A new look at religion (specifically Satan)
20 2014-08-10 by strokethekitty
Disclaimer
Okay, first, because there are lots of people who complain when you call something a theory, I will official announce that this post is intended to incite discussion, to encourage speculation, and possibly theorize about an alternative paradigm in regards to religion. Nothing that I will posit should be taken as a claim of fact, belief, or creed. Correct me when I'm wrong, but in a nice way, and be open minded enough to discuss this.
So, for ease, I'll reference Christianity, even though Christianity is not the only religion that recognizes a Satan, or an evil overlord or whatever.
The idea of Satan begins in the garden of Eden. Adam and eve live there in peace and harmony, naked, happy, and innocent. Then, Satan, in the form of a serpent, entices them to eat from the tree of knowledge, and instantly they recognize that they are naked, yards yards yards etc. Etc. Etc.
However, here is another way of looking at it. This follows the ancient sumerians ideologies about our creation, btw.
So, beings from another planet came to earth to mine gold. They needed this gold to fix their atmosphere. However, these beings quickly found out that mining on earth was rough, tedious, not-fun work. They hated it. So, they decided to come up with a solution to fix this issue.
They turned to their chief scientist who was well versed in genetics. They asked him for his help. His name is Enki. He was their kings son, one of two (the other being Enlil).
So, enki worked and worked, genetically modifying the creatures of earth to try and find a good worker/slave species. But to no avail. The creations were either too stupid, too weak, too strong, or too atrocious to look at. Then, enki had a stroke of genius.
He told his team, "Lets make them in our image!"
By this, he meant let's create a new species, using our DNA and splicing it with the closest thing on earth to us--an early hominid. For the purpose of this hypothetical, I'm going to use Big foot as the primer. Why not?
So enki and his team of genecists took their DNA and spliced it with big foots DNA, and created Man. And they called this new species Adamu.
The adamu was perfect. They took orders well. They spoke and they listened. They understood. They worked. They were the perfect little slaves. But, for one thing.
They procreated like rabbits. Much faster than these beings could. Enlil and the others saw this and were afraid. "Adamu must not be allowed to learn further than their job. For, if they were to gain our knowledge, with their birthrates, they would inevitably be able to overpower us eventually. Also, they must not be able to live as long as us. This knowledge and this lifespan must be forbidden to them.
Enki understood his brothers decree. After all, his brother was higher in rank. However, Enlil loved his creation. He could not help but to help them. He could not withhold teaching them their ways---agriculture, writing, reading, astronomy, everything. He taught them. He helped them. He loved them.
When Enlil found out, he was furious at his lower ranked and disobedient brother. Enlil demanded that the Adamu must be destroyed to insure no future uprisings take place.
But enki couldn't allow his entire creation to be wiped out, so he told one of them how to save himself and his family.
Btw, enki was always recognized via his symbolism which was predominately the serpent.
So, by now, you can see what I am positting. Enki is Satan. The knowledge was the forbidden fruit. Enlil was "God". Enki loved his adamu so much he taught them things. He loved humans, and was compassionate and empathetic towards humans. Enlil was stark, rough, and unforgiving, even merciless.
Enki, the serpent, lost the future battles against Enlil. And, as we all know, history books are written by the victors. Enlil saw that enki had followers, for his intentions were purely benevolent and helpful. He was nice. He was fair. He loved.
Enlil saw this as a threat to his reign on earth, however temporary. So, after he defeated enki , he defamed him, casted him and his followers out. They were to forever be known as Satan and his fallen angels.
I find this idea compelling, as it's mostly from the Sumerian texts and clay tablets. Today's religions have us fear God. Follow in total blindness that which we rationalize this abuse by labelling it as faith rather than fear for retribution. Enki, no w known as Satan, only wanted to help, to curate, to facilitate our status as possibly equals. He wanted to raise us as his own. But, he lost, his side of the story never got told, and he will forever be forsaken as the evil one when the true evil rests on top with the false label of "God" with complete and utter control over his fearful minions.
So, what do you think? Is it possible that all religions stem from this point in history, where Satan, aka Lucifer (which literally means the enlightened one, or the illuminating one) is bad, are wrong and biased, telling the side of the story of the true evil, the winner, Enlil? Could Satan be a victim of a false flag? Sure would make sense, seeing how corrupt and untrustworthy organized religion seems to be nowadays.
So, what do y'all think about this speculation? Add to it, if you want. Dissect it, analyze it, correct it, whatever. Let's have fun with this :-)
38 comments
9 Jfloyd87 2014-08-10
This is a very good derivative of the Terra Papers. It is how I believe we got here.
