The kind of revolution I want isn't just a change in leadership where we have some bloody fight and a new leader assumes his or her place at the top of the pyramid. Then we go back to the same old structure where people are basically slaves mindlessly plugging in to the machine. What interests me is the kind of revolution that happens when people wake up to the power they already have, the power that is inside of every human being, power that can't be taken away in a real sense - power that those at the top can only trick us into believing we don't have by using illusion and scare tactics. The revolution I want is one where people stop feeling scared all the time, where we feel like we have to wait around for permission from our superiors before we take action. I think this revolution is already here for many people. It will really take off when kids realize they don't have to pay a fortune to go to college for four years, that instead they can talk their way into jobs or else they can start their own careers. This revolution happens every time people take charge of their own lives, start getting in touch with their creative selves and the community around them. It'll happen when people start paying more interest to local politics than they do to the BS of Presidential politics. This revolution happens when people organize rent strikes, when they learn how to grow their own food. The truth is we don't need a Revolution. We need 300 million revolutions.

Well said my man.

IMO, the kind of revolution now needed is the occupation of corporations, at all levels, by becoming employees of those corporations that you want to change. Evildoers are not always hiding in the government - they are hiding in the mid & upper echelons of corporations - and they cycle in & out of government.

I think any other kind of revolution right now would be completely non-productive. You have to infiltrate and occupy the minds of those who have been selected to manage the business. You do not want to take their positions away, necessarily, but have to force them through the use of high quality correspondence.

You can (and I have) filtered revolutionary ideas up the corporate chain of command (6 levels of mismanagers) and got decent results, but was seriously pressured to shut the fuck up.

If you wanna have a fun revolution that isn't about bloodshed and violence, join a corporation and OCCUPY IT.

The ever increasing practice of greed is the problem. Greed is at the root of uncountable bits and pieces of the misery and destruction we find around us

If we cannot reduce the practice of greed as a basis of everyday living we will destroy ourselves and our ecology.

The increasing greed is mainly caused and supported by our leadership which tends to only represent the sociopaths and psychopaths among us.

We have to increase the values of conscience and empathy in our leadership. They can feel no compassion or remorse when they destroy our habitat and so many members of humanity.

In a violent revolution you get absolutely nowhere. You destroy all that's good and replace bad leadership with different bad leadership. It's always the sociopaths who campaign to get power over others and the leadership of your violent revolution will be NO DIFFERENT.

If they continue to prevail we are on our way to being just another lost civilization.

Well, we tried intellectual, and that made us smarter, but didn't make our economy better. I'm not quite sure what you mean by practical, but I assume that you mean straight-forward. That doesn't seem like a great way to have a revolution. We've had a bloody one, that didn't help either. All that's left is Spiritual, which is the most do-able, though that would upset our materialistic scientists who would whole-heartedly disagree with this statement. Religion can be profitable, or it can eliminate the need for money all together. A world religion would honestly be the way peace and prosperity could reach around the world.

A Spirtual revolution would be the most bloodiest and most intellectual revolution ever. God said plenty of times that it's going to be like grapes in a wine press when The Kingdom gets established.

I agree with you, there would be blood. But I propose this question:

Is the sacrifice of some blood worth being able to live in a Utopian society? This of course depends on personal opinion and I'm not saying there is a religion that could do that, this is hypothetically speaking.

Well, here's the rub; as soon as ends justify means, there goes your utopia.

this is hypothetically speaking

I propose a Global Ethos of Justice, that holds all of us to the same accountability, regardless of bloodline or bank account.

In jest, Super Friends have "Hall of Justice WIKI https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hall_of_Justice_(comics) , Image Search"

Keep in mind those who reclaim history for humanity will be labeled Super Heroes

I wouldn't call it a sacrifice though. It's just business.

That seems rather heartless to be honest. It is a sacrifice, you are extinguishing human life for a cause. That isn't business, that's sacrifice.

God isn't establishing Utopia without getting rid of the people who are problems first. It's just business as usual for God too. I'm sorry. It's the truth though. Just pray you don't end up in the wine press.

