Congratulations.

agreed, that's an impressive feat nowadays.

Well, you are taking the right steps in my book. To keep myself sane I read up on skills I need to improve. I'm working on gardening, and trying to sustain myself with very little space, power, or resources. It's pretty zen actually. Other than that, read, let my mind wander into imaginary worlds.

Awesome! Do you play a musical instrument? There's nothing like it. It costs no money (other than purchasing the instrument and buying strings or reeds or accessories), but the act of playing music triggers a dopamine release in your brain that makes you feel "happy". Its better than alcohol or drugs because it's all natural, you make it, and it lasts as long as you play or listen.

Heh. IF I had rhythm, or could hear tones. Not my strong suit.

All humans, even deaf humans, are born with the innate ability to hear and appreciate music, and the template to learn to sing and play an instrument. I teach mostly adults. I guarantee I could teach you!

You are still tied to a fiat money system, which makes you completely vulnerable.

If there's a house fire, he's royally fucked.

Agreed. But life is short. Might as well tighten the belt while you can. Who knows what will happen next?

Fire proof safe, they aren't expensive and if you have a lot of cash at home, it's the way to go.

I wouldn't trust a fireproof resistant safe that is included in the "aren't expensive" list for your entire life savings in cash.

I love those things. They survive every time, but if the fire is hot enough, your fiat burns up anyways.

Businesses prefer cash, they don't have to pay the 3 percent to the credit card companies.

Yes. In fact, I get extra services from some local businesses because I pay in cash. When they see me coming their eyes light up. A lot of people around here are on welfare (Holyoke, Chicopee MA area) and pay with those EBT cards. It takes time to be compensated from the government. It's a hassle.

I hope those businesses know it's only getting worse. Soon, you'll be like a water truck driving through a post-apocalyptic town.

Have you ever driven across the US? It's mostly barren anyway. I've driven across many times.

[deleted]

Cool. We're neighbors. Hi neighbor!

A high school friend attended college in Holyoke. Many fond memories.

[deleted]

That's what i was thinking.

True, although some newer businesses as so "hip" they rarely see anyone pay in cash. The people there look at you like you use two heads if you use cash. Imagine if you asked to pay in gold as legal tender... or Bitcoins... haha.

I live on the low side of everything. I really don't need much. Food, utilities, transportation, communication...that's about it. I don't go "shopping" like other people do and stay away from brands

Oh I know. Honestly, I almost never use cash myself.

So true, American Express wants 3.2% of every transaction. Visa and MC, with good merchant services you can get as low as 1.8%.

I, too, invested in bitcoins. I started a (small) online business selling home made canned goods and I only accept BTC.

My Husband and I also converted Our truck to run on veggie oil. This helps decrease our dependence on diesel/big business. Its an adventure going to restaurants to pick up their old veggie oil for free. We have to filter it and the process takes a bit of time, but we are in no big hurry either. Plus the truck smells like french fries!

What else? We built a bad ass urban garden and have been producing a lot of good, organic yummy food. "Gardening is the most defiant and therapeutic act you can do. Plus you get strawberries". :)

Wait...you want to get away from "big business" but get your Vegetable oil from.. restaurants..please tell me you do not go to McDonalds

if it's free how is McDonald's gaining from it

exactly my point.. he wants to get away from "big business" and oil, but getting your fuel from McDonalds isn't exactly staying away from big business.

What I got out of it was that he doesn't want to enable big business or hep them profit at all, taking oil from mcdonald's doesn't sound like much of a business benefit unless they get tax breaks from it.

No way! Large Corporations don't "give" out any recycled oil. I don't support any large scale restaurant corporation in any way shape or form. I pick up from local mom and pop stores, small joint chinese food restaurants, donut shops, and there is also a website called fillupforfree.com that lets you meet people in the area who will donate. I also get a lot of free oil on craigslist!

I assume you go to a library or something for internet access, but if I may ask what the point of all that is?

Have we really gotten to the point where people with bank accounts and credit cards are "sheeple"?

Any money you keep in the bank helps the bank. Every credit card transaction you make helps the bank. Any checks you buy helps the bank. Basically, any time money moves in or out of the bank, you are helping to support that banks practices.

i was the same way. but, then i realized i am not evil or a sheeple for using a bank. i dont bank with bank of america though...i will tell you that.

You Vote with your dollars and your participation.

Nope. I go to the local Comcast office and pay with cash every month.

I'm not sure what the point is really. I guess the austerity was a lesson in learning how much "stuff" I really needed and what I could do without. Turns out I don't need much at all.

My expenses are thus:

• mortgage
• insurance
• food
• utilities
• fuel
• communications
• office supplies/business needs

What kind of business do you have, if you don't mind? Just interested/curious.

I'm self employed as a musician and teacher.

I assume you go to a library or something for internet access

Why would you assume that? My ISP is 25 miles away and I go once a year and pay cash for a year's service in advance. My previous ISP was only 8 miles away but I had a lot of trouble with poor service so I switched.

Good for you. I feel like doing the same.

NEVER EVER turn on your tv!!!

Haven't watched TV since 2000

I had no TV from 2002-2004. My head cleared up a lot and I was able to re-organize my priorities. Watching TV after that was somewhat shocking because I was able to see the programming for what it was. All TV is cartoons to me now, none of it is real.

I do not watch TV (no cable) but a couple of days a week my so and I watch a documentary or a highly recommended show (commercial free).

I am wondering why you don't watch and how strict your prohibition is?

