I think banning pre-emptive large amounts of people is nonsense and only creates drama.

Ignoring /r/conspiratard is the best way to deal with them as long there is no evidence for trolling or bad behavior from a certain user, i see no reason to ban pre emptive users.

They use alt accounts anyway.

This really seems like the most reasonable answer. Unless they've actually trolled the sub I can't see a good reason to ban them and in the few that I checked out none of them had actually done so in the last 30 days. If we see a troll we can report them and then you guys can figure out whether he needs banned or not. You've always shown pretty good judgement in the past, and I do imagine it would create even more drama to just start banning people.

Thanks weed. Dunno what I did that was ban worthy to be on that list :)

they just wanted to sneak your name into it ;)

I wouldn't be surprised if the list existed to get me banned in the first place lol.

Not to mention the circlejerking they would be doing if they did get banned, they take that shit as a badge of honor ove there.

http://www.reddit.com/user/YellsAtWalls

Ignore people who purposely halt discussion? People that go to conspiratard to talk about how they don't like this sub?

I don't see any violation of the rules in his comment history.

You however did tell him to shut the fuck up, which would violate rule #3, stop this behavior.

Post a link where he violates a rule and i will look into it.

Congratulations.

9

In a thread about this whole thread. Wonder if their active discussion is having any impact on the outcome of this communities active discussion on the matter.

[deleted]

We tried it out for a day here on /r/conspiracy.

It was making the new queue a bit better.

The problem is that isn't actually remvoing the downvote button and you can still downvote, if you disable the CSS.

This doesen't protect against bots which we had already problems with.

Yeah, and some people freaked out. I remember one person who I'm not going to name who posted a bunch of incredibly hostile threads because he thought his voice was being taken away. oh, good times....

[deleted]

I am now some time here and can say the admins did a decent job here.

They sometimes don't respond but also removed some of the downvote bots.

The major subreddits are corrupted by the mods mostly.

Its far from only /r/conspiratard,/r/SubredditDrama and the racist subreddits are also present here.

Also we have those who are just trolling here for the lulz.

All that will come of this is a need to identify their new accounts that they would create immediately. Banning new users from posting will only punish legitimate users. Banning diwnvoting will see this sub flooded with garbage in 24 hours or less.

I don't know if I agree with pre-emptive bans either.

If I see them breaking rule 9 I ban them, but if they want to post in both subs and follow the rules then that's what the free flow of information is all about.

Not if their intent is to derail and it usually is, they just do more low level trolling by not quite breaking the rules enough to get banned, but still do their best to stop meaningful discussion.

I would agree about pre-emptive bans for any average user, but people who are known mods or major contributors to /r/conspiritard. That is all the evidence we should need to know they are not here to add anything of value to the conversation.

8 of the 9 mods listed have been banned for a long time for various rules infractions.

As for the others, we would need specific instances of violations of our rules.

mossadi is an auto moderator. I'm hoping thats the one who hasn't been banned.

You do realize that not everyone that occasionally posts to both forums come here to troll, right?

This push seems to go directly against the ethos of this board as described on the side-bar.

This subreddit is a thinking ground, above all else we respect everyone's opinions and ALL religious beliefs and creeds.

Should that be changed to the following?

This subreddit is a thinking ground, above all else we respect everyone's opinions (unless you happen to post on a subreddit we don't like) and ALL religious beliefs and creeds.

[deleted]

So the only way to gauge the strength the community is to implement policies that directly go against the stated ethos of the community?

I don't have any interest in trying to control what other people on /r/conspiratard do; I comment there very rarely and only when something specific catches my attention, and if I make my way here from there, I only up-vote discussions I am participating in (even if I disagree with the other commenters).

If you take issue with people organizing brigades and trolling efforts, by all means ban them from here, but don't ban the rest of us because we're not going to police your subreddit for you.

Can you prove they were brigading? If you can, then obviously a ban would make sense. But I would need to see some proof.

[deleted]

Yeah, it was a post warning people not to participate in the brigade. For all I know, the original message could've come from an alt of someone here looking to trap the users over there.

[deleted]

You definitely just changed the subject. Once again, the post was blatantly anti-brigading. IT WAS WARNING USERS. I'm not talking about what they say or what they believe. I talking about brigading. Prove to me that they brigade.

EDIT: Ask for proof, OP goes silent.

I'm sure you know, just as well as the rest of us, that if "proof" exists then it's hidden away in a private sub. Posting links to this sub in that sub is evidence of it but certainly not "proof".

Fair enough, I'm just tired of people crying "brigade!" everytime they get downvoted or debated.

I just learned that /r/conspiratard has been converted to a private sub. Now we won't even be able to document evidence of them posting to instigate vote brigading. Are you sure you want to support that?

Well heck, you telling me it was a private sub just informed me that it was a private sub. While no I do not not support that (making it impossible to find evidence/proof), I enjoy some of the more ludicrous material posted there. Not so much the stuff that links here, but the user-created stuff. So I will stay there.

However, if they ever do publicly post about brigading then I retract my support, because that is stuff that could get a user shadowbanned. I go there for the lulz, not for brigading/trolling.

