It's good to see people falling away from Trump, regardless the reason. He is absolutely not a President of the people and anyone who believes so is misguided.

My advice: avoid that sub. Who cares what goes on there. Filter them out and let them circlejerk among themselves.

You're breaking the rules.

No worries I just wanted to give you a heads up. I guess I must have misunderstood then.

Lol reported for rule 10 enjoy your ban

I see you edited your post so I don't know what you even said haha

President of the people

Lol…and there is someone in the system that would be?

The system itself is rotten to it's core. As long as people continue to have faith in institutions they deserve to be institutionalized

The topic at hand isn't if there is someone in the system that would be, nice straw man though. What I was referring to is I have watched Trump time and time again (including his inauguration) say that he is his presidency is for the People but his actions haven't been synonymous to that claim.

Your happiness that people are turning from him tells me you think there's somewhere better for people to go. Where is that, exactly?

Cuz if you're expecting someone else to provide "hope and change" within the current system you're seriously deluded

Because a demagogue without unquestioning followers is merely a blowhard.

Because a demagogue without unquestioning followers is merely a blowhard.

unquestioning followers

They are precisely what the two party system is based upon

Yes, because clearly Bernie Sanders is no different than Donald Trump. FDR was no different than Hoover, Carter was no different than Reagan and Lincoln was no different than George McClellan.

I am sick and tired of people who are too goddamned lazy to learn the history of and the mechanics of our government sitting around and claiming that there is no difference or that "they are all the same" when the contrast between individuals candidates and elected representatives is often massive.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8rSxKv7hg4

And I know this is going to go in one ear and out the other... but if you want to make such a strong claim then I want you to attempt to sway my opinion with a coherent argument with legitimately sourced information

with legitimately sourced information

According to those people, only zerohedge, infowars, randompizzagate youtubers and brietbart/fox are the only "news".

Everything else was a magic fairytale made up by CNN and other fake news. Even if you go read news in different languages from different places-- even then when it corroborates the "fake news" it's a giant, terrifying liberal conspiracy!

They got a moral panic too so if you dont agree they can shame you by calling you a pedophile. Shame people into agreeing. Shit is gross.

Yes there are differences in the most superficial of ways…but with the amount of money required to compete every candidate is beholding to someone.

Yeah maybe Bernie would have been different…maybe…but as you saw he wasn't allowed to even really compete. But really…would Bernie have abolished the Fed? Ended Israel's hold over Washington? You know…the things that really matter?

Hillary is terrible, but she would've been better.

Absolutely no fuckin' way. She'd have made a child molesting piece of shit like Podesta complete with a fancy title and powah. That woman had our demise on the tip of her crooked nose, and we barely missed that trainwreck.

Now I know the shills are out. Hillary would've been better. You've lost your goddamned mind.

I'm a shill because I think she would be better than one of the worst presidents in modern history?

Ok.

Alright, maybe not a shill. Not very bright, sure, but maybe not a shill. I take the shill thing back, sorry.

He is president to exactly his core, and that's it.

You shouldn't be downvoted, nothing is even going to change in either direction until we have some sort of complete political reform. Everybody in either of the two major parties (yes, including Trump) are owned, and we aren't going to see ANYTHING change until we can stop that.

He is literally going down the checklist fulfilling campaign promises. There is very, very little to complain about.

If he's super anti weed then fine, one thing I wouldn't agree with him on. Let's see how it plays out

Division Techniques - find the first concrete division point within a group, grand-stand it and make it a polar issue. Pump the importance, the gravity. Context? Actions? That's then, this is now. Agents should be acting now. ShareBlue is thick and quick on this issue, running it into the ground. Could it be more important? Ask some of the "concerned" folk here on ... well, I'm sure you smell what I'm steppin' in.

I'm with you, it's just weed. It's not the end of time.

There is if you didn't agree with his campaign in the first place.

The dirty secret of r/the_Donald is that their mods are the biggest censors of all. Mention Israel in anything less than a worshipful light over there and see how that works out for you.

Before r/altright was banned, there were several lengthy threads full of people who had come over after being banned from T_D for really ridiculous reasons.

I myself was banned for daring to question the Treasury Secretary appointment, without warning, permanent ban.

It will backfire on them at some point, I'm sure.

This is why I can't respect them. They can't possibly criticize any aspect of their dear leader.

I love Obama, but I can easily come up with a list of things he's done that I disagree with.

You love Obama... and you're in this sub?

For the millionth time, this sub is not a Donald Trump circlejerk. Anyone is allowed to be here and take part in discussions. Let him live

Why are you talking about Donald Trump? I was talking about Barack Obama.

Why the fixation on partisan politics?

you just gave that guy shit because he said he liked Obama, and I'm fixated on partisan politics? ok man

It's fairly hard to like both conspiracies and Obama since Obama is heavily implicated in a lot of conspiracies.

maybe, but it's not up to members of the sub to judge who gets to read about conspiracies here and who doesn't based on what they think. we aren't the thought police here.

No one is stopping anyone. Theres a difference between being supressed and not being the loudest voice in the room.

I never said anyone was stopping people from being here, I just pointed out that HDJ was being a dick to that guy. this thread only got so long bc he randomly accused me of being partisan hack instead of considering what i actually said

It's because alot of this conversation is meaningless, to the point where it its almost like double speak. Spend more time and thought on your posts and you will get a better reception even if its still through disagreement.

my main goal when i post on this sub isn't to get "good reception" i could care less tbh, but thanks for the advice dude!

Posting good content is not based in wether its generaly agreeable or not. Post good information and people will always be at least apreciative and more receptable to oposing opinions. By "good reception" Im not saying you have to suck cock for upvotes.

we're....still talking about this? i've kind of moved on to the next thing

Nah I think weve summed everything up pretty well I wont keep you

Nah, he's right HDJ was being a hack and kind of a dick. AC-phil is in the clear here champ. No need to critique.

http://reactiongif.org/wp-content/uploads/GIF/2014/08/GIF-Amused-flirt-flirting-game-of-thrones-Peter-Dinklage-please-smile-GIF.gif

I see you. Tell Brock the commoners always come to collect their dues eventually.

Nah there's no conspiracy against you, you're just wrong. It's arrogant to assume every time you see someone disagree it's a paid shill on the other side. Not too healthy for you mentally either.

Why don't you tell him yourself? Put your tinfoil hat on first, he can hear you.

Not everyone that disagrees with you is some arm of the establishment, people just think you're wrong. It's pretty arrogant to think that when other people say you're wrong it's a government conspiracy against you. You're not that important.

I wasnt wrong, I didnt even comment on if what he said was right or wrong, he was being strawmanned and downvoted and I didnt agree. And you know what's going on here with shareblue because it was a pretty narrow reference I made. No need to write a paragraph presuming stuff about me if you arent at least going to be intelegent about it.

It's not a narrow reference every partisan on here throws that name around constantly.

No need to write a paragraph presuming stuff about me i

Your projection is strong. I simply said you can't accept being wrong and insist instead there's some conspiracy to downvote you. Which you've just doubled down on for a second time! Tell me again how I'm being presumptuous.

I didnt really have a strong enough opinion on the original matter tbh just the replies. Theres not a conspiracy surounding me. I think your abit confused mate.

everyone is implicated in a lot of conspiracies, i heard a conspiracy that said /u/NationalDenbt is a reptilian hyper-shill from Jupiter's forbidden moon...

There is one strand of Narrative which suggests George Soros and other important people are part of a nonsensical left-wing conspiracy, this ties Obama and Hillary and all sorts of other people into a complex network of shadow cartels and Illuminati hi-jinks however this is only one of many conspiracy based narratives - a much more plausible one suggests that the European Aristocracy who used to rule most the world continue aided and merged with various colonial developments (rich americans) this theory makes a lot of sense because unlike the counter-theory 'obama and the nwo' it has a rational start point, during the age of empire the aristocracy of Europe really did rule most of the world, especially England who used economic and military power to carve an empire the sun never set on and declare defacto global hegemony... that this continues is all but proven by the fact there's no point in history where it ever stops, in Britain the queen still has a shiny hat ffs.

So what happened is people started working together to create a better world for themselves, french and american revolution for example however power wasn't just a document it's a physical thing - money, food, and weapons are what really matters... the very rich used their power and influence to make sure they got richer at the expense of everyone else and to scupper the electoral process and government every change it gets - when the government is week people can't combine their resources and efforts so the rich have all the real power - for centuries a very powerful cartel of ultra wealthy criminals has been actively working to undermine any for of progress that help's the people and everything to enforce system that compel people into endless servitude which benefits the bosses a lot more than the workers...

this is who organisations like Fox News support, notice how they'll flit from one set of values to another without any regard for consistency? that's because none of it matters to them, they're just trying to find the weakpoint of everything and cause as much conflict and confusion as possible because that stops people being able to organise and do more positive things... it's about spreading doubt, confusion, conflict and slowing down the advance of progress so that their well funded lobbyists can get in there first and rig the system to favour the mega-rich.

every high-profile person is implicated in conspiracies. they're even regularly directly accused of conspiracy.

when it comes to national politicians, the questions are: who are they helping? who are they trying to help? who are they hurting?

