So, the Supreme Court took up this case a year ago, and heard argument a few months ago, and released all of their annual opinions at the same time they do every year, and you think this was all planned based on the thing that you are freaking out about this week?
That is a truly impressive level of paranoid delusion.
But... but... what if they scheduled the TPA/TPP for this time of year with this specific case in mind knowing the info is released at the SAME TIME every year?
Well the TPP is being pushed by Republicans. The only thing Republicans like more than giving big corporations more power is religion. So you mean to tell me that Republicans just up and arranged to be defeated on one of their biggest issues just to push through a single trade deal? Do people even think anymore before calling conspiracy?
The only thing Republicans like more than giving big corporations more power is religion pandering to the religious so they can give big corporations more power.
Also, Ds and Rs are friends behind the scenes, the rest is theater.
Exactly, OP's looking in the wrong place. It's not the timing that's suspect, but the relatively low coverage it's getting. Compare it to SOPA/PIPA just 3 years ago, and it's pathetic how apathetic the internet is about TPP.
This is the problem I have with this sub, but I really can't figure out a better alternative. There seems to be a potential conspiracy hiding in every story. People throw everything - virtually everything - at the wall they possibly can to see what sticks. Some of it does. But a lot of it, like this post, simply doesn't.
But like I said, I don't know if there's a way around it. I feel like a lot of the convoluted, paranoid garbage is a necessary evil to get to the legitimately good information that's posted here as well.
Here is one extremely obvious point you apparently missed: People are different and have different opinions. Just because you see several people support conspiracy X, several for Y, and several for Z, doesn't mean everyone believes conspiracy X,Y, and Z.
This sub is about questioning everything, what part of 'theory' did you miss? It probably wouldn't happen at all if most of what we were told was actually true.
I agree, which is why I said even posts that are probably garbage are necessary to the sub. What I meant is that I do genuinely believe the majority of posters here have their hearts in the right place, and it's not always clear which theories "stick" without opening up just about everything to discussion.
That doesn't mean it still doesn't occasionally make browsing here a bit tedious though.
And they should question their own theories, as well, to make sure they make sense. This one clearly doesn't, as they think gay marriage was somehow "passed" because tpp was up.
But, you're right, its also a distraction from the Iran nuke deal deadline, and the attempts to take down state displayed confederate flags, and the recent ACA ruling, and, etc. Man, SCOTUS is crafty!
That's what courts do. They rule on stuff. You can call that "effectively legislating from the bench" if you like, but you will still sound uneducated if you can't use the proper words to describe the Court's actions: Courts don't "pass" things; they rule on them. They decide.
Maybe sounding like you know what you are talking about isn't important to you, in which case more power to you!
Justice Kennedy said something stupid in his majority opinion though... "Many who deem same sex marriage to be wrong reach that conclusion based on decent and honorable religious or philosophical premises". No wonder it took so long. What a phony liberal
The case that they decided has been in the appellate since October. It's not like they could decide to rule on this week — the schedule it pretty set in stone.
Well this was the lower "gay marriage distraction" post at the time and had 40 comments. And I rarely if ever see admins posting here unless it's some reddit controversy thread popping off. So yeah, all that considered, I would.
So you are saying there is zero chance that this was potentially orchestrated? Absolutely no chance at all? Doesn't it seem like the political ramifications of lining these things up seem sketchy, at all?
Look at major TV broadcasting tactics. They intentionally put shows/pilots on days when major sports events/political scandals break. We KNOW this. The designers ADMIT it! Are you so naieve to think that governments wouldn't as well?
Look at major TV broadcasting tactics. They intentionally put shows/pilots on days when major sports events/political scandals break. We KNOW this. The designers ADMIT it!
Evidence?
Including evidence that "the designers ADMIT it!"?
Look at major TV broadcasting tactics. They intentionally put shows/pilots on days when major sports events/political scandals break.
Uh, what? Maybe you just mistyped, but the exact opposite is true. Networks intentionally avoid broadcasting new shows or buzzworthy episodes on the same days as major sporting events (with the exception being when the game is on the same network, and they use that as a lead-in - to wit, though, none of the other networks are trying to compete with the Super Bowl every year). And when large unexpected news stories occur, they preempt their usual scheduled programming.
And who cares if the "designers" admit it? It's not exactly a conspiracy, it's just a smart move for ratings-minded executives trying to offset production costs. It makes perfect sense.
While I think we can all agree that gay marriage being passed is turning this country in the right direction, I agree with you. It's not implausible that they would do it for that reason. Hopefully now people will stop arguing and focus on the REAL owners that oppress us.
As much as i support it, it is truly amazing to see the concurrent big headlines sway right over the top of what essentially is a facist worldwide takeover. Tpp and gay marriage legalization were probably scheduled hand n hand. Now tpp tpa are burried.
Yeah that's what I thought as well... and does anybody know what's in it yet?? The rumors are frightening as I keep hearing rumors about gun control measures, and wide open immigration.
Sweet. Maybe if we keep posting about it/spreading the word they'll finally legalize marijuana federally and the country can actually start making some money for education, health care, infrastructure, etc...
I hate how they play with peoples' freedom to have whatever relationship they want as if it were a card. People should be able to have relationships with whomever they choose and a bunch of fascist assholes in robes does not make it any more or less acceptable.
The only thing that I see happening is that our government has made it legal for the proletariat to fuck whoever they want just as they are going to pass the TPP so their fascist bourgeois regime can legally fuck whoever they want, too.
I don't think it's that quickly done. This was in the Supreme Court for months. Was it timed strategically? Yes. Was it timed to cover the TPP? Probably. But it's also there to cover up the fact that the IRS deleted emails after the subpoena was filed and Clinton deleted emails.
Plus, there were several terrorist attacks today and it's gay pride month.
You just don't have any idea how foolish you make yourself sound with these kind of remarks. That look of disbelief you see on people's faces when you share your ideas with them?
Tell me why this remark is foolish. Do you have anything to contribute other than "you're a fool"? Probably not but I'll suspend disbelief for you. I await your response.
Gay marriage has been one of the biggest issues dominating our political landscape for the last 15 years. There have been dozens of state laws passed to either ban it or allow it. There have been many amendments add to State Constitutions to ban it. There have been hundreds of court decisions related to gay marriage. And prior to this decision, we had some courts ruling that it was legal and others ruling that it was illegal.
It's the Supreme Court's job to intervene in situations like this when the Circuit Courts come to different conclusions about federal law. If Circuit Court A says something is legal and Circuit Court B says it's illegal, the Supreme Court is needed to make a final ruling.
That's why the Supreme Court took up this case last year, and why they heard argument a few months ago.
The Supreme Court works on the same calendar every year; They convene the court on the first Monday in October. They hear cases throughout the fall, winter, and spring. And they release their rulings in June. Then, finally, the choose the cases they will take up next year.
To summarize:
The Supreme Court follows the same schedule, every year.
The Supreme Court decided to rule on this case last year.
There have been thousands of court cases over recent years with differing outcomes, forcing the court to act.
