reddit died with Aaron Schwartz

This comment deserves more attention.

After Aaron died, everything went on full speed ahead down the spiral.

There was significant distance between reddit and Aaron just a few months after they were bought. His death seems only symbolically linked, in my opinion.

symlinked eh?

ln -s /deaths/schwartz/aaron /reddit

ooooo, someone that knows the linux

You must be against us. Prepare to be assimilated.

The Borg was basically Unix

More like sudo rm -rd /lives/users/aaron

ln -s

so it uses Linux?

Because the linux master race.

Because you are right

No, because http://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/309fuf/how_reddit_was_destroyed_ver30/cpt3tsy

because thats a comment loop

Wow, you are smart.

henwas still involved, the level of take over that is now reddit would have been called out by him, so he had to be silenced.

Who bought reddit?

This is so true :( I keep wanting to call out alexis on Twitter and ask him what his good friend aaron would think of the site now.

Aaron never would've let this happen.

Then do it

Whats his twittername? I'll do it

I dunno. You seemed like you had a plan and needed someone to tell you to pull the trigger

I don't like this wording in a Swartz conversation...

Alexis Ohanian

Everyone do it.

Why be a troll? You can't stop money/progress/etc and the powers that be are blaming the trolls for destroying the site. Therefore, trolling Reddit and its employees just brings closer the demise of the Reddit you're fighting to keep. Learning to compromise (pro tip: know the game, first) would yield spectacular results. Call me a shill and downvote me, wutev, but consider the obvious: the world you think exists or believe should exist isn't ready to exist. Technology may one day change it, but for now capitalism reigns (when did it not, really?) and idealism is owned by it.

Was he the previous CEO or something? What did he stand for or how'd he die or what?

The Internet's Own Boy: The Story of Aaron Swartz

This is a great documentary. I highly recommend it for anyone curious about it; really shows you how the states are run by scumbags.

Really it all goes down to money and profit

i already know that.

you think its limited to the US government? Dude its an international zionist conspiracy man. Im not fucking kidding. The western media, banking and governments are almost entirely run according to jewish interests. Freemasonic Talmudic Satanists run the key levers of power in most nearly all of the western world. The only exception is the internet right now and thats obviously why they're coming for it so hard evwerywhere! too many people are waking up to the hollyhoax and the formerly secret societies that just arent secret anymore.

Y downvoted

pretty obvious dont ya think?

Yep

Obligatory video for everyone who doesn't get angry when watching:

Don't talk to the police

(Of course most of you already know this)

Just watched this. Sincerest thank you for showing me it existed. What an amazing, sad story.

Cool. Spread it around like I have done.

Already on it!

The video is blocked in my country ( US ), why?

I clicked that link and YouTube said "This video contains content from Cinetic Media, who has blocked it in your country on copyright grounds." I live in America...
Is there anywhere else I can see this video?

Blocked on copyright grounds, naturally.

Somewhat shamefully, I admit that I have yet to see this. It seems to require more bravery than I can muster.

.

Press the save button. So you don't clutter comments with "." Pretty old feature.

Well it sucks that on mobile you can't save a comment. So I tend to see these more from people who can't save it.

Do what I want.

and we punch you in the dick for it

.

.

.

Remember, the internet is made up of people. If you see something on the internet, you can download it and save it. I have archives of data "4+TB's" worth of information that would have been deleted years ago relating to games that are barely being kept alive.

All it takes is 1 person to make a difference.

Relating to the internet, you can always host the data yourself. People have been doing it for 1000's of years when it comes to books, the only difference is that they could only carry 1 book with them easily. With a 1TB hard drive, you could carry centuries worth of information in your pocket.

I know what you mean, i really battle some days to find things i knew were on the internet.

Its like google is missing tons of information that used to be there, no matter how specific you search.

I used to download and store but stopped a few years ago. Lately ive found myself backing up data and bought myself a blu ray stone disc drive (permanent disc writer) .

I've seen Google remove results.. If you know someone with a unique name it's easier to check.

Older games, like Sourceforts. You used to be able to find tons of information about the game, and user made content was plentiful. Now it's far in between.

I really hate how megauploader was taken down, it used to host the majority of the modding communities work and since it's gone there isn't really a place to host with reliability.

You trying to link me to that disc drive? Sounds interesting.

Its a standard lg blu ray writer but it comes with some stone technology that allows you to write onto stone discs that last for hundreds of years allegedly.

Megauploader had everything, now i battle to find drivers for hardware.

um, it's the top-voted post. How much more attention would you like it to have?

It wasnt when i made my comment.

Romantic notion, but flawed and false.

Like Wikipedia, Reddit's own popularity and growth was it's own "demise." Starting around 2007/2008 when the US government really ramped up it's information warfare campaigns on the public Internet is when shit started to go down. Any site as popular as Reddit is going to be hotspot of attention for information operations. Think JTRIG for example, operation earnest voice, etc.

These days the front page of Reddit is just a 24-7 propaganda engine and subreddits are run like the fascist shitholes that they are. Fine, who cares about the subreddits? Everyone with their eyes open knows /⁣r/⁣netsec is run by NSA sympathizers. Whatever, fuck it. One thing to remember is that the agents and shills are really just cheerleaders.. it's the masses of useful idiots who really amplify them. Without a user base this website, like all other social media including Wikipedia, is just an empty shell. It's the user base that makes these sites what they are.

These days everything on the Internet is touched by information warfare and those in power are more emboldened and arrogant than ever. The enemies making advances? Have one of your cells stage a terrorist attack.. then coordinate that with electronic warfare, including information warfare, efforts. It's all coordinated now. Kinetic attacks coordinated with electronic and information warfare. You got an agent on standby waiting to make the post as soon as it happen.. Then the army of sock puppets to get the ball rolling. Once that happens, the useful idiots take over and let the data mining begin.

Reddit got big when Digg screwed up their site.

People just go to smaller subs now bc alot harder to censor and input is more valued.

Yup. Smaller subs are still enjoyable.

IAmA is now used only to sell something a celebrity is doing. Half the time the celebrity is barely participating.

askreddit is all horny teenagers and has become more useless than yahoo answers.

I only just checked what the current defaults are, since I no longer sub to any of them (except videos), apparently TwoXChromosomes is a default sub now? Christ. Thanks Ellen Pao. Equality does not = making a women's sub a default without also making a men's sub a default.

You're describing eternal september.

Fuck yeah I am. When did the influx of reddit users become so daft?

I think it was because we were all exposed to jailbait from a young age, but I'm not sure.

Just saying the Morgan Freeman thing was proved to be totally fake and the picture was photoshopped. Occasionally there is good amas and occasionaly there are interesting askreddit posts but for the most part they are shit.

shitty askreddit post

pretty interesting askreddit post imo

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IAmA is now used only to sell something a celebrity is doing

It's no coincidence that minutes after Broken Lizard does an AMA we get crowd funding requests for Super Troopers 2. Here is a screenshot of a search for "Super Trooper 2" sorted by New, All Time. Up to the point of the AMA there is almost nothing relevant, but just a few minutes after the AMA, BAM! crowd funding request.

EDIT: removed "minutes" which I did not verify

hey man the super trooper people are cool

I feel like askreddit is now just recycled threads

Most feminists don't care about equality lol

I only just checked what the current defaults are, since I no longer sub to any of them (except videos), apparently TwoXChromosomes is a default sub now? Christ. Thanks Ellen Pao. Equality does not = making a women's sub a default without also making a men's sub a default.

So much this

"equality when it's convenient"

As a user that came from Digg years ago, I see an striking resemblances in the failures that led to the demise of Digg that I see happening here. It's sad to see.

True fact; remember the propaganda post yesterday? iSIS meat grinder. In that article it said that the U.S. Runs propaganda campaigns every day in the Middle East. Like putting out new pamphlets. Said that it speaks to the "softer side" of the conflict.

Then the article says it has used 1 billion dollars on paper pamphlet propaganda. I guess my point is...dis shit cray

We're all part of the information warfare machine dude. And it's primarily funded throught private sources. Soon as you guys start railing off about the government(whose explicit purpose is to enable the rich people and the companies within the state) being the problem, you're raging against the wrong machine.

I think it would be better to say: you are raging against the machine when you should really be raging against the people who own and operate the machine.

The institutions of our world (aka the machine) are inanimate fucking objects and it's of no use to rage against an inanimate fucking object. Doing so will only result in a downward spiral that will inevitably lead to suicide by gunshot next to the dead body of a dwarf on a movie set.

It's much more productive to rage against the people who misuse inanimate fucking objects than it is to rage against inanimate fucking objects because people are actually going to feel your rage. (Edit: Replaced a "that" with a ":".)

I am a card carrying machine operator so I'm not sure why you think I'd be angry in the first place.

I was attempting to provide constructive criticism to the following: "you're raging against the wrong machine." I actually agreed with the comment for the most part.

[deleted]

Racial slurs aren't allowed here because it does 2 things.

1. It causes unwanted flame wars.

2. It fails to communicate anything valuable.

This is a warning, any further slurs from you and you will be banned from this subreddit.

Thanks,

~Flytape

Yup, had this happen today. Someone was arguing climate chance was a political problem, another was arguing it was a scientific issue and I'm like: "guys, it is an industry problem. They don't want to upgrade so the pay politicians and scientists to wave colored flags of dissent and division. Literally, the Men behind the Curtains.

It is easy to figure out who is behind something if you use the 'follow the money' mantra. Whats difficult is accepting what you find at the end of that trail.

Can they pay though, even if they want to? Their competitors sure as fuck aren't going to pay.

reluctance to pay for upgrades vs massive climate change. Business exists to make profit. There is no profit in changing your pollution levels.

hmm...interesting pick of options we have here, eh? Sounds like we need an intervening hand of government to help them all along, huh?

One thing to remember is that the agents and shills are really just cheerleaders.. it's the masses of useful idiots who really amplify them.

Ah, this is the best way of putting this.

...Like blaming Ronald McDonald for the quality of the cheeseburgers.

Like blaming Ronald for the acceptance of the quality of the cheeseburgers.

What subreddits would you recommend? Not just conspiracy-related but just news and other kinds of links that aren't controlled?

https://voat.co looks pretty cool, also the owner seems like a decent kid

I wouldn't.

r/Anticonsumption and the like, for obvious reasons :D

Also, what I don't get: Most (minority) language communities could use reddit formidable, as it would be very transparent, when somebody would try to game it, at least for the first 5..7 years and also, it would render it much, much harder to manipulate. It would use up much more resources and would be funny if the same notions would suddenly pop up everywhere by accounts with no posting history :D

But last I looked at foreign language subreddits, it was tumbleweed and crickets. Schade.

What's wrong with wikipedia?

Everyone with their eyes open knows /⁣r/⁣netsec is run by NSA sympathizers.

Why do you think this?

In truth, Reddit's death spiral began when the blackhat marketers discovered that they could make money off of posts/comments (so, years ago). A simple google search is pretty damming, and keep in mind there are THOUSANDS of blackhat sites just like this one.

https://www.google.com/search?client=opera&q=blackhatworld.com+reddit&sourceid=opera&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8#q=site:blackhatworld.com+reddit

For example, upvote clubs made by blackhat marketers to push their links to the frontpage of a sub - http://www.blackhatworld.com/blackhat-seo/social-networking-sites/702681-new-reddit-upvote-club-skype.html

Holy fucking shit. These guys are assholes.

http://www.blackhatworld.com

Here is what one of the posters said about us: Reddit is a bunch of broke students with adblock on.

I lurked there for a couple of years. I learned a shitton about SEO. 80% of BlackhatWorld are pretty decent people and are just looking to outsmart Google for better search rankings, some will go out of their way to help you....the other 20% would waterboard their own grandma for $2 in their PayPal.

100% of those people would game Reddit for a quick buck.

BHW is like 90% scammers scamming scammers.

I would disagree. You find more knowledgeable people at BHW than most internet marketing forums and there is a sense of community. People genuinely help each other in most cases, even if it's just to stay off the literal "Shit List" of people never to trust (yes, it is an actual list).

What you're describing actually sounds more like the other big internet marketing forum, Warrior Forum. Again, some good advice and good people can be found but their "Warrior Special Offers" are a joke.

Essentially they are 99% crap made up by some newbie that doesn't know jack who copypasted an ebook and gave it a title like "Push Button Riches . How I Make $150,000 Per Month Doing - Almost - Nothing!!" that some other newbie copypasted a year ago from some other newbie who got it off a google search from a blogger who had absolutely no idea what they were talking about in the first place.

These people don't make $150k a decade, nevermind a month, but they sure will sell you a $37 ebook promising just that.

There are people at BHW who, like, seriously know their shit. Seriously.

Most are scammers though. Acknowledge.

the other 20% would waterboard their own grandma for $2 in their PayPal.

hahaha.

Sign me up.

Oh Grandpa...

Reddit is so easy to game though, I've sent quite a few comments and suggestions on how to stop these things to reddit admin, they have never replied. I just assume that they know what's going on and are allowing other people to game the system, so that when they do it, it makes it harder to tell it was connected to the admin.

I thought up a bot scheme that would be super simple to script and route through TOR. All I would need is some server and bandwidth resources and I could pound this site with thousands of votes.

It's already being done. I know of a service that charges for such a service. Sort of like facebook likes, twitter followers or youtube video views. It's almost to easy. If you do it correctly, you can make a nice roi on your investment.

Wait, how exactly do you make money on reddit?

the other 20% would waterboard their own grandma for $2 in their PayPal.

Citation needed.

So im looking at their site, not sure what I'm looking at

uh, an opera user, << Internet-high-five>>

heh, I never noticed that google does that.

I installed opera a month ago and I love it. No more memory eating and painfully slow firefox and no more Big Brother google all up in my business. And since I can install pretty much any Chrome extension too I'm never going back.

<< Internet-high-five>>

Well, uh, you missed the decade of uber-browsing then. No problem. But I recommend to look on the net what earlier opera versions had as nice features. Nicknames for bookmarks and quick url-bar based searches where there since 2006 :)

No more memory eating

what version of opera are you using? the last time i checked, recent versions of opera use the same engine as chrome and in my experience are just as resource intensive (and are definitely less stable compared with chromium).

No more memory eating and painfully slow firefox

Overall I am coming out better than firefox. I tried firefox light, which was the fastest browser I've ever used, but it had some issues like crashing every time you load flash or a webm or a gifv or look at it the wrong way....

This build of Opera is essentially the same as Chrome, but I don't like Google all up in my business so I prefer Opera.

As far as features I miss a few things (like being able to customize my top bar), but I think in the grand scheme of things I'll end up going to vivaldi when a finished version comes out.

First time posting in this sub

upvote clubs

This shit happened ALL the time during the Digg 2.0 and 3.0 days. It's hilarious to believe that reddit ever had a system to avoid this in place. Hell, it happens blatantly in some meta-subs IRCs all the time.

Supply and demand are certainly there.

Is your assertion pre or post Sydrah debacle? Seriously asking.

When he died he hadn't had anything to do with reddit for a number of years. IIRC, he was hired to help with the programming, but left after some disagreements with Steve Huffman and Alexis Ohanian.

Oh shit, you about to open a huge can of worms... but yea reddit is at dead as digg. hopefully soon will have something that self regulates with human input.

fuck I hate this why does it have to be true?

me too, it really angers me how quickly people have infiltrated reddit. but don't let the hate block you from thinking clearly. i used to ragequit after i read conspiracy theories, thinking i could take on all these evil people myself. but instead of just fuming, try thinking rationally like this: can we stop this? if so, what can be done to reverse, or at least mitigate this? what are our options? what kind of strategies can we implement to defeat or at least spread awareness of this?

stop using it and encourage others to do so as well.

Can't its kinda addicting like Facebook lol I wish i had more self control

can we stop this?

No

if so, what can be done to reverse, or at least mitigate this?

See above.

what are our options?

See above.

what kind of strategies can we implement to defeat or at least spread awareness of this?

See above.

Real helpful reply ya got there lol

As opposed to yours? lol

yea, ur just a troll

Prove me wrong, I'll give you six months to fix the shithole that is reddit.

Why should I be the only one?

You mean besides the fact that in this exchange you are what is wrong with reddit?

The fuck are u talking about?

will reddit shadowban us for discussing these topics?

open your profile in incognito mode to check. I have recently been an ass so If i got shadowbanned for something I would assume that instead of this. /r/Conspiracy is a joke to reddit. I would guess no one would think high enough of this place to start shadow banning.

(to: why_compromise)

maybe we should start a habit of naming the person we are commenting to

whats shadowban?

whats shadowban?

.

Or you can always just have your comments deleted. You will not even know your comment is deleted. You will still see it. Only you. The only way to know is to be inherently suspicious, and sign out of your account after clicking on the permalink of the comment.

A sneaky tactic, but hey, at least it is only your comment and not your whole account. Isn’t it great that we have shadow-banning on a website that claims to support free speech.

Thanks

Are you kidding me? When reddit moved out to San Francisco, Aaron didn't move with them. He simply failed to show up for work for quite some time - IIRC a month or two. When he did show up, he under-performed and was eventually bought out.

and yet ... here we are

Truth right there.

whelp, been nice knowing ya

I hope that isn't true. But I fear that it is.

I agree 100%

The content has changed, the attitude of people in charge has changed, and the conspiracy stuff keeps getting bigger and bigger.

Personally I have been banned from three subs in the last year already simply for disagreeing with mods. They are drunk on power now.

I think I remember hearing the same thing about Digg when it went under

Guys, can someone explain me why he did it? why?

We need to gather the communities of Reddit - rally the platform, and remind the Board and staff what is important about this site. What Aaron stood for. /r/undelete Reddit

Holy sh-t, I just Wiki'd the his article and it's terrible. This is one of the reasons why I hate academia. (Side rant: Professors read hundreds of fresh papers, straight up plagiarize the ideas, and then guess who has a new $100 textbook ready next semester? Oh, it's a required text for their class btw.)

How did he die? Wikipedia says suicide but no note was found

90% sure, but Aaron Swartz was raldi, right?

Weird that I'm Googling and can't find any evidence for this. No relevant results for "Aaron Swartz raldi" or "raldi suicide" or "Aaron Swartz reddit name"

Reddit died when AS no longer had anything to do with it. It was dead long before Aaron was.

rather "suicided"

you are overstating his importance

There's really no disputing that Schwartz had very little to do with reddit. Can we not just make shit up, please?

Someone give this man gold!!!

Are you saying Aaron Schwartz was killed by reddit?

Immediate downvotes while in /new. Color me shocked.

I agree with most of what you've said here.

