I don't understand why anyone pays for cable. It's nothing but trash and commercials. These days there are so many good podcasts that the sheer thought of watching commercialvision gives me a headache.
Dan Carlin
No Agenda
Duncan Trussell Family Hour!
Joe Rogan
Tangentially Speaking
Grimercia
Mysterious Universe
Psychedelic Salon
Radio Lab
Philosophy Bites
Kuntslercast
Stuff you should know
These are just my favorites. I'm not trying to you what to do, I am just sincerely concerned about your well being.
The problem is, MOST PEOPLE ARENT LIKE THOSE ON REDDIT. While we sit here, scratching our heads wondering how in the fuck can people possibly pay attention to this garbage. MILLIONS of people are paying attention to this garbage. I haven't turned on or watched a tv channel in years now, yet the elderly, the 'baby boomers' the largest proportion of our population and the largest proportion of voters HAVE WATCHED THIS GARBAGE THEIR ENTIRE LIFE. As a 20 year old with 60 year old parents(im adopted) they can't even comprehend the generational gap. My mom fucking lives for the Young and Restless, and my dad can sit and watch CNN all day everyday. Hell when I was younger and told them about Reddit they banned me from the Internet thinking I was gonna lure some child molester to our house or something. AND THESE ARE THE PEOPLE RUNNING OUR COUNTRIES.
One of the main reasons I can see their shit very well, is that we lived overseas for years. Gives you a whole new perspective on the unfreedom that is the US.
And we also wish to retire abroad. I cannot tell you how harrowing it is becoming to try to move anything more than pocket change out of the country. It's downright frightening, if you want to take some money with you to live on, it's very very risky.
They are closing the exits. And I mean that in the deepest sincerest sense. What we really have is a form of soft exit control, what has been known in other cultures in other times as 'exit visas'. The only part we're missing here now is the actual permission slip itself.
R/conspiracy may be angry. They should be fucking alarmed.
It just somehow finds a way to you regardless. It's what people post about on facebook, it's the "news" on facebook, it's the frontpage, it's on TV's at restaurants, airports, everywhere. You don't have to pay them to know what they're spreading.
You need to stop paying for it. Start watching all your shows online for free and listening to podcasts. Meet some online friends who share different views and really learn about the world. I'd also suggest gaining a cool hobby/life skill as you can meet a lot of new and interesting people there as well. Expand your world views and mind my friend.
Why are you standing up for a child that had to take to private messaging me to tell me I'm in a fantasy world and that I'm an "idiot." It's advice he doesn't have to listen nor take it. No need to get up in arms about it.
It's not that his advice isn't bad, it's the fact the guy didn't ask for it and didn't even seemed like he needed it, but this guy decided to push his opinions and lifestyle on him as if he's got it all figured out and the other guy doesn't.
Yeah reading it through again, it was impromptu, seemingly unwanted advice. I'm admittedly biased though, I like most of those podcasts and the ones I haven't tried, I will be trying out soon.
I can tell you now, the people I've met in person are usually more enjoyable to talk to than most of the social retards I end up conversing with online. You've made an assumption that just because he pays for cable TV he needs to open his mind. It's honestly not that big of a deal and having a cable subscription doesn't make him a sheep. There are plenty of openminded people with active lives who watch TV.
You've misunderstood everything I've said. First off he states how he watches "News" to see what others are "Watching." The best way in my opinion is to do this by bullshitting with a bunch of morons on skype. I suggested "Online" because he works from home. Second everyone should be actively opening their mind no matter how old they are they SHOULD be learning new life skills and gaining new experiences. This was general advice I'd give to pretty much anyone when I stated he needs some hobbies... Everyone needs hobbies and what better hobby is there than a new hobby?
Radiolab has its fair share of propaganda. Don't give them any more credit then they deserve. Leavitt, from Freakonomics, also admits that he has worked with the CIA
Just chiming in that No Agenda will radically change the way you view the media. Give it a few listens and all the fear mongering, distracting, and propagandizing tropes will become much more obvious. ITM!
It already passed guys. Why would you think it wouldn't when none of us did a god damn thing? There are numerous disadvantages to being a member of the conspiracy community but the worst by far is that we know so much and yet don't do anything about it. There are even fights because people think one issue is actually a distraction from another. They don't need to distract us because we aren't a threat. Stop trying to get other people to wake up when we're the ones that need to. Let's come together and make some real change otherwise all of this is meaningless.