It just doesn't make sense that the Court would have planned all this out in advance in anticipation of what a small group of people on Reddit would be obsessing over this week. That's just not how things work.
The court didn't plan it, I never said that. It's just too convenient. And still, another comment that doesn't explain why reddit is deleting TPP posts. I don't know why I even respond to these comments, it's going into law today anyway. The damage is done, regardless of whether you agree or not.
The court didn't plan it, I never said that. It's just too convenient.
Well, help me out, then. When you say "it's too convenient" what exactly are you trying to suggest? It sounds like you think there was a plot involving the court to distract from TPP. But when confronted with that specific question, you deny it.
another comment that doesn't explain why reddit is deleting TPP posts
But Reddit isn't deleting TPP posts. There are tens of thousands if not hundreds of thousands of TPP posts all over Reddit. The mods of /r/news are deleting TPP threads, but they are not "reddit," any more than the mods of /r/conspiracy are "reddit."
I'm not sure how familiar you are with how reddit works, but it's basically a giant user-controlled web site. Any user can create a subreddit, and any user can become a mod. Once a mod, you have more or less absolute authority to manage the sub how you see fit, and there is almost no interference from Reddit the company. (There is a vast amount of whining when the admins do step in from time to time, but it is very infrequent and 99.99% of subs are able to do whatever they please without any interference.)
There is a giant disinfo campaign going on to claim that Reddit is deleting TPP threads, but this just isn't the case. Where deletions have happened it is because of mod actions, not Reddit actions.
We may not like it -- I don't -- but /r/news mods can run their sub however they want.
IF we don't want them telling us how to manage /r/conspiracy, we have to give them the same freedom to manage /r/news how they want. That's the thing about liberty: it's very messy. I can say what I want, but so can other people.
Too many people seem to want authoritarianism instead of liberty, smashing everyone who has an opinion they don't agree with.
It sounds like you think there was a plot involving the court to distract from TPP. But when confronted with that specific question, you deny it.
Sounds like, precisely. I never said it, you did. I mean to say that, whomever orchestrated it, they intended to distract people from the TPP signing. I never spoke as to who or why they would do this.
Okay. Reddit itself isn't deleting posts. But someone is. That sub is all about correct info. The whole point of news is to educate people on things they otherwise wouldn't hear about. So yeah. There is something wrong with the news sub of reddit cutting out news from the frontpage about TPP. No news source should ever omit information. Like I said to someone else, there has to be some motivation to delete these posts, regardless of who is doing it.
whomever orchestrated it, they intended to distract people from the TPP signing.
We know who orchestrated it. The Supreme Court did. No one tells them what to do. They pick their own cases. They chose the gay marriage case last year, and they listened to arguments a few months ago. They spent the last few weeks writing their opinions. And they released their opinions today. They release their opinions in the last week of June every year.
So, now that you know who orchestrated it, are you going to claim that "they intended to distract people from the TPP signing?"
How would you even know that? Where is your evidence that "whomever orchestrated it, they intended to distract people from the TPP signing?"
There is something wrong with the news sub of reddit cutting out news from the frontpage about TPP. No news source should ever omit information.
I agree. I think it's ridiculous. But here's the thing: Normal ordinary users run Reddit. The mods over there have exactly the same freedom to run that sub however they want that every other sub's mods have. If you start trying to regulate how they behave, what's to keep them from regulating how you behave?
Freedom is messy. You either accept it warts and all, or you don't. It sounds like you don't. It sounds like you want an ideologically-managed Reddit, where certain opinions are forbidden.
Like I said to someone else, there has to be some motivation to delete these posts, regardless of who is doing it.
Yes, that's true. But if you are going to allege a specific motive, you need evidence.
You are too narrow-minded to see what I'm saying. You are too vested in proving me a wack job than actually considering my statements. Furthermore, freedom to run a sub is one thing. I'm not arguing their right to delete posts, I'm arguing the implications. What was the motivation? Why TPP and not something else? Why aid an already secretive trade agreement by deleting posts regarding it from a major distributor of news?
Freedom does not have warts, and I'm not "not accepting freedom". Goes back to what I said about you being narrow-minded. I have no further desire to read your ideas. They are flawed. Clearly you think the same about my ideas so let's just leave it with that. You aren't making any progress and clearly, neither am I.
"Those who do not learn history are doomed to repeat it"
...And here we are. I mean, don't get me wrong, we should have had marriage equality YEARS ago. But still, the timing of this just feels too calculated.
No arguments, no debate, no long drawn out conflict over the decision. Just BAM! gay marriage is suddenly legal. Splits the country in two conflicting groups, neither of which will notice the fast tracking. I feel so helpless, our government is so messed up and TPP is going to fuck everything up for civilians who aren't filthy fucking rich. I see now why people prefer to ignore politics, ignorance is bliss. What can I do short of starting a revolution? I don't have the cash to buy out my representatives, and I don't have the cash to convince people not to vote for them. And all the while, ignorant fools are arguing over a basic human right such as marriage. My god, America. My dear fucking god are we fucked up.
Dude, you need to take a deep breath. In fact, there has been discussion about this for months. This case was brought about in the October 2014 term, argued in April and decided today, which is at the same time the court releases their decisions every year. There are valid conspiracies, but this one is absurd.
Even if there has been talk, they chose this day to pass it. That was their decision. Not to mention reddit deleting TPP posts. I'm sorry but it's not absurd. Certain people wanted to move the spotlight off of TPP. I'd say they succeded.
Douchebags? That's all you can come up with? That would suggest their motivation was to be assholes for the sake of being assholes. Then why TPP? Why not the gay marriage posts, I think that would be more indicative of douch-baggery.
No arguments, no debate, no long drawn out conflict over the decision. Just BAM! gay marriage is suddenly legal.
Did you just arrive on earth? If you had been paying the tiniest, least little bit of attention over the past year, or few years, this decision would not have blindsided you. There has been a long road painstakingly covered in vast detail for many years leading to this decision.
The fact that you are oblivious to all of it tells us much more about you than some plot like you describe.
No arguments, no debate, no long drawn out conflict over the decision.
Oh my god. The ignorance is amazing. Just fucking amazing.
Just BAM! gay marriage is suddenly legal.
I mean ... wow. Were you in a coma for the last decade?
Splits the country in two conflicting groups, neither of which will notice the fast tracking.
So, then, your idea is that the Supreme Court took up this case last year and heard arguments a few months ago, and issued their opinion during the same period they release their opinions every year, for the sole purpose of distracting people from TPP??????
That's just ...
I see now why people prefer to ignore politics
Your lack of self awareness if just fucking unreal.
I know people have been fighting this for a long time. Tone down the asshole will you?
It's the fact that it is THIS day that the decision is made. The same day TPP is fast tracked. Reddit deleting posts about TPP on r/news. There is no reason for that other than to keep people in the dark about it. Sure if you were looking for posts about it, you'll find the few that haven't gotten up voted enough to show up on hot news. But anyone who is clueless about it will remain that way. A result that r/news is meant to prevent.
