.S. citizens labeled enemy combatants must be afforded with basic due process protections and also to be provided with an opportunity to challenge their designation as an enemy combatant. Not saying I agree with labeling U.S. citizens enemy combatants for acts committed domestically, just pointing out that you conveniently decided to side step some factual information.

The fact that a US citizen can be labelled an enemy combatant is quite frightening. Its gone from terrorist to enemy combatant making the US a battlefield. Enemy combatants is a term used on the battlefield, not in a country where the person is a citizen. He's a terrorist by definition by wanting to create fear to pursue a political, religious or ideological goal.

You want to keep a close eye on that term being used because it opens a can or worms with a lot of implications.

I love seeing actually facts in this sub. Thanks for sharing

false, he's conveniently leaving out the precedent set by Anwar Al-Awlaki and his son, who were both American citizens and were killed by drone strikes.

notably, this was lacking due process.

they were overseas, but it's not like it's all black and white here. they may afford him basic rights, or they may not. that being said, I've heard it said that you can best judge a society by how it treats it's 'untouchables' and we treat ours pretty bad. solitary confinement for 23/24hr a day, giving money hand over fist to the prison industrial complex for profits.. until we fix some of these things and maybe humanize the process a little like the Scandinavian countries (who've also lowered recidivism accordingly, since inmates are treated at least to some extent like human beings) we can only expect a revolving door.

it's a pretty sick world, but don't take refuted claims at face value either and do your research.

So now that we know he isn't being read his Miranda rights, is it still a fact?

edit- fogot leters

Does that still apply under the new NDAA?

Ex Parte Milligan is probably even more apt because Hamdi was captured in the field of combat in Afghanistan. A citizen captured in the US would have to be tried like any other citizen as José Padilla (eventually) was.

If that is true then we're really all in trouble.

My thoughts exactly. The way this has been treated should be an example of how any "domestic terrorism" case will be treated in the future. So far, I'd say we're fucked.

Yeah, now we really can't place bombs in crowded areas without having to deal with a whole lot of guff!

Yeah, now we really can't place bombs in crowded areas without having to deal with a whole lot of guff!

Wow! What an intelligent, well thought reply...fuck off.

Hey man, at least I don't eat poop.

Speechless

You mean... I could win an award for these comments?

Without anything linking him to being anti-American, it's not treason. He's just a dick who hates marathons and cops.

But you don't need to be anti-america to be charged with treason thought right? An act that can constitute as terrorism should do it.

Terrorism != Treason

*Terrorism does not equal treason

For those that don't know math terms

Edit repeated words

Why not? Why should this afford him extra rights?

It doesn't afford him anything extra, he is only afforded what everyone is afforded, which here I think is the presumption of innocence until proven guilty in court, and competent legal council. Nothing more than anyone would get if they were accused of murder.

[deleted]

This does not appear to be so, (at least in the US) "Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. No Person shall be convicted of Treason unless on the Testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court." US Constitution Article 3 section 3. So a confession can be enough to be tried for treason, but it is not required.

I don't think this is true. But if it were, I think it'd take away the abilities of our government to go after a US citizen going after us on behalf of a foreign entity.

He's actually right. Look up the law it's stupid as hell.

One of the brothers consistently quoted Quranic text, called for Jihad, etc. Even if that was only the dead one, the live one conspired with him.

The problem is who decides what is a terrorist act. Currently, since Bush, it is whomever holds the office of the presidency. With no legal standards, they can claim someone is an "enemy combatant" on a whim.

This is what trials & habeas corpus were created for.

But again, trials and habeas corpus are granted to US citizens. If we give it to someone we deem a terrorist, then we're expanding those rights further than they were intended. An enemy combatant has no choice but to be classified as such by Congress and the President. And it is.I understand your stance, I'm just struggling to see how it would work in a worse case scenario.

Trials and habeas corpus are granted to all citizens and non-citizens as a practical matter. Because if we arbitrarily decide that some foreign national doesn't get extended the courtesy of a trial or especially habeas corpus which is intended to prevent governments from "disappearing" individuals, then foreign governments will claim the right to disappear U.S. citizens based on U.S. precedent.

The Bill of Rights specifically refrains from any requirement that the rights are only to apply to U.S. citizens. The language is intentionally broad.

Most of these discussions confuse "being a non-citizen" with "being an illegal resident". There's a vast grey area between them of tax-paying, social-security funding (even when in fact they do not receive those benefits), well-behaved (because they'd get thrown out if they weren't) legal residents who could easily find themselves losing out if citizenship was the boundary of human rights in the US.

Good point. It comes down to how the one interprets the meaning of terrorist. A lot of folks automatically think of a middle eastern make with a turban when they hear terrorist

Being charged does not imply guilt; if one is confirmed in a procedure fitting one's citizenship status to have committed an act of treason, then subsequent trials will assume a different quality, if they occur at all. However, the fact of being charged does not formally suspend legal rights; it merely drives the media to agree with wanton abuse.

So if someone were to go overseas and commit atrocious acts against the US while still maintaining citizenship, you would have to be arrested and charged before any guilt is issued beforehand in your example. Though this is ideal, this isn't how the powers given to Congress and the President are interpreted, thus why we are allowed drone attacks.

'Allowed' drone attacks? Seriously?

Well, Congress allows the President such power is what I meant. The Constitution offers plenary powers, which can be broadly interpreted by Congress. If Congress is silent, many will find this gives the President the right on his decision...

You have to charged first.

Tell that to Abdulrahman al-Awlaki. He was a sixteen year old American citizen sentenced to death without a trial last year. Precident set.

But there is a huge difference between calling for a drone strike on a criminal in a foreign country who can not be captured easily and revoking the rights of a criminal after his capture in the United States.

Like it or not, he is entitled to an attorney and the right to shut his mouth.

Please link to this story. We sentenced a 16 year old to death?

http://dissenter.firedoglake.com/2012/10/15/denver-teens-death-by-drone-remains-shrouded-in-secrecy/

[deleted]

I think its the other way around now.

He wont. He got clipped in the neck and is considered in serious condition. You'll never hear of a trial let alone see one plastered on the news. Dorner didn't get one and neither will this kid.

Where can the rest of us get a hold of a crystal ball like the one you're using?

http://www.reddit.com/user/Botulism

Will you eat your words when the suspect gets a very drawn out public trial?

[deleted]

glp is calling you

[deleted]

No, I 'm calling you a shill because I looked at your comment history. Way too fucking antagonistic. Look at what sub you are on. This isn't /r/news. We know who you are here and you stick out like a sore thumb.

[deleted]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shill

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COINTELPRO

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agent_provocateur

http://www.politicususa.com/obama-rejects-war-terror-boston-bombing-suspect-civilian-court.html

Oh my God the reptilians have failed you!

He's a citizen?

If only we could get the coverage on this trial that we did on the Casey Anthony trial.

Or Jodie

Exactly. His right to habeas corpus is revoked due to the Patriot Act.

References:

• http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/PLAW-107publ56/pdf/PLAW-107publ56.pdf
• http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patriot_Act

That's pretty fucked up. I knew the Patriot Act was some bullshit, but damn.

Yes. Yes it is fucked up.

The Patriot Act gives the Executive Branch and law enforcement almost Orwellian powers of investigation and presidence over the Constitution.

Essentially, if you are accused of terrorism, they can do whatever the fuck they want with/to you.

[deleted]

tastily planned*

By whom?

Good question, but the FBI is certainly involved, as they had been handling those brothers for years.

The President's address makes me think otherwise. He sounds like he is looking at this situation with possibly the same eyes - that there is more to the story and he's not going to jump on the bandwagon of pitch forks and torches.

You believe a word out of his mouth?

So...you think it's unfair for people to pre-judge this guy before he's tried, but totally cool to pre-judge the judicial process he's going to go through before it has even begun? Yeah, that makes sense...

The difference is that this guy doesn't have a proven track record of being "broken."

In other words: "So you say that scratched pan you've never cooked things on might be perfectly fine, but you're going to prejudge the stove that caught on fire and burned down as being broken and unable to heat up the pan before you even try to turn it on?"

Unfortunately, we don't have an alternative working stove with which to test the pan. We've got the stove we've got. And that leads to even more conspiracy theories about why the pan doesn't heat up.

(I'm not supporting either side, just explaining that there's no black and white here at any level of the issue.)

The difference is that this guy doesn't have a proven track record of being "broken."

Er...

Also, the brokenness of the US criminal justice system is overrated and most of the people who rant about that don't have much to compare it to. Yes, it is fucked in many disturbing ways, but as someone who lived in China for years and worked with dissidents there, I'll put it this way: if I was going to be arrested and tried for a crime I didn't commit, I would sure as shit want it to be in the US and not there.

Why do you need to compare it to something? I get that you're saying that there's a scale of brokenness, and that the U.S.'s criminal justice system is less broken than others, but does that make it not broken?

I just see that kind of logic used constantly to justify actions that probably shouldn't exist in a nation we like to call "free." "Well, you think your rights are being trampled on in America? Just try going to Uganda!" It's nonsense. Just because something's worse somewhere else doesn't mean it should exist without questioning where you are observing it.

It's like saying you shouldn't fix your car's brakes until the whole thing's as broken as the neighbor's rusted out jalopy growing weeds in the front yard.

Edit to add: I didn't see your initial link, and again I say that this kid did not have a proven track record. This kid had NO track record. The article in question is regarding his brother, and there's a paragraph in there that clearly states the FBI found zero relation to the allegations after a thorough investigation. It's hearsay (and the allegations could have come from anyone - a jilted lover, an angry boss, anyone), not a proven track record. If a "tip from a foreign government" ends with zero evidence and no leads for the FBI, how is that proven evidence?

Anyway, that's neither here nor there, because the person in question in that article is NOT the person we're discussing in the thread.

To break it down: Just because it could be worse doesn't mean it's ok.

Exactly. Thank you. I often say that brevity is for the more intelligent and less self-indulgent. ;)

Brevity is a good thing on reddit, especially. Ever noticed how your short comments tend to get way more upvotes than the ones you put a lot of thought and effort into? I admit, I'm guilty of not reading especially long comments, myself, depending on how interested I am in the topic being discussed.

Anyway, in regards to the issue at hand: Since America is supposed to be held to a higher standard, comparing it to some horrible dictatorship (or whatever) isn't exactly very inspiring.

"Well, I know I got a D-, but John got an F because he didn't even show up to class!" A D- is still bad.

Ever noticed how your short comments tend to get way more upvotes than the ones you put a lot of thought and effort into?

Ha. Yeah. But three-quarters of the time, I'm really just writing to see my own thoughts, so I don't care whether anyone else reads them (and sometimes I'm relieved when they don't). I'm glad you did, though, because ...

Anyway, in regards to the issue at hand: Since America is supposed to be held to a higher standard, comparing it to some horrible dictatorship (or whatever) isn't exactly very inspiring.

"Well, I know I got a D-, but John got an F because he didn't even show up to class!" A D- is still bad.

Exactly. Every time my father and I get into discussions about current events, he brings up Nazi Germany and how none of us have anything to complain about because we don't live there/then. Or if I bring up issues in the healthcare system (he's a doctor), he'll say, "Well, whatever. Try needing a triple bypass in the Middle Ages, if you think there's something wrong with our healthcare. Let's see how long you live then."

If you won't admit a problem, you can't change it. (Especially if the denial involves the need for a time machine.)

I'm not saying we shouldn't fix the car's brakes. What I'm saying is that when people say "This car will never get us anywhere," that's bullshit. Sure, our car breaks down from time to time, but often enough it actually does get us from point A to point B. In comparison, China's car is missing most of its wheels, and can only get from point A to point B if being dragged behind a large truck.

Obviously we should fix everything about our system. What I'm saying is the fact that there are problems with the justice system sometimes does not prove that this guy isn't going to get a fair trial. He might not get a fair trial, because yes, our "car" sometimes breaks down. But let's wait until there's any evidence that's actually happening before getting upset about it.

What do you mean "pre-judge?" The judicial process through which he'll be going (or not going, technically) can be judged on its merits. And, as such, it can be said with great certainty that "No, never:" he will NOT be getting a fair trial.

it can be said with great certainty that "No, never:" he will NOT be getting a fair trial.

On what grounds are you basing this?

From what I've understood from headlines is that the two guys were suspects. It really blows my mind that first they shot the another one and then it took FBI and Boston police forces like 10 hours to catch the another.

Not only that US has it wrong, but I believe this is utter bullshit. No police forces of anykind can take so long to catch a man, who fled from the very same car as the one ho was shot. This is all just wicked campaign to run your stupid gun law in, since your country's politics is so inefficient that nothing can be done without these media shows. No offence, but that surely what it looks like to me.

The overall stream of information has so much saturation that feel free to correct me if I'm having false info here. Not that it would matter, because soon someone else would be saying the opposite.

The level of happiness cant be described as I dont feel this touching myself, so I can believe 4chan's consipiracy theories as much as I like.

Escaping from police presence and then vanishing isn't anything extraordinary... happens everywhere in the world.

You're so sure the trial is going to be rigged .. but they did capture him alive. Surely if this was a big bad conspiracy where they needed a scapegoat, surely they would've just shot him during capture or say that he blew himself up.

I think the point where you throw explosives at police officers is kind of the point where it's obvious you aren't innocent, well the legal process with do what It can but there is not a bit of doubt in my mind this guy is guilty.

[deleted]

Look at the pictures on MSNBC. They're "celebrating in the streets." The world is already convinced this guy is guilty. This wont be a fair trial. Not even close.

If obvious evidence comes out that he is innocent, then people will change their minds. And people are cheering the fact that the guy who was involved in a shootout with cops that involved bombs and his brother rushing at cops with a bomb rigged to his chest, is now in custody and off the streets.

While I personally agree with you, the "court" of public opinion is not in fact a court. "Innocent until proven guilty in a court of law," is the full text. Not really a point in the justice system if the proper procedures aren't conducted fairly and honestly.

Edit: oh wow, dropped a conjunction that completely changed the meaning.

I just think it's funny that people say he won't get a fair trial, because of all this media exposure. That's he's already been labeled guilty, and that he's basically already been sentenced to death. They seem to forget that a lot of these high profile court cases actually turn out to BENEFIT the defendant. Who here honestly thought O.J. was innocent? Doesn't matter, he was found not guilty. What about Casey Anthony? Doesn't matter, she was found not guilty.

[deleted]

So, we are never supposed to trust any source that's not some guys Youtube video of edited together Family Guy clips? How do you personally decide which information you trust and which you don't? This is what bugs me so much about this subreddit. Selectively choosing what you want to believe, and from whom, when it fits your agenda. You'll believe an anonymous person on 4chan, who could literally be ANYONE IN THE ENTIRE WORLD, but not a police officer who was AT the scene of the crime.

[deleted]

You still didn't answer me. Who is to say the evidence isn't faked either. Or that the media is showing you false evidence.

Good. He's guilty

He won't live through the night, most likely.

i think "he'll commit suicide"

Still alive! What about your conspiracy theory now?

Hopefully. Save the money and execute him. Fuck this obamacare life saving bs.

Save the money and execute him.

I hope you're the next patsy that everyone wants to kill without a trial.

Critical but stable. Im betting he is going to be a vegetable

There are pictures of him climbing out of the boat on his own. So, we know he didn't go into custody as a vegetable at least.

His chances to tell his story were nearly zero to start with, and are not much better now...

Are we sure? They could give him the ol' "James Holmes" treatment. Or he could be a seriously duped patsy like Abdulmutallab and believe it all. I'm actually leaning toward that. But I definitely could consider another James Holmes type situation.

I'm not familiar w/ James Holmes... but yeah, he could have been a patsy. We have to remain open to all possibilities.

James Holmes is the "Batman shooter" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9wP9fWVWM5A

oh geez, I'm embarrassed I forgot his name.

yeah, I'll never forget his face - he was so hopped up on drugs, sitting in that courtroom. I'm not sure he knew what was real.

Nah they already did his brother in. Now there's no witnesses against what really happened that night. He'll probably get the death penalty in a show trial and an expedited execution ala McVeigh.

yeah, I think that's a good theory.

funny, I was just going to say, "wait, MA. has the death penalty?", and literally as I started typing that, the broadcaster on CNN says that the US has automatic death penalty consideration for anyone considered guilty of terrorism.

Sure he will. Or is the reptilian Illuminati going to either smother him in his sleep?

The Illuminati control your world, not his.

[deleted]

You are all over the place aren't you? You don't know what to think. Rage on.