I've noticed that after many subs started filtering out brand new accounts where age<Xdays/months, suddenly I started seeing 3 year old accounts with 1 day of actual activity which started 1 day ago or hours ago. These accounts conveniently bypass all attempts to filter out instant trolls and throwaways, but more importantly these accounts are usually very focused on specific topics.

Wow that's pretty amazing that you noticed the trend. Also would indicate that people have sleeper accounts just waiting for when they're needed. (especially if the account is 3 years old and 'woke up' shortly after the new accounts were getting hit)

I caught a user a few months ago. The account was a bot that automatically copied a comment from a different user in each thread, and then the bot posted it. I noticed it completely by coincidence and I figured it out because the bot would not copy capital letters, so the comments were always mimicked in all lowercase, even with proper nouns, etc...

This account ran 24/7 and would get upvoted constantly even though the comment it copied was usually just a few down from it.

By using this technique, I watched that account get +20K comment karma. But even more sinister, if you clicked on the account name, it was almost impossible to tell that the comment history was completely forged.

So you could run a bunch of these bots, wait until they collected enough time and karma to look legit, then sell them. The new owner would begin to use them for corporate shilling or what have you, and anyone who tried to call them out would see months and months of seemingly legit comments that covered an entire range of topics. Comments that the account had not actually made, just copied.

I used to regularly check in with the user of that bot, and it got to the point where we were even a little bit friendly with each other. I would usually ask questions like "Pretty brilliant system. How much are you going to sell this for?", etc... and I would get replies that implied the owner knew exactly what I was talking about.

I don't know if they eventually got caught out, because I was constantly blowing up their spot. But one day I signed in and the account was gone. It was called "timewaitsforsome".

I wonder how many of those bots are out there, slowly developing a real looking history.

i caught a user a few months ago. the account was a bot that automatically copied a comment from a different user in each thread, and then the bot posted it. i noticed it completely by coincidence and i figured it out because the bot would not copy capital letters, so the comments were always mimicked in all lowercase, even with proper nouns, etc...

this account ran 24/7 and would get upvoted constantly even though the comment it copied was usually just a few down from it. by using this technique, i watched that account get +20K comment karma. but even more sinister, if you clicked on the account name, it was almost impossible to tell that the comment history was completely forged.

so you could run a bunch of these bots, wait until they collected enough time and karma to look legit, then sell them. The new owner would begin to use them for corporate shilling or what have you, and anyone who tried to call them out would see months and months of seemingly legit comments that covered an entire range of topics. Comments that the account had not actually made, just copied.

i used to regularly check in with the user of that bot, and it got to the point where we were even a little bit friendly with each other. i would usually ask questions like "pretty brilliant system. how much are you going to sell this for?", etc... and i would get replies that implied the owner knew exactly what i was talking about.

i don't know if they eventually got caught out, because I was constantly blowing up their spot. but one day I signed in and the account was gone. it was called "timewaitsforsome".

i wonder how many of those bots are out there, slowly developing a real looking history.

Hahaha, nice.

The bot that I saw was much less sophisticated and I think someone from here caught it. All it would post would be the phrase, "nothing will make a difference," or "nothing will change" over and over. It would do this on topics related to politics, foreign policy, tech (like net neutrality and surveillance)... it was creepy.

Ha, oh fuck I got in an argument with that guy on bad_cop_no_donut. Did not realize it was a bot...

That's no got, just an average /r/technology poster

Whoa...

I've seen those bots myself and I wondered what the point was. Now I know.

I'm pretty sure I know that bot....

What was its response to your question that implied it knew what you were talking about?

Lets just say he didn't deny any of my accusations but had a lot of cute answers that implied he knew exactly what I was talking about but would never admit it because he knew I would take a screenshot of his answer.

This was a while ago honestly, it is hard to remember specifics.

But the owner of the bot definitely started seeing our interactions as a game, to the point where we actually started liking to interact. Like a professional courtesy or something. Like the guy working for your competitor, but you get to know each other over time.

Reddit needs to do more data science.

I remember that account.

I actually suspect that the accounts are created "1 day ago" and the creation date artificially rolled back 3 years by someone.

Damn, that's a scary thought. I always figured this kind of manipulation was happening 'around' the rules of Reddit through loopholes and the cleverness of profit seeking entities.

If what you're saying happens that's a whole other level of corruption though.

think about this, why is google better at indexing reddit then reddit's own search engine. I'm talking simply about "exact word matching" the simplest of search tools. Any database built in search feature would be better then the current search in reddit but it's crap compared to google even for exact word matching.

Reddit search had always always been shit.

it makes sense. i've seen a lot of what OP is saying. think about this. Reddit describes itself an internet aggregator. hahaha! no, it is a generator, it is where stuff happens on the internet and that 'stuff' get disseminated. it is so much easier to start at the headwaters than manage the river downstream

It's a conversation taking place on servers controlled by the parent company, I'm sure they have access to what's necessary to change the vote count, account age, etc.

I don't claim to know reddit's software, but from what I know from other software it's as easy as logging into MySQL, looking up the field and entering a new number.

Source: have adminned phpBB and vBB boards.

Kinda like youtube videos with 700 likes and 301 views?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oIkhgagvrjI

Thanks for the link. Good to know!

Whoa, is that possible??

Absolutely. Its just a number in a database.

Damn, that's messed up.

While I totally agree with you I can also say in fairness that I rarely post and mainly lurk

SHILL!

not so loud, his account just woke up

Wtf? Why did OP delete his/her account?

I completely agree. If reddit wants to Digg its own grave, let them.

I see what you did there

So what exactly does a haunted turtleneck do? Make people's necks itchy? :P

But then how will I get my disinformation and biased and/or heavily censored news??

Fantastic writeup. Now Reddit is a sell-off bitch. Just a sad state of affair.

The user was deleted, funnily enough.

since you figured all of the above, automatically downvotes should not be a surprise :)

Are months that I'm pointing many of the points you've made with different accounts (those accounts usually gets shadowbanned or a target for automatic downvoting)

glad to see them (and more) clearly explained

That was just /u/ekjp on her phone in court.

You DO realize that some of the most blatant subreddit hoarding "powerusers" run /r/conspiracy too right?

stop stirring the honeypot.

Name one.

I'll give you two.

Illuminatedwax and creq

You do know that illuminatedwax hasn't participated in mod activities here in literally years. His last post was five months ago. He has not been anything other than a placeholder mod account for a long time.

Further, I am also less active but due to family and work obligations that take up my time.

Personally, I th uhh no the current mod team do a fucking fantastic job of managing this sub.

Yeah, but he still runs the place, still has control over it, and still makes sure everyone who works under him follows his agenda.

Hmm, I'm intrigued by your theories and would like to subscribe to your newsletter about how I am subservient to said agenda in any way.

If IlluminatedWax has had nothing to do with this sub... why doesn't he let go of it?

Oh sorry, I forgot, he actually does a have a lot to do with it... No other reason to hang onto it as he does the other 50000 subs he controls...

Great post, but the one thing I'd like to mention is that Reddit is NOT making tons of money. The website/community has tons of value (~$500million), but do not assume that means they make money.

[deleted]

Then don't let the door hit you on the way out.

This is one of the best posts I've read here in a long time, thanks for taking the time to put this out for this sub to see.

I'm glad I saw this. I have felt for a while that there was something different about Reddit. I would read about injustices around the world and it kept me informed. The American media filters so much. Reddit starting feeling filtered, too. There are a LOT of top posts from gaming subreddits. I don't mind, but it seems there a lot more and that other content is just not there anymore. I had subscribed to under eye...and noticed a change, so I unsubscribed.

I just don't like media manipulation. It's as if you cannot escape it anymore.

I just don't like media manipulation. It's as if you cannot escape it anymore.

It's unfortunate, but I don't think you can. I like the community and information I get from online interaction, but it seems like there will come a day when the combined forces of advertisement and media manipulation will overwhelm most benefit there is to be gained from the internet.

[deleted]

This is version 3.0 of a post that I originally made.

Not that it is obvious, I change usernames quite a bit. Its good for the soul.

Thank you for all the hard work. Even though reddit may be fucked as fucked can be, we must face it and do whatever we can.

What can an honest redditor do in the face of this massive corruption?

Why would OP delete his/her account?

It's a shit post, I can't believe this is the crap people are making so much noise about. Where's the fucking conspiracy? Uhhh new users...uh AMA is very organized...uh conspiracy!

This is why people make fun of conspiracy theorist. This whole place is 99% mental wasteland and at the same time everyone here is patting each other on the back for being so astute and open minded.

I can't find any evidence to substantiate the claims about undelete, a forum I frequent. It is constantly trolled by mods like fritzly, posts are not deleted, and while the two humans on the team mod a lot of subs, those subs seem user-sympathetic. The only questionable behaviour that I've ever seen from cojoco is friendliness to fritzly, and it's probably in his best interest to be that way for a number of different reasons.

Are you saying u/magnora made that stuff up?

I am not being a jerk by asking you this. I am honestly curious because I just took his word for it. It is one of the few things on my list that I didn't witness first-hand.

I'm saying that even at the time the issue seemed contrived and blown out of proportion. The only two human mods for undelete now do not seem active other than that I know cojoco works on the code that makes that subreddit possible.

And what seems like several months before the described issues, AssuredlyAThrowAway made a big fuss in undelete about IAmAnAnonymousCoward (two people whose names are crafted so similarly that I figured them for the same person) because he was a mod of r/politics. This is no longer true, at any rate, but what I find so odd about it is that AssuredlyAThrowAway is a mod of r/worldnews and does not disclose this often.

Magnora is a loon. He thought theghostofdusty was a snoonet troll and he couldn't get his own subs correct (undeleteundelete vs deletenothing).

He also was shadow banned again most likely for vote manipulation again.

Why do you bother rearing your weasely little head around here?

Probably just stalking the "bad subs" (ones that actually call out the bullshit) and monitoring discussion. I had a discussion with him once. He's openly pro censorship...that means he thinks certain knowledge should be hidden. He's here observing knowledge thats critical of him and the rest of the mods ruining this site. If you can put two and two together, it basically says that he actively monitors his critics and would censor this sub in a second IMO. When I asked him about what he wanted to censor, it was all typical anti-SRS shit. He's at least open about it, but he's still just here to tow the company line. Only mainstream prejudice is to be censored, not prejudice in general. Your typical "white males are the worst, and people of color can't be racist" kind of shit...although censorship in ANY form is disgusting.

Seriously. This guy just seems to want to participate in conversations about him. It's so weird that he can't let us talk about him in peace.

Oh hi, power mod! Never thought you'd be stalking too!

Power mod? Damn, I must've missed all my paychecks so far because I'm not getting paid enough for this.

It sucks that you and I can't talk about fritzly in peace though. It really bums me out man and I share your pain.

ah damn, I missed where I said you were paid and not just a mod of over 100 subs with influence on the site as a whole :(((

While I agree that users should not have the ability to mod so many subreddits and that Kesha may be writing facetiously in the comments you're responding to, you should check the subs they mod. I can't see any defaults and the rest aren't well-frequented.

Although one of them is Olive Garden's promotional sub.

Real influential subreddits like /r/Ameristralia and /r/pimpcats. Government-type stuff, surely.

Try going down the list instead of citing the gotcha number.

Yeah, you just seem to be in a lot of the modmail driven subs. Circlejerking and memes all day.

Literally a government conspiracy that goes all the way to the top.

I didnt say that idiot, you're just an annoying braveryjerk type.

Thanks for the compliment, 3-day account.

le memez

Top quality shilling, friend.

was it dank tho?

I don't remember talking to you but if you are suggesting that I'm srs then you must have misread what I said.

well I can scan my history, if you want. It wasn't that long ago. When you mentioned what you wanted to censor, it was pretty much the same shit SRS bitches about.

I just dont like hate speech and get tired of stormfront copypasta

y u gotta be so ruude. Don't you know we're human too. Y u gotta be so rude. I'm going to marry her anyway.

About the time that whoahverse was taking off, I remember seeing a post about a mod bragging about squatting that particular subverse as well as bragging about taking over undelete here on reddit. I cannot verify the accuracy of the post, but I do remember it. It was someone from conspiratard IIRC.

Nice post, but a waste. McReddit is unrecoverable. Its done - finito - charred and burned. They won and they got a biased, synthetic, manipulated, viral ad platform that people still think is organic, open, and honest.

Nope.

I wonder how much those bastards (like bipolarbear and his ilk) actually helped to bring about these changes thanks to all the bullshit. Almost like the agenda was to break it so they can 'fix' it to their standards...

Yea it's getting a bit shit round here now a days.

Yeah, I mean, obviously we still participate. I just don't get surprised or hurt when something is obviously censored or brigaded - its business as usual TBH. It sucks, but the sooner we accept that McReddit is not ours, is not able to be reverted back to the 'golden age,' and that there exists a large amount of 'official interference,' the better off we can be as the posts here will (hopefully) remain intact.

First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out— Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out— Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out— Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

Sure, but when they came for the Socialists, THEY WARNED THEM ALL THEY WERE COMING.

I mean, I get the gist of the poem and its meaning. But seriously, they all were warned to GTFO.

Having jewish relatives who died in WW2, it was not like they didn't know and wanted to leave. You needed a lot of money to leave and then you needed a place that would let you come. Knowing is only HALF the battle.

I understand - and it probably wasn't like the said "leave or you will die." I think it was more "leave or face arrest."

Either way, money or no money: where there is a will, there is a way.

This is why there are many survivors, people who escaped by any means necessary and who had good luck as well when doing so.

PS: All the polacks being stupid jokes were based upon the fact that they were in between Russia and Germany so all the smart people who came of age got the fuck out of there as soon as they could.

Kinda like voting TBH, your choice is shit platter A or shit platter B... now go vote and talk about which shit is shitter than the other shit, meanwhile we get an illusion of debate and what not... what a fucking waste of time

Yep. I never could reconcile the "vote for the lesser evil." I always asked why you'd vote for evil? Why not try something else for once?

Ugh.

/r/politics - "WE HATE CONSERVATIVES AND THEY ARE EVIL"

/r/conservative - "Yeah this is a conservative subreddit, but most posts are downvoted anyway"

We should go back to Digg.com

Alternatives?

TBH, no idea.

There are reddit-clones like Voat which have potential, but have the same foundational loopholes that allowed what happened to reddit to recur. Its the anonymity factor: anyone can create one or multiple accounts, inevitably leading to bots, which can be used to misinform, disinform, sway opinion, stifle conversation, and so forth. I wouldn't want to get rid of anonymity as this is what makes it so attractive (otherwise its just facebook).

I don't know...

4Chan isnt the same as it used to be,but it isnt so controlled as Reddit.

Once in while it pays off,when you can see honest answers.

Nah, the founder of 4Chan recently sold out and let the website get overrun by the same SJW/SRS types that took over reddit.

http://imgur.com/gallery/G0eIGQx

8chan bro

8chan sucks in it's own ways. It has no originality or soul of it's own. Seriously, Reddit is the best place right now, even though it's censored. One good thing is that when shitty subs become shitty, there will always be alternatives. I remember when I heard the main LBGT sub became a shithole, someone made an alternative which is where everyone eventually went to. Good thing, unlike 8chan, it still had the same soul as the original sub that went to shit. The good subs may not be on the default front page and many lurkers will not see it at first, but the good people and subs can always be found here for now.

Its almost like its an orchestrated event

Yea I know about mootykins and what he did. Maybe just because the boards I frequent didnt get their share of shills,I didnt see difference.

If youre still using 4chan and not 8chan youre a fool.

How is it that in every somewhat intriguing thread I happen to come across on Reddit, some whiner is complaint about social justice warriors? It's so annoying; I'm honestly considering leaving Reddit because of all the negativity surrounding it. And to top it off, it's incredibly boring.

So what needs to happen right now is we need a list both over arching and highly technical that would be more ideal.

One thing that strikes me about /r/conspiracy is that most people here are stuck in a retroactive mindset. But being able to use information available to spot patterns and accurate predict what will happen and how to prevent it would bring actual value to a place like this.

Well anyway, not to get side tracked. I want to see a big detailed list of how a next generation aggregator should function. Which is the first steps toward making it happen.

One thing that strikes me about /r/conspiracy is that most people here are stuck in a retroactive mindset. But being able to use information available to spot patterns and accurate predict what will happen and how to prevent it would bring actual value to a place like this.

Meta-cognition is a sign of intelligence, the kind you get with critical thinking. This sub seems to still have a large amount of honestly inquisitive people - but is certainly not immune from the McReddit curse.

The best thing for people of /r/conspiracy to do would be to start doing more future predictions as well as list the weaknesses of current technology.

I would love to know who the next president will be based on how much walmart wants him/her to be. I would also find it incredibly entertaining to see what the CIA is going to cause next long before it happens. If predictions like this can be accurate enough it would be entertaining!

Not only that but knowing and learning how to make conspiracies more costly to do on modern technology would be super useful! All forms of leadership should hold the weight of forced transparency.

Ha! Walmart President. I instantly think of Idiocracy LOL!

Transparency as a weapon. Interesting.

I wonder if like Schrod's Cat that by mentioning it, the thing (manipulation) changes.

You can take a heavy swing at most of it by taking a book out of SomethingAwful forums and have users pay for accounts (I think it's $5 or $10?).

It won't get rid of shill mods and manipulation of the rules from the site owners, but it will get rid of a lot of spammers and disinformation. Unless, of course, it becomes corrupted from within... then you're hopeless.

It may even strengthen incorruptibility because users will be providing the $$$ and not advertisers.

The current crop of facists ruining reddit come from SA, by way of digg. A forum that excludes people breeds superiority among it's users.

https://voat.co/

Metafilter? That's the one which costs 5 bucks to sign up for right?

Just take the reddit source code, strip out the crap you don't like, and re-launch as Reddit without censorship.

Which license is it released under?

You need more than that. Gaining an audience these days is an extremely huge topic by itself and probably has a lot of the same problems due to aggregator disfunctionality.

8chan. 4chan was handed over to SJWs by moot.

I'd very much like to know of any alternatives..
One thing I enjoy the most about the Internet is the ability to read and discuss real peoples opinions from all over the world (often regarding news and politics in my case), but I'm having a hard time distinguishing shills from real people in subreddits like worldnews, which means I don't really trust any comment there, which in turn means its basically useless :(

Check out 8ch.net it has Chan styled board that are user created and user maintained except for of course US law.

It's in the OP:

https://voat.co/

Go to your local bar or coffee shop and start talking to real people one on one. Look them in the eyes. Converse. Agree. Disagree. Hopefully come out learning something.

Ech...

It doesn't help that you find less and less intellectual comments on each post. You could watch a crazy animal video and have unidan explain it, or read an article on R/world news and here both sides of the story in the comments. Now it's popular opinion and people shooting for that really good joke.