Gay marriage shouldn't even be an argument at this point. I don't think it ever really was, as far as the lawmakers are concerned. You are the one who is not aware my friend. There was no talk of gay marriage being legalized recently on r/news. Nothing until today. Considering how much crap thus issue has caused in the past years, you'd think this decision would have grabbed more space on r/news as of late. But it hasn't.
Just do a little research on reddit for anything about TPP. It's like a fucking graveyard. A few different posts, none of which have any up votes. It's like someone doesn't want people talking about TPP on reddit.
This is the same week the Supreme Court announces decisions from the last docket every. single. year. It isn't new. Last year they announced their decisions from the spring docket at the last full week of June. The year before they did the same. So on and so forth. Unless you have the attention span of a gerbil you would know this was coming. The only surprise really was their Obamacare announcement Thursday instead of today as well.
Unless you have the attention span of a gerbil you would know this was coming.
This is correct.
There is a certain kind of person who will invent a conspiracy theory to explain any event they are unhappy about. There are a lot of people unhappy TPP isn't getting more attention. So now they are going to invent a conspiracy theory about every single other thing in the news.
Still doesn't explain why reddit would delete TPP posts. And if you haven't noticed, most of this country does have the attention span of a gerbil. I wasnt up on my Supreme Court info, and I thank you for clearing that up. But my position stands. People were averting attention away from TPP.
Nope. Those interpretations are your own. Reddit and the Supreme Court in cahoots? How stupid are you?
The Supreme Court had nothing to do with this. They were doing what they always do. Whomever decides the dates of the TPP'S voting lined it up with the Supreme Court's scheduled ruling.
r/news deleting high ranking TPP posts is highly suspicious. Why choose TPP posts to delete? What's the motivation there? Wouldn't a news sub be the most adamant about not omitting information? You could say the same for any news source, but you can't trust all of those either. Where does their motivation come from? Whatever the reason, I doubt it's a good one. Anytime someone attempts to cover something up, it deserves some speculation.
Are you going to try and convince me there's a good reason a news sub is shit canning important news? Forget the gay marriage ruling, the deletion alone is reason to be suspicious.
Actually, they do. They grant petitions for writs of certiorari a year in advance. That is, each summer they choose about 80 cases they will hear in the next term of the Court. Then they start hearing arguments in October, continuing through April. Then they take a few weeks to make their decisions and write their opinions. Then, every year, the opinions are released in June.
This is the calendar the court has followed for a very long time. But the key is that they announce the cases they are going to consider a year in advance.
Precisely. They should've passed this long ago, but they didn't so that they could pass it at the same time that another very important law is passed. Everyone has an opinion on gay marriage. The same can't be said for TPP. Passing gay marriage just revived all the banter surrounding it, be it opposed or not. This effectively silenced any TPP talk, by making the surrounding 'noise' louder.
Actually, it's precisely the opposite. The Court picks cases a year ahead of time. Everyone who has been paying attention knew a long time ago that this case was going to be decided in June of this year.
Why do you think you missed it? People have been talking about this for a year.
This effectively silenced any TPP talk, by making the surrounding 'noise' louder.
What you are doing here is creating a conspiracy theory out of thin air because you're upset that the whole country is talking about one thing while you want them to be talking about an issue you care about. It's understandable that you are frustrated people aren't talking about issues important to you, but inventing a conspiracy theory to make yourself feel better about it?
That's an interesting theory. I don't see how you have any proof, and speaking as though it were true doesn't make it fact. That would be stupid. Perhaps I'm simply trying to help widen people's perspectives on the topic. Besides, the nature of the reason why I'm talking about it doesn't have anything to do with whether or not I'm right. So try again.
Well, you can trust me on this. I promise you, if you look out for this you will see it happen again and again and again.
Every single time something happens that people don't like, they will instantly invent a conspiracy theory to explain it. Right on the spot.
That's not how a serious person works. A serious person builds an argument with evidence and fact. You can't just pull brand new conspiracy theories out of your ass without any evidence as a way to insulate yourself from news you don't like.
Let's face it: No matter what happened today, if it distracted from TPP, people would say it's a conspiracy.
If a rock star had died of a drug overdose ...
If a plane had crashed somewhere ...
If a gunman shot up another school ...
All of these would have become instant conspiracy theories.
Literally everything that happens is instantly assumed to be a conspiracy theory if it "distracts" from something people care about, or if it hurts their cause in some way.
Does that seem like a reasonable way to interpret the events happening in the world? Does it seem reasonable to just claim everything is a conspiracy the minute it happens?
I get your point but I never said an actor dying was a purposeful distraction.
I claimed one point. The ruling on gay marriage being on the same day as the TPP signing is no accident.
I know people invent theories to fit their opinions, but that isn't grounds to discredit every single theory that comes into existence. There's a fallicy involving that.
I get your point but I never said an actor dying was a purposeful distraction.
I claimed one point. The ruling on gay marriage being on the same day as the TPP signing is no accident.
I know people invent theories to fit their opinions, but that isn't grounds to discredit every single theory that comes into existence. There's a fallicy involving that.
Okay, well, I appreciate what you're saying.
Just a couple final thoughts for now:
(1) There have been a lot of votes recently on TPP. This has been bouncing back and forth between the House and the Senate and I think the latest vote was the 4th in the last two weeks. (Maybe the 3rd; I've lost count.)
(2) Nothing has been signed. You mention "TPP signing." But the signing won't happen until the bill reaches the president's desk.
(3) It's not the TPP that they have been voting on. They have been voting on fast track authority. Votes on the actual TPP are many months away. The treaty will not become law until Congress debates it and votes on it in a few months.
Basically all that has been happening the last couple of weeks is debate on whether to fast track it.
(4) The other thing you might not know is that all trade and treaty deals have been handled using fast track for several decades. There is nothing at all unusual about seeking fast track for TPP. It's how these things are always done.
They have voted to fast track it, and it has reached Obama's desk. All he has to do is sign it, and I doubt there will be much hesitation.
Regarding point 4.
Although fast tracking isn't irregular, a secret agreement is. When else has such laws been passed before the public was allowed to review it? Oh yeah, the Patriot Act, which gives the government too much power. They didn't want people to know about it because they knew it wouldn't fly. That's why they hid TPP from the public. The small amount that was leaked sparked a lot of distress in people, and that's not even the whole thing.
I know that these recent proceedings seem innocent. So does everything else the government does. Not everything they have done was innocent though.
I appreciate your calm manner, and you raise valid points, unlike some other comments I've received regarding this topic. I hope our discussion has been mutually beneficial. It's unfortunate that one cannot suspect the government of bad behavior without being spotlighted as a wack job conspiracy theorist. History provides much on the bad behavior of our government, as well as many others. They are not above creating conspiracies to achieve theit goals. Therefore it would seem beneficial to constantly suspect them of such. Unless every theory is shit canned as quickly as a schizophrenic's babblings.
Please man. I know it's difficult. But listen, it may seem like nothing, but the fact that we are discussing this here and now mean's it's worth fighting for.
Please don't give up because the odds are against us. They're counting on that... I don't have an exact answer on what needs to be done. Hell, I think Bernie Sanders 2016 is a GREAT start.
