Couldn't agree more! This is how to really spread the message to new minds instead of just preaching to the choir here on this sub. And it only takes 30 seconds to copy a megathread with links, you just hit "source" below the post, copy the source text (which preserves the formatting and links), and paste to a comment. Done!

Maybe 2 people are exposed to this idea they've never been exposed to before. Maybe one of them talks to their friend about it. Maybe his friend tells a group of friends. Maybe some of those people tell others. And suddenly that 30 second action you took has planted the seed for a new important idea in the minds of dozens of people. Maybe then half those people won't support a war in Syria next time they try to push for it. This is powerful, don't underestimate your power.

Thanks very much for your recent ISIS+Israel+US post!

No problem, glad it's appreciated.

Definitely have noticed a lot of link-heavy comments get posted in stuff like 9/11 treads. They kind of have a Gish Gallop vibe and rarely spawn much discussion. People just go "I support/hate this topic" and click the up or down arrow. Then they don't comment and move on.

Gish-gallops are intended to shut down discussion in a way similar to carpet bombing.

Literally no one can argue with someone who produces 30 - 40 sources, then does that really shitty "waiting", "still waiting" ten minutes afterwards, when there would be something like six or more hours involved in checking all of the sources, refuting any flaws, and then posting only to be downvoted to non-visibility.

Reasonable discussion should consider one or two points per thread.

You want to raise other points? Great. We can talk about those too. But chuck them in a separate thread.

"Skeptics" tend to overuse the term "gish gallop" to include a well-sourced list of links that is designed to give you a fuller picture of a reality, such as the fact that shills exist and are common. Take my sub /r/shills for example. The first link (shills 101) is designed to give the reader a full picture of the reality of shills. If I cite one of those links, a dirty skeptic will try to argue something such as "yea, but that doesn't happen in the US because there's an anti propaganda law." That will happen, so I am left with only citing a link which shows such a thing is legal in the US (Or I can let the back and forth argument take its course, but I don't have time for that). Also, each link is complimentary information to the others. They really should be condensed into one article by somebody.

You know that "skeptics" love to weasel their way out of a claim and draw the conversation out. Sometimes it is impossible to distinguish them from trolls. One way to prevent this is to address each of their obvious future counterarguments by providing all of the information at once. It makes the threads much neater.

Additionally, a "list of links" could also be a place that is designed to be referred back to in the future. Again, my sub /r/shills is that place. I also go back periodically to add additional information. Calling that a "gish gallop" is just a cheap attempt at discrediting all of the information at once. I hope people are not dumb enough to fall for this trick.

On the other hand, if I actually saw a low quality list of links that looked like a gish gallop, I would be right there with you calling them out. I just wanted to come by and make this important distinction here.

Remember that if you overuse the term "gish gallop" just like skeptics have overused the term "conspiracy theorist," the term will lose its sting and no longer be useful.

"Even when someone's very first exposure to an allegation of political corruption is seeing it branded as a conspiracy theory, they are no less likely to take it seriously than if it is instead called a corruption allegation."

add more fronts we should at least go back and compile all the evidence into really laser pointed, coherent narratives with a list of links.

Are you saying that we compile the sources, evidence and links somewhere here on r/conspiracy...maybe a convenient side bar resources section or file it on our home computers and laptops?

I am all for going out and spreading the word and fight for Truth. I even go into the biggest snake pit of them all, r/worldnews and do battle. It would be a big step towards achieving that kind of mission.

Sounds good to me! Thanks for the info.

Not that I disagree, but your last step sounds like what Reddit describes as "brigading". Don't need any excuses for admins to come down on this sub.

Yes, more stickied or weekly/daily discussion threads. This is one of the few places we have left.

Just as long as people don't start carving them into stone tablets, and correct issues as they come to light.

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Yes, but I had another post to worldpolitics that did great. Just have to keep trying

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Yeah, I think lots of the biggest subs could be frontpaged if one was clever enough. Most of them have a 'no politics' rule, this is probably the biggest barrier. I think all the others could be frontpaged though

[deleted]

I'd say get a list of the 10 biggest subs without a "no politics" rule. The tone is best gotten by looking at the sub itself, imo.

[deleted]

Nice! Well done. Now if anyone can come up with a clever way to get the message out in any of those subs... I'll think about it myself and see if I can come up with anything.

[deleted]

No not any exact message, it's just that many of the messages worth spreading are things they try to block

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No need to be sneaky, it's just a matter of making things fit right for the subreddit. I'm just talking about the articles and stuff I post, nothing that isn't already out there, no need to PM

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Some of my posts have a lot of up and down votes, but they just cancel so it's at zero, they're ranked high as "controversial" posts.

Yeah I think it's a bit too on the nose, maybe people need to feel like they can kind of discover this info for themselves. Or they need to dip a toe in the water before jumping right in. Or maybe just too long and needs to be condensed to the absolutely most relevant 3 links and paired with an easy to follow explanation or something. I'm not quite sure what the best approach is really, I just keep trying stuff and sometimes it sticks and sometimes it doesn't.

My post in worldpolitics was what did the best, maybe after successful posts in that sub, one could reference them in other subs and they wouldn't have the 'conspiracy' label on them.

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Yeah, of course! Feel free to copy-paste whatever I have and make any changes you like. And there's no reason to credit me or anything, just get the info out! I'll check your postings out later

technology, science, space, nottheonion, askmen, askwomen, futurology all would probably not work. The rest may work, if the post can be made appropriate for the subreddit and maintain the quality of the information.

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You have to go under the post, where it says "source" and click that. Then copy that text and the links will be included.

Alright thanks. I'm trying something out now.

shillary chimpton

lmaoo

There is also the immigration/invasion front.

Europeans are viewing the Syrian refugee crisis as the beginning to a new Muslim crusade. The media is painting these individuals as racists. Europeans are worried about preserving their culture, government and way of life.

All opposition to integrating refugees has been stifled.

Gish-gallops are intended to shut down discussion in a way similar to carpet bombing.

Literally no one can argue with someone who produces 30 - 40 sources, then does that really shitty "waiting", "still waiting" ten minutes afterwards, when there would be something like six or more hours involved in checking all of the sources, refuting any flaws, and then posting only to be downvoted to non-visibility.

Reasonable discussion should consider one or two points per thread.

You want to raise other points? Great. We can talk about those too. But chuck them in a separate thread.

"Skeptics" tend to overuse the term "gish gallop" to include a well-sourced list of links that is designed to give you a fuller picture of a reality, such as the fact that shills exist and are common. Take my sub /r/shills for example. The first link (shills 101) is designed to give the reader a full picture of the reality of shills. If I cite one of those links, a dirty skeptic will try to argue something such as "yea, but that doesn't happen in the US because there's an anti propaganda law." That will happen, so I am left with only citing a link which shows such a thing is legal in the US (Or I can let the back and forth argument take its course, but I don't have time for that). Also, each link is complimentary information to the others. They really should be condensed into one article by somebody.

You know that "skeptics" love to weasel their way out of a claim and draw the conversation out. Sometimes it is impossible to distinguish them from trolls. One way to prevent this is to address each of their obvious future counterarguments by providing all of the information at once. It makes the threads much neater.

Additionally, a "list of links" could also be a place that is designed to be referred back to in the future. Again, my sub /r/shills is that place. I also go back periodically to add additional information. Calling that a "gish gallop" is just a cheap attempt at discrediting all of the information at once. I hope people are not dumb enough to fall for this trick.

On the other hand, if I actually saw a low quality list of links that looked like a gish gallop, I would be right there with you calling them out. I just wanted to come by and make this important distinction here.

Remember that if you overuse the term "gish gallop" just like skeptics have overused the term "conspiracy theorist," the term will lose its sting and no longer be useful.

"Even when someone's very first exposure to an allegation of political corruption is seeing it branded as a conspiracy theory, they are no less likely to take it seriously than if it is instead called a corruption allegation."