'I really hope you think I'm an idiot'

Everybody who swallowed this story is an idiot (useful or not) especially if they followed it closely.

The only truth I could garner from it was that he had blown the whistle on some pretty nasty shit in the force, and that probably isn't such a good idea when you look at the things he was blowing the whistle on, what did he expect would be done to him? It's awful.

The worst was when they added the celebrity ranting at the end of it to discredit him.

in law enforcement- if you know how to get your hands dirty you go far. If you a morally high grounded individual with a conscious, that is the only time you ever get fired. There was a guy once that tried to go against them, to prove that they were all psychopathic pigs- they gave him a choice; to die by a hail of infinite bullets or to be burned alive.

Can someone tell me what he was blowing the whistle on? Legit question, I didn't follow the story closely at the time.

Right. The premis of the whole mass media (propoganda) story was that he was "blowing the whistle" on the LAPD because of rampant corruption. But that only holds water as long as you assume his facebook manifesto is legit, which means you just assume his facebook account was legit...I'm not saying it's impossible, but my point is, if you want to believe this story as it was presented you littlerally just have to have faith that everything you were told was true, and there simply isn't any hard evidence that this is so.

What do you want to hear?

Yes, we all know it was a cover up. Now what? What are we expected to do? I mean, I am totally with you here. There is no proof of anything and they set out to murder this man not bring him in. They clearly did not want him talking.

But what is next? They won. They fucking won, man. They have the guns, the media, the spin control, the law all on their side. They can say anything they want, do anything they want. They can set you up for murder if they want.

They arent showing proof for anything and guess what? They never do when they kill someone. All of America should have woke up in 1992 when Rodney King was beat on camera and the cops went free.

All that is left is people like you, me and a few others who remain frustrated. Even still, if people like us got out of line they could twist our words and actions to fit whatever agenda they want. Its all fucked up man.

If we were powerless, they wouldn't need to expend so much time, energy, and money into keeping us docile, confused, afraid, etc.

Never make the mistake of thinking you have no power.

I never said we were powerless. I said they won. And I asked what do we do?

I see the same stories of cover ups and police brutality posted every single day, the cops get off, no one is charged, stories shoved under the rug, people get mad then nothing happens, then another shitty story pops up, people get mad again, rinse and repeat. When you look at it globally, in the places where they DO do something, like Egypt, its actually sanctioned by our government. Or you look over to Libya, where they murdered Muammar Gaddafi. Or the murder of Saddam Hussein. I mean shit when they murder world leaders and get away with it on a global stage, what does a little Chris Dorner matter? Or YOU? Or ME?

They have us directly by the balls. The ONLY thing people could do is just...stop working. Stop working and don't worry about death.

We would need to do this: http://i.imgur.com/xN95mSv.gif We would need to be Luke and Leia and Han. But technically that would be considered terrorism so....not fucking happening.

Therefore we sit and take it and post about it and stay frustrated as we watch the world around us continue to go to shit. Then we go play with a puppy or something.

I know, I hear you. I wish I had the answers for you - I don't.

All I meant was that yours is almost exactly the reaction the "thems" want you to have to all of this. They want you and all of us thinking, "whelp, they win - we lose. Nothing we can do now but accept it."

Nah, fuck that. I don't agree. As long as I have breath in my lungs I'll speak my mind and be unafraid to do so.

I don't know, feel hopeless if you want. I don't, though - naive or not.

Edit: Also keep in mind: there are BILLIONS of us.

Here is how I break it down

1. People who dont want to see what happens and ignore reality

2. People who see what happens, see its hopeless and give up and turn into #1

3. People who see what happens, see its hopeless and fight

4. People who see what happens, see its hopeless and talk about it

5. People who see what happens, think they can win and fight

6. People who know what happens and exploit it for personal gain

The younger you are the more apt you will be to want to rebel, then you get more and more frustrated and either become a terrorist, become a complainer or take a happy pill and become docile. Think Neo in The Matrix.

So its all about what are you gonna do, you know? I mean shit we probably all have files on us just for discussing this shit. So ill just play my xbox one and enjoy ghosts and battlefield 4 and enjoy also discussing shit like this with yall, ie being a complainer.

I think we need a #7:

• #7 - People who know what happens and exploit it for the purpose of fighting from a position of power.