Thanks.

Good for you, that's a hard cord to cut for some.

Good on you, OP!

To stay sane I spend time with my family, gardening and plant cultivation, home brewing my own mead, beers, and wines, and smoke copious amounts of cannabis. :)

I have done similar to you - although I still have the cards and a few loans. I withdraw my direct deposit check almost immediately and then use cash. I am addicted to Amazon ordering (its just TOO EASY!), so Ill still have a card for that.

Check out /r/SelfSufficiency

thanks. I did!

/r/SelfSufficiency

I moved to Mexico nearly 2 years ago. This was actually the biggest change I made. No credit or debit cards. Nice restaurants or places that charge large amounts for services accept them but nowhere else.

I think it is amazing. I love it. The shitty thing is when you show up with too little cash. You either put items back and have to drive home and get more money or you just get the items you wanted next time. But luckily for us when those times have happened, in the smaller stores, they just credit us and trust us to bring in the balance the next day. This actually happened yesterday, and I love it.

Another thing. I have not had a cellphone for 2 years. I panicked a little for the first few days. I could not contact my girl when she was away.

I don't want one though. Bad things happen but that is life. I don't need to hear about it immediately. We lived a long time without them.

Letting go of always needing to have every piece of information instantly was a big thing for me. I love it. I hope nothing bad happens, and minor things have happened, where a cellphone would have been crucial. But we managed. And we had amazing stories to tell because of it. If we had cellphones I would have just drove and picked her up or vice versa and we would have no memories.

I bought one of those disposable phones from the 7/11 for $14. I prepay/pay as you go, which is fine

I am happier without one at all. If my girl needs to get a hold of me. She can find me. I like it that way. The stories are fantastic.

I use maps - real ones - to figure out where I'm going.

Haha. You know what is hilarious. My girlfriend and I are moving back to the good ole' US of A for awhile. And I plan to not get a smart phone. I plan to take it a step further and not even have internet or cable TV for at least as long as we can stand it.

And the first thing I thought of was...I need to a buy a map. In Mexico it is easy for us. We don't have to venture far. America is going to be...fun.

you can get a wifi hotspot for like 20 bucks a month

where? One that is reliable? That is not even close to what is offered here. $45/month for an aircard. $80/month for internet that is less than reliable.

i am in new jersey - i just asked my friend the name of it

Good for you. I wish I was brave enough.

To what part of Mexico did you venture to?
As a Mexican, hearing such good things about my country makes me feel happy.
Thanks for cheering me up : )

Oh I love Mexico. I am very sad to leave. I am south of Tijuana in Rosarito.

I constantly hear people berate Mexico, and I know I am not deep in the heart of it, but I have never had a bad experience, in 2 years. And we partied like animals many weekends.

We are just 20-something kids, living here. Besides people being thrown in jail for drinking in public, and seeing friends fight each other, I never witnessed a crime. And was never worried about my safety.

Mexico, at least this part, gets a very bad reputation. I walk the streets with friends or alone in Tijuana or Rosarito every night, never once a single issue.

God I love it here, and will miss it more than anything.

DUDE! I live in Tijuana! And I know your feeling.
I cross to the US every weekend to buy groceries (mostly meat or stuff from Whole Foods. I know veggies and fruits here are so far non GMO and still cropped in a traditional manner in most parts) and there is this odd sense of dread I get at night even when I'm in the busiest part of Downtown.
It's like they are going to kidnap me or do something to me. I don't know why.
Yet, I can be all alone in Downtown Tijuana and I know people will be helpful if anything were to happen. Heck, nobody cares about what I do alone and stuff. It's all cool.

It's just has been used as a news cow for bad news and pointing on how bad we are and how better over there it is when I am just awed at how many people sleep in the streets in Downtown SD in the middle of a busy street. It's just. . odd.
There's much more openness in Mexico and less paranoia, and you can feel it - despite the fact that we are 'violent and prompt to kidnap your first child and sell you drugs'.

I just wish we weren't used as a bad example, keeping in mind most of the situation here is partially caused by the US.
People going to the US illegally to get jobs or anything? Well, if there was a steady flow already, NAFTA made it worse. We cannot compete with the US in many ways and left growers and farmers without jobs. Ironically, manufacturing companies would settle in the north to receive those who couldn't cross over and are still looking for a job. Do remember these manufacturing jobs are the ones 'we stole'.
Cartel and Narco problems? Welp, the War on Drugs. You know it's results. Nasty thing that was fueled since 2006 and has so far killed 100k people, without counting those who had to leave and are still gone. Let's not forget the ties the Cartels have with the government. . and the media.
The Government and the Media - These are the true masters of Mexico, particularly the Media. I was shocked and enraged when Obama congratulated our current president (so on forth called "That idiot") and the electoral process for being the cleanest and most transparent ones in the world. No, I'm not lying. Heck, even Germany pointed out how the Media had helped sway the people's thoughts into voting for this puppet guy only because he was pretty (Again, not lying sadly). The Media prepared a full scale IRL telenovela which is halting progress and the ability of rising living standards overall. And yet, there are nations who have the same kind of processes and are called 'evil' or 'rigged' (sometimes, rightfully so). But why give such heavy emphasis on places so far away and leave us here without the recognition we need on our own flawed processes?
It just pains me, and hurts more when I listen to people living here how shitty the country is and yet they won't do more than sitting down to watch the TV and news produced by the same media that's fucking the country.