You see, you're proposing a God that is omnipotent, which in that case, there would be no bloodshed because that God would be perfect and could turn the world into Utopia without the need of killing people.

God is perfect and omnipotent. God likes a show though. What do you think this(existence) is all about? Your amusement or God's?

I don't personally believe that there is a single God running things like a puppet master. I believe that the theoretical definition of God (an all knowing, all powerful being) exists inside all of us. Not physically, but mentally and spiritually. Have you heard of Lucid Dreaming? It's a dream state where you are only limited by your creativity, you create your own reality in a way. In a Lucid Dream state, you are God, you just don't manifest these things in the third dimension.

What do you think this(existence) is all about?

I'm not really sure of why we would be here, other than our natural desire to be in human contact. I feel that our body dies, but our soul doesn't. Our soul returns to the Lucid Dream "dimension" to manifest there until we decide to live another life time. In the aforementioned dimension, that is where the concept of heaven and hell come from. If you've lived a positive, outgoing, spiritually enriched life, you will manifest good things in the dimension, if you are the opposite, you will live in a hell-like state.

We all have the Holy Spirit in us. Only The Father is perfection though. That's why you only get a taste. Reality is the real lucid dream. It's God's dream here in the now.

Sure, but only your own blood. If you're thinking there may be some legitimate amount of others' blood that can be spilled to establish your utopia, you've fallen right back in to the trap. Lobsters in a bucket, can't get out.

What I said to him is relevant to you as well.

I meant spiritual as in Holy, Divine, and Supernatural. Humans will never construct Utopia themselves.

The other response I gave him is relevant here as well.

Humans will never construct Utopia themselves.

Well, on one level, I wouldn't disagree with this. We are most definitely very underdeveloped as intelligent beings, and, as such, most definitely need help and guidance along the way toward our continued growth. However, we should also make very sure and be careful not to sell ourselves so short that we abdicate the great level of responsibility that we should indeed take toward our own development as intelligent beings. I would say that we most definitely have to stand on our own two feet, as it were, and we should become very accustomed to moving forward as best we can using the guiles we were given without depending on any outside intervention, help, or aid - much as we might still need to be aided along the way nonetheless.

With God all things are possible. Not with man. Without God this is as good as it will get.

With God all things are possible.

Absolutely. We just have to know and understand what "God" really and truly is, however - and it seems many of us humans very much don't.

Not with man.

There is no "man". There is only human, as the woman aspect of the total equation is just as important as the man aspect.

Without God this is as good as it will get.

Yes. We just have to continue to evolve more and more in terms of our understanding and imbuing of what God really is.

Or Mankind. I love women but I know the worlds problems started when Eve ate the fruit first so they have very little say for a reason.

That is extremely (abysmally) ignorant thinking on your part, but okay.

Sorry. I just follow the protocol.

...but that's what ultimately contributes to overall human enslavement.

Following it wrong does.

Following any exclusivist religious doctrine (including but not limited to Christianity), however, makes it extremely difficult not to follow the cosmic path incorrectly. It makes the steps toward following a mistaken path all the more difficult to avoid.

Wow. This conversation could not sum up why i dislike religion any better.

They started when eve ate the fruit (if you believ fairy tales or metaphors) but continued when mostly men controlled the true power structures in the world for millenia after.

We have very little say for a reason? Because of Eve, all women are doomed to being lesser than men? Please explain what protocol you believe you are following.

Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the Lord God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden? And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden: But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die. And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die: For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil. And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat. And the eyes of them both were opened, and they knew that they were naked; and they sewed fig leaves together, and made themselves aprons. And they heard the voice of the Lord God walking in the garden in the cool of the day: and Adam and his wife hid themselves from the presence of the Lord God amongst the trees of the garden. And the Lord God called unto Adam, and said unto him, Where art thou? And he said, I heard thy voice in the garden, and I was afraid, because I was naked; and I hid myself. And he said, Who told thee that thou wast naked? Hast thou eaten of the tree, whereof I commanded thee that thou shouldest not eat? And the man said, The woman whom thou gavest to be with me, she gave me of the tree, and I did eat. And the Lord God said unto the woman, What is this that thou hast done? And the woman said, The serpent beguiled me, and I did eat. And the Lord God said unto the serpent, Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life: And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel. Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee. And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life; Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field; In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return. And Adam called his wife's name Eve; because she was the mother of all living. Unto Adam also and to his wife did the Lord God make coats of skins, and clothed them. And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever: Therefore the Lord God sent him forth from the garden of Eden, to till the ground from whence he was taken. So he drove out the man; and he placed at the east of the garden of Eden Cherubims, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to keep the way of the tree of life. (‭Genesis‬ ‭3‬:‭1-24‬ KJV)

Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.