Awareness is key. Educate yourself, and those around you, so when the time comes, we'll have a majority of the population on the same page.
You're right. It's just frustrating wen everyone around you is on their agenda. I get called a conspiracy theorist and a nut. Reaching a majority seems impossible.
I don't have any faith in any candidate to be honest. Nobody who will do the right thing will ever get to the top. Bernie looks just as good as Obama did. They're all puppets, they're all masks hiding the true monster that politics consists of. That's why I mention revolution. Throughout history, the most effective way to motivate the masses is through hatred and fear. Only through these means will people turn off their netflix and fox news and grab their pitchforks. So long as their reality is better than the one we would make apparent to them, they'll be content with watching House m.d. or some other mindless distraction.
What really gets me is Reddit. Deleting TPP posts? What the fuck is that? Where's the free speech and unadulterated exchange of information? Part of me wants to stop using reddit, it clearly isn't a safe place, they don't have my back. I don't know what their motivation is for hiding this immensely important news from its users. It can't be a good one.
I'm glad you and I exist, and there are more like us. We need to find them and bring them all together so we can start making a difference in the world. Before it goes entirely Big Brother.
Bernie Sanders?! Just listen to that as you say it for a moment... Do you really think Bernie Sanders even has a snowball's chance in hell of being elected (selected)? Come on, man. Short of another Constitutional Convention, the USA is dead and buried.
I've seen this dismissal of Sanders as an candidate even from those who support his ideology, but in reality, that kind of response only serves to hurt the chances he might otherwise have at winning the election. Let's just assume that right at this moment, there is a God-given 1% chance of Sanders becoming the next US president. Now, would you say "fuck it, it's too hard", or would you do everything you can to achieve the improbable? The more people who choose the latter, the greater his chances of winning become, and the less people who turn to apathy in the face of continued government corruption. It's a positive feedback loop either way, so make sure you're on the side that will actually fix this fucked up country!
Something tells me Sanders isn't what he claims to be. Just the same as any other Politician. Lie, lie, and lie some more. Only path to corporate funding, and a comfy retirement.
Say we get (at least) 51% of this country's population on board with Sanders 2016. We all spread the word and actually vote for him. Then the preselected puppet get's picked, regardless of our majority vote.
Yes, It happens all the time, but the more energy we build up, the more like-minded people that actually vote for this guy, will realize, democracy is dead in the U.S. They will see it first hand! THAT could be the fuel to the fire this population so desperately needs.
Call me a dreamer.. but dammit, I'm not the only one..
121 comments
90 TwinSwords 2015-06-26
So, the Supreme Court took up this case a year ago, and heard argument a few months ago, and released all of their annual opinions at the same time they do every year, and you think this was all planned based on the thing that you are freaking out about this week?
That is a truly impressive level of paranoid delusion.
29 WizardOfOhZees 2015-06-26
But... but... what if they scheduled the TPA/TPP for this time of year with this specific case in mind knowing the info is released at the SAME TIME every year?
25 formerteenager 2015-06-26
And thus a valid conspiracy is born.
-11 FriendlessComputer 2015-06-26
Well the TPP is being pushed by Republicans. The only thing Republicans like more than giving big corporations more power is religion. So you mean to tell me that Republicans just up and arranged to be defeated on one of their biggest issues just to push through a single trade deal? Do people even think anymore before calling conspiracy?
22 WizardOfOhZees 2015-06-26
You've already fallen for the Republican/Democrat game.
1 FriendlessComputer 2015-06-26
And you've already fallen for the "they're all the same" game.
2 RailroadBro 2015-06-26
TIL Obama is a Republican
1 CelineHagbard 2015-06-26
Also, Ds and Rs are friends behind the scenes, the rest is theater.
15 gonzobon 2015-06-26
The timing isn't suspect, what is suspect is the media domination of all things not TPP.
7 1v1meinminecraft 2015-06-26
Exactly, OP's looking in the wrong place. It's not the timing that's suspect, but the relatively low coverage it's getting. Compare it to SOPA/PIPA just 3 years ago, and it's pathetic how apathetic the internet is about TPP.
0 IgnoreTheTwoof 2015-06-26
So discussing the TPP should be the only thing that the media covers?
OK, then, please give us the pros and cons of the TPP and how it will affect trade globally.
Go ahead. I'll wait. I mean, as long as it doesnt interfere with your bitcoin discussions.
9 UniversalPolymath 2015-06-26
Seriously.
This is the problem I have with this sub, but I really can't figure out a better alternative. There seems to be a potential conspiracy hiding in every story. People throw everything - virtually everything - at the wall they possibly can to see what sticks. Some of it does. But a lot of it, like this post, simply doesn't.
But like I said, I don't know if there's a way around it. I feel like a lot of the convoluted, paranoid garbage is a necessary evil to get to the legitimately good information that's posted here as well.
3 InternetPropagandist 2015-06-26
Here is one extremely obvious point you apparently missed: People are different and have different opinions. Just because you see several people support conspiracy X, several for Y, and several for Z, doesn't mean everyone believes conspiracy X,Y, and Z.
Maybe we should explain this on the sidebar.
-1 IntellisaurDinoAlien 2015-06-26
This sub is about questioning everything, what part of 'theory' did you miss? It probably wouldn't happen at all if most of what we were told was actually true.
5 Boukish 2015-06-26
Except for the threads we're currently posting on at the time, of course.
2 Paradise__Lost 2015-06-26
I would say there's been a lot of questioning. The first comment on the thread is mocking it for fuck sakes.
4 UniversalPolymath 2015-06-26
I agree, which is why I said even posts that are probably garbage are necessary to the sub. What I meant is that I do genuinely believe the majority of posters here have their hearts in the right place, and it's not always clear which theories "stick" without opening up just about everything to discussion.
That doesn't mean it still doesn't occasionally make browsing here a bit tedious though.
0 anon445 2015-06-26
And they should question their own theories, as well, to make sure they make sense. This one clearly doesn't, as they think gay marriage was somehow "passed" because tpp was up.
2 mrv3 2015-06-26
I think it's far more likely that they passed this deal in time for the supreme court announcement.
2 TwinSwords 2015-06-26
I don't agree, but that's a far more plausible theory.
1 darkwingduckdunn 2015-06-26
Resistance is futile
1 sHaDowpUpPetxxx 2015-06-26
Yeah and its not like they need to appease anyone politically, they are appointed for life.
1 TwinSwords 2015-06-26
Exactly.
-1 coba1t 2015-06-26
Welcome to r/conspiricy where every thing that happens in the world has some evil overtone to it
37 ninekilnmegalith 2015-06-26
It was on the docket all year...
But, you're right, its also a distraction from the Iran nuke deal deadline, and the attempts to take down state displayed confederate flags, and the recent ACA ruling, and, etc. Man, SCOTUS is crafty!
8 ShiIlyourself 2015-06-26
Meanwhile, people in the real world have been discussing all these issues uninterrupted.
4 CowboyAstronautClown 2015-06-26
That's the scariest sentence I have ever read.
3 ShiIlyourself 2015-06-26
Why's that?