. . .and I just . . made a whole rant out of a simple thing. Sorry.
I also must remember most members of /r/conspiracy are from the States so, maybe this is irrelevant . . .

Wish we would have met 2 years ago, when I was still going to be living here for 2 years haha.

There is a lot to touch on in your post (it was long). But I will say the thing I didn't like and the only thing I didn't like was the food. I loved the local food, but being from America, it got old pretty fast. America does have pretty good food and a ridiculous variety, healthy and not. So I love mexican food, but it gets boring.

Crime, Family, Culture. I can say only one thing. Mexican people work to live, unlike the US where they live to work. You can see it everywhere. People here have a sense of community, family, it is hard to explain. But I never saw it in the US.

As for since the Government shift. I can only comment on what I have seen. The military moved out, the crime went up. Nothing else to say really. There was crime before, we went looking for it, and we found it. If we didn't we would never see it. If you don't do drugs, or 'crazy' things, you are probably no more likely to be a victim of a crime here than anywhere.

Can only attest for the TJ area though. Which is supposed to be VERY violent. But not sure about other areas.

TL;DR Sell drugs get killed maybe. Do drugs get killed, almost never. Same as the US.

What do you do to keep your head sane within all the insanity these days?

Post on reddit :)

What do you do to keep your head sane within all the insanity these days?

Kona Gold

LOL. Cheers!

[deleted]

I buy from Comcast. There's an office nearby. They know me and take cash payments.

You could probably even pay well in advance if you wanted to. Or get a prepaid card and try to get them to ding that monthly.

If I have to pay something online, I buy a prepaid card at the 7/11 with cash.

Damn! How long has 7/11 had these prepaid cards?

no idea

You can pay via credit transfers

Couldn't he go to the office of the ISP and pay in cash? After all in most countries it is 'Legal tender for all debts public and private'.

I have changed up my diet. No HFCS, milk, or sugar and drastically reducing processed foods. Lots of raw nutrients like hemp seed added to meals. Think clearer, have more energy and feel great. Mind control is in the food. They want to fatten us up and dumb us down to make everyone subservient.

Nice. I grow my own food in season, and buy local when not. I don't eat meat unless I know the farm that raises it. No sugar, wheat, rice or potatoes.

what's wrong with tatters?

I can't eat them...I'm diabetic

Ummm; what does diabetes have to do with not eating starches?

source: http://www.diabetes.org/diabetes-basics/diabetes-myths/

Its covered in the fifth bullet point.

My doctor told me not to eat potatoes. I figure she studied her trade for at least 12 years, so I take her advice. I'm funny about stuff like that.

Seems like solid reasoning; though taking a single opinion in the medical world seems awfully trusting for someone who refuses to use credit cards.

Well I also grew up in a medical family. My father and sister are both doctors and my grandpa was a surgeon in Boston. I also check with them.

Seems like very solid reasoning:)

www.diabetes.org/diabetes-basics/diabetes-myths/

Now go out there and enjoy some taters :) carefully though

Like I said, I"m doing this because of what my doctor told me so thanks anyway

Cutting carbs cures dm2

You are great! They are trying to move to only electronic payments so they can shut down your bank account and freeze you that way.

Are you able to live okay like that? Do you live by yourself? How long have you been doing this? I think this is cool and would like to see how it's going for you. It might be able to help others assess how to better go about the process for themselves.

Thanks,

I've been credit card free since 2005 and bank account free almost 2 years. I have a wife and two boys.

Okay so are your efforts being buoyed by your spouse's credit cards and bank account(s) etc then? While I don't take anything away from your efforts and do commend them, is it the case that although you yourself are existing on a "100% cash" basis, your household and family themselves are actually still using credit cards, checks, etc? and perhaps your own "cash only" lifestyle is made possible only because it is, again, buoyed by the fact that it is existing surrounded by a foundation that (via your spouse and their possible use of credit cards, etc) is itself still credit card-based?

Honest questions. Just wondering. Not trying to undermine what you're doing or trying to poo poo on it or make it seem like you're really "not" doing what you're saying you're doing. Again, just trying to get a better idea and understanding of the logistic practicalities of your situation and how you're doing it, etc.

Thanks again.

My household? You mean my wife? Cuz my boys are too small for bank accounts LOL.

Yeah. I meant your wife. I figured I was communicating with a male and the kids might be too small for bank accounts, but I didn't want to assume. :)

Well, she doesn't have a credit card either.

Wo. Well that's cool then. So is there anything you guys do without or can't do that "requires" a cc? What differences have you noticed in your lives not using a cc?

I've never used a cc myself. I do have a debit card and I do write checks. Do you guys use debit cards and/or checks?

You need a bank account for debit cards and checks, so no.

Wow. Okay. So...you guys have an arrangement w/the people you pay rent/mortgage to?

"Here. Take cash. Write us a receipt. The end." Something like that?

What if any inconveniences or problems have you and your family found or come across since going cash only? This would be good to know for others thinking about embarking on this same m.o. and might present them w/things they should watch out for or be aware of.

We own our house

What about bills? There ARE still utilities that have to be paid, no?

yup. I pay them in cash

Okay so answer these questions, as (again) I think they're important as they pertain to this discussion:

Do you live in the United States?

Do you live in a decent sized metropolitan city?

And, again, what (if any) issues or inconveniences have you or your family come across working this way? Anything that's made you guys go "That would have been easier to have accomplished if we had a cc."?