Yes, the only reason to criticize Obama is partisan politics. Not because he knowingly funded ISIS, and gave cluster bombs to the Saudis and...

you didn't criticize Obama, you criticized u/zachar3 by suggesting he shouldn't be here bc of who he likes or doesn't like

You are having trouble reading.

You love Obama... and you're in this sub?

you didn't say "you like obama? obama sucks", you said "you like obama? why are you here?"

As i read it hes just highlighting his suprise that you can be into conspiracy theories at the momment and view obama as anything more than ambiguous. Its you guys who are sperg'ing out over it all imo...

I hail from the roads of r/all

Get the fuck out of here. Adults are conversing.

Somewhat refreshing to see this sub turn its' back on Trump, but that's not what this sub is about.

Let's talk about some Ufo's and missing people.

As an outsider (from Scotland), I subscribed here for that sort of thing. I came close to unsubscribing until I seen this post today. I didn't come to read political bias, isn't this supposed to be where it's ousted for the greater good and accountability? If politically different people can't come together to expose corruption, what fucking hope is there?

Why is that a probem? this isn't T_D Part 2 despite some signalling otherwise. Many long time lurkers are left leaning and are not necessarily /pol/tards

What the fuck are you 13? No sense at all about the history of this subreddit, you've got the pulse for about a minute, GTFO newfag.

I'm an Obama fan and a skeptic. So basically opposite of what this sub represents. I come here for exactly that reason. Self affirming discussions bore the hell out of me. I like my ideas to be challenged.

skeptic of what? you think that the fbi didn't conspire against Malcolm X, Martin Luther King, Fred Hampton, Marcus Garvey, and other notable black activists? think the CIA didn't try to assassinate, discredit and destroy pretty much every left-wing leader ever to be democratically elected anywhere in the world? think that a cartel of the richest people in the world aren't manipulating current events to try and maintain control?

the word conspiracy doesn't mean 'things the right-wing want everyone to believe about their enemies' and we need to stop acting like it does, there are some very real conspiracies in the world and many of them unsurprisingly involve the richest people in the world trying to keep and increase their wealth and power at the detriment to everyone else. i.e. the right-wing agenda.

you think that the fbi didn't conspire against Malcolm X, Martin Luther King, Fred Hampton, Marcus Garvey, and other notable black activists?

Oh god know, that's pretty much common knowledge by this point, isn't it?

think the CIA didn't try to assassinate, discredit and destroy pretty much every left-wing leader ever to be democratically elected anywhere in the world?

You lost me with "left-wing" and "democratically". Barring the fact that I don't think that many of the people we've fucked with over the past 60 years have fallen into either of those categories, we're pretty equal opportunity when it comes to fucking over people for gains. If anything we just tend to do it with nations that aren't white.

think that a cartel of the richest people in the world aren't manipulating current events to try and maintain control?

While it comes as no surprise that the rich and powerful attempt to use control to remain more rich and powerful, I find it very dubious as to whether or not there is any significant collaboration across varying industries.

But you've also only listed some of the things to be least skeptical about. For instance there's the elephant in the room, Pizzagate. Most of the shit talked about on that is fan fiction at best. Don't get me started when people start talking about demons. Chemtrails, vaccines, GMOs, heart attack guns. It's perfectly reasonable to take a skeptical view and also still be interested in the topic.

Barring the fact that I don't think that many of the people we've fucked with over the past 60 years have fallen into either of those categories

i always forget how differently Americans view the world. uncle ho disagrees

but yes oppressing the third world is basically the engine of capitalism, this is why so many people say capitalism is a systemic evil which needs to end. [see: uncle ho]

there's the elephant in the room, Pizzagate.

you can't believe everything, especially if there's no reason to believe it. Of course Obama isn't the antichrist, i don't even believe in jebus let alone god and the devil... of course hillary doesn't eat children, she's just a wolly liberal without enough of a soul [see spinoza] to resist the call of the hawk... of course three scientists didn't die in a gas explosion on the moon in 1936, why would they be using gas when they already had psychotoronic free-energy wheels?

but uh, the heart attack gun isn't demons, congress believe in the cia heart attack gun - http://www.military.com/video/guns/pistols/cias-secret-heart-attack-gun/2555371072001 - democratic senator Frank Church believed it, why do you think you get to write it off with a wave of your hand? and do you really think the cia wouldn't at least try to assassinate people with heart attack guns? have you read how many times they tried and what obscure methods they resorted to try and kill comrade Castro?

yes of course you're a fool to believe everything that's spouted in a a hyperbolic infowars shitpost but get some serious docs in there, some court testimony, a bit of video evidence and you've got yourself a stew going....

I'm not going to say that Vietnam wasn't a shit show that the US should have never gotten involved with, but are you honestly going to compare a communist revolution (during which it can't be discounted that political rivals were killed) makes one a democratically elected leader? Seriously, come the fuck on. That example is only vaguely usable due to the fact that the average American has zero fucking knowledge of the guy before the war, and the people who do likely got their knowledge in a Red Scare highschool history lesson, but ye ain't backing up your claim.

I actually wasn't waving off the heart attack gun, I think it's perfectly sound scientifically and historically. I'm not certain that it's correct, but I can't really see anything to rule it out as a possibility.

My point was that this is certainly a place for skeptics, particularly when people can sit down and talk like adults. The people responding with "cuck" however, IMHO, should just be fucking banned.

well no of course he wasn't technically 'democratically elected' because that would be literally impossible, the Viet Minh who wrestled control of Vietnam away from the french oppressor never had a chance to establish a fair and just system for the people because when the imperialist forces of old Europe were defeated they called on their bully boy America to come and drop chemical weapons and fire on villages burning innocent men, women and children to agonising death and causing chemical problems which persist the form of high incidences of birth defects to this very day... the exact same method of ultra-violence, shock and awe [i.e. terror] and pure brutality unleashed by America on any nation that's ever tried to free itself from the oppressive grasp of the old masters...

is the game really not obvious enough for you?!

My point was that this is certainly a place for skeptics

it's a place for sceptics not denialists, it's a place to judge each and EVERY thing on it's merits and not take anything for granted - that includes the 'official story' or 'conceived wisdom' just because it totally seems like it should be true or we'd really like it to be true doesn't mean it is. we should never lump all conspiracies together and treat them as equal any more than we should lump all objects starting with a together and treat them as identical, you'd have trouble when they rushed you to hospital in an apple for trying to take a bite out of an aardvark...

The people responding with "cuck" however, IMHO, should just be fucking banned.

yes, yes they should.

is the game really not obvious enough for you?!

Yap yap yap. I'm not disagreeing with any of that. Vietnam had the utter misfortune of trying this after there were enough global powers interesting in stopping this but before there were enough global powers to keep them from being stomped. They attempted a violent revolution, and like most violent revolutions they angered enough people to get shat upon. I wish it had gone differently, but you can't be a minority power forcing out a majority powers puppet, kill the rest of your opposition, and then somehow expect things to be all hugs and puppies after.

I'm not a typical American. I know for a fact that we've done some ridiculously fucked up shit. I also can acknowledge that some of it was done with good intentions of those involved, some of it wasn't, and that we've more or less fucked up every pie we've tried to bake in the past 60 years. Unfortunately, I think a lot of that is due to the fact that humans are just plain fucked.

yes, yes they should.

Well, at least there's that.

some of it was done with good intentions of those involved

so what percentage of babies in Vietnam that were set on fire were done with good intentions?

if you think that America is essentially just the heroic policeman of the world making the hard choices that had to be made for the greater good then you're absolutely delusioned and every bit a typical american.

This idealistic notion of america as a bumbling hero is absolutely childish, the people of america are often amazing and awesome people but the organisation which controls the government is (exactly like in the uk) absolutely corrupt and evil - honestly the pizzzagate people who think the elites are eating children in DC restaurants are closer to reality than the absolutely insane notion the establishment is doing everything it can do to help people and wishes it could do more...

Well, at least there's that.

it's enough for me... [leans in to kiss]

so what percentage of babies in Vietnam that were set on fire were done with good intentions?

Honestly? A non-zero percentile. I think it's inconceivable that at least some of the decision makers didn't go that route under the logic that it was either our citizens or theirs dead, and really I don't envy that.

I think that there are some individuals who have been ignorant or deluded on our military actions. I don't think that everyone involved in Iraq Round 1 was intent on protecting Iranian oil money, and I think it's naive to believe some of them didn't genuinely see Iraq as a valid humanitarian threat at the time. I can equally some in Iraq Round 2 just seeing Saddam as someone who was never going to mesh with western interests and it would be in the best interests of the planet to snuff him out.