1 m4050m3 2015-06-26
I keep seeing SCOTUS as SCROTUS and obviously that becomes scrotum.
Anyway, who is this SCOTUS group anyway
3 ninekilnmegalith 2015-06-26
Supreme Court Of The United States
-1 SpaktakJones 2015-06-26
OTUS means Of The United States. So the first lady is FLOTUS, the president is POTUS, etc.
26 dmareddit 2015-06-26
They didn't pass anything. They ruled on it. Different wording.
-8 [deleted] 2015-06-26
[deleted]
13 TwinSwords 2015-06-26
That's what courts do. They rule on stuff. You can call that "effectively legislating from the bench" if you like, but you will still sound uneducated if you can't use the proper words to describe the Court's actions: Courts don't "pass" things; they rule on them. They decide.
Maybe sounding like you know what you are talking about isn't important to you, in which case more power to you!
3 zorbinthor 2015-06-26
And they decided withholding marriage rights to certain people, regardless of legislation, is unconstitutional
4 TwinSwords 2015-06-26
Yes. Exactly. And thank God they did. It's a great day for freedom in the USA.
1 WizardOfOhZees 2015-06-26
Lol this is exactly the point of this post to the Tee... I don't even.
1 zorbinthor 2015-06-26
Justice Kennedy said something stupid in his majority opinion though... "Many who deem same sex marriage to be wrong reach that conclusion based on decent and honorable religious or philosophical premises". No wonder it took so long. What a phony liberal
1 dmareddit 2015-06-26
They interpret laws. Essentially the final say in a case.
17 Drunken_Economist 2015-06-26
The case that they decided has been in the appellate since October. It's not like they could decide to rule on this week — the schedule it pretty set in stone.
-7 ILoveBrokenWomen 2015-06-26
What brings you here? Come here often?
Nobody else wondering what an admins doing in this random tiny thread in conspiracy?
5 Sir_Edmund_Bumblebee 2015-06-26
It's the #5 post in a 315k sub subreddit, is that really tiny?
2 ILoveBrokenWomen 2015-06-26
Well this was the lower "gay marriage distraction" post at the time and had 40 comments. And I rarely if ever see admins posting here unless it's some reddit controversy thread popping off. So yeah, all that considered, I would.
2 Paradise__Lost 2015-06-26
Take note of this.
-7 Nodent 2015-06-26
So you are saying there is zero chance that this was potentially orchestrated? Absolutely no chance at all? Doesn't it seem like the political ramifications of lining these things up seem sketchy, at all?
Look at major TV broadcasting tactics. They intentionally put shows/pilots on days when major sports events/political scandals break. We KNOW this. The designers ADMIT it! Are you so naieve to think that governments wouldn't as well?
4 TwinSwords 2015-06-26
Evidence?
Including evidence that "the designers ADMIT it!"?
1 UniversalPolymath 2015-06-26
Uh, what? Maybe you just mistyped, but the exact opposite is true. Networks intentionally avoid broadcasting new shows or buzzworthy episodes on the same days as major sporting events (with the exception being when the game is on the same network, and they use that as a lead-in - to wit, though, none of the other networks are trying to compete with the Super Bowl every year). And when large unexpected news stories occur, they preempt their usual scheduled programming.
And who cares if the "designers" admit it? It's not exactly a conspiracy, it's just a smart move for ratings-minded executives trying to offset production costs. It makes perfect sense.
12 cakes_and_pies 2015-06-26
That's the first thing I thought when gay marriage started blowin' up the headlines.
TPP affects every American. Very few people seem to care.
3.8% of all Americans are gay (source). Everybody cares.
I think passing gay marriage is long overdue, though I fear people don't realize how much the TPP is going to affect their lives.
Edit: wording.
-4 quicklypiggly 2015-06-26
Actually, this is your source, and the methodology of averaging other survey response data sets might be best described as "horseshit".
EDIT: Another eschewing of science by r\conspiracy. I'd tell you to take a statistics class, but this is just basic logic.
9 cakes_and_pies 2015-06-26
3.5% vs 3.8%...0.3% margin of error. Even if 5% of people are gay, the main point still stands.
6 s70n3834r 2015-06-26
There are no accidents in politics; if something happens, you can be sure it was planned that way.
3 wreck_loose 2015-06-26
It's too easy isn't it? The airwaves are flooded with things that don't matter.
2 mliving 2015-06-26
NO SHIT!
Squirrel!
2 lostfuture 2015-06-26
sigh
2 bafflesaurus 2015-06-26
They should've just legalized drugs.
2 di_ib 2015-06-26
Gay marriage isn't working they still have interest in TPP. Quick legalize Marijuana.
1 neurofluxation 2015-06-26
Totally this. I just made a thread saying the same thing - then I found this one.
1 ledankmememan 2015-06-26
While I think we can all agree that gay marriage being passed is turning this country in the right direction, I agree with you. It's not implausible that they would do it for that reason. Hopefully now people will stop arguing and focus on the REAL owners that oppress us.
1 DigitalAllDay 2015-06-26
This was in the cards.
So is marijuana legalization. It's in the cards for when they need a bigger distraction.
The biggest one in the cards is knowledge of alien beings. That one is being held for something serious.
1 javi2828 2015-06-26
Google Trends shows otherwise. People are still interested.
1 backtolurkingagain 2015-06-26
Well played card. What do you think they have planned when they finally legalize Mary-J? full military police state. Fak, already there.....
1 videinfra666 2015-06-26
So... u americans are being fucked, either way. You bitch about one thing and then BOOM! you are being fucked with some other!
U ppl are bringing it all to ur heads
0 bamtron5 2015-06-26
As much as i support it, it is truly amazing to see the concurrent big headlines sway right over the top of what essentially is a facist worldwide takeover. Tpp and gay marriage legalization were probably scheduled hand n hand. Now tpp tpa are burried.
0 coffee_berns 2015-06-26
Yeah that's what I thought as well... and does anybody know what's in it yet?? The rumors are frightening as I keep hearing rumors about gun control measures, and wide open immigration.
0 IceDagger316 2015-06-26
Because the Supreme Court passes laws lololololohfuckitlooksliketheydonow
0 lamothek 2015-06-26
Lol
0 rougekhmero 2015-06-26
Sweet. Maybe if we keep posting about it/spreading the word they'll finally legalize marijuana federally and the country can actually start making some money for education, health care, infrastructure, etc...
0 mikeshoe1 2015-06-26
No, there's a gay agenda
Undermining of our nature, connection to nature, family system, and society
0 HulaguKan 2015-06-26
Everything is a distraction and false flag.
No real crimes are ever committed and no two important things ever happen at the same time.
0 Kevo_CS 2015-06-26
Too many people getting suspicious about TPP? Quick, air the NBA draft nationwide now!
-1 BeneathTheRainbow 2015-06-26
I hate how they play with peoples' freedom to have whatever relationship they want as if it were a card. People should be able to have relationships with whomever they choose and a bunch of fascist assholes in robes does not make it any more or less acceptable.