The next step forward is a reddit like system that automates moderating through randomized crowd sourcing to eliminate arbitrary power users. I would also like to see a limited number of upvotes per user and meta-moderation for the automod system.. That coupled with some kind of built in bitcoin tipping system and revenue sharing, I think you have a better mousetrap.

Problem reaction solution...

Are there replacement options to try out?

Are there replacement options to try out?

Current recommendation, also point 13 in the OP: https://voat.co/

There are moderators that control like 150 subreddits. These are supposedly not admins but it is super sketchy. http://www.np.reddit.com/r/dealsreddit A couple mods in particular you might find there...

I have seen some of these mods do coordinated takeovers of subreddits with inactive mods through /r/redditrequest. How does one even have time to moderate more than like 10 subreddits?

How does one even have time to moderate more than like 10 subreddits?

Because it's their jobs and they get paid for it. Absolutely no doubt about it - who in their right mind would spend all their free time doing such a menial task, and not get paid? They 100% are on salary.

Don't be so sure. There are MMO players who put in full time (or more) hours doing tedious, boring shit in a game they pay to play.

I wouldn't compare that at all. It's a videogame and they get rewarded with phat loot at the end of their boring/tedious grind. These mods get nothing at all - except for that salary.

It makes them feel good. Having that "power" is like a drug to them.

The type of reward doesn't negate it's game mechanics though.

There are also MMO players that get paid full time, who work for the NSA.

WHAT? Was this sarcasm? get paid to do what, play?

No this was not sarcasm. It was revealed a couple of months ago that they have paid players on staff. They are "looking for terrorist cells" domestically online. They play games all day. That's their job.

Your tax dollars at work.

I kinda wanna work for the NSA now.

I am in the wrong business.

Not really. They are in control of the subreddit remember? They can throw in the occasional amazon referral post, or similar. Get users to click on it; Then just sit back and collect 10% off of every sale made on amazon by that user.

I've guess your school didn't hold elections for class president. Or your country doesn't have resident elected building supervisor.

I found this thread a bit late.

But reddit is training a new crop of marketing and PR agents in a webinar for $149.

http://www.reddit.com/r/HailCorporate/comments/309k67/this_site_that_you_are_on_right_now_is_training_a/

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Oh the irony

love that this happened

There are mods with a lot more than 150 subs. I saw one with over 500 the other day.

/u/xvvhiteboy

There needs to be a limit on how many subs you can mod. Anything over like 20 to me feels like a power grab.

They would just create more accounts

Wassup

How can you be a MOD of so many subs? Why are you a MOD of so many subs? Do you get paid?

I do CSS, I do CSS, and lots and lots of bitcoins.

I dont want to sound accusing or anything, just curious: do you think you can effectively moderate so many subs every day or was it more of a one time contribution with your CSS skills? Also, how much time do you spend on reddit a day?

I only do css for 99% of the subs I mod but I do actively mod like 15 subs. I spend probably 2 hours lurking or using the site normally a day and probably 45 mins moderating if I dont have any projects

Cool. Thanks for the reply :)

hi wb

Hey Rico, did this get linked somewhere or something?

I don't think so, I mean we all know about it lol

Most subs with CSS have a dedicated person doing that and that alone.

Or how about /r/GMOMyths?

They search reddit for GMO/Monsanto threads and vote brigade them.

Look at the mod's comment history.

I think it's funny the same people control /r/agriculture and i think /r/farming

That's super sketchy.

[deleted]

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Isn't that how r/atheism went down the drain, with r/redditrequest?

I feel like the bigger problem with that one was the crazy influx of super 'edgy' teens that hated their parents and wanted to make fun of them.

It used to be a really cool sub that honestly atheists and theists could have productive, eye opening discussions. Then it up and went to shit.

FYI it's just np.reddit.com, without the 'www' subdomain.

Also, I've noticed that there's a bot user called AutoModerator that almost 8,000 subs use to auto moderate them. Cleaning up posts with bad links and that sort of thing.

This might sound pretty silly, but isn't that leaving it wide open for the admins (or someone else) to seize the account and get 100% full mod control of the majority of reddit?

it is contoled by Reddit. Its made by them I am pretty sure.

I only mod 2, and sadly feel they're both neglected. :(

Clear concise and thorough. You have my upvote. From all appearances, it seems everything you said is is spot on.

Seriously, speaking of shills. /r/canada mods will now ban you if you call someone a shill but can't prove it.

It's just not worth it to speak up if the mods can decide what's enough proof.

Understood. Thanks for the heads up!

/r/france will ban you if they just think you didn't reply nicely enough to someone. You don't have to actually insult them, use bad words or anything, you just have to disagree sarcastically.

Of course that does not apply if you hold the appropriate opinion.

Impressive number of subscriptions.

We all know asking for actual evidence which supports an allegation is inherently unreasonable.

No, asking for evidence is not unreasonable, on the flipside banning people because they cannot supply any is very unreasonable.

Why? It's clear-cut defamation and/or libel (depending on jurisdiction) if there's no evidence upon which to base such claims. The website would be liable if they didn't remove it.

While I agree with your sentiment, the website having any real liability for an insult/accusation between two anonymous users is a stretch. They're most likely just trying to keep things civil. Some people would like to call out shilling whenever they suspect it, but this can cause people to shy away from expressing genuine enthusiasm about anything with a price tag.

Banning does seem excessive but honestly you should have tangible proof or else you just look like an idiot. Then people form a generalized opinion and dismiss accusations like that more freely in the future. Also, I'm sure a lot of those mods have good intentions and would unban you if you apologized for breaking the rules.

Honest belief based upon evidence is a defence to the tort, but it has to have some grounding. No evidence ain't gonna cut it.

Yeah I agree with you

Yes, and that falls in their stalking/doxxing bracket and is also worth a ban. See how it works?

I'm going to test this right now

/r/metacanada has been pushing for this for a long time.

I have some money, 18 years of development experience, and some of the same frustrations you do. I've also spent YEARS on online discussion sites. Want to start a "real" discussion site? We should talk. I love your energy.

I'd be interested as well actually. I have time, money, and am a competent programmer to put it mildly

EDIT: It's also worth mentioning that (like several others with the ability, no doubt) the idea has occurred to me before. But lately more than ever, it seems like Reddit no longer serves its original intended function as a free speech congregation zone.

I have no money, no discernable skills of value, and not much time. But if you all create an unbiased, free-speech site, please let me know. I'd love to be a member of it!

Count on me for video production once the site is ready and you want to spread the word.

An example of my work from my YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GZQRp9Mup0w

Nice work! I like your editing.

Damn, nice video. Alan Watts is a smart guy

to put it mildly

I like that part :) ARROGANT PROGRAMMER HIGH FIVE! haha

it seems like Reddit no longer serves its original intended function as a free speech congregation zone.

I feel the same way. I have some ideas on how to improve the formula (which has literally barely changed here since it was founded) but I'd rather keep em private till we get some folks together. I've been approached via PM already

ARROGANT PROGRAMMER HIGH FIVE! haha

It's hard to get the right message across in this context, glad you know what I'm saying :D. I think what separates great programmers from good is the desire for constant improvement -- definitely a life-long pursuit. Having said that, web programming in general isn't exactly rocket science (although security is always a bit more difficult).

I feel the same way. I have some ideas on how to improve the formula (which has literally barely changed here since it was founded) but I'd rather keep em private till we get some folks together. I've been approached via PM already

Let me know. I've been thinking about it for a long while, just never had a catalyst. This seems like as good of one as any. Always looking for new/interesting projects.

(I'm a few 11% beers in, this reply may be a little on the sporatic side -- I'll check back when more sober)

I'm a competent programmer to exaggerate wildly!

I'm in!

What do ya bring to the table? :)

Fuck it, I'm down to be a member.

If this ever gets off of the ground, let me know. I have no contributions, but I would love to know about any alternative to this site, especially one built solely to combat the editorializing on Reddit.

yeah. I really need to get something together. maybe at least a google hangout or SOMEthing, to at least brainstorm. A large number of people have approached me already about this.

The problem with "real" discussion sites is that you have no way to be truly open while remaining high-quality.

On the one hand, if you have selective membership, it will start to become a circlejerk-y, cliquey back-patting society as you exercise direct choice on who is able to join the conversation. The quality of conversation, overall level of knowledge on topics, and adherence to site rules will be much higher, but the overall group will stagnate, or else become a power struggle for site privileges and influence.

On the other hand, if you have an open membership model, the there's no need to worry about accusations of elitism, exclusivity or exclusion of any particular type of user. The topics will be fresher as more people contribute, and more topics will be started because you'll have users from more diverse backgrounds. The overall quality of conversation will be lower overall, however, and you'll have a much higher chance for trolls, griefers and flamers to pop up and cause a ruckus. You'll also have a higher userbase, which means mob mentality will be more prevalent; user bullying/brigading are considerations to take in this situation as well.

Making a social/discussion website is a fine undertaking, but it requires a very thorough planning for both format and implementation.

Coding Horror has slipped, and Discourse isn't the right direction, Jeff.

I can do some design. I'm pretty new to the webpage side of it but if you need graphics or logos or whatever, I'll see what I can do! PM me or something.

Any updates on this? /u/shark_shank

Yeah, I wish I knew more about developing. I am more of an idea man. I am down to give it a go if you are. Send me a PM.

go to voat and help

I don't have enough personal attachment to reddit to feel strongly about this stuff, but it has definitely changed my perspective of what I once viewed as an open platform where everyone had equal opportunity with security measures that did pretty well to keep out the cruft. Most of that is out the window now, but the one thing that really bugs me after all these years is that the community (read "hivemind") has the power to effectively mute people within a subreddit ("you must wait to post") in downvoting comments to below a karma threshold that throws the spam filter. This must have seemed like a great idea at one point, and I admit it sounds intriguing, but with the mob mentality around here it only results in strengthening the hivemind effect, with valid, dissenting all but vanishing from the discussion, generally weighted to the bottom out of visibility, or collapsed/invisible. I personally come to reddit to learn, and I often have to swap my sort to "controversial" and back just to find the information I'm looking for, which is rarely pursuit of confirmation of my own bias, but more often seeking what often goes unsaid or to gain a more objective view on a matter. It's nice that we have tools to conduct this type of browsing, but the comment throttling feature has to stop. Maybe they could reserve it for reported comments, or something.

I don't really understand why anyone here is surprised by any of this. All reddit's servers take a ton of money to run, and those little ads in the corner just don't bring in the big money that people assume they do. To see the same clips from the same TV shows being spammed all over the front page over and over again, to see the same product placements and ad campaigns being regurgitated over and over and not assume that money is changing hands here is utterly naive. Reddit is a business, and people need to think a bit more critically about the content they are consuming here. It utterly obviously hasn't been a pure 'meritocracy' in quite a while.

I'm not sure why you chose to respond to my comment. My initial disclaimer was supposed to serve to detach me from having any emotional investment in the issues brought up by OP's post. I'm really only aggravated by the community itself and I feel it would benefit from Reddit making a few minor changes, but I don't expect it to change because Reddit has been very successful giving everyone the gratification with seeing the results of their punishment enacted on commenters by triggering the spam flag after downvoting them. I understand the main problem at hand is the issue of Reddit's corporate structure and admins and I don't want to denounce any of OP's claims on the basis that I can't personally prove anything either way, but I wanted to add my own personal beef to the list.

You're a rambler

Apparently some folks like it, plus's alt. I only put as much effort into my comments as I feel the discussion warrants.

Funny, Ellen Pao claims to want a meritocracy in other places.... Hmmmmm

So, basically, if there was another platform created, the visibility should be the exact opposite that of reddit: posts everyone agrees on should be on the bottom by default, posts either "downvoted" or "controversial" should receive most visibility, no?

I mean, you're not required to read my comment to understand my proposal, but you're also not required to pretend like you did and stuff words in my mouth.

Don't be so paranoid :) — I'll bet you money I have more shadow-banned accounts here than /r/conspiracy combined, but that's beyond the point.

My point is — if I did create a platform, would see the aforementioned approach as viable and useful?

Useful? Maybe for trolls. I can't understand why anyone do ascending ordered sorts on ratings, exactly opposite of Reddit's sort. I think that's what you're suggesting. In a way, it would influence people to counter those comments overwhelmed with negative votes by upvoting them to send them back down again.

Ideally, you'd want to do two lists, with a random selection of one of the comments displaying in a collapsible box with some action buttons, "report", "downvote" and "upvote" at the very top, as you said. User is presented the shitty comment and prompted to perform further action, with an accompanying note, "this comment has getting a lot of negative attention. Do you need to report them to the moderators for violating rules? Is it a horrible comment made by a person who serves no purpose on this earth?" This would give people the opportunity to consider whether someone has been vote brigaded. Perhaps the rest of the remaining comments would sorted normally.

Interesting about the shadow bans. I'm interested in hearing what you're up to.

I'm interested in hearing what you're up to.

I'll hit you up or vice versa? I really don't like to discuss of this nature anything in "public".

i have seen a couple of AMAs where the shills have come out in such force that they overwhelm reddit. and a few people will call them out but for the most part it goes off completely unnoticed. and yeah it the worst on weekends

Holy shit! Reddit answered my feature request and I never even officially made one! I'm thinking this must have been an ongoing problem and they've never actually seen my bitching, of course, but wow! I've only ever received negative attention for every expressing this opinion, so of course you're the first person I thought of. Go to this thread and note the default sorting will be "random", aka "contest mode", regardless of whatever your user preference is set to. It's possible this has been around for a while and I wasn't aware of it, but this seems to be a subreddit setting. It's my feeling that /r/undelete and any sub that deems itself to serve the purpose honorability and transparency should set this up as well. It decreases the odds of the hivemind effect, even if indirectly and not ideally.

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I see, I never thought of it that way. I ninjedited and fixed it, so you/mods can delete this now.

This is a great timeline. I try to mention as many of these things as I can remember when I am explaining to people how reddit was destroyed. Now I can just refer them to this thorough and detailed post.

Do it, I encourage everyone to copy and paste the source code and post it everywhere all the time. Thats why I made it and try to update it every few months.

thank you so much! im glad it is on the top of the page now :D

I don't have any data on it, but I feel like most of this can be explained by the fact that Reddit has grown multiple hundreds percent over the last few years. Any organization that grows in popularity and revenue is going to become homogenized and have its edges smoothed out. It doesn't take a conspirators effort; it just happens via natural sociological forces.

Yes, I am very aware of the "standard" excuse for why reddit has declined. It is a conclusion that takes about 5 minutes to come up with.

Have you ever thought about the fact that literally every person has thought of this rationale and that the people who would have taken over reddit would have known that this excuse would perfectly cover their organized manipulation?

[deleted]

If you look at any organization that grew from small to large you will see a complete takeover by people in power. Or of course you can just chalk it up to something simple and easy to explain away, which is a defense mechanism of basic human nature when dealing with complexity.

And as I already said, that trait of human nature is something that those in power are very well aware of and exploit while using as the perfect cover for anything they were doing behind the scenes.

I'm surprised the timeline didn't start with reddit being annexed by Conde Nast

Graduation, the frog boiling thing.

good plan!

Yup. People are like "oh you just want to be a hipster and say you liked it before it was cool". Not at all - this place has legitimately changed for the worse while maintaining its cover for the masses. All good things...

this is basically satire of the entire post

Just offering a bit of a different opinion.

Reddit definitely has changed over the years. I joined 6 years ago and lurked for a while. It used to be very intimidating to participate in serious subreddits because comments were extensively backed by personal or professional knowledge, or citations to articles.

If you were wrong you'd be called out instantly.

The Reddit community was exponentially smaller. Big subreddits had maybe 100K users. Probably less. I can't remember exactly.

But there were always dumb jokes.

Remember pun mega threads?

Remember the narwhals bacon at midnight?

Dumb jokes and dumb behavior was always a part of Reddit. It didn't used to be just an enlightened and progressive utopia.

It just feels inaccurate to bemoan the loss of Circlejerk because it was a garbage subreddit for most of its life. It started as a kind of clever satire group and turned into dumb garbage.

Same for places like fffffuuuuuuuuu or atheism.

To me the death of Reddit is more about a massive influx of young and ignorant people trying to exploit Reddit. Look at my art, listen to my music, watch this video I made.

/r/music had to make rules against self promotion because it was so rampant and annoying.

same with /r/wearethemusicmakers

That's exactly what's happening now is exploitation for self gain. It's more sophisticated but that's because there's more to gain.

Reddit is nothing more than an ad site. Everything is fake and everyone is selling something.

So yeah of course corporate interests are trying to get in on it, but everyone else is, too.

It's lots of dumb people and lots of advertisers ruining the site. There may be some evil forces influencing parts of the site, and government agents of all kinds monitoring and steering discussions when they can.

But we're having this discussion in the open and uninterrupted so everyone needs to chill out about Reddit being taken over and destroyed.

It's not all destroyed, because we can still organize and talk to each other.

The "mass media" subreddits like /r/news or politics have always been a joke so who cares. Go build up a good community in /r/worldpolitics or something.

/r/moosearchives is also a place to direct people to if they want to learn.

Reddit may be getting worse but we're all already here and can make parts better.

One thing I have always wondered is ok, so every OTHER subreddit is controlled by x, y or z although this subreddit is OBVIOUSLY NOT controlled.

I am not saying I have not seem some truly suspicious shit posted here but not everything is a conspiracy.

I don't think so. Now that the admins are selling seminars on how to market on Reddit, the happy times are officially gone. Reddit is done. Reddit is DIGG, Reddit is Facebook, Reddit is Twitter.

I think the best thing we can do is stop empowering Reddit with our posts, content and attention. Let the marketers, shills, and troll have this place.

Goodbye everyone.

Ok, goodbye . But were is everybody going? Or just let's stop commenting or reading anything.

To me the death of Reddit is more about a massive influx of young and ignorant people trying to exploit Reddit. Look at my art, listen to my music, watch this video I made.

Wait what, by and large those are exactly the kind of people that we need. Censoring them has been a massive problem. The main issue is the voting system is not being embraced. An aggregator that has a filtering system driven by people should never have manual censorship.

Which is the primary problem with all of this. The second you take out filtering methods or make them useless is the second you destroy what the site is really about.

But we're having this discussion in the open and uninterrupted so everyone needs to chill out about Reddit being taken over and destroyed.

I disagree with that statement. The fact is that there are subreddits that are allowed to exist as 'quarantine zones'. These discussions are going to happen no matter what but it's in every way in reddit's interest if they're allowed to happen ON REDDIT. It keeps things highly manageable.