And then there are the absolute knob-gobblers pushing through conflict overseas via lies for monetary gain, and the spineless degenerates who do the same for political gain. And yeah, unfortunately the gobblers and degenerates seem to be in a majority.

it's enough for me... [leans in to kiss]

Sorry about the beard

it was either our citizens or theirs dead

yeah right because they thought they were going to get the boat over and invade america? really? you believe that?

I think it's naive to believe some of them didn't genuinely see Iraq as a valid humanitarian threat at the time.

yeah right, because there's nothing else that spending literally billions of dollars could do which might have a more positive humanitarian impact? destabilising and entire region and taking control of their oil isn't something you do because you love the people and feel bad they have a leader no more cruel than a hundred others they're close friends with...

And then there are the absolute knob-gobblers pushing through conflict overseas via lies for monetary gain,

there are two types the short sighted and the long, both are evil and stupid

yeah right because they thought they were going to get the boat over and invade america? really? you believe that?

I was referring to the soldiers overseas. I would have assumed that was obvious from context?

because there's nothing else that spending literally billions of dollars could do which might have a more positive humanitarian impact?

Don't mean to make you lose your boner, but have you been reading what I said here? That part about assholes being a majority. I was talking on the stupidity of black and white morality on the real world, and more specifically bringing the conversation away from baby-napalm-burning.

For what it's worth, the Iraq and Iran armies were smashing each other over and over again with no real sign of stopping. At a certain point it's obvious that financial motivations played the significant part, but realistically either party could have been sided with. Saddam simply made a better enemy on paper.

there are two types the short sighted and the long, both are evil and stupid

I'm not sure if that statement displays a pathological distrust of humanity, or an utter incapability to emphasise with the nuance of another human mind. There's never black and white. This isn't a novel.

I was referring to the soldiers overseas.

who weren't there before they went there - why would they go there to protect themselves if they're not already there?

more specifically bringing the conversation away from baby-napalm-burning.

yes it'd be nice if you'd done that before they set fire to the babies....

the Iraq and Iran armies were smashing each other over and over again with no real sign of stopping

ah so we sided with Iran and went out of our way to help Iran and get the toppled Iraq back on it's feet so it's people could prosper.... yah.... it was a war far oil, for control and dominance of the middle east - if they wanted to do good things then there's a million things that'd have been more effective, the rarely do anything that actually makes things better but they always manage to maintain or increase their power and keep the impoverished regions firmly under the jackboot...

face it, we're the badguys. just because you've never personally withheld food from a family forcing the parents to watch their baby wither away and starve doesn't mean you're not part of the system that fights incredibly brutal wars to maintain a system which enforces this reality on literally billions of people. yes there's nuance, yes if you struggle against the system and put more effort into resisting it than you get showered upon you just by being part of it then maybe you're not such a bad person after all... but in all regards yes this is a novel, if the novels you're reading don't have nuance then read some better books - this novel is called history and it's going to be read by our decedents.

who weren't there before they went there - why would they go there to protect themselves if they're not already there?

Are you intentionally ignoring the multiple times that I stated that we shouldn't have been over there?

Lemme put it in plain words: yes, when American soldiers were already in Vietnam I believe it's a non-zero-percentage that someone, for the best intentions, decided that the risk of firebombing Vietnamese children was preferable to the loss of lives by drafted American soldiers.

yes it'd be nice if you'd done that before they set fire to the babies....

Man, I wasn't even fucking alive during the Vietnam War. I've done nothing in my life to support actions like that. Sorry, but I'm not going to take personal guilt for something that my father was in university during.

face it, we're the badguys.

At no point have I disagreed with this. We've fucked up a lot of things from malignant meddling, and we've fucked up even more by pretending to ourselves that we're doing the "right thing".

when American soldiers were already in Vietnam

but we're talking about the people that had a choice, it's stupidly easy to find people who don't have a choice and say 'oh everything is nuanced and complex because this guy is a victim too' but firstly no, not Vietnam, if you went to Vietnam you're a terrible person -- plenty of good people made a moral choice and resisted. None of this really matters though because the actions of people who have no option don't count for anything, it's the people who do choose that matter and those people chose to smash an effort by people trying to organise a better life away from the oppression of western imperialism and they did it because they were scared uf working people started getting on their feet then there would be no one to do act as cheap labour and they wouldn't be able to make such vast profits...

I've done nothing in my life to support actions like that.

things like that are happening now

if you're not actively resisting the system then you're supporting it and enabling it, simple as that.

and sorry but i agree with Zizek, people know what's going on you're just choosing not to think about so you don't have to change to a more moral system - you're actively complicit in the evil.

I'm skeptic in that i need logical evidence in order to believe something. For example, the Pizzagate stuff doesnt warrant belief.

yes i know what a skeptic is but i'm saying you're exactly the same as everyone in this sub, there is no default position - some people believe pizzagate, some [often the same] believe american exceptionalism, and some believe absolutely anything the tv, government or local sports team tells them - these same people who demand evidence for pizzagate blithely accept the warren commission as gospel....

to be a skeptic only of 'conspiracy theories' is to be naive to the fact the term conspiracy theory was popularised explicitly to discredit people who pointed out how corrupt the system is....

They can't possibly criticize any aspect of their dear leader.

It's a subreddit created specifically for pro-trump posts, so the thing. It's not really difficult to understand. What happens when you post something negative about Hillary in her subreddit (whatever it's called). There is nothing conspiratorial about wanting to keep the Trump hate out of a pro-Trump sub, but there is definitely nothing wrong with looking wrong with certain agendas outside of that seemingly being pushed by certain mods.

There have been plenty of critical opinions within the posts on /r/the_Donald especially a couple of months back when someone was pushing the "praise Israel" agenda with multiple pro-Israel posts. Plenty of people commented with "let's make America great, not other countries" and did not get banned.

I was for Bernie and regularly pointed out her faults over in her sub, got lots of down votes but I was never banned.

Same here, I criticized their stupid advertising strategy, got upvotes, never was even warned by a mod.

i love obama

How can you possibly rationalize loving Obama?

He's gentle when he makes love to you

He brought me a towel afterwards.

It's pretty easy, actually. Especially if you or someone you love has a pre-existing condition that limited their insurance options. And it's only getting easier to respect his time in office after seeing that shit-show that's going down in the White House right now.

That's an emotional argument. Obama bombing a shit load of muslim countries, aggressively attacking dispensaries, punishing whistleblowers more than any of the prev presidents combined, and much more is why most rational and anti 'obama is so cool cause hes black' media narrative, dislike him

That's an emotional argument.

It's not my fault you asked to rationalize an emotion.

My bad. I assumed that since you love Obama, you thought he was a good president (which is what I was arguing against)

Well, I did think he was a very good president. I know I'm not going to change your mind on that, so why even bother debating your points? I guess I'll point out that my biggest issues with him were his stances on the surveillance state -- that was total nonsense in my mind. But otherwise I think he left the country in much better condition than it was in 2008 when we were on the verge of economic collapse.

Can you state anything apart from ObamaCare that actually improved the state of America?

You mean aside from him helping to bring the country back from the brink of economic collapse during the worst recession in our nation's history?

Well, I voted for him based on his campaign promises, so I guess I'll point to those. Here's 13 pages worth of them.

interesting il take a look at that later. Could you provide a rebuttal for any of my points ?

On the topic of dispensaries: I witnessed some of these crackdowns first-hand. The people the feds came after weren't legit and in many cases were targeted for reasons other than pot. One farm near me had an underground dog-fighting pit, another was a front for a Mexican cartel.

When all was said and done, the pot industry had grown to a multi-billion dollar a year industry, so I don't think it's fair to say Obama 'aggressively' went after dispensaries. He signed memos explicitly stating that the DEA should turn a blind eye to legal growers. My only issue is that he should've gone further and pushed for full legalization.

Emotional argument for an emotion?

Lol so free shit is enough to get you to ignore bombing hospitals and Syrians?

Free shit? I pay for my insurance dude.

And I want to see your short list of presidents that managed to get through their terms without shedding blood while protecting the country. I also want to know how you would have handled ISIS while still keeping our troops off the ground.

Protecting the...country? Obama armed ISIS. They exist due to the vestiges of Bush's policies which Obama dutifully continued. Are you kidding? What happened to the antiwar Democrats? Have you no fucking shame?

Nope, no shame. And not a democrat.

And I highly doubt you would have handled such a complex situation any better. He inherited a shitshow of a problem and did what he thought was best. That's all any man can do.

Handling the situation literally any other way would have been better, bootlicker.

Lol like how Trump approves a raid that kills American service men and kills children and destroys hundreds of millions of dollars of helicopters.

