What do you count as abusive/trolling?

Is posting evidence against someone's conspiracy considered trolling? For example, I posted some info in that Denver airport thread the other day that somewhat debunked a few claims.

Nope. I think he means more if you directly insult a person with a vulgar name.

I kind of think it could be that, but also the people who are obviously trolling. There is no need for that here.

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The problem is: when is absurd too absurd? I think believing in reptilians who rule the world is equally absurd as believing the Eastern Bunny exists. But I'm pretty sure some of you guys actually believe in reptilians.

I'd say: let the people decide. Upvote/downvote takes care of most problems, right? It's a bit ironic to me that a subreddit that strives to unmask governments and the likes who try to take away personal freedom, actually announces that they'll ban anyone who "is being a dick", aka: doesn't agree with you. Dat freedom of expression.

see, i dont really believe in that, but whos to say that there arent reptiles ruling the world, are you the one to say its impossible? Im just saying this: It could be possible.

Er, by that standard, isn't the "easter bunny poisoning with sugar" thing equally possible?

It is. But if someone really believes that, who are we to censor them in the one spot where they can let it out?

And are we actually getting this posts? I'm just not seeing them.

I just mean, at that level of credulity and "possibility" you can't distinguish obvious trolls from the very strange beliefs that a lot of people in here sincerely hold. There has to be some other mechanism for dealing with the issue.

Great point. I believe reptilians are allegory for powerful Jews though. The people that think David Icke is actually talking about an alien race, pretending to be human, ruling the world are down right stupid and make us look bad.

Could me saying this be considered trolling, or "having a bad day?".

That said, unless someone expresses real racism, spams, or gets caught breaking the rules. I see no need for a ban. Id hate to see people getting banned here.

Why do you think that David Icke is talking about Jews when he talks about reptiles? where is that coming from? you are obviously not that familiar with his work. This might help you understand https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0GVi78jYI5k (it is a mainstream tv show that looks into whether David Icke is anti-semitic or not).

Because if he is talking about aliens he is utterly crazy.

how? let's define crazy:

Crazy, n; A mentally deranged person

Deranged: v; To become insane

Insane: adj; In a state of mind that prevents normal perception

How is believing that there might be extraterrestrial life make somebode not sane? How does that make their perception skewed? Because there are a lot of sci-fi shows on this topic, I'm sure there are plenty of average people who believe aliens are real somewhere in the universe. Are they all literally mentally incapable of seeing the world properly?

Forget the reptilians as shapeshifters for a minute and just look at your argument. Why does this make David crazy? He is clearly right about a LOT of other things. Let people believe what they want, if it comes to be false they have to deal with it. Not you.

I'm sorry this is not attacking you, it just makes me furious to keep seeing people use the word 'crazy' to describe this.

I dont feel attacked. But, I cant just forget the reptilian shape shifters. Its pretty much the biggest strangest thing that keeps popping up.

Im not saying the mods should shut down people talking about it. Im saying that we shouldnt ban any discussion.

Not to infuriate you but it is crazy. I challenge anyone to bring it up outside of the conspiracy circlejerk and watch how people look at you.

it's crazy if you take it out of context... if you listen to his whole talk, it starts to make more sense (see my comment above)... just listen to him before rushing to judgement... I'm sure you are a cool person... but it is not cool to brand someone as a racist without even listening to what they have to say first.

and watch how people look at you.

yeah because the general public are clearly the most informed people.

"It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society."

Ive talked about 9/11 truth & the federal reserve, with lots of people. I cant picture saying, hey did you know there is evidence Hillary Clinton may be a trans dimensional shape shifting lizard alien.

He is not even talking about aliens... he is talking about inter-dimensional beings.

Quantum physicists have evidence that there are other dimensions... it is mainstream science now... so why would other dimensions not be populated? And do you know that we are not made of solid matter, but vibration (or frequency)... again, this is mainstream science... and it should change the way you look at the world if you give it some serious consideration.

You don't have to believe David Icke, but please do some research (or at least listen to him) before you call him crazy.

Thanks

He comes off too culty for me.

You've basically called him racist, you called him utterly crazy and you called him culty... remember this thread is about abusive behavior haha... seriously though, I think the point is that it is helpful to be objective and argue the points in question rather than just call people names, label them or make accusations.

He's right about 95% of the time. The alien thing is so far out there for such a seemingly rational guy. It's like he is taking a dump in our cereal. Also being anti Zionist isn't the same thing as being a racist. He is European though. Don't they have laws over there that say u can't bad talk a jew? Maybe he is just walking the line.

I see no need for a ban. Id hate to see people getting banned here.

Agreed. Need we remind the mods that this is NOT /r/politics or /r/news. This is /r/conspiracy !! (It's where we come when we get banned from the "main stream" channels.)

If you don't believe in reptiles, that's fine. If you do, that's fine. If you call someone an idiot for not believing in them, that's not fine. If you call someone and idiot for believing in them, that's not fine.