That doesn't mean anything illegal either, I'm just talking about using the same privilege hacks that TPTB use to fuck us over for our own agenda.

Easy? Not at all. Possible? I think so.

yeah i agree... actually, people would have been really pissed that Neo ruined their happy world and woke them up to destruction, mess, and a lot of work.

Although I can see where Ambiguously_Ironic is coming from. history has had surprising examples of a few people making a change. like ghandi. but realistically that isnt any of us... and i think people are too..... submerged in the matrix for there to be another ghandi.

all we can do is make survival plans. water food shelter independence.

Unless we win the lottery and start exploiting for personal gain, lol.

all of the best examples are pre internet, pre globalization, pre mcdonalds on every street corner. the world is much much smaller now which makes it all easier to control. Gandhi didn't have to worry about a drone wiping him out. There weren't cameras everywhere. Media wasn't the God that it is today. The system can put out a message, and have it repeated millions of times over until you believe it. Everyone is plugged in. Its nearly an impossible mission nowadays. A worldwide EMP knocking out world wide communications would help. Sure, more chaos at first, but smaller towns would be better then the big brother shit we have going on now.

I agree!

This is so true, there is power in numbers. Their whole purpose is controlling the population through lies. Our challenge is educating the population to think critically.

they have computers for that now

They have computers for what? Keeping us docile? That would only reinforce the point I was making.

Who said i was arguing a counterpoint? Maybe that it takes left effort than it used to? I don't know.

I would argue that it takes a lot more effort since the invention of the internet because it's pretty difficult to control the narrative when there are so many millions of people with access to so much information.

if I were Katt Williams, I'd say something like, "Y'gotsta think about quantum pimpin', nigga! Keepin' tabs on your ho's wit' browsa tabs. Automate the search f'shit you actually care about…"

wait, i'm slipping into the bipolar nonsense with mods modifying the opinions of millions at once and directing, hiding, or blocking conversations. Sorry, that's an actual point. lol

Anyway, you my nigga an' all, but automation is key. Fuck, who cares if people are talking. they're not doing but they feel like they are, hooray. Computers leads to robots that consume corpses, turn them into energy and keep going. They may or may not have been corpses when they found the fuel.

There are so many ways to give people a shiny to look at. Distract them with nonsense. Who cares if it's even real at this point? The movies were't enough so now we're in them. And then we make a movie. Like the 9/11 movies, or Bin Laden movies EVENTUALLY you will have a boston bombing movie. Or a batman movie. Or maybe you follow the life of a guy who's at all of them. Granted, you don't know why until the end. Anyone wanna write this script with me? Lol!

I agree with what you're saying - most people certainly use the Internet as simply a little brother to their TV, solely for consuming corporate media.

Luckily it doesn't have to be used that way, or places like this (and others) where we can have a decent discussion without someone simply trying to deflect the conversation, wouldn't exist.

Education is what everyone needs.

I don't have proof for you and, of course, I've never seen any since none exists.

What are you implying though: that it was all a psy-op and there was never a manhunt for him at all?

I've read about parts of his "manifesto" being doctored but do you think the entire thing was fabricated?

I'm not trying to ridicule, I'm legitimately asking what you make of this because all I can really say with any certainty is that there was definitely quite a bit of fuckery afoot with the whole situation.

Here is how my movie watching mind constructs it.

Dorner has legit beef with LAPD. He talks to Quan about it and tells Quan to keep it to himself. Quan agrees that something is fishy, but he takes it to a superior whom he thinks he can trust. The superior is in on all the bullshit and calls his friends and they realize Dorner could make trouble for them. So they start following Dorner. Tapping his movements, his apartment. Dorner gets wise to this and realizes he can't pass on new information directly to Quan. He gets in contact with Quan's daughter and decides to pass it to her in hopes that it can reach Quan. The superior and his people intercept this message and see that there are too many people in the loop now and need to stop all of it, so they murder Quan's daughter and the guy she was with as they waited for Dorner. Quan is now distraught, even tho he knows Dorner has a legit beef, he lost his daughter and is pretty disgusted. He completely gives in to the superior. Dorner sees the bodies dead and realizes he has been set up and splits. Meanwhile the superior and his cronies go thru with their hastily thrown together plan to make him seem like a lone nut. They let it quietly go across lines in a strong implication that Dorner would be better found dead and that compensation would be provided for it. They essentially create a bounty. Cops go wild and shoot at anything in sight. Again Dorner is half blindsided by all of this, he had plans to expose all of them and leave, but not this soon. He also needs to get to his documents in order to somehow get them out to the public, so he can't just leave LA. But they find him and capture him, alive. However, they still need to find the documents and rush around like mad to secure them before anyone else can. However, they can't say they captured him or else there would be arrangements, trials, public appearances, questions. So they threw him under the jail, where he may still be, alive. The documents have not been found yet. The End.