Like this post for example had to happen here in r/conspiracy, where else would it not get instantly deleted? By it being posted here the discussion automatically loses credibility both because of the usual conspiracy theory insanity and because people like you can go and say 'well here we are talking about reddit on reddit so it can't be all bad'.

Then you have to consider that if this sort of discussion was forced off reddit they'd start to lose pageviews and would lose any influence they had on the discussion. They don't want that happening, they want everything here on reddit where they can see it going on and intervene when necessary. Prime example is gamergate being almost sitewide banned with the exception of r/kotakuinaction. The dissidents get their corner to talk about things while the 'mainstream' portions of the site are kept on the agenda.

Reddits founders selling out humanities current hyper mind switchboard is one of the more sad and shameful things I kn0 about.

This is so true. Reddit has such fucking potential and in the beginning, so many amazing things were achieved by the users working in unison. I can vividly remember this website single-handedly leading to the closure of the Elan School, a place that abused children and was open for over 40 years.

Reddit bitch-smacked that place within 24 hours and then it closed and all the children were released.

Now look at what we have. Its a crying shame really. Such fucking wasted potential.

Now you have the microstory on what happened to internet in general the last ~20 years.

Is it just me or have I seen a staggering amount of racism among other things popping up more frequently as well? I'm not talking about the aggro people talking about "SJW hug boxes" and shit either, but the real subtle stuff - the kind of stuff that silently creeps into a readers mind as "plausible" because it's not overtly offensive.

Yeah, I noticed that too. And I believe it also proves organized vote-brigading because sometimes you see downright racist comments that get tons of upvotes and anyone calling it out gets gang-downvoted.

it's a real shame. something related -- there was an article posted to /r/technology that was about nypd editing wiki articles about police brutality cases to downplay the wording in thee favor. I can't even think of how many people screamed "NOT TECH NEWS" and then blasted me with downvotes for calling them out.

Serious question. What sites would you go to for acurate content?

The mods over at /r/worldnews apparently don't take kindly to me shitting on religion when it's deserved. I remember posting essentially a defense of free expression -- specifically how self-censorship is a bad thing -- and they've banned me.....multiple times.

Yeah, if reddit has turned to shit, r/worldnews is the exact center of it.

The internet is effectively being censored by western governments. One name for it is JTRIG. It likely has many more.

I'd throw Israel into the 'western' category as well.

You can add the 'no calling shill' rule to the list. And I get it, people call other people shills too often, do we really need to start banning people over it though? Why not call them out when they accuse someone of being a shill without any proof?

http://www.reddit.com/r/undelete/comments/304uk6/the_reddit_trend_towards_banning_people_from/

I actually have to disagree here.

There is nothing educational or even entertaining about a bunch of people shouting "SHILL SHILL!" back and forth. It literally ruined this sub's comments section for a while.

I agree it was getting to be too much at a point. But, if shill accusations are a banable offense, what does one do when they legitimately think they've found a shill?

I like being able to call out someone in the comments so everyone watching can decide for themselves.

This. We have shills getting paid to shill with American tax dollars. If the site owners (not just Reddit, they're all over the net) can't stop or spot them, who is going to? They completely ruin free exchange of ideals, and that is exactly what they intend to do.

I'd love to sue the US gov and some of these corporate shills and even have them prosecuted for what they're doing, but hey, I'm an American. We are worthless when it comes to making our government and companies behave. Sorry, world.

We typically warn and explain everything carefully before we go so far as to ban.

Which is why this sub is still pretty good ;)

Unforuntely I think this rule will be highly abused in other subs.

We should try autoreplacing the term Shill with something like "You're such am insightful and valuable and beautiful part of the systems status quo!"

I don't have a problem with banning shill accusations while simultaneously adding checks and balances that allow the community to know that the mods are actively fighting against it.

Unfortunately, the second part never seems to happen.

What would you suggest to do for that 2nd part?

We could develop a tagging system, just like askreddit has a [serious] tag. People could tag self-posts with something that implies they are only looking for a discussion with people who are willing to entertain the basic premise the theory is built from.

So someone could actually have an in-depth conversation about an aspect of, for example, WTC7 without being flooded by arguments that refuse to even acknowledge that it was an unusual thing.

Basically, people here want to discuss some conspiracies with other people who have read up on the conspiracy. A lot of those threads are destroyed by people who come in just to argue that the mainstream media explanation is sound and anyone who thinks otherwise is stupid.

I don't want to sit there and explain to people that I have already registered the mainstream reasons in my mind, but that I am now PAST that point and want to have a discussion with other people who are PAST that point.

I guess that would be the best way to describe it.

My point is that there are a ton of creative ways that we can at least TRY to build a better subreddit and we don't need to be politically-correct to the point where we let every baby who cries "OMG, dats censorship" ruin this sub from evolving.

Some people are not going to like the new rules. Thats just life and they will have to deal with it. Too many times the mods in this sub try to placate everyone and make everyone happy. The intentions are correct, but in practice this has helped to ruin this place.

And obviously when we try out a new system, it would just be a test-run. I NEVER see test-runs of new systems in this subreddit. Its like we aren't even trying.

What wiki does. Ban posts from certain IPs. Also look for patterns in postings and ban those, too. I know it's not cheap, but the big sites like Reddit can do it.

There is nothing educational or even entertaining about a bunch of people shouting "SHILL SHILL!" back and forth.

Calling people "cancer" on the other hand is regarded civil and constructive.

In a sub about cancer, its on topic.

I would agree if you stopped about it here in /r/conspiracy and if it wasn't so distasteful.

That's exactly what an anti-shill shill would say...

shill!

11

:)

Up to 13 already! Nice!

Which is interesting considering that nobody seems to care when the accusations are sponsored by the mob: “This guy is a Putin-bot!

This is good because it's so damn true. Someone the other day posted a link to their comment in worldnews and someone responded "how much does the Kremlin pay you to post this stuff" and the guy had 10 upvotes.

But calling shill is bad!

I actually received an interesting message from a worldnews mod.

First I got a PM saying I was banned for shill accusations.

Then I got a PM a few minutes later saying "Sorry, we misread your comment, your ban has been lifted".

My comment was a little sarcastic and Poe's Law-y so I do not question that they genuinely misinterpreted it.

But I do find it interesting that in a Russia/Ukraine thread where all of my comments were essentially trying to advocate actually reading the article and not just knee-jerking, the mods jumped at the chance to ban me while simultaneously choosing to ignore loads of other comments calling out "Putin-bots", ending insults with "comrade", or implying that "Russia was paying them to post".

Yeah that's the biggest problem with all of these rules, selective enforcement. It's the same way they write laws in ways that can be open to interpretation so they can abuse them later.

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While not required, you are requested to STFU.

1) /r/reddit.com was removed to prevent confusion. Plenty of other subreddits exist for discussing the community: /r/metareddit, for example.

3) Believe it or not thousands of Redditors are happy to have an opportunity to ask famous people questions. There's no money involved in coordinating these threads. Any celebrity could host one for $0.00. Should they be banned from hosting threads? Well now that's the very censorship you claim to oppose. Obviously threads get exploited (albeit rarely) for commercial purposes, but so does everything else in this world.

4) "Eglin Air Force Base = Reddit's most addicted city" "most addicted" as in "highest number of visitors per capita" this is due to the fact that this "city" has an extremely low population, and that it functions as an IT training center even for non-government-associated persons. and believe it or not, a high percentage of people with interests in IT visit reddit. Even if this were some "secret shilling operation" were going on there, why the fuck would they be using Military IPs for it? You really think they would be that reckless?

5) Yes censorship does happen there, I agree with that, but it's rare for threads to get removed for illegitimate reasons. I frequent /r/undelete, and at least 80% of threads are deleted for legitimate reasons.

6) The vote fuzzing exists to prevent the very same shilling you claim to oppose. Those fuzzing rules are what stops me from creating 10 new accounts through proxies and voting myself up.

8) Again, prevents the very same shilling you claim to oppose. If this limitation were lifted, what stops me from spamming my products everywhere? People will catch on and downvote, but this restriction prevents spamming from getting out of hand.

9) I don't think /r/conspiracy is banned from the front page but please correct me if I am wrong. As for ". Different subs are given different algorithms." - do you have a source on that? Create a sub and tell me how exactly to implement that function. Must be kind of hard, since it doesn't exist anywhere in the reddit source code.

11) Rule was implemented for many reasons, the primary being that "shill" has become a buzzword to attack anyone with opinions that do not coincide with your own. Abused to the point where at least 95% shill accusations are just plain incorrect.

1) r/reddit was a major subreddit that made the front page almost daily. r/metareddit is an obscure subreddit that gets no play on the front page. There is a BIG difference.

3) you can believe the official story if you want, and I will continue to believe that AMA's are done for profit (profit made by reddit). Of course any celebrity could just sign in, but then they would have to compete with the sponsored AMA's that are set up strategically where the largest stars get the best peak hours.

Why are celebrities doing AMA's from reddit HQ? Why do all major AMA's need a person named Victoria? These are valid questions.

4) Englin Air Force Base would not have been caught at all if not for someone at reddit not getting the memo to leave it out of the stats. That is my personal theory and that would explain why they didn't need to hide their IP's, etc... Because they were assured that they would not get caught and once the mistake was made, it was too late to back-track because that would have brought even more attention to it.

5) The "legitimate" reasons that posts are deleted are based on the interpretation of rules that are intentionally written so that they can be abused and selectively enforced. Every con has a cover story. All you are saying is "those post broke the rules so they ended up in undelete". Congrats, you are buying into the system they designed for the sole purpose of giving every deletion a reasonable cover story.

6) You are absolutely wrong when it comes to new voting system. I actually find it insulting that you think you can rationalize that to me when I was on this site for over 5 years using the other system and I am more than capable of understand the differences between then and now. They changed the voting and it has made manipulation easier. It has made manufacturing consensus easier. It has made it easier for them to vote-brigade. It was a brilliant move on their part actually.

8) Those rules only enforce mob mentality and this can be witnessed every single day on subreddits like r/worldnews. They further the echo-chamber mentality and nothing more. It is disgraceful.

9) r/conspiracy is banned from appearing on the page 1 on an unsigned-in front page of reddit. This is how a large majority of users view the site.

Proof of different algorithms is explained in the link I provided.

11) I have no problem with rules as long as they are not selectively enforced. Calling someone a shill in now not okay, but calling someone a Russian shill is perfectly acceptable.

And once again, if you actually click on the link provided under that number, you will see the issue is not about calling people a shill as much as it is about the mods creating a system where you are unable to do anything because their rules created a catch-22.

I have to unfortunately agree with you on is the voting system and how much easier it is to get a hive mentality. That in itself is scary stuff because we all know too many people get a easily caught up in a herd mentality and don't take a question first. I am guilty of this just as much as anyone. Although I do hope for the benevolence of the admins and staff who run this site. I understand they have to make money and will sell the website in a way that it can, and there is really no stopping the Democratic circle jerk because of the majority of the age bracket who visit this website. But right now I still do enjoy the hilarious GIF's and everyday meme's even though 90% of them are probably fabricated or lies. Still makes me smile which in some ways is worth more.

Sorry this is totally random and not applicable to this thread but I am just reading through all of this (2 months later)... and I love your username!

Ha! Thank you! Yours isn't too shabby either!

Lol. You are my favorite drug! ;)

You don't know as much about the vote fuzzing system as you claim to. I've been on the site just as long as you if you wana go off that type of 'experience' with the 'system'

the bottom line is they are now hiding numbers that were always incorrect to begin with. Any "Sense" you used to make out of them was a lie.

You are really missing the point here. I understand that the upvotes/downvote were only a representation, even from the beginning. But showing that representation added a new dimension to a comment that is now absent.

Look at these two comments:

-5: (45/-40) Wow, I really hate it when people do that!

-5: Wow, I really hate it when people do that!

The first comment reflects a controversial opinion, but one that many people agree with. This is clear from the visual representation, regardless of whether or not the numbers are exact.

The second comment is begging for downvotes. People will knee-jerk downvote it because they won't even try to understand the logic behind it. This is human nature 101.

These are facts of human nature that have been backed up by scientific experiments and trials.

Obviously threads get exploited (albeit rarely) for commercial purposes, but so does everything else in this world.

I'll disagree with rarely based on purely anecdotal evidence, because most of the AMAs I see mention the latest movie/project/charity that the famous person supports and that benefits someone. I don't really have a problem with that, but everyone should be allowed to do the same. (I'm still kind of pissed that the OAG girl was denied an AMA a couple of years ago.)

I'm curious about #9 since I found this post via /r/all. Not the front page of course but it's not like I had to do anything but browse /r/all.

The links I'm suspicious of are those persistent posts that follow you through pages and pages of /r/all. I wonder if they would still follow you after you click on them once. Hmmm, that would be very easy to script...

| I'm curious about #9 since I found this post via /r/all.

| Not the front page of course but it's not like I had to

| do anything but browse /r/all.

Same. For many months now, it seems like at least a few times a week something from /r/conspiracy about reddit censorship or reddit mod conspiracies makes the first page on /r/all. As long as reddit itself remains the venue of choice for those discussing censorship on reddit, I find it hard to take such complaints very seriously.

The first page of r/all is NOT the reddit front page. And a large majority of users will never leave the reddit front page.

I have seen r/conspiracy posts reach the 2nd page of the reddit front page (extremely rare), but never the 1st.

/r/conspiracy is not a default subreddit so no, you have not seen links on the front page or the second page. That would only happen if you are logged in to an account subbed to that subreddit. If you're complaining about it not being a default and it is being buried, that is a whole different argument because you could make the argument that any non-default sub is being buried.

What you are saying is incorrect. Default subreddit are not the only ones allowed to make the front page, unless reddit recently changed that system as well.

EDIT: You could be correct actually. But I don't believe it has always been this way. Maybe it has something to do with point #9 and the fact that different subs are now given different algorithms.

It has worked the same way for as long as I have visited reddit, but I rarely visit while logged out and it could have changed. Default subs show up on the front page, this is why you can make an account and pick your subreddits that you want to see on your front page. That was always the point of the default subs unless I am mistaken. Non-default subs will only show on All.

If someone can provide a link proving me wrong, feel free, but from my understanding, it makes sense that non-default subs are not shown on the front page, otherwise what would the point of All even be? I just opened reddit while not logged in and all of the posts for the first few pages were from the defaults, so that small test seems to indicate this is the case.

The front page is not only for default subreddit, it is for any posts from any subreddit that reach a certain score within a certain amount of time. That is why obscure subreddits like r/twitchplayspokemon were hitting the front page when that concept went viral and the userbase was large enough.

One of the biggest problems is that it has now been proven that not all subreddits are created equal because reddit admins have essentially started rigging certain subreddit to more easily reach the front page and others to have a handicap in reaching it.

go to the front page of reddit right now and take a screenshot showing:

1. you are not logged on
2. you are on the front page (reddit.com)
3. a non-default subreddit is shown

here is the list of defaults as of march 8th:

• /r/announcements
• /r/Art
• /r/AskReddit
• /r/askscience
• /r/aww
• /r/blog
• /r/books
• /r/creepy
• /r/dataisbeautiful
• /r/DIY
• /r/Documentaries
• /r/EarthPorn
• /r/explainlikeimfive
• /r/Fitness
• /r/food
• /r/funny
• /r/Futurology
• /r/gadgets
• /r/gaming
• /r/GetMotivated
• /r/gifs
• /r/history
• /r/IAmA
• /r/InternetIsBeautiful
• /r/Jokes
• /r/LifeProTips
• /r/listentothis
• /r/mildlyinteresting
• /r/movies
• /r/Music
• /r/news
• /r/nosleep
• /r/nottheonion
• /r/OldSchoolCool
• /r/personalfinance
• /r/philosophy
• /r/photoshopbattles
• /r/pics
• /r/science
• /r/Showerthoughts
• /r/space
• /r/sports
• /r/television
• /r/tifu
• /r/todayilearned
• /r/TwoXChromosomes
• /r/UpliftingNews
• /r/videos
• /r/worldnews
• /r/WritingPrompts

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It doesn't happen all the time, but "default" subs do reach the front page. Or at least they did up until recently (the last year).

I will keep this post in mind and I will send you a screenshot when it happens. Or maybe they changed it. I guess we will see.

The TPP posts were all over /r/gaming as well. I don't visit the main front page enough to dispute you fully, but I would imagine that crossposting to the larger subs is why stuff like that can surface. I followed TPP closely and don't recall any front page posts from that specific subreddit, but is it also not possible they whitelisted that sub temporarily to allow it on the front page and gain some traffic? I have no idea if they can even do that, but I think that would be a much more reasonable explanation if possible.

I'd really like to see if it is actually happening, but I can't say I have ever seen a non-default on the main front page. Unless you can show proof, it is entirely premature for you to say it was proven.

Indeed, which is why I said "first page of r/all" instead of "front page of reddit." You don't have to log in to see the first page of /r/all, though, and threads like this making it there is does not seem to be an even slightly rare occurrence.

And that is why nobody ever said that r/conspiracy could not make the front page of r/all.

But........ you did.....

"As we have learned at r/conspiracy, if they don't like our sub, then we are banished from the front page, forever. "

"the front page"

That usually implies an unsigned in, reddit.com

R/all is actually something different.

in response to number 4, yes, yes i do. and reckless isnt the right word, it's more accurate to say "you really think they would lack the self-awareness and foresight?"

source: my service + the service of friends and family members

edit: when the president got asked questions during his ama it was done by shill accounts, so...

[deleted]

His post is essential because it gives everyone who hates this subreddit something to upvote. And yes, people are literally that petty.

"Hey look, this guy is calling the OP out! Lets all upvote him. Hahaha, that'll teach those conspiracy retards!!!"

Its sad but true. I am sure many of the upvoters are simply skimming the words and pressing the up arrow.

Everything in that post is pretty much BS.

[deleted]

you're new to this planet i presume

Looking at their history/ comments they have 3k comment karma but you can't see any comments that would account for it. edit: not saying they have fake upvotes just that its odd that deleted comments even count.

Good catch, that is a super weird comment history.

Deleted comments count.

I delete my comments once in a while because I don't like having a long visible trail of posts going back a few years.

Still have my upvotes.

Actually, the admins stated they were removing it partly due to confusion.

Not totally disagreeing with you,but just because something is not in the app side source code doesn't mean it can't happen. Plenty of data crunching occurs server-side or even at the DB level that isn't found in the app source code. At least in every app I've worked with.

Yes censorship does happen there, I agree with that, but it's rare for threads to get removed for illegitimate reasons. I frequent /r/undelete[3] , and at least 80% of threads are deleted for legitimate reasons.