I assume this, specifically, is what you are referring to. Is there any argument out there, even in Christian theology, that states otherwise at all? I'm curious because, honestly, they didn't really focus on that verse in my Sunday schooling.

Yeah they don't go over the details to much in Sunday School. Here's what Jesus had to say about it. No matter what we are all supposed to follow the golden rule.

And it came to pass, that when Jesus had finished these sayings, he departed from Galilee, and came into the coasts of Judaea beyond Jordan; And great multitudes followed him; and he healed them there. The Pharisees also came unto him, tempting him, and saying unto him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife for every cause? And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female, And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh? Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder. They say unto him, Why did Moses then command to give a writing of divorcement, and to put her away? He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so. And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery. His disciples say unto him, If the case of the man be so with his wife, it is not good to marry. But he said unto them, All men cannot receive this saying, save they to whom it is given. For there are some eunuchs, which were so born from their mother's womb: and there are some eunuchs, which were made eunuchs of men: and there be eunuchs, which have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it. Then were there brought unto him little children, that he should put his hands on them, and pray: and the disciples rebuked them. But Jesus said, Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven. And he laid his hands on them, and departed thence. And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life? And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments. He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept from my youth up: what lack I yet? Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me. But when the young man heard that saying, he went away sorrowful: for he had great possessions. Then said Jesus unto his disciples, Verily I say unto you, That a rich man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven. And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God. When his disciples heard it, they were exceedingly amazed, saying, Who then can be saved? But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible. Then answered Peter and said unto him, Behold, we have forsaken all, and followed thee; what shall we have therefore? And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. And every one that hath forsaken houses, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my name's sake, shall receive an hundredfold, and shall inherit everlasting life. But many that are first shall be last; and the last shall be first. (‭Matthew‬ ‭19‬:‭1-30‬ KJV)

So then, though in marriage, the man is ruled by the woman (this does not mean he owns her, right?), this still applies:

12 Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets. -Matthew 7:12 KJV

Therefore, there is still human respect between the two and they should do no harm to each other as they are now of one flesh, and doing harm to each other would do harm upon the self, correct? I am simply trying to deduce what you're getting at. Being ruled by man doesn't sound all that appealing, to be honest, especially as I grew up being told I could be anything I want to be, even though I am a girl, but sigh we know how that kind of thinking turns out in today's world. I want to understand your point of view without thinking you're just disparaging women in general.

I'm not quite sure what you mean by practical, but I assume that you mean straight-forward.

The quote is from Mae Brussell in 1971. I am sharing this vintage information as the basis for conversations that must continue & increase.

I saw, I was just trying to purpose a solution to the issue.

You are doing good work.

You were doing well with this comment until you made the mistake of equating spirituality with religion. TOTALLY not the same thing - not necessarily in the least anyway. A world religion would not work - not for humanity anyway. There seem to be too many different levels of intellectual development for that to work properly.

An increase in global spirituality, however, seems like it would absolutely work.

You're overestimating what I mean by religion. I mean Spirituality, by religion, I don't mean dogma. Let's look at the definition of religion:

A religion is an organized collection of beliefs, cultural systems, and world views that relate humanity to an order of existence.

Trust me, I 100% meant spirituality. I just used religion because it would be a collection of spiritual beliefs.

Fair enough, but regardless of the technical definition, religion in actual practice has been horribly detrimental to actual human development and evolution. As such, any "organized system of beliefs that requires everyone's adherence" and where "noncompliance is punished" (at times severely and at the threat of one's life) most definitely seems to be a danger toward proper evolution.

