yeah i don't believe all science is faked ... i mean, who created math then and how smart were they so it all makes such an awesome sense when you do some calculations? it's brilliant if it's all fake.

and i don't believe we faked moon landing either. sure they tried to, or have just for backup, but faking, forging all these images, thousands were released just a few months ago, i mean it would take some serious effort just to fake these and we all know governments are incompetent. let alone have a conspiracy hidden this well 70 some years later.

what i am eager about is see the results of some independent projects, make a drone, send it the moon and make some pics, it's not that expensive anymore.

Sending unmanned aircraft to the moon is still a project upwards of a few hundred million, I wouldn't exactly say it's cheap either.

The only logical explanation is faking it to prove superiority in technology or simply because they didnt want to waste resources. Which I don't believe the United States needs to do because they are always decades ahead behind the scenes.

We'll see when we start sending probes, if it was faked our government would crumble from lack of credibility but by then they'll probably roll out martial law or terminators at that point.

Fake can be brilliant. Brilliant can be fake. EINHORN IS FINKEL! FINKEL IS EINHORN!!!

"Government" is not incompetent. Lumping the people in "government" is a fallacy. They want you to lump and categorize them that way.

You suppose every single person that holds power is incompetent. Really?

well not every person. in general.

Exactly. So supposing these individuals are brilliant, wouldn't it even be easier to compartmentalize, hide motives from, and deceive their idiot compadres?

Here's how I see it. Let's take NASA at their word.

Distribute the Apollo schematics (wiring, everything) freely online so that the public can open source our own mission with tested, proven equipment.

That's too much information, I think the evidence given is more than enough. Do you think everyone involved is lying ? Including the astronauts ?

That's too much information

Now you're just being silly.

I think the evidence given is more than enough.

Good for you, but that is your opinion. I disagree.

Do you think everyone involved is lying ?

Not that it matters what I think, but no.

Including the astronauts ?

They're airmen. Don't get it twisted.

Done cutting capers?

For what purpose ? What are they covering up ? I'd believe them taking things OUT of the photo's before faking it.

real technology. Best way to have an advantage on the world stage is to play dumb.

I'd believe them taking things OUT of the photo's before faking it.

Therein lies your problem. You've already defined what you are and are not willing to accept without having been offered any evidence in support of (or leveled-against) either position.

At this point it's probably best to refer you back to my previous comment above about jerking yourself off.

Have a good one. :)

Edit: of.

Would you care to explain what you think ? I have yet to see a broken down response with your opinions.

Would you care to explain what you think ?

It'd only wear us out.

Go ahead.

It'd make more sense that all the stars have gone out already and ours is the last one lit.

Such matters never concern me. This one's for you though.

http://youtu.be/rA-i4ti2OQI

Not lying. Just telling the truth under oath.

Fake photographs and grainy, phoney videos is not evidence

I believe them to be censored before faked.

NASA has released 14,000 photographs here. That hardly fits the MO of "censoring", and it would take way too much effort to fake that many photos.

It takes effort correct, but with the amount of resources they have, child's play. You might know, because you speak so vehemently in favor of NASA. Do you perhaps work for them?

I speak in favor of them because I am in favor of facts and science, rather than fantasy and paranoia - as you are. If

And then there's the question regarding if I work for them - I'll make it simple for you. I do not.

Sure, and if you did, i'm sure you would tell us. I'm not the one who is paranoid. You are. You know its only a matter of time.

You're not the one who is paranoid? You're the one who continually claims that there are shadowy groups of people who hide the truth about the moon landings and hide the fact that the earth is flat. I only point out the (many) gaps in your various claims.

And if you're not going to believe the answer to your question, why even bother asking it?

I did answer all the questions. Your version of the story is not without gaps. The only difference is that you have the weight of the establishment backing your second hand facts.

PS: I am not paranoid. I repeat, you are. Moreover, you are like that kid who is desperately holding on to the fairytale that Santa is real. The moon landings are myths bud. If it were not, we would be building on top of that accomplishment. Sadly, we aren't. I wish more than anyone it is true, but it isn't. You'll get over it too.

I did answer all the questions.

I was pointing out that you asked me a question that you weren't prepared to believe in the first place unless you got the answer you wanted. Hence my comment of why ask it in the first place.

The only difference is that you have the weight of the establishment backing your second hand facts.