The problem with your argument is that the only way to make a difference in politics from outside the political system is to either:
Have lots of money
Mobilize tremendous amounts of voters
Since we don't have lots of money, our only option is to mobilize people on a large-scale. Some (~30%) of people have a hard time believing me when I tell them the new regulations imposed from the leaked text of the TPP. They cannot even fathom the idea that people in power consider their interests above the collective good. And others still are too ignorant or foolish to care.
The only thing the darkness fears is the light. We don't need money or power to defeat corruption because that would just put us in a position to start the cycle all over again. What we need is an American mainstream news platform which is operated by average citizens that will speak truthfully about issues like TPP without being labeled as a conspiracy group. The word conspiracy has become synonymous with crazy while you can call anything news and it becomes fact and law. If we can get the word out there on a grander scale with these conditions then we can repair anything.
Look at Sepp Blatter's resignation. That was a huge step forward for the conspiracy community because that was achieved from spreading the word alone. No power or money was used to achieve this. All that happened was the news picked up the story and when enough people became aware of what was going on, there was no choice but to resign. The elite don't need to be forced into behaving, they just need a light to be shown on their deeds and then they can't go through with them.
Another example of this is Edward Snowden. If the Guardian never picked up the story of his leaks, they never would have shown it as front page news on all the major news networks and the NSA would probably be a million times worse because they would be operating entirely in secret. We need to get the word out but on a mass scale and without the conspiracy connotation.
Russell Brand's Trews has made gigantic leaps and has forced politicians to come face to face with their corruption. However, the problems are that 1. very few Americans know about his program and 2. many people who have seen the program don't trust it because they consider Russell to be the elite due to his celebrity status and wealth.
Any one of us could start such a news source at any time but we don't because we would rather sit in our comfort zone complaining to ourselves within our own little conspiracy bubble. Sharing this information with each other isn't going to do anything. Sharing this information with your friends and family isn't going to do anything. The only thing that will is if the entire world knows our message like it was written in the history books.
The only thing the darkness fears is the light. We don't need money or power to defeat corruption because that would just put us in a position to start the cycle all over again. What we need is an American mainstream news platform which is operated by average citizens that will speak truthfully about issues like TPP without being labeled as a conspiracy group.
I agree about the darkness fearing the light. But I'm not really sure how you foresee starting a national mainstream news platform without money. You'd need to higher reporters, anchors, producers, AV guys, plus equipment, building, etc. Then, if you want it truly mainstream, either radio towers or somehow get it on cable/satellite. Do you really think Comcast is going to let you have a channel which constantly calls them out? And if you don't call Comcast out, what's the point?
That leaves you with the internet, which I believe is better for modern mass communication anyway. You already have shows such as Democracy Now! which have been talking about TPP for years now. DN! is about as far as you can go with a broadcast and still seem mainstream without getting the conspiracy label. Many here still consider it to be compromised though. It's definitely better than MSM, but I still feel they have lines they won't cross.
What we need is an American mainstream news platform which is operated by average citizens that will speak truthfully about issues like TPP without being labeled as a conspiracy group. The word conspiracy has become synonymous with crazy while you can call anything news and it becomes fact and law. If we can get the word out there on a grander scale with these conditions then we can repair anything.
This is exactly the solution, and all the pieces exist to make it happen.
All it needs is qualified groups to step forward, have the crowd endorse by funding, and do it.
But we are divided. Most who step forward would get pelted down, while the most conniving would survive, monopolize and then sour it all over again.
Blatters resignation is because of the FBI investigation. The sport journalists where I'm from were talking for years here that he was corrupt and should resign.
NO! This is a very distinct difference. They passed TPA, giving the president fast-track authority to negotiate the deal. TPP has not yet been passed. It still needs to come before congress. The difference it will now be voted on simply as a yes/no vote. No amendments can be proposed or added.
Correction - TPA, the legislation required to allow the US Congress to delegate Constitutional authority to the executive branch will pass shortly.
The TPP still requires and up/down vote once agreed upon, and this gap in time will give us a chance to get politically motivated and organized against specific canidates who voted for dis.
We need to track who voted for TPA and who inevitably votes for TPP in a few months. You could even expand this to the Bait & Switch Freedozm Act too, TBH.