If they make a movie about it Will Smith can play him, Gene Hackman can play Quan, and Lisa Bonet can play his daughter.

Great read although it would be LL Cool J playing Dorner.

Thanks. The reason I said Will Smith is because it bares a resemblance to 'Enemy of the State'.

Guy has info, police want info, guy contacts old guy's daughter for help, police kill her and pin it on guy, guy on the run. the same building blocks.

licks lips, and smiles

It would have to be LL Cool J.

Quick trivia, anyone know what the LL Cool J name means?

Ladies Love Cool James (Todd Smith)<-LL's real name.

I imagined that they had killed him before the 'manhunt' and before Quan - to silence her father. The rest was theater.

so you think his letter was fake then?

I'm not sure how anyone can believe the facebook account was legit. All the photos uploaded within two days. I'm sure the shocking content of the manifesto and the confusion over multiple versions floating around compounded that. What does Zuckerberg know about it?

if that letter is psy-ops it's going really deep

parts of the letter seem legit, by the critereon of embarrassment, the LAPD wouldn't include such specific information as singing nazi songs.

if you were dorner and knew the only public platform you could use to get your manifesto out- what would you choose?

yeah, i would create a new facebook profile, upload a bunch of photos to make it look like it was established profile, and then post a crazy manifesto daring the LAPD to hunt me down and kill me before I got them?? WTF?

would the LA pd go as far out of their way to shoot random civilians while trying to keep up this lie? That seems pretty on point with their standard operation. they shot an old asian lady because she drove a truck; and a few jazz players in the process of this farce?

I'm sure it was compartmentalized enough that only a few in the force knew what was going on.

Its a huge possibility that the manifesto was fake. I remember when it came out that there were 2 copies floating around. I tend to think this guy knew specifics to implicate a few, but not enough to make an entire house of cards fall. But enough to cause some serious trouble into the operation of police. None of that was shown in his rambling manifesto.

there may have been a copy that was redacted or altered to make it less harsh, but that doesn't explain a dis-info letter slapping the department in the face. they also altered the letter to translate military terms, so those may have gotten mixed-up and blown out of proportion. maybe they just used his own words in a letter they produced and left all that in to make it realistic. but it's also easy enough to believe the letter for me anyways.

I'm seeing your comment just as I'm stepping out the door to go to the gym and will truly respond later, but I just wanted to say your polite, concise, and honest comment is awesome to see.

No problem, man. I'm here to discuss and learn the truth of things, not ridicule those who are trying to do the same.

if he's not implying it, I am.

So what did the ones perpetrating the psy-op gain from it? What was the motive?

To me it ended up with the cops looking like shit for injuring civilians during the manhunt and burning Dorner alive. I don't know, what do you make of it?

I've never really considered it from that angle before today.

Well let's think about it.

First, you don't blow whistles if ya knows what's goods for ya's.

Secondly, the police will do whatever they want and, as shown, more or less get away with it scott free because oh yah, it's taxpayer money they're wasting, they're not personally liable for anything.

Thirdly, they use this as a further reasoning to control guns, which is really just putting all guns in a few hands and thinking "how could that possibly end badly?!"

And the list goes on. But the point is that when you're real or not they will kill you and some other people because they are the only ones could hold them accountable and now why would they do that?

These types of events help to make sure the big budgets for police and federal agencies remain in place, because otherwise we would die, right?

I agree they could be using it as another excuse to control guns.