EDIT: Well, not necessarily "that would have been easier" because I know that this society tries to make EVERYTHING "easier" w/a cc (that's part of the scam). I just wonder if there's anything you HAVEN'T been able to do going 100% cash.

LOL this has turned into an AMA. Why all the questions?

Well, because like I initially mentioned, what you're doing is something that various other individuals might themselves do as well if they can see that one person (you) is doing it pretty decently enough with a family and kinds to boot.

That's no small argument in favor of saying f.u. to CCs.

And the way you phrased your OP does indeed make the whole thing seem quite a bit like an IAMA. That's kind of how I was approaching it anyway and is why I was asking you a few Qs.

Sorry if you've had enough of it. No harm meant.

nah it's ok. I actually phrased it to hear what other people are doing...this thing turned into what I'm doing, which isn't much actually. I'm a simple musician and teacher, a nobody really.

Well I'm a jobless musician and film maker, so I guess that makes me even more of a nobody.

The reason why it turned more into what you're doing is because I don't think all that many people are doing what you're doing, so it's interesting because it gives others that might WANT to do what you're doing a game plan to follow.

Yeah that makes sense. Anyway, I don't mind answering questions :)

Okay. http://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/1fmt98/i_closed_my_bank_accounts_and_cut_up_my_credit/cac0bt9

[deleted]

we still have to pay taxes and insurance on the house. That's what I meant

if only everyone else had the option of doing so, and by option i mean making it possible to continue on living after making such a decision

congrats

[deleted]

Your piddly little $500 checking account is a drop in the bucket.

Your debit transactions fund the bank in a much bigger way.

it all counts, its the cumulative effect we are after. but you are right, getting out of debt and avoiding new debt is vital too.

Debt and credit are inherent in any economy of any size.

I sell hvac and hvac accessories. The sheer volume of "money" that passes "through my hands" in a year would require me to build a vault in my office and hire a full-time employee and a group of security guards just to drive around and pay vendors. It's not feasible to do that without credit and debt.

My invoices get paid within 45 days. Because I always pay out vendors within that 45 day period they trust me. They issue me credit by dropping supplies at the shop without taking COD. I go into debt every time there's a pending invoice.

On the job, I issue credit to my customers. I do a job, they pay when it's done. My guys work on credit. They do a job, and I am in debt to them until friday when I cut their checks. Without credit and debt, nothing would work.

Lets say im setting up a freezer in a donut factory. The price is $50k. Without credit I need that money up front to pay vendors. The donut factory will have to collect cash from every gas station it delivers to. I have to wait until they have pooled that money, a couple hundred bucks at a time. Once it's in my hand, I can start buying materials- panels from milwaukee, vents from china, tools from south korea, whatever. I'm then responsible for shipping those items to my doorstep. After all, without insurance I'm not trusting anyone but my own captain to ship this stuff over to me. Six months after having donuts inc pay me cash, I'm ready to start building. I pay all of my guys up front, and hope they stay through the week. They probably won't. Most of them are reliable, but there's a reason checks are cut on friday after work.

Then, say I go over budget. work stops. I cant get more supplies. I quoted them a price, and they're not paying me any more. They have 3/4 of a working liquid nitrogen cooled fast freezer, which is to say a really warm room with a couple conveyor belt and a couple of fancy tanks outside. Donuts inc is fucked. I'm fucked, because I'm the guy that builds half freezers. My guys are fucked because they need work every week to eat. you're fucked because there are no more donuts. I can sell my home, but the asking price is 300k. The foreman at the donut factory is in the market because he just got promoted, got married and has a kid on the way. As soon as he has the money, i can sell to him and finish the job out of pocket. Unfortunately, without that freezer that I fucked up, the factory is closed.

Every day of my life I work with debt and credit, and it's a wonderful system. It keeps the roads open, keeps you and I fed, keeps the wheels of society rolling. Without it, NOTHING gets done.

My home is bought on credit, your cable is built on credit, every moment of your existence revolves around debt and credit.

If you're homeless and unemployed, then you're out of debt and avoiding new debt. If you have a job, you're trading credit for labor. Even as a day laborer, you issue credit to your employer: I will put in a days work and you will pay me afterwards. You write me a check that I trust will not bounce.

Getting out of debt is impossible. Avoiding new debt is detrimental to the entire world- for want of a nail, and all that.

That was a bit of a drawn out analogy, and if I started mixing metaphors and talking nonsense I can simplify it a bit. Otherwise I'll let it stand.

Agreed. My dinky little local account meant nothing to my bank. In fact, the day I closed it and took out my money, they looked at me like I was a snail.

[deleted]

not even once

Wow - what a statement. I am scared, but want to follow.. Well done!

Thanks. I think the biggest issue was tightening my belt financially, which took a long time...I had to learn how to grow my own food, where the local farmers were that grew milk and meat and eggs, how to shop with cash, who was willing to take cash over credit or check...

If you want privacy on the internet I can recommend a VPN service that takes privacy seriously and that doesn't log you actions. I don't think they accept bitcoins though but they do accept Western Union or even cash in an envelope.

That's a good idea! Can you post a link here?

This company accepts bitcoin https://www.privateinternetaccess.com/

I've used PIA for a few months now, it's like reclaiming the Internet back. I've used this VPN for Android (you can setup the VPN manually or download their app from Play), iOS, Windows 7, and Ubuntu (they have a nice script that sets up each of the VPN locations for you, but you have to put the password in the first time you use each location).