These Senators and Representatives need to be scrutinized based on voting records and alternative candidates need to be located in their districts. Primary season is coming and a crowd sourced PAC specifically to aid challlengers who are tired of the surveillance state and the corruption on capital hill.
All we need is something to get people riled up about. And this could be it.
Scrutinizing each one and finding alternative candidates for the next election will take some time (and is probably not something I should be doing on the clock...). If we can get people from most of the states (hell, we may only need to do the populous ones, I could probably process the Florida ones easily enough).
Not to mention the bill they were voting on was titled "A bill to amend the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 to allow Federal law enforcement officers, firefighters, and air traffic controllers to make penalty-free withdrawals from governmental plans after age 50, and for other purposes."
wasn't Obama against porkbills and earmarks back when he ran all the way in 2008? Now he's using them for his convenience.
Net neutrality was a "this could fuck with your couch time" issue.
The average American won't mobilize on anything as abstract as relinquishing national sovereignty because they don't understand it and thus, don't care about it... Unless someone explains it to them which is the job of the mainstream media but they are the mouthpiece of the people pushing the agenda so that won't happen.
Reddit got played like a fiddle on Net Neutrality.
The strategy now is to not be distracted by bullshit media distractions and actually work to spread factual information to others so we cam have a semblance of cohesion, just for this (utterly doomed, IMO) moment at least.
Well not sure what you mean by reddit being played like a fiddle. Regardless there was a net neutrality-related article on the front page about once a day for at least a month. But I agree we need to be united. My point was mainly that it's hard to spread the message when TPP-related posts are being removed on the main subs.
came looking for this correction, as anyone who really follows this knew how misleading the title was and was wondering why an astute poster wouldnt have ALREADY changed it...
It is funny because media is also overwhelmed by fascination with Roof and the confederate flag and slavery. Not one blathering idiot has ever read the 13th amendment. Slavery remains perfectly constitutional if you have been convicted of a crime.
This is a big thing: how they keep us entertained with exciting bullshit stories while the important things are prevented from reaching us until it is much too late.
There was no way the TPP was not going to pass. It is the keystone for the legal basis for legitimizing the corporatcracy. With all the millions of money pumped into the political system, big business is demanding to get what they paid for -- free reign to plunder, destroy, exploit and own whatever their greed demands. There is only one coming official morality, profit and more profit. The solutions have to lie outside the political system, as Gandhi showed us decades ago.
How do you know the general public most of whom aren't even close to the prison would rather hear? One thing affects us all and the other a small insignificant speck of property. How do you speak for the majority? What's your secret?
People can relate to "bad guys on the run". It's a simple story, unfolds quickly, excites fear and thrill of the chase, police say "call us if YOU see them", etc.
Whereas TPP story is kind of arcane, unfolding over a couple of years, about corporate and national-level rules and money, hard to relate to. Add even more arcane things such as TPA and Fast Track.
The general public becomes interested in what the media presents to them and the spectacle it creates. Almost no one in the general public would know about the prison incident if it was not plastered all over the media first.
The media then decides to present a story in a way that is more or less entertaining. If a story is presented as dry, with a quick headline, it will fade away. If it becomes a topic of debate and discussion in opinion segments, it suddenly becomes popular even if the topic itself is not very interesting.
If the media had presented the TPP in an attention-grabbing way, we'd be discussing that instead. Admittedly, "prison break" may have elements that are inherently more exciting. But the public does not dictate the direction the story goes first, the media does.
Some of the media probably covered the TPP right from the start. Serious major newspapers. PBS. Online newspapers and serious political/economic sites.
But most people don't see anything exciting in TPP, and most media accurately judged that too. Complicated, mostly-secret, unfolding slowly over a couple of years, arcane stuff about trade rules, sort of happening far away.
Whereas the prison story is simple, quick, easy to relate to, exciting, somewhat local (for people in the Northeast).
No, I think most of the media is a reflection of the people. A pretty accurately-judged reflection of them, too.
For someone trying to whip up outrage about TPP, this is frustrating. But blaming some media conspiracy is wrong.
109 comments
57 New_name_every_week 2015-06-24
Why are you giving CNN your eyeballs?
32 flimflam2020 2015-06-24
I flip between all the cable news networks to see what bullshit they are talking about. I work form home so yeah I see a lot.