Did you guys listen to the police scanner as it was happening, live? On twitter they were leaking the transcript and it sounded like there was someone in the building that they wanted killed. i had assumed Dorner was the guy, but emareperiod's comment is interesting:

<Again Dorner is half blindsided by all of this, he had plans to expose all of them and leave, but not this soon. He also needs to get to his documents in order to somehow get them out to the public, so he can't just leave LA. But they find him and capture him, alive. However, they still need to find the documents and rush around like mad to secure them before anyone else can. However, they can't say they captured him or else there would be arrangements, trials, public appearances, questions. So they threw him under the jail, where he may still be, alive. The documents have not been found yet.

I think Dorner was murdered in that cabin. The way they spoke and the extreme actions they took probably did not need to occur if it was just a patsy.

But I don't think Dorner was running around people's backyard and holding people hostage.

I agree with emareperiod's that he was blindsided and had no real fall back plan. He knew they were after him and he was trying to escape. They could easily have arrested him and made him stand trial. They chose to murder him.

The cops were judge, jury and executioner.

This is why psy-ops would have been interested.

1) How far can they go and how will the public respond? They keep testing, how many rights and liberties can they destroy?

2) Again, based on twitter, celebs etc.... they were truly scared that a big black insane murderous ex-cop was in their back yard and could kill them. Locking their doors, feeling that the cops were out there protecting them from some kind of Jack the Ripper fairy tale monster.

The media was able to manipulate people very well at the time.

I have not followed the story so I am not sure if the general public still sees Dorner as a monster or someone who was set up.

Oh and the facebook thing had to have been faked. Government is written all over it. If they had made a good hacker he would have done a good job. The mistakes and confusion and stupidity of posting random pics just screams interdepartmental involvement where they are communicating or they are infighting.

I don't know how Dorner was really supposed to have had time to find a place to facebook while this thing was collapsing.... but it is possible. But shmegegy had some good points.

And at that point any whistleblower would have put all the info they had, even if they didn't currently have the documents. At least that way, the message would be out and people would ask questions - it would be more difficult to justify killing him.

Anyway, this is a great group, awesome discussions and knowledge sharing going on!

Can't corner the Dorner.

I think it was one of those fake FBI scare events they like to do every six weeks. Think Sandy Hook, Navy Yard Shooting, Boston Bombing, Wichita airport bomb plot, that sort of thing. I think the LAX shooting was one of the most blatant bullshit events.

I don't discount the possibility whatsoever - there was definitely a lot of sketchiness going on with the reporting of the whole Dorner thing.

I'm just skeptical on the motive because the end result was people being pissed off and more aware of the rampant corruption in the nation's police force.

Hmm.. I don't know.

That may be the case. On the other hand the script could have just backfired. Maybe we're reading too much into this. The whole passport thing was suspicious though. By the way I love we can have this discussion.

By the way I love we can have this discussion.

This is why I come to r/conspiracy, truly. To have reasoned discussion of topics that simply elicit shrill shrieking in other venues.

They are pushing the Anti-Gun agenda hard right now...

I had a blog post recently 'disappeared' in a really suspicious way... I listed a bunch of stats and scientific evidence, in history and in other countries.... used logic. I spent a long time on it and all the drafts and the post - gone. it was pretty pro gun.

Sometimes I think that the point of the whole Dorner charade, the transparency of the cover up and everything, was just to get people angry and to hate the govt. So maybe there'd be copycats running around or just a general trend in violence towards cops. This would make it fairly easy to legitimize any increase in the security state, especially if a bunch of civilians got hurt in the process.

^{<< bad guys taunt cops, cops shoot innocents, bad guy at fault for 'causing' the cops to shoot bystanders [remember that incident in NYC?] and therefore we really need to stop these crimes before they're even committed. being suspected of a crime is now a crime. keepin the country safe. >>}

or something like that. just a thought.

Did they ever play the conspiracy theorist card? If so it might have also been about marginalising anyone with critical thought.

No, they didn't play that card as I remember it, but the LAX "event" came about as close as I've ever seen.

