I agree entirely. The one positive aspect of all of this manipulation is that it is a good indicator of what truths they are most concerned with.

Exactly. Here's the three issues I've detected the most downvoting on that doesn't make sense for this sub:

One: Hoax theories, like Sandy Hook, Boston Marathon, Batman shooting, the 'no planes' and 'hollow towers' theories of 9/11, and the theory that the JFK assassination was a hoax (a theory I've presented and been downvoted to hell for).

Two: Global climate change skepticism.

Three: Israel/Zionism/Jewish influence in business, government, the arts, organized crime, etc.

Precisely. Also, anything that deals with Peak Oil or calls BS on the current fracking hype gets down voted into oblivion immediately.

I haven't followed that but will have to do so.

After reading OP's submission on gaming I'll have to consider that as another protected area . . . albeit one I'm not familiar with.

Oh, and anything that questions the veracity of Monsanto products or Nestle's attempt to privatize water gets a lot of attention. Basically OPs theory that corporate interests are protected is probably true.

That reminds me: Gas Fracking Industry Using Military Psychological Warfare Tactics and Personnel In U.S. Communities

If corporations will shell out good money on military personnel, why not $10/hour for a few losers with persona management software?

These are the main things I see on r/conspiracy...

Those are things I'm interested in and I bet most organic conspiracy users are interested in. So I think there are lots of submissions like this. And the Israel/Zionist stuff gets promoted oftentimes, but it gets bogged down in fighting, like this current thread that has been overrun by trolls:

http://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/1tsz2l/zionist_support_of_multiculturalism_exists/

'hollow towers' theories of 9/11

have not heard this one. Why would you think the towers were hollow? Honest question. I had a job interview in one of them. Not hollow.

What floor?

The theory is that most of the floors were never built out for occupancy. Even according to the official response from the Port Authority many of the floors remained unoccupied during the 3 decades of existence. It was a grand opportunity for many companies and other intelligence agencies to engage in insurance fraud, fake death of agents, etc. The buildings would be much easier to prep for demolition and may have even been built with this in mind.

Here's the place that has done the research (including FOIA requests) on the hollow towers theory:

http://letsrollforums.com/world-trade-center-hollow-t21572.html

http://letsrollforums.com/press-release-world-trade-t24256.html

Here's a list of most of their threads on the subject:

http://letsrollforums.com/world-trade-center-hollow-f16.html

I remember seeing in a video a group of construction trucks in and around the towers during 9/11 and seeing huge boxes labeled "(can't recall the name) Demolition." I took a screen grab, but it's on my computer at home. I'll look for it and post it here when I get the opportunity.

They were labeled Tyrone. I found them in a Jewish directory at some point but just checked the link and they're gone now. Here's their contact info if anyone wants to ask what they were up to. Tyrone 416 East 236th St. Bronx, NY 10470 718-842-7479 718-842-7472 Demolition Specialists, Rubbish Removal, Plant dismantling

what else is there besides "business and organized crime"?

Exactly, my current thread on Sandy Hook and the censorship of the police report is doing really bad point wise but has as many comments as this thread. Also half the comments I think are shadow banned.. If I got that phrase correct.. Says 56 comments but I only see like 15. Reloads the same every time.

This one? http://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/1ttxdv/sandy_hook_report_released_content_redacted/

I counted about 56 comments myself (maybe 55). Two subthreads are hidden but available if you click on them.

Do you still not see them?

And 19 upvotes and 9 downvotes doesn't seem that out of the ordinary, but I would still bet many of the 9 are trolls or shills.

Does seem like there should be more upvotes with that many comments though.

I don't see any hidden subthreads..just the first 15 comments and that's it.

edit: how do I view if shadow banned?

Log out and see if there is a difference? I counted about 55.

I did..the only way I can view all the comments is through self.conspiro

Strange. Click on message the moderators above the moderators box and ask them.

[deleted]

oh, is that why the replies sometimes don't equal what it says before you open the thread?

[deleted]

The most likely cause is this-

/r/conspiracy has an auto mod that will not allow an account less than 3 days old to post threads or comment. Given that /u/solidwhetstone banned a crapload of our users it is probably one of them commenting with a newly made account. The comments will appear after the account is 3 days old, or if a mod happens to approve the comments.

I remember in SomethingAwful, the post background alternated between white and light blue for every other poster. It was pretty obvious when somebody was hellbanned because you would have two white posts or two blue posts in a row.

See my comment below.