1 strokethekitty 2014-08-10
I'm not familiar with the terra papers, actually. I'll have to look that up!
2 Jfloyd87 2014-08-10
You recited a great portion of it, almost verbatim.
7 thinkB4Uact 2014-08-10
As far as I see it, there are two basic extremes to behavior. Either you care for others or you only care for yourself. Of course, there is a lot of room in the middle and most of us exist there. The extreme of caring only for oneself is just like psychopathy. Psychopathy is robotic (predictable) pleasure seeking, pain avoiding, risk calculating self-serving behavior without the tether of empathy. The opposing extreme contains that behavior, but is also shaped by empathy for others compelling one to feel pain and joy vicariously by witnessing it in others. This compels one to serve others in need and want. Even with empathy, serving others is still optional.
Evil doesn't really exist. The perception of it greatly affects our behavior though. That evil is some esoteric, enigmatic concept is a deceptive illusion. Evil is just misunderstood service to the self. The purveyors of evil gain from their evil and they wouldn't do it if they didn't have something to gain. Angels and demons can be seen as potential avatars of either paradigm. There were human beings on Earth like Hitler and Jesus that also embody the extremes. Maybe over time the extremes extend out and make old entities appear to be demons or angels.
How do we know which paradigm an entity prefers besides examining its deeds? We can't trust a name or a book or anything else really. The best psychopaths know how to effectively lie, even with fine words that warm our hearts, just to get what they want out of others. We can't just trust fine words then. We have to discern the intentions of their deeds. Do they appear to want to serve themselves even at the expense of others or do they appear to want to make other people happier, healthier and better? Domination and control make psychopaths feel high. They seek to get others to serve themselves as kings or other powerful individuals as a pinnacle of achievement, power over others.
Let's look at the "God" of the Bible. He commands his followers to kill every last man woman and child and to even kill all livestock in order to steal land from others. He supported various wars. He asked for animal sacrifices and rarely human sacrifice. He demanded obedience under the threat of eternal torment. The first two commandments were to not have any other gods before him and to never use his name in vain, how egoistic.
Many of his one true faiths fight each other for domination and control of others. Why does he allow that if he truly loves his followers? Maybe he loves to see just how much control he has over them and many psychopaths actually do take pleasure from the suffering of others. Why do some of his followers adopt a practice of mutilating the genitals of their children? Why do his followers keep on missing the message of compassion and peace and instead act like they have to propagate the religion at all costs? If eternal hell is worse than a painful death it's worth it, the same logic of the Spanish Inquisition. Why does obedience to an unknowable faith mean more to "God" than good works in his religions?
Maybe "God" is not a creator really, but instead a subjugator, a dominator, controller and a sadist. It would fit his behavior better than him being someone that actually cares for others, feeling their delight and their suffering. Now, that doesn't mean that a creator of reality doesn't exist. It just means that this local demon has fooled many of us into worshiping him, obeying him, and making suffering sacrifices to him for his pleasure, because of the belief that he created our reality. Judging by his behavior, I strongly believe one could find more service to others based beings at one's local Wal-Mart. Don't follow demons/psychopaths, they want thrall, not happy and healthy beings.
4 sinominous 2014-08-10
its worth remembering the old testament is a jewish book and has zero, nothing, to do with jesus, if he even existed.
the god of the old testament is spiteful, vindictive, egotistical, maniacal, murderous, vengeful, in short: evil.
this is not the god i know.
2 strokethekitty 2014-08-10
Interesting claim. I actually got in a fight with my wife not too long ago because I told her that no matter what is done by humans, the fundamental reason for any action we decide to take is for selfish reasons. Even if it's charity. We give to charity because it makes us feel good that we helped others. This is the fundamental basis for giving to charity.
Even if we sacrifice our own self, it is done for selfish reasons because we find peace in the fact that by sacrificing ourselves for others, we are helping them. And that feeling trumps the pleasure of not sacrificing oneself.
Everything we do is for a fundamentally selfish reason. So, I like how you described the two kinda of people---the selfish egotisitical psychopath, and the other with empathy.
Through my course of life, I've learned that organized religion is similar to the psychopathic nature you described. It creates and facilitates, even rewards servitude. It disallows questioning authority. It discourages original thought. The only reasonable assumption ad to why this is is that it is centered aroundbpower and control, not the dissemination of peace and happiness.
In regards to Satan, it certainly seems he was the more pea e centered one, when looking at the predecessor cultures and stories of ancient civilizations and comparing them to today's religiously sanctioned beliefs.