Nah, you're not an idiot. I spoke with someone today who said that I was crazy for believing that the there were a group of elite people involved in banks, oil, and drugs that heavily influence governments around the world. He voted for Obama twice and the idea of Bilderbergs, MKUltra, Mockingbird, and Paperclip would go in one ear and out the other, dismissing it as fiction. I'm sure he would stop talking to me if I ever brought any of those up. I knew there was no way I could get through his thick skull, so I didn't even try. That, my friend, is an idiot. Asking for proof does not make you one. (sorry...ranted a bit)

I want to see the footage at Sandy Hook of "Lanza" shooting out the front window of the school. Honestly, I don't need to see the dead kids or whatever. I'm sure I could handle it, but that is a huge thing to ask for and I understand that a lot of people would be against it. The footage of Lanza driving up, getting out of his car, and shooting out the front window should've been released over a year ago in my opinion. That would not be objectionable.

so you called your friend an idiot then proceeded to say that you think the government shot up a bunch of kids to increase gun control?

Did you read my post or are you just trying to be an asshole? I kept my mouth shut. And I didn't say it was the government. It could have been anyone. And I didn't say it was for gun control. That is just you lumping me in with all of the other false flag people. Don't do that. You know what they say about assuming....you look like an ass. I haven't seen any proof that it was Lanza. Have you???

you did call your friend an idiot. " I knew there was no way I could get through his thick skull, so I didn't even try. That, my friend, is an idiot." I never said that you said it to his face. Reading comprehension. Learn it.

so what do you think happened then?

LOL. The fact that you're telling me that I need to work on my reading comprehension is hilarious. Go fuck youself bro. No matter what I respond with, I already know that you'll come back wigh some snarky reddit neckbeard response.

Do your own research.

you literally called your friend an idiot. Its in text. Theres nothing to dispute about my reading comprehension.

I did and i think a mentally unstable kid shot up a school. Now please, what do you think happened then?

I thought you meant to his face. Maybe you should be more clear. It is just text, overall.

How about this: Why do you think that it was Lanza? Have you seen any proof?

lmao. "no you"

Honestly, my theory stems from things that most people wouldn't believe. I know you'll just ridicule it. I think Lanza was a patsy.

Learn to read. I'm not just saying that to be a dick. Seriously, learn to read and comprehend what you are reading. You'll thank yourself later.

People like you are enabling this type of rampant government corruption to go completely unpunished due to your extreme willful ignorance.

There has never been a discussion of proving his guilt. He is blamed for killing Monica Quan and Keith Lawrence but there has never been any evidence or even lines of questioning regarding if he actually killed them. The parking garage where they were killed has cameras. For almost a year I've been demanding proof, yelling at a brick wall because this conversation doesn't exist.

That's all I know is that no one questions his "guilt" in those murders. Suspicious.

well they confiscate all the evidence so anyone trying to do an analysis from the outside is hobbled from the start. his letter read like it was legit though, i don't think the lapd would be so critical of themselves in their fake confessions. maybe the f.b.i.

I was in LA at the time, I landed in LAX and they had huge signs and cops with guns and all sorts of crap...but no one knew what was going on. It just seemed like the cops were there as background props. A lot of people thought it was part of a movie.

I don't think you are a dolt and that is a bizarre event start to finish.

I know something is up with this case because it is a CRAZY story...yet received little to no MSM coverage. That's all you need to know.

Dude it was all over the news

Remember: The absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

Are we to believe we're smarter than people living through that situation?

Remember: The absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

That's why he and everyone else wants evidence. It's impossible to draw conclusions without it.

Are we to believe we're smarter than people living through that situation?

He didn't actually say that. Nice strawman attempt, though.

But why don't we trust the people that lived through that?

You are at once the most annoying, yet entertaining, person who regularly takes the time to comment here. Thank you for your service...whatever that is...

..... but there is evidence available in the camera recordings... the evidence has just not been released. The evidence is not absent.

But interesting quote, i will have to look it up!

Here ya go: http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_ignorance

I would argue that it takes a lot more effort since the invention of the internet because it's pretty difficult to control the narrative when there are so many millions of people with access to so much information.

Learn to read. I'm not just saying that to be a dick. Seriously, learn to read and comprehend what you are reading. You'll thank yourself later.

People like you are enabling this type of rampant government corruption to go completely unpunished due to your extreme willful ignorance.

Did you read my post or are you just trying to be an asshole? I kept my mouth shut. And I didn't say it was the government. It could have been anyone. And I didn't say it was for gun control. That is just you lumping me in with all of the other false flag people. Don't do that. You know what they say about assuming....you look like an ass. I haven't seen any proof that it was Lanza. Have you???