Yes, if it shows 1 reply but there are no comments visible - that means someone is shadowbanned and commented on the thread.

Similarly with other amounts (i.e., you see it say 6 comments but only 5 appear - 1 shadowbanned).

Most often though it's noticeable with 2 or 1 comments, since you either see 1 or none, respectively. So any time you see that you can tell the shadowbanned person quickly by saying "first commenter, you're shadowbanned, FYI".

They can see everyones' comments, but no one can see theirs.

Yes, if it shows 1 reply but there are no comments visible - that means someone is shadowbanned and commented on the thread.

Similarly with other amounts (i.e., you see it say 6 comments but only 5 appear - 1 shadowbanned).

Most often though it's noticeable with 2 or 1 comments, since you either see 1 or none, respectively. So any time you see that you can tell the shadowbanned person quickly by saying "first commenter, you're shadowbanned, FYI".

They can see everyones' comments, but no one can see theirs.

that seems like sloppy programming. Is there any technical reason why they didn't fix that?

I'm not sure why it's like that, probably just overlooked. At this point it's definitely a good thing, though.

If not for that oversight we probably wouldn't have any way to tell people they are shadowbanned.

That said it's not hard to check for yourself (open incognito window, if you don't see your comments when logged out - you're shadowbanned).

Who said that?

...jk

Great post.

Somebody should create a front end for reddit, something like a "metareddit." It could keep track of its own vote counts and order articles appropriately.

If serious /r/conspiracy posters all used the metareddit, the original reddit voting system would not matter.

Scammers and shills could choose to use the metareddit (in which case their IPs and vote-brigade patterns would be logged and accessible to more than just the reddit admins), or to avoid the metareddit (in which case their votes would be ignored by metareddit).

The front end could also be used to work around shill mods, like at /r/politics. (Just because something is deleted at reddit does not mean it is deleted at metareddit.)

And then over time, the metareddit could evolve to have a new back end, replacing original reddit entirely. Ideally a distributed, de-centralized back end... but that's a different story.

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I agree about the motivation part. :) That's why a group project might work well.

Having servers is a good thing, too.

I'd like to see something that is totally open, so people could get most of the info from the DB, so there were no fears about admins hiding / abusing info, and so that the whole thing could be evolved into something distributed and hopefully more shill-resistant in the future.

As far as motivation / effort goes, I could probably supply some assistance, but I think it would make a nice open group project for something like /r/conspiracy to tackle.

whats yourback ground soldier?

thats a good idea.

Would it be possible to have another sorting category tab at the top? Like, "Hot, New, Rising, Controversial, and Oblivion." So we could see posts that just received outrageous numbers of downvotes?

Anything and everything Israel related gets met with an organized group of JIDF agents, acting in concert across /r/news, /r/politics, /r/worldnews, /r/conspiracy and of course the infamous /r/conspiratard trolls. I started my Reddit career on /r/conspiracy this past February and have since moved on to posting in the larger subs, only to be met with an incredibly organized downvote brigade immediately after each Israel/zionism related post goes up. I'll literally have my lone upvote and 2 or 3 downvotes In a matter of seconds, its very frustrating. I can't get anywhere on those subs and am thinking about giving this sub the majority of my attention again. Also there's the fact that /r/news and /r/politics moderators hassle me daily, I've been banned and unbanned from /r/politics twice in the last month and am getting pretty tired of explaining to them how the AMERICAN Studies Association academic boycott of Israel is in fact US politics my eyes are going to pop out of my head, the willing cognitive dissonance on behalf of those moderators is really unbelievable.

The truth comes to those who seek it

This is not one of the things that simply fades. You use what it is while it's here. They've spent millions and countless man hours infiltrating the places where we exchange thoughts and ideas. Don't allow the attempts, any of them to win. Naturally the conversation will move to a better place with better technology. I wish it sooner than later too. But in the mean time call out the bullshit when you see it, and use what you can however you can. Don't let anyone stop you.

Its something we must fix.

I'm sure there are people being paid right now to create usernames to just to solely downvote anything from this sub.

[deleted]

Well said.

Which posts specifically do you think are unfairly being buried?

[deleted]

On the second one . . . . for sure, that's the type of thing that is buried here. That falls into the hoax theory I mention above. Sort of. One could make a whole new category for controlled opposition.