I don't know what to think? Elaborate.

The Illuminati are real, and you don't know what all these slurs you hurl even mean. I believe in a puppet master behind the scenes that doesn't have everybody's best interest. Garbage? Illusions of grandeur? Hardly. You just got too excited today. Now tell your parents good night, and go to bed.

Great non answer. I know what I think. And think that what you think is laughably stupid. Care to let a pleb like me in on how my life is run by the puppet master and yours is not?

I do live on the wrong side of an oligarchy.

Didn't think so. Thanks.

PS: Will you eat your words when your non Illuminati influenced crystal ball bearer friend is incorrect about the suspect not making it through the night?

It is hard for me to understand you because you call me garbage, and say weird things that don't make sense. What friend? What crystal ball? Do you want the guy to die tonight?

no, but your mom will.

Suspect still alive =/

I was wondering how much he will be drugged when he stands trial.

I wonder how many moon crystals the government will have installed in his spinebox?!

Wha?? Everyone in our fine government/military industrial complex is 100% awesome, and always has been! History backs me up!

USA! USA! USA!

Hmm... you know? I hadn't really thought of that before but now that you mention it...

I had to laugh at this, haha moon crystals.

First time to this subreddit and I honestly can't tell if that's meant as a joke. You guys really blur the line.

What does this mean?

Yes, he most certainly is. But will he be given a fair trial ? Not likely.

FTFY

They'll probably just send him home.

Oh, I mean, his new home: Guantanamo Bay.

he will most likely be executed actually.

Either of those outcomes would be fine with me.

[deleted]

Anyone who will be on the jury has already made their minds up. No way it will be considered a fair trial.

I'd give him a fair shot for sure. I'd like to be on that jury.

[deleted]

Exactly. My opinions will change with facts.

I just don't think the majority of people will be so open minded about this situation. But then again, the majority of America already labeled Casey Anthony as guilty and she made it through.

I'd like to be on that jury

Saying something like that would exclude you from being on any jury

I'd like to be on that jury

Saying something like that would exclude you from being on any jury

Yeah, that would be the case if that was all I said. Before that line I said that I'd give him a fair shot.

Comment for reference:

I'd give him a fair shot for sure. I'd like to be on that jury.

I live 20 minutes north of Boston. I don't have cable and got all the news from this week online. If I were picked for the jury, I'd have a pretty clean slate. I've been bombarded with opinions but not many facts. I haven't posted any Facebook statuses or tweets in reference to "Boston Pride" or anything like that. I think I'd be a damn good jury member. He deserves a fair trial, like the rest of us.

I don't think deserves is the right word, sounds like you're saying he earned it.

He should get a fair trial, but nothing he did makes him deserve it other than being a citizen (is he?).

Yea, he will be found guilty, then they will send him to the Swiss Alps to hide with a 100,000 dollar a year stipend for following orders.

Lets just tie him to a 300lb weight and throw him into a lake, if he swims to the top he's a witch and if he doesn't he's not.

Lol, a duck.

Very small pebbles

That's barbaric!

Just check to see if he weighs the same as a duck.

Joke?

There wont be a trial, there will be a tribunal.

He is NOT an american citizen,.. his brother was. He only has his green card. Also as many sites are reporting they have NOT read him his Miranda rights,.. as he will be tried as a combatant against the state.

You will see as much real court room coverage as you see for the gitmo trials.... oh ... wait... that would be none. They will classify this under national security and ONLY announce his sentence to appease the sheep... I doubt if anything this man says will hit the lamestream media.

He IS an American Citizen as of September 11, 2012.

Ain't that a coinc-ee-dink.

I had heard they were both naturalized citizens. But then again I've heard a lot of stuff in the last few days

Green card? He's from East LA!

Good point. I remember a criminal justice class early in my college years where they mentioned that very high profile criminal cases are virtually impossible to have a fair trial because everyone has an opinion and there are tons of facts every where.

But seriously, the guy deserves a good legal defense. A local forum I was reading brought up the possibility that the older brother might've led the younger brother into doing things he might not have known the actual consequences.

Just... come on... he's 19 years old; you know that KILLING PEOPLE is wrong when you're 19, and you know there are consequences. Granted more will come to light, but to date there is no reason to believe he's insane or mentally handicapped either.

I don't understand how anyone can- especially at this point where there is no evidence to support his being mentally incapable- could throw out the "he didn't know what he was doing" routine. It makes me a little angry/sick; I feel for the families that will have to put up with hearing people go down this road, telling them that it's ok- he just couldn't help it/didn't know what he was doing. Fuck that.

Update: They're Patriot Acting him. They can detain and question him for as long as the want without trial.

So no, no trial.

I'm sure he will. Lawyers all over the place will be chomping at the bit to get their name associated with this case. He'll probably get free representation from a (few) big law firm that will drag the case out as long as possible to get as much advertising out of it as they can.

The evidence against him is pretty damning. The guy that lost his legs identified him for starters. Saw him drop the bag that blew up

This is the first ACTUAL terrorist caught since 9/11 in the US. It's going to be a massive news story for years probably.

Wait, what? I thought that guy who gunned down the cinema at the batman premier was a terrorist as well? Or are terrorists only arabs and muslims now, and white guys are just crazy.

[deleted]

Find me 12 people in America that haven't heard about this.

Do you even know what a fair trial is?

But if he is, and the videos of the planting and shooting are released after the trial (needs to be fair). And the witness testimonies (car driver and witness who lost his legs + cops) are you going to pfut this to rest? No, of course not. The car driver was a plant. The marathon witness was coerced. The video isn't clear enough (because all video is hd until they want to put up cameras, then they're overstepping, right? 1984!!!!!). Give me a break.

You guys will never be satisfied and you give free thinkers and skeptics a bad name. You just have to be special. Guess what? You're just loony.

Edit to correct the book. I knew it was one away from my birthday year.

1984?

Appreciate the correction. Should have looked it up.

It's 1984, not 1982.

Until you realize that 1982 was the year 1984 was commissioned.

Yeah.. Ok.. except the book was published in 1949, So why wouldn't you use that? Or why not use the year Orwell got the deal for the book?

The movie, you dorks.

The Movie, seriously?

I don't read, you loser.

Wait, he recanted his story?

He doesn't know what recant means.

Lol, okay.

Can we get a link or some context of that?

(Do you mean to say "recalling"?)

Thanks for proving my point.

I'm definitely not interested in seeing another person killed. I'm interested in answers.

[deleted]

And if there is anyone else still involved as well.

Or, there is another story unfolding in the history of our generation fifty years from now.

There is a narrative here, but we're not being told why we're being told.

He will likely be tortured, may better die than live, he won't be going anywhere anyway.

I wish he can rest in peace to leave this agony and nonsense..

Why are you sympathetic toward this individual? There appears to be overwhelming evidence he is a pussy-ass terrorist that have come in the form of independent photographs.

Once proven guilty (which he ultimately will be given there's far more video evidence that hasn't been released to the public), he will deserve nothing short of death. I know there's a lot of anti-government sentiment in this sub, but these types of individuals must be made an example of. You don't fuck with our peaceful civilian events. Innocents do not need to die.. it's not their fight. If you bring terror to our populace, you're going to pay.

You are right on making example out of him but definitely not the feds way, it just goes backward in time, in any case.

Best reply in thus thread.

who downvotes this?

Presumed innocent until proven guilty

Seems like he is presumed guilty if they interrogate and detain him without reading him his Miranda's.

[deleted]

[deleted]

Okay then, so read them their rights as U.S. citizens. The thing is, if you are going to have a small number of people controlling a large number of people, as with government, then hypocrisy must never be tolerated. If they make rules, they should never break them. It undermines authority.

Exactly. This is why our leaders must take an oath to uphold the Constitution.

Any violation of that oath should result in being dismissed from public office and possible treason charges.

But I guess I'm just an idealist.

I think the constitution at the time granted the government more authority than it deserved, but of course, it was not enough. I prefer the articles of confederation. N State rights, no fiat currency or commerce clause.

are we all forgetting that this country does all that same shit to everyone else with no accountability? is it any surprise when people retaliate? feel lucky they dont get helicopters and kill u and ur kids from a mile away casue ur camera looks like a gun. yes yes, little details.

[deleted]

Interrogate and detain, or, kill first and put story together later?

Yes. He has been proven guilty of atleast shooting at police officers and throwing explosives at them, as well as carjacking. That much HAS been proven, because it was witnessed happening.

They are not withholding his maranda rights to screw him over. They want answers, and they want to know what happens. If what they get from him can't be used in the court of law, then maybe he will be more likely to talk.

So arrest him for attacking the police. When we allow people to be detained (indefinitely), that's a slippery slope on the way down to fascism.

Thank you. An important distinction which OP is ignoring.

Notice how everyone had all sorts of theories as too who the bomber could be? Then when the authority figure (the fbi) said they knew who it was, all the major subreddits etc made a knee jerk follow the fascist "IT WAS HIM."

What proof has the fbi released? Nothing more than the nets have. As to those who say well the evidence needs to be kept secret:

1. Its a national event. As Americans we all have a right to know everything about this.

2. If you're deploying a small army to occupy Boston, then your better make your reasons for doing so known.

They never said those two did it. They said that they were suspects. The FBI has video proof that they wouldn't release publicly because it would compromise the integrity of the trial.

I'm honestly just asking because I never got the reasoning behind why courts do that - how would releasing stuff publicly compromise the integrity of the trial?

I'm not a lawyer but I think this is how it works:

The 14th amendment gives you the right to a fair trial by due process. If they release the video of them placing the bombs, everyone (including prospective jurors, witnesses) know he's guilty. Those videos are withheld until the trial and then shown to the jury. Witnesses who testify already saw them do it. They describe the video without having seen the video.

Oh, the old "secret evidence" ploy. If you have the proof fucking show it. This is a national event, if the evidence can't stand up in the court of public opinion, why the fuck should it stand in a trial?

EDIT: Quite aware that is the normal justification given, and it normally would suffice. But jesus christ they initiated a military level response to find this guy. In light of what they have done, perhaps justly, there should be NO SECRETS.

The 14th amendment gives you the right to a fair trial by due process. If they release the video of them placing the bombs, everyone (including prospective jurors, witnesses) know he's guilty. Those videos are withheld until the trial and then shown to the jury. Witnesses who testify already saw them do it. They describe the video without having seen the video.

Finally someone with logical thinking. Thank you.

But it's so much easier to be a nutcase and scream conspiracy!

Interesting. Would you mind linking me to these descriptions? I haven't seen them yet. Would appreciate it.

EDIT: I'd also say that conducting a nationally televised manhunt would slant the jury pool against this guy just as much as releasing the vids.

Descriptions of what? Even if they didn't place the bombs they killed a cop last night, stole a cop car, possibly robbed a gas station, and ran from the police. Why would they have done ANY of those things if they weren't guilty?

"Witnesses who testify already saw them do it." - as in descriptions of those who supposedly saw the placing the bomb(s). These other issues have nothing to do with the core issue, which I would like to remain focused on.

As for your other comments though, I only have this:

Imagine yourself, you see yourself on the news. You hear the news about the militarized police search. You didn't do it. You're a smart kid, you know about guantamo, brutal US police, torture etc. You'd do anything to escape that. You know what the United States security forces due to people it deems "enemies."

You also know that if they blame it on you, there realistically isn't shit you can do. You know what you might do? You just might do something crazy like jack a car, jack an atm, try to escape the encircling net.

What seems crazy to someone who is safe and comfortable, wouldn't seem so crazy if the powers that be decided to use you as a patsy.

That's ridiculous. Because I know I'm innocent I'd commit more crimes. To claim that's the reason is idiotic.

Desperation my friend. Desperate people do desperate things.

What you miss is that he could be desperate for reasons other than being the bomber.

I think you know full that is not what I was claiming. Please don't deliberately misconstrue me.

I know people do stupid things when they're desperate. I think that it's hard to not find them guilty of the bombing after what happened last night and today. Suicide vest on the older brother, throwing bombs/grenades at the police, etc.

I've read varying things about the suicide vests, the bomb throwing etc. Maybe I'm just suffering information overload, but I remember reading conflicting accounts of the bombs and suicide vest(s)

Hopefully this will become more solidified in the next couple days. Anyways was nice to have a convo without name calling and shit. I don't want to think about this anymore for a while, it makes me unhappy.

Agreed. This week has been a real overload of stuff. It'll be nice to get a break for a while.

I love how you use these vague sweeping statements to prove[sic] your point. Just because you don't have the evidence doesn't mean it isn't there. They shot at police, jacked a car, got in a chase while throwing fucking bombs out of their car, black hat died with a bomb strapped to his chest, there is a picture of white hat setting his backpack down at the place where the bomb went off on marathon day, and I'm sure much more evidence that is being withheld and/or hasn't been leaked.

Yet you attempt to disprove the entire thing and imply it's some type of set-up or inside-job with sound logic like "if they don't show all the evidence to whiny redditors right now then they have no evidence!".

This is only the beginning, assuming he survives there will be a loooong trial process where any evidence the state has will come out and any defense the suspect has will come out. As of right now you are desperately trying to make this big conspiratorial plot where there is none and you look downright silly.

Yes it does and so does people seeing other people cheering when he is taken in to custody. So that shit don't fly. ... jury is already tainted.

Not to mention, how can we even continue this ridiculous trial facade if they didn't even read him his Miranda rights?

http://www.politico.com/story/2013/04/no-miranda-rights-for-now-for-bombing-suspect-90362.html?hp=f1

Seriously, wtf are people thinking?

The police are not required to read you your Miranda Rights when they arrest you. This is a common myth fostered by television shows. They only have to read you your rights prior to a custodial interrogation; if they don't, then the only consequence is that they can't use any of your statements from that confession. They could still use any other legally-obtained evidence they have against you in court. It's important to remember that you still have those rights whether the police read them to you or not.

Apologize for fascists much?

Now that they have him in their prison, it doesn't matter whether they chose to give him his Miranda rights anymore. Its their words against his. he's fucked.

Dude do you understand the law at all? Evidence is never released before a trial. Military level response was because the guy was hurling pipe bombs at cops.

He has a PhD in YouTube. Show some respect.

You actually just reminded me of how they've conducted trials for Guantanamo prisoners in that the evidence against a person is not revealed to them because it could compromise national security. The person is then conflicted with everyone just taking their word for it that evidence exists.

gaerg4tg43ryt35y

and yet one of them is dead without trial with no defence given...

He shot at cops. What are they gonna do? Just let him shoot at them and take it?

[deleted]

How do you know HE didn't shoot at cops or what happened there at all?

[deleted]

There is more evidence to show that he was shooting than he wasn't. We have a picture of suspect #1 dead which matches the pictures, we have witness video of shooting taking place in the area, and we have a picture of suspect #2 on the ground near the boat. I would highly doubt a city would be put to a standstill and the officers carrying out a "fake" mission with people in their houses recording everything they're doing. There is also evidence of suspect #2 running from the scene without a backpack and a picture of him at the exact blast area with his backpack on the ground.

What evidence is there that he wasn't shooting? He doesn't look like a terrorist... so? One person who looks like one of the police officers from Sandy Hook, is that good enough? No. Some guy on 4chan who made a general outline of what would happen which was partly correct, is that good enough? No.

You people are merely grabbing at sticks because you, for some reason, want it to be a conspiracy. What is so good about conspiracy? What makes you crave for conspiracy? It makes no sense and you are just putting yourself in a box in which you cannot live without being afraid of your surroundings.

[deleted]

What?

[deleted]

You need to format your thoughts a little better, you don't make much sense.

Also a lot of people who "believe in conspiracies", which you must not, have done a lot of reading, a lot of studying history, a lot of leg work that got them to that mindset, it's not just an "INSTANT" thing. Took me about 5 years to come to the realization that things aren't as they seem, that there are manipulations happening in the public psyche, that they are intentional, and that it's all been planned out for about 100 years. The people who planned all this wrote books about how they would do it and why they are doing it. A lot of this isn't just speculation, people see a concerted effort to drastically change society into a one world government run by a technocratic elite. In order to keep the people in line they need to scare them, they need to create problems that they have a pre-made solution for.

This is like level one shit, you've obviously not gotten to level one yet.

[deleted]

5 years was an understatement, out of about 30. I'm not being dense, I'm pointing out that you're a moron.

[deleted]

Dense would be me taking what you wrote completely wrong and seeing it as a personal attack, I am just seeing it as an ignorant statement made by some doofus.