The only thing that I see happening is that our government has made it legal for the proletariat to fuck whoever they want just as they are going to pass the TPP so their fascist bourgeois regime can legally fuck whoever they want, too.
7 TwinSwords 2015-06-26
The decision wasn't about legality of fucking. It was about the legality of marriage.
-2 BeneathTheRainbow 2015-06-26
You understand the analogy. Pedantry seems to be right up your alley though... keep it up!
-1 facereplacer3 2015-06-26
I don't think it's that quickly done. This was in the Supreme Court for months. Was it timed strategically? Yes. Was it timed to cover the TPP? Probably. But it's also there to cover up the fact that the IRS deleted emails after the subpoena was filed and Clinton deleted emails.
Plus, there were several terrorist attacks today and it's gay pride month.
This was not an accident.
-6 TokerAmoungstTrees 2015-06-26
That's what I was thinking. They keep getting to distract us. I guess reddit isn't above political bullshit.
24 TwinSwords 2015-06-26
You just don't have any idea how foolish you make yourself sound with these kind of remarks. That look of disbelief you see on people's faces when you share your ideas with them?
Yeah.
-16 TokerAmoungstTrees 2015-06-26
Tell me why this remark is foolish. Do you have anything to contribute other than "you're a fool"? Probably not but I'll suspend disbelief for you. I await your response.
13 TwinSwords 2015-06-26
Gay marriage has been one of the biggest issues dominating our political landscape for the last 15 years. There have been dozens of state laws passed to either ban it or allow it. There have been many amendments add to State Constitutions to ban it. There have been hundreds of court decisions related to gay marriage. And prior to this decision, we had some courts ruling that it was legal and others ruling that it was illegal.
It's the Supreme Court's job to intervene in situations like this when the Circuit Courts come to different conclusions about federal law. If Circuit Court A says something is legal and Circuit Court B says it's illegal, the Supreme Court is needed to make a final ruling.
That's why the Supreme Court took up this case last year, and why they heard argument a few months ago.
The Supreme Court works on the same calendar every year; They convene the court on the first Monday in October. They hear cases throughout the fall, winter, and spring. And they release their rulings in June. Then, finally, the choose the cases they will take up next year.
To summarize:
It just doesn't make sense that the Court would have planned all this out in advance in anticipation of what a small group of people on Reddit would be obsessing over this week. That's just not how things work.
-7 TokerAmoungstTrees 2015-06-26
The court didn't plan it, I never said that. It's just too convenient. And still, another comment that doesn't explain why reddit is deleting TPP posts. I don't know why I even respond to these comments, it's going into law today anyway. The damage is done, regardless of whether you agree or not.
9 TwinSwords 2015-06-26
Well, help me out, then. When you say "it's too convenient" what exactly are you trying to suggest? It sounds like you think there was a plot involving the court to distract from TPP. But when confronted with that specific question, you deny it.
But Reddit isn't deleting TPP posts. There are tens of thousands if not hundreds of thousands of TPP posts all over Reddit. The mods of /r/news are deleting TPP threads, but they are not "reddit," any more than the mods of /r/conspiracy are "reddit."
I'm not sure how familiar you are with how reddit works, but it's basically a giant user-controlled web site. Any user can create a subreddit, and any user can become a mod. Once a mod, you have more or less absolute authority to manage the sub how you see fit, and there is almost no interference from Reddit the company. (There is a vast amount of whining when the admins do step in from time to time, but it is very infrequent and 99.99% of subs are able to do whatever they please without any interference.)
There is a giant disinfo campaign going on to claim that Reddit is deleting TPP threads, but this just isn't the case. Where deletions have happened it is because of mod actions, not Reddit actions.
We may not like it -- I don't -- but /r/news mods can run their sub however they want.
IF we don't want them telling us how to manage /r/conspiracy, we have to give them the same freedom to manage /r/news how they want. That's the thing about liberty: it's very messy. I can say what I want, but so can other people.
Too many people seem to want authoritarianism instead of liberty, smashing everyone who has an opinion they don't agree with.
-8 TokerAmoungstTrees 2015-06-26
Sounds like, precisely. I never said it, you did. I mean to say that, whomever orchestrated it, they intended to distract people from the TPP signing. I never spoke as to who or why they would do this.
Okay. Reddit itself isn't deleting posts. But someone is. That sub is all about correct info. The whole point of news is to educate people on things they otherwise wouldn't hear about. So yeah. There is something wrong with the news sub of reddit cutting out news from the frontpage about TPP. No news source should ever omit information. Like I said to someone else, there has to be some motivation to delete these posts, regardless of who is doing it.
12 TwinSwords 2015-06-26
We know who orchestrated it. The Supreme Court did. No one tells them what to do. They pick their own cases. They chose the gay marriage case last year, and they listened to arguments a few months ago. They spent the last few weeks writing their opinions. And they released their opinions today. They release their opinions in the last week of June every year.
So, now that you know who orchestrated it, are you going to claim that "they intended to distract people from the TPP signing?"
How would you even know that? Where is your evidence that "whomever orchestrated it, they intended to distract people from the TPP signing?"
I agree. I think it's ridiculous. But here's the thing: Normal ordinary users run Reddit. The mods over there have exactly the same freedom to run that sub however they want that every other sub's mods have. If you start trying to regulate how they behave, what's to keep them from regulating how you behave?
Freedom is messy. You either accept it warts and all, or you don't. It sounds like you don't. It sounds like you want an ideologically-managed Reddit, where certain opinions are forbidden.
Yes, that's true. But if you are going to allege a specific motive, you need evidence.
-11 TokerAmoungstTrees 2015-06-26
You are too narrow-minded to see what I'm saying. You are too vested in proving me a wack job than actually considering my statements. Furthermore, freedom to run a sub is one thing. I'm not arguing their right to delete posts, I'm arguing the implications. What was the motivation? Why TPP and not something else? Why aid an already secretive trade agreement by deleting posts regarding it from a major distributor of news?
Freedom does not have warts, and I'm not "not accepting freedom". Goes back to what I said about you being narrow-minded. I have no further desire to read your ideas. They are flawed. Clearly you think the same about my ideas so let's just leave it with that. You aren't making any progress and clearly, neither am I.
Good day.
6 Teethpasta 2015-06-26
In one post you deny their is some plot and then in the next one you say there is. You can't even keep your story straight.
2 MelechiZedek 2015-06-26
"Those who do not learn history are doomed to repeat it"
...And here we are. I mean, don't get me wrong, we should have had marriage equality YEARS ago. But still, the timing of this just feels too calculated.
0 TokerAmoungstTrees 2015-06-26
No arguments, no debate, no long drawn out conflict over the decision. Just BAM! gay marriage is suddenly legal. Splits the country in two conflicting groups, neither of which will notice the fast tracking. I feel so helpless, our government is so messed up and TPP is going to fuck everything up for civilians who aren't filthy fucking rich. I see now why people prefer to ignore politics, ignorance is bliss. What can I do short of starting a revolution? I don't have the cash to buy out my representatives, and I don't have the cash to convince people not to vote for them. And all the while, ignorant fools are arguing over a basic human right such as marriage. My god, America. My dear fucking god are we fucked up.