And, unfortunately, the absolute vast majority of things in human history that fall under the definition of "religion" are absolutely guilty of these two transgressions.

As such, it seems that anything approximating any religion should be stayed far, far away from. Spirituality, however, even a collective, communal spirituality, seems not only right and correct, but perhaps even a requirement for human evolutionary development.

You're correct, but in one of my other comments I mentioned that it is only hypothetical. Current religions can't do what I purposed. However, one that is very spiritual and works to better humanity and the world can.

Here is a quote from Albert Einstein that I personally feel applies to this (perhaps not the Buddhist part):

The religion of the future will be a cosmic religion. It should transcend personal God and avoid dogma and theology. Covering both the natural and the spiritual, it should be based on a religious sense arising from the experience of all things natural and spiritual as a meaningful unity. Buddhism answers this description. If there is any religion that could cope with modern scientific needs it would be Buddhism.

Current religions can't do what I purposed.

That is most definitely correct, and it was more toward the current and past doctrines and manifestations of religion that I was directing my comments. The main current (and past) world religions that humans on planet Earth have generally espoused are most definitely not what I refer to as "spiritually evolved".

However, one that is very spiritual and works to better humanity and the world can.

I wonder if it would still be a religion in the strict sense of the word at that point, however.

Now that I am thinking about it, Jainism seems to be one religion that might not be too far from some of the things you talk about here - particularly the second main principle of Jainism.

Having just read your Einstein quote - especially as it pertains to the Jainism references I just made - it seems we are saying similar things.

We are saying similar things, as a matter of fact I agree with you. I just took my ideas of a collection of spiritual thoughts and called it a religion because by definition it is. Not in a dogmatic, god worshiping way, but as a collection of my thoughts and beliefs.

I wonder if it would still be a religion in the strict sense of the word at that point, however.

It absolutely can, at least by my predefined definition of religion. In a dogmatic way, unless there hypothetically was an omnipotent God that wants to help us achieve the solution I suggested. If we all had the same spiritually enriched culture, it would fit together as a collection, a religion, that would better us as a species and as a collective. We don't need dogma, we don't need theology. We only need spirit and a passion to make everything better that comes with enlightenment.

Sounds ultimately semantic, then.

We only need spirit and a passion to make everything better that comes with enlightenment.

I wouldn't disagree with this at all. Given that any form of worship per se would not be needed in this dynamic, however (and, instead, more of a constant "mindfulness", for lack of a better word, that walks forward with an awareness and imbuing of the proper spiritual principles) it would seem that individuals can, within the context of the spiritual principles involved, do whatever they want.

In that sense, then, this wouldn't necessarily be any sort of "religion" per se because the collective wouldn't necessarily have to "gather round for prayer" or any sort of doctrinal practice. I would imagine that some could if they wanted, but it wouldn't/shouldn't be at all necessary.

As such, a society where everyone carries the proper spiritual principles, but can comport themselves in pretty much any way they want within the context of those principles...may or may not/could or could not be looked upon as a "religion" proper.

Ultimately, and again, it seems we're saying very similar things. We're just, perhaps, describing it a bit differently - which is, of course, fine.

Violent revolutions are just a tool of the elites. violent people are easy to control because they act without thinking.

Kennedy was assasinated because he wanted to get rid of the federal reserve and have the Government print it's own money well the big bankers didn't like that because they wouldn't be in control. If you have money you have power if you have power you have control. Imo the only way to change the current state of things is by revealing to the masses that everything revolves around pieces of paper and particularly debt. How to start a real revolution? My idea is to tell everyone you know to go to the bank and take out their money, what will happen? The bank doesn't have the money and people will panic, then we will begin to see the flawed system fall apart and maybe reform can come of it and if not then a free for all and survival of the fittest

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Yep you got it. Can you imagine if what is happening in Greece with all the people trying to withdraw money only to find they can only take out $90 per day.... happened here in America. People would demand answers and slowly people would realize that this system is extremely flawed and they'll actually start to learn about the banks and not just what they see and hear on the news. Not sure what a better system would be because people are naturally greedy and always want more.