I did! ;-) click on 'I can recommend a VPN service' above or here it is again then:

https://www.citizenvpn.com

Careful regarding the IRS. Do you keep track of business expenses, 10-99, etc?

Yes. I document every receipt, make copies, and report everything where appropriate

I'm self employed and take cash only

What do you do for work? I don't know many businesses that will pay in cash. In fact, besides stripping, bar tending, and some manual labor jobs, I can't think of any. So - I'm curious.

If a business won't take cash

I wasn't aware that many businesses won't take cash. Can you name some examples of some businesses that don't?

I'm a musician and music teacher. I book bands here locally and they pay me a commission. That's it!

I'm a musician and music teacher. A colleague is a local farmer. He does the same (cash only, no banks). Another colleague is a local baker. She rents a kitchen with cash and sells at local markets and farmer's markets. It can be done.

I can't think of any businesses right now. There were a couple...oh, yeah AT&T won't take cash, but I have to pay for my wife's cellphone so I buy those prepaid credit cards at the local 7/11 and pay that way

Good man.

Awesome job man.

It's a shame the cash you're going exclusive on now actually isn't worth anything though (FED, confinscation of gold, etc.)

Agreed. I like barter best. I'm giving music lessons to my plumber's daughter.

[deleted]

of course. anyway it's not many transactions. I have one person who barters eggs and a plumber who has bartered lessons for his daughter. That's it

Cash is king...

You're still on the money system...

I'm in the process of switching everything over to a local credit union. Still on the money system, but at least I'm not funding one of the big banks' dirty work anymore. It's a good feeling.

I'm happy to see change.

closed my bank account during the ows protests - havent had a phone since december

Yeah I did the same a couple of years back. Well I've never had a credit card, but bank account, fuck them. I just cash my checks at the "Checks Cashed" by my house for 3 bucks and pay for every bill with cash or money order. People give me shit for it, but IDGAF.

Nobody's really hassled me about it. In fact, most businesses appreciate the cash. The 7/11 is always thanking me for 1s

Did this myself 5 years ago. It's hard at first, but after awhile you get really smart about it. Kind of like how people were before consumer credit was considered a good idea. It's amazing how easy it is to save money when you don't have to spend it all paying back credit cards. I would much rather have $25K in my emergency savings fund, than to have a credit card with a $25K limit.

I'd like to barter for more things. I know a lot of people do this.

I don't so much barter as trade favors when needed. I have had many careers in my short life. My two primary were IT and construction. Both are hard to make a living wage at right now, but I am always fixing things for friends and family. In return they do things for me when I need them. Watch the kids, help me paint, etc...

I don't even have pity for these common criminals. Too big to fail huh? Take that capitalism.

its not really capitalism, more like crony corporatism

America is not using capitalism it is just crony corporatism like you said. If you try and start a capitalistic company you will get the IRS all over you.

Thats stupid, alot of people pay only by card.. You lose customers.

You mean for my business? People are fine with cash.

He's clearly not hurting.

How do you know how many customers who wouldve gone to his place and pay by card?

In Northern Europe we promote paying by card since it clearly minimizes theft, but obviously we trust our government/banks/authorities more than you I guess (I guess you are from USA).

Seems the stupid is paying only by card.

Why? Because you are from USA and you dont trust anything in your country?

alot

It's actually two words: a lot

I am sorry, English is my second language.

OP, I'm curious as to whether you have any kind of insurance (home, car)?

Yes. I live in Massachusetts, where car and home insurance are mandatory. I pay in cash by going down to my agent's office. I've known the family for years that owns the brokerage. My father bought insurance from them, so did my grandfather.

The thing is I'd need to make enough money in the first place to follow suit and go self employed. I'm happy living day to day making what money I can when I need it (being a skilled tradesman helps) and not paying taxes where I can avoid it but I cant see a way to go the whole nine yards without winning the lottery or something. I feel trapped by something I was born into and had no choice but to comply.

True enough. I would not have been able to do this ten years ago, even 6 years ago...I had to save up money to buy a house, pay for my cars, etc. I have zero debt now, but it took some time

Exactly, I don't know how long that would take in the U.S.A (I'm assuming) but in the U.K that certainly wouldn't be easy.

[deleted]

I have often thought about not bringing another life into a world like this, it just doesn't seem fair.

Pffft, I've never had a credit card </hipster>

I kid, but it's true. Never had one. I pay cash for everything. Contractors love it. You get some serious bargaining power with cash, for almost everything.

For online, I have a checking account Visa that's sole purpose is online transactions. Amazon, Newegg, etc. If I want to buy something, I have to go put that amount of money in that account, then checkout. It stays at a 0 balance at all times, and no overdraft.

Another checking account is used for my bills. The auto-deduction for the phone, internet, water, insurance...all that stuff. I know what the monthly amount is, and preload it each month with a few bucks extra just in case.

I have another checking account Visa in my wallet for the MAC machine (Where I live, the 7-11 type store has free access to my bank, and they are everywhere) and the gas station if I don't feel like going in. I keep at most $200 in there, and recharge it as needed.

My paycheck is dropped into a different bank, and every two weeks I stop there and empty the account, deposit the monthly bill amount into the other bank's account, and drop the rest in my safe. I make deposits from there into my portfolio.

It's an easy system to keep. My statements come in already categorized. I don't have to worry about losing my wallet, because that card isn't responsible for anything. I just get a new one. I'm free of worry about any website getting hacked, because there's not much, if anything, they can get from me. I can just cancel the card. Since I've compartmentalized everything, I don't even have to update the card number on very many websites.

but you have a bank account. I don't.

