Thanks for being here.

It's no secret that governments, intelligence agencies, and corporations Astroturf their products and agendas here (and elsewhere), because the ROI is staggering.

Get a top post or comment in one of the defaults? You got some exposure. People always be talkin' about some link I found on reddit, bro (at least in my circle still, but we're reddit's target demo (18-34 males). And when your buddy talks to you about a comment he read that was yours (once you learn to play the reddit meta-game), it's a creepy feeling. This place is a digital megaphone for propaganda, with cat GIFs sprinkled in for good measure.

And the hive/mind circle jerk can be slowly massaged and manipulated over time to focus on any agenda, really, given enough time.

So, at least here, on this forum, we at least acknowledge that it happens, because we have all peeled back the onion in our own way and pace to at least see that far. And we learn how to work around them and have little skirmishes once in awhile. Sometimes it ends up in mod drama, other times it's used to paint the sub as anti-vaxx (currently), or anti-Jew, or anti-something.

Think of this place as part-time Ministry of Truth, part time Looking Glass to see what they want us to see and focus on, part-time internet highschool with cliques and a currency, and part time small-town internet pub, where some of us hang out at night drinking and talking and tossing ideas around. And I upvote you if you link to sources.

You should stay.

I wish I got such a warm welcome. Well said :)

I have some karmic debt after the support I got on Friday here. It's a good group. See you out there.

Long days & pleasant nights.

Long days and pleasant nights?

Are you... a Dark Tower fan???

19

Hile gunslinger!

There's always room in my Ka-tet, FYI.

Thankee-sai.

Well now I know where one of my buddies gets a few words.. Is it a good read?

Also, welcome to /r/Conspiracy where the karma is pointless and everyone's a tinfoil hat wearing kook.

::puts his on::

Thanks! ::dawns tinfoil hat like a king::

Yes, The Dark Tower is an incredible series. There isn't anything quite like it out there in terms of imagination or quality of storytelling. I highly recommend it.

Think of this place as part-time Ministry of Truth

Kinda sending mixed messages here...

Ha! There were a few good folks at MiniTrue... Shit, Winston worked there...

They, including Winston, were hardly human; or, at the very least, they were scared to be human.

Could you blame them?

No, but I wouldn't aspire to be likened to them either.

Maybe you missed the subtlety and nuance of the Mini-True reference. The employees there knew that what they read and doctored was all bullshit and propaganda but they all participated anyway, because of the indoctrination. Not much different than the defaults no?

Perhaps I misunderstood what you meant by "this place".

I would say the ministry of truth would be more likened to Shill Inc.

I would agree. This place can be a but nebulous, considering the differences between sub's.

I still wouldn't say reddit at large is aware of the lies they propogate.

...which is like Mini-True.

The employees there knew that what they read and doctored was all bullshit and propaganda but they all participated anyway

I'm getting quite mixed up here.

What I mean is that Winston's job was to take facts and change/manipulate them, or to erase undesirables from memory by altering old archives.

I am merely likening this to redditors who inject these types of ideas into stories and comments:

Well, Putin annexed Crimea

Without detailing the nuances with the US involvement with the National Endowment of Democracy, Victoria Nuland's comments regarding the eventual leadership succession and her negative feelings towards the EU, the armed protesters in Maidan, the snipers.. It was really fucked up Ukrainian Spring event.

But when you boil it down to

Putin invaded Ukraine

You miss a lot. I see those redditors as unwillingly Winstonian, be it by their naivete of geopolitics, or their blatant disregarding facts in favor of a political agenda. And with the repeal if Smith-Mundt, it's no surprise that they are now working the internet beat. At least to me.

I think my off handed comment spiraled out of control.

I mean you no offense, but you are back and forth confusing me! First you seamlessly transition between localities with vague adverbs then waffle about on wether or not the ministry of truth is or is not aware of their transgressions.

Suffice to say, I was just making a joke. Expanded from our conversation, I'd say neither this sub nor reddit at large really carries a hint of the ministry of truth.

It's all just mixed messages man. Cheers.

and part time small-town internet pub, where some of us hang out at night drinking and talking and tossing ideas around.

Yes! Better than actual bars. Instead of a local opinion we get more of an inter/national one.

The beers are cheaper and the pours are heavier too.

Also good for those with DUI concerns ;)

Cheers to that!

How is it possible that such a large majority of minds all center around one particular topic, such as supporting vaccinations and countless other mindless bullshit (such as their obsession with Neil De Gressie Tyson, "science" and Cats).