Serious question, why do you not make this sub private?

Making this sub private would go against the very purpose for its existence... free and open discussion (as long as it's respectful).

Ahh yes that makes sense. Well, unfortunately that sounds like a catch-22. Either you can't have true free speech, or you will have trolls.

On another note, /r/conspiritard is a private subreddit, but not the one we inhabit. /r/conspiratard is our home. If you are going to hate us, at least hate the right place :)

On another note, /r/conspiritard is a private subreddit

Dang, I could have sworn I clicked on the link I included after I posted it to double check and found it to be private. Did you happen to click on it when I first posted it?

And now I can't find the comment where I found it either.

No, I didn't click on the link you posted. But it would not have mattered, because I subscribe there already. I was just told by a friend that you might be going to the wrong subreddit.

My mistake then. Sorry for the confusion.

No problem. Good luck with your sub. This has been an eventful week to say the least.

if they ever do publicly post about brigading

I understand what you mean but it's no longer "public". I guess you're going to have to get used to not using that word to describe them.

I think you are looking at the wrong subreddit. I believe you are looking at /r/conspiritard, not /r/conspiratard. We inhabit the second.

Pah, private sub? You just can't see the fnords!

[deleted]

[deleted]

I made it through about the first 5 and gave up, that shit takes forever. And I didn't come across a single one that had trolled here in last 30 days or so yet.

Please show me what I've posted that is racist or inflammatory.

And who decides what is inflammatory? You?

Way to continue the drama! If you feel users are abusive here, don't even respond to them. Report them to the mods and let them handle it. Stop feeding the fucking trolls, guys. That's the whole basis of their existence here: attention. Ignore the fucks and STOP EMPOWERING THEM...

The problem is when companies pay people to downvote certain things into oblivion and promote their own agenda's.

Can't really trust the votes since /r/conspiratard will obviously brigade it. I think anyone who is here to have honest discussions should stay. If you go over to /r/conspiratard to mock people here, then stay over there. That's about it. I see quite a few names on that list who are clearly just here to make everyone angry. I say the mods should click the history of each person and just ban anyone who is here to troll and mock. /r/conspiratard has a no trolling rule and so should we.

Can't really trust the votes since /r/conspiratard[1] will obviously brigade it.

Do you have any proof of this claim? Other than the fact that they link to this page? If you use the claim brigading due to the links, then you could also accuse /r/bestof of brigading.

They are active posters in this sub. Admittedly and demonstrated during the mod drama.

I wasn't asking about if they were posters, that's not against Reddit's ToS. Brigading is a much more serious issue, and I would like to see some proof of this claim.

"Proof of claim" is a tactic used to cause disharmony in discussion.

How about all the posts that had to be deleted making fun of the sub during the mod debacle?

You can downvote troll posts to make them go away. You can't make a downvote brigade go away. That is why I am interested in proof of the brigade.

Also, since when is asking for proof "a tactic used to cause disharmony in discussion"? It is part of discussion. If you can provide proof, then we can further the discussion. Right now we might as well be saying the "tooth fairy is teaming up with santa to put fluoride in our presents" since we don't need proof.

The amount of times you have asked for "proof of claim" in this ONE thread is proof that you are using it to discredit and take away from any discussion we would have.

Anyone who actually visits this sub regularly does not need proof of brigading, as I type these words I can only shake my head in sadness at the lack of words to convey this feeling. Its the same feeling that makes you want to slap someone in the face for asking "what color is that" 500 times in a row.

So, you sit there, whine over being called a shill while you try your hardest to stop discussion in a sub you don't even like.

Since when have I whined about being called a shill? I actually don't think I've ever been called one before, so thanks for that.

And perhaps the reason why I've asked for it so much is because NO ONE CAN PROVIDE ANY PROOF. The burden of proof is on you if you are going to demand bans. None of this "Known Truth" bullshit if you are asking for bans. Either you have evidence of it happening, or it might as well not have happened. It is that simple.

Yeah, sorry people who come here for discussions can't provide proof that another sub is conspiring against them to systematically vote and post useless things. Kind of like this discussion right here, someone who posts in conspiratard who admittedly does not like this sub putting in effort in making sure people do not think another sub geared twords making fun of the people here has anything to do with the problem of having people come here and post useless shit to make fun of everyone.

Your posts have nothing to do with discussion. The only function of your posts is to provide an ultimatum to stop discussion. You obviously have a vested interest in this function or you would have never started this.

My vested interest is in fair treatment. Please don't attack me personally in attempt to change the subject. That is causing a disharmony in the discussion. I only wish to see a fair trail before you condemn us all. I believe that all people are innocent until proven guilty. So prove that we are guilty. And not guilty by association. Just because I am friends with people who have committed crimes does not mean that I have committed the crime.

Also, I think what we are doing is having a discussion about the topic. So yes, me asking for proof has furthered the discussion.

My vested interest is in fair treatment. Please don't attack me personally in attempt to change the subject. That is causing a disharmony in the discussion.

You deliberately halted any discussion we might have had about the original topic with your ultimatum. Now the discussion is about you...