There are places that won't take cash? Is that even legal?

AT&T won't take cash

If you close your accounts and only use cash, dosen't that strengthen the dollar because the banks cannot inflate it?

"What do you do to keep your head sane within all the insanity these days?"

I try to understand that this, ALL OF THIS, has always been fully calculated by the infinite mind of THE ALL. It is an infinite web of consciousness that holds all things within it. We are it. It is us. Smile and continue to dance in this cosmic drama that we ourselves are co-authoring with each fleeting moment. Peace be with you brother. I will see you on the other side.

I have a bank account with webster, but they made a deal with me for it to be free until i turn 24. So every two weeks I use their bank to cash my paycheck, and then immediately withdraw all the money I just put in, then flip them off as I drive away. As for how I stay sane, I guess I don't really put much effort into it. Adapt yourself to new situations as best you can and try not to hurt anyone.

Until you realize that cash is really just a national "check" as it were.

So do you you no plan on growing your moneyat all? It's good to have a portion of your savings in cash but if you don't have your money in some kind of investment then you're losing money to inflation.

nah. I'm just a musician.

Cash is King!

I admire your dedication to your ideals but wait till you "have to" have one of those things like a cc or a bank account to do something. You may never need a bank account or a credit card but for some reason there's always that one type of service where you need a credit card and it will f you over. I wish you the best.

Examples: Car Rental, Hotel, certain other services etc.

If I have to have a credit card, I buy a prepaid one at 7/11 or Barnes & Noble or Walmart

Didn't think of that.

I closed my BOA account after many years. I removed my ROTH with them, and converted it to gold and silver (yes, you can have a retirement plan based on precious metals). I now have an account with a local credit union, and one credit card (that I only use in cases of emergency).

How do you keep sane within the insanity these days?

I make it known to others what is going on. It may seem small "waking" people up, but without people knowing what is wrong, where, who is responsible, and possible solutions then nothing will be done. People see these problems and feel themselves useless in it and I explain that they have more power than they think so forth. But it has to start with people know what the problem is to understand what is the solution. (understand the question to know what the answer is.)

I congratulate you, humans are not made to be going faster and faster. Getting into debt, paying large sums of money for the rest of your life is not happiness. That's why the world is getting fatter, stress and horrible eating. I'm planning on doing this, a stress free life. And maybe taking it a step forward and living I the woods just relying on myself. Taking primitive skills back.

Good on you! I hope you do it if that's what you want to do. There's nothing more important in life than finding a way to do what gives you the most satisfaction. For me, it was music.

i also pay cash for everything but i am a man on the run

LOL. I am not.

Very inspiring. I was starting to feel left behind because I've never owned credit cards or built up any credit scores.

I think that's a good thing actually. The only reason why you need a credit score is so you can borrow money. The only reason why you need to borrow money is to buy something beyond your means. My philosophy is if you can't afford it now, you shouldn't buy it now. It's better to put money aside and wait. Most impulse buys are made easier by credit. If you don't have the money in your pocket, you won't spend it (obviously).

Too late ! You're already in the system. Birth certificate, driver's license, past electronic records. They can track you with facial recognition. Better not use a computer or a phone. Paper cash has serial numbers; better stick to coins.

It's not about being tracked. I know I'm in the system and I know they know who I am. I've had some run ins with creeps on the internet and involved law enforcement. I'm not "off the books" as I stated elsewhere. I'm perfectly legit and doing everything within the law. This is not about hiding. This is about reducing my own footprint.

How do you get a loan?

What do I need a loan for? I have a very low profile. I own my house, cars, everything. I have zero debt.

I doubt that, but this is the internet so you can be whoever you want to be if it happens to support the stance you are taking.

woah this outlook is whats wrong with the world.

Your seriously can't believe someone can go through life without debt?

Living debt-free is "what's wrong with the world"?

Now that's a warped point of view.

I think you're reading comprehension is what's warped

Oh, I see now. The way my reddit plugin had the comments listed, it looked like your reply was to a comment that said the opposite, something positive about not being in debt so it looked like you were saying that no one could go through life without debt.

Lots of kids in this thread today...Your ignorance is very telling.

66 year old "kid" here. My house was bought on contract with the previous owner so no loans were involved and it's been paid off for 15 years. I haven't purchased a car for the last 35 years without paying cash. I haven't had a bank account or credit cards for 25 years.

Why don't you take your ignorance and your condescension someplace else... someplace where people are susceptible to such things.

You sound like someone saddled with a butt load of debt, bitter and twisted at the world and can not except the fact that some people have not fallen into the dept trap.

Have fun paying off your 'life'.

Oh, I'm not the one that sounds bitter here, munchacho.

The correct spelling is muchacho, old man.

Who I am is easy to figure out. I've been a redditor for a long time and I'm pretty well established in my area. I'm not trying to hide or go "off the books". Everything I do is legit and within the law. I'm just trying to lighten my impact.

Why doubt it? Houses are cheap right now, and I've owned over 200 cars over the years and only had personal loans on 3 of them. (Former mechanic. I used to buy & flip or part them out all the time) I

t's not that difficult to get out from under interest payments if you truly want to.

The only thing I currently owe is 50K on my house, and I'll have that paid off in 11 years tops. Sooner if I want, but it's currently a decent tax break. I have it set up at about 3% interest, so it's not a serious money sink either.

You're exactly right, this is the Internet so why not?