Never underestimate the powerful yet spiritually immature 'need' to be accepted somewhere in life by someone or something. The paradigm of mainstream is not built on rock solid facts or any need for truth, it's built from the collectively misunerstood feelings of loneliness and a yerning to feel well accepted and a part of something outside ones self, even if that means being part of a majority that is acting detrimentally towards the long term welfare of said majority and others by way of being the majority and the 'power' that holds in itself. If the ships sinking it's ok, look at how many people I get to sink with.

lol.

Man...You want the most glaring example of some of the most blind sheeple-like following you're talking about here? well check out a post I threw up in /r/losangeles. The shit is like...fucking hilarious/frightening (take your pick, as both apply).

The main crux of my point was that ALL vaccines are not "100% fool proof"...and dayem. I think I'm at -50 plus downvotes and counting so far. lol. I've been besieged by one of the fiercest hive mind assaults I've gotten yet since I've been on this website.

I know I'm not the nicest guy around, and sometimes HOW I say things pisses people off regardless of WHAT it is I'm actually saying one way or the other...but (again) dayem. I think this occasion is just a straight up example of the hivemind having gotten itself into an absolute froth of downvoting hatred (lol) regardless of how I would have phrased the subject matter.

Take a look (if you dare...a lot of it is pretty facepalmingly bad). Again, I'm not super nice in it, but the level of sheer sheepdom immediately expressed in it just made it almost impossibly difficult to handle these people with any real intelligence. It was more than obvious that the vast majority (if not all of them) are already emotionally committed to their PTB-indoctrinated stance that "all vaccines are guuuud!" and they just absolutely refuse to be shaken from it...so there's not really much one can do but just sit there and watch more and more cars pile up on top of the wreck that post turned into. lol

Is there some sort of robot algorithm that upvotes all posts that fall within the calculated perspective necessary to be viewed on reddit or have we, as a culminated population, truly created a singular hivemind that is so indoctrinated to believe one particular side of an argument or perspective that the system just perpetuates itself forward. Is it a fear of being downvoted? Does anyone actually care about "karma" or another internet person's opinion on themself?

If anyone could shine some light on this topic, you'd be more than welcome to speak your mind.

Ultimately, I don't think it's any sort of robot algorithm at all. I think, unfortunate and disheartening as this is for the human race, the hivemind is a just a bunch of people that really do follow each other regardless of whether what's being said actually IS correct or not. The mind of the general public apparently really is that stupid. It's just one of those things where people go "Well, it seems most people are going in 'this' direction, so I'll go ahead and go with the crowd without actually stopping and REALLY seeing if this actually makes real sense or not."

Of course there are people that DO really check and question, but the vast majority, it seems, absolutely do not.

And what's saddest of all is that there are actually multiple comments in there saying things like "go back to the rest of the idiot retard no thinkers just like you on /r/conspiracy."

lol. Wow. I'm like wtf? Man...Just...shakes head...

EDIT: What's even more embarrassing still is that some of them have, for whatever disturbing reason, taken it upon themselves to begin stalking (yes, stalking) my account and have come to this subreddit only to report my activities back in that one. lol. What the actual fuck? Wow. Scary little gerbils, these people.

the hivemind is a just a bunch of people that really do follow each other regardless of whether what's being said actually IS correct or not.

I disagree. If an idea is truly too idiotic, nobody would give it the time of day. If you posted, for example, "my family lives in a bunker and only eats canned food because it's the only safe source of sustenance," you might get three downvotes and have it die out.

People are more worked up than ever about the vaccine debate because there are enough people doubting their safety and efficacy. I read a parenting article the other day about whether to vaccinate (they answered a resounding yes), but the point is that they said the main demographics that don't vaccinate are the poor because of resource scarcity, and--here's the important point--California's educated, specifically in Silicon Valley and San Francisco. So, contrary to what the Reddit masses would have us believe, it's not the ignorant slack-jawed yokels who are abstaining from vaccinations here.

Basically, I think people are so rabid about the issue because they're indignant that others disagree. And the higher the number of people, the more vitriol.

Either way, whether it's an ignorant, rabid, frothing hive mind of "dumb yocals" or of "hipster wannabe intellectuals", it's still an ignorant, rabid, frothing hive mind at the end of the day.

ate (they answered a resounding yes), but the point is that they said the main demographics that don't vaccinate are the poor because of resource scarcity, and--here's the important point--California's educated, specifically in Silicon Valley and San F

"Stop telling me things I don't want to hear!"

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The funny thing is that /r/conspiracy is the ONLY place left where there is still scientific debate on topics like vaccines. Every other subreddit is a maniacal pro-vaccine shitfest where absolutely no real scientific discourse happens and literally psychopathic comments about incarcerating and killing vaccine skeptics get upvoted to the top.