64 New_name_every_week 2015-06-24
I don't understand why anyone pays for cable. It's nothing but trash and commercials. These days there are so many good podcasts that the sheer thought of watching commercialvision gives me a headache.
These are just my favorites. I'm not trying to you what to do, I am just sincerely concerned about your well being.
14 rhinocerosGreg 2015-06-24
The problem is, MOST PEOPLE ARENT LIKE THOSE ON REDDIT. While we sit here, scratching our heads wondering how in the fuck can people possibly pay attention to this garbage. MILLIONS of people are paying attention to this garbage. I haven't turned on or watched a tv channel in years now, yet the elderly, the 'baby boomers' the largest proportion of our population and the largest proportion of voters HAVE WATCHED THIS GARBAGE THEIR ENTIRE LIFE. As a 20 year old with 60 year old parents(im adopted) they can't even comprehend the generational gap. My mom fucking lives for the Young and Restless, and my dad can sit and watch CNN all day everyday. Hell when I was younger and told them about Reddit they banned me from the Internet thinking I was gonna lure some child molester to our house or something. AND THESE ARE THE PEOPLE RUNNING OUR COUNTRIES.
3 xdyev 2015-06-24
Meh. I'm 62 and I can see we're being shafted eight ways from Sunday.
On the other hand I rarely watch TV. Bores the shit out of me.
2 rhinocerosGreg 2015-06-24
That's awesome but I feel like you're in the minority, does it seem that way?
1 xdyev 2015-06-24
One of the main reasons I can see their shit very well, is that we lived overseas for years. Gives you a whole new perspective on the unfreedom that is the US.
And we also wish to retire abroad. I cannot tell you how harrowing it is becoming to try to move anything more than pocket change out of the country. It's downright frightening, if you want to take some money with you to live on, it's very very risky.
They are closing the exits. And I mean that in the deepest sincerest sense. What we really have is a form of soft exit control, what has been known in other cultures in other times as 'exit visas'. The only part we're missing here now is the actual permission slip itself.
R/conspiracy may be angry. They should be fucking alarmed.
11 flimflam2020 2015-06-24
If I don't pay for it then how will I know what others are watching?
2 Adjustify 2015-06-24
It just somehow finds a way to you regardless. It's what people post about on facebook, it's the "news" on facebook, it's the frontpage, it's on TV's at restaurants, airports, everywhere. You don't have to pay them to know what they're spreading.
-1 throwawaynameday 2015-06-24
You don't need to know. Once you stop caring about the lies, you are free.
5 NewAlexandria 2015-06-24
Then you're unaware of how to subvert the lies that others are believing. If you cannot deconstruct the shock-theater, then what?
3 throwawaynameday 2015-06-24
http://radgeek.com/gt/2013/07/true-power.jpg
The only way you can really subvert the shock theater is to recognize it for what it is, shock-theater. The only way to win is not to play.
1 NewAlexandria 2015-06-24
No no, I'm saying it's like Digg. I kept watching the fallout even after I was off it.
1 malcomte 2015-06-24
Make your own theater of cruelty.
-2 DisabledNeckbeard 2015-06-24
You need to stop paying for it. Start watching all your shows online for free and listening to podcasts. Meet some online friends who share different views and really learn about the world. I'd also suggest gaining a cool hobby/life skill as you can meet a lot of new and interesting people there as well. Expand your world views and mind my friend.
28 TheDreamisFree 2015-06-24
Why are you lecturing this guy on how to live his life?
why do ppl need to start listening to podcasts? This guy can do whatever the fuck he wants.
-9 DisabledNeckbeard 2015-06-24
Why are you standing up for a child that had to take to private messaging me to tell me I'm in a fantasy world and that I'm an "idiot." It's advice he doesn't have to listen nor take it. No need to get up in arms about it.
19 TheDreamisFree 2015-06-24
This is basically what you're saying
"Don't watch cable TV because they are telling you to live your life the wrong way"
"Live life the way I live my life"
I'm not up in arms over it, It's just that you're being a hypocrite.
7 iShootDope_AmA 2015-06-24
His advice isn't necessarily bad, he could have phrased it better though, imo
3 erts 2015-06-24
It's not that his advice isn't bad, it's the fact the guy didn't ask for it and didn't even seemed like he needed it, but this guy decided to push his opinions and lifestyle on him as if he's got it all figured out and the other guy doesn't.