21 formerteenager 2015-06-26
Dude, you need to take a deep breath. In fact, there has been discussion about this for months. This case was brought about in the October 2014 term, argued in April and decided today, which is at the same time the court releases their decisions every year. There are valid conspiracies, but this one is absurd.
-12 TokerAmoungstTrees 2015-06-26
Even if there has been talk, they chose this day to pass it. That was their decision. Not to mention reddit deleting TPP posts. I'm sorry but it's not absurd. Certain people wanted to move the spotlight off of TPP. I'd say they succeded.
15 formerteenager 2015-06-26
This is the same exact time of year that they make these announcements every year. That's how it works.
-12 TokerAmoungstTrees 2015-06-26
So it was convenient, still doesn't explain why reddit is deleting TPP posts from r/news.
8 formerteenager 2015-06-26
/r/news moderators are douchebags? Highly doubt there is a conspiracy on this one man, sorry to disagree.
-6 TokerAmoungstTrees 2015-06-26
Douchebags? That's all you can come up with? That would suggest their motivation was to be assholes for the sake of being assholes. Then why TPP? Why not the gay marriage posts, I think that would be more indicative of douch-baggery.
13 TwinSwords 2015-06-26
Did you just arrive on earth? If you had been paying the tiniest, least little bit of attention over the past year, or few years, this decision would not have blindsided you. There has been a long road painstakingly covered in vast detail for many years leading to this decision.
The fact that you are oblivious to all of it tells us much more about you than some plot like you describe.
Oh my god. The ignorance is amazing. Just fucking amazing.
I mean ... wow. Were you in a coma for the last decade?
So, then, your idea is that the Supreme Court took up this case last year and heard arguments a few months ago, and issued their opinion during the same period they release their opinions every year, for the sole purpose of distracting people from TPP??????
That's just ...
Your lack of self awareness if just fucking unreal.
-6 TokerAmoungstTrees 2015-06-26
I know people have been fighting this for a long time. Tone down the asshole will you?
It's the fact that it is THIS day that the decision is made. The same day TPP is fast tracked. Reddit deleting posts about TPP on r/news. There is no reason for that other than to keep people in the dark about it. Sure if you were looking for posts about it, you'll find the few that haven't gotten up voted enough to show up on hot news. But anyone who is clueless about it will remain that way. A result that r/news is meant to prevent.
Gay marriage shouldn't even be an argument at this point. I don't think it ever really was, as far as the lawmakers are concerned. You are the one who is not aware my friend. There was no talk of gay marriage being legalized recently on r/news. Nothing until today. Considering how much crap thus issue has caused in the past years, you'd think this decision would have grabbed more space on r/news as of late. But it hasn't.
Just do a little research on reddit for anything about TPP. It's like a fucking graveyard. A few different posts, none of which have any up votes. It's like someone doesn't want people talking about TPP on reddit.
8 Bunnyhat 2015-06-26
This is the same week the Supreme Court announces decisions from the last docket every. single. year. It isn't new. Last year they announced their decisions from the spring docket at the last full week of June. The year before they did the same. So on and so forth. Unless you have the attention span of a gerbil you would know this was coming. The only surprise really was their Obamacare announcement Thursday instead of today as well.
6 TwinSwords 2015-06-26
This is correct.
There is a certain kind of person who will invent a conspiracy theory to explain any event they are unhappy about. There are a lot of people unhappy TPP isn't getting more attention. So now they are going to invent a conspiracy theory about every single other thing in the news.
I can't believe they can't see how dumb this is.
-6 TokerAmoungstTrees 2015-06-26
Still doesn't explain why reddit would delete TPP posts. And if you haven't noticed, most of this country does have the attention span of a gerbil. I wasnt up on my Supreme Court info, and I thank you for clearing that up. But my position stands. People were averting attention away from TPP.
11 Bunnyhat 2015-06-26
Are you trying to say the Supreme court and Reddit is working together to make sure your gnat like attention wanders away from TPP?
-1 TokerAmoungstTrees 2015-06-26
Nope. Never said that.
2 Guyjp 2015-06-26
Only heavily implied it.
2 TokerAmoungstTrees 2015-06-26
Nope. Those interpretations are your own. Reddit and the Supreme Court in cahoots? How stupid are you?
The Supreme Court had nothing to do with this. They were doing what they always do. Whomever decides the dates of the TPP'S voting lined it up with the Supreme Court's scheduled ruling.
r/news deleting high ranking TPP posts is highly suspicious. Why choose TPP posts to delete? What's the motivation there? Wouldn't a news sub be the most adamant about not omitting information? You could say the same for any news source, but you can't trust all of those either. Where does their motivation come from? Whatever the reason, I doubt it's a good one. Anytime someone attempts to cover something up, it deserves some speculation.
Are you going to try and convince me there's a good reason a news sub is shit canning important news? Forget the gay marriage ruling, the deletion alone is reason to be suspicious.
1 Guyjp 2015-06-26
You're right.
/r/news mods are paid shills. I was a fool to think otherwise.
1 TokerAmoungstTrees 2015-06-26
I hope that isn't sarcasm.
2 formerteenager 2015-06-26
The Supreme Court doesn't announce which cases they are going to decide on in advance. Thus the lack of attention.
3 TwinSwords 2015-06-26
Actually, they do. They grant petitions for writs of certiorari a year in advance. That is, each summer they choose about 80 cases they will hear in the next term of the Court. Then they start hearing arguments in October, continuing through April. Then they take a few weeks to make their decisions and write their opinions. Then, every year, the opinions are released in June.
This is the calendar the court has followed for a very long time. But the key is that they announce the cases they are going to consider a year in advance.
-2 TokerAmoungstTrees 2015-06-26
Precisely. They should've passed this long ago, but they didn't so that they could pass it at the same time that another very important law is passed. Everyone has an opinion on gay marriage. The same can't be said for TPP. Passing gay marriage just revived all the banter surrounding it, be it opposed or not. This effectively silenced any TPP talk, by making the surrounding 'noise' louder.
4 TwinSwords 2015-06-26
Actually, it's precisely the opposite. The Court picks cases a year ahead of time. Everyone who has been paying attention knew a long time ago that this case was going to be decided in June of this year.
Why do you think you missed it? People have been talking about this for a year.
What you are doing here is creating a conspiracy theory out of thin air because you're upset that the whole country is talking about one thing while you want them to be talking about an issue you care about. It's understandable that you are frustrated people aren't talking about issues important to you, but inventing a conspiracy theory to make yourself feel better about it?
That's just stupid.
-2 TokerAmoungstTrees 2015-06-26
That's an interesting theory. I don't see how you have any proof, and speaking as though it were true doesn't make it fact. That would be stupid. Perhaps I'm simply trying to help widen people's perspectives on the topic. Besides, the nature of the reason why I'm talking about it doesn't have anything to do with whether or not I'm right. So try again.
3 TwinSwords 2015-06-26
Well, you can trust me on this. I promise you, if you look out for this you will see it happen again and again and again.