Hopefully more people come to /r/conspiracy, they might actually learn something.

The funny thing is that /r/conspiracy[1] is the ONLY place left where there is still scientific debate on topics like vaccines.

Completely agree. I don't align entirely with the people who don't vaccinate whatsoever (nor do I buy the "vaccines are totally safe" line), and it's only been on this subreddit where I've been able to have any meaningful discussion on the matter.

It's gotten to the point that I don't touch vaccine or GMO topics on the regular subs with a ten-foot pole. It's a shame because I'm sure that's what they--being the corporate interests that no doubt have people and bots patrolling Reddit 24/7 to shape discourse on the topic--want to happen.

It's easy to say, "that's all the more reason to be diligent," but really, I'm starting to see Reddit as a carefully-managed echo chamber no different than newspapers and broadcast networks. And just like I find writing to the studio executives to be a pointless endeavor, I'm thinking the same is true of commenting on certain topics on Reddit.

It's easy to say, "that's all the more reason to be diligent," but really, I'm starting to see Reddit as a carefully-managed echo chamber no different than newspapers and broadcast networks.

It wasn't always this way but yeah, it's bad and getting worse in this regard. The main subs are pretty much entirely gamed and even ones such as /r/conspiracy are subject to an incredible amount of manipulation and attacks from outside sources.

Over 1000 upvotes for a lame pedestrian meme and around 1-200 for a post exposing blatant govt. corruption (50% downvoted), surely not bro.

Yeah, I've noticed that even the threads that get hundreds of comments sometimes only have 50 upvotes or so if they're about a "sensitive topic". I'm not sure if it's intentional (though I highly suspect it is), but the effect is that these posts don't reach the #1 spot of the sub and thus are never seen by /r/all and the rest of reddit at large.

Also posts that get genuinely high votes on their merit but aren't bullshit/memes don't make the frontpage (logged in) but shitposts do, and /r/conspiracy often not being seen until page 3 or 4 of my frontpage while rad-decentralisation, anticonsumption and other tiny subs get 2 or 3 links by then... I could go on :)

Yep, when I first started using reddit, /r/conspiracy posts showed up on my front page all the time. Haven't seen one in months now. It's gotten to where I don't even bother looking at my front anymore, it's little more than sanitized bullshit and corporate/government circlejerking.

I scroll through a few pages to see the other subs top posts but I'm not subscribed to many big defaults anyway for obvious reasons. For a laugh I scrolled through the suggested subs list (my subreddits>show all) to see where /r/conspiracy was in the list, I gave up looking after 38 pages, lots of dubious porn and /r/coontown though, keep it classy reddit.

I think the circle jerk or, shall we call it, "echo chamber" bias is partly seeded by paid PR shills, partly herd behavior, partly propaganda/brainwash-driven, and partly people who have really thought through the issue. All I can say is we have a moral obligation to fight for truth, or we slide headlong into some psychopath's imaginary hell become real.

Very true, don't let their imaginary hell become real through fear and/or lack of action.

bacon is legit though!

I think so too, but I was thinking it was convenient to have America's love for bacon confirmed while fighting a war against Muslims as well.

Now that is a conspiracy!

No argument there.

This sub is really the last stand in making anyone understand what is really happening. I think there are people or intelligence that monitor this sub and send in the down voting bots when they get exposed.

I also think that users who are particularly successful at bringing about genuine discussions, not "THE END OF THE WORLD IS NEAR BEACUASE OF GEORGE BUSH EXPOSED!!!!!!1" posts, but facilitating actual level headed conversations, are put on a list by someone and then targeted.

I agree, unfortunately.

If you're getting flak, you are over the target.

That's an interesting way of putting it.

Great post, linked from the sidebar.

Who found that ANNUIT COEPTIS, HUMANAE LIBERTAS??

That's just totally freaking AWESOME - explains everything, perfectly.

I miss the bomber undies! :)

Here are over 20 sources on internet propaganda. Paid shills exist and this fact is reported in the mainstream media all the time.

Reddit is the 9th top website in the US, 3rd for social media. It's rigged by various corporations and governments. Not only that, once an entity establishes what content is "good" to the hivemind, it's self-perpetuating. People want to fit in, be part of groups. Downvotes and up votes are signals from your peers about what is appropriate to say.

It is social engineering, at its finest.

Yeah, I also can't stand this.

I must admit that I amuse myself by making disparaging , however not racist, comments on mainstream Reddit articles about Israel. It still amazes me how quickly their shills can downvote a comment.

Thank you for posting this. Last night i was about to blow a gasket reading how people should be force vaccinated because "science".