2 iShootDope_AmA 2015-06-24
Yeah reading it through again, it was impromptu, seemingly unwanted advice. I'm admittedly biased though, I like most of those podcasts and the ones I haven't tried, I will be trying out soon.
0 Paradise__Lost 2015-06-24
You must be disabled in the head
6 erts 2015-06-24
I can tell you now, the people I've met in person are usually more enjoyable to talk to than most of the social retards I end up conversing with online. You've made an assumption that just because he pays for cable TV he needs to open his mind. It's honestly not that big of a deal and having a cable subscription doesn't make him a sheep. There are plenty of openminded people with active lives who watch TV.
1 DisabledNeckbeard 2015-06-24
You've misunderstood everything I've said. First off he states how he watches "News" to see what others are "Watching." The best way in my opinion is to do this by bullshitting with a bunch of morons on skype. I suggested "Online" because he works from home. Second everyone should be actively opening their mind no matter how old they are they SHOULD be learning new life skills and gaining new experiences. This was general advice I'd give to pretty much anyone when I stated he needs some hobbies... Everyone needs hobbies and what better hobby is there than a new hobby?
-3 flimflam2020 2015-06-24
How can i talk to my friends if I cancel it?
3 ordinary-people 2015-06-24
You have no other talking material than what you see on tv?
3 Teeklin 2015-06-24
Wow, that's the saddest comment I'll read on reddit today.
1 malcomte 2015-06-24
You don't use telepathy?
6 thetom 2015-06-24
No Agenda, ITM!
3 purplem00se 2015-06-24
You forgot The Duncan Trussell Family Hour!
1 New_name_every_week 2015-06-24
Thank you kind sir! I bow to your superior brain power.
3 BeneathTheRainbow 2015-06-24
Radiolab has its fair share of propaganda. Don't give them any more credit then they deserve. Leavitt, from Freakonomics, also admits that he has worked with the CIA
2 concertjunkie6 2015-06-24
The Higherside Chats needs to get added to that list too!
2 DronePuppet 2015-06-24
You forgot Red Ice Radio!
2 Adjustify 2015-06-24
Nice list, man! Most of the ones I listen to are on there so I think I should check out the others since we're on the same page.
2 Pop-up-king 2015-06-24
Just chiming in that No Agenda will radically change the way you view the media. Give it a few listens and all the fear mongering, distracting, and propagandizing tropes will become much more obvious. ITM!
1 RebelRatel 2015-06-24
I would also like to add "The survival podcast" to the list. Lots of resources and an engaging approach to issues.
1 BadinBoarder 2015-06-24
You forgot Bryan callen and Freakonomics
1 neurad1 2015-06-24
Dan Carlin is down today (for me anyway). Interesting.....
1 Findout246 2015-06-24
How about "The Conspiracy Show" podcast
1 Findout246 2015-06-24
Ehh.. found this on Philosophy Bites. Not a fan: https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/cassim-quassam-on-conspiracy/id257042117?i=341842264&mt=2
-1 Drinkgamedrunk 2015-06-24
TYT cough cough.
14 xdyev 2015-06-24
I was going to say the same thing. Who watches CNN?
I thought it was mostly just infomercials now anyway.
12 compliancekid78 2015-06-24
I'm amazed that some people still take news corporations seriously.
1 malcomte 2015-06-24
/r/news does. It's the appeal to authority. And we are educated not to question authority.
1 neurad1 2015-06-24
Yeah, spend all day on Reddit and learn to think OUR way!!! And, ya know, stop worrying about that TPP thingy.
1 Findout246 2015-06-24
Because the rest of America does. It's important to fully understand roots of the minds you're trying to change.
1 lukekvas 2015-06-24
You have to know what the mainstream is saying in order to point out its flaws.
55 Steponallthechickens 2015-06-24
It already passed guys. Why would you think it wouldn't when none of us did a god damn thing? There are numerous disadvantages to being a member of the conspiracy community but the worst by far is that we know so much and yet don't do anything about it. There are even fights because people think one issue is actually a distraction from another. They don't need to distract us because we aren't a threat. Stop trying to get other people to wake up when we're the ones that need to. Let's come together and make some real change otherwise all of this is meaningless.