What is a legitimate reason? (Honestly asking)

[deleted]

The length of existence of an account is completely irrelevant, obviously. Do you think I was born 1 month ago? Do you think I have never been to reddit before the start of those 30 days? In this community its almost a necessity to create new accounts because of people like you who go into other's profiles looking for something to criticize.

No more r/circlejerk, that pesky subreddit hits too close to home

this is the only part of that post that I didn't get. /r/circlejerk is just a meta jerk where they repeat whatever memes are popular on that particular sub. I never see anything that questions the politics or perspective of the hive. They mostly just talk about how comcast is a bunch of nazis.

For instance, you mention that we get a lot of military propaganda- pictures with soldiers and dogs. You'll never see anything like that on r/circlejerk.

Infact, they spend a lot of time mocking 9/11 Truth, which hasn't been popular on reddit in about 5 years- other than in this sub.

I can remember when circlejerk used to regularly get it right. For every viral 10 posts that were joking nonsense, maybe 3 of them would hit the nail on the head and correctly satirize whatever current circlejerk reddit was on.

Now almost every major sub has become a circlejerk and a post that points it out will never go viral and to the front page.

But I see your point and I really believe that there was a moment when r/circlejerk went from a bunch of free-wheeling jokers to what it is now. It was taken over. Probably around the time that the Ron-Paul-jerk started, during the election.

If you click on the video I linked, it is insane to believe that this coordinated media campaign was happening simultaneously with the Ron-Paul-jerk on reddit. And I am not Ron Paul fan and never was, though I am not against him or anything. And I get that reddit really was circlejerking over him at the time, but there was a definitely a point where it suddenly went from a joke to a coordinated campaign.

Like or dislike him Ron Paul was a non corporate candidate, hence his marginalization.

Fed Fed Fed Fed Fed Fed Fed Fed Fed Fed.

The anti-paul brigade were what brought down digg, as far as I understand. Though that history seems to have been re-written to make it look like the Ron Paul supporters were in fact the digg patriots bury brigade.

Super users also greatly contributed to Digg's death. The top hundred accounts had massive amounts of followers and controlled the content that became popular using the "share" megaphone which broadcasted submissions to their followers.

MRBABYMAN

https://youtu.be/PhLoghrZ9vE

Lmao, I forgot about him. Dudes like him were cancer for Digg.

/r/circlejerk has never gotten anything right. we're still a bunch of "free-wheeling jokers". nothing about /r/circlejerk should ever, ever, ever be taken seriously. it was never taken over. all the top mods are still there. it's like it's literally ... a circlejerk.

I wasn't here before they changed the voting. I wondered as soon as I saw it who was responsible and why they didn't show us upvotes and downvotes so we'd know. It seemed so silly and it still does.

The military base activity is terrifying and we Americans should be able to sue our government for engaging in this behavior, if not prosecute criminally. If enough Americans had any sense, we would do so at once. I apologize to the rest of the world, we're mainly media celebrity gobbling idiots. But hey, did you hear something or other about that whatsits chick who got famous for two seconds for taking off her clothes in an Ohio mall?

I wouldn't compare reddit to foxnews. At least not just yet. But I suppose in a way it could become worse. What's worse than censorship? Highly skilled manipulation of perception so that people don't even say what the powers that be feel should be censored to begin with. It isn't just Reddit, though. Not by a long shot. Been seeing this stuff online for over a decade now. Everything from silly advertising to dead serious political stuff. Complete with personal attacks on everyone who doesn't toe the line.

Thanks for confirming something I've seen other sites do and wondered if this one did: Disappearing posts but letting the writer of the post still see it as though it's actually there.

That is dirty. Really dirty.

it just goes to show this place is a business

Makes me wonder why more independent sites similar in layout to Reddit and other forums (Huffpo and Democratic Underground, for example) don't seem to get anywhere. The biggest sites for politics have all pissed me off one way or another. But there are no viable alternatives.

thats the problem. any good alternative quickly gets the Reddit treatment, like hell anyone with money to lose is going to ignore a +150 million user site. and like facebook, it's "too big to fail". i hate facebook, but i wouldn't know anything about half of my social circle without it. and same here. how am i suppose to find a social group for all of my interests? for example Cities:Skylines. +60k users in two weeks. that's a resource i can't ignore. no way the Steam or Paradoxplaza forums can compete with the layout of Reddit.

i find myself just unsubscribing from anything that is on the default list and isn't a direct hobby, like r/fishing or r/paradoxplaza

I do avoid the disease that is FB. I quit Huffpo because they wanted people to register on FB. With a phone number, no less. The day Reddit does that, I'm gone.

same exact thought jemora. I loved huffpo and when the shit hit the fan and all of those volunteers were let go and Ms. Huff made all of those millions and AOL became..........well.........I'm getting riled.......

tl;dr: same exact opinion.

Reddit wont do that because almost literally all of their users will leave. No one likes that shit, especially here.

Hiding the upvote/downvote counts is a measure against vote manipulation, and the resistance to it was mis-timed.

Waaay back when...

1. Reddit had an API for querying exact up/down counts
2. Reddit start using a "fake" vote system, where up or down votes would be added via an algorithm. This was an attempt to balance out vote spamming: silent upvotes were added to comments that were brigaded, and silent downvotes were added to comments that were getting spammed up.*
3. Reddit Enhancement Suite started using the API to add the counts to the UI. But, those counts were not always accurate: If the fake vote system had touched a comment, then RES would not be able to get the "true" tally of which votes were placed by users.
4. Reddit removed the API, since it was giving misleading information.

*Admins claimed that even while the vote counts for a given comment were silently adjusted, the overall total of (up count) - (down count) was still true. I fail to see how that's possible, but that might just be misunderstanding on my part.

At no point did Reddit itself ever display up/down counts. At no point was anyone able to see true up/down counts. The upsetting part should not be that they shut down the API, it should be the obfuscation around the votes in the first place.

OP has a lot of good points, but there is always misunderstanding around the vote count issue.

Why would you sue a government because its employees are browsing reddit?

They're not just browsing. They're posting in an attempt at perception management. It's not new. The term comes from the US military itself, though private companies use it now, too.

"US Military Admits Spending Millions to Study Manipulation of Social Media"

http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2014/07/pentagon-admits-spending-millions-study-manipulate-social-media-users.html

They need to be in jail for doing this. It's a direct threat to freedom of speech, association, and our ability to participate in a democratic society in a meaningful way through exchanges of ideas online as well as face to face (haha as though we ever had a democratic society to participate meaningfully in! But this sort of thing is meant to ensure we never will.)

They aren't just browsing reddit. They are manipulating discourse with shill accounts.

Would you be able to please provide some bit of evidence that supports this?

Here is one article from msm

http://www.cnn.com/2014/04/18/world/jihadist-twitter-state-department-trolls-terrorists/index.html

Reading this makes me want to quit this site. It was fun while it lasted. I will also be deleting my alien blue app

Reading this made me finally register on voat.

I just did too.

Reading this made me finally try pizza. It is great.

Follow me to Voat. I'm new there, but I feel like it has potential. Its aesthetics put Reddit's ugly ass to shame.

Isn't this exactly what some Snowden documents have showed? Atleast that the NSA work for manufacturing consent on the web?

Also: Whats the alternative? Is anybody gonna start using Voat immediately? How do we protect and give space to the open voices on the net, if all that happens when users change space is that space subsequently being invaded?

Ps. You opened my eyes man, i remember the more open times too but but i cant put a finger on WHEN it became like this, i guess thats the danger. Now that you explained it i understand whats new/weird about the voting system, i had noticed but couldn't put my finger on it

I will be using voat now for sure.

I'll use Voat if there's a mobile Android app made for it that is comparable to Reddit News Pro

Just use the web browser and favorites?

App is more fluid man. It's just not the same with the browser.

We need to have a site-wide campaign to have EVERYONE sort by NEW.

Then everyone will SEE the suspicious bullshit that i always point out...

Like 2 hours into a post with a guy in uniform getting licked by his dog that i can reverse image search in seconds and find from a news article two years ago somehow has 2000 upvotes and 120 comments.. mhm... if everyone was on /r/new everyone would see that things arn't right.

We also need to change reddit to force people into the comment section when they open a link...i don't know but it would help if the comment section was somehow forced on people lol. A big problem is just the sheer number of lurkers.

Hell no, have you been to /r/new?

Why does it tell me this subreddit is banned?

You know, when I first discovered reddit, it was like the Wild West of the Internet, but I mean that in the best possible way. Content was user determined, shills were few and far between, and you could tell when someone actually disagreed with your statements.

Over the past few years, I have seen things take a tragic change, I can no longer depend on r/news and R/worldnews to deliver real news, and this sub to an extent has even changed.

Is there another "reddit" circa 2011, out there? If so, point me in that direction and I will leave this site forever.

Is there another "reddit" circa 2011, out there?

There isn't and there never will be. It's not in the cards. Just like there will never be another Facebook.

Why? The same reason that giant banks are still around. Too big to fail. New sites will be ignored. If they somehow gain traction, they will be bought out or spammed/DDoS'd/litigated in to nonexistence. Reddit has become a media/marketing oasis, a mecca.

circa 2011? no. Circa 2006? yes. voat.co

I generally agree with OP, I'd just like to point out that the common factor behind all of the listed changes is control over how politics is discussed on reddit. The admins decided that they didn't want anything truly controversial on the front page, and they made changes to make that (mostly) happen.

If you want to don a thin layer of tin foil, I suspect that certain organizations desire to curtail reddit's crowdsourcing abilities - such as when we helped to stop SOPA.

control over how politics is discussed on reddit.

Very much so.

deserves to be stickied

Sounds eerily similar to the situation thay forced the ol' Digg migration... Corporate interests ruin anything and everything with a grain of salt to its name.

There was a Digg migration because Kevin Rose is a fucking idiot and let Digg turn into Mrbabyman.com with a bias toward pro Disney, anti alcohol retardation.

Did any of you see that "Steve Buscemi" AMA the other day? Photoshopped picture bullshit. No one said anything about it not a single mention despite the complete similarities to the Morgan Freeman 'shop. That was my last straw, I am just waiting for something else and parking here but I have no more doubts Reddit is fucked.

Edit, I went back because I still can't believe no one said anything. pages and pages and I FOUND ONE!!! 1 person and they were at -1

Maybe it's possible the camera reversed his text and the mirror corrected it?

It looks to me like a post-it note on the mirror behind him. The post-it note is covering the part of the mirror that would be reflecting his hands and phone into the camera.

Ya that's what I thought!

what took the picture then.

His hands are positioned to take the picture and the camera or phone is hidden by the note.

The camera is where his hands are. the note is photoshopped in. there is no note. look how different the data is in this

http://fotoforensics.com/analysis.php?id=295ac381247fef63cb890bcd8be0bcc1156c5ae8.25415

I wonder who it was then, and what purpose they would have pretending to be Buscemi.

probably a marketing agent or something. The purpose is to drum up interest for a documentary most people didn't know about.

I don't understand what it's showing. I'm not familiar with this kind of thing.

There's a bit of information but essentially this image was resaved at least once with 25% of the data being lost. This isn't like save from the internet to my computer. This is open in an editing program and save it after changing things. The ELA data is a little harder to determine but most puctires will have a uniform look throughout the picture but you can see the note is a different color blue than any of the other blues AND if it was really there it would actually be a bit brighter as well as more uniform.

you just taught me something, kudos.

Welcome back!

https://voat.co

thanks. ive been wondering where to go when I leave reddit

interesting writeup. i dont agree with every point but the comments about ama are spot on. let's not forget about master shill accounts like hmlee and others that exist to support agendas.

i think manufactured consent should be a required book in high school curriculums. imagine what kind of society we'd be...

Like pnewell ?

what was the story with hmlee?

(3) And people wonder why I HATE AMAs so much..........

Amazing post.

Well said.

Removing the vote-counter was the "last straw" for me. Before that I was able to shrug off the propaganda subreddits and admins blatantly facilitating PR interests(obviously for profit).

But such a malicious injury the users as intentionally obscuring the votes was what ended any benefit of the doubt I could possibly give the pieces of shit who run this site.

The scary part about this all is every single person (when you type "how reddit was destroyed" in the search bar) absolutely ignores the severity of all of this and just make jokes. It's really bizarre. Not one of them tries to have an intelligent discussion but instead just mocks... So sad.

I'd like to help but I just don't know how.

I know what you mean.

If you have a look at the Wiki page for the second most addicted city, it's the home of several major corporations including McDonalds, but the one most interesting here is Reed Elsevier, who is described in this (pdf) report from the US Senate titled "A Review of the Data Broker Industry: Collection, Use, and Sale of Consumer Data for Marketing Purposes" as one of five "well-established targeted marketing companies" that were investigated for the report. According to the same report, Reed Elsevier collects, uses, and sells data on millions of consumers.

I was hoping someone noticed this. Not only that, it is a town of less than 8,000 people with a median home value of $837,000 and a median family income of $155,000.

Wow. This is spot on...

The first thing they did was create sub-reddits... reddit without censorship or subreddits is a really neat tool.

The thing is... there is an uncensored version of reddit... but it is not for you. They can do math to see how fast an article accelerates before they remove it, or +4k it. And, they keep it for themselves.

Don't vote.

Reddit is controlled by the media to show what it wants to show, to monopolise content, to manipulate content, to push an agenda (feminism is the biggest one so far). Yep, its all going to shit.

First off, I'm sorry for replying to this post even though it's 3 days old. I know it's a massive Reddit Faux Pas.

But I just need to say that... Reading this made me physically ill. I have been a redditor for just over 3 years now, and didn't have the faintest clue that any of this was going on. Thank you /u/shark_shank.

For opening my eyes to the horrors that this site has become.

I think I'll wait a few months, wait for Voat to get a few more users before I consider switching over there.

So what would some similar sites be that remain, at least for now, more respectable?

The theoretical science sites still seem legit. In general, it appears that the more obscure and unrelated to politics a sub is, the more honest its operation and mods.

Whenever I read something like this, I get a feeling of utter helplessness. What can we do!?

I'm leaving this site.

Reddit is nothing more than 9gag for me now.

Well done. Thanks for all this.

Fuck, im Palestinian but i've never visited Palestine. When i read this my eyes teared up. Amazing post.

4) The appearance of shills soon became VERY apparent.

Everyone should be aware of these techniques to spot a shill/spy:

http://pastebin.com/irj4Fyd5

Reddit became mainstream, and then corporatiz'd.

I'll connect with a throwaway just to give you an upvote. Not really useful but hey.

My main account was banned over an issue with JIDF. I don't really remember the exact topic, it concerned Israel though. Now i'm not really antisemitic : half my family has disappeared for being jew in WW2 (am french), a stepsister has married a jew (and became herself jew), plus for 10 years now I study geopolitics and macroeconomics as a hobby (because why the fuck not, it's like game of throne in the real world). So we had a discussion, obligatory JIDF shills appear, so fucking obvious we were like 10 to call them out. Then we see they open a r/conspiracy topic linking to our discussion so we also call them out here. Wrong move fuckers.

I lost my 3 year old account that day. I was banned from several subreddit, including r/conspiracy, and little by little it went from banning to doxing. Deleted everything in a hurry. Of course reddit staff was contacted, but you know? I was the bad guy, because I'm a fucking antisemitic conspiracy tard.

Reddit is dead indeed. Went from "4chan with clever discussion" to "witch hunt and marketing tool". Move on, it's over.

incredible find about Eglin Air Force Base being reddit's most addicted city! screams cointelpro-esque tactics

Especially since Reddit is blocked on govt computers.

CIA now runs reddit through popular subs. Mockingbird still widely in effect. Classic CIA We need to digg this site

6) Speaking of voting, they changed that too.

We now have an entirely new way to view upvote/downvote scores. A user used to be able to see their score. But now, everything is fuzzed. For example, if you made a semi-controversial comment before, but many people agreed, you may have a score like (47/45), leaving you with a -2 next to the comment. Now you just get a -2 and nobody knows if anyone agreed with you.

I hate this change so, so much. Whoever did this... fuck them.

I only arrived here a year ago this month so I dont really know how it used to be. I am very worried about the power Reddit has over its audience's beliefs. /r/WorldNews is just a massive CNN/BBC hivemind where Russia is the greatest evil in the world that should be nuked and the US/NATO is God's own little indestructible angel army. Most /r/Wrldnews mongoloids seriously think that the US homeland would be completely safe in a NATO+US/Rus war. I live in Europe and if a war does break out Europe will take the brunt of it and I swear to God i'll fly over to America and start ripping dumb yanks a new one.

If anyone cares about Karma they should just bow down to Dear Leader Obama and support more 'peacekeeping'. I've pretty much left the Reddit Brainwashing Machine for Youtube and UK/EU news sites.

R/worldnews and r/news used to be great. I joined in 2012, lurked for 2 years prior.

whyd u eat my cake lol jk

lol tahts such a good description of worldnews, literally word for word, i cant stand the fuckers there

"Feel good" military posts started appearing, like a soldier coming home to his dog.

I've been saying this for years now.

Hit the nail on the head with the voting one. That's exactly the point -- peer pressure/perpetuating herd mentality.

They even shame this type of post over in /r/theory of reddit which is mostly filled with fluff stuff that everyone already knows.

Actually, reddit will be destroyed by the publication of an NNTP-like protocol in an RFC that implements every feature of reddit in a decentralised uncontrollable way.

Dude, this post is fucking bad ass! You are a hero sir!

Very interesting read, quality post.

Just yesterday I asked myself: WTF happened to reddit? Seems like only the FBI, NSA and CIA is talking here nowadays. One voice. Where are this crazy & individuall minds and rich talks? Nothing critical/real anymore. Just opinions I saw on Fox News and the German 'Bild' magazin already. This sucks.

Thanks, Dad.

I really despise shadow banning, why shouldn't I know that I was banned? Unless there is a sadistic nerd somewhere getting pleasure out of people not being informed? It's the most childish thing about reddit. FFS just tell people.

Because a troll will just make a new account if he's banned. With a shadowban they don't know it.

He/she'll find out eventually. So what is the difference? A day or two???

You should really include these examples. Like they are really good examples. Like they are some of the best examples you can find anywhere.

https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/2zx7gm/well_i_have_been_banned_from_rpolitics_for/

https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/2v7kx3/guy_exposed_a_cabal_of_users_taking_over_reddit/

https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/2kq1sm/thought_police_gone_wild_100_posters_in_rhistory/

https://www.reddit.com/r/undelete/comments/22yewf/i_have_identified_a_list_of_keywords_that_are/cgsmqw1

Lets make MetaFilter popular again.

What's the solution to shill accounts? Obviously companies and such are going to promote themselves on social media, so how do you prevent that?

Preventing it is definitely an uphill battle and it will only become more sophisticated as one tries to prevent it. But like anything in life, it is worth it to slow down and deter the problem, even if it will inevitably come back.

I think an even bigger issue is why we are doing NOTHING to prevent it while actively making it easier for them to manipulate the site. This website seems to be great at destroying checks and balances instead of evolving them.

i dont understand what is so wrong with having a flare that says you're officially representing someone or thing. it is awesome in gaming subreddits, great to see developer interaction. of course, the only one who stands to lose is that division of corporate who want anonymity and shadow influence. that fact that subreddit communities can't do this (make community generated flairs for 'shills' or otherwise detracting accounts) just shows me how reddit is just Reddit^TM

Thats a good point, there are probably plenty of people who would love to be able to talk with mainstream representatives of various products or companies.

It is just one more example of corporate sneak-ery shooting itself in the foot. An obvious side-effect of greed.

yea i mean theres nothing wrong with someone trying to represent something, but its wrong when they try to prevent the average person for voicing his/her opinion or having a fair say in something

What's the solution to shill accounts?

Critical thinking. That is the only solution unless you want to register with a state ID.

Does anyone have any ideas about what we can do? Also, I am amateur web programmer but I'm thinking that it might be good to make a website that tracks certain things on reddit, or allows people to put un-delete stuff there rather than on reddit... But I'm not sure if I'd get in trouble for hosting reddit comments on my site.. Any input?

Wow you put a lot of time into that!

I remember as the upcoming election loomed, all of a sudden, r/circlejerk (one of the old default subreddits) became completely obsessed with bashing Ron Paul.

I remember the election cycle before this, where Ron Paul was reddits darling. It might have even gone a little overboard IMO but at least it was honest.

Also on that same note, in the years following 9/11 there was plenty of open-mindedness on differing theories of what really happened, was or wasn't it a conspiracy, and so on. Try that now on reddit and you will be ignored, mass downvoted, or ridiculed.

This is fantastic.

Any thing anti-American which is factual gets always voted down these days.

'REAL' that's the word. I've been watching as quietly as I can, for 9 years now. This about sums it up.

Some of my favorite puff piece propaganda comes from Europe. The once a month front page posts idolizing the queen. Some silly photo of the queen with her in all her glory pops up once a month on the front page. I always scratched my head as to "why" and made an off the cuff remark about her and was banned from the sub. It wasn't even that bad.

While I believe much of the influence is geared towards monetary gain as opposed to government control, there are some posts that come along that leave me scratching my head. The creepy utah daycare being one of those posts.

I don't believe everything is a conspiracy, but I do believe reddit has become riddled with agendas and is sensoring like crazy. Be it government, corporate, or mod with an agenda, I will probably never know. I bet if Snowden tried to use reddit to expose the NSA he would be promptly banned before anyone could read it. He's only allowed to post now because the cat is already out of the bag.

If anyone tried to pitch the same propaganda here in Europe people would be laughing their heads off. It's definitely tailored to the US

I have felt this way for some time now. I have noticed almost everything you have said. I don't have an alternative so I read it all with a heavy dose of skepticism.

Best Reddit post ever.

I hate the military circlejerk on reddit.

The masses are powerless in a place where the masses are supposed to have all the power. Sound familiar?

I first noticed that this kind of activity was going on on reddit when /r/science started banning "climate deniers". No legitimate criticism of any study or conclusion derived therefrom was allowed that disagreed with reddit's position on global warming. It could have been the worst, most contrived, error ridden study in existence, but oh well you're banned!

Reddit is a huge propaganda tool now. It is cool for some niche things, but I hate supporting the site knowing what it is becoming despite the cool subreddits and threads you can find here.

I've only been on Reddit for a year and a half, and I see all these things. To me, its just what happens when a website starts to profit. They realize they wont be around forever and have to bleed out every cent they can get. So whoever "donates" the most cash, controls what people get to see. Just like ever "news" channel on TV.

So where can we find a site that isn't bullshit anymore?

Is there any better alternative than this awful echo chamber? Where could the more alert and inquisitive of us go to discuss news and actively seek to uncover bullshit? Reddit is a hive, a swarm in every subreddit. Even this one.

First they came for the conspiracists...

Ha Victoria is here..because I can't read.

So where do we go next? Back to digg? fark? usenet?

It sounds like there is an opportunity for some alternative to rise up & claim the space that reddit inhabited a long time ago.

Here here!

www.voat.co

Yup

Do we have better reddit alternative ?

Going to be featuring this article on my site. This is truth all over it.

What's the alternative?

I moved to Reddit because my other forum subtlety guided non-mainstream ideas out of the politics/news discussion areas. Looks like Reddit has had the same operation done here.

I think reddit is still useful if you unsub all defaults and sub stuff like /r/conspiracy. Reddit is still extremely valuable for me to decipher the truth from the lies. Sure, we aren't reaching people who aren't already sympathetic to the cause but it is still very useful for those who are.

Thank you for this. Just had a terrible experience on Imgur yesterday that really unsettled me and had the feeling I was talking to propagandists rather than users. I guess it was to be expected.

Just to clarify, I shared how uncomfortable I was with the glorification of army men sob stories on the front page and how irrational it seemed to me as a Western European. I was expecting retaliation -I'm not new to Imgur or Reddit - but not like that. It's definitely gotten more sinister than last year.

i know that feel, brah. just put it behind you and keep browsing and making funny comments and youll feel better :D

As someone whos been on reddit less than 2 years I can say that even in that time frame I've noticed mind boggling changes for the worse. Defy popular opinion? You're fucked. Not an SJW? You're fucked. Not a political/corporate shill? You're fucked. Speak out about karma whoring or any other karma conspiracy? You're fucked.

Thank you for this, OP. I'm glad I am not the only on who feels this way.

Thats why fuzzing the scores is even worse than the original way....

I'm also sick of the restrictive rules in the news subs. I've gotten shit for too many legitimate posts about timely news. On top of that, I can't tell if 4 or 400 people like my contributions. Frustrating.

Another thing I dont get is comment voting. Some get voted way up and others get voted down and there seems to be no pattern, outside of someone commenting with an unpopular opinion.

In longer threads, I suspect people find something they like and alternate down- and upvotes every other post without even fully reading them.

Here's a perfect example, at the time though this post appeared first. Also, WTF is the logical between alternating up and down votes? That is completely pointless.... http://imgur.com/64lnPlt

. Not an SJW? You're fucked.

lolwut?

Look at the front page. See how often bigoted comments reach the top. Then come back and say there's an "SJW" bias to reddit.

SJWs aren't even real. God damn.

SJW's aren't even real Lol wut. Nigga, you serious?

Time after time I've been acosted and downvoted by SJWs for biggoted, sexist, racist, offensive comments.

You mean you've been told off by decent people because you made shitty comments.

The SJW is a boogeyman made up by bigots so they have something to demonize.

LMAO. Okay, keep telling yourself that. No, I didn't make shitty comments. I made comments that didn't coincide with popular opinion which is what Reddit runs on. Not sure what you mean when bigoted posts make it to the front page either, have yet to see any...

Anything better than reddit available around the Web?...

Hey, man, did you read about the latest r/politics disaster?

A rule change was made and discussion of it was locked...

I have a reasonably short modmail thread where noone tells me why it was locked

do you think r/conspiracy isn't controlled?

I think ALL of reddit is controlled.

everything is controlled even the revolutions

It seems to me this subreddit isn't controlled in the same way the more mainstream subreddits are. I think they reserve disinformation campaigns for r/conspiracy. This combined with the hearty natural dose of nonsense makes navigating here a treacherous affair. It's dangerous mental space if you don't exercise extreme prejudice. But I stop by to check for grains of truth. Your post is a pretty big grain.

In your opinion, is the manufactured consensus more corporate, military, or combination?

I think a combo. But I believe the corporate stuff is small scale and the government stuff is large scale and can have some very serious consequences for our future.

Everyone collectively left Digg and the same needs to happen to Reddit, anyone know where to go next?

I always wondered what happened to digg, it was doing fine when I checked it back in the day.

I just checked OP and I've been shadow banned from /r/news. I commented "interesting" on the top post, did your permalink trick and it's not there. Cool beans.

I havent experienced the issues you have, but you have some good ideas on how to make Reddit completely open. The Admins shoud read and take notice. Also, you should not have been deleted -- consider this post a protest on your behalf.

The New Reddit. . . a corporate advertising vehicle with forum capabilities.

It's funny - I was a part of /r/buyitforlife before it blew up, and there was so much more insight and less group-think. Now, it is becoming overrun with advertisements (covert and overt) for items, and there is shady stuff happening...

I read everything and the first thing that came to mind was Digg. There was so much hate for it in my day and I never once jumped on that bandwagon. Funniest thing was I kept telling myself that Reddit is Digg and that one day, users will abandon it in droves for something better.

I really feel like it's happening.

Testing shadowban.

Please could somebody reply if they see this?

Yeah, you are good.

.

Where does ass go? The outbox? Junk folder?!

Woman's rights isn't a conspiracy. Reddit is a boys club. r/shitredditsays is important.

no it's not. They often take things out of context and take offense to any minor thing. Sometimes people say fucked up shit but a lot of the times, shit on that subreddit is way overblown and people overreact.

Didn't title this PasteBin, but this post has been archived in it's current form for ever: http://pastebin.com/LqEuGxiH

Nice one, was looking at it, does that copy the links too?

No, unfortunately, I didn't get all HTML-ly and do a 'proper' archival.

But I think your post is really one of Reddit's gems. The Forever September thing got me thinking about how online communities are actually not that open... everyone conforms to a preformed netiquette.

We all saw how Edward Snowden was treated when he blew the whistle; shame Reddit has their own secret society of mods.

Good lord, just joined this subreddit and read this.

I have seen a metric fuck ton of censorship here. Mods will regularly delete a comment they don't like (usually criticizing the mods or calling them out on some other censorship) and then put a note saying it was something entirely different. There really very much needs to be a move, this is not the reddit I joined 6 years ago anyway, that reddit has been dead for a while.

Its clear to see the liberal "paid" agenda going on here. I'm not R or D but its clear as day there are thousands of paid posters, automated scripts to socially engineer what is on the front page.

There's nothing liberal about it.

Ripping the throat out of their employers overheads is pretty much the definition of employed liberals.

That has nothing to do with liberalism.

Unemployed liberals liberalism perhaps.

no, the one that is defined as liberalism in the dictionary.

we have different words for different things.

we have different words for different things.

The old Marxist fall back pout.

It doesn't have anything to do with Marxism either. This is basic political theory.

Hmm. I tried voat. Pretty good. Be a lot better if it had an app.

TL;DR Go to 4chan because reddit sucks

4chan can just be a little much for some people or at certain times. Like the unavoidable gore, titties on the front page. It's always in NSFW/L mode.

7ch doesn't suck so much

I think the shadow banning is their biggest weapon against the casual occasional poster.

There are plenty of subreddits that are now covertly controlled. Check out this post which was pushed into r/undelete for identifying a list of keywords banned from r/technology.

Their word filter is now open for anybody to see and criticize(elsewhere...): https://www.reddit.com/r/technology/wiki/automoderator

Eglin Air Force Base = Reddit's most addicted city!

Eglin as one of the largest military bases, thus having one of the largest amount of civilian personal in defense contracting and technical positions, does not surprise me too much that they goof off on the dime of their employers.

But since you are talking about shilling, a legitimate point is that calling out shills in the comments is banned in some subs where you are now supposed to talk to the moderators yourself. Those same moderators say the program is working and shills have been found. But you don't know for sure what is happening, if they were the legit shills, if they were banned, etc...

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Not only Reddit, RT news as well on their youtube and home website ever since the Ukraine affair from last year the number of them rose dramatically.

The shills just like the USA are doing the bidding of Israel. There is no patriotism about it although patriotism might be the catalyst of the bodies involved to get shills in the first place. Interestingly the shills are very very close to uncovering what their bosses are hiding from them. Not to mention the high stress that the shills experience from all the abuse the receive and the paranoia of being found out by the forums. Which as a result many would call quits.

How Reddit Was Destroyed. Now look at all the random subreddits that exist just to mock outside of the box thinking.

YMWTK that Google lists it first.

Why does Reddit allow this subreddit to exist even when it attempts to poke holes in Reddit's continuously strengthening armor against stuff like this?

my guess is that it would completely confirm all of our suspicions about them, and make them look really guilty. for them, it's best to keep this subreddit "somewhere in the back", if you will

use it like me, look at it for a quick 5 minute fix, comment like this one and never EVER look back. what ive said here is important and it will remain that way, ciao

And how exactly is that if you get shadowbanned? Did you even read the post?

what? not sure what ur talking about

You said: what ive said here is important and it will remain that way.

How can you be sure it will remain that way if nobody sees it if it's been banned? Or are you saying it's important to you and that's all that matters? I can't imagine you'd mean the latter because... y'know....why bother posting it then?

listen dude. Everything i say is right. thats all you need to know

Sorry, lady, but no.

Yay I got cited. Good write up, tells the story very clearly. Perhaps some day we actually will reach critical mass

So where do we go now?

Wherever you want! There's plenty of reddit alternatives and even a subreddit for them r/redditalternatives

I don't quite understand what people expect. Maybe they are young?

Reddit is not a non-profit. It's a corporation like anyone else.

this post deserves to be here on reddit http://imgur.com/B9M7Hib infinite votes up for you ps i forgot to mention that youre post should be on r/top

nobody knows if anyone agreed with you.

There's an option in preferences to turn on an indicator of whether your post is controversial.

even though they wanted to remain an anonymous sub

The mods want to be default and have a checkmark that allows them to become non-default any time they want.

Different subs are given different algorithms.

Source?

Just like we were banished from r/bestof, after this amazing comment[10] that was gilden 8X and received over 3000 upvotes. They actually gave that user the boot.

Mods can do anything they want with their sub.

Sad to say but this was bound to happen

I went to subscribe to some of these subreddits then asked myself "am I going to be put on a list?" . After a brief moment I figured what the hell I'm probably on the list now just for going there.

Hum, been having a feeling that something's been wrong with reddit for a few years now. I think you've hit it on the head, I thank you! I'll be looking elsewhere for my internet media, any suggestions? (Not digg of buzzfeed tho :)

P.s that deleted post about Palestine was fucking amaze balls. I got chills just reading it.

This is fucking spot on.

I jumped off the 4chan boat when I saw a spark but I'm staying with reddit until the embers blacken...

If all you say is true, then how does this post exist and what makes it trustworthy? I'm not disagreeing, just shocked to have come across this 2 days after posted. Explains a lot of shit that's happened to me and really turned me off about reddit.

But... but... the frontpage brought me here... where do I go from here? Everything I knew was a lie! What do I do? Where do I go? 4Chan? No. Tumblr? No. Where do I go?

Voat is very similar to reddit and rather new

Wherever you go, there you are!

Truth.

I think your account has been unbanned.

Make sure we save this guys. might not be around too long

I think I'm going to need a sit down. I don't even know if I feel right using this site any more. But I spend half my free time reading on here.

I'm saving this page.

I like a lot of the niche subreddits which is why I still visit daily, but I was thinking about unsubscribing from /r/news, /r/politics, /r/worldnews and pretty much ever other default sub except maybe /r/videos. This post put me over the top. voat.co is where I'll be getting my news from now forward.

Wow.

Amazing thank you ;)

Test comment.

the reason we have rights is so that they can be taken away.

In the world of civil law yes. In natural law nobody can come between the rights you were born with and our creator. And you can bring natural law into civil law if you know who you are.

So what can we do? I'm not being incredulous, but genuinely asking what it is that we can do. I'm glad to find that I'm not the only one who feels this way. I've been a long time lurker on reddit since the very beginning and have witnessed its growth from obscurity, it's fall from grace, and now its homogenized, easily manipulated, hollowed out husk of a current existence. At one time it was a great source of communal education. If we look at our human history we see that each new information technology has its early adopters who use it as almost a sounding board for advancing intellect - a communal mind. We are more intelligent as a group than as individuals. The difficulty is in the fact that as it grows you risk pedestrian over saturation that fosters abuse and draws the attention of those who would control us. Old business models have adapted more readily to internet marketing than we like to admit and I believe that it has occurred so subtly that we have been trained not to see it. Even in the early days of publication, radio, movies, and television there have been those who would use media to manipulate the masses and sell not only a product but a lifestyle of easy persuasion and indifference to government control - corporations and the government have vested interests, shared goals, and are ultimately so reliant on one another as to be one and the same. We have more than reached that point here on the internet, we have found ourselves struggling to keep from drowning in the middle of it. The internet is no longer a disconnected jungle of unbiased information, it is a well collated collection of propaganda. So what do we do? Is the darknet going to be viable? I don't believe that simply cloning reddit is going to be the answer - it could just as easily be an outright deception from the beginning or eventually corrupted in just the same way. It's also hard to get people to adopt a new-but-similar "product" when one that is already established and enormously popular is available. Reddit is a household commodity worldwide now and I believe it is the main mechanism of control being perpetrated against our internet loving generation.

Reddit wasn't destroyed, those subreddits are.

/r/POLITIC

Maybe you did not notice but /r/undelete is on that list of compromised subreddits. That for me makes this post serve as a veiled attack on the people interested in the creep of censorship and one of the key tools driving that discussion.

The "evidence" condemning /r/undelete points to the antics of /u/fritzly and /u/unclesamuel . Both mods of /r/POLITIC ! I hope you can see where this might head should the creative writers continue getting approving nods for this copypasta.

I can't speak for /r/undelete

Anyone who questions the moderation of /r/POLITIC is welcome to join it.

Would you like to be a mod?

I think your open door policy is spot on for /r/politic but not looking to mod there thanks as I avoid US internal politics.

Cool, just be sure to point that out if anyone ever questions the subreddit's motives.

Maybe you could suggest a nice concise way to relate that in the sidebar?

I'm also working on a way to automate this solution for other subs

Also /r/politic is not limited to US internal politics, it's certainly focused on that due to reddit's user base but purely foreign (from my perspective) affairs are more than welcome. Just follow the rules of reddit.

If you have any subreddits you think I'm missing here let me know:

http://www.reddit.com/user/PoliticBot/m/regional

If you want to post Nailin' Palin to the sub, that's fair game, if you want to post off topic porn that's fair game to.

As moderators the most we will ever do is flag posts as nsfw. Either voting works or it doesn't

Note that I'm not encouraging you to post porn, there is plenty of that on reddit; I'm just using extremes to show the (lack of) boundaries.

[deleted]

Because influencing the masses with propaganda has been the job of governments for 1000's of years.