[deleted]

Actually your composition skills are lackluster, as well as your logic.

[deleted]

[deleted]

[deleted]

we have witness video of shooting taking place in the area

That video seems to clearly show that there is shooting going on within whoever is fillming's general area.

yea there is no video showing the actual gun fight. Just the noise of it. Who's to say the cops didn't just shoot him.

Again, I'm not saying that they didn't just shoot him, I'm saying that there is a lot of evidence to show that they had malicious intent.

There is a large influx into this subreddit of both shills (although probably less then many think in my opinion), and people who find conspiratorial ideas threatening to their worldview in the wake of the Boston bombing.

[deleted]

Tunkin Gulf entertainment coming right up! On a side note if you are from this group, and reading this, please look into real conspiracies. There are plenty of real proven conspiracies - the results of which definitely have shaped your life.

Don't look at is as just entertainment - it isn't. Though I concede it could be quite entertaining. Its a conspiracy forum, there will always be crazy shit, and enjoying it is really half the reason to even visit here.

Anyway solid on your for pointing this out, it is an important part. And alot of questioners start out in this category.

This is a very good point, and I appreciate the effort and thought put into many topics here.

I was frustrated earlier due to the fact that claims are made and when there are holes in those claims, people try to fill in the holes by themselves with information that is simply not there. I was personally trying to use examples that were showing that one aspect of the story has at least some backbone.

You people are merely grabbing at sticks because you, for some reason, want it to be a conspiracy.

Why is this surprising to you on the /r/conspiracy board?

There are more reasons than what you paint here for people to think this might be some sort of set up. Most importantly, what is the motive? The Boston Marathon is a global event, made up of all different nations, religions, and other affiliations. If the attack were religious or even nationalistic in nature, this type of event doesn't really make much sense symbolically. These big picture pieces of the puzzle do not make sense yet, and the fact that you can parrot the 'official' story does not impress many here (other than the shill army).

It makes no sense and you are just putting yourself in a box in which you cannot live without being afraid of your surroundings.

The whole thing doesn't make sense, so that's not saying much. And nobody here is afraid; what the hell are you talking about? People on this board are not afraid; they use knowledge as a tool against those who would conspire. A 'conspiracy' is not really such an outlandish idea; people secretly working together towards a common goal is not a hard concept to understand or imagine happening. Until the information comes forward that makes this whole thing stand up, people are going to doubt. It doesn't help that the previous 2 massacres were left with so many questions unanswered either...

What evidence is there that he shot at cops? Keyword: evidence?

A dead cop.

[deleted]

TWO PEOPLE GOING TO A CAMPUS WITH IEDS AND RIFLES MEANS THEY WERE INNOCENT!

Are you really a person? With a functioning brain? Can you feed yourself?

I can be a dickhead too. Why don't you try and provide evidence to defend your opinion rather than being a toolbag?

Also, I was merely saying that conspiracy theories should not be formed until there is evidence of collusion occurring. If you look too long at any situation you will always find something that looks off. No matter who the suspects were, no matter what evidence there was you people would still point at there being conspiracies.

It's just that in these types of events, one way or another, some person or persons were without a doubt covertly scheming or conspiring. It's in our face - someone has done this.

So it's a great thing people are looking at all angles, because its not as if authority figures haven't been known to conspire (in the negative sense) in the past. Why rule that out prematurely?

"TWO PEOPLE GOING TO A CAMPUS WITH IEDS AND RIFLES MEANS THEY WERE INNOCENT!"

.

"I'm reciting what I was told even though I wasn't actually there".

So do you not believe anything unless you were physically there to see it yourself?

Another question is why didn't they kill the owner of the Mercedes? They allegedly told the driver of the Mercedes they were the guys responsible for Monday. LE also claims they were prepared to kill innocent people, yet they let the driver go or escape after they admitted to the attacks on Monday? Kinda odd they would let that person live..

Thoughts?

[deleted]

[deleted]

I heard a CNN report, after they took him into custody, that they were not the robbers of the 711, but he was in fact there obviously. Can't source it, it's just what I heard on my lunch break

Exactly. Why would they say that, who does that? Also, the picture of the kid in the "robbed 7-11" .. it just looks like he's casually strolling in the store to me. They don't show any footage of him near the register or actually robbing the place. Don't the cameras usually point down to the register?

And why would they walk into the 7-11 without even the slightest disguise? And so casually, when their faces are plastered over every news outlet?

Why would Tamerlan walk up to the window to watch what Dzhokar was doing inside? Why risk being placed with his brother?

I know they needed gas, so it was probably inevitable that they had to show themselves on camera, but I just got a funny feeling about this.

I just don't see how all the pieces fit together. Until I do, I gotta stay skeptical about this.

The FBI, the CIA and the Joooz were mind controlling them of course. Isn't it obvious?

"Oh, and by the way-- WE ARE THE BOMBERS!! Tell everyone! Thanks for the ride!"

There are multiple occasions where spree/rampage killers have let people go for no apparent reason. Columbine, École Polytechnique, Charles Whitman, Port Arthur...

It is actually an occurrence in most major shootings.

No shit we don't know. But to expect to see evidence that he did shoot the cops at this point is plain stupid. Like Ashgon says, there's more reason to believe he did it than not.

There are reports of multiple cops with injuries from the shootout. If you're going to say that the FBI, BPD, paramedics, and hospitals were in on it too you might as well go to "well how do you know your reality is real and maybe this is all just a dream?"

EDIT: my bad I didn't see what sub I was in.

How do you explain the dead cop?

And the 3-4 bombs the police found. And the suicide vest.

Shhhhhh. This /r/conspiracy. Off with you and your common sense

One too many donuts

The point is how do you know that the Police didn't shoot first, which is an automatic presumption that you've made without any evidence to back it up, because your natural instinct (like almost all of us raised in this culture) is authority=good guys.

The cop was shot inside his police car. And why does it matter who shot first? The fact is he shot at police. Also, what about the grenades that were used and explosives found?

And why does it matter who shot first? The fact is he shot at police

To use your own logic:

Cops shot at him. What is he gonna do? Just let them shoot at him and take it?

Surrender and try to provide an alibi for being the suspect, maybe? I'm assuming the police had already announced themselves as such pre-gunshots... or at least pulled up in a squad car. Shooting at a cop or a soldier is usually a really bad idea.

Why was he fleeing from the police in the first place if he wasn't hiding anything?

Crisis actor playing dead?

Seriously...seriously? Not everything that ever happens is a conspiracy. This sub is a joke. Remember how ape shit it went during the olympics? Aliens, terrorist attacks, zionist takeover. How about we have some factual discussion and investigation rather than "Nuhuh you can't provehe did". Yeah man the paramedics at the scene must be part of the conspiracy. Along with every forensics investigator who will investigate, every cop who responded, every possible eyewitness, you get the point.

So the MIT cop shot himself did he?

I'm sure there's some dashcam footage.

Then why kill one and not both?

To fool conspiracy theorists of course!

You can't say he did or didn't either way. None of us will ever know anyways. It takes a lot for a cop to use the gun.

Tell that to the two Asian women whose truck got shot up in the hunt for Chris Dorner!

I didn't say the police were infallible.

But you said "It takes a lot for a cop to use the gun". Clearly police firing over 40 rounds into a stationary truck with no cause other than "we think dorner is in there" shows what you said is false

point very well taken!

To be fair, the LAPD is a whole different level of trigger happy fuckwits.

The man was a cop killer. Anyways I can see my point has been taken too seriously, Peace out.

They hijacked a car and killed one cop after the fact. They threw pipe bombs out the car when being chased, then when the second one was cornered in the boat, he shot at the cops again.

He's lucky they didn't kill him then.

[deleted]

i spelled it that way but then it gave me the auto correct red line thing so I relented and gave in to it....

[deleted]

The U.S Media are the terrorists.

And who owns them?

the U.S government

Are you telling the previous poster to suck your cock? or the machine?

How would it compromise the integrity of the trial? I don't buy it. U.S. intelligence/authorities are the worst lying scumbags in the world. They may be planning to kill the next dude, too, so there's sure to be no trial. Don't just believe whatever the FBI says; that's ten times more idiotic than any "conspiracy theory."

The 14th amendment gives you the right to a fair trial by due process. If they release the video of them placing the bombs, everyone (including prospective jurors, witnesses) know he's guilty. Those videos are withheld until the trial and then shown to the jury. Witnesses who testify already saw them do it. They describe the video without having seen the video.

I swear man every tinfoil hatter here thinks everyone is out to get them and the FBI will be knocking on their door to strip them of their rights any day now... It's just irrational.

Notice how everyone had all sorts of theories as too who the bomber could be? Then when the authority figure (the fbi) said they knew who it was, all the major subreddits etc made a knee jerk follow the fascist "IT WAS HIM."

Shocking. Almost like the FBI had more information than some subreddits. 2 fascist4me

Definitely innocent until proven guilty, but having a fire fight with the police that includes throwing explosives at them is pretty damning.

If that happened, and if he did it.

Why would the FBI release information? Are you dumb or just a bit tapped in the head (I ask as someone who is borderline schizophrenic)? You think a day after naming the main suspects they would give away all the information they have, giving the defense a heads up on how to find loopholes and make a case? I don't think you understand these things in the slightest.

I'll cut your shitty post down to size for you:

1. Why would the FBI release information? - DURR of course they don't want to, I never said they would want to. Pure misrepresentation by you.

2. Within your second sentence you are resorting to calling me dumb or insane. Classy. Great argument as well!

3. The likely hood of him having a fair trial is very low. Just look fate of the US war on terror detainees. So this "point" is completely irrelevant.

4. More insults.

Your post is terrible brah, you should feel bad.

To be honest I read yours after reading a bunch of other posts that made me angry and must have just read it whilst assigning those feelings to your post. Re-read and I understand your post, and my reply was pretty bad. For sake of discussion I do disagree with number 2 though slightly. Perhaps if you stayed there for a while yes, but if it is only a day or two after you find the suspects (who are quite possibly heavily armed...whether that turns out to be the case or not remains), seems fine to me. I do however understand the possible negative implications if this were to become the status quo, but I believe it will be a matter of opportunism, rather than conspiracy. With a suspect, who is fleeing and able to watch the news, search the internet (social media, forums, police forums, etc), call someone, get a precise longitude and latitude location on the globe, use satnav, have a camera and video camera and zoom camera, have a flashlight,have a stopwatch; you can't be giving away too much information.

This x 100000000. It sickens me. The "GOT HIM!" post that shows him with his face bashed in hurts me, despite whatever crimes he may have committed with or without his brother. I don't believe hate and violence compounded into previous tragedy solves anything. We should be looking for the solution to these things rather than revelling in the revenge.

Or just makes the problem worse.

You can't resolve death, period. The decision is now about punishment, and I see no problem with a quick, efficient hanging.

His face wasn't bashed in, the blood was from the bullet he took to the neck. He also took one in the leg. In the boat, he was bleeding out for over 18 hours. They didn't assault him, he was on the verge of death when they captured him.

Okay... I still feel terrible for him and my compassion goes out to him. These details change nothing for myself. I don't seek revenge; I think its shallow and childish to do so.

That I do agree with. An eye for an eye? That makes us no better than the people we demonize.

rather than revelling in the revenge.

*cough*9/11*cough*

No one took "revenge" on him. He was curled up in the fetal position, bleeding out for 20 hours. He was ushered out of the boat, and given medical care. Not exactly my definition of hatred and violence. Please take an objective look at what actually happened before posting sensationalist crap

I'm talking about the thirst for blood and the 'FUCK YEA AMERICA' that comes from a big section of people when things like this happen. A suspect is dead without trial and people are partying because of that. There is no want to understand why this kid did what he did; they just want him dead. That saddens me. I thought we were better than that. Violence doesn't stop violence.

I agree with your overall sentiment. I too felt ashamed when people threw parties when Osama Bin Laden was killed, because it seemed moot at that point. This is different though. People celebrated their capture because this guy posed a legitmate threat to the city of Boston. I have family Boston. They were terrified to leave the house with Suspect2 still loose. I think the celebration was more about feeling safe again.

I disagree with the sentiment that people want them dead. No one really celebrated the killing of Suspect 1. It was the capture of the second suspect that was celebrated, because it brought closure to a week's worth of anxiety.

Also-"violence doesn't stop violence." In this case, it quite literally did. The dead suspect was a known killer, and he was trying to kill more innocent people. Killing him was a measure taken to prevent more violence. If you shoot at police officers, they're going to shoot back. Thats standard operations.

I disagree with the sentiment that people want them dead.

Trawling through reddit as it was unfolding, I saw and felt differently. But to your point, as much as there are people/media/authorities being ugly about this, there is also the opposite in effect as well. We're seeing both the best and worst of it at once.

You have no proof that his face was 'bashed in' by the police arresting him. Considering the boat owner reported someone in his boat because he saw blood, it's entirely possible that his injuries were previously sustained.

I love how people in this subreddit make sure to insist that people ALLEGEDLY committed crimes, but in other instances take pretty large liberties with their assumptions.

Where did I say that? I said it hurts me to see that; I don't really care who did it. What does the fact that he is a suspect have to do with 'large liabilities with their assumptions'? Read shit more carefully. I never spoke against anybody other than people getting a hard on over this whole manhunt. Police have a job to do; I don't blame them for doing it. I do blame the media tho.

"Bashed in", to me, has to connotation that someone hit him. I apologize if that's not how you meant it.

That's because you are a pussy. Execute this bitch and save the money. Fucking obamacare is saving his life now after taking 4 others. Disgusting, I hate liberals.

Enjoy your hatred, man. I prefer to go without it. Also, he's a fucking suspect; he hasn't been convicted of shit. Don't get ahead of yourself; part of this country is having a fair trial. When and if his part in this gets proven, i'm sure the punishment will fit the crime. Also, where's your fucking passion when it comes to the 50 some odd bombed in Iraq a half day after the Boston thing? Why aren't you asking for anybody to be executed there?

Based on how /r/conspiracy is reacting to this incident, it seems like some of you people don't believe it's even possible for anyone outside of boogie men from the government to do wrong.

You don't go throwing bombs out of stolen vehicles and then expect everyone to honestly remain neutral towards your guilt.

Seriously, why did I have to scroll down this far to find this comment? OP may be technically correct, but there's no doubt this guy is guilty of at least one of these big crimes. We also have only been exposed to a controlled amount of evidence against this guy. It's not like the FBI decided this is the guy based on the same news stories we've been seeing. The FBI has a LOT more evidence on these guys than we've been exposed to. The chances that he just coincidentally happened to be an innocent bystander at the Boston Marathon during a terrorist attack the same week that he got in a shootout/hijacking are extremely unlikely.

So does he deserve a fair trial with due process or not?

He does, I'm just saying that it's a little naive to back this guy up when the evidence is pretty clear. Obviously WE haven't seen any hard evidence that he was a bomber, but the FBI found him the most likely. He was obviously running from something all week, and it's pretty apparent (judging by their social networking sites that have been exposed, particularly YouTube) that they have an interest in terrorism.

He deserves a fair trial, but anyone with that much evidence will most likely be convicted. And that's not unfair, that's just how court works.

One thing everyone forgets is that he can be "innocent until proven guilty in a court of law" and still be super guilty. One refers to the actual guilt, and one refers to legal guilt. No he has not yet been tried, but the general public does have enough information to come to a conclusion on our ideas of whether he is guilty or not. Oftentimes we should refrain from judgement because we don't know the facts, but at this point we do have enough information to make an informed decision, even if that decision is not the legally binding kind that we send people to jail for.

That pretty much sums it up. I was having a hard time trying to put that into words.

He honestly does, but the majority of America will probably never care if he doesn't. It's probably because most people assume no matter what he will end up in the same situation. Also it will be almost impossible to find an impartial jury in this country that has not already been biased by the news and events.

Of course he does, but when you start chucking explosives and shooting police it makes it quite difficult to get you in for that trial alive.

If it is such an open and shut case, then why be so opposed to treating him like the murder he is, and have an open and fair trial put the evidence on the table for all of us to see, and let Avg Americans send his ass to the electric chair? Some people would say that it is a resource issue and that taxpayers shouldn't pay for him to stay alive, but considering the cost of the manhunt and shut down, I call BS

There is one way it could happen.

He and his brother witnessed the bombing and went crazy.

...

That wouldn't explain the bombs they threw around in such a short period, however.

The problem is that you're already saying "neutral towards your guilt." That is not how the justice system works, it relies on the fact that he's innocent until proven guilty.