Ahh, a solid point there telling me to shut the fuck up. I was furthering the discussion by asking for proof. If that had been provided then we could've continued to further the discussion. However, you chose to attack me, so I had to defend myself. I did not make this discussion about me, you did.

An now we have gone full circle. Thank you for displaying the tactics used against the every day people in a easy to read and concise manner. Your contribution will be used to identify those like you who have no intention of actually facilitating or entertaining ideas. Have a good day.

Seriously, what are you talking about? All I did was ask for some proof, and you proceeded to attack me. That is what derailed the conversation.

I don't believe that most people here would agree with this guys hostility towards you and hope you don't hold it against the rest of the sub. We welcome all opinions and arguments here that are meant to provoke thought as long as they aren't ill-intended.

Nah, I try not to judge the group by the actions of an individual. And it is my hope that you all will do the same.

He posts in conspiratard and admittedly doesn't believe in conspiracy theories I'm guessing, but he isn't trolling or initiating hostilities so there's really no reason to be hostile with him.

Demanding proof to further discussion about the topic is hostile to the topic itself.

I was furthering the discussion by asking for proof. If that had been provided then we could've continued to further the discussion.

It is the main tactic used on reddit to shut down any discussion topic, when it is stated that no direct proof can be displayed there is then an opening to discredit the whole thread or topic.

Either you have evidence of it happening, or it might as well not have happened.

Such a dismissive statement.

Did you really just say that demanding proof to further discussion is hostile to the topic itself? I can't even wrap my brain around that. Anybody that posts here should be able to provide evidence any time we are asked, that is the entire point of what we do. Someone asking for proof of something isn't automatically something to get hostile about, whether he posts in Conspiratard or not.

If you ask to provide evidence that is fine, to demand proof so that you can further discussion on the topic is inherently hostile.

I didn't see him demand proof at all, in fact looks like he asked pretty politely to me.

Either you have evidence of it happening, or it might as well not have happened.

Good thing I do have evidence!

Do you have any proof of this claim?

I wasn't asking about if they were posters, that's not against Reddit's ToS. Brigading is a much more serious issue, and I would like to see some proof of this claim.

You can downvote troll posts to make them go away. You can't make a downvote brigade go away. That is why I am interested in proof of the brigade.

Also, since when is asking for proof "a tactic used to cause disharmony in discussion"? It is part of discussion. If you can provide proof, then we can further the discussion. Right now we might as well be saying the "tooth fairy is teaming up with santa to put fluoride in our presents" since we don't need proof.

3 posts centered around the basis that proof must be given or there can not be any more discussion, solidified by the 4th post.

Either you have evidence of it happening, or it might as well not have happened.

When proof is "asked" for 4 times in 3 posts it is no longer "asking" is it? Furthermore there were no attempts to salvage any direction other than proof.

Well shit, if you have evidence why didn't you just provide it? I imagine he asked for proof multiple times because instead of showing it to him you acted like he did something wrong by asking.

Quit feigning ignorance of context and actually reply like you have a brain, thank you.

[deleted]

Recognized.

/Verify?

I don't even know what that means.

So is anyone noticing a pattern here? If you're for protecting the sub from known agitators you are downvoted. Not that all of /r/conspiracy would necessarily agree with that action, but they mostly wouldn't downvote someone who is only trying to protect the sub.

Edit: And surprise, surprise the people here that usually post in /r/conspiritard are voted up and most others are currently near or below zero. Boy am I glad the [blank] are looking out for this sub.

[deleted]

They have one third of the users that we have active. If they post a direct link to this one, many of them will brigade this poll. That goes for all of their alt accounts as well and the outside help they get. Have an upvote, you'll need it.

Can you call it " The Purge " If you do please?

I'm in, please mods, ban these trolls, a lot of these accounts strike me as JIDF at a casual glance. Anyone who unduly accuses someone of antisemitism to stifle conversation, critical of Israel should be banned. It's such an obvious subversion of the 1st rule of /r/conspiracy. All of a sudden you go from discussing the plight of the Palestinian people, to defending your credibility as an objective interpreter of events is Israel.

[deleted]

How does it logically follow that "Disagreeing with you == Zionist".

I don't even post or vote in the political conspiracy threads, only the scientific ones.

[deleted]

This isn't a game of Clue where accusations follow the formula "I accuse x of y!".

What does the following mean if it doesn't mean you suspect the people disagreeing with you are sympathetic to Zionism?

This thread is causing /r/conspiracy[1] to show its true colors. They're blue and white by a vast majority.

You definitely just changed the subject. Once again, the post was blatantly anti-brigading. IT WAS WARNING USERS. I'm not talking about what they say or what they believe. I talking about brigading. Prove to me that they brigade.

EDIT: Ask for proof, OP goes silent.

My vested interest is in fair treatment. Please don't attack me personally in attempt to change the subject. That is causing a disharmony in the discussion.

You deliberately halted any discussion we might have had about the original topic with your ultimatum. Now the discussion is about you...

I just learned that /r/conspiratard has been converted to a private sub. Now we won't even be able to document evidence of them posting to instigate vote brigading. Are you sure you want to support that?

My mistake then. Sorry for the confusion.

Recognized.

/Verify?