Loan for what?

Umm, anything? Life? You know, buy a house, grow your business, simple luxuries?

simple luxuries

...and we wonder why there is a debt problem...

Saving then buying, what wizardry is this?

Well, I'm a musician and teacher so there's not much business to grow! I don't need a loan currently. If I have to take out a loan, I'll try to work out something within my network.

One thing I'd change is not having a credit card, I keep one for emergencies and online purchases, just immediately pay it off when used, that way the currency on that account has little to no time to be used in the fractional banking ponzi scheme.

I buy those prepaid cards if I have to

Good for semi-instant one time purchases, but pre-paids are riskier, you lose it, it's lost(unless someone knows otherwise.) To get the utility of having one for emergencies would involve keeping one loaded up. My method negates that risk while still not feeding the scam(or paying interest of course.) Also, the card's interest rate is irrelevant when immediately paying it off, just get one with no fees.

A loan isn't necessary.

What do you do to keep your head sane within all the insanity these days?

I keep my money in a bank, so I don't have to keep track of it all. And I keep a credit card for emergencies and online purchases. It's just a little something to help keep me sane.

I personally don't think bitcoin is any different than banks. There is still someone getting part of the transaction other than the receiver of the bitcoin.

This makes you a terrorist! I saw a see something say something advertisement a while back!

Homeland Security will be at your door soon, Terrorist.

Nice. I have been working "off the books" for over a year now. It feels good to not get taxed on the money I make, knowing I'm not supporting an incompetent, authoritarian government that gets worse every day. I have never had a credit card, next step is closing my savings account.

I keep records of all of my receipts. I don't work "off the books". I pay the IRS for every penny it is due. I'm not interested in being audited. But I am a private teacher and musician, and don't make much anyway.

Probably not the smartest thing to admit online.

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There's a federal AND state sales tax?

More than just sales tax - there are a ton of taxes that are charged throughout the making and selling of a product, from import taxes to income taxes on the employees making it to corporate income tax, "sin tax", etc.

40% of your cell phone bill is just taxes. Gasoline prices are 45% tax. A pack of cigarettes? Over 75%.

Do you enjoy public roads? Did you go to free school?

I hate when people don't realize the government is made up of over 2 million individuals in 28 completely different functions such as police, fire, water, education, hospitals, ect.

Exactly.. like I feel like some of my tax dollars are spent on things I probably wouldn't spend them on..but at the same time I really like the fact that if my house is on fire I can call a number and have somebody come out and figure it out. I like that our children learn to read good and do other things good too, thanks to public schooling

That's probably going to catch up to you and bite you in the ass. Give the IRS a few years and they'll catch on to a person not paying taxes and yet seemingly still being able to buy things. It's not like not owning a credit card or paying in cash makes you invincible to them. They audit those types of people the same as everyone else. Unless you're still a dependent on your parents' tax forms or something like that.

Credit card and banking are biggies but the biggest is using dollars at all.

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"all the cash"? LOL I'm a musician. There's not much cash.

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Wow, you're in a bad mood.

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Were you making monthly payments on the garden hose?

I dont understand bitcoin? Why people need so much ANON for? Whats the suspicious items people are buying, spiderman underwears? childpron?

I see bitcoin as another money laundering program. It'll eventually be shutdown by the gov.

I have 2 credit cards, they never made any monies off of me. So far I've made 2000$ just from their rewards, and they have not made no Interest off of it, I MAKE BANKS WORK FOR ME!

I really dont see no insanity these days. I think problem with people is they like to get into DEBT, they dont understand how to manage money. I've seen plenty of friends in debt, mostly cause of their wives that dont know how to manage money.

By spending "money" with your credit cards, the banks are profiting. Don't be naive, they outsmarted your strategy before you had even thought of it.

meh not really, just so you know I profited 2000$ at least. They have not earned a penny, thats money I was going to spend anyway, its not because like, ooo rewards card I gota get that.

I only buy things I need, no use of over splurging on useless crap they try to trick you into.

For me free money is free money. Its only a LOSS when you are in DEBT, like most americans.

Banks charge merchants processing fees which are often passed onto the consumer via markups. Most of your purchases, even those in cash, are partially going to the bank to cover said fees.

Oh yes I noticed, its not right, I like to use cash most of time.

Another thing you dont notice, these merchants already has these fees built into their products, so we are screwed either way lols :( .

They actually wanted to pass a law for merchants to charge extra % for credit card users and + thats already built in to their products? wtf.

Wouldn't surprise me in the least. I try to look out for and priority shop at merchants who offer discounts for cash purchases. Keep your eye out, you may find some to support in your neighbourhood.

what? banks definitely do not profit by you using your credit card and gaining rewards but not paying them any interest if you dont have loans

They get a percentage from credit and debit transactions. It's a huge source of income.

Why do you think smaller corner store style shops have card minimums? They get charged out the ass every month by the bank in processing fees. If they don't set that minimum they'll end up having to pay more than they made in sales.

thats the shops fault for not charging more for card than cash. besides its easier for the shop to accept a card than it is to count cash all the time, so they pay for that privilege

Use your brain for a second: Would you ACTUALLY go to a store that CHARGES you an additional fee to pay with a card?

If they made the original prices cheaper without the fee, yes. Or they can phrase it as a discount on cash. w/e works. I would if the final price is not that much more expensive, or if i am paying cash and want to pay less

You clearly have no idea how retail works.

