In the 1980s capitalism triumphed over communism. In the 1990s it triumphed over democracy. ~ David Korten

48  2016-01-09 by no1113

23 comments

It triumphed over democracy first, actually; on Christmas Eve of 1913.

Whoosh on me. ELI5 please. Thanks.

During the holiday recess, a handful of corrupt congressmen handed the nation's money power to a handful of banksters with The Federal Reserve Act; which those men, and their progeny, have used to rule it ever since.

Ah. Got it. Good distinction then. The capitalistic machinations of the money launderers during the early 1900s lead to the Federal Reserve Act, which singlehandedly did away with any real democracy at that point that could have occurred. Correct. Astute observation, sir. Thanks for the clarification.

It's crony capitalism for fucks sake.

I would say it's more crony practitioners - crony capitalists - i.e. capitalism or communism or really any form of government for that matter will succeed or fail based more off of how it's practiced than on anything internal within the system itself.

Anarcho-capitalism is the only pure form of capitalism.

Under capitalism, man exploits man. Under communism, it's just the opposite. ~ John Kenneth Galbraith

More

TY

capitalism did not triumph over communism ... alone the petro dollar did

The petro dollar alone didn't triumph over communism. Greedy, self-serving capitalists did.

Capitalism and Communism have never truly existed. They are both Utopias. Democracy is shit, which is why we (the US) are not a democracy (well not founded on, for that matter - Democratic Republic).

A democracy because the upper class could not be trusted with a republic, and republic because the lower class could not be trusted with a democracy. It was only ever a standoff in the ongoing class war extending back to feudal times, and standoffs never last; one side or the other eventually grows tired, and lets their guard down, as working people in the US eventually did. The solution to the class war is a fairer distribution of wealth. Nothing wrong with some people being rich, but nobody should be rich enough to conspire to enslave everyone else, and that is exactly what is happening. In 1970, the average CEO compensation was 44 times that of his lowest paid employee; today it's 845. Adjusted for inflation, the 1968 minimum wage would be $22.00 an hour.

I agree, but you're missing a few other things. Globalism/consumerism. Why do you think that gap sky rocketed? Because of globalism/consumerism. That's the problem (imo). Also, minimum wage is a wash.

Wouldn't disagree with this.

The trillion dollar question is, how do we improve on the system we have after learning the trials and tribulations of past.... The pendulum swings left and right, but maybe we should figure out how to stop the pendulum ;)

The trillion dollar question is, how do we improve on the system we have after learning the trials and tribulations of past.

"By growing some fucking balls and moving forward as one united people", said no one (unfortunately).

The pendulum swings left and right, but maybe we should figure out how to stop the pendulum

The only thing I see that stands a hope of stopping the pendulum is unity. That's why TPTB work so diligently at keeping us apart, antagonistic toward one another, and disunited.

"By growing some fucking balls and moving forward as one united people", said no one (unfortunately).

Be careful though, they are pushing a trans-humanism agenda. I agree to a degree, but be careful (playing into their game). There is nothing wrong with having separate identities/heritage/sovereignty.

The only thing I see that stands a hope of stopping the pendulum is unity. That's why TPTB work so diligently at keeping us apart, antagonistic toward one another, and disunited. All fronts are thought about and planned for.

I see this 50/50. Conquer and divide is a tactic, but what I'm seeing is a oneness coming from the elites. That sends out a red flag for me, because their MO is usually divide and conquer. Remember, they are playing 3d chess.

Be careful though, they are pushing a trans-humanism agenda. I agree to a degree, but be careful (playing into their game). There is nothing wrong with having separate identities/heritage/sovereignty.

I fully understand this. I don’t mean anything that TPTB are advocating. I don’t mean not acknowledging your differences culturally, etc. I mean acknowledging the deeper truth that none of these difference mean “greater” or “less than” anyone else - which is the way that TPTB have twisted those differences as being in the minds of the masses today. “I’m better because I’m white/black/asian/native, etc, etc, etc”

It’s all bullshit. No one is better than the other. We are all one people - one species. Nothing wrong with having different cultures so long as no culture infringes upon another.

Are you better because you wear a brown shirt and I a red one? because your family has always worn shorts and mine slacks? No. Of course not. None of these differences should ever lead to a “better or less than” type of mentality. We can wear our different shirts (i.e. races/cultures)…They’re just external markings, however, and should mean nothing in term of assessing our ultimate worth.

Unity is the key. Oneness is the key. In separation, it is easy to take advantage of a divided people. Just pick them off one by one - small, splintered group by small, splintered group. The more people advocate “pride” in their culture to the extent that it creates an insular perspective in them (which such a thing often tends to do), the worse it is for everyone including the very people advocating such separation.

what I'm seeing is a oneness coming from the elites.

And that’s why it’s very important to stay away from THAT type of “oneness”. That is no real oneness. It’s no real unity. It’s not the type of oneness that promotes or leads to strength. That’s the type of oneness that promotes a weakness leading to a greater separation between the 1% and the 99%. I’m talking about a unity that involves everyone pulling their weight and not taking undue advantage of anyone else - as is the case now and as would be the case if TPTB dealt w/the “one world government/nwo” plan that they’ve been advocating for a while. That’s not the kind of “unity” I’m talking about. That’s not any type of unity at all, ultimately. I’m advocating unity that leads to strength - not weakness.

That sends out a red flag for me, because their MO is usually divide and conquer. Remember, they are playing 3d chess.

Exactly. Of course - and because it’s an MO that is usually a divide and conquer MO, it is the very thing I’m NOT talking about. Again, I’m talking about unity and strength - and that “nwo” type shit does not ultimately lead to unity and strength.

I completely agree with what you are saying. I just do not think it's in human's nature. Maybe, it's not the point of this experience? I don't know. I have many mixed feelings of things, but from what I know about history, I'm not sure humans can get to that level on "this" plane. Maybe that is the goal? But, I cannot see it, in my lifetime "experience". One day, maybe.

I just do not think it's in human's nature.

I think it is. I just think we’ve gotten indoctrinated and brain washed into think that we’re “supposed” to be apart and antagonistic toward one another, etc. “We’re supposed to look at each other as being different and with hostility!”

I think that’s all complete bullshit - and the fact that I think and feel this way (and always have) lets me know that the idea that “Humanity just can’t be together! It’s just not human nature! We’re just not made that way! We have to be separated from each other!” is just utter, complete, brain-washing bullshit. 100%.

Although I, of course, know that not everyone else is just like me, I also don’t think that I’m some sort of “atypical mutant” human being. I think I’m pretty typical enough as human beings go (I guess). The fact that, again, I understand these basic tents of unity let me know that they’re not some strange sort of alien “impossible to grasp” concept that others can’t also themselves understand.

Maybe, it's not the point of this experience?

That’s certainly a possibility, unfortunately. There’s a very real possibility that this planet and this world and this civilization is…simply a prison; just meant to be a shit place - a holding cell for identities that have either done some really bad things in previous incarnations and have to, as a result, “go to Earth to serve their sentence for crimes prior committed”, or…or this planet is the spiritual equivalent of, say, middle school. We’re grown enough to not be considered spiritual elementary school toddlers, but we’re still far from developed enough to be in spiritual high school (to say nothing about college or spiritual post graduate school).

And just as middle school can generally be said to be a time of great angst and general lameness for many kids (tons of discomfort and self consciousness, lots of growing pains, a stage where you’re just growing into a feeling of confidence and arrogance, but it’s coupled with a lot of ignorance and stupidity) we as a human species - although we can be said to be passed just being “dumb animals” - are still quite a bit…arrogant and hubristic and really nowhere near as evolved or intelligent as we think we are.

That’s where we seem to be as a species evolutionarily speaking. We think we’re all that. We think we’re “the top of the food chain!”…but that’s only because we’re so stupid in our “middle school” arrogance and have so much hubris that we don’t understand that we’re barely just growing out of the beginning stages of “mid level growth”.

We have a long way to go still.

Maybe we here on Earth are just the spiritual equivalent of some country ass kids in a country ass middle school in the rural perimeter of the Milky Way Galaxy thinking we’re cooler than we actually are. Maybe the point of life here is simply for those of us souls here in this “mid grade” to simply go through school here in “Earth Middle School” and, A) hopefully pass, and then B) hopefully move the hell on out of here into the next grade and stage of spiritual development.

I don't know.

I don’t know/am not sure either - although I have a lot of thoughts and feelings on it, as I imagine you might have discerned. ;)

I have many mixed feelings of things, but from what I know about history, I'm not sure humans can get to that level on "this" plane.

While I acknowledge that it does seem not very easy for humanity as a whole to reach the level of global togetherness that I talk about, I for one think that it would be good for the species (or at least as many members of the species as possible) to at least make the effort toward it nonetheless.

Maybe that is the goal?

Maybe what is the goal? to get to that level on this plane? Perhaps. Is that what you mean?

But, I cannot see it, in my lifetime "experience". One day, maybe.

I understand. I certainly don’t see it in the lifetime of this incarnation either. Although I try to do what I can to help, I’m not too worried the species ultimately achieving this level of development. I’m more worried about making sure that I actually pass the classes and the lessons that I’ve been given to study this time around in this life. They’re hard enough on their own and as it stands without having to worry about dealing with problems of the rest of the world. :/

Fuck democracy. We never wanted it.

Well, whatever system ultimately leads to ruin is the one that I personally "never wanted". Unfortunately, what system that is depends more upon the practitioners than the system itself. As such, almost any system is bound to succeed or fail depending upon how its executed by those individuals managing it. This seems to lend itself to a relativity that thereby makes almost any and every system an utter failure or a utopia depending upon whose hands it falls in.

The answer to what to do with these shit systems seems simple, therefore: We the people simply need to raise our level of consciousness and collectively be the actual change we wish to see in the world.

Yep. Real simple (/s). :/

Regardless of how simple or difficult it may be, however, the ultimate reins of change are really in our hands.

TY