You'll find no defense of Trump from me. I was rebuking the man above us with his ass where his head is.

It's pretty easy if you forget the fact that he dropped one bomb every 20 minutes for 8 years in the Middle East.

You got a credible source on that?

Working now but a quick search brought me to this site and quote for 2016.

Looking back at President Obama’s legacy, the Council on Foreign Relation’s Micah Zenko added up the defense department’s data on airstrikes and made a startling revelation: in 2016 alone, the Obama administration dropped at least 26,171 bombs. This means that every day last year, the US military blasted combatants or civilians overseas with 72 bombs; that’s three bombs every hour, 24 hours a day.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jan/09/america-dropped-26171-bombs-2016-obama-legacy

It's pretty easy to ignore that when you realize he likely wouldn't have engaged in those wars to begin with and was a president entering an administration already at war, and someone who just so happened to be THE FIRST BLACK PRESIDENT OF THE USA, after a string of FOURTY-THREE WHITE MEN OVER 200 YEARS OF SUCCESSION.

Humans have a HARD time dealing with change of any kind. Face it: the real problem for you and the rest of T_D was seeing a non-White (or Partial White) in the White House, and NOT his politics.

You really think that 8 years of republicans not giving him an inch had ANYTHING to do with Obama's centrist approach? He was the first president to be vilified openly during a fucking state of the union address for fucks sake. Remember "YOU LIE!" ? Yea. That's what you get for being a fucking black dude in the White House. NO one has ever broken decorum like that for any other president in recent history, likely ever. The racists and war hawks (same people) who make up congress kept Obama from accomplishing his goals.

Blacks make up 37 million out of 303 million in this country or about, 12%. There are 100 senators in the US Senate and only TWO are black, making it 2% of the senate legislative body.

How the fuck can you not see that as underrepresentation?

T_Ders and anyone else will always claim that they aren't racist and yet EVERYTHING THEY SUPPORT OR SAY OTHERWISE IS OBVIOUSLY RACIST AS FUCK...

"It's easy to ignore the things that actually matter about a president if you instead just focus on race instead"

r/politics is that way. That's where your bogus identity politics belong

bogus identity politics

Race exists, we're not living in post-racist times yet. It very much affected how Obama acted and how other politicans acted towards him

I never said it doesn't exist, I said making it THE most important thing in any discussion is absurd.

That's not what you said at all, fam.

No, it's actually exactly what I said

Please point me to it.

Can we be fucking friends man? Like real shit.

I always see this on reddit, and I'm always curious as well. Obama made the same garbage foreign policy decisions as W, with similar outside influences controlling him. We slid further into debt. Job growth gets thrown around, but how many of those jobs were wage slave tier? All our leaders have been garbage since I was born. The government is sick.

It gets easier every day

Whilst I understand you probably dislike Trump, this doesn't excuse the cancerous acts that Obama did whilst he was president

Sure; but it's hard to take his critics seriously when they almost completely focus on stories they made up in their head.

Policies aside; at least he was well spoken and somewhat competent

I don't know much about that. My problem with Obama is that he claimed he enjoyed marijuana when he was younger, then went ahead and made it a class A drug, he continued the retarded war on the east, he prosecuted more whisteblowers than all prev presidents combined, he also shutdown the most amount of dispensaries than any prev presidents, and much more. It also doesn't help that every dumbass 14 year old feminist believes he was the greatest president ever

Trust me; if you dislike Obama for those reasons, you're gonna have a tough next 4 years

Oh I know. I already dislike trump but still would choose him over shillary any day. They are both puppets for corporate overlords and I guess tbh we are choosing these candidates based on their personalities more than their actual policies (mainly)

My problem with Obama is that he claimed he enjoyed marijuana when he was younger, then went ahead and made it a class A drug

Marijuana was classed this way long before Obama was in office.

he also shutdown the most amount of dispensaries than any prev presidents

He also allowed a record number to open.

The response to this comment is confirmation for me that I'm this is one giant shareblue post. The whole post seemed forced and we've seen how easy it is to buy comments and upvotes for cheap. This just did it for me.

His humility.

I could list 50 other non-political reasons, if you want.

You really think his public personality mirrors his personal personality?

Obama was said to always find the dissenter in a room full of smart people to pick their brain. If someone disagreed with him, he wanted to know why to make sure he wasn't missing something.

That is the definition of intellectual humility.

The dirty secret of r/the_Donald is that their mods are the biggest censors of all. Mention Israel in anything less than a worshipful light over there and see how that works out for you

I've noticed that too. I think there are literal Mossad agents on the mod team.

No, there are Russian agents in the_donald

lol

If CTR can be shills why can't Russians?

I won't entertain your delusion. You have the whole of Reddit and and the MSM for that.

They can be and probably are, but that's literally what a CIA/NSA shill would say lol. And I'm sure they are all over Reddit purporting that

The Russian 'Troll army" as the Netherlands named them is a real thing and was uncovered when the Dutch were doing their MH17 investigation. The whole 'shit posting' tactic is what they used on subs like worldnews in any thread that was critical of Russia. This was going on in 2014 and 2015 when things were going down in Ukraine. Hell even the 4D chess meme was heavily used by them. They would claim Putin is playing 4D chess and Obama is playing tic tac toe etc.

Anyways there are a lot of similarities.

The Russian 'Troll army" as the Netherlands named them is a real thing and was uncovered when the Dutch were doing their MH17 investigation. The whole 'shit posting' tactic is what they used on subs like worldnews in any thread that was critical of Russia. This was going on in 2014 and 2015 when things were going down in Ukraine. Hell even the 4D chess meme was heavily used by them. They would claim Putin is playing 4D chess and Obama is playing tic tac toe etc.

Anyways there are a lot of similarities.

the 4D chess meme

That meme is like 2009 old at least. And it's just a modification on the "X is playing checkers, while Y is playing chess", which may be ancient and was at least already used in 2001 film Training Day.

Your post made me curious, apparently checkers with a 64 square board was invented in the 12th century, while earlier versions have been found as far back as 1600 BC.

Neat!

CTR is a fraction of the Russian Troll Army.

Cybercrime and psyops are their largest national export.

...I hope you're kidding, because Russia hates Clinton.

Perhaps both?

neah just the plain old JIDF

/r/The_Donald is not a place to discuss both sides, it's for when you just wanna talk about the positives. The mods make that painfully clear, just because you can't read the sidebar doesn't mean they're mindless tyrants, they told you you'd be banned if you go against the rules.

Are the rules fair? No, of course not, they openly admit that because it's not that type of sub. If you want to openly discuss it go to 8chan or something of the like.

8chan is not open and fair when it comes to /pol/ they'll ban you in an instant if you don't play along with the alt-right neo nazi circle jerk they got going on.

I got banned for saying it was annoying that the sub was melting down when that comedian tweeted a joke about Barron Trump. I said we shouldn't be getting all upset about a joke, and people were acting just like SJWs.

Banned permanently for being an "annoying cunt". Fucking triggered.

It's because the group think and turf are engineered - because Trump is a Zionist puppet.

I generally so hate it when people claim that others are a Zionist puppet... my mouse hovered over the downvote button... but my conscience grabbed my finger and forced it to press the upvote because, dammit, you are right.

Sounds like the little snowflakes need a safe space.

that's what trump would do

T_d: fuck pc culture Comedian: Barron trump looks like a school shooter T_d: hey man not cool you shouldn't joke about people families Rest of the world: DO YOU KNOW WHAT PC CULTURE IS? T_d: fuck off faggots maga!

You don't support the hive mind? The hive mind doesn't support you

You know what I'm going over there right now with the purpose of getting perma-banned in one post, brb!

I see a lot of people mention you can't say anything bad about Israel in not only t_d but in MSM too. Why is that?

omg hororcost!!!!

If you want to know who controls you find who you can't criticize.

You're getting a stereotypical /r/conspiracy response, but the truth of the matter is because it's an insanely fucked up situation with multiple viewpoints and all of them go frothing mad in the face of opposition. It's one of those topics that almost no one is capable of discussing rationally.

I was banned for calling out one of their posters for creating the most mind-numbingly disingenuous framing of the Milo controversy I have ever seen, suggesting that Milo's book was cancelled for something he said about Germany and not the borderline NAMBLA shit he said in those tapes, this image.

They are so far gone at this point that Trump himself could be caught in a pedo sting and they'd say "he was just infiltrating it so when they came after him they would find the other pedos, 4D CHESS"

Trump and his new labor secretary have deep ties to Jeffrey Epstein, I wouldn't be surprised if he does have some underage shenanigans in his past.

There's allegations that have been around for years and years that Trump has definitely diddled some kiddies in his time. On mobile right now, but fifteen different women have come forward with stories of Trump sexually assaulting them, the youngest being a 13 year old girl at the time Trump violently raped her (allegedly).