I say we make a new reddit, one that stays a true democracy and isnt run by shills and corperations

Don't forget about other alternatives like http://snapzu.com and http://hubski.com

Also any comments deleted about the cabal is pure censorship and proof of the cabal/r/conspiracy being taken over by shills.

How social good and causes play a part in the Reddit landscape

I knew social justice was popular among the mods...I wasn't aware it was part of how reddit officially advertises itself.

Everybody, back to forums like its the early 2000's!

If you know what's good for you, you'll learn that you don't know what's good for you. -piko

I want to make the next reddit.

Not sure if planned or just the consequence of the young being retards.

I know that my local /r/ is toxic, but it is a reflection of the current local politic so I'm not surprised there...

Perfect for you guys on this sub. Check out /r/cantmeltsteelbeams where we go deeper into the cover ups in America's history.

I don't think there's a conspiracy here...Sure it makes sense to put your rant in /r/conspiracy because there are fewer rules here than the rest of Reddit and the mods are generally great guys. There's a shitload more "democracy" in this subreddit than the rest of the site!

But what I'm saying is, this is just one of the swings of the site...it's going way to the right now and will probably go this way for a couple more years before it swings back the other way. I should know, I was here when it first started...I learned about it from a FARK link for chrissakes, back when Mike Arrington had just started Techcrunch as a blog...do you guys remember when there was a forum on that site? With conversations about startups and great new social media sites. Those were the days!

Reddit used to be this tiny FARK imitation site where you could vote, share and discuss any fucking thing you wanted without moderation, kinda like 4chan, but with a better setup.

I guess some of us are waiting for the next thing, but for right now, we got /r/conspiracy and that's good enough for most of us :)

I've completely checked out of everything but r/NFL, even here there are predominant waves which don't allow opposition. The rest of the site is pretty much a waste now.

smaller subreddits for specific topics are still useful, and I can always find funny pictures. Any site that got this big is doomed to censorship, control and marketing anyway.

Whenever I want proof that some coordinated attack is going on in Reddit, I just go to an Israeli article on worldnews.

Just like the gilded comment u mentioned that was deleted, this particular issue is one that Reddit would really like to be able to control.

[deleted]

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I got a shot of Reddit reality when I found out /r/science was political. Not even peer reviewed scientific papers challenging the human-global warming link are allowed.

It seems like a lot of the attacks on free speech here come from the extreme left. I consider myself green and fairly liberal, but these people are fucking left wing fascists.

I wish there was proof of something dirty for all mods on reddit. That would be disastrous. Let's be real, all mods are dirty in some way. Anybody with 800k+ link karma is definitely suspicious...

Demoralizing as fuck.

So how do we know r/conspiracy could be trusted?

So how do we know we can trust your question?

Hello number 37

Then start something new without the BS.

Hmmm interesting... reads just like the US political scene.

I do totally agree with you about the AMA sub going downhill. You used to get interesting things in there...normal redditors with amazing stories. I hardly ever visit it now.

Your "Fun Fact" should be an item on its own.

There is a constant manipulation to takeover important subreddits, and those "mocking" subreddits are how they do it by gathering support from an ignorant mob.

So if Reddit is too far gone, what's the alternative? Is there even another open source sharing site out there? Maybe something decentralized? Don't be part of the problem, let's be part of the solution.

What we need is an open source reddit clone. Something where anybody can deploy it and fork it to their heart's content, but it will remain transparent. I'm not sure how you would handle the spam issue the other reddit clone faced, but I'm sure the community would be able to devise a way.

I am very skeptical, but this makes fucking sense.

I left digg when it had become an obvious public opinion manipulation tool. I've tolerated reddit, not because it hasn't, but because I don't know of any alternatives just yet. However, there will be some decentralized, merit based, options, eventually. As soon as I identify them, I won't waste my time with this nonsense anymore.

Is it bad that absolutely none of this surprises me?

Reddit was literally always shit, and will literally always be shit.

And you come here, expecting what exactly? I come here for the shit. I am never disappointed.

http://www.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/30jbnq/reddit_ceo_ellen_pao_just_lost_her_16million/

you might find this interesting for point 7

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Elgin Air Force Base at number 1, and Oak Brook, Illinois - basically a small, ritzy suburb of Chicago full of corporate HQ's including that of McDonald's.

The first thing they did was take away r/reddit.com.

It's still there.

The power now resided in individual subreddits, obviously the most popular ones. There was a power grab to become moderators of these subreddits.

I mod two very popular subs, we have say in shit.

3) Once the default subreddits were controlled, drastic changes began to occur.

meh

4) The appearance of shills soon became VERY apparent.

Who gives a damn? honestly?

5) Now we have blatant censorship on r/news, r/worldnews etc... saying that X site is not allowed.

Only reputable sources are allowed, makes sense.

6) Speaking of voting, they changed that too.

This was to dissuade bandwagon voting, a lot of people do it, hell i've done it.

7) Hey guise, us nerds who run reddit have decided to shuffle all of the front-page subreddits, tee-hee we are so random ‿^

Again, who gives a shit.. do you really look at the front page? Don't like a sub? unsubcribe.

8) You are posting too much, please wait...
If you anger the wrong mod

We (mods) Don't have control over how often you may post.
The only thing even remotely close that we could do would be set automod to remove your comments.

9) Reddit is not a meritocracy.

I got this from the front page, because i searched /all.
Again though, why does it matter if things make it to the front page? unless you're looking for the most upvoted posts, then how do you explain james franco everywhere the other day. Unless you seek it out on purpose, you're not going to see them.

10) The arrival and subsequent take over of r/undelete.

If this was some secret reddit conspiracy, why is your source post from 4 months ago still up? Wouldn't the all mighty uber hitler admins just remove it for exposing them?

11) Now we are seeing a new site-wide trend that is designed to make it even harder to call out shills.

This is because when you accuse someone innocent of being a shill, 9/10 they get doxxed. Their post history is scoured through, every thing they've ever posted gets googled to try and find more about this person. It's an invasion of privacy. Granted there should be a reasonable waiver of your privacy on here, but people post things with out thinking sometimes.

12) All of the proper "checks and balances" are now in place.

that DDOS was from reddit users pretending to be detectives. Everyone was coming here from all over. a DDOS can happen from legit traffic too.

13) Online guerrilla tactics.

I'll buy that one. Seems plausible to destroy your competition.
I'd do it if i were in their position.

"this subreddit is archived and no longer accepting submissions." r/reddit.com is essentially just history, that what he meant by taken away. "Only reputable sources are allowed" these "reputable" sources are heavily biased, most likely to what the elites support. "You are posting too much, please wait..." referring to the post limit which would more often than not, lead people to leave the site before posting the two comments they wanted to post. Keep everything controllable *wink "Their post history is scoured through, every thing they've ever posted gets googled " well how the hell else are we supposed to know if what they post is based on endorsing a single topic (different to being relevant to topics). Patterns are looked for, and if right ones (or wrong ones) are found, then it will be known whether they're shills or not.

www.ted.com/talks/eli_pariser_beware_online_filter_bubbles

Amazing post. Thank you. And the fact that people gave you reddit gold shows how so many people are idiotic and will stay that.

Thank you for posting all this.

I appreciate you laying this all out for us to read. Thank you.

I wasn't trying to imply that thy had fake karma I just meant its harder to trust whether or not the account wasn't bought based on having a comment history.

It would seem that algorithms could be written to eliminate a lot of this. You are posting excessive, don't act like a human, etc, you are gone. Take everything with a grain of salt, even Reddit. You want to see the swarm, say something negative about Israel or the F-35 and watch what happens.

8) You are posting too much, please wait... It now doesn't matter if you have confirmed your email, or been posting on this site for years. If you anger the wrong mod/admin or your posts aren't doing "well", then you get benched.

Can someone please explain how this works? How can a mod restrict a post on another sub? Exactly how does this work? I have noticed in the heat of a debate on some subs - just when I was ready to put the dagger in on 4 or 5 self-appointed police - I get the "please wait" message. Usually followed by a ban.

I generally laugh at this subreddit, but I'd be damned if you didn't make some good points here.

[deleted]

I created the bulk of this post before I even knew whoaverse existed.

Maybe even before it did exist.

You came up with a good way to be unobjective and shut off your mind though.

I've been here for about 8 yrs, nearly daily - so I feel uniquely qualified to comment.

If yall are the future of the conspiracy movement, well, it's fucked. Because this is the most weak sauce bubble gum bullshit I've seen in a really long time.

All of a sudden new accounts started popping up out of nowhere. Cue the birth of r/HailCorporate. "Feel good" military posts started appearing, like a soldier coming home to his dog.

This is bullshit hand waving. What's it even suppose to mean? NEW ACCOUNTS STARTED POPPING OUT OF NOWHERE? You're trying to give this the air of mystery. It's been one of the hottest sites on the net for a long long time now.

New accounts have always showed up en mass since the digg migration. It's a social media site, that's exactly what happens. It's not some secret exclusive invite only site with a special hidden url.

Many people create accounts just to share that one story, or ask one question. Just because it's softball or feel good doesn't make it fake. I've made many comments people considered HailCorporate but it was really just that I really really liked that service, the company had been really good to me or something (massive credits to a bill, great customer service, etc).

Once the default subreddits were controlled, drastic changes began to occur.

You listed like one thing, and it wasn't even that drastic. One subr decided to become a lot more organized.

All in all this is a boring ass conspiracy. Over zealous asshole mods have been a thing since IRC. That's basically what you're describing here.

Conspiracy should be embarrassed to have this as a stickied top post.

If anything destroyed reddit it's the money (potential). All good things are ruined by money.

tl;dr - OP is 17 and everything is really really exciting.

prediction : I'll be called out as part of the conspiracy, a liar, and so on. /Conspiracy can't stand when people disagree.

edit : /reddit was taken away because it was a catch all and there was a better place to discuss whatever the topic was.

Still, OP did put forth more actual arguments than what could be read in your post arguing against OP's opinions.

This post was deleted.

I came to this sub for lulz (really) and this post validated everything I hate about reddit. I really do need to leave and never come back.

Hey, I don't know if you remember this post from a few hours ago, but it reached the front page.

So, you know, goodbye forever.

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Thought I'd let you know I was banned from the Reddit Facebook page for linking to this post there.

Does anyone else think mr schwartz may have been murderes?

time to move to/create the next place for us

I would like to see a site that's like Reddit, but that shows who is upvoting and downvoting, and maybe have a limit on votes.

I got banned from /r/worldnews for saying "itt: paid russian commenters" Also, Isentrope is a piece of shit

I know this post is a month old, but if Reddit is so long gone, why don't we make a new reddit? 4chan did it a few times, such as 7chan and 8chan.

https://voat.co/

I actually found out about that a hour before you replied. It's a pretty awesome alternative!

AND IS BANNED

where were you when reddit was kill?

This is powerful work. Thank you.

Reddit = Fascist

Pao =Tianamen Tank Driver after the camera stops.

BTW: "Lots of Money" is all just cash from speculators.

The wealth inequality that is destroying Capitalism has Silver Spoon Inheritance Babies playing with mega-money they don't even understand or respect and these folks are dumping it all into bullshit IPOs and places like Reddit.

The tide that comes in does then go out again. Just a matter of a short while from now.

I saw this post on front page, it was about 1h old. Stated reading it, got distracted, got back to reading the post whereby I accidentally quit this post and reloaded front page. Tried to find my way back to This post but it was a goner. Felt like the whole front page exploded with exceptionally interesting content in just 30 minutes from first reading your submission. Was that all a fluke or just a way for some one to flush you out from front page I wonder?

/u/isentrope is the biggest piece of shit to ever serve as mod

For trying to explain what happened with a particular user's ban? Doesn't seem to take much to be literally Hitler I guess.

Yea, and this is what you said: "We don't allow shill accusations from anyone. We can't tell who is a shill and who isn't, and people are entitled to express their opinions without being impugned in that way. Upvotes are not a reflection of the validity of a claim. We have very little tolerance for new users who break the rules of the subreddit."

I read the rules, I didn't break any by saying "itt: paid russian commenters". Maybe had I said "you are a paid russian shill" to a specific person, you could maybe stretch that into breaking the "personal attack" rule, but since my comment wasn't directed to any individual, that can't be considered a violation of the rules

Do you not see how fucked up it is that you cannot even mention the presence of shill accounts? Especially since everyone knows they exist in huge numbers?

I can't see what your original comment was because you appear to have deleted it. If you'd like to reply to the modmail you are quoting, we can discuss this further (additionally, all other moderators are able to view our conversation thread as well).

No, the mods deleted it.

Mods would still be able to see removed comments. You would, too. If you'd like to discuss this further, please either start a new modmail or reply to the one you have quoted.

Who at reddit allows site-wide shadow banning?

Try voat.co

You might like it.

That's enough Reddit for me, goodbye.

This is so legit is should be a vice article or something. Even gawker. Lol. I know (especially) gawker sucks, but it would reach more people that way.

Good, read and so true. So many of these subs are ran by the shills. Just look at the names. For example https://np.reddit.com/r/steam by several of the real Steam Community Mods with their own agenda of towing the company line, and quickly curtailing discontent, of the service and the products, with stupid rules and bans just as they do in their own real Discussions .

I imagine some other corporate shills run other Reddit subs, but are not as so blatant to use their real names / alias. This is where its hard at places like Reddit or anywhere on the web to decipher who is who and real motive.

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I'm out, bye reddit.

In light of recent events, wow.

There should be a better subreddit for things like this. Like /r/hypotheses

So are we all hanging out here now?

Why the hell did you delete your account?

Oh god... when i was on /r/CrazyIdeas, one of the top voted thing was Delete /r/Conspiracy and watch them go insane trying to find out what happened. At first i thought it was just meant to be a joke, but after seeing this, i'm not so sure.

You raise some good points, but I will have to disagree with you on most of it. You've only been a user for 7 days, not sure where you got your information from but a lot of it is flat out wrong.

1. /r/reddit.com was a very difficult subreddit. Getting to the front was pure random and the topics of discussion were everywhere. There are still plenty of places to hold meta discussions about reddit without having to worry about signal-to-noise.
2. The admins moderated almost nothing to /r/reddit.com, the big moderators always had that responsibility. And the big topics were about how Ron Paul was being ignored in the media, which is why /r/circlejerk made fun of it.
3. The subreddits were always controlled by a small handful of moderators, some of which got jobs working for reddit. And /r/IAMA simply changed. It's a thing that happens to communities when they grow. /r/casualiama is /r/IAMA circa 2010.
4. Shills exist, but the extent that people call out others for being shills is utterly ridiculous. Remember, the vast majority of people on reddit are regular users. Shills have to post things that are already popular with redditors to get any traction. And if they are posting something objectional, that doesn't mean that they're a shill. They may simply have a difference of opinion. There's a reason this subreddit banned usage of the word, see rule 10. OP of this post, /u/shark_shank, is only a 7 day old account, that's enough for people to call him a shill.
5. I see nothing wrong with banning sensationalizing and opinions. There are other subreddits for that. /r/worldnews used to be a cesspool, filled with memes and titles that don't even match the content. I remember an experiment where a headline titled "NSA Listening Devices in Aborigine Huts: Snowden Leaks Reveal" on an unrelated article was the top news story.
6. The scores were always fuzzed. The admins simply got sick of everyone asking why all stories had 66% upvotes so they did away with the old system.
7. A wide variety of view expressed in a wide variety of subreddits. Front page is still the same.
8. Nothing new. This has been a part of reddit for at least 5 years.
9. subreddits only get the boot when the build a reputation for vote manipulation by subtly hinting to users to vote a certain way on a different subreddit.
10. A guy made a tool, turns out they guy was a tool. Nothing to do with reddit itself.
11. Again, a year ago you couldn't post a dissenting opinion in /r/conspiracy or /r/politics without being called a shill. The mods had to stop that because it meant that there was no discussion.
12. "The IQ of a mob is the IQ of its dumbest member halved." -Terry Pratchett. You call it "collective investigation" I call it "mobbing".
13. No evidence, just accusations. Reddit deals with tons of spam each day, only no one except the mods ever see it.

It wasn't always like this. A few years ago, there were just as many disagreements and differences of opinion on reddit, but they were REAL. And the site was still a democracy. People voted and things swung from side to side, everybody learned in the end.

/r/Circlejerk was created because of how one-sided everything was. When I first joined no one would dare say something negative of Ron Paul.

The scores weren't always fuzzed, especially in the single digits. If nobody cared enough about a comment to upvote or downvote you, you knew it for sure.

Not really. Once it hit 5 or so, there was always an automatic downvote and upvote were added. More and more would be added the higher it went. I still don't see how that "destroyed reddit".

Not "destroyed" so much as took a tiny bit of power away from users, but all of these ways in which the power of users on reddit is diminished add up.

How does that take power from users? Things still get upvoted and downvoted based on popularity, the ranks are still the same. Literally the only thing that's changed is the number next to the karma on the top of the comments page, which 99% of reddit ignores anyway.

Just missing a tiny bit of information that we used to have; information is power. As I indicated, by itself it's pretty insignificant.

What information? We used to get a fake number, now we get a real percentage. There's literally no less information in the current system.

Do you really not see a difference between these two comments:

-2 (45/-47) Putin annexed Crimea as a reaction to the destabilization of Ukraine.

-2 Putin annexed Crimea as a reaction to the destabilization of Ukraine.

...................

Do you not see how basic human sociology/psychology would play in role in the average user's decision to upvote or downvote the comment?

Only a very slight difference. Certainly unnoticeable on a site used by millions. First off, if something doesn't get a 75% or greater upvote ratio, it will be ignored. So an example such as 45/-47 will probably never happen as things disappear off of the front page after a few downvotes and few upvotes. Second, most users don't use Reddit Enhancement Suite so they wouldn't even see the downvotes (which again, are inaccurate) unless they are already reading the comment page and specifically looking for it. A very small percentage of users are voting based on number of ups and downs.

So an example such as 45/-47 will probably never happen as things disappear off of the front page after a few downvotes and few upvotes.

We are purely talking about comment scores here. That is the issue.

Then sort by controversial. Those comments were still rare, at the bottom of the page and mostly ignored. And again, those negative scores were all fake and only visible with RES or other 3rd party apps.

Sorting by controversial does not show you HOW controversial a comment in. And the scores were not "fake", they were representative, but now we have nothing.

Ok fine, the old system was a little better for the user. Still not sure why that's such a big deal. Like I said, the vast majority of users voting on comments didn't even see the downvotes because they didn't have RES or any of the Greasemonkey plugins. Even then, the majority of controversial stuff was outright ignored due to being near the bottom of the page.

Heck I don't think I recall ever seeing a single comment that had less than 10 karma but more than 10 downvotes so even if something did hit 45/-47 it's incredibly rare.

But those numbers were fudged to begin with. They were normalized for the express purpose of making it look like the comments were 50-50.

Those numbers were not the exact numbers. They were a representation of the numbers though, and a lot of information could be taken from them.

1. subreddits only get the boot when the build a reputation for vote manipulation by subtly hinting to users to vote a certain way on a different subreddit.

that is simply not true. i have a hard time believing the rest of your post because of this

/r/conspiracy was booted from /r/bestof because of that post. Users from this subreddit swarmed to /r/bestof to vote on stuff to conform more to /r/conspiracy mindset. That's the only time it happened.

so all the gamersgate, anita sarkeesian, the fappening, and anti Ellen Pao subreddits being deleted don't count? what the hell is wrong with you?

• Gamergate: Not sure what you're referring to. There was one thread that was raided by 4chan to repost what was allegedly personal contact information in the comment so all comments were deleted. What other stuff was deleted? /r/gamergate and /r/kotakuinaction are all still very active.
• I've never seen stuff about Feminist Frequency deleted. In fact, there's almost a weekly video on /r/gaming or /r/videos talking about how wrong she is. Never would have even heard of her if not for reddit.
• Seriously? You think it's ok to allow very personal and embarrassing pictures of people (some of which were minors) to be posted on a privately owned website?
• Not up to date on the Pao/Fletcher thing. All I know is that she's involved in some high-profile discrimination case and her husband is under serious investigation. All of this I know from reading reddit, so I'm not sure what, if anything, is being deleted.

Gee, thanks for replying with every mainstream rationale/excuse. I haven't heard those from literally everyone or personally thought of them myself 1000 times.

Also, a good amount of your feedback is just flat-out wrong. I could sit here and make another list that responds to your incorrect corrections, but I have better things to do with my time today.

One final tip: making a new account is very easy, you should try it sometime. It allows you to shake the chains of the point system. So the number of days by my account name has very little to do with how long I have been here. But that should have been obvious by my correct analysis of changes made many years ago on this website.

And yet instead of responding and discussing, you ignore and insult. If you're not going to respond to my exceptions to your original post, or at least point me to someone who has (after all, you've head it a 1000 times), then why did you bother replying?

Turns out I act like an asshole to people that I believe are intentionally wasting my time.

If you really believe the things you posted, then maybe you just don't get it. Not everyone does. There are plenty of things that I don't get, but I do understand reddit and I have been actively watching and examining the decline for years now.

You're right, I don't get it. The more I read your post, the more I found myself disagreeing with it. Instead of downvoting it, I posted a long list of problems with your original post hoping to spark some discussion or perhaps change my view. You stuck your hands in your ears and went "LALALALALA!". I don't get it and I don't get people like you.

Actually, I posted a long list of very good points, along with links.

You put your fingers in your ears and went "LALALALALA!" while reciting every mainstream conclusion that literally takes about 5 seconds of brain-power to come up with.

Then you wrote me those excuses and peppered them with flat out wrong conclusions that can only be based on the fact that you have no clue what you are talking about.

I've seen your points posted many times before. You didn't think much of them either, as they are all pretty much copied and pasted from various threads that hit the front page here like every week. I've never actually had a proper discussion over them as every time I post a rebuttal, someone like you comes in and tells everyone to ignore it.

These are all my own points, I didn't pull them from older threads. I have yet to have a proper discussion about them. Seems people would rather just call me a "shill". That's the right way to end an argument, yeah?

You should stop talking because every comment further proves you don't get it.

I am the author of this list and I came up with the original version almost a year ago. 90% of it was pulled directly from own thoughts and conclusions. I have updated it since then, intentionally, with the help of this subreddit.

Then your narcissism is preventing you from taking any criticism. Seriously, this subreddit is supposed to be about critical thinking and questioning everything, yet every time someone questions the acceptable /r/conspiracy narrative, they are downvoted and the questions are ridiculed with kindergarten level insults.

If you made the list, then either allow it to be questioned/criticized or admit that it has gaping holes that you refuse to fill.

I have to side with OP on this one as an observer it seems like you are more so concerned with "disproving" OP rather than a discussion.

A point to point bullet list of counterpoints isnt the best way imo to have a discussion. Especially when it doesn't seem like you are willing to say " on this number you seem to be on to something".

For me the hiding of the votes (on comments) is when I knew the system that was reddit was being changed behind the scene.

Individual subs should have the power to choose the new or the older system. That site wide implementation made reddit a much worse place. From my standpoint

Just my two cents on you two guys exchange.

I almost agree with you, but obviously SOMEONE is reading this on Reddit still, so it's not quite done. The final nail in the coffin will be when no one reads it at all, because they've moved on to voat.co. It's is still in alpha, but shows it is better managed than Reddit so far.

I'll give you a brilliant example of how much sellouts this site is. For those not informed about GamerGate and what happened at 4chan here is the short version. Gamers uncovered a lot of corruption ultimately leading towards the discovery of a mailing list. Jewt (Formerly moot) head of 4chan sells out and bans any discussion of this. This results in 2 of main boards there leaving. Several other boards have left as well.

Just as his site should lose all views /r/4chan becomes a main subreddit. Yep to save Jewt's site, reddit made 4chan's subreddit a default. Doesn't seem to be working though, Jewt up and quit his site leaving only his shill moderators in charge.

So don't renew your subscription.. I haven't for similar reasons.. reddit is a diluted form of what it was.

This

If this agrees with you... Voat needs you!

13) Online guerrilla tactics.

When reddit changed the voting system and people were on their last nerve with this site, a place called Whoaverse (now https://voat.co/) became popular overnight. It is basically a reddit clone and at the time was run by one guy. He was happy about the surge but mentioned it was going to be hard to keep up with, but was committed to making it happen. Guess what happened next?

Did you guess: “Thousands of targeted spam attacks to overload and destroy the website”? Then congrats, you now understand how far these fucks are willing to go to keep the herd in their pen. Hijacking a cool brand and using it’s facade to conduct propaganda games is extremely profitable, just ask VICE. And once you have the customer, it costs much less to keep them than to acquire new ones. So we are seeing online guerrilla tactics designed to destroy the competition by any means.

You had me until here. voat.co was a joke. It was one butthurt person going "oh yeah, well I'll make my own Reddit new website totally not based on Reddit at all even though it runs the same software and works the same way and looks identical, with blackjack and hookers!" It proceeded to collapse under the weight of the handful of users who actually bothered with it, because lol how do web hosting?

my account (other) was shadow banned for saying fuck and faggot related to reposts from gallowboob. he even messaged me "thanks for evidence" and within minutes that account got shadowbanned. freedom of speech my ass.

I got here from r/all. This either disproves or proves the conspiracy depending on your previously held beliefs.

Was a great read, though makes me wonder if there is such a thing as being too paranoid.

It was a good read until the end. Fox news of the internet, really? When's the last time you've been to r/politics; it's full of Republican bashing.

https://voat.co/ gets my vote.

As many people have pointed out that it takes a lot of money to run such popular servers. I wonder if there's a way to calculate near actual costs each user creates by using such site. I'm not suggesting that users be required to pay but it could bring in more donations if everyone saw how much it costs to make a post, or click on a link.

if you hate it so much why don't you leave?

How this post was downvoted

Someone hasn't been taking their soma. . .

Nothing is perfect. Reddit is still good for many situations.

You cracked the case!!! It was me! In the shower!

Why do my eyes hurt?

I understand the lamenting of something that was better (or had elements that at the very least weren't horrible), but I have a genuine question: why not go elsewhere/start your own site? I feel like this is so obvious that it's probably been asked before and even asking it probably brands me a shill. But I genuinely want to know, if Reddit is so broken, why stay?

Because the reality is that people who were on this site for a long time got used to the idea of having informative and thought-provoking conversations with the masses of the outside world.

If I go create some random website then I will be talking to myself and a handful of people if I am lucky.

Also, many of us are not simply going to sit around while what used to be our favorite website turns into a propaganda filled cancer of the internet.

I just can't. I feel some responsibility to at least attempt to do something about it.

You make some valid points, but completely lose it with some of the more stupid conspiracy theories, like your Boston bomber part.. I realize I'm in /r/conspiracy, but still.

said it before - people make a one hell of an effort to complain about reddit. Make a new website or forum away from this place, off this site. And then put your energy in to that. I'm down to help. But I get the feeling that too many just want to complain rather than do anything about the problem. Prove me wrong reddit users. Again, I'm willing to help anyone who wants to make a new place where we can converse freely. @JakeArsenal1 on Twitter

I'd be down to help in any way I'm capable.

Cool man! I'll look in to making a site and how to do it decently. I'm more on Twitter than here. If you have it, follow me. :) @Jakearsenal1

And yet...this post turned up on the home page with 2k upvotes and hasn't been deleted yet...

No more r/circlejerk, that pesky subreddit hits too close to home.

Oh you''re one of those guys.

God all the circlejerk subs are the fucking pits... they could all be gone tomorrow and nothing of value would be lost.

step 2 is when the jews took over control. Dont believe me? look at who owns this site.

They sent in jidf and then when they realized they couldnt derail the anti israel libertarianism on reddit they moved in to take it over officially. Aaron was the main opposition. The got their buddies to go after him with everything AND the kitchen sink. "SUicided" him so to speak...

Mhmm talk more about how censored you are while this exists at the top of your subreddit. Idiots.

You must be new to the internet.

You sound like a voat.co shill. /s

/u/shark_shank I posted this and violated no rules on /r/technology. Yet this mod removed my post without reason

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While not required, I don't give a fuck fite me m8

I won't sit here and disagree with the majority of these points because several are spot on and backed by hundreds of separate posts across the site with substantial evidence, and as a whole, I agree with the idea that there has been a secretive and conspired attempt to limit content posted on this site.

That being said, a week-old account doesn't exactly establish the credibility of a long-time user who has single-handedly witnessed these changes. Moreover, within the first few points you mention a "conspiracy" to block and defame Ron Paul on /r/circlejerk. Let me make this clear for the umpteenth time: Ron Paul's downfall on this site was a direct result of his batshit insane beliefs, lack of bipartisan support, and extreme supporters, not some inside job to limit his exposure. In that one point alone you've lost most of your credibility to me.

And you lost credibility with me. Ron Paul's downfall was absolutely a smear campaign. Who are you kidding?

[deleted]

well, at least we can still talk about it here. i probably would have no idea of all these things if not for this subreddit!

In all honesty and in all seriousness i want to know why this should matter to me, what did anyone expect from a website that is run by a general public, and how i can look at this in any way as a big deal in the grand scheme of things.

I mean its a website. Is this really anything that actually matters?

Because it gives it closure. If not for this guys damning revelations and expositions of reddit, many people would still think reddit is a genuine place that protects free speech and so forth

Keep going guys, you are hilarious.

Who gives a crap. This is entertainment site. Take what you like and move on.

I was wondering why this thread hadn't been deleted yet... Oh /r/conspiracy fuckin nutjobs...

I'm very sorry, but I think that you guys are taking Reddit way too seriously.

Once again, I'm sorry, but I don;t see the point in caring about censorship on Reddit. It's Reddit. It's whatever. Blah.

You're a whatever blah.

YOU TAKE THAT BACK!!!

not so whatever blah now, are you?

HAS THE US MILITARY TAKEN CONTROL OF REDDIT TO MANIPULATE PUBLIC OPINION TO PRODUCE AN ARTIFICAL FOG IN THEIR COLD WORLD WAR OF TOTALITARIAN WORLD DOMINATION?

Votes don't matter. And complaining about them not counting or being dved is asinine unless your trying to show someone else how asinine it is, in which case, you're stealing my shtick, and I want an upvote for every time ya do.

Whether votes matter or not is not the issue.

The issue is that a comment with a score or 45/-47 will make a person pause before reacting.

A comment with just -47 will invite a person to knee-jerk downvote. See: manufactured consensus.

This is all subconscious and these issues are studied by good and evil alike so as to better manipulate human nature.

by default posts with certain negative score will be removed from view

There are plenty of subreddits that are now covertly controlled. Check out this post which was pushed into r/undelete for identifying a list of keywords banned from r/technology.

Interestingly, that and the ensuring drama actually led to that sub being removed from the defaults by the admins. That filtering was removed immediately and the mods involved were removed. So it's like the opposite of what you claim.

Source: I am a new mod of /r/technology and it's not being covertly or overtly controlled. Things are quite transparent and the mods work hard to make it a better place and stay within the rules.

I've been on Reddit since 10 years, since before it had subreddits or even comments, and I have seen quite a few things come and go. Virtually none of the things you mentioned are some sort of conspiracy and mostly result from a few subs having a few bad mods.

Even if technology is no longer compromised, the reality is that is was. That shows a conscious effort of multiple people to manipulate a large subreddit and that is the definition of conspiracy theory.

If you have been here for 10 years and you do not see a HUGE difference between then and now, then I guess you are not even worth talking to about this issue.

It wasn't compromised, there were simply too few mods to deal with a 5 million sub with constant brigading by bitcoin, Tesla enthusiasts and they set up the auto bot in order to lessen their burden without needing to manually go through each article. It was a genuine but misguided attempt to keep the front page from being 100% bitcoin, Tesla and Snowden. They ended up paying the price for it.

If you have been here for 10 years and you do not see a HUGE difference between then and now, then I guess you are not even worth talking to about this issue.

I have noticed a big difference, but it's more easily explained by big changes in the nature and numbers of the userbase rather than some mod or admin conspiracy. Take a sub with 10k subscribers, add a few million overnight, how could there be not a huge difference even if the mods are the same?

The difference between believing this all happened naturally and believing that a hidden hand orchestrated it comes down to your particular worldview.

I believe that money and power corrupt and that reddit represented both of those things and that people noticed.

You believe that it happened organically as part of human nature and a number of other theories that I also believe in and understand.

I also believe that many of those theories would act as the perfect cover for anyone who did want to come in a manipulate the site on a large-scale level. People are always going to explain things away rationally, it is human nature. If people came in to manipulate the site, they would also understand this.

you guys are fucking retarded lmao

honestly if you care so much about the way reddit used to be, why don't you create your own site and invite people to join it? I'll join. Just don't create some arbitrary rules limiting use of the site like GLOAT did

See point 13.

Is this /u/putin_hates_cats?

Why? Are you looking on behalf of the Admins to shadowban him again?

Just wondering if it's the same author

Fair enough, maybe I ranted out of turn.

You a pathetic loser, wasting space complaining about some evil website opressing muh freeeeoms!

Seriously fuck of sorry excuse of a human being.

by default posts with certain negative score will be removed from view

What would you suggest to do for that 2nd part?

Thats a good point, there are probably plenty of people who would love to be able to talk with mainstream representatives of various products or companies.

It is just one more example of corporate sneak-ery shooting itself in the foot. An obvious side-effect of greed.

How does that take power from users? Things still get upvoted and downvoted based on popularity, the ranks are still the same. Literally the only thing that's changed is the number next to the karma on the top of the comments page, which 99% of reddit ignores anyway.

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Yeah, I mean, obviously we still participate. I just don't get surprised or hurt when something is obviously censored or brigaded - its business as usual TBH. It sucks, but the sooner we accept that McReddit is not ours, is not able to be reverted back to the 'golden age,' and that there exists a large amount of 'official interference,' the better off we can be as the posts here will (hopefully) remain intact.

Maybe you did not notice but /r/undelete is on that list of compromised subreddits. That for me makes this post serve as a veiled attack on the people interested in the creep of censorship and one of the key tools driving that discussion.

The "evidence" condemning /r/undelete points to the antics of /u/fritzly and /u/unclesamuel . Both mods of /r/POLITIC ! I hope you can see where this might head should the creative writers continue getting approving nods for this copypasta.

They're not just browsing. They're posting in an attempt at perception management. It's not new. The term comes from the US military itself, though private companies use it now, too.

"US Military Admits Spending Millions to Study Manipulation of Social Media"

http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2014/07/pentagon-admits-spending-millions-study-manipulate-social-media-users.html

They need to be in jail for doing this. It's a direct threat to freedom of speech, association, and our ability to participate in a democratic society in a meaningful way through exchanges of ideas online as well as face to face (haha as though we ever had a democratic society to participate meaningfully in! But this sort of thing is meant to ensure we never will.)

They aren't just browsing reddit. They are manipulating discourse with shill accounts.

We should go back to Digg.com

Why? Are you looking on behalf of the Admins to shadowban him again?

Just wondering if it's the same author

Looking at their history/ comments they have 3k comment karma but you can't see any comments that would account for it. edit: not saying they have fake upvotes just that its odd that deleted comments even count.

What subreddits would you recommend? Not just conspiracy-related but just news and other kinds of links that aren't controlled?

Reddit got big when Digg screwed up their site.

I just dont like hate speech and get tired of stormfront copypasta

But........ you did.....

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Would you be able to please provide some bit of evidence that supports this?

We're all part of the information warfare machine dude. And it's primarily funded throught private sources. Soon as you guys start railing off about the government(whose explicit purpose is to enable the rich people and the companies within the state) being the problem, you're raging against the wrong machine.

True fact; remember the propaganda post yesterday? iSIS meat grinder. In that article it said that the U.S. Runs propaganda campaigns every day in the Middle East. Like putting out new pamphlets. Said that it speaks to the "softer side" of the conflict.

Then the article says it has used 1 billion dollars on paper pamphlet propaganda. I guess my point is...dis shit cray

One thing to remember is that the agents and shills are really just cheerleaders.. it's the masses of useful idiots who really amplify them.

Ah, this is the best way of putting this.

/r/politics - "WE HATE CONSERVATIVES AND THEY ARE EVIL"

/r/conservative - "Yeah this is a conservative subreddit, but most posts are downvoted anyway"

No more memory eating and painfully slow firefox

Overall I am coming out better than firefox. I tried firefox light, which was the fastest browser I've ever used, but it had some issues like crashing every time you load flash or a webm or a gifv or look at it the wrong way....

This build of Opera is essentially the same as Chrome, but I don't like Google all up in my business so I prefer Opera.

As far as features I miss a few things (like being able to customize my top bar), but I think in the grand scheme of things I'll end up going to vivaldi when a finished version comes out.

I think a combo. But I believe the corporate stuff is small scale and the government stuff is large scale and can have some very serious consequences for our future.

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What's wrong with wikipedia?

Yep

I would like to see a site that's like Reddit, but that shows who is upvoting and downvoting, and maybe have a limit on votes.

Everyone with their eyes open knows /⁣r/⁣netsec is run by NSA sympathizers.

Why do you think this?