As far as robot voting, I'm not sure about how algorithms work there, but there's been more than one article by reputable sources that I've linked that boast that there are bots (think clever bot) that people online cannot tell they aren't human.

Some of the more notorious troll accounts here might be these, or could be multiple operators running them, but either way are here for the express reason to cause conflict, push an agenda that turns public opinion against the sub, and spread misinformation. You can check for yourself with snoopsnoo or redditinvestigator.

I don't think there are any real measures to stop bots beyond the extremely obvious same accounts voting the same things at the exact same moment. Or all same IP. It's sad, but I think that bot operaters just have to limit the number of bots per vpn connection and simply have a program that that staggers the accounts voting and the timing a bit.

And that's using 'legitimate' means where you are a private org using paid vpns. You could also have a botnet, or run a Big Internet company, or be a government.

Some history: How Reddit Was Destroyed (ver2.0)

I don't think I can shed light on your questions. There is a big circlejerk most are unaware. I think this sort of thing is very dangerous. I'm commenting because your hive mind remarks made me think of a quote from an anonymous person:

"You should kiss the ground you walk on if you were born in this country-- take it from an old man who once had to wear the Star of David on his shirt. There's a safety to living in such a diverse place. It's much more difficult to brainwash a population that is composed of so many different nationalities and so many different viewpoints."

" It's much more difficult to brainwash a population that is composed of so many different nationalities and so many different viewpoints."

But much easier to drive wedges and pit the people against each other. Much, much easier.

I agree. Divide and conquer.

Balkanization with a little sprinkling of social Marxism - the great game.

This is why I love this subreddit, if our hive mind is to question governments and corporations that ain't so bad.

The upvote/downvote system is vastly too simplistic. It should be a four pronged vote on each post which everyone is allowed. Given reddit, there should be a "this makes me sad/upset, and this makes me happy/thoughtful" button. The upvote down vote is, "Do I want others to see this, do I not want others to see this"

It's now called McReddit.

I know someone here has a link list compiled explaining how government agencies multi-national corps have an army of shills and actual bots that do the voting and commenting for them.

I am currently looking for employment...could you like...send me that link.

I will shill like crazy on reddit. Army me up.

I forget who I've seen post it, I was hoping the comment would be seen by them and replied to.

i got minus 10 karma for speaking my mind earlier :) i dont care what i said needs to be heard ... and thank you for being different ;) we're all in this shit hole together and the only way we'll get out is together ... united we stand divided we fall ... but until we out weigh the brain washed all we can do is educate and inform ... tough but progress will be made just don't give up ... its what 'they'd' want you to do ... everytime someone makes some brainless comment about a well researched or well thought through opinion it makes me want to try even harder ;)

I hate mainstream reddit. I hate the hivemind and I hate how unbelievably predictable they all are. How is it possible that such a large majority of minds all center around one particular topic, such as supporting vaccinations and countless other mindless bullshit (such as their obsession with Neil De Gressie Tyson, "science" and Cats). Yet, there is an insane amount of confirmation, circlejerk bias that people on reddit are "intelligent".

Switch out the obsessions and that's a fair description of any grouping. It works for /r/conspiracy too.

This post doesn't actually make sense.

Also, almost all the mindless bullshit belongs to the sky-is-falling anti-vaccine idiots.

mindless bullshit belongs to the sky-is-falling anti-vaccine idiots.

So you're one to have a civil discussion on the efficacy of modern vaccinations i see?

Sure. I don't deny there are reasonable people with concerns, but if you read the comment again you'll see the bullshit belongs to the hyperbolic morons and the overwhelming majority of civil discussion backed up with evidence comes from those who see no issue with vaccination.

Put simply, the pro-vaccine posters aren't the ones getting their arguments from Natural News, Zero Hedge, or Alex Jones

Any grouping eh? I guess it's as true of preachers as it is of mathematicians... There is no such thing as verifiable truth after all...

It's human nature I think, plain and simple .

Edgy.

Could you blame them?

What I mean is that Winston's job was to take facts and change/manipulate them, or to erase undesirables from memory by altering old archives.

I am merely likening this to redditors who inject these types of ideas into stories and comments:

Well, Putin annexed Crimea

Without detailing the nuances with the US involvement with the National Endowment of Democracy, Victoria Nuland's comments regarding the eventual leadership succession and her negative feelings towards the EU, the armed protesters in Maidan, the snipers.. It was really fucked up Ukrainian Spring event.

But when you boil it down to

Putin invaded Ukraine

You miss a lot. I see those redditors as unwillingly Winstonian, be it by their naivete of geopolitics, or their blatant disregarding facts in favor of a political agenda. And with the repeal if Smith-Mundt, it's no surprise that they are now working the internet beat. At least to me.