Most intriguing.
2 4to4 2014-08-10
It's easy to lose sight of the difference between selfishness and altruism when arguing in this manner -- and there is a real difference between the two, which we are aware of even if we cannot explicitly articulate it.
1 strokethekitty 2014-08-10
Yes but one who is an altruistic does what he does because fundamentally it makes them feel better to do so than to only care for themselves. So, my argument follows, even altruism is a form of selfishness, if taken in the light that even though it is at the altruists expense to help another being, they have either consciously or subconsciously decided that they feel better losing out on material or abstract profits in order to facilitate the welfare of a more needy being. Does that make sense?
2 4to4 2014-08-10
Sure, it make sense. It made sense to me forty-five years ago when I first came up with it. All I'm saying is, don't forget to see the trees because there's so much forest.
1 strokethekitty 2014-08-10
Hmm, well I am definately familiar with that expression, but ibam failing to see how you are intending to apply it to this conversation. Could you help a brother out and expound a bit?
0 wiccaslimshady 2014-08-10
You should give your wife anal when she disagrees w/ you.
1 strokethekitty 2014-08-10
Tried that too. She disagreed even more.
4 FormalPants 2014-08-10
Quite a few problems here:
Earth is a pretty shitty place to come for gold.
Gold is not a gas, never a natural part of the atmosphere.
The aliens travelled the galaxy with no plan to extract the gold they were searching for.
You can't have a mining slave race without agriculture to feed them. Reading and writing are merely an extension of communication. Astronomy is largely unhelpful outside navigation.
Aliens can control the atmosphere on earth (flood), but not their own planet.
After defeating his brother the boss alien doesn't kill all humans as planned and instead talks petty shit about his brother to them.
It's pretty much an all around awful theory with more gaping holes than a pride parade, but I still appreciate this kind of speculative posting and wish we saw more of it.
1 strokethekitty 2014-08-10
It turns out that earth is the best place for gold in our solar system. (According to some.)
When gold is pulverized into am extremely fine powder, it is the best material to be inserted into the atmosphere, as the particles will stay aloft indefinately, and it effectively replenished the ozone layer by substituting for its place. This is true on earth, and is alledgedly true for their home planet.
Well he tried but his little brother saved some of the humans behind enlils back. In these theories and in the ancient Sumerian texts, they describe that the flood was not their doing. They just knew it was going to happen and didn't do anything to save anyone else (besides enki saving some). It happened, and when they tried to resume their operations, They found that the floods destroyed so much. They realized that at this point the only way they could survive was by teaching the humans that had survived the remainder of the knowledges and helped them to reach the point where the humans could help the beings survive. If enki hadn't don't what he did, they would've all starved, according to the texts and stuff.
It's pretty interesting. Some holes exist, yes. But, imo, way more holes exist in any other organized religion than there are in what the ancients talked about and des robed with the limited vocabulary that they had available to them.
But, a purely fool-proof theory or speculation isn't what I was going for. I was intending more to see how easy it could be to describe what we are indoctrinated to believe is the king of evil as a most benevolent, helpful, and merciful, and empathetic being who lost a war with an egotistical psychopath who wishes to be worshipped, and be the only one who is worshipped.
I've had issues with organized religion for a very long time, and I won't get too into it in this post. But essentially, I've noted plenty of controversy, plenty of negations and hypocritical statements and stuff, that I couldn't help but to apply the logic that follows with the adage that history is written by the victors.
What if Satan was just a loser of a war? Not some terrible beast? How would the winner defame him best? Exactly how it is written in the Torah, bible, and Quran? I think so.
But, feel free to "fix", even tentatively or speculatively, those holes you found. I'm interested!
1 FormalPants 2014-08-10
According to whom?
This is rhetorically incorrect, could you elaborate?
This is factually incorrect, could you provide evidence?
Why did his brother punish him for saving his and his crew's (and presumably everyone on their home planets) life?
Then you are doomed to the existence of a fool. If a theory is patently absurd and logically incoherent, you would require remarkable evidence to not dismiss it outright
But that won't make the ancient texts any closer to the truth. Then it just becomes something I made up rather than some ancient person. I would be incredibly dishonest to claim faith in something I know I personally made up.
Why is this story important? Why would you try so hard to believe something so obviously deceptive?