There are lots of people like me that argue Snowden, Assange, Anonymous, et al., are controlled opposition honeypots and you will see people comment on this but a lot of negative votes. Could be simple disagreement because people fell for the ruse and fell into a hero worship role and feel like it's bashing. But why wouldn't people that believe Snowden and Assange to be the real deal be open to hearing conspiracies about them being controlled? Most conspiracy people (like me) don't just shoot down theories without examination. If I hear someone suspects a source I previously trusted of being controlled opposition I'll consider it.

Btw, I like Willy Loman for his openness to hoax theories and controlled opposition theories but it's possible he's deep cover controlled opposition as well . . . one must be ever vigilant . . . but I like the topics and theories he covers.

The 1st one is interesting, too cynical for me - but it makes some points.

It's just kind of everything is bad and beyond repair. I don't know if it's engaging - people have issues they think are especially important and this really doesn't touch on anything specific it's possibly too general.

The 2nd one seems like Snowden bashing. I don't think many people get down with that, that he's part of a double conspiracy essentially.

The 3rd one I don't even know what's going on in that gif, i remember seeing it the other day and thinking "I don't know what's going on in this gif"

I seem super negative, but I think it's possible things don't succeed because people just don't connect with the way the content is being presented or just disagree with the point it makes.

On the 3rd one I'm confused as well but intrigued. I agree with OP that it doesn't deserve a downvote. I assume most people just went, "Meh, another NASA/moon landing hoax theory" and downvoted it. It doesn't make sense that organic users of a conspiracy sub would downvote that content, especially if they were confused.

It makes me want to figure out what's going on and I thought OP's comment was provocative in a way that should have elicited questions or responses.

The first one, the rant, doesn't warrant downvotes either. It may be general and may not have garnered that much interest, but I can't see organic users of this sub being hostile enough to the message to down vote it.

Even though the subject matter may be trite for this sub ('down with power') it was well written and used provocative examples.

One idea may be to disable downvotes. Maybe people more familiar with how that works can chime in.

Wow, this thread has already downvotes right now. They are trying to deny something obvious to be discussed. It means there are already evident trolls / shills / retards here. It is sad that we cannot know who exactly is trying to sabotage this thread, this system is defective and against genuine posters.

The voting system is obviously making this place weak and very easy to be corrupted by the enemy. The only solution is to ask the mods to disable the voting system here on r/conspiracy, or at least making public informations about who voted and how. Otherwise it is useless posting here. Normal forums without voting bullshit are way better against trolls.

[deleted]

Make multiple accounts. Upvote against the downvotes.

I'm sorry but I have to remove your comment. Vote gaming is against Reddit's terms of use.

It's cool. I remembered the rule after I posted the comment, but I thought it might slip thru the cracks.

Btw, congrats on the new modship. I've often upvoted yr posts and comments. Have a cool day!

Thanks for being so reasonable about it.

I'd rather have a warm day. It's been a little too cool in my neck of the woods ;>)

Lol, okay. It's cold here on the plateau as well.

So how does r/conspiratard get away with blatant brigading? I mean, they aren't even subtle about it...

Well, as far as I know they don't actually post "go to /r/conspiracy and up/down vote. They even have a "rule" against it. Apparently it's just "understood" that that's what they're supposed to do. Or maybe they've got something going in a private subreddit. That's probably why the admins let them get away with it.

Did you just wander up on my comment, or did someone flag it? Just curious...

I was going through the mod queue and it had been reported.

thanks. let's talk again some time.

If that is true how did I see this post?

lol, some can't just handle the truth.... that many posts on this sub is very bad! Conspiracy theorists finding conspiracies on a conspiracy forum? xD You've got to be kidding? And this is why people cannot take "conspiracy theorists" seriously. It is because most of you find conspiracies where ever you look. Focus more on facts and hard evidence rather than on weird symbolism and unscientific feelings. If you are so damn concerned about downvotes, write some bot that gives you upvotes.

Yup, it's shills. All those shills are trying to stop us proving how fake 9/11 and Sandy Hook are, which we could if we could just upvote our articles to the front page.

oh, is that why the replies sometimes don't equal what it says before you open the thread?

I remember in SomethingAwful, the post background alternated between white and light blue for every other poster. It was pretty obvious when somebody was hellbanned because you would have two white posts or two blue posts in a row.

The most likely cause is this-

/r/conspiracy has an auto mod that will not allow an account less than 3 days old to post threads or comment. Given that /u/solidwhetstone banned a crapload of our users it is probably one of them commenting with a newly made account. The comments will appear after the account is 3 days old, or if a mod happens to approve the comments.