Every single time something happens that people don't like, they will instantly invent a conspiracy theory to explain it. Right on the spot.
That's not how a serious person works. A serious person builds an argument with evidence and fact. You can't just pull brand new conspiracy theories out of your ass without any evidence as a way to insulate yourself from news you don't like.
Let's face it: No matter what happened today, if it distracted from TPP, people would say it's a conspiracy.
If a rock star had died of a drug overdose ...
If a plane had crashed somewhere ...
If a gunman shot up another school ...
All of these would have become instant conspiracy theories.
Literally everything that happens is instantly assumed to be a conspiracy theory if it "distracts" from something people care about, or if it hurts their cause in some way.
Does that seem like a reasonable way to interpret the events happening in the world? Does it seem reasonable to just claim everything is a conspiracy the minute it happens?
1 TokerAmoungstTrees 2015-06-26
I get your point but I never said an actor dying was a purposeful distraction.
I claimed one point. The ruling on gay marriage being on the same day as the TPP signing is no accident.
I know people invent theories to fit their opinions, but that isn't grounds to discredit every single theory that comes into existence. There's a fallicy involving that.
1 TwinSwords 2015-06-26
Okay, well, I appreciate what you're saying.
Just a couple final thoughts for now:
(1) There have been a lot of votes recently on TPP. This has been bouncing back and forth between the House and the Senate and I think the latest vote was the 4th in the last two weeks. (Maybe the 3rd; I've lost count.)
(2) Nothing has been signed. You mention "TPP signing." But the signing won't happen until the bill reaches the president's desk.
(3) It's not the TPP that they have been voting on. They have been voting on fast track authority. Votes on the actual TPP are many months away. The treaty will not become law until Congress debates it and votes on it in a few months.
Basically all that has been happening the last couple of weeks is debate on whether to fast track it.
(4) The other thing you might not know is that all trade and treaty deals have been handled using fast track for several decades. There is nothing at all unusual about seeking fast track for TPP. It's how these things are always done.
1 TokerAmoungstTrees 2015-06-26
Regarding points 1, 2 and 3.
They have voted to fast track it, and it has reached Obama's desk. All he has to do is sign it, and I doubt there will be much hesitation.
Regarding point 4.
Although fast tracking isn't irregular, a secret agreement is. When else has such laws been passed before the public was allowed to review it? Oh yeah, the Patriot Act, which gives the government too much power. They didn't want people to know about it because they knew it wouldn't fly. That's why they hid TPP from the public. The small amount that was leaked sparked a lot of distress in people, and that's not even the whole thing.
I know that these recent proceedings seem innocent. So does everything else the government does. Not everything they have done was innocent though.
I appreciate your calm manner, and you raise valid points, unlike some other comments I've received regarding this topic. I hope our discussion has been mutually beneficial. It's unfortunate that one cannot suspect the government of bad behavior without being spotlighted as a wack job conspiracy theorist. History provides much on the bad behavior of our government, as well as many others. They are not above creating conspiracies to achieve theit goals. Therefore it would seem beneficial to constantly suspect them of such. Unless every theory is shit canned as quickly as a schizophrenic's babblings.
5 MelechiZedek 2015-06-26
Please man. I know it's difficult. But listen, it may seem like nothing, but the fact that we are discussing this here and now mean's it's worth fighting for.
Please don't give up because the odds are against us. They're counting on that... I don't have an exact answer on what needs to be done. Hell, I think Bernie Sanders 2016 is a GREAT start.
Awareness is key. Educate yourself, and those around you, so when the time comes, we'll have a majority of the population on the same page.
4 TokerAmoungstTrees 2015-06-26
You're right. It's just frustrating wen everyone around you is on their agenda. I get called a conspiracy theorist and a nut. Reaching a majority seems impossible.
I don't have any faith in any candidate to be honest. Nobody who will do the right thing will ever get to the top. Bernie looks just as good as Obama did. They're all puppets, they're all masks hiding the true monster that politics consists of. That's why I mention revolution. Throughout history, the most effective way to motivate the masses is through hatred and fear. Only through these means will people turn off their netflix and fox news and grab their pitchforks. So long as their reality is better than the one we would make apparent to them, they'll be content with watching House m.d. or some other mindless distraction.
What really gets me is Reddit. Deleting TPP posts? What the fuck is that? Where's the free speech and unadulterated exchange of information? Part of me wants to stop using reddit, it clearly isn't a safe place, they don't have my back. I don't know what their motivation is for hiding this immensely important news from its users. It can't be a good one.
I'm glad you and I exist, and there are more like us. We need to find them and bring them all together so we can start making a difference in the world. Before it goes entirely Big Brother.
2 whiteyjuice 2015-06-26
Bernie Sanders?! Just listen to that as you say it for a moment... Do you really think Bernie Sanders even has a snowball's chance in hell of being elected (selected)? Come on, man. Short of another Constitutional Convention, the USA is dead and buried.
4 crazyevilmuffin 2015-06-26
I've seen this dismissal of Sanders as an candidate even from those who support his ideology, but in reality, that kind of response only serves to hurt the chances he might otherwise have at winning the election. Let's just assume that right at this moment, there is a God-given 1% chance of Sanders becoming the next US president. Now, would you say "fuck it, it's too hard", or would you do everything you can to achieve the improbable? The more people who choose the latter, the greater his chances of winning become, and the less people who turn to apathy in the face of continued government corruption. It's a positive feedback loop either way, so make sure you're on the side that will actually fix this fucked up country!
3 TokerAmoungstTrees 2015-06-26
Something tells me Sanders isn't what he claims to be. Just the same as any other Politician. Lie, lie, and lie some more. Only path to corporate funding, and a comfy retirement.
2 militantomg 2015-06-26
Follow the money. People ignored that Obama was funded by wall street. Bernie is not.
1 TokerAmoungstTrees 2015-06-26
That's a good sign. I'd be hopeful if I didn't think it was pointless.
1 criticalthinkitout 2015-06-26
If I even get a whiff of that same ole' shit out of Bernie, its go time to the streets as the political process dead and buried.
2 TokerAmoungstTrees 2015-06-26
I'll see you in the streets.
1 MelechiZedek 2015-06-26
I agree with you to an extent. But hear me out.
Say we get (at least) 51% of this country's population on board with Sanders 2016. We all spread the word and actually vote for him. Then the preselected puppet get's picked, regardless of our majority vote.
Yes, It happens all the time, but the more energy we build up, the more like-minded people that actually vote for this guy, will realize, democracy is dead in the U.S. They will see it first hand! THAT could be the fuel to the fire this population so desperately needs.
Call me a dreamer.. but dammit, I'm not the only one..
Edit: Spelling.
1 Mr_Dr_Prof_Derp 2015-06-26
Al Gore won the popular vote and nothing happened. The electoral college is a fucked system.
8 formerteenager 2015-06-26
/r/news moderators are douchebags? Highly doubt there is a conspiracy on this one man, sorry to disagree.
1 Mr_Dr_Prof_Derp 2015-06-26
Al Gore won the popular vote and nothing happened. The electoral college is a fucked system.