23 CJ1517 2015-06-24
The problem with your argument is that the only way to make a difference in politics from outside the political system is to either:
Have lots of money
Mobilize tremendous amounts of voters
Since we don't have lots of money, our only option is to mobilize people on a large-scale. Some (~30%) of people have a hard time believing me when I tell them the new regulations imposed from the leaked text of the TPP. They cannot even fathom the idea that people in power consider their interests above the collective good. And others still are too ignorant or foolish to care.
6 Steponallthechickens 2015-06-24
The only thing the darkness fears is the light. We don't need money or power to defeat corruption because that would just put us in a position to start the cycle all over again. What we need is an American mainstream news platform which is operated by average citizens that will speak truthfully about issues like TPP without being labeled as a conspiracy group. The word conspiracy has become synonymous with crazy while you can call anything news and it becomes fact and law. If we can get the word out there on a grander scale with these conditions then we can repair anything.
Look at Sepp Blatter's resignation. That was a huge step forward for the conspiracy community because that was achieved from spreading the word alone. No power or money was used to achieve this. All that happened was the news picked up the story and when enough people became aware of what was going on, there was no choice but to resign. The elite don't need to be forced into behaving, they just need a light to be shown on their deeds and then they can't go through with them.
Another example of this is Edward Snowden. If the Guardian never picked up the story of his leaks, they never would have shown it as front page news on all the major news networks and the NSA would probably be a million times worse because they would be operating entirely in secret. We need to get the word out but on a mass scale and without the conspiracy connotation.
Russell Brand's Trews has made gigantic leaps and has forced politicians to come face to face with their corruption. However, the problems are that 1. very few Americans know about his program and 2. many people who have seen the program don't trust it because they consider Russell to be the elite due to his celebrity status and wealth.
Any one of us could start such a news source at any time but we don't because we would rather sit in our comfort zone complaining to ourselves within our own little conspiracy bubble. Sharing this information with each other isn't going to do anything. Sharing this information with your friends and family isn't going to do anything. The only thing that will is if the entire world knows our message like it was written in the history books.
5 YodasYoda 2015-06-24
The night is dark and full of terrors.
2 CelineHagbard 2015-06-24
I agree about the darkness fearing the light. But I'm not really sure how you foresee starting a national mainstream news platform without money. You'd need to higher reporters, anchors, producers, AV guys, plus equipment, building, etc. Then, if you want it truly mainstream, either radio towers or somehow get it on cable/satellite. Do you really think Comcast is going to let you have a channel which constantly calls them out? And if you don't call Comcast out, what's the point?
That leaves you with the internet, which I believe is better for modern mass communication anyway. You already have shows such as Democracy Now! which have been talking about TPP for years now. DN! is about as far as you can go with a broadcast and still seem mainstream without getting the conspiracy label. Many here still consider it to be compromised though. It's definitely better than MSM, but I still feel they have lines they won't cross.
1 Peregrin_toque 2015-06-24
This is exactly the solution, and all the pieces exist to make it happen.
All it needs is qualified groups to step forward, have the crowd endorse by funding, and do it.
But we are divided. Most who step forward would get pelted down, while the most conniving would survive, monopolize and then sour it all over again.
People is the problem in the equation.
1 Baardmeester 2015-06-24
Blatters resignation is because of the FBI investigation. The sport journalists where I'm from were talking for years here that he was corrupt and should resign.
3 hal77 2015-06-24
Any wonder why TPTB view the common American as cattle?
1 Nerdherd99 2015-06-24
as Americans we don't ask out elected officials to do things we tell them what to do. We have forgotten that as a people.
1 Metabro 2015-06-24
Those aren't the only ways.
2 lukekvas 2015-06-24
NO! This is a very distinct difference. They passed TPA, giving the president fast-track authority to negotiate the deal. TPP has not yet been passed. It still needs to come before congress. The difference it will now be voted on simply as a yes/no vote. No amendments can be proposed or added.
0 PostNationalism 2015-06-24
why is /r/conspiracy so distrusting of governments except when it comes to the TPP removing their sovereignty..
12 JamesColesPardon 2015-06-24
The TPP is certainly not good, considering it is a trade deal negotiated in secret, by corporations, for corporations.
Not for you.
Not for me.
Hang up the nationalism argument. This isn't zero sum.