3 humanefly 2014-08-10
In the nag hammadi there is an unnamed codex "on the origin of the world"
It retells the story of the garden of Eden with different characters. The snake is a teacher and god is ignorant. It seems that the writers are clearly aware of the stories in earlier bible's or texts and they start out by saying, you know, those earlier stories are not correct; here is what really happened. ... Its a very interesting reinterpretation or retelling
2 OGDirtyDan 2014-08-10
Satinism is the only religon that accepts all people so it would make sense if he was the nice one haha. Satan is a definition of evil in todays society so there are very few people who even have the balls to even give it a chance. Everyone is terrified of hell! No one wants to risk their afterlife so it isn't even given a chance. Sure makes you wonder..
3 TheCapnRedbeard 2014-08-10
Satanism is not the only religion that accepts everybody? Such blatant ignorance..
2 no1113 2014-08-10
Veeery relevant
2 strokethekitty 2014-08-10
Shit. That's a lot to read. I'll get it here in a little bit. Thanks, in advance.
2 no1113 2014-08-10
Yeah. Definitely a lot. Read the actual material as well as the interview that was linked too, however. Yes. It's quite a bit indeed, but, to those who are open minded and critically thinking enough, it offers a perspective that can be pretty impressively eye-opening and helpful with regard to how to look at this world and all the insane calamity that continues to go on in it.
Cheers,
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2 diagonali 2014-08-10
When the Serpent was asked by God why he had been disobedient in the garden and led Adam and Eve astray, he didn't give any excuse - he probably winked.
1 RTS1991 2014-08-10
This is the conclusion I've been coming to as well after researching ancient religious history from different cultures around the world and listening to people like Robert Morning Sky and Michael Tellinger. We've grown up being spoonfed nothing but lies so it would make sense that the truth is the inverse to what we've been taught. Ever since I was a kid, I always questioned "God's" fairness and saw him as an evil puppetmaster who enjoyed fucking with humans for some kind of sadistic pleasure. Lucifer (which means light bearer) on the other hand, sought to give man knowledge. The immense irony is that when Lucifer said, if you eat of this tree you will not surely die but your eyes will be opened and you will become like Gods, he was saying the truth, whereas when Jehovah said that they would die, it was a direct lie that Christians try to cover up by making it a symbolic spiritual death. The fact remains that the values of the OT God Jehovah are completely at odds with the NT teachings of Jesus i.e. turn the other cheek as opposed to eye for an eye.
1 strokethekitty 2014-08-10
Did, I can't remember which book I've read, but I know it was authored by Michael tellinger. It was an amazing read and definstely helped me on my quest to figure out the ancients versions of today's religions.
After all, I'll give more credit to the oldest versions vs the newly revised and editted (with omissions for Christ's sake!) Any day.
It's amazing how old these "stories " are. And what amazes me even more is today they are treated as myths and legends. Basically, fake stories used as metaphors.
But, writing in ancient times was arduous and important. I don't think they would've wasted all that time effort and resources just to record fake shit. And, also, the ancient verso nd of these stories seem to be more realistic than the sugared version of today's society.
1 [deleted] 2014-08-10
[deleted]
1 strokethekitty 2014-08-10
Reminds me of the yin and yang. No matter how big you draw it, you will still get equal amounts of each color.
0 sinominous 2014-08-10
serpent=reptile
1 strokethekitty 2014-08-10
Serpent literally is a synonym for snake.
0 sinominous 2014-08-10
and a snake is a reptile
1 strokethekitty 2014-08-10
But not all reptiles are serpents.
It's the same thing as all squares are rectangles, but not all rectangles are squares.
All snakes are serpents, and all serpents are reptiles. But not all reptiles are serpents/snakes.
0 lloydbennett1 2014-08-10
Satan started out in heaven - he was an angel.
-1 [deleted] 2014-08-10
Jesus saves, then he goes and buys a bunch of shit he does not need. "Be as wise as serpents" - jeZeu$
-1 yellowsnow2 2014-08-10
Sounds like an easy way to confuse someone of who is the good guy and who is the bad guy. I hope you didn't go and offer your soul to satan right away. Satan is known as the great deceiver.
2 herisee 2014-08-10
Yeah I always thought Lucifer was the good guy. Bad press.
-1 [deleted] 2014-08-10
why is this in /r/conspiracy? shouldn't it be in /r/christianity, or r/biblethumpers? or /r/nonsense?
2 strokethekitty 2014-08-10
Because it is related to the theories about alternative history, as well as pointing out how organized religion could have muddied the waters of our creation at an attempt to control the population. After all, organized religion is a system that facilitates blind servitude that followers call faith.
That is, indeed, a conspiracy theory.