Otherwise known as science and reason, yes.

PS: I am not paranoid. I repeat, you are.

Just because you continually repeat something, that doesn't automatically make it true.

If it were not, we would be building on top of that accomplishment

Entire books have been written on the why the approach we took to go to the moon in the 1960s was not sustainable from an economic or political perspective. Just because we haven't been back yet doesn't mean the originally landings didn't happen. We have many individuals from around the world working to make it so future landings can be done in a more affordable and repeatable fashion, as well as continuing on to Mars.

Sure believe what you must.

What do you believe ? I have yet to get many answers on this.

In what respect?

On the moon landing, it was an hoax orchestrated by the American govt and all the other govts chimed in. Because that is the only way to rule over the citizens via deception. It happens on a smaller scale in our lives, what makes it so different on a grander scale as well? How naive do you have to be to think the wealthy and powerful people don't lie to you?

exactly. Its all under wraps and they won't even go there again with vastly improved technology at our disposal. Why people are even defending NASA and other space agency lying scum is beyond me.

Their self-esteem depends on it.

People always bring up the moon landing as an example of a "wacky" conspiracy that could never happen. Probably because the lie is so great, no one thinks it could be pulled off. If the moon landing happened, there would be overwhelming scientific evidence that it happened. Instead, there's a massive amount of scientific anomalies. Here's a list of such anomalies:

• No evidence of any radiation other than visible light on the pictures.

  • No evidence that the PLSS ever vented any gas, water exhaust, or other materials
  • Insufficient shielding on the spacesuits to protect against ionizing radiation
  • Liftoff pattern as filmed by NASA shows a linear progression, rather than an exponential progression. (Exponential progression is how a rocket would act. Linear is how being lifted by a crane would act.)
  • No evidence that the liftoff engines used hypergolic fuels.
  • No explanation for how the LM weighed all the alleged moon rocks they brought back. (Fuel is precious, and they allegedly brought back hundreds of kilos of rock.)
  • Dosimeter readings don't agree with modern radiation levels. (In other words, when the astronauts "got back", the scientists said their dosimeter readings were within expected calculations. Then 30-40 years later, scientists find out the moon is much more radioactive than once believed. Why wasn't this reflected in the dosimeter readings?)
  • Insufficient shielding on the capsule to prevent against micrometeors
  • Insufficient shielding on the capsule to prevent against ionizing radiation

That's just off the top of my head. There's many more. And this isn't taking into account the ludicrous engineering standards we're supposed to believe went into this. For example, the first time anyone tested how mammalian cells would behave beyond Earth's magnetosphere was allegedly on Apollo 8, when the first manned test of the Atlas V rocket was sent on a circumlunar orbit. It seems insane to test whether or not the environment outside Earth's magnetosphere is suitable for humans by sending humans as your first test subject.

Let's add to that that no other country has been back in 40+ years - despite the fact that technology increases over time, not decreases. We allegedly went to the moon 40 years ago but don't have the technology to do it now? (And the argument that it costs too much is moot. The proposed moon landing mission by Bush (which has since been cancelled) set a landing date of 2020 when first announced. Why such a long date? Why not use the tech that worked 6/7 times in the first place?)

Finally, the idea that Russia would "blow the whistle" as a counterargument to the above is insufficient. Not only does this not explain away any of the scientific anomalies. But one may argue (calling upon the work of Antony C. Sutton) that the US financed the USSR from Day 1, and that the cold war was a scam to line the pockets of the military industrial complex. One might also point out the great grain robbery of 1972, which also might buy a lot of silence from our alleged enemies.

If you think the moon landings happened, and think it's just too far fetched that this could have been faked, I urge you to do some basic research. The behaviour of NASA surrounding the Apollo missions is bizarre. (BTW, NASA lost all the original telemetry data and film footage of the alleged greatest engineering feat of all time. Whoops.)

The more research one does into this subject, the more obvious it becomes the moon landings never happened.

So how do you explain

-The shear number of photo's and video's.

-Rock samples that are universally acknowledged as non-terrestrial.

-The other missions to the moon. The entire Apollo program.

-Hubble telescope shot pictures of the landing site.

-Even nVidia with graphics technology managed to proof the video's as legitimate.

Do you know how much shielding is needed to protect against micrometeorites and ionizing radiation?

Also why would there be evidence of non-visible radiation in pictures captured in visible light?

A very good explanation sir!

Good work, friend. I just wanted to say it does not go unnoticed. Keep up your investigations.

I am still in the beginning phases of this stuff, but I will explain what I've come across to the best of my ability. The theory that has made the most sense to me is that the moon landings were not completely faked, but partially faked. By this, I mean that NASA went to the moon, but when they got there, they found that there was already an alien lunar base on the dark side of the moon. Since that point, the moon landings have been faked with the purpose of hiding the alien existence/presence. As far as why this was done, I couldn't really tell you. One thing I've heard is that the aliens do not want to reveal themselves to us, because they know that we would turn to them to solve our problems, rather than solving them ourselves, and thus growing as a species. There is evidence out there to backup that this is the case, just like there is evidence out there to argue against it. So it really comes down to what you personally choose to believe. To me, it makes sense logically, but I don't draw any conclusions about it, as I haven't seen definitive evidence. Hope that helps you.

What do you think they're doing exactly ? Observing for entertainment, monitoring an experiment, or worse breeding us as pets ?

Well one thing that I saw in an interview with an "insider" is that they are monitoring an experiment. The premise of this being that these alien beings actually created humanity by crossing their own genetic structure with that of the original "humans" that inhabited the earth, but left centuries ago. Again, another idea I've heard is that they are waiting for us to evolve to the point of being able to accept their existence without turning to them as our saviors. The idea being that they previously visited humanity, in ancient times, and were seen as gods. It all comes down to what you choose to believe. For me personally, I think it makes sense, or at least the logic behind it is sound, but I try not to jump to conclusions without evidence. May I ask what your thoughts are on the subject?

Simple, pressure and strife breeds innovation and understanding. It's probably like looking at a big rats maze that has a purpose too difficult and painful to deal with for us humans.

The whole aliens are every race combined is a possibility too.

I'd never heard the idea that aliens are every race combined. Do you mean that to be every human race combined, or every race from another planet combined?

There's probably 13 or 14 variants.

The funny part is they're not omnipotent. God is technically above them and he guides it all, I am still figuring out their attitude or feelings behind it all if they have one.

If not then they're trying to eliminate him or guide us to become like them.

I agree. Even if a race of aliens were superior to us in terms of evolution and technology, that would not place them higher than source, or God. It's the same way that being so far advanced beyond animals and insects, does not place us above God either.

You have to test and reveal them not God.

Yes, I think that it all comes down to looking inward, and choosing to live a good life, to the best of your abilities. I think that if we all simultaneously chose to examine ourselves, instead of others, and to live well, then all of these problems would be solved overnight.

Next step get everyone to do that, won't be overnight though I'll keep you updated.

Discipline, Love and Faith. Wonder what the other side's about.

Lol. No small task indeed! I've struggled with this from time to time. It's very frustrating to try and modify someone else's behavior. I've finally concluded that the only thing I can do is live my life the best way I can, and hope that other people see that, and are inspired to do the same. Fight the good fight my friend! I wish you luck!

Also why did they leave exactly ?

1. Using us as slaves

The correct answer is all of the above

Slave's for what ultimately ? I'd say as their children.

Wonder what their qualities are.

I can find a few good uses for a few slaves of my own, wouldn't you?

Fighting ? Shit they could just be training us all to be their soldiers for something worse eh ?

But they love us.

Sure they do! All hail our lords and masters, they gave us life, we wouldn't be here if it wasn't for them!

What if the alternative is worse, at least that's what they want you to think ;)

Praise God and don't kill yourself, you win. Also not being a shitty person helps too.

Also they're probably all working together, demons and angels, dark vs. Light that is.

What are you even on a bot?

For one thing, supposing there are aliens on the moon, they were able to affect the rotation of the moon's mass so on Earth, we can only see one side of it.

The dark side of the moon is a city. Lol

Maybe the moon is heaven and earth is..

Would jive with NASA's reason they haven't sent men back (Let's just assume they've made it there......)

"NOTHING HERE. Everything we need can just be seen through a telescope. Oh, yea, you won't see the dark side of the moon in your lifetime, but it's the same as the visible side. We promise."

You wanna bet they're just hiding the scary stuff from us. Must be hard deal with.

Somebody's gotta do it.

What is your question? How could a bunch of Free Mason's keep a secret or how could a mass populous of people could be mislead by, literally magic schools. Yes, you heard that right Bill Nye, majic schools of Pythagoras.

Magic ?

Yup. Sure you wanna go down this road? I have some sauce, if you do and a shot and a welcoming hand. Lemme know, mate.

I'd believe advanced technology before magic. You're still avoiding the purpose of it all as well.

Ugh, You not following and clearly do not know what I'm talking about. Where do you think the Babylonians learned it from. It's not magic like, hocus pocus, here is a rabbit out of my hat. Jesus Christ. Never mind.....

Stop talking in riddles and explain what you mean then, magic is a very vague word.

I'm not speaking in riddles. Ancient magic schools are very real. Pythagoras. Look into the man and who he associated with. Hermeticism. There is so much here dating back to Egypt/Sumerians/Babylonians , just fucking look.... Where did the Free Mason's come from? Look. I'm giving links... Sorry If I come off as a dick, but I have to pee and I'm pretty drunk..

You're still not answering any of my questions. I'll entertain the links but you need to connect your theory with answers to my questions.

Ok. Why would Free Mason's lie about going to the moon? It's a Jesuit conspiracy and merely cold war propaganda. Why would scientist play along? They aren't (useful idiots) they are brainwashed with thinking the math/science/physics/etc checks out ( it does, in a Heliocentric model). Math and such on earth is relative, it is not the "language of the universe". It's all relative and big fucking lie. Doesn't that answer your question?

Not really, you have yet to explain a purpose, who ordered it and how it's achieved on a grand scale. Also satellites and astronauts in space.

This is like describing a ant-farm to a kindergartner. Why? Control. For what purpose? Control. What is the end game? Control. I was trying to give you the reason, but you want to skip class and get cliff notes. It doesn't work that way and no, adderrall will not work. Revisit what I've said. Then go forward. I thought we were suppose to learn the alphabet, before writing sentences....

I'm going straight to the source no time to read that bullshit I'll just ask them personally.

There is a reason they want control and it's not as simple as power or greed, surprisingly many people don't put themselves in their shoes. I guarantee you there is a purpose for all this and it's for our benefit and survival.

Why the hell else would they be gathering resources, power and control ? Probably to prepare us all for a world changing event, particularly one that strains our survival and would require us to leave the solar system.

But you obviously can't take billions, 144,000 sounds about right.

Oh and I'm pretty sure you have proof for that... /s

I do, it's funny because even the "open minded conspiricists" would act like the flock, which is probably why they're in charge and we're all just tinkering and attempting to solve their simplest agendas and distractions.

Dam, you must be smoking some good herb! Leave our solar system, really?

It makes the most sense, the rapture will end up being Noah's ark 2.0.

The real question is who gets to go and why ? Being rich doesn't make you useful but it can put you in the captains seat.

The rapture huh? So, like stated above this is a story from a book written long ago and translated many times, what factual proof do you have that this event will take place?

It's all just a setup or metaphor for a cosmic Noah's Ark.

It'd be pretty funny in a way if the rapture ends up being a one way ticket to another solar system. That would explain the whole 'control' and 'resource hoarding' mentality the elite has. Somebody's gotta do it, and not everyone can go.

I'm just curious as to what qualities or criteria you must meet to get a seat.

Cool hypothesis. Now, prove it.

I need a couple million more before I can scratch the surface.

Come on, present evidence if you claim to have it.

Also "Noah's Ark 2.0" ...really? What makes you think there was an Ark to begin with? Because an old book that you never touch outside of sunday school and that has been written by bronze-age goatherders said there was?

It's a joke, there may have never been one.

But with 500 trillion dollars, underground bases and the worlds brightest minds it sure is possible now. It makes a lot of sense if you look at the reasons behind it all.

You have yet provide evidence. Not hypotheses. Solid Evidence. You said you had proof. Present it.

It's all from process of elimination and running into a few groups. The hardest part is picking the right one.

Still waiting for evidence.

I don't post incomplete works.

Mate, do you think all space programs are fake? Like the Russian one, Chinese, Indian, Japanese, joint-European one as well?

Are you drunk?

no, not really. Why?

You must be a special kind of stupid to come into this sub asking a perfectly reasonable question like this. Prepare to be disappointed by the responses you receive.. You may even suffer personal attacks for doing something as stupid as this.

Everything is a conspiracy theory, nothing good or bad ever actually happens in the world, everything is simply a well coordinated event to further an ever-changing, often conflicting plot. As it has been since the industrial revolution, if not earlier, but definitely not any later.

Don't fret, however, as the fearless Trump is here to protect our guns and skuddle dissent that disagrees with our dissent. Soon humans will go to the moon, for reals this time, to escape the horrors of climate scientists and parents of children shot to death in their classrooms.

Yes, we'll fly far far away, up past earths "atmosphere" to a place with no FEMA camps, a place with no background checks, no antidepressants, no vaccines and a place where the only false flag is the one we'll view through a telescope while looking down on this shit planet.

found the Obamaton.

i read this is why no movie (sci-fi) has ever been made about going to the moon.

would this be the "biggest lie" ever told? probably not, but it's close.

What's the biggest ?

good question. a post in this thread said that the landing may have been partially faked (NASA realized: "someone" was already there & we weren't invited to the party).

if that's true & i think it is, obviously "we" (humans) are newbies, aliens have been living longer than us & know more than us. no, they won't save us from ourselves, we have to evolve to that realization. i hope there's still time to get there.

maybe humans are the experiment, we were created & here we go again, running amok, trashing everything. hope this civilization isn't "reset", only to begin all over again, not knowing (or remembering) anything about what was before.

imo, compared to other world beings we are so ignorant that we can't figure out how to live in peace amongst our own kind.

So they're running a zoo. I wonder what they'd spend their life doing ? Acquiring resources or pets ? Lol

Gotta catch em all.

Also what's the point of the experiment and why the secrecy ?

If you found a pot of gold, would you tell everyone? Rich people stay rich because of the secrets they keep, and get slaves to do their bidding.

No sci-fi movie has ever been made about going to the Moon?

Ummm...

The first film EVER was literally about going to the moon.

And here are a couple more off the top of my head

Moon (2009)

Apollo 18 (2011)

I don't understand what you mean by "no movie (sci-fi) has ever been made about going to the moon".

The funny part is they're not even in control. Technically God is higher than them, they're just stuck with the role of figuring him out.

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE56F5MK20090720

Oops NASA accidentally erases it's tapes.

But here is a documentary you need to watch showing the astronaut wires and fake liftoff sequences.

https://youtu.be/W79mIGx9Ib4

The logical answer is that the majority of the earth's populace can't fathom the possibility such "genius" men would lie and deceive.

Appealing to authority isn't just a logical fallacy it's a psychological technique.

You are asking this sub a rhetorical question because you believe what you haven't personally verified. You are hoping that the users here will be "awoken" to the absurdity that is disbelief in "authorities" and "popular consensus".

Problem is, a good many of us in this sub have personally witnessed liars lying, and have empirical objective proof of deceit by the very people you trust.

Are you so arrogant that you do not think you can be deceived? The genuinely free thinking individuals on this sub are not...

You like most people here completely avoided my simple questions.

I answered your question directly asshole.

What proof ? For what purpose ? How was such a grand deceit achieved and still kept quiet and unnoticed ?

How was such a grand deceit achieved and still kept quiet and unnoticed ?

Wait, your proof lies in no one noticing the deceit, and yet here you are attempting to draw-out information from those who do, in fact, believe they have noticed said deceit?

If it had gone "unnoticed," then you wouldn't really be here would you?

I have yet to hear a valid argument proving deceit regarding this subject.

I think people who believe the moon landings or space programs in general are a fake elaborate hoax are delusional, paranoid, wasting time spreading disinformation and I believe alot of things mentioned in conspiracy.

Which in no way changes the reality of our present dynamic. :)

Are any of you going to answer one of my questions ?

You might try r/AskScience if you want to discuss the real-world technology that would have had to be used to fake something like that.

I want to know who ordered to fake it and why bother ? How do you involve so many on such a big hoax unless aliens are breathing down their neck.

As far as I can tell, you're not looking for answers. What you're looking for is a novel full of reasons to jerk yourself off to plausible deniability. :)

In that case cuz 'Aliens' we're all just cattle.

[removed]

No need to get personal, I've removed this comment.

Rule 10, warning.

Still waiting for evidence.

If you found a pot of gold, would you tell everyone? Rich people stay rich because of the secrets they keep, and get slaves to do their bidding.

You wanna bet they're just hiding the scary stuff from us. Must be hard deal with.

Somebody's gotta do it.