4 AbolitionistDynamite 2015-06-24
Most people who distrust states don't want international corporate rule, either.
1 godiebiel 2015-06-24
TPP is part of our distrust. It corporate power-grab, in other words the puppeteers are taking center-stage in front of their puppets
43 JamesColesPardon 2015-06-24
Correction - TPA, the legislation required to allow the US Congress to delegate Constitutional authority to the executive branch will pass shortly.
The TPP still requires and up/down vote once agreed upon, and this gap in time will give us a chance to get politically motivated and organized against specific canidates who voted for dis.
This is how the game is played.
Who wants to play?
7 Apoplectic1 2015-06-24
I'm game, got a strategy in mind?
16 JamesColesPardon 2015-06-24
Yep.
We need to track who voted for TPA and who inevitably votes for TPP in a few months. You could even expand this to the Bait & Switch Freedozm Act too, TBH.
These Senators and Representatives need to be scrutinized based on voting records and alternative candidates need to be located in their districts. Primary season is coming and a crowd sourced PAC specifically to aid challlengers who are tired of the surveillance state and the corruption on capital hill.
All we need is something to get people riled up about. And this could be it.
9 Apoplectic1 2015-06-24
Tracking those who voted for it is easy enough.
Senate roll call
House roll call
Scrutinizing each one and finding alternative candidates for the next election will take some time (and is probably not something I should be doing on the clock...). If we can get people from most of the states (hell, we may only need to do the populous ones, I could probably process the Florida ones easily enough).
The hard part is getting people riled up enough.
6 unkycornfat 2015-06-24
Not to mention the bill they were voting on was titled "A bill to amend the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 to allow Federal law enforcement officers, firefighters, and air traffic controllers to make penalty-free withdrawals from governmental plans after age 50, and for other purposes."
wasn't Obama against porkbills and earmarks back when he ran all the way in 2008? Now he's using them for his convenience.
6 Apoplectic1 2015-06-24
Publically, yes. However Machiavellianism is common among
sociopathspoliticians.2 gustoreddit51 2015-06-24
That's why Congress will never consider granting the President a line item veto.
3 theinfin8 2015-06-24
Reddit seemed quite able to mobilize around net neutrality. Yet to me this is 100x worse. With the rampant censorship going on, what's our strategy?
3 gustoreddit51 2015-06-24
Net neutrality was a "this could fuck with your couch time" issue.
The average American won't mobilize on anything as abstract as relinquishing national sovereignty because they don't understand it and thus, don't care about it... Unless someone explains it to them which is the job of the mainstream media but they are the mouthpiece of the people pushing the agenda so that won't happen.
1 JamesColesPardon 2015-06-24
Reddit got played like a fiddle on Net Neutrality.
The strategy now is to not be distracted by bullshit media distractions and actually work to spread factual information to others so we cam have a semblance of cohesion, just for this (utterly doomed, IMO) moment at least.
1 theinfin8 2015-06-24
Well not sure what you mean by reddit being played like a fiddle. Regardless there was a net neutrality-related article on the front page about once a day for at least a month. But I agree we need to be united. My point was mainly that it's hard to spread the message when TPP-related posts are being removed on the main subs.
1 JamesColesPardon 2015-06-24
They seem to be picking up some traction, finally.
2 TheWiredWorld 2015-06-24
Honestly not just voting records but straight up, clear and dry, who voted for the TPA. They're literally treasonous
3 brownestrabbit 2015-06-24
Diane Feinstein. Not surprised.
0 JamesColesPardon 2015-06-24
I can't argue that.
3 mynamesyow19 2015-06-24
came looking for this correction, as anyone who really follows this knew how misleading the title was and was wondering why an astute poster wouldnt have ALREADY changed it...
2 JamesColesPardon 2015-06-24
Thankee sai.
2 [deleted] 2015-06-24
Do you have a good link for info on the TPA?
1 JamesColesPardon 2015-06-24
The wiki is a good start.
2 1n5aN1aC 2015-06-24
Could you explain a bit more what you meant when you described the TPA?
3 JamesColesPardon 2015-06-24
Here
2 1n5aN1aC 2015-06-24
oh wow, I didn't realize that's how fast-track worked. I'm... not sure I like it, either. :)
2 JamesColesPardon 2015-06-24
It gets worse.
