To be honest I don't understand the concept of shadow-banning. Just inform the person that they were banned.
What's the point of making someone go through the trouble of several ignored posts/comments until they find out? It just seems like such a fucking stupid concept.
It makes a bit of sense from the perspective of dealing with spam bots, as the bot will theoretically take longer to realize it's banned and therefore switch accounts. In practice, however, any half-decent bot coder would just check whether the bot was shadowbanned from a separate account, so I find shadowbanning to have little to no practical effect in this regard.
Using it against persons who do things deemed against the rules is just petty.
Generally, spam bots are just reported to the admins and/or regular banned. Subreddit shadowbans are really only meant to be used against known persistent spammers and trolls who keep making new accounts, or if there's a reason to believe that they will make new accounts.
I don't think you are. I only see one comment of yours, which was auto removed for some reason (I approved it). I don't actually have access to the automod config anyway, so I honestly couldn't tell you either way. I really just stick with comments.
I don't have mail either at this point, but if you worded it like that ("Why am I auto moderator banned from /r/news"), it comes off as accusative and I wouldn't be surprised if you didn't get a reply.
Look that used to be true. Now being shadow banned is a known thing it's very simple to check if you or some bot you're running is shadow banned or not. Just see if your comment loads without sending the cookie.
He's talking about the relatively new practice of cancerous moderators banning people from ALL of their subreddits...most of the time these people have never even posted in them at all.
It's a concept that was primarily used as an anti-spam measure, since back in the day, bots would make the spam posts (through proxies and typical measures, and they validated their server response). If you just banned the user, they would have instant feedback and start a new army. A silent measure was needed; something that flagged them but pretended the system was operational, meanwhile, the entire effort is going into a black hole. Google pioneered a system along these lines for fake account creations. They would actively allow bots to create mass accounts e-mail, while silently capturing user heuristics, allowing spammers to expend a tonne of energy in what they thought was a successful campaign only to have their entire army wiped over night.
But over the years reddit has come full 180. It's a legitimized spammers heaven (we call it PR now, just make sure you go through the appropriate channels and your product will be front page, complete with a 85% comment circle jerk).
So now it's used on the opposite end, to silence anyone who makes too much noise. It's basically like the patriot act, started for "our safety" but in the end, used against us.
The best part of a shadowban is that you don't even know they killed your account unless someone tells you or you notice your posts go nowhere after posting.
Mods can ban you from submitting / commenting to their subreddit, but they don't have the power to completely ban your account from interacting with the site.
Mods can ban you from submitting / commenting to their subreddit, but they don't have the power to completely ban your account from interacting with the site.
19 comments
10 Footstompshonie 2015-06-17
To be honest I don't understand the concept of shadow-banning. Just inform the person that they were banned.
What's the point of making someone go through the trouble of several ignored posts/comments until they find out? It just seems like such a fucking stupid concept.
7 CelineHagbard 2015-06-17
It makes a bit of sense from the perspective of dealing with spam bots, as the bot will theoretically take longer to realize it's banned and therefore switch accounts. In practice, however, any half-decent bot coder would just check whether the bot was shadowbanned from a separate account, so I find shadowbanning to have little to no practical effect in this regard.
Using it against persons who do things deemed against the rules is just petty.
3 FireandLife 2015-06-17
Generally, spam bots are just reported to the admins and/or regular banned. Subreddit shadowbans are really only meant to be used against known persistent spammers and trolls who keep making new accounts, or if there's a reason to believe that they will make new accounts.
1 Flytape 2015-06-17
Why am I auto moderator banned from /r/news?
I've asked in mod mail before and I'm completely ignored.
1 FireandLife 2015-06-17
I don't think you are. I only see one comment of yours, which was auto removed for some reason (I approved it). I don't actually have access to the automod config anyway, so I honestly couldn't tell you either way. I really just stick with comments.
I don't have mail either at this point, but if you worded it like that ("Why am I auto moderator banned from /r/news"), it comes off as accusative and I wouldn't be surprised if you didn't get a reply.
1 Flytape 2015-06-17
I am definitely automod banned from news.
2 tamrix 2015-06-17
Look that used to be true. Now being shadow banned is a known thing it's very simple to check if you or some bot you're running is shadow banned or not. Just see if your comment loads without sending the cookie.
4 JackassWhisperer 2015-06-17
Then they'll just run off, make a new account and continue doing whatever it was that got them banned.
5 FranktheShank1 2015-06-17
He's talking about the relatively new practice of cancerous moderators banning people from ALL of their subreddits...most of the time these people have never even posted in them at all.
/r/subredditcancer
-2 Digitel 2015-06-17
Don't most of you rotate accounts anyway?
3 joseph177 2015-06-17
It's a concept that was primarily used as an anti-spam measure, since back in the day, bots would make the spam posts (through proxies and typical measures, and they validated their server response). If you just banned the user, they would have instant feedback and start a new army. A silent measure was needed; something that flagged them but pretended the system was operational, meanwhile, the entire effort is going into a black hole. Google pioneered a system along these lines for fake account creations. They would actively allow bots to create mass accounts e-mail, while silently capturing user heuristics, allowing spammers to expend a tonne of energy in what they thought was a successful campaign only to have their entire army wiped over night.
But over the years reddit has come full 180. It's a legitimized spammers heaven (we call it PR now, just make sure you go through the appropriate channels and your product will be front page, complete with a 85% comment circle jerk).
So now it's used on the opposite end, to silence anyone who makes too much noise. It's basically like the patriot act, started for "our safety" but in the end, used against us.
2 Polaris80537 2015-06-17
It's a coward move. It's an example of a moderator that shouldn't have the position because they lack the intestinal fortitude to lead.
3 DronePuppet 2015-06-17
The best part of a shadowban is that you don't even know they killed your account unless someone tells you or you notice your posts go nowhere after posting.
2 MyFavoriteLadies 2015-06-17
I thought only admins could shadowban
5 AssuredlyAThrowAway 2015-06-17
Mods can use automod to silently remove all of your comments and submissions.
In the automod setup wiki it's called "shadowbanning".
3 JackassWhisperer 2015-06-17
Yeah, that's what I thought as well.
Mods can ban you from submitting / commenting to their subreddit, but they don't have the power to completely ban your account from interacting with the site.
1 FranktheShank1 2015-06-17
They can shadowban your comments in their subs. They might even be able to use automod to completely shadowban you from their subs too, not sure.
1 [deleted] 2015-06-17
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2 sincewedidthedo 2015-06-17
Why are you still here, then?
And how dare a privately-owned entity try to turn a profit!
0 [deleted] 2015-06-17
[deleted]
2 sincewedidthedo 2015-06-17
That's not very nice.
3 JackassWhisperer 2015-06-17
Yeah, that's what I thought as well.
Mods can ban you from submitting / commenting to their subreddit, but they don't have the power to completely ban your account from interacting with the site.
5 AssuredlyAThrowAway 2015-06-17
Mods can use automod to silently remove all of your comments and submissions.
In the automod setup wiki it's called "shadowbanning".