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Nazi alert

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/r/hailcorporate

For sure dude

We are all here to learn, if you have info on a topic that's important we want it. On the other hand if you come here everyday and paste links to disinfo debunk sites over and over, its kinda different...

I think you're fishing for something because you know the answer to that. This is not and has never been some childish board. You know what trolling/being a dick is.

In either case if you want an example, go to any of the top "hot" threads this passed week and look at any of the circle jerking comments with 200+ upvotes.

The abuse I'm seeing is not so much the name calling and the general foul language debate that arises on hot topics.

The abuse I'm seeing is the bizarre and extreme upvoting of pure establishment and pro official story comments here lately. Some of these comments read as if they came from an FBI agent and they recieve upvotes, by the hundreds, almost immediatly. How does a mod deal with that?

This presents a false impression on the post. It is also an attempt to make us alternate theory types look silly and our ideas socially unacceptable to the usual conformist mindset.

There are the troll posts that definately don't belong. We all know them as the ones that completely defy common sense and look as if they were planted in this sub just to look stupid.

I will agree, something needs to be done.

The abuse I'm seeing is the bizarre and extreme upvoting of pure establishment and pro official story comments here lately.

I agree that this is a problem. But the moderation isn't going to fix that either. That isn't considered "abusive" posting.

It should be considered something...it's like they/someone is hijacking a post when they do that. It's far worse than name calling or foul language.

If you look at these top threads you'll generally see some responses which initially sit at 1-2 votes, then a new response will skyrocket 15-30+ above the others. it generally agreees with the top comment - to make it seem like more people believe with the top comment. since it has so many upvotes, dirveby users just browsing here will read it and shrug everything off. it's a technique which has been going on since I joined, and it is not easy to track or stop.

keep a list of saved links for evidence towards accounts you think are dropping comments and gaming votes. save the entire comment threads. I will be doing this over the next 2-4 weeks and hopefully mods will just remove the comments after enough repeats when it continues to happen over and over.

Good

Anytime you see tttt(sub in a character other than 0)tttt. Get rid of it. I've seen several shills, trolls, alters ... start false OP's to try to set up tttt0tttt on several occasions.

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9000SINS on the job. Excellent!

BTW: Why don't we get rid of those who would rather not debate the topic at hand with facts. Instead try to deviate, and attack those who disagree. By manner of giving the sorry ass argument of "you should go back to school based on your grammar skills". Inferring that the person disagreeing is ignorant rather than sticking to the discussion points.

This is an informal forum for discussion, and not an English class.

We are regulating this behavior as personal attacks.

That's good my man, but I guess some downvoters disagree with you,

You've given us zero examples of the downvoting system not working - literally none at all.

All the examples you've given us of abuse have been downvoted to oblivion.

I read this every day - I don't see some outpouring of desire to have this subreddit censored.

Why are you doing this?

Hopefully people don't just cry censorship about this.

Not everyone should have to agree with everyone, but just harassing people and being rude to people for no reason does not help discussion.

censorship is worse for discussions.

Yeah, but banning posts where people literally just say:

"You fucking idiot." and nothing else, doesn't change the course of discussion in any way.

He's not talking about getting rid of people who have opposing view points, but those who add nothing to the conversation, and in an incredibly destructive way.

insults get downvoted anyway. censorship silences people entirely.

He's not talking about getting rid of people who have opposing view points

you're telling me you honestly believe that mods will never be tempted to ban someone they disagree with more than someone they agree with? because that alone is enough to assure that people WILL end up being banned for their opinions.

and that's the problem with censorship- we'll never know exactly why people get silenced. the censors win and we all just accept it.

FUCK. CENSORSHIP. here of all places.

I've seen mods be down voted so hard they're almost in the hundreds over posts and not seen a single [deleted] tag under the comment.

You'll notice that a lot of times you see people make a thread about how a mod banned them because "they had a different opinion" it's usually quite a different story once the actual post is shown.

I've seen mods be down voted so hard they're almost in the hundreds over posts and not seen a single [deleted] tag under the comment.

anecdotal evidence is meaningless.

it's usually quite a different story

so usually, they won't ban people just for disagreeing with them or offending them? how reassuring.

the only thing that should be banned is ads.

No, you're taking my post out of context intentionally so you can use it in the way you want to use it, rather than the way I used it.

By all means, message 9000sins about this very subject about how hard they get down voted and yet don't delete any posts under them.

As I stated before, this is in place to ban trolling/abuse that doesn't exist (it has actually been one of the main rules in this sub in the two years I've lurked here) and is just being mentioned that it's actually being enforced.

censorship is mind poison. it makes you think you've got the whole story when you don't.

I truthfully don't think you understand in any way.