2 lukekvas 2015-06-24
Elizabeth Warren wants to play. Sanders wants to play. Actually, more accurately, they want average Americans to play too.
31 buzzlite 2015-06-24
I figured it would be all about how the confederate flag killed all those people in church
6 Apoplectic1 2015-06-24
No missing Malaysian airline jet?
11 Grammatologist 2015-06-24
It is funny because media is also overwhelmed by fascination with Roof and the confederate flag and slavery. Not one blathering idiot has ever read the 13th amendment. Slavery remains perfectly constitutional if you have been convicted of a crime.
6 DronePuppet 2015-06-24
CNN is a propaganda engine. Nothing more but entertainment.
6 BeneathTheRainbow 2015-06-24
CIA
News
Network
4 funkarama 2015-06-24
This is a big thing: how they keep us entertained with exciting bullshit stories while the important things are prevented from reaching us until it is much too late.
3 macinit1138 2015-06-24
"Any dictator would admire the uniformity and obedience of the U.S. media." -Noam Chomsky
2 gustoreddit51 2015-06-24
You can't really expect CNN, a member of the corporatocracy, to tell you anything meaningful about TPP can you?
-5 flimflam2020 2015-06-24
I see you are new here.
2 gustoreddit51 2015-06-24
Yeah, just fell off the turnip truck.
1 gustoreddit51 2015-06-24
Don't let my cynicism discourage you. Keep posting these types of things. People need to hear about it.
2 e-socrates 2015-06-24
jingling the car keys in front of a baby
2 shadowjack00 2015-06-24
There was no way the TPP was not going to pass. It is the keystone for the legal basis for legitimizing the corporatcracy. With all the millions of money pumped into the political system, big business is demanding to get what they paid for -- free reign to plunder, destroy, exploit and own whatever their greed demands. There is only one coming official morality, profit and more profit. The solutions have to lie outside the political system, as Gandhi showed us decades ago.
1 smudio 2015-06-24
News ≠ Neutral
0 billdietrich1 2015-06-24
The general public is far more interested in the search for the prisoners, than in TPP. This isn't the media's fault.
And "TPP" isn't about to be signed by Obama; Fast Track for it is about to be signed.
3 The_Free_Marketeer 2015-06-24
How do you know the general public most of whom aren't even close to the prison would rather hear? One thing affects us all and the other a small insignificant speck of property. How do you speak for the majority? What's your secret?
2 billdietrich1 2015-06-24
People can relate to "bad guys on the run". It's a simple story, unfolds quickly, excites fear and thrill of the chase, police say "call us if YOU see them", etc.
Whereas TPP story is kind of arcane, unfolding over a couple of years, about corporate and national-level rules and money, hard to relate to. Add even more arcane things such as TPA and Fast Track.
1 untumulted 2015-06-24
He's never found a conspiracy theory he doesn't hate.
3 AbolitionistDynamite 2015-06-24
We've got a chicken/egg problem.
The general public becomes interested in what the media presents to them and the spectacle it creates. Almost no one in the general public would know about the prison incident if it was not plastered all over the media first.
The media then decides to present a story in a way that is more or less entertaining. If a story is presented as dry, with a quick headline, it will fade away. If it becomes a topic of debate and discussion in opinion segments, it suddenly becomes popular even if the topic itself is not very interesting.
If the media had presented the TPP in an attention-grabbing way, we'd be discussing that instead. Admittedly, "prison break" may have elements that are inherently more exciting. But the public does not dictate the direction the story goes first, the media does.
1 billdietrich1 2015-06-24
Some of the media probably covered the TPP right from the start. Serious major newspapers. PBS. Online newspapers and serious political/economic sites.
But most people don't see anything exciting in TPP, and most media accurately judged that too. Complicated, mostly-secret, unfolding slowly over a couple of years, arcane stuff about trade rules, sort of happening far away.
Whereas the prison story is simple, quick, easy to relate to, exciting, somewhat local (for people in the Northeast).
No, I think most of the media is a reflection of the people. A pretty accurately-judged reflection of them, too.
For someone trying to whip up outrage about TPP, this is frustrating. But blaming some media conspiracy is wrong.
0 Apoplecticmiscreant 2015-06-24
The Wolf Blitzer, Mrs. Greenspan channel? Who watches that crap?
-1 flimflam2020 2015-06-24
Maybe you should help the apathetic?