No i dont. I dont understand why they would swallow the cost of credit card transactions and pass it to everyone, rather than why only passing it to people who use credit cards. They can make products cheaper if they have a "fee". They can also call it a discount on cash rather than a fee on credit

Your entire routine can be checked based on your payments. Unless you don't buy much but otherwise there is a ton of info about you in your payments.

It's for privacy reasons.

Yes I am aware of this, it shows on their online activity. Theres nothing to hide anyway. They have home address once you signed up for it. When I think about it i rarely use them that much. Probably cancel them sooner or later.

As for privacy, they are not buggin me re or hounding me on the phone , sending spam or whatever; so im glad there.

Have to remember if you own a own or buy a home, you deal with a bank if you need a loan just as well.

This strategy would be good for a pedophile or criminal on run lols.

Taking the whole tinfoil hat thing too far.

Revolution is coming. They will look through your payments and if they see anything they will regard as suspicious activity will warrant a visit from the fed. Doesn't matter how long ago you bought it.

It's all privacy. If you are one of those people thinking that privacy is useless because you are not a criminal... Then you better educate yourself on it because it's a big and important issue.

Thats what I mentioned above? What are you guys buying with bitcoin that needs so much anonymity?

I hope im not going to jail for going to mc donalds, I know its a crime and all. And people be hatin for shopping at walmart that might be another crime.

Maybe those heat lamps for my special plants, makes sense now.

I just told you. It's not only for illegal activity. It's for PRIVACY. You clearly have no clue what privacy really is and how important it really is. For everyone.

I do know what it is, its basically spying on consumers.

Not just consumers. People. People or businesses spying on other people.

In an Orwellian state there is no privacy. 0% of it.

reddit too hehe. If i remember correctly some big company owns this one, forget which.

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lol

edit: hehe thanks that was an interesting read.

I'm not hiding anything or doing anything illegal. I'm out there in my community, I vote, I pay taxes and I spend money locally. It's about reducing my footprint.

It's not about hiding. It's about taking back control of our money. Fiat is an instrument of debt. It is created as debt for the paying of debt. Every year the gov steals (by printing more) 2-4% of your money.

Bitcoins is the opposite. As there will only ever be a certain amount created, it will increase in value. It is not debt because you can't loan out more than you have.

Also with cash, the cops can seize it if they suspect you of a crime.

Purchases made with Bitcoins pay a very small transaction fee. And it arrives instantly. Try sending someone in Mexico a bunch of money and see how much you pay.

What about Turkey? How hard do you think it would be to wire cash to someone in Turkey right now? Bitcoins do not have that problem as they are decentralized, meaning, it's the people's money.

Lastly, cash is the #1 instrument for drugs, CP and all the other nasty things out there. Why are you not condemning that?

Agreed. As I've stated elsewhere, this is not about hiding. THis is about reducing my impact. I pay taxes. I support my local economy. I'm a member of my town's Historical Commission and Cultural Council. And I vote. Often.

Why do you close the door when you go to the toilet? Why do you wear clothes on a hot summer day?

Do you have something to hide? or do you just want some privacy? Why is the internet any different?

Bitcoin is used for making online purchases of items I need online where a credit card or paypal is the only other option. I don't trust PayPal and I don't have a credit card. Now some companies still accept check payment, but I don't have a bank account either. So that leaves cash. Right now if I need something like ink for the printer, or stamps or whatever, I can go to the place and buy the ink or the stamps with cash. It's worked out great so far.

Bitcoin is used for online music lessons over skype/hangouts.

Welcome to /r/conspiracy

we will downvote the fuck out of you for asking questions.

pillock

By spending "money" with your credit cards, the banks are profiting. Don't be naive, they outsmarted your strategy before you had even thought of it.

Your entire routine can be checked based on your payments. Unless you don't buy much but otherwise there is a ton of info about you in your payments.

It's for privacy reasons.

There's a federal AND state sales tax?

Welcome to /r/conspiracy

we will downvote the fuck out of you for asking questions.

Why do you close the door when you go to the toilet? Why do you wear clothes on a hot summer day?

Do you have something to hide? or do you just want some privacy? Why is the internet any different?

Bitcoin is used for making online purchases of items I need online where a credit card or paypal is the only other option. I don't trust PayPal and I don't have a credit card. Now some companies still accept check payment, but I don't have a bank account either. So that leaves cash. Right now if I need something like ink for the printer, or stamps or whatever, I can go to the place and buy the ink or the stamps with cash. It's worked out great so far.

Bitcoin is used for online music lessons over skype/hangouts.

LOL. Cheers!

yup. I pay them in cash

Exactly.. like I feel like some of my tax dollars are spent on things I probably wouldn't spend them on..but at the same time I really like the fact that if my house is on fire I can call a number and have somebody come out and figure it out. I like that our children learn to read good and do other things good too, thanks to public schooling

I wouldn't trust a fireproof resistant safe that is included in the "aren't expensive" list for your entire life savings in cash.

I love those things. They survive every time, but if the fire is hot enough, your fiat burns up anyways.

Well, because like I initially mentioned, what you're doing is something that various other individuals might themselves do as well if they can see that one person (you) is doing it pretty decently enough with a family and kinds to boot.

That's no small argument in favor of saying f.u. to CCs.

And the way you phrased your OP does indeed make the whole thing seem quite a bit like an IAMA. That's kind of how I was approaching it anyway and is why I was asking you a few Qs.

Sorry if you've had enough of it. No harm meant.

LOL. I am not.