Banning someone who only posts "Fuck Jews." as a reply is not taking anything away from the discussion.

yep, and putting psychopaths in prison camps doesn't make society less pleasant. but the act of building and filling prison camps ALWAYS sucks up innocent people and those who question the status quo.

same with censorship. it will ALWAYS result in silencing meaningful critics. it's only a matter of time.

I still think you're misunderstanding.

understood.

Reddit's up/down arrows work fine. Heavy-handed modding is really way too prevalent on Reddit these days.

For posts I think this generally works but obvious abuse should be more heavily modded here

Agreed.

Unfortunately, heavy handed modding is exactly what this place needs.

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this argument has been proven false.

[citation needed]

I recall reading a thread in which you banned someone from this subreddit before they'd even posted to it. So you having this "up/downvotes don't work" philosophy is unsurprising. People with power always think their possession of it is for the common good. And people with power always want more of it.

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Ive noticed some weird inconstancies on my up vote traffic.

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Seems like a backend issue

I hope by "abusive" you mean trollish, shillish & abusive? Cos otherwise we are going to go from a forum infested by abusive disruptive negative assholes to a forum infested by polite disruptive negative assholes...

Just to clear somethings up. Are we talking trolls as in

A. Someone who presents counterarguments in an appropriate way.

Or

B. People calling people names who they disagree with.

Just wanting this cleared up because i love this board, even though i present alternative arguments often.

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Thank you.

I never understood why some people show up to the conspiracy sub just to call everyone in here crazy. This is a place to debate and display information. Looking forward to the new spring cleaning.

Ah, Hows Rusty Shackleford today?

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Just people that get uppity or indignant when alternative viewpoints are expressed.

And when alternative viewpoints to the alternative viewpoints are expressed? Will you accept it when people are being called "government shills" and the like when disagreeing with a conspiracy theory?

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Wait, so if conspiracy theorists insult non-conspiracy theorists that OK but vice-versa that's a ban.

Did I get that right?

This sounds very much like the suppression of inconvenient viewpoints.

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Just for clarification:

If I repeatedly call a user, or several users, things like "idiot", "retard" or "nutjob", that's considered trolling and/or personal attack, which is unacceptable.

If I repeatedly call a user, or several users, things like "shill", "disinfo agent" or "sheep", is it considered the same as above?

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That's good to hear.

Allright. We'll see. Just asking questions.

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Lern2sarcasm.

Not sure if either. I think he means people who are making fun of us/ at us.

So people who start their post with "Im not usually one of the retarded conspiracy nut jobs but....."

Yes.

Look, I try to be objective and open-minded, and believe that 9/11, Aurora, Sandy Hook, and the Boston Marathon were false flags. But this guy claiming to have befriended someone in the 13 families of the Illuminati is a bit of a stretch for me with very little evidence. It appears to me to be conspiratard rope-a-dope. Please check that Poster out.

I totally agree with that u are saying.

It is basically the Israeli card, but on another level.

Ie: Whenever something major happens, you have a lot of mouth pieces trying to blame the Israelis or Mossad.

And, in this case, whenever there is genuine subject to discuss, some idiot will come waltzing along and bring up the ridiculous catchall term "Illuminati" and ruin the conversation.

Try .redditinvestigator. you can help spot thectrolls and the shills

Thank you.

What constitutes a worthy conspiracy? For instance if someone posts about lizard people they get flamed, but in turn if you post about Syria or something , it's considered a conspiracy? Is this not a sub for ALL conspiracies , not just political ones?

Maybe we need a new sub for activism , or government distrust , so were not all labeled under the "nut job" category by our peers, and we can be taken seriously

Some are just obvious. Look to the right side bar for a list of different subs loads avaliable. Except mine which is not listed /r/conspiracyhumour

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I'm on board with that, there's been a lot more instances, recently, of going from talk to debate to name-calling all within the span of, say, three posts or so. Not asking for everyone to hold hands and be all 'kum-bay-ya' or anything, just a little more civil would be excellent.

And why is a mod post downvoted? Like at all?

I'm down to help.

I hope that you ban users who are clearly trying to damage this sub-reddit by harassing conspiracy theorists.

Like you said, Reddit's voting system does not work. And that's for the same reasons democracy does not work. Only a benevolent dictator, a monarch, can do the job right.

This seems bogus to me.

Can you give us some examples of recent threads that needed your attention?

As other people on this page have said, the up/down buttons work just fine for me...

http://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/1cu884/report_any_abusive_behavior_you_see_we_are/c9k4j2k

Just right below here. I think you'll find it a perfect example

if you see someone being a dick?

Well, well, well. Aren't you a nazi piece of shit. I'll save you the trouble you faggot fuck, enjoy your fiefdom of pansies and supplicants. People like you are pathetic, life isn't nice, it isn't pleasant. You are seriously one of the worst mods on this entire website, which is saying quite a lot. Die in a fire, cunt.

Will do.

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How do you really feel, though?

Leave this as an example I say

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Don_Gotti?

Lern2sarcasm.

Nazi alert