I can't stand the majority of this subreddit, but I'll be a lot more nervous when the population stops asking questions.

Do I think this is the person who planted the bombs? Yes, his pictures came from hundreds of bystanders, you can do the detective work yourself. Do I still think he deserves a fair trial? Yes.

Do I think the government coordinated these attacks in any way? No. Do I think the government takes advantage of EVERY single one of these events to trade freedom for security? Indisputably. People get scared and emotional, and they don't notice when the Patriot Act or the NDAA goes through, because it's America vs. the bad guys and it's okay that we're being protected.

The fact that CISPA is going through right now is just a terrible coincidence, but it is unquestionably being affected by this incident. That is not an opinion. I have been talking about CISPA for the last few days, and almost everyone I've talked to outside of reddit has no problem with it, because it would help stop things like 'the Boston marathon from happening again.'

It's just kind of comical how so many people will vigorously insist that he ALLEGEDLY committed the crime, despite there being a decent amount of damning information available.

However, with MUCH LESS evidence, the same people will make all sorts of wild assertions about government mind control, dopplegangers, patsies, etc.

It's just kind of comical how so many people will vigorously insist that he ALLEGEDLY committed the crime, despite there being a decent amount of damning information available.

Because he did allegedly commit the crime. You don't get to remove that word without a trial; it doesn't mater whether you have video evidence watching him do it, a signed confession and 20 million witnesses.

That's the absolute foundation of all modern justice systems. Your view is irrelevant, alledgely is the correct term

You're missing the point. People on this subreddit insist on 'patsies' allegedly committing crimes because they're trying to insert doubt.

But they'll insist with absolute certainty that government agents commit crimes all the time. Aren't they afforded the same legal protection?

There is something that is misunderstood about "innocent until proven guilty"

It doesn't mean that he didn't do it. We, the citizenry, don't have to put on kid gloves. It simply means that until he gets a trail, the government must act as if he is innocent, with only reasonable precautions like holding him in jail before and during the trail. They must also distinctly prove guilt, and not just disprove innocence.

If he were to be treated correctly, he would be eligible for the death penalty and the people calling for blood will get their wish.

Well to counter the government aspect of your post, I don't think the government is smart enough to come up with ways to trick the US public, but I do believe they are pawns in a game higher up in the food chain. Politicians are just front-men. They are the middleman between the real owners of this country, and the masses. They take orders. They do what they are told. If they are told to feed us shit with a smile, they do it. That being said, I believe its the power elite that are taking rights away from us, with the help of the government cronies they elected to assist in easing the transition. The government doesn't want to take your rights/guns etc away, the power elite do. But the government is just the lobbyists for the power elite, and assist in marketing their agenda for the masses to consume.

So would you say if hypothetically someone is directly seen by many shooting someone in the head and is captured on camera, that man is still "innocent until proven guilty"?. I think it is fair for people to just downright know he is guilty, not neccesarily of the boston bombing, but atleast of all the shit that went down last night

That's the justice system you'd like to live with, one where we just "know you're guilty?" This exact thinking is what allows the NDAA to exist. Well if we deem them associated with Taliban or Al'Qaeda, then we "know they're guilty." First of all, since when is being associated with a group illegal? Oh, and then they go ON to say that a damning cause can be as vague as a "belligerent act." So now a "belligerent act" is enough to "know you're guilty," with no need for trial.

Why are you requesting that he be denied due process? If the evidence is as clear as it appears to be, then justice prevails and the system works.

I'm not saying that just because someone is associated with something means that they are guilty and dont deserve a trial.

I think this man should have a trial, but all i am saying, it is downright obvious that he is guilty, even if not neccesarily for the bombing, but for the god damn big chase he lead them on, and the killing of the Cop and throwing explosives at police and injuring them all! So i just feel that all these negative connotations towards him are deserved

Was he "directly seen by many shooting someone in the head?" Source? And if he was, then a trial would be the way to establish that the person seen doing this was indeed the man in custody. We may consider it likely, based on what we have heard, that the man is guilty, but our standard of evidence is not as rigorous as the court's.

There have to be some people to play's devil's advocate - being skeptical doesn't mean you necessarily have to believe fully one direction or the other. I don't really know what more you'd expect from a subreddit dedicated to conspiracy theories.

If you knew you were being framed for mass-murder and hunted to death by the people who have been harassing you for the past 2+ years (FBI), would you really just let them kill you?

While the FBI is allegedly notorious for solving their own crimes - that methodology isn't similar to what a clearly distraught mother is claiming, and it most certainly doesn't match up with what you're proposing.

It's even worse when the main sources proposing a set up rely on already disproven misconceptions and snippets of coverage from when this whole story just began to unfold (you know, the most rapid fire and unreliable information.)

You are being humanly correct but law doesn't work like that.

Lady Justice says it all.

False Flag man, MKUltra made these guys do this shit

We'll never know the truth...dude is already guilty in the court of public opinion, regardless.

casey anthony

Zimmerman.

Simpson.

Hitler...

Was proven innocent?

The Allies killed him before he could prove his innocence and to cover up their own war crimes dude. Get with the program. This is /r/conspiracy

Oh, my bad

What did Bart do this time? That kid is always getting into trouble.

proven innocent in court.

Hey, this statement fits all three!!And all three were thought to be guilty by the general population!

all three? are you from the future and know the verdict of the yet to be held Zimmerman case?

Ah true true, i was recalling incorrectly the pre-trial of Zimmerman. Anyways, that's a defense for someone else's remark. My remarks still stands, all three are thought to be guilty by the general population. Zimmerman still is, no one needs to hold an opinion on OJ Simpson anymore and Casey Anthony got away despite the entire country raging over her "obvious" guilt. So yeah i'd say all three were thought to be guilty by the general population, all without time traveling!

proven innocent in court.

How can you assuredly say that? The reason it took so long was because they wanted to be able to question his motives, otherwise why not just kill him on the scene last night?

The innocent don't run like that. You are incredibly naive. I for one hope the doctors give him too much morphine and he dies. The families of those killed and those that were maimed should be spared a trial.

You've never seen The Fugitive have you?

If you're being called the guilty one on TV, putting out pictures of you saying THIS GUY DID THIS SHIT and the police are coming at you with Humvees and looking trigger happy. Anyone would run. You would surrender and then you would go to jail for life. Or worse, they would say you tried to shoot them and just unload on you.

You need to step out of Hollywood and into the real world, dude.

Is it art that reflects life or the other way around?

Wow you're an idiot.

Yeah, I would definitely have a shootout with police and lob pipebombs that I just happened to have on hand at them.

I am disgusted by the lack of humanity this is bringing out in people.

I am disgusted by the lack of humanity this is bringing out in people.

It's a good reminder that humans are pack animals, capable of irrational behavior. Was Freud wrong in thinking humans were gripped by Thantos and a negative, aggressive impulse?

It's as if someone flipped the "Off" switch on the back of these people's heads and they react with their most primitive brain.

I would almost argue that this is showing people's humanity. It is human nature to want redemption, everyone in this thread is acting like this is just just an American thinking, butnit is human nature.

[deleted]

The hell are you talking about?

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/lookout/gene-rosen-sandy-hook-conspiracy-155033813.html

http://news.yahoo.com/oregon-man-charged-harassing-theater-shooting-victims-families-032025757.html

http://www.snopes.com/politics/conspiracy/boston.asp#vogt

Wakey wakey

Edit: Guys asks for what I'm talking about, get down voted for responding. Who are the "shills" here? Who has the agenda?

Not sure why you're being downvoted either.

"..and sympathizing with the murderer." You do realize that many of the conspiracy theorist you're critiquing don't believe he's the murderer, right? The rest believe there are other forces behind these incidents, which kinda explains the "sympathy" the whole not believing he's completely at fault is what defines them

I get it. But it doesn't make it any less disgusting. They can believe whatever they want, right or wrong. But when you start to harass people that got their legs blown off at a marathon or lost their child to a bullet to the face then you can clearly go fuck yourself.

Yes that is pretty despicable. Lucky, I haven't encountered anyone discrediting the actual victims of these incidents on here but if I ever do I'll be sure to tell them why I think what they're doing is wrong

Fuck you pussy. Execute this bitch in the hospital and move on. Fucking obamacare is saving his life while we front the bill, fuck everything about this. I hate you liberals.

I too feel so... I don't know really. The only thought going through my mind is what if this guy is innocent? All those people cheering for the death of this man who is in fact innocent until proven guilty, sad really Edit: also, officials saying thanks to the people who helped, no thanks to the actual people who crowdsourced lots of pictures :/

its funny how we can scoff at the middle eastern people who find joy in capturing our soldiers who are terrorizing them, but we find the same joy when capturing a suspect of terror here... we are no better than they, if he doesn't stand a fair trial

Good observation

He is a HUMAN, nationality means nothing.

We are ANIMALS, morality means nothing. Thinking on instinct & going with our gut is what's happening here.

Tell that to all of the people around the world America has killed, for political/profit reasons.

Reminds me of Jonbenet Ramsey's parents. They didn't kill her. Or Richard Jewell. Didn't plant the Olympic Park bomb.

Were these two smart enough to build these bombs themselves? Or did they have help? Because if they did then this isn't over by a long shot.

It honestly does not take much skill to build a pipe bomb. Anyone who's reasonably intelligent and has access to supplies can do it. we just need to keep the attention off of the shooter.

CNN posted a pretty detailed how-to on building bombs like this, gave the history of homemade bombs, and then even showed websites were you could get more information... WTF CNN?

What if they showed everyone how to make bombs so more bombs would go off so they could get more ratings?

Wow this is more fun than reality.

Also note how many bombs were at the marathon... four separate explosives. IF these two are even responsible at all, who helped plant the other two explosives?

there were only 2 explosives at the marathon.

edit: http://www.boston.com/news/local/massachusetts/2013/04/16/feds-seek-suspects-motive-boston-bombings/QkejBWGEKMopcHVekRXTHP/story.html

Says who? On Monday there was much talk of more.

There was a lot of confusion, but there were only two explosions reported at the marathon itself. There was an 'explosion' at the JFK library, but it turned out to just be a fire in an electrical room.

I was watching live coverage after the bombing and another explosion happened while a reporter was giving her report. She thought maybe they were setting off other explosives they had found. I can't recall the source... it was available online.

No, I knew that wasn't related. However, I do recall many mentions of other explosives being found in trash cans-- but the two bombs at the forefront of this story were beside the track. And there were controlled detonations of additional explosives found, if I am not mistaken. This is all just a compilation of what I have heard on Monday and the days following. I actually have not heard at all that it was only two explosives. All I've seen has offered a final count of at least 3-4.

Eh, Bomb Disposal guys do that with suspicious things to be safe quite often. I knew a guy who had his Ipad blown up because he accidentally left his bag in the wrong place. And when there's already confirmed bombs, they're going to play it safer than usual, as well.

From all eye witness accounts that I've heard, there wasn't more than 2 explosions at the marathon. They did however reportedly use explosives while being chased after killing the MIT police officer.

I will go back and read more into what exactly happened Monday, because we have apparently gathered different information. I didn't truly look deeply into this situation until about Thursday, aside from watching the news Monday. So since Thursday I have been playing catch up with the details of Monday's events (which have been a little drowned out by Thursday and Friday's).

I had the same discussion as you yesterday. The confirmed bomb that exploded under controlled circumstances suddenly vanished without a word that it wasn't a bomb, they just stopped talking about

And thus why I'm not sure how much I can trust from the media here-- from either side of the story. I wish there was a reliable source anywhere but there just isn't.

There was an even more strange situation in the holmes case, where I have seen a picture that suddenly vanished and no one seemed to remember that it even excisted. Gladly there was one person who replied to me that he has seen that picture too, otherwise I would've needed to question my mind.

Shit, I can't even remember today what the picture exactly showed, I sure make notes from now on and save everything that is suspicious. I think it was a picture where you could see two persons, holmes and another one, exactly like the people in the cinema described in the beginning, that there were two people, him and a man who looked like a SWAT in body armor and helmet, but that was forgotten completely later and it was only him in the end.

Do you remember the stories of another one involved amd there was a man with a full body suite and pictures on the parking lot with just holmes in normal dress without professional clothing?

Well, no, I do not remember that. But I believe it. See, until this incident I never paid any attention to anything conspiracy related. I have always fully trusted the government and anything they tell us-- hence why I signed up to serve and protect the country under their thumb... But this Boston Marathon changed everything for me. I will never believe a word they say again. Trust no one.

That's good, but please be careful. You have to make sure that you won't climb too deep into the rabbit hole and make sure that you don't get mad about the fact that there is almost nothing you can do. It's dangerous to take it all too personal and let it affect your life. Things like that can trigger a psychosis by some people. If you start to see a conspiracy in everything and feel like they're onto you, please pull the emergency break and stop.

Yes, I agree totally. Just from last night's 8 hour internet scouring session I feel stressed and frustrated. I think it's time for a break. But it is very upsetting to see such obvious flaws in this story and to believe that we as a country are just oh so wrong...

A trick that did it for me is to think logical to not get into the state of a helplessly . I compared it with the same mechanism that stops me from crying about every dead person I see in the media.

It was the Illuminati for me which made me start to look more into things than we get presented. I was kind of a freak about it when I was 19 and feeled that I had to step back from the emotions I put into it. Stay calm and think logically, not emotional. I think that is a dangerous combination if it goes too far. For any questions or discussions about every excisting topic, feel free to shoot me a message.

Says governor of MA, Deval Patrick

http://www.boston.com/news/local/massachusetts/2013/04/16/feds-seek-suspects-motive-boston-bombings/QkejBWGEKMopcHVekRXTHP/story.html

That wasn't a sassy comment by me, I was truly wondering what was said and by whom. I've seen several stories, as I imagine you have, and I am wary on who is reliable.

There were a lot of confused reports. Early reports that there were four devices in total were later retracted.

Is there any photos/videos of the second bomb site? I haven't seen any yet and I have been wondering about this as well.

http://files.foxnewsinsider.com/cdn/farfuture/uzTN2LamffPLSG3qnt2Wq5E6i1B5vvEZCA83wwWahRM/mtime:1366214116/sites/foxnewsinsider.com/files/styles/780/public/field/image/BombPhotoNew.jpg?itok=f5GI5nUU

That's the only picture I can find now. (Note-- not even a backpack in that picture, but a bag.) But of course we've all seen the picture of the black backpack near the young boy. And I remember hearing on Monday that there were supposedly bombs in trash cans being found. I found the final unofficial count of at least 4 explosives here: http://thepoliticalbreakdown.tumblr.com/post/48067977930/breakdown-boston-marathon-bombing

Well the photos were minutes before the bomb went off and then the second bomb was 10 seconds. That probably means they were walking down the track putting each bomb down and the last two didn't go off.

The question wasn't whether or not they went off, it was the logistics of two men with 4 explosives. Not calling it impossible, but if there were, in fact, at least 4 explosives... Where were they? In the backpacks? Did they remove them from the backpacks and place them and then leave backpacks? Did they make a second trip from the car to get the others? It just seems unlikely.

I see what you mean. It will be interesting to see the story they give out to the public which will probably be different from the truth.

As it always is. NOTHING about this story is adding up.

Hadn't thought about that...

So you're saying Blue-Robe-Guy and White-Hoodie-Mexican-Looking-Man could still be in the mix?

I want to believe.

Been wondering about blue hoodie mouth breather looking guy his back pack was identical imo to the one picture of the detonated bag.

I was just discussing this. There is no way this kid will get a fair trial. The media has already designated him as guilty. I don't know about the "Standoff" and the bombs allegedly thrown during that. Bill O'Reilly as soon as he came on earlier stated, "One of the suspects is in Hell...." really?

Also doesnt a jury need to be unbiased? How could they possibly find 12 unbiased people to be on this jury?

they could probably find them here! although flooded with media intel, not everyone formulates an absolute opinion as to the guilt or innocence of the accused. I for one don't have an opinion about any of this other than to say i don't like to see us as a compassionately capable species be so blood thirsty! guilty ppl should serve theie penance but more and more we just seek death in all matters disagreeable!

They have their scapegoat, taken alive. I'm not sure if its just me but the cheering and rejoicing is pretty sickening. Human sacrificing is alive and well in modern society.

If they wanted a scapegoat, he'd be dead.

Did they force this "scapegoat" to shoot and throw explosives at police? Cheering and rejoicing over him dying would be sickening, but he was captured alive, with strict orders to not return fire by FBI and SWAT, and was given medical attention. What's sickening about rejoicing that a dangerous man was captured and is no longer putting the city in danger?

Lol.

You are an idiot

come on man. the guy has left an entire city in torment for 32 hours and aided in one of the largest attacks on American soil in recent memory. I don't find the cheering sickening whatsoever, it's just people celebrating that they don't need to worry anymore.

[deleted]

well fuck me but I think the evidence is pretty damn incriminating

[deleted]

the pictures, the radical activity, the fact that the older brother was sent to the FBI in 2011, and the fact that they literally threw pipebombs at the police to escape. innocents wouldn't try to bomb the police

the guy allegedly has left

As far as I'm concerned, he is innocent until proven guilty in a fair trial. A fuzzy video doesn't convince me. The police or the FBI claiming that eyewitnesses identified him doesn't convince me. The police or FBI saying that they threw bombs at them or fired on them doesn't convince me.

It does appear that these are the right two guys. But until I see evidence that is beyond doubt that it is in fact them, I'm not going to celebrate their being caught or their being killed. Statements from the police or FBI don't convince me. I know that those guys will say anything to keep from looking like they fucked up.

What's at stake here is not that we think these two guys are necessarily innocent, or are good guys for bombing people. What is at stake here is the basic right for people to receive their fair day in court.

I know that the government can set up false flag events. I know that they have set up false flag events in the past. I know that the government has set up innocent people for crimes they didn't commit. And almost all we have to go on right now is the word of the government - a government that has proven itself to lie about this stuff before.

So I am skeptical. Because if no one is skeptical of our government, then it will do any and every thing it can to feed itself and grow more powerful, up to and including killing innocent people, and framing innocent people for some political agenda.

I'm not saying these guys didn't do it. I'm just saying that until he's proven to be the one who did, he has rights. And that knee-jerk 'MURRICA stuff about cutting off his head, well that just puts people at the same level as true terrorists - striking back without narrowing down your target to people who you are positive deserve it.

So what evidence would convince you?

Bomb making supplies at their residence

So no matter what I do, no matter how many people see me or if I'm captured on video while committing a crime, as long as I properly hide the stuff I used to prepare it, I'm innocent?

Brilliantly put. My thoughts exactly.

it honestly feels like an essay i read a while back. About how in the future we watch people who break out of social norms get hunted for fun.

Sounds interesting. Would you happen to have a name for this essay?

I too would like to read this essay.

I'll be waiting too. Letmereadpls.

break out of social norms

Interesting way to say 'firing and throwing explosives at the police'

uh not what he said. feels is not the same as is, nice work with the context...

What?? you consider this "breaking out of the social norms?"

I certainly want to live in a future where I can break out of social norms by killing people with explosives and guns and not have everyone freak out.

Morality is hardly just a social norm.

innocence and guilt are independent of proof. Innocent people have been sentenced and guilty have gone free. He's innocent in the eyes of the law until proven guilty, the eyes of the citizens have a different standard

I predict he'll be dead from bullet wounds before tomorrow.

Case closed! Great work boys!

But what if he's not? Won't that really hurt the conspiracy theories? Why would they take him in alive and not kill him, if this was so carefully controlled?

Depends on if they'll keep him muzzled and perpetually drugged like all their other high-profile "suspects" lately.

[deleted]

What mob mentality? All I'm seeing is people grateful bombs and shootings going through redditor's homes have stopped. If you had to hide in your closet while a gun battle raged through the streets of your city, I think you wouldn't be above joining in on the mob. The mob hasn't and won't murder this man. I am looking forward to the trial so that so many potential conspiracies will fail.

And if he isn't he was replaced by a government doppleganger. You will notice that he suddenly has a crazy haircut/ dyed his hair. He always blocks his face in front of cameras.

Are you for fucking real.

Dude, take a look at what subreddit you are reading. This place is full of these kind of people.

it still boggles the mind where some people's threshold for "crazy" starts

You can't hurt conspiracy theories. They're very pliable.

But then they won't get to waterboard him.

I wanted the guy alive. You can't ask a dead suspect questions.

Not yet anyway.

Well he is alive...

we act like we have rights anymore

Oh shut up... Try posting your whiney paranoid bullshit in North Korea.

you mad brah?

[deleted]

haha you have no life either to take that much time to insult me over the internet. I care = 0

I know it took me like 2 mins to write. I'm going to my day shift at the hospital tomorrow and then celebrating the end of this debacle with my friends in Boston. Enjoy your solitude and internet conspiracy theories on the internet.

b r a i n w a s h e d

at least be an original r/conspiracy poster

d e l u s i o n a l

have a pint, sit back and watch our freedoms erode, and ignore the irony of Boston being the place where our nation both forged and forgot what it meant to be an American.

U S A!!! U S A!!!

Examples? Stop speaking so vaguely and explain what freedoms eroded since the bombings.

U S A! U S A! entire city on lockdown for two people? U S A! U S A! three cities!!! U S A! U S A! house to house warrantless searches U S A! U S A!..

Forgive me for seeing past whats directly in front of my face.

[deleted]

OMG we've been in a police state since 9/11 officially, obama even signed the extension, its whatever... you can choose to ignore history and the facts, I choose reality.

You still haven't told me how our rights have been taken away due to the Boston bombings. So much hyperbole so little content.

I believe however, I did... They are exercising their rights to deploy armed military in the streets.

Again, I spoke about how these things dont happen overnight, it takes time, decades even, just because you dont see it within 48 hours does not mean its not at work, that things arent at play.

I like how we look just like jihadist though chanting U S A, its frightening

They bussed in hundreds of police... they had multiple MRAPS deployed with troops walking the streets and guys at the gunner position... for one 19 year old boy barely man.

I'm sorry you can't see what is unfolding...

While everything is in fact a combustion, a coup of this size take decades before your average minded individual can see the results of the explosion.

1933 Germany no one thought Hitler was evil... 1943, entirely different story.

Its ok though, again, enjoy your pint, I'm happy that this event is over and that our Police State got to demonstrate the extent of their power over a 19 year old boy barely man.

P.S. you all look like savages and terrorists the way you are depicted supporting this foreign regime that has hijacked our country.

[deleted]

Uh huh... until the next staged event. MRAPS! it aint nothin to it!

[deleted]

History is my evidence. And laws like NDAA and Patriot Act... its fine dude, i understand your lack of concern, i was there once too.

[deleted]

so dense, cant see past the first page

Am I supposed to care? let me guess you wish to now play on my emotions with this shit happening in Boston? Grow a pair.

Play on your emotions? This thread is about stopping the "witch hunt" in MY city. While basement dwelling armchair warriors defend the guys and say it's not really happening. That we no longer have rights because people were outside cheering because they could leave the house for the first time that day and the guy throwing bombs was no longer hiding in their neighborhood. Do you realize how stupid that makes you sound?

whatever you tell yourself

I tell myself that you're mentally ill.

I kinda am

No, he is not 'proven innocent until guilty,' he is presumed innocent until proven guilty.

I'm still confused about his backpack.

In the surveillance video his backpack is white, the picture of the destroyed backpack the bomb was in looks pretty black to me.

His backpack is not white in the surveillance video, what are you talking about?

Can you link the picture? The only pictures I've seen either him or his brother seem to be holding the bag that is evidence.

It isn't the same backpack.

The older brother had a black backpack.

I am fairly sure the white you saw was a combination of a bright sun that day and a squeaky clean window he walked by.

pretty guilty of shooting at police/throwing explosives/grenades at them too

What makes you people happy? The guy was arrested in a peaceful surrender and you're going on as if this was Dorner, pt. 2. You're going to feel foolish when he stands trial, but I'm sure by then Infowars will have something else to say.

And as for the chanting, it's really not so unbelievable or crazy mob activity, it was a show of gratitude for and pride in the uniformed personnel who worked so hard to make today's arrest. Not all cops are Constitution-shredding jackboots out to disarm and illegally search you, they really do get it right sometimes.

Hell yes, fuk yes to you, I am surrounded by Alex jonesains in my circle...props to you.

He won't be given miranda rights, as he is a terrorist suspect. Whether he survives long enough to make it to trial is another thing. A fair trial is unlikely.

I can't shake that this is either to distract from the 4chan images of possible mercinaries, OR this is one of those entrapment stings that either got away from them... or worse they let it go on.

I've not understood this part fully. I understand that the Patriot Act has some modifiers for rights granted to suspects, particularly some rights that were guaranteed in the bill of rights (attorney etc.)

So, whats to keep the guy from just shutting up? Say nothing, absolutely not a word. Do they just have intense psychological interrogation techniques that would just 'break' him? Would they starve him? Dehydration? Withhold medical care (he was injured)? Practically I can see them finding a vacant cell in Cuba, but that seems like a hard sell to the public.

There is nothing keeping him from shutting up. Miranda rights aren't required to be read. You always have Miranda rights. If they aren't read to you at the time of your arrest, self-incriminating statements can't be used against you in court, except in the public-safety exception (which was probably invoked here)... i.e., "did you plant other bombs".

If he shuts up, then america would have to resort openly to torture for information. That's if the people OK it. If not, there would be serious backlash.

I just want to know if the only fair trial is one is which he is found not guilty. There are mountains of evidence against him, so it isn't "fair" but I do think it will be done through our legal system in a court of law. I would hope no military tribunals or any such nonsense, and apart from some GOP who want to use this to label Obama weak I don't think that is a serious option.

My step dad was watching Fox News earlier, and I overheard Bill O'Reilly say "we will execute him." Fucking made me sick.

Luckily Obama is in charge and while he might get the death penalty, if he wants to live he could save us all the trouble of a trial and plead guilty.

[deleted]

Excuse me, this is /r/conspiracy not /r/soapbox

I don't know man. They say the dude's in serious condition at the moment. I actually hope he pulls through so we can hear his side of the story.

excuse us for keeping an open mind to other possibilities. plus, your statements are not backed up by proof, so they don't have too much weight here. him being taken alive is simply common sense btw. plus, we accept everyone's opinions, we are not convinced that there is one truth, we just like to think that the truth isn't always what it seems to be. until the truth is out we're just speculating with proof.

If he didn't do it, I'd love to know why his brother had bombs strapped to him and why they were throwing home made bombs and grenades out of a car window at cops.

I have not been able to find any video of the suspects throwing bombs at the police. Is there any evidence that suggests that was what happened at this point? You have to understand that official channels are suspect on this subreddit/ so the word of the police/FBI/ whoever is not enough on the subreddit. Do you know of or can you link video of the suspects throwing bombs at the police?

[deleted]

Dial down the hate dude he is just a guy on the Internet trying to make sure no one is spewing bullshit, and the last two paragraphs of your comment were unnecessary and unhelpful, you can voice your opinion without being a dick.

[deleted]

Ok, I understand a bit more now, sound like you have had it rough. Good luck, I was just trying to make a fact driven discussion hopefully we can catch these guys and stop this from happening again.

I agree. These guys hated Americans. They bombed a marathon for god's sake. I'm really glad they took him alive. It really legitimized the FBI's story.

I'm sorry, but why would an innocent person shoot at cops, drop explosives outside his vehicle and continue to run away and hide from the police?

Um.... Maybe because hes innocent and knows too much and theyre trying to kill him?? Open your mind a bit

How does that even make sense!?

Isn't that the plot in 30% of Hollywood movies?

lol

If they were trying to kill them to keep them from talking (about what?!), they'd both be dead. Sometimes things are what they look like.

By all means let's be open-minded, but not so open-minded that our brains drop out.

Thank you for posting this. You're right on the money.

The worst is that both CNN and Fox were talking about suspect 1 and "muslims", "Islamic army".etc. I can just feel something coming

My favorite from the news earlier: Referring to him as a "suspect", then referring to him as evil.

That's real PC.

The only way to stand above scum is to treat them well. Put them in jail after a trial but don't torture them. That's what Jesus was all about, and I'm no religious man. Too bad most religious people DON'T FUCKING UNDERSTAND THEIR OWN RELIGION.

I almost threw up when Osama was "killed" and people flocked to the streets to celebrate. Barbarians.

My wife, not from the US, told me, "This is why people don't like you guys." Referring to the mob chanting "USA, USA..." and cheering on the police when we know nothing and the kids were probably set up anyway.

Dude I know . I feel the same way. I feel like I was the only person who wasn't screaming and cheering when they said osama was dead. Holding his casket in the air like they were. I dunno I just don't think its right. Even if he was guilty...I can't Believe they even found the actual people that did these things..

Wait until its your family who gets their legs blown off or has to jump out of a 100 story building onto the pavement rather than burn alive in jet fuel. While I disagree with the Watertown streets turning into Fenway park after a homerun, I don't blame the people for publicly commending law enforcement and cheering the fact that they can start to feel safe again and come out of their houses.

What part of throwing homemade bombs out of your window and shooting at cops is innocent exactly?

This ^{^} Thank you!

They showed a naked man get arrested on LIVE tv, yet they can't show him getting arrested?

What happened? I missed the naked guy part

Some naked guy went out for a midnight stroll and the police overreacted.

[deleted]

Yep, that was the idea.

they found someone they thought was a suspect and made him strip down but ass naked, then were like oh, our bad.

Press were kept back in case of a firefight. What would it have helped for them to show him getting arrested?

They have shitty dashcam coverage of the supposed shootout. Only police chatter on the shootout. Explosions could have been them just throwing grenades saying it was explosions. People believe anything police or media tell them.

Which shoot out are you talking about? The first one had civilian eyewitnesses and the second one only had explosions from flash grenades or gas grenades thrown by the police.

The car chase scene in which they said pressure cooker bombs were tossed out of the window at the cops? Did you watch the coverage of any of it?

Civilian eyewitnesses of the shootout of what? at 7/11? The cops turned that around and said it wasn't the suspects they were looking for.

They probably beat his ass before arresting him.

Amerikkka.

[deleted]

I have seen the picture. I was watching the news and the feed I was watching it never showed him...

I hope he doesn't end up dying like the suspect #1.

Does his Aunt, Father, and Mother not matter in all of this? Saying they strongly believed it was a set up?

There are endless questions to this atrocious reporting and fear mongering by the media. Also, people aren't considering all of the facts surrounding this event.

Exactly. We can't just jump to conclusions based on the mayhem that's been going on this past week. The point is, we don't know what exactly happened or who exactly did it. That's what a trial is for, but even then some trials convict the wrong people and vice versa. Let's just hope that he survives and is allowed to speak. Also, mass media says that the man who saw the suspect in the boat said that he was covered in blood... but I only see a little bit of blood on the face in the picture that's circling around.

I too hope he doesn't die and we get to hear why he did it.

His family are just trying to look for any defence possible, which is understandable. Other suspects were chosen from pictures. Maybe they are clinging to the hope this is the same. Main difference is the other guy walked into a police station, he didn't shoot them or try and blow them up.

Media are mostly shit, I thought that was just a given around these parts.

his mother spoke with the FBI on several occasions according to her.. What makes her any less credible than MSM??

this picture is already circling the internet.

Photo of Jahar http://imgur.com/XDuMHCY

What is deplorable exactly? They are giving him medical attention. A guy 1000's of people right now want dead is being given the gift of modern medicine because of the awesome justice system america has in place.

Other places in the world giving medical attention to someone who is suspected by the public of killing innocents would be a joke, and you would be shunned from your community for doing so if not killed yourself.

Why is it that so many people in this sub have a kneejerk reaction to any sort of authority? I fucking hate certain things large governments have done, their are without a doubt a bunch of things that never became public domain that governments did which are immoral and despicable and their will be more in the future. But that doesn't mean every god damn bad thing that happens was in direct relation to a government like it seems this sub would have you believe. To the contrary if one were to look at all the horrible stuff to good stuff any country has done when comparing our somewhat corrupt government to most of the highly corrupt governments around the world you might stop criticizing every single action and start giving props when they are deserved.

What's deplorable about this picture? They're giving him medical treatment.

and first ask the question "why?" ... LOL do you even have a brain?

I find it slightly ironic that the front page post of this sub yesterday was a complaint about people coming in and insulting unnecessarily, and while I've been here the majority of immaturity and rudeness has actually come from people who participate in this sub the most.

(What's deplorable about shooting a guy in the neck who's shooting and throwing bombs at you?)

I hope you didn't mistake myself and ComeAtMeBrother's question as rhetorical.

I desire an opinion/defense from you as to why you see this as deplorable?

[deleted]

The other photo is of his brother.

He's not proven innocent until guilty. That doesn't even make sense. He's presumed innocent until proven guilty.

Dude relax, that's clearly a typo.

A typo is a letter in the wrong place. This is major derpage.

What about the part where he shot a cop?

That was the old america. when due process, the fourth (and all the others) amendment were things, and acts like the NDAA was shit the BAD GUYS did.

What do you mean by 'old America'? The amount of innocents put in prison or put to death in the past is still staggering, regardless of this boy's guilt or innocence.

It was weird to see people acting like Jihadists against terrorists. I mean, seeking justice is one thing, seeking revenge is what makes a Jihadist.

Nothing fights terrorism like terrorism.

Something Doesn't seem right with all of this. I am not a nut job by any means SO please ... I just finished reading about the younger brother and by all accounts from hundreds of people he was a happy sweet gracious young person . Could this be some sort of ruse staged to make us think it could be anyone, anywhere, anytime and to try and divide us through paranoia and fear of each other ... I am a totally normal down to earth guy that likes to look at both sides of every story but something just isn't right here .

It is obviously a tragedy of what ideological motivations can do to screw with an otherwise normal person. It isn't right, and it should make us think. But we need to accept that there is something wrong with ourselves as humans that can make horrible choices, and that it isn't some government or secret society that is causes all of our problems. The fact a good man can turn bad in the wrong circumstances is a very scary thought because it means it could be anyone you know, and you'd much rather it be someone that was an alien.

You are not crazy for not taking something at face value.

Even if he is guilty of the crime I think it's more important to get to the bottom of things so we can do whatever possible to try to prevent it from happening again. They were both so young it just breaks my heart that someone so hateful could be so influential to such young minds. It makes me wonder what they had going on in their personal lives that would enable them to think doing something so horrific was a good thing! Makes my heart ache for everyone. It's all so senseless, and there's never any winners :-(

Honestly, we always say we have to do what's possible to prevent it from happening again, but there's really no way to do that. There's shit like this that happens every fucking week in the Middle East. Don't you think if there was a way to prevent it from happening again they would've found it decades ago? Just sayin. I think it's just the government's way of trying to gain control over us little by little. While everyone's busy worrying about this situation, the CISPA bill was passed by The House of Representatives this week. I'm convinced it's all a set-up.

Since I read over this and noticed that I used a lot of profanity, I want to point out that it's not directed at you. I'm just venting.

I completely agree that it's more than likely a government set up. I feel that way about a lot of things that go on. It's just upsetting that so many ppl continue to get hurt. Not only the victims but the criminals too. Maybe something could have been done to save them too. Unfortunately the world is run by evil. I just can't help but remain optimistic. May be ignorant or silly but I'll always hope for better.

It's impossible to prevent every crime, it is possible to learn to protect yourself

Yes. Clearly. That doesn't mean we can't try.

I get the sense that the big brother brainwashed the kid brother. I didn't hear a negative thing about him from his former teammates, friends or neighbors. While it certainly looks like the kid participated and should suffer the consequences, there are a lot of questions that need to be answered before we know how deeply involved he was.

I wonder how come they aren't reporting on the character of the older brother who died already? They're just telling about the character of the guy who's still alive. The media uses some slick tactics. Or maybe I'm just too much of a conspiracy theorist for my own good.

I have seen a lot of information about the guy. He apparently was the ringleader of this operation, and was interviewed by the FBI a year or so ago about potential terrorist leanings, but they found nothing, and I guess there wasn't much followup? He spent 6 months back in Russia and the authorities want to know what he was up to there.

This has to be the most bizarre series of events, ever. It's like the twilight zone. This story really reminds us that we are still animals.

I couldn't agree more man.

You're right of course. I think we saw the death of due process widely publicized with Dorner. They just did not care about the law.

A couple things:

• He will have a civilian criminal trial: http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2013/04/19/What-Next-Civilian-Criminal-Trial-for-Marathon-Bombing-Suspect

• He is a suspect in the bombings but was in multiple shootouts with police. It's pretty much accepted that he is guilty of shooting at cops, because, well, he did and there are dozens of cops as witnesses.

• Miranda rights protect him from incriminating himself. As he was shooting at dozens of cops, they don't really need a confession. They have enough eyewitness reports.

• His apartment was described as a bomb-making factory. It's safe to assume they were planning on using these bombs they made, and they waived his miranda rights until they know no more bombs have already been planted. (In theory at least, this one could be open to interpretation.)

Carry on.

Yep, cops are the most trustworthy witnesses ever.

well, he did get shot twice during the shootouts. I guess it's possible that he was a civilian in the wrong place at the wrong time, but if that's the case why would he run and hide for something like 18 hours?

Also, if it was one (or two?) cops OK I might be skeptical as well, but we are talking a small army of police men.

Rooting for someone's rights to be violated chips away at your own.

I support the kid kind of (If he is from Chechnya). The US government has been involved in covert operations and the destabilizing of the area. If there is one thing you Americans lack it is empathy, which is odd after 9/11. People from all other parts of the world have every right to hate you; you run around policing the world and dictating law over areas that you have no rule. Anyways, I think it was probably these 2, but the bigger question is Why they did it? In my Eyes it's blowback from American involvement in Chechnya, or else the FBI set this up with the intent to catch them before it happened but failed. And don't look at me like I'm a conspiracy nut because The New York Times have covered the FBI doing this a handful of times over the past decade. Also worth nothing is this 4chan post https://twitter.com/YourAnonNews/status/325372566359388161/photo/1 Not even sure if it's legal to post links in reddit comments, hopefully I don't get bombarded with down votes for my opinions or the wrongful posting of that link. Note the post in that link was made on Monday before any suspects were confirmed.

kind of agree, if another country or group constantly attacked Texas (or America for that matter) i think there would be a few thousand pickup trucks heading that direction in no time loaded up with good old boys.

im so damned proud of the Boston PD for not taking him out, they deserve so much f#ing respect for the discipline they showed and i hope he gets to tell the world his story.

if he dropped a bag that blew up and hurt people- he has to be punished accordingly though.

there were two bomb sites, and probably two groups.

The only comments I've seen like that have been in the non-conspiracy threads. Like normal reddit users forget that in the U.S. everyone is innocent until proven guilty. It really seems like the vast majority of reddit is ignorant, and clearly have the hive-mind mentality. It's quite sad to see so many dumb people in the normal threads. A lot of people on reddit are dumb enough to believe CNN if they said the Moon was flung out of Earth's orbit.

And really, people don't know that CNN is controlled by the US Government (I think I first read that on reddit actually). So we're really just hearing what they want us to hear about the situation. We'll probably never know the truth.

Is there any chance that the NDAA will play into all this?

Yup, but unfortunately, he won't be talking to the media, his family, his friends or a lawyer for the unforeseen future. He may be innocent until proven guilty, but he will receive no Miranda Right, and is expected to be handed off for a "Military Interrogation". I'll let the readers decide what that means.

I think the Intelligence Interrogation is a bad idea. He's an American citizen and deserves due process. When we start making exceptions to that notion, then one has to question the process.

I think it's bad for many reason. First for all the reasons I've previously stated, and the fact that once he shut away, we won't ever learn the truth. At least if he had a lawyer, she could address the public on his behalf and make a statement (hear his side of the story), but that's never gonna happen.

There's a reason that the press calls him a suspect. This new panel doesn't treat him that way. All his friends are shocked and find his transformation into a terrorist hard to believe -- this alone makes me want to know more.

It stands to reason that these guys had some help someway somehow. One does not build a bomb by accident. Are they guilty of that which they have been charged? The old axiom still applies, if it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, quacks like a duck...most of the time you've got a duck.

you don't have to be "innocent until proven guilty" when on trial to be convicted, thats not how the law works. goddam shitty tv shows making everyone think it is.

This is one of my responses to someone in another post. I am quoting but I think the logic is sound.

"Again. It is not my responsibility to prove these person's innocence to their accusers. Those whom are making the allegations against them have to first prove reason as to why they are suspects to begin with beyond eye witness testimony which has been proven to be the most unreliable source of information due to the ease of persuasion most individuals can succumb to. However, what creates my distrust is the number of possible suspects being narrowed down two these two individuals based upon the these facts which were given:

They had backpacks.

They were seen there.

They were seen running.

Taking away eye witness accounts, all of which have not been made public (who, what, when, where and why) how many individuals can be named as suspects meeting this criteria? This is why in the fourth amendment it states the need for probable cause. According to what has been put forth about these individuals a case for probable cause is broad and can apply to many suspects.

However, the reasons the media has chosen to single them out over photographs of people who; look more capable, are actually seen via photographs at the scene, visual confirmation of the same packs worn by these individuals then viewed again actually abandoned on the ground right at the bombs location (via photographs), all seem to me to have more "probable cause" than these suspects. The probability increases when taking into account that we know the media has lied in the past and is not a reliable source of information.

This is all assuming that you, an individual, values your own reasoning skills and do not defer them to institutions which have a history of dealing in secrecy and deceit.

If you do "trust" that these institutions have your best interests in mind than you would have to disregard an entire history of them contradicting your trust on countless cases.

If you wish to refute my logic in the future please point out what specifically you disagree with along with providing an alternative framework so that I may properly rebuttal."

Your sense of compassion is obvious. The situation just shows how the mob mentality can take over .

I agree, it felt weird watching people cheer and party for these men being killed and captured before they were even proven guilty...

we cheer after everything, and of course it was stirred up in front of the cameras.

Nope just you. And there hasn't been ANY mention of it on reddit, either.

100% with you OP. Two wrongs don't make a right. I don't like the guy (assuming he's the one who did it and wasn't set up), but I don't think he deserves to be treated horribly. He's a human, he has rights. All these circle jerking "true patriotic" americans who are saying he should have just been shot, or toss him in prison and let him rot, or give him the chair (figure of speech). I'm like "you do realize that part of being a patriot is adhering to the rules in this nation that make sense, principally one that we pioneered- a fair goddamn trial with due process (correct me if I'm wrong about the pioneering part, I just feel that its a core value of this country).

Exactly, We are told they were the ones who set off the bombs, fleed the college of the shot office, they were at the store that was robbed while getting gas, they were said to have several shoot outs with cops and stolen cars blah blah blah.... .....

Anyways there is dash cams and surveillance cameras and I want to see one or both of them in the action because this is all info that was told to us by the media not once have i seen with my eyes yet evidence.

All I can say is I want to see the trail and evidence.

Anyways there is dash cams and surveillance cameras and I want to see one or both of them in the action because this is all info that was told to us by the media not once have i seen with my eyes yet evidence.

There's already evidence of him walking to the scene of the explosion with a backpack. A picture of him immediately behind the poor 8 year old who died, possibly with his backpack on the ground. And then a photo of him fleeing with no backpack.

He absolutely deserves a fair trial (which is why they haven't and shouldn't just publicly dump all the evidence they have). What is available so far is pretty damning, though. There's a possibility it's all coincidental, but it seems rather unlikely at this point.

I agree completely. Now if only it were possible for him to get a fair trial here.

That is if the police don't just kill him.

my thoughts exactly. the tv is acting like a judge and the general public is becoming the jury

I agree, two wrongs do not make a right. People don't seem to think that by wishing death upon them they are just as bad as the people that brought death to us. Justice will prevail but eye for an eye is not the answer, if we all done that there would be just one guy left with on eye in the whole world...

Force feed him 1000 pills and put into trial - us gov way of dealing with 'terrorists'

Exactly. They got their grips on this poor patsy now. He's gonna be drugged all to hell and propped up for the cameras.

I was waiting for the news to say they were both killed...end of story. Im quite pleased that he was taken alive because I would actually like to some fucking evidence during the trial.

I just can't believe that he is the only suspect left. They shut down the entire city of Boston and two other smaller towns close by, and you're going to tell me they did all that for one 19 year old with a gun? Plus I heard a recording of a police scanner that said they were chasing a stolen state police SUV when the chase of the two boys supposedly happened, but the media told us they stole a mercedes

Dude is probably guilty but you are right. What happened in Boston is a part of the Human condition. The rush to judgment is often clouded by our rose colored glasses.

That kid is still an AMERICAN. His 6th amendment rights are being violated. how is he going to get a fair trial if the news and the population already decided he is a terrorist. Has anyone seen any evidence of his connection? NO. Also all the "Shoot out" videos online do not show them shooting back only the police shooting at them.

I agree. There seems to be all kinds of missing evidence, and things that really don't add up.

If we learned anything from the Donner incident, it's that a lack of due process doesn't really anger Americans, sadly.

He is proven innocent until guilty.

No. We assume innocence until we are given concrete evidence to support the notion of guilt. That means that, yes, we should treat him as if he is innocent until he is legally convicted of his crimes. That's not the same as him actually being innocent.

It's a reservation of judgment, not an actual inference of innocence or guilt. You insisting upon his inherent innocence is no better than people assuming his guilt and crying for his blood.

Just my two cents.

I understand the burden of proof is with the prosectution, but then why run?? Why not, if falsely accused, walk to the nearest police station with a lawyer and turn yourself in so you can be cleared. There were a couple other wrongful arrests and those guys were cleared pretty quickly...

he was chilling in his dorm room, went to a house party and everything!

i commented for the kid's innocence in another post, and i was downvoted and ridiculed. i'm so happy to see people here with a bit more reason.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

most of the people here in america are idiots, 20% use their heads around here enough to treat this guy like a human

I was going to post this here originally, but put it under rant instead. http://www.reddit.com/r/rant/comments/1cplwp/right_now/

He is proven innocent until guilty.

what??

I think OP meant "presumed innocent". I hope...

he's fucking 19

And killed an 8 year old and 3 other people

Allegedly

So?

Are you saying that 19-year-olds shouldn't know any better?

Yes. A 19 year old kid knows better. But the point is HE IS A KID. There is more to this story and he deserves a fair trial.

As a straight guy I will say this, he is an adorable looking guy.

I'm not even going to bother to watch the news, I've been watching since the 15th non-stop. But I know exactly how the crowds are reacting right now, i'm going to spare myself. If he is guilty he should be punished and all and its very fucked up the things he did. I can't stand the herd behavior from the crowds.

reddit front page is fucking full of FBI praising. I smell a rat...

totally agree with you

The false flag flies. You dare trust them. They will show you true deceit.

I am with you OP.

Can someone explain why when I opened up my front page I saw literally (that's dictionary literally) 15 posts congratulating the BPD on 'such an amazing job' (edit; or joking about boats, or blasting the LAPD) on the first two or so pages.

Really? Reddit doesn't work like that. People don't upvote that much of the same stuff. (3 whole subjects? Lapd sucks, burning boats, or hide and seek masters?) It feels like propaganda.

Edit:This might sound kinda ramble-y, but all I'm saying is that reddit isn't that focused. I've been here for a year- it's not like that or getting better.

I'll also admit that I'm subscribed to adviceanimals, but I still find it odd that the top posts of that subreddit (and mostly only that one, oddly) are following the trend I'm referring to.

Observe - http://i.imgur.com/hnzY7Xq.png http://i.imgur.com/8GsvXKy.png 18 posts before we find one that isn't related to the ordeal? Isn't that just a little suspicious/odd?

Edit: now the top advice animals post is blatantly calling /r/conspiracy stupid.

are we not here to observe and discuss stuff with good evidence and reason? The front page is nothing but drivel, and we are the stupid ones. Wtf.

They are showing to the authorities some "respect" after that ddos attack, which very probably came from the authorities...

She's a witch, Burn her.

How do you know she's a witch?

Well, uh, she was seen wearing a knapsack. And a hat. And she isn't from around here!

She turned me into a newt!

It all starts with a story. Once they have the story about you it doesn't matter if it's true. If you're reading this you've probably already had the feeling that maybe the courts were all game made to vindicate the stories that are told.

99.99% of all Americans and 99.9999% of all humans did not see or have any contact with the bomber but we believe that it happened as it did because the story was told from the moment the shrapnel flew. False Flag they call it when a Ship flies the flag of a foreign nation to elude or ambush an enemy. Well friends I would say indeed that there is a ship flying a false flag in America- and it is the Federal government. The Federal reserve is allowed to prop up the markets and keep the global ponzi scheme alive just long enough to get the Federal assets trained and into place. What better exercise is there than a manhunt in a large populated metropolitan area. Find the one man- that's really all there is isn't there. What if I disappeared tonight? What if you disappeared tonight?

All it takes is a few voices on NPR; a few angry talkshow hosts to rile you up, some sensational images of men acting serious with guns; a lot of high definition pictures and lastly- a few dead Americans. The FBI has now trained everyone to be their cheerleaders- memes are sprouting up making jokes about miranda rights. We WANT to help them catch the terrorists- it's a serious cool game to us now! Well let me tell you there are no terrorists.

It was a false flag. The dead Americans are not a big deal to the people who detonated it. Why? Because they know that the banks, the stock market, the dollar- it's all going to collapse. It's all propped up through printing and promises and derivatives.And when it collapses theres going to be a lot more blood. When the oil runs out- when the oceans collapse- when the water is too toxic to drink- when the "Rapid, Non-Linear, Unpredicatble" events begin to occur that we all know are going to happen- begin to happen---->

Then those who sow the seeds of false flag terrorism will begin to reap their harvest- The harvest of a plastic and willing public. A public who is not only easily fooled- but made to feel as if they are in on the fight. Happy to kill and convict- excited to join in on the shaming and high-fiving, the joking and boasting.

Time will tell what is to come dear friends, it seems that the night has grown dark and my light, dim as it may be, is radiant in this inky black. You need to ask yourselves a few questions before you too turn out your lamp tonight;

Do you think things will be better a year from now? 3 Years? 10? 50? When (not IF) your light doesn't turn on one morning- what do you do? when it doesn't come on for a day? 3 Days? a Week? A Month....A year?

What if you look on the computer one morning to find your picture under the banner "Lone Wolf Terrorist"?

Sounds like this is just the right case to roll out all the nasty new things in the shiny new NDAA. But it'll be ok because he's a terrorist, and a muslim and a Chechnian.

you smell a patsy also?

If you can't pronounce his name, he must be one dem terrist.

Boston Police tweeted: "CAPTURED!!! The hunt is over. The search is done. The terror is over. And justice has won. Suspect in custody."

Guys, justice has already won. The terror is over! He doesn't need a trial.

/s

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-fi-boston-bombings-media-20130420,0,19541.story

^ This stuff makes me sad. We are celebrating the very thing we scream bloody murder about when another nation does to us. Our hypocrisy knows no bounds. I want to surrender my citizenship, only where do I go?

It's okay, you sound like a pussy anyways. Edit:I'm a smartass.

Bitch bitch bitch bitch. Bitch bitch bitch bitch bitch bitch bitch bitch. - OP

THANK YOU SOMEONE UNDERSTANDS ME

This week we bore witness to an appalling act of violence. Then we were treated to the spectacle of a disaffected Elvis impersonator/janitor mailing ricin letters to a Senator and the President. Friends and neighbors said he seemed like such a mild mannered guy. At the same time a fertilizer factory blows the hell up, and we learn that two Americanized brothers morph from average, low-stress guys to terrorists. The press were reporting themselves reporting anything that slipped into their shiny heads, and furiously interviewing each other. In actuality, they proved distracting and many people got their news from social media. I ask myself: how hard would it be to recruit people to do things they wouldn't normally conceive of? People will debase themselves for fifty bucks a night to be a pop star these days. How hard would it be to manipulate the sore and simple-minded among us? People on the street where the guys stayed mentioned that the brothers had a crew coming around their place in recent weeks with clean cars, stylish clothes, and expensive shoes. Who was calling the shots of that crew? Was it a gang? How hard would it be to hide this activity from the press? Easy as throwing them a cookie? I hate to sound like Alex Jones because he is stark raving mad, but ultimately I have to wonder if all this stuff has more to do with the Sequestration than "they hate us for what we stand for." If certain shadowy elements within the industrial/military complex who are well versed in Psy Ops and Counter-terrorism wanted their funding restored back to full levels—if they wished to flex some muscle and make everyone (including the President) scurry to their tune, the events of this week could effectuate that readily. Now, whenever we see a Blackhawk helicopter over a major US city, instead of thinking why the military has deployed basically a tank in the air over our heads, we'll be more apt to say, "they must be looking for bad guys." Pretty soon we will forget when it was different. Surveillance will be second nature, we will do it to each other with our devices. We will never feel really secure again, but it will be OK. Perhaps if we re-establish and strengthen the defense spending supply lines these sorts of things will abate, and we can be wrapped in the full bosom of freedom forever.

bumpitty-bump.

[deleted]

Even if he is considered to be 'guilty' by a court, if I'm not in there I will forever remain indifferent. I've been in court cases where I've gotten off on a technicality. There was "eye witnesses", descriptions, reports, a million things. Even people who admitted their own guilt said I was there. But I was innocent. It was looking absolutely hopeless, but I found a flaw and, on a technicality, I was found to be not guilty. But I shouldn't have been, and anyone else who wasn't me wouldn't have found this technicality, and they would've been caught. From my own issue I will never judge anyone unless I'm presented with the full facts from both sides of the fence.

So are you going to go or are you going to shut up about it forever?

All part of the new world order. The government wants to take our guns so we will have no way to defend ourselves. We are not free in this country. Big brother is always watching and looking for ways to being us down. Just a thought but does anyone else think so?

the new world order has always been the one conspiracy theory I've believed to be somewhat real.

Yeah I totally agree.

There is more to this story. I guarantee it. Nothing in this story ads up.

好!

So when it comes out he was never at a militant camp or mosque will they begin to question whether they're losing the battle of hearts and minds? Probably not.

Do you mean the innocent guy that had a shoot out with the police before being captured, less that 24 hours after his brother died while having a shootout with the police? Seems logical that an innocent guy would lead a man hunt for 5 days and shoot at some cops.

allegedly

Welcome to the fall of Rome.

Bread and circuses.

I'll just leave this here. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TBobEiXInxQ&feature=player_embedded#!

You're right, shooting at cops, detonating explosives. Totally innocent.

Human Rights- ----Right to a fair trial- Sounds familiar to anyone?

I'm right there with you. I can't honestly remember the last time they actually did it the legal way and brought someone in to be proven guilty. There are far to many "self inflicted gun shots" that end the lives of "suspects." Instead of real police work and handling the situation legally we see giant manhunts that end with bodies one way or the other. Dorner gets locked into a cabin by police who then burn it down not know if there are innocent hostages inside with him. Yesterday in order to find a 19 year old kid who's elder brother they killed in a shot out, a major American city was put under Marshall law while they went door to door violating peoples rights and our laws by rummaging through the homes of innocent civilians. And even are all that effort they still barely took him alive.

Agreed. We are not judge, jury, and executioner. No matter how flawed the justice system may be, we have to believe in it and strive to do the right thing. If we kill the bad guys with no second thought, we are no better than they are.

[deleted]

Because he was seen throwing bombs and grenades out of a car window. He had not one, but two shoot outs with the cops. He murdered that officer from MIT. ...yes, 90% of it is on video. If this kid isn't guilty, he's crazy as fuck and still needs to face the repercussions of his actions. Yes he'll pass through the legal system as usual. Yes, he'll face traditional judgement. However some people in here (not you specifications. Just saying..) need to get the fact that this is a very passion-inducing event. People are going to react violently to violence. When they see wanton death and destruction they will cry for blood. They'll see reason later. They will. They always do. But Jesus, let people fucking vent their anger and outrage.

[deleted]

Well, he and his brother admitted to it when they hijacked the car. Is a confession of guilt not enough?

“Those who desire to give up freedom in order to gain security will not have, nor do they deserve, either one.”

Benjamin franklin

He is guilty! There's proof...

Stop acting like a fuckin fool

The harder it is to recognize that right, the more important it is. You just got Battlestar'd.

I don't know who here is calling for blood. I would be happiest the more normally this case proceeds. I'm more concerned that that incompentent beotch Carmen Ortiz is invoking a "public safety" exception to mirandizing Tsarnaev when the police and FBI publicly stated the danger is over. She could botch the case by making it exceptional.

This is probably pseudo-terrorism. I bet one or the other brother had some kind of setback and psychological break that made him want to go out as some kind of self-styled avenger. The less unusually the case is handled the better.

Welp. He's no longer innocent till proven anything. I suppose a couple people may finally hear about habeas corpus going out the window.

Here is a list of video links collected from comments that redditors have made in response to this submission:

• VideoLinkBot FAQ
• Feedback
• Playlist of videos in this comment

Anyone notice "The Craft", a Blackwater style agency, was there before and after the bombing?

yeah, at the finish line though.

the image shared that allegedly shows Dzhokar shows him near the other position.

He will be given his Miranda rights and tried as a civilian.

He's not proven innocent until guilty...he's 'presumed' innocent until guilty.

http://www.reddit.com/r/boston/comments/1cpx51/death_of_the_us_constitution/

shills are out in full force...

best bet for people who can see whats goin on in this world?

Go to a developed but small nation that has minimal impact on the global dealings and live a peaceful life.

The Most Ignorant Country the World has ever known happens to be, by far, the most powerful as well...

Livin in the belly of the beast.

it is comfy here, but we should be conscious of what's being done in our name.

So brave of you to make a post like this in r/conspiracy.

People is just scared; it's natural they would react like this when scared. They are not reasoning.

its super fishy that two brothers (if unconnected to this event), would run away from a bombing-seperated.

i know that if i went to the marathon with my brother and it was attacked-we would be running away side by side.

i wouldnt have tried so hard to make it look like we didn't know each other.

that being said, i think that most of us that listened and transcribed the scanner traffic throughout the night believe that more than one group was involved.

I havent heard ANYTHING about what type of guns this kid and his brother used. Is anyone else curious about this? After all we've heard of these magnificent gun battles not once have we heard anything reported on what weapons were used. I remember during Sandy Hook, they were reporting on it with in the hour after it occured.

Answers then death

we are in deep...er kaka...the final false flag to throw the dragnet on us all...be careful eyes open...

AMEEEEEN

He will most likely die or be killed before any answers are possible. Mark my words. Therefore they will have no reason to show any evidence that was claimed because there will be no trial.

You know, the more I uncover, the more it looks like if only some chick would've banged him when they were partying the Wednesday before, this whole thing might never of happened. Dv;js

"I don't have any American friends."

Don't have, or don't want? Maybe there are generalizations being had by BOTH sides, eh?

I'm sure they wanted to belong and have achievement. Too bad their choices were doctor or mad bomber.

Yeah, I just don't get that at all, not when, say, the younger one could've chosen to up stakes, moved out west & grow weed! Now that sounds like a SUPER career choice, and a lot more fun. Now he's gonna rot in jail for the rest of his days for what? Being a murderous asshole.

One of his last rants on whatever social media he uses, " I don't have one American friend." If only someone had blazed him out and sent him to Portland.

this isnt conspiracy...

If he didn't do it he wouldn't have been running and hiding in a boat, it's as simple as that.

I'm not suggesting he wasn't guilty, but if you had 900 officers, swat teams and the national guard after you, I think you would be hoofing it, too.

Yeah, running from the cops always makes you look innocent. Good thinking.

[deleted]

A guy came forward the other day after being targeted as the bomber. History has already forgotten that dude because he didn't do it

[deleted]

TIL I am history

We need more proof that they did this. So far all I see is a fucking picture of them walking. I think they needed to find someone fast and close this thing. Notice how it was all done after CISPA was put through??? Yeah...

I'd say planting a bomb on campus, throwing bombs at police and donning a suicide vest is not something an innocent person would do.

I'm just saying. He's guilty as hell, and thankfully he's in custody.

I agree with you, but at the same time I wouldnt mind if this mother fucker's guts were spread across the street

Finally some sense on this subreddit.

I don't think the government considers anyone innocent until proven guilty.

And killing them is the best way for an hypothetical cover up.

This whole witch-hunt makes me wonder if its just to hide/ justify the passing of CISPA and justify a number of government decisions that have keen made recently, which remove more of our freedoms (like a government takeover of the Internet in an "emergency").

He is legally presumed innocent until proven guilty, if they treat him like an American Citizen. But the evidence is overwhelming, and he most assuredly is guilty.

Plus, they are refusing to give him his rights as a citizen. If I were a crazy conspiracy nut, I'd be far more worried about that fact.

If you're referring to the lack of Miranda rights, it's because it's technically an act of terrorism and therefore they don't have to Mirandize him.

I'm sorry, but that is a bullshit excuse, and I hope for the sake of our constitution that this kid is smart enough to keep his mouth shut anyway.

The exception, according to the FBI‘s website, “permits law enforcement to engage in a limited and focused unwarned interrogation and allows the government to introduce the statement as direct evidence.”

The point? They don't have time to dick around getting a lawyer and for him to get a story and bullshit together. They have to act NOW to see if he had accomplices and if so, where they are. BEFORE they leave the country. Because if he did, and if they do get out.. guess what. All the conspiracy theorists are going to cry how "our government knew who they were and let them go free and just made a show of acting like they were looking for them."

According to the FBI, the HIG’s “mission is to gather and apply the nation’s best resources to collect intelligence from key terror suspects in order to prevent terrorist attacks against the United States and its allies.”

Like it or not, he is an American Citizen, and deserves to be afforded his rights. All of them.

Not if it's in the law. I'm sorry, but law is law. He allegedly committed an act of terrorism. If there are others involved they need to find out now, not later.

The Constitution is above the law.

Under the Constitution, you are afforded a lawyer, and are innocent under the law until proven guilty. If they are allowed to remove someone's rights because of an allegation, then we don't have rights at all.

Again -

The exception, according to the FBI‘s website, “permits law enforcement to engage in a limited and focused unwarned interrogation and allows the government to introduce the statement as direct evidence.”

According to the FBI, the HIG’s “mission is to gather and apply the nation’s best resources to collect intelligence from key terror suspects in order to prevent terrorist attacks against the United States and its allies.”

Where is this exception listed in the Constitution?

Everyone seems to think that this guy is a piece of human garbage and doesn't deserve the rights of an American Citizen, but it is precisely this kind of human garbage that the rights need to be fought over. Because it is there that a corrupt government will put the wedge of injustice.

I hope he dies, frankly. I don't want our tax money going toward keeping him alive. But if you love your freedom, you must admit that even the dregs of society, the human garbage, have rights, too. Our Constitution, and the numerous documents that influenced it worldwide, outline those rights.

If we don't fight for those rights for him, what hope do we have for ourselves?

I'm glad they captured him alive (while absolutely agree on not wanting tax dollars supporting him.) only because I want details. I want to find out his side and why this even happened.

I want to know, too. We all do. But that is not an excuse for the removal of a person's rights.

We protect the rights of people who have killed far more people than this guy. We protect the rights of drug dealers and gangbangers who have links to international criminal organizations. We protect the rights of foreign nationals who commit "normal" crimes in the US.

Why don't we want to protect the rights of a citizen, in any situation?

Because it falls under an act of terrorism. I'm not saying it's right or wrong, but people keep freaking over it. Well, if he didn't want to deal with being questioned like a terrorist, he shouldn't have committed an act of terrorism.

If he is to be presumed innocent until proven guilty, he is to be afforded his rights in the meantime. It is that simple.

If he is not to be presumed innocent, then none of us have the right, except when the Government decides they'll allow it.

Have you read the details of how/what they can question him on without him being mirandized? It's not like they can just ask anything and use it in court while he's drugged up in a hospital. It seems like this sub is full of kids watching the news, hearing "no miranda rights" and freaking out because of that without actually looking anything up. They're limited as to what they can ask. The primary purpose is to get information regarding possible accomplices. Not to get information to be used in court. This isn't them questioning him for his court date. It's for the immediate safety of the residents of Boston and potentially surrounding areas. It's so they have the chance to locate and capture any/all accomplices he has. It's not to do a full questioning of the events.

Don't you understand the implications of questioning a suspect without a lawyer present? That right exists to protect the innocent from being railroaded, and if they suspend that for any reason it is meaningless. If he has no right to a lawyer, then they have no obligation not to use the things he says against him. The Miranda ruling even applies to the obviously guilty. It should not be suspended over suspicion of guilt.

No, it's actually not a bullshit excuse. It's the law.

Look, I'm not one of these tinfoilers, but I like the knowledge that my freedoms are intact. What happens if the government declares that anyone who hacks their Wii is supporting terrorism, or some other ridiculous nonsense? They already say you're doing it for bootleg DVDs.

I think that "exception" is their not for the people's protection, but to make arrests easier.

Now, if they were to balance that with a protection for the accused, such as immunity for new facts which come to light, then I'd withdraw my objection. That would mean that if they refuse to provide an attorney, any statement he gives can be assumed to be under duress. We have the evidence that he set those bombs, stole that car, tossed grenades, and shot a cop. He's going to be convicted, but if he is forced to disclose an unconnected murder, they shouldn't be allowed to use that in court.

I agree, it needs it's limits however it isn't hard to see the logic behind them claiming this to be an act of terrorism and focusing on finding any and all people who helped him in this as soon as possible.

[deleted]

There isn't really a 'maybe' about it.

There is video of them laying the bags down that contained bombs. The 2 brothers threw grenades and pressure cooker bombs at police officers. They shot and killed 1 police officer. They admitted to being the Boston bombers when they hijacked the car.

[deleted]

Yeah, that parts all a lie because, because globalconspiracyilluminatimindcontroldrugsufosmydoctorisoneofthem.

My thought on it all is like this, 9/11 was a bad time dr America. It generally scared the public of these "terrorists" so naturally when something like this happened and it came to light it was a terrorist act, the American public of Boston had enough and actually got shit done. I can see why we are blood hungry.

If he's guilt we should publicly execute him, maybe then people will see America is done fucking around.

Presumed innocent,not proven.

So Brave

You are PRESUMED innocent until proven guilty. When you start shooting at cops & hiding in boats from them that presumption no longer exists.

Free OJ!

[deleted]

nope, too general.

there are groups behind the scenes- but they can be expected to act the same way they always have. keep people entertained and distracted, and enforce the status quo.

there are both evil and kind people, most are a mix of both. its safe to say that evil people take what they want a bit more aggressively- and at any cost.

its also safe to expect that some of these evil people will rise to positions of power along the way.

[deleted]

Fuck your self righteous indignation.

[deleted]

when something like this happens in your city i hope it affects someone you know....you might have a different view

don't start shit that you know nothing about.....have some respect for what happened

Guilty till proven Innocent for terrorism.

How the fuck can you think this guy didn't do it?

Is this the same guy that threw explosives during a shootout with the police? That guy that's not guilty yet?

Edit: you guys must live in a sad, scary world if you need to cry conspiracy everytime something happens. I can't decide if I pity you or I think it's hilarious.

You got some proof of that?

proof, who needs that, the media/gov said they did it, that's all I need. Hang them.

Yeah. Show me some proof of these brothers being armed at all. They were set up.

No man this was a complete FBI set up. Think about it, could an innocent Muslim extremist yielding explosives and killing police officers after being captured on camera directly at the scene of the attack really be responsible? Stop being so closed minded.

You're right, I'm sorry. I keep forgetting that nothing that happens is actually as it seems - I keep forgetting that the govt devotes all of it's time to fuck over these innocent kids! Big bad G-men.

[deleted]

The FBI has video of them placing the bombs, seen fleeing crime scene with smiles on face with no bag, man who had his legs blown off woke up in the hospital to confirm with police it was in fact him (he had looked him straight in the eyes after he placed the bag), he placed explosives all over the city, shot at police, and hid in a boat for god knows how many hours. Seems innocent.

Yeah, that thing about shooting police and lobbing bombs at them, means absolutely nothing.

Guilty or not, he is innocent, he is just a damn kid. I mean, come on, he is just 19 yrs old, what do you expect? Man this young just do what we taught, the real evils are those who grown up and are given power.

I'm 20, should I come kill your family because society is fucked?

a few hundred years ago, in boston, if he were a white guy, the headlines would read a little differently.

look how our founding fathers accomplished things.

That's hasty generalization. Me saying he is innocent doesn't give him more rights than he deserves.

Kill my family? If it happens, I should be mad on you as much as i mad about the society, i wish you will be judged by law and you should be judged by laws

but heck, there is just no way i could "GOT HIM" or laugh like those idiots did, which is what OP complains about.

...but he's not innocent, and you're blaming society for this. Look, I agree. He's just a kid. Regardless of the nature of his crimes we still have human compassion. I just think its fucked up you're providing some sort of justification for this kid. To further elaborate on my first comment, this is not what you expect out of an adolescent..

By "innocent", you probably refer to formal language on court but i am referring to a mere adjective we use in daily basis. I really think he is innocent for being dragged in all these nonsense and i am sure that he doesn't know what he did.

If people don't get along, then everyone is sinned. Being an adolescent, an adult or whatnot doesn't serve any meaning. I believe this still applies in our age of stupid. That's why when shit happens we don't have to spread hatred unnecessarily on "terrorists", "murders" or something, the police just gotta do what they should and that's all.

I am afraid they will probably torture him or something, he isn't going anywhere anyway. I feel sorry for him, actually.

I'm sure he was convinced but knows damn well what he did..you don't attend a prestigious college and still can't decipher right from wrong. If people don't get along, then everyone has sinned? I got bullied throughout high school for being weird, but always kept to myself and never lunged back. I must've sinned somewhere along the line, thanks for catchin that. I agree we can use this as a time to look inwards and reflect but you can't justify any actions this kid has made on his own free will.

I agree with you, he is innocent until proven guilty.

Who is to say that is even the right guy, because America wanted blood so the FBI gave them "Suspects" so they could get their blood.Also think about the guy who identified him, he got blown up, went into shock, was stabilized in the hospital, and though all of that he remembered a guy who set down a back pack? Is America really that blood thirsty? Or am I missing something here?

Suspect 1 (Dead) was the one identified by the victim.

It's been reported that the FBI has video evidence of Suspect 2 (Arrested) placing the bag down prior to the explosion, but they haven't released it publicly.

I love how all of a sudden he's the victim.

The evidence I have seen (just on the internet) is enough to make me believe these men did this. I am, however, acutely aware they were most likely not working alone, and want to have answers as to how they got started etc. I hope he makes a full recovery and we get to hear the full story in a trial.

this.

well that innocent until proven guilty ship sailed along with the death of a cop and throwing bombs at cops during the pursuit. you are retarded.

I think it's very convenient that we already nabbed the culprits. Should spark enough blind patriotism to lead us into another war. North Korea anyone? I'm sure there would be sooomething to gain from it.

why would we go to war with north korea over two chechnyan/american men setting off bombs at the boston marathon?

I would love to see the spin on it if it 'turned out to be N. Korea' after all.

kim jong un- boston marathon bombing mastermind. quoted as saying "just because it seemed fun at the time."

Makes about as much sense as going to war with Iraq over a Saudi Muslim Jihadist...

what does that have to do with boston?

I'm saying the idea of going to war over an unrelated event isn't new. We've done it already.

yeah...nobody is going to war with foreign countries over this.

I agree. I was just making note that strange things happen when patriotism and fear mix, which I think was OP's original point.

NO i don't think it will be used to start a war, i think this is being treated as another newtown/colorado

"A human life is a human life." -You

Exactly, and he took 3 (Or did they confirm more?) and ruined dozens more. And yes, I do agree with you, he is still innocent until prove guilty. But the fact that they got into a high speed chase, killed police officers, and hid out for hours after the marathon? I mean, I understand kind of trying to stay hidden, but killing police? The one who got in the chase, at least, is proven guilty because of that.

An eye for an eye. If he is proven guilty, have his limbs cut off one by one, and THEN kill him.

this sickens me. fighting fire with fire makes everyone burn.

He's a physcopath (I know I spelled that wrong) and if he rots in jail, he won't think anything of what he did. What do YOU suggest we do to him?

I don't understand why Americans complain so much about America, yet they choose to live here. If you hate it so bad, and if it's so unfair, and if you feel that your rights are being taken away, move, why stay? Move out now while you can before they close the borders and declare martial law. Why stay and fight a fight you always feel you will lose anyway? Why complain about what the government does day in and day out, if you hate it here that much, then move to another country and call that place your home.

I am one for conspiracy theories, but a lot of people here sound so ungrateful, and if America and it's government has been so bad to you, then I ask you to please move away, so you can make room for the people who want to leave there poverty life and country and come here.

Because if you want to live in any other first world country, you most likely won't get in permanently or become a citizen. Do you know how hard it is to get an extended visa and citizenship? For Canada and any European country I have researched, you need to be a student or hold a job to have an extended visa. In the European Union, each country is forced to fill a job with their local country's citizens, then EU citizens, and then finally if they can't possibly find someone to fill a position, they will seek someone applying for a job outside of the EU.

Also, you act as if any normal citizen has the money and means to just up and live in a completely different place. As someone who holds a "normal" job after getting a 4 year college degree, I can't even fucking afford to go on VACATION in another country, let alone move to one. What you are saying is just like telling any downtrodden people tired of their country to "just leave", as if becoming a refugee is the easiest choice to make. Imagine telling that to someone whose in a country stuck in deeper shit, like places where civil wars are taking place. Sure, it's easy to say from your position, and it's easy to define our standard of living as being better in a world view sense, but have some fucking empathy for ALL people.

If you run from your problems you're not resolving anything.

Norway, Sweden, Iceland.

It takes a while to move from one country to another.

Thanks for your time.

Oh please, don't act like this is the first even tthat has happened. They could have left a long time ago.

Well that's not the point, is it? "They" could be of any age, any demographic. Moving to another country requires years of preparation on top of significant work to ensure citizenship or work visas upon arrival - it's not an easy feat.

[deleted]

Tho I don't agree with anything the bombers did, it's horrifying, but just saying he did it have him hung isn't solving the problem either. It seems like of you just want to investigate the reason why to prevent something like this from happening again you will be called a traitor (not literally)

I'm not entirely convinced there was any bomb in Boston, let alone that this guy was hiding in a boat.

Who writes this shit?

You're fucking kidding, right?

[deleted]

All I want is some proof.

I agree with you but to think you're all ballsy by standing against popular media in /r/conspiracy is pretty puss.

He didnt do it, The FBI have been controlling him for years now.

“He was controlled by the FBI, like for three, five years,” she told Russia Today during an interview. ”They knew what my son was doing, they knew what actions and what sites on the Internet he was going [to], they used to come…and talk to me…they were telling me that he was really a serious leader and they were afraid of him.” “How could this happen?…They were controlling every step of him, and they are telling today that this is a terrorist attack,” she added.

Link

[deleted]

Whats that?

stop defending this guy...if you wanna defend this murderer get the fuck out of this country

The 14th amendment gives you the right to a fair trial by due process. If they release the video of them placing the bombs, everyone (including prospective jurors, witnesses) know he's guilty. Those videos are withheld until the trial and then shown to the jury. Witnesses who testify already saw them do it. They describe the video without having seen the video.

I've read varying things about the suicide vests, the bomb throwing etc. Maybe I'm just suffering information overload, but I remember reading conflicting accounts of the bombs and suicide vest(s)

Hopefully this will become more solidified in the next couple days. Anyways was nice to have a convo without name calling and shit. I don't want to think about this anymore for a while, it makes me unhappy.

If obvious evidence comes out that he is innocent, then people will change their minds. And people are cheering the fact that the guy who was involved in a shootout with cops that involved bombs and his brother rushing at cops with a bomb rigged to his chest, is now in custody and off the streets.

You actually just reminded me of how they've conducted trials for Guantanamo prisoners in that the evidence against a person is not revealed to them because it could compromise national security. The person is then conflicted with everyone just taking their word for it that evidence exists.

Dude do you understand the law at all? Evidence is never released before a trial. Military level response was because the guy was hurling pipe bombs at cops.

You still didn't answer me. Who is to say the evidence isn't faked either. Or that the media is showing you false evidence.

What is deplorable exactly? They are giving him medical attention. A guy 1000's of people right now want dead is being given the gift of modern medicine because of the awesome justice system america has in place.

Other places in the world giving medical attention to someone who is suspected by the public of killing innocents would be a joke, and you would be shunned from your community for doing so if not killed yourself.

Why is it that so many people in this sub have a kneejerk reaction to any sort of authority? I fucking hate certain things large governments have done, their are without a doubt a bunch of things that never became public domain that governments did which are immoral and despicable and their will be more in the future. But that doesn't mean every god damn bad thing that happens was in direct relation to a government like it seems this sub would have you believe. To the contrary if one were to look at all the horrible stuff to good stuff any country has done when comparing our somewhat corrupt government to most of the highly corrupt governments around the world you might stop criticizing every single action and start giving props when they are deserved.

i spelled it that way but then it gave me the auto correct red line thing so I relented and gave in to it....

I just don't think the majority of people will be so open minded about this situation. But then again, the majority of America already labeled Casey Anthony as guilty and she made it through.

You're fucking kidding, right?

Says who? On Monday there was much talk of more.

Trials and habeas corpus are granted to all citizens and non-citizens as a practical matter. Because if we arbitrarily decide that some foreign national doesn't get extended the courtesy of a trial or especially habeas corpus which is intended to prevent governments from "disappearing" individuals, then foreign governments will claim the right to disappear U.S. citizens based on U.S. precedent.

The Bill of Rights specifically refrains from any requirement that the rights are only to apply to U.S. citizens. The language is intentionally broad.

Most of these discussions confuse "being a non-citizen" with "being an illegal resident". There's a vast grey area between them of tax-paying, social-security funding (even when in fact they do not receive those benefits), well-behaved (because they'd get thrown out if they weren't) legal residents who could easily find themselves losing out if citizenship was the boundary of human rights in the US.

You have no proof that his face was 'bashed in' by the police arresting him. Considering the boat owner reported someone in his boat because he saw blood, it's entirely possible that his injuries were previously sustained.

I love how people in this subreddit make sure to insist that people ALLEGEDLY committed crimes, but in other instances take pretty large liberties with their assumptions.

Ever noticed how your short comments tend to get way more upvotes than the ones you put a lot of thought and effort into?

Ha. Yeah. But three-quarters of the time, I'm really just writing to see my own thoughts, so I don't care whether anyone else reads them (and sometimes I'm relieved when they don't). I'm glad you did, though, because ...

Anyway, in regards to the issue at hand: Since America is supposed to be held to a higher standard, comparing it to some horrible dictatorship (or whatever) isn't exactly very inspiring.

"Well, I know I got a D-, but John got an F because he didn't even show up to class!" A D- is still bad.

Exactly. Every time my father and I get into discussions about current events, he brings up Nazi Germany and how none of us have anything to complain about because we don't live there/then. Or if I bring up issues in the healthcare system (he's a doctor), he'll say, "Well, whatever. Try needing a triple bypass in the Middle Ages, if you think there's something wrong with our healthcare. Let's see how long you live then."

If you won't admit a problem, you can't change it. (Especially if the denial involves the need for a time machine.)

What's deplorable about this picture? They're giving him medical treatment.

His face wasn't bashed in, the blood was from the bullet he took to the neck. He also took one in the leg. In the boat, he was bleeding out for over 18 hours. They didn't assault him, he was on the verge of death when they captured him.

There are reports of multiple cops with injuries from the shootout. If you're going to say that the FBI, BPD, paramedics, and hospitals were in on it too you might as well go to "well how do you know your reality is real and maybe this is all just a dream?"

EDIT: my bad I didn't see what sub I was in.

That's because you are a pussy. Execute this bitch and save the money. Fucking obamacare is saving his life now after taking 4 others. Disgusting, I hate liberals.

How do you know he's guilty?

don't forget Lync!

Tom Cruise.

Publisher.

Front Page

Publisher.

Publisher

Thunderbird

Bob

edit I'm glad that at least one other person remembers Microsoft Bob.

Clippy

And with our powers combined we are MS OFFICE PROFESSIONAL 2003!

Visio.

Front Page.

yeah, I think that's a good theory.

funny, I was just going to say, "wait, MA. has the death penalty?", and literally as I started typing that, the broadcaster on CNN says that the US has automatic death penalty consideration for anyone considered guilty of terrorism.

Paint

Silverlight.

Project

Bob.

Exchange.

Publisher.

Clippy!

Nope just you. And there hasn't been ANY mention of it on reddit, either.

Uh....Paint?

his mother spoke with the FBI on several occasions according to her.. What makes her any less credible than MSM??

Internet explorer!

I'd like to be on that jury

Saying something like that would exclude you from being on any jury

No one took "revenge" on him. He was curled up in the fetal position, bleeding out for 20 hours. He was ushered out of the boat, and given medical care. Not exactly my definition of hatred and violence. Please take an objective look at what actually happened before posting sensationalist crap

Amerikkka.

Art imitates life.

I agree. There seems to be all kinds of missing evidence, and things that really don't add up.

this.

we cheer after everything, and of course it was stirred up in front of the cameras.

rather than revelling in the revenge.

*cough*9/11*cough*

Speechless

I hope you didn't mistake myself and ComeAtMeBrother's question as rhetorical.

I desire an opinion/defense from you as to why you see this as deplorable?