They all do. It's a way for their shadow gov to control them.

I wouldn't be surprised if he does have some underage shenanigans in his past.

I mean he's awfully close with Ivanka.

I would say T_D is the biggest source of fake news on reddit through censorship and an unexplainable trend of getting to the top of /r/all at all times. They get outright fake news brigaded to teh top of /r/all and ban anyone who calls it out.

Like this post from yesterday, the article didn't even get the name of the organization right and its a Christian lobbying group but anyone who called it out got banned.

Lol I was banned for asking why everyone was typing in caps

I got banned for saying, during the Milo debate, that both the left and the right should condemn paedophilia instead of defending Milo and George Takei. Banned within an hour.

Considering how we are constantly called Nazis and anti semites - I can see why they would be sensitive on jewelry criticism

I got banned for being a concern troll, what the fuck does that even mean?

Not even a secret. There's an entire subreddit of people banned from T_D.

I am so confused why anyone would think posting non pro Trump shit in a pro Trump forum would be allowed... I cant go to Islams subreddit and talk about athiesm. You guys are a bit crazy. Why go to a subreddit about ford cars and talk about mitsubishi cars? How hard is it to understand?

It's a little different when the subreddit abuses its power to spread outright fake news by pushing it to the top of /r/all.

T_D mods routinely and consistently allow fake news articles to stay on the subreddit (which usually place in the top 10 of /r/all) and bans everyone who calls it out with evidence-based responses, even if the comments are not anti-Trump.

I get banning anti-Trump comments because yes its a pro-Trump subreddit but when you start exposing the entirety of this site to fake news articles and cover up the fact that its fake news is a HUGE problem.

Comment like this usually attract their cops to cross-check the ban. Last time I commented using my another account about the ban, one cop came and give the reason of the ban.

The dirty secret of r/the_Donald is that their mods are the biggest censors of all

Dirty secret? It's been known since forever that they are one of, if not the most censored sub on the website. People celebrate the censorship and don't give a shit. The fact that you guys struggle call it a dirty secret shows how ridiculous the situation is.

Oh well, nobody is fucking surprised.

I, too, am banned for ridiculous reason. Can u/futurenactiveaccount corroborate me? I wonder how he can know why someone got banned from TD without being mod there.

Sorry? What?

I found that you usually checked the background why someone got banned from the TD despite you aren't mod there.

It was never a secret. It was always like this. You probably just thought it was funnny or that they were just attacking the sub. T_D is a walking breathing example of "First they came for..."

I got banned because I literally posted a date. They posted an article about refugee rapes in Sweden that was months old, passing it off as new. I posted the date the article was written: banned.

I was banned from the_donald for being a "Bernie cuck" after a single comment.

I was asking somebody if they thought it was ok to post a picture of blackface while making fun of black people. They did.

I was banned just for clarifying thst he isnt a pro gay rights csndidate, holding up a rainbow flag during a campaign means nothing when your intent is to let states individually reduce rights.

Why is this your only comment ever.

I remember seeing a while back, there was a video on the front page of t_d of french police arresting some drug dealer. It was falsely titled as something like "Muslim refugees assaulting french citizens". A guy in the comments tried to correct it by providing proof that the title was incorrect. He had like 400+ upvotes, then, mods just removed his comment - really shameful.

You ban dissent when you dont have other effective means, like arguments.

And while this is conspiracy, and honestly many here interpret maybe a little too much into things, I think its a sound strategy by Trumpers to enforce strict obedience, because the alternative is to lose your only connection to the group.

This is like the jehovas witness shit where once you question absolute authority, you will get punished by the entire group out of fear of losing more people and out of fear of being rejected themselves.

I was a trump supporter until my jaw literally fell to the floor when i watched sean spicer live saying that "greater enforcement" will be undertaken.

You were a supporter until it hit you personally. Trump and the Republicans had support of conservative people on Obamacare, and then lost it as they started talking about repealing it. It's kinda funny, but also serious business. Especially in light of transgender rights in the news, you don't care, it doesn't affect your personally.

It's always happening to "the other", divide and conquer.

Sorry I am drunk and was trolling.

r/the_donald is supposed to be a 24 hour Trump rally. Criticism of Trump in any way is verboten and you'll be shoved off to their ask Reddit for questions on policy.

You say that like it's a bad thing

"echochambers aren't a bad thing"

Fuck off, you absolute moron.

"Echo-chambers are only a good thing if I agree with them".

Fuck off, you absolute moron.

The fact is r/the_donald doesn't pretend to be anything but an echo chamber. If you get sick of the anti-Trump spam that hits every single other sub you spend a little time there to remind yourself that you're not the only one. That's the whole reason it was made, not to be another place for people to spam anti-Trump stuff. You have literally any other subreddit for that.

The real problem with echo chambers is when they pretend to be impartial and goad people into thinking there is only one accepted view. Like a certain political subreddit.

This argument basically boils down to a misunderstanding of how subreddits work. If people only posted about cats on r/cats, that's expected and nobody cares. But if you went to r/animals and there were only pictures of dogs there would be reason to question the subreddit.

Nowhere in my comment did i say that i liked anti-trump echo chambers. All echo chambers are fucking stupid and should be broken up, because the lack of negative feedback will just result in more extremism and more stupidity.

The end.

The sub is literally called the_donald. If you want to bash The Donald then you will probably bother the people on the sub who like him.

This is like baking the gay cake, but even more stupid. Go to another sub then?!?

Discussion and disagreement should still be welcome. You can ban outright hostility, but for someone to come and say that it seems fucked up that he'd ban marijiana given his states-rights driven campaign promises seems kinda fucked. This is putting the president over the people.

Yeah, I can agree with that. At least when the shills stop coming out in full force. The way I view it is that the sub is being brigades just like this one, but possibly even more fervently.

You need some protection -_-

Honestly I think the "brigaded" accusation is just brought way too quickly on both sides. People be having different opinions let's talk about it instead of pretending the other side doesn't exist.

You're a little special snowflake that can't have his ideas challenged. :( Grow a pair, you pussy. No one is above criticism. Not even the president.

Also, your orange lipstick looks great, dog.

the donald doesn't pretend to be anything but an echo chamber.

Nah, they very frequently pretend to be the last bastion of free speech on Reddit

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So a cult

Yeah Trump could go full liberal and they'd STILL be on that tinpot's dick.

He already seems pretty liberal. From Wikipedia. Though if any part of it is wrong I would love to know. I am still trying to learn this stuff

Liberalism is a political philosophy or worldview founded on ideas of liberty and equality.[1][2][3] Whereas classical liberalism emphasises the role of liberty, social liberalism stresses the importance of equality.[4] Liberals espouse a wide array of views depending on their understanding of these principles, but generally they support ideas and programmes such as freedom of speech, freedom of the press, freedom of religion, free markets, civil rights, democratic societies, secular governments, gender equality, and international cooperation.[5][6][7][8][9][10][11]

Though if any part of it is wrong I would love to know

freedom of the press

Uhhhh....

Are they not allowed to say what they want? Even though the Legacy media is legitimately propaganda.

Trump is essentially trying to delegitimatize any media that doesnt conform to his views and his pre existing bias. Hence all the attacks on twitter calling them the "enemy of the people".

They are still free to say what they want. This doesn't touch upon the point of freedom of the press. He has freedom of speech and he is able to say whatever he wants?

They are literally propagandizing all of the news in an effort to mislead the public.

Propaganda is "information, especially of a biased or misleading nature, used to promote a political cause or point of view".[1] Propaganda is often associated with the psychological mechanisms of influencing and altering the attitude of a population toward a specific cause, position or political agenda in an effort to form a consensus to a standard set of belief patterns.[2]

Trump is just a con man, given power he'll do whatever he feels like.

See: Trump Steaks, Trump the Boardgame, Trump TV

Who has he conned? Can you give any examples of instances where he conned people?

Taking advantage of idiots doesn't count.

Wow.

That's what I thought.

His "wow" means, "Do you not open a newspaper?"

Trump University? The endless contractors he's screwed over?

Lol

He asks a question, gets an answer to the question, and then types "lol"

These fucking Trump supporters can't stop showing everyone how they're the dumbest of the dumb.

He asks a question, gets an answer to the question, and then types "lol"

These fucking Trump supporters can't stop showing everyone how they're the dumbest of the dumb.

Lol

To be fair, contractors get screwed pretty regularly, especially in shark tanks like Manhattan

what about all the contractors hes stiffed

what about his fucking supporters lol

That's what I thought.

Trump University ringing any bells?

Taking advantage of idiots doesn't count.

Do you know what a con is?

You obviously don't.

Your ability to ignore what's right in front of you is truly inspiring.

Thanks

Taking advantage of idiots doesn't count.

Are you serious?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2016/09/28/i-sold-trump-100000-worth-of-pianos-then-he-stiffed-me/?utm_term=.61019e809b49

I said taking advantage of idiots doesn't count.

You all really prefered hillary to President Trump?

That's comical.

Yeah, no one here is saying they preferred Hillary. Don't put words in people's mouths.

So maybe people should stop bitching about the only other legitimate option. Trump said what he wanted to do and he's actually doing it and people are flipping out.

You that dumb guy that doesn't know he's dumb

Oh he knows he's a fucking moron, but like his precious puppet-president he likes poking at people.

Don't feed the sad little troll. "Only other legitimate option" lol....

Don't project your issues onto me.

😉

Great logic. Whoever gets elected can never be criticized because the alternate would have been as bad or worse.

😂👌🏼

I said taking advantage of idiots doesn't count.

Ah, got it. So being screwed over by Trump makes you an idiot - so Trump can screw anyone in the world, and they are therefore idiots, and it's not a problem!

Most people would readily give services on a net-30 basis to someone who is both a Presidential candidate and a billionaire, but I guess everyone everywhere is an idiot.

Still, as a Trump supporter, you might stop and think what it means when you think that trusting Trump implies you're an idiot. What does it say about you?

Tldr

You must be the king of the idiots

Pope

What the fuck is your definition of "con" then? You basically just said "give me an example but I won't allow it as evidence." In this article a guy took a standard business order from D. Trump and trump used his huge amounts of resources to essentially intimidate somebody into not pursuing a legal battle to get the money they rightly deserved for fulfilling his part of the deal. That doesn't make him an idiot. That makes Donald Trump a rich dick contracting out small locally owned businesses he knows won't be able to stand up to him. That's a con in every sense

k

I said taking advantage of idiots doesn't count.

"Taking advantage of idiots" is the literal definition of being a conman.

Taking advantage of idiots doesn't count.

Even if it wins you the presedency?

Haha good one

Who has he conned?

Trump is a proven conman who had to pay millions for getting caught running a scam university. This happened RIGHT BEFORE the election...

LOL you must really be mad. Calm down cupcake.

No need to message me 3 times.

Yup, your stupidity is rage inducing.

Good one!

freedom of the press, freedom of religion, civil rights, secular governments, gender equality, and international cooperation.

*Ahem*

How is he impinging on freedom of the press?

or civil rights?

or gender equality?

He seems like he wants international cooperation?

Can I get an example of how he is violating any of those?

How is he impinging on freedom of the press?

You're fucking kidding, right?

What isn't the argument that supports your statement?

Trump bans press from briefing.

That is the paradigm example of restricting the freedom of the press. Not like the truth is going to change your mind or anything. Just know we know you're completely wrong about our great leader.

It is a privilege to go to the press briefing not a right. CNN can still say anything they want. I am also happier with any other organization getting the press pass.

Do you see the difference?

It's a "privilege" in a dictatorship, not when the highest office is an elected official.

Those news sources are still free to publish their bit pieces. It's a privilege for any media site to be at an event which has limited invitation. Were you aware that they weren't even originally invited? Pool for bigger and they still weren't invited and then they complained. How dare Trump respect the corporate conglomerate media!

I think you're purposefully being obtuse.

"Hit pieces"? Really? Are facts now the enemy of the state?

Are you saying that no media organization has published something false or misleading in an effort to spin their narrative?

Have they always been completely honest when discussing Donald Trump or things related to him?

Of course not. That's not the issue. The media was not elected to run our country. Trump was. And in a functioning democracy, access to true information is vital. If you want a dictatorship, it's to your benefit to stifle the media and its damn questions. If you believe America is a land of free people who give the government its power, then you want the media to be in those meetings to answer the questions you and I cannot.

Here's the real litmus test: If you're just fine with the opposition party doing this, then it's probably not that big of a deal. If it really bothers you if Hillary Clinton were to do the same thing that Trump already did, then you're just a political tool who apparently works against his own interests.

Do you realize that if this truly were a dictatorship the media would be imprisoned or killed for reporting negatively? You are exaggerating the point. They are able to freely say whatever they want right now and it will remain that way. If the President believes that the media is misleading the public with the way they present the information then he has the right to call them bc he also has freedom of speech.

Hillary Clinton were to do the same thing

If the media is lying about the issues and she calls them out I don't care. They shouldn't be lying about issues and misleading the masses of sheep.

Can someone good with video make this for the trumplets https://youtu.be/trtaMHesWc8

That's entirely accurate. And I have no problem with it, because they're open about it.

Look, if someone wants to make a pro-Hitler sub and ban criticism of Hitler, I don't give a shit.

You'd have no problem with a large community of people wanting to bring extreme persecution to the point of extermination of certain minorities while banning any dissenting opinions on the subject? You sure?

No, I have no problem with people talking about their batshit crazy ideas. This is America.

You're allowed to have a problem with it that's the whole point. Freedom of speech isn't let's plug our ears and pretend everyone's opinion is equally valid. You are still allowed to have an opinion.

It's their right to ban dissenting opinions but it's also unamerican.

No, I have no problem with people talking about their batshit crazy ideas. This is America.

Abso-fucking-lutely! People forget about Freedom of Speech really quick when it's something they disagree with, unfortunately.

It's also free speech to call them out. Nobody here is advocating for shutting them down.

Of course it is, does my post indicate otherwise? One of my favorite authors says it best - “If you accept – and I do – that freedom of speech is important, then you are going to have to defend the indefensible. That means you are going to be defending the right of people to read, or to write, or to say, what you don’t say or like or want said. The Law is a huge blunt weapon that does not and will not make distinctions between what you find acceptable and what you don’t. This is how the Law is made. People making art find out where the limits of free expression are by going beyond them and getting into trouble. [...] The Law is a blunt instrument. It’s not a scalpel. It’s a club. If there is something you consider indefensible, and there is something you consider defensible, and the same laws can take them both out, you are going to find yourself defending the indefensible.”

The moment you ban people for disagreeing, it's not "free speech" anymore. No one here is saying Trump supporters need to stfu, or if they are, they're not advocating free speech.

If dissenting voices are silenced, it's not free speech. Period.

The /r/AskTrumpSupporters response to this was just that Sean Spicier said it, not Trump himself and that there is nothing to worry about. They are really living in denial.

They never wonder why Trump keeps all these wackos around who keep saying crazy things on his behalf

As if Spicer would still be around if he said anything not approved.

They even banned Kellyanne Conwoman from TV because of her slips.

How do you sustain a 24/7 Trump rally, when he changes his position on everything, based on who attacks his dumb ass on twitter every ten seconds?

1. Make everything a '4D chess move' like misspelling words on an official document (lol now he's got people talking about it when they weren't before!).

2. Content control. By not allowing anyone to bring up any concerns about their 'god emperor' they can ensure the only messages getting to their front page are positive and motivating to their users.

3. Encourage shitposting. By allowing shitty memes, spamming, and immaturity the sub constantly seems very active and full of content even if it's low quality.

4. Make it about the subscriber. Most people want to feel like a part of something. The_Donald has perfected the idea that anything Trump does is because of their help and they are on the front lines of a culture war. By shitposting Pepe. So people vulnerable to their rhetoric join up, like how it makes them feel, and become pedes.

Exactly. And it's exactly what Obama people did when he started wars and drone attacks and the rest. '3D Chess'

People are so desparate for a savior they can't see the nose in front of their faces.

It's the oligarch vs the 99.5 %.

I saw a fair bit more backlash against Obama, but hey, it's early days, it will be interesting to see how long they can keep fooling themselves.

Until the next election. And then the cycle continues..

Number 4 was me. Making fun of SJWs was fun and everyone seemed to be having a great time. Then I came to the realization that Donald is a giant lying piece of shit and I instantly regret ever shit posting in his favor.

They're all lying pieces of shit, with 'public vs private positions'

You are exactly right.

So these people are being radicalized via the internet? Sounds familiar.

It actually balances out the rest of Reddit.

r/the_donald is supposed to be a 24 hour Trump rally.

r/the_donald is supposed to be a 24 hour Trump circljerk

Safe space

This is exactly why I unsubbed from that subreddit. I thought he'd be a better alternative to Hillary and now I can't fucking stand the guy. His whole cabinet is fucked. The shitposting was fun at first but his supporters take it a whole new weird level where they basically worship every fucking move he does, no matter how stupid. It's sick.

I'd be okay with that if the subreddit did not have multiple fake news posts on the top of /r/all on a daily basis.

Just yesterday they had a post about a conservative Christian lobbying group masquerading as "medical association" claiming treating transgender children is child abuse. Except the article misstated the name of the group and misrepresented it to confuse readers into thinking the official American Academy of Pediatrics said it, instead of a random Christian group with absolutely zero credibility in the medical field that pushes its agenda ahead of accepted medical science.

T_D mods response? Ban everyone who pointed any of that out. Not even anti-Trump comments, just people against fake and misleading news. And that post was #3 on /r/all.

The biggest threat to this world is the global financial institutions of the elite. It's behind the military industrial complex (real terrorism) and both sides of the media that stroke your sensibilities. Sex trafficking is bad shit ok? But the root of the problem is the Elite, the petty low hanging fruit dominating /r/conspiracy 's front page is not.

Are you high right now?

meh who the hell cares, from my experience pot heads are generally lazy and unambitious.

0/10

Chances of potheads being accepted into an Ivy League school

0/10

No u

Your experience is limited

meh who the hell cares

You sound pretty lazy and unambitious yourself

I am,just imagine if I was smoking pot

Why contribute your labor to a society that doesn't accept you? Why focus your ambition upon rising within it?

Imagine:

If basil, oregano, and thyme were made illegal, then die-hard Italian-food lovers would have to break the bank just to have some marinara sauce. They would have less money to spend on other things. If they had children, it is likely they would be going hungry on the occasion that mommy blew her whole paycheck on 'spaghetti herbs'. (Daddy is, of course, in jail.) If the children tried to understand why other herbs such as dill and parsley were legal but not basil, oregano, and thyme, they would probably become disillusioned with society and feel that it was based upon hypocrisy.

Dripping with ignorance

What is your experience, beyond the one time you were invited to a party and nearly shit your pants before saying, "n...no t...thanks." when offered a joint.

Then let's ban alcohol while we're at it! Can't have all those alcoholics sitting around doing nothing!

alcohol is not a gateway dreug

What is it a gateway drug to, may I ask?

If you want a real gateway to harder drugs, try opioids. Many people that start on prescription painkillers move on to Heroin and other nasty shit. If you want a problem, focus there. People don't give a fuck if drugs are illegal. If I wanted to smoke some dope I could waltz down the road to my buddies house and walk home. The only reason I did it was because I had a "Fuck the government" sort of edgy emntality. Marijuana laws only exist to lock up youth and profit drug companies and for profit prisons. More harm is being done by it being illegal than for it to be legal. Users may have to visit a nasty part of town for a deal and risk getting ripped off, robbed, killed in the process. Make it a safe deal where the user isn't going to eitehr of the latter. The justification for parents to tell their kids not to use it is "You'll go to jail!", that was the focus of the entire marijuana unit in my High School health class. My cousin underwent breast cancer treatment last year and she used it through treatment to cope with the sickness and pain of chemo. Do you want these people to go to jail for smoking it? Do you want these people to suffer from treatment? What is your justification for it being illegal?

I'm gonna be serious instead of trolling. I don't care really. I did have some bad experience with stoners, they are generally lazy but I don't want to project my bad experiences into the rest of society. I'm libertarian when it comes to this, states should decide if they wanna make it legal or not.

I'm a Trump supporter and I often post in t_d. I am not afraid to criticize him or hold him accountable.

Did Trump flip flip on this issue or was this the plan all along? I don't smoke weed so I didn't really pay attention to his stance on it. If he did flip flop can you please provide a source? Thanks.

Sean Spicer said something along the lines that attacking marijuana is going to be one of their goals

Yes I heard that. Did Trump ever say he was going to legalize weed or not fight it?

The thing with Trump and asking if he has "ever" said something is that you will certainly find quotes of him both defending and attacking a position. The same goes for weed, but he is on the record saying states should deal with the issue.

He claimed he is all for state rights, but now his press secretary now is saying to expect federal enforcement. I would say that's a flip flop

okay, lets see you link to one of your posts in t_d where you criticize him, then.

i'll wait.

Yesterday

http://www.reddit.com/r/The_Donald/comments/5vydhd/fucking_illegal_aliens_come_here_and_can_get/de5yk3b

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hm yep that comment 100% fits the bill of what i asked for and it looks like you haven't been banned, thanks for following up

you have successfully improved my opinion of t_d as well as trump supporters in general

Glad I could help. Come spend a day reading some of the more serious posts and I think you'll find a lot of people like me. The highest upvoted shitposts are fun and entertaining (at least to Trump supporters) but those usually are not where quality conversations occur.

"In terms of marijuana and legalization, I think that should be a state issue, state-by-state," Trump said while taking a handful of questions during a political rally at a casino outside Reno on Thursday afternoon.

This was following the third Republican debate in 2015.

Go ask them. We're not the_donald.

You can't - the post would be deleted and you would be banned.

/r/AskTrumpSupporters

Rofl. OP. I cannot believe you didn't see this coming.

Reasons like this are exactly why everyone was saying not to vote him in.

Too bad Hillary was such a terrible candidate.

She was a terrible candidate, but Trump is also bad. I can't say who is worse, but we need to NOT blindly follow anyone.

It simply should have been bernie. Like him or hate him, he has this country's best interests at heart. The other two were there for themselves and no one else.

Maybe Keanu can share some immortality secrets with Senator Sanders and he'll run again. I'd love to see him and Gabbard give it a go.

Gabbard is just a neocon in sheeps clothing. Fuck Gabbard. If Bernie dies and she becomes president just because she supported him during the primaries in an effort to be contrarian I'll be pissed. There are a lot of anti-neolib dem senators who are a better choice, they're just relatively unknown. Fuck Gabbard.

Can you elaborate on why you say she's a neocon? Not arguing with you at all, I'm honestly just curious.

How is she a neocon? She is one of the very few politicians calling out our middle east foreign policy.

I've clearly missed something about her. Could you expand on your opinions of Gabbard? I'm genuinely curious. Also, name some of those Senators and I'll check into them. I'm not being combative, by the way, I really want to know.

As much as I dislike Hillary and Trump, Bernie was not the way to go. His Socialist ideas would absolutely fail in America.

because... why?

Last year, my wife and I left America for a social democracy in Europe. You have no idea how much better things are here. Yes, somewhat more of your paycheck goes to the government (but I lived in New York City, so the difference is small) but the level of services! The comfort!

And the friggen efficiency here. Jesus. We live on a busy street in Amsterdam. A few weeks we got a letter in our mailbox explaining to us that they were going to be doing repairs on our block overnight for two nights in a row - very apologetic.

Starting at midnight they ripped up half the block, did the maintenance, put back the road before the morning. The next night, they did the same to the other half. All done! Two nights! In New York City, this would have easily been months.

Watching them work was a trip. They didn't seem in a hurry - they just worked steadily and efficiently, taking a short break every hour or two, until it was done.

Of course, all Dutch apartments have the bedrooms facing away from the street, so we didn't even hear it.

Because we just moved here, we have had a lot of contact with bureaucrats. In each case these government workers were on our side. "No, I wouldn't put that here on this form, you'll be hit with taxes. Let me white this out for you!" In each case they underpromised and over-delivered. "You'll get this residence permit within six week." Four days later, there it is.

Honestly, I think the reason that social democracy would never work in the USA is because the rich like to see the poor suffer bitterly.

Your examples aren't due to socialism, but due to a small country with lower population. You think the Netherlands is better because road work is finished faster? That's kinda ridiculous.

You have had contact with bureaucrats because they govern a lot less people so its easier to listen to individuals.

The unemployment rate is higher in Netherlands and the value of the currency is lower.

Please tell me what Socialist ideas would work in America.

Parliamentary constitutional monarchy and Socialism/social-democracy are not opposed. Belgium, Luxembourg, Sweden, Norway, Denmark.

Universal Health Care ?

Canada seem to be working fine.

So you think you have the right to force doctors, nurses, assistants, technicians etc. to treat you?

Its call job. No one is forcing the doctors and nurse to do anything. Its the same damn job they will do with more centralize approach. And cost less for people like you and me.

They are forced to do it though. Doctors in Canada (and other UHC countries) make substantially less than in the USA. Do you want doctors to make less?

Where is this money coming from for Universal Healthcare? Higher taxes?

Gov already tax you enough for universal health care to implement.

Stop using buzzword stylish "Doo you want doctor to get llow pay" . It is annoying as hell , because that the issue for another time and doesnt connect with the Healthcare issue.

I suggest you check http://healthcare.procon.org .

Because pointing out every holes back and forth in reddit isnt productive at all.

People already paid tons in insurance that only cover halfass in serious HC problems. Live saving Medicine are massively over price only for sake of profit. And its wrong. We need that middle ground.

My life, and yours is worth more than money. So yes, I don't mind doctors making less.

Netherlands isn't socialist and neither is Bernie Sanders.

Found the one percenter !

Yes, I'm in the one percent because I would like to pay less taxes.

You're already paying some of the lowest taxes in the western world

Lower taxes are not happening. Even under Trump, expect major indirect tax hikes to create all those massive infrastructure project.

You're paying those taxes one way or another.

Democracy is asset insurance for the rich, and if you skimp on the payment you can ask the Russians and the Chinese how that goes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VBQ4MLodVKU

It's all about the magical mysterious leviathan called public-private partnerships or better yet, straight up privatization! Get the government outta the picture so people can't assert their pesky constitutional rights and let the private companies charge exorbitant tolls for using infrastructure that used to be paid for by taxes and run by the government.

Personally, I just favor a return to cannibalism.

You can't get smaller government than the state of nature !

As far as I'm concerned, a person who doesn't have the integrity to stand up for themselves when they've been cheated by their own party doesn't deserve to be the president. I think all three weren't good candidates.

I believe he's a calculated man. If he had been outspoken. About the primary rigging, then that would certainly have been the nail in the coffin for Hillary. He obviously wanted to win, but he wanted Trump to lose more.

I would fuckin die for Bernie if he asked

This is the answer. I don't agree with him, but I understand why from his point of view he had to play the game.

I understand what you are saying, but the Dems were never Sanders' party until the primaries. He has always been an independent. I am not that surprised that the DNC preferred Hillary. I think Bernie was more than qualified to be POTUS.

The DNC wasnt supposed to prefer anybody. That is considered illegal. Thats the whole point of the "but the emails!" rhetoric- they show the DNC colluding against Bernie even though he filled warehouses and Clinton couldn't fill a gymnasium

To me that makes it worse, what kind of person won't stand up for himself and all those that stood behind him? I do prefer his message to the other two but as far as I'm concerned anyone who's to afraid to stand up for themselves In that situation is happy with a corrupt system to keep running its course.

I don't think that he was "too afraid" to stand up for himself. He had two choices - fracture the Democratic party and hand Trump the Presidency or try and prevent him from winning by backing Clinton. It's obvious, to me, that he believed Clinton to be the lesser of two evils. It was a logical and pragmatic approach.

So, when was Bernie a Democrat?

In all his actions and votes throughout history that place his values and concerned at what the LIBERAL/DEMOCRATIC GOLD STANDARD should be for our candidates and representatives. The guy is the perfect liberal, the PERFECT DEMOCRAT, and the DNC/RNC hydra couldn't have that.

He wasn't until the primaries, but I think that makes it worse having been independent he should have more reason to stand up for himself and all of those who stood behind him.

If he had fought it, it would mess with the process and given trump an even bigger win

The other two were there for themselves and no one else.

Well thats simply not true. Trump is there for bannon and his other business cronies. Hillary wouldve been there for her friends. Only Bernie would have been there for the american people.

You think the elderly socialist Jew would have won away all the people who voted for the capitalist racist who had the explicit backing of the Klu Klux Klan? Are you mental?

No. I just think he would have done better than the elderly authoritarian Cheeto.

I was willing to bet Trump was worse. I didn't want either of them but Hillary has more control when it comes to ridiculous outbursts.

Because Hillary is actually qualified - she's a slimy, underhanded politician but at least she is an actual politician that understands international relations and the limitations and importance of government.

Wow I'm kinda surprised to see such a level-headed rational statement about Hillary in this sub. I hated Hillary and her cabal only marginally less than Trump but the discourse in this sub has been so politically polarized lately that it seemed like any comment not equating her with Satan would be buried.

This whole post is giving real hope that this sub is on the mend.

I despise the Clinton family with the most vehement hate, and I don't think here first quarter of policy would have been great, but it also wouldn't have been this.

The Republican Party would have been a great foil to President Clinton. They operate much better as an opposition party. Case in point: dozens of futile attempts to repeal Obamacare over 8 years when they knew it wouldn't get enacted now they have the power and have no idea what to do.

We would already be embroiled in a fight in Syria that would be pitting us against Russia, getting us ever closer to being nuked.

Sorry, I fail to see how this is so much worse than that.

I know right? This is the first time in a while that this place doesn't seem like /r/the_donald+safespace

I kept seeing this argument during the election. HOW is she more qualified? Because she has more experience as a failed politician?

She withstood 25 years of the entire republican establishment attempting to discredit her and personally attack her for the actions of her husband, was secretary of state, and earned 3 million more votes than her opponent in an open election due to effective organization and campaigning.

Policies aside, you cannot be a bad/failed politician and accomplish those feats at the same time.

Agai , not defending her or her policies, but she WAS more experienced and more qualified, and she did know more about how Washington and the government ran. Trump literally had no clue what he was/is doing, and will do irreparable damage that likely would not have happened under Clinton.

Yeah you answered your own question. Experience and even failure can make someone more qualified than a billionaire playboy businessman who's never held public office and who very clearly has zero grasp on our country's most important contract between citizens and government, the constitution. The constitution is like a whopping 27 pages and this fucker can't be arsed to even read it. He actually thinks the President has the unfettered right to free speech when he speaks for the country. Clinton is awful and I'm glad she lost and I hope I never have to worry about her getting elected ever again. But at least she studied the constitution for 3 years in law school and spent the rest of her life learning the ins and outs of federal governance.

How is Trump qualified should be your first question.

Im not saying he was, but to act like she was a good choice/qualified to be president is a joke. She had paid speeches, public and private stances, and was attempting to attach her name to the failed ACA. Not to mention she was for the invasion of Iraq and wanted continued intervention in the middle east. I would have gladly voted flr Bernie, but I sure as fuck didnt want her shady ass as president.

She was qualified.

And then there's also all the objectively bad stuff like the climate change denial and all the tax breaks for him and his rich buddies with a bit of deregulation on top - they show that he's just another big-money candidate thinly veiled behind anti-establishmentism. Hillary felt a bit too much like a career politician, but at least had decent economic, social, and environmental policies.

At the very least she can read and she's pragmatic. She didn't outright promise to legalize weed because she knows it'd be a lie. Whereas Trump dangled it in front of his supporters under the guise of "states rights" which turned out to be a lie. She said they'd consider moving it to schedule II so that research could be funded, and they would've stayed out of legalized states... well now with Sessions you're getting no research and full private prisons.

If people don't think that's how the rest of Trump's presidency will go they're delusional. Pragmatism is always a safe choice, and incremental amounts of progress are always better than snake oil.

At the very least she can read

Oh jesus this shit again? How do you expect anyone to take you seriously when you lead with this hyperbole?

at least she had decent economic, social, and environmental policies.

Did she, though? She wanted war and to continue the status quo that is very clearly not working

They are both controlled, the same shit is going to happen either way. There is no better or worse in our government at this point.

I can say who's worse. It's Donald. Donald is worse. As shitty a candidate that Hillary was, I would absolutely love to hear an argument explaining that she would somehow be a worse present than this orange ass clown. He has acted with complete disregard for the constitution, reality, and common decency. At least with Hillary we would know what we were getting, even if it was more of the same. The damage that this farce of a president is doing to the office and to the country will take a great long time to repair.

She was the bigger threat to democracy. Rigging primaries, colluding with the DNC. That's the shit she needed to be punished for. As shitty as it is that trump was the alternative it had to happen, she had to lose. If she didn't the DNC would never again hold a legitimate primary if they found out they can rig, have the public know they rigged it and then still win the election.

As awful as trump is he's still better for america than Hillary in the long run.

He has repeatedly questioned the outcome of the election he won.

He has repeatedly said that a free and independent press is the enemy of the American people.

He supports regressive racist policies like banning people of a certain religion although simple basic math and facts prove that these people are not the real threat.

He does not understand the simple notion of mutually assured destruction and wants us to have more nukes.

But sure, her emails. You have a point.

nobody brought up her emails....

Progress.

You're right. I was projecting the most-common argument used against her by far. But the Trump team is using private email accounts and no one seems to give a shit.

I could have also brought up Benghazi although she was, by all accounts, guilty of nothing despite endless investigations. But then, the failed Yemen raid was a travesty and no one seems to give a shit.

The back room DNC shit is shameful. Exceptionally so. And I do think she represents the nearest thing to a real-life Frank Underwood in DC. But let's be honest, that DNC shit is actually not much different from the ways in which Ron Paul was cheated out of ... New Hampshire was it? And the way that the republican propagandists portrayed him (as an old kook) on a daily basis. Nor should any of it really surprise anyone who follows politics at all.

Party primaries are nasty cannibalistic things.

projecting

Seems a common problem this recent political season.

At this point Trump could refuse to step down in 4 years and there is fuck all we can do about it if the military backs him.

Isn't it funny how people believe you could ever not have corruption in high level politics? There is too much money and power. Hillary was corrupt but she was at least predictable.

Hillary won more votes(people) than Bernie so she won the primary. How is that in itself rigging?? You may not like the tactics she used, but she still got more votes. If she lost the popular vote and the DNC still picked her then that would have been rigged, but that didn't happen.

The Trump administration is going against the will of the people for a few billionaire elites, that's really bad for our country.

We don't like the tactics she used, such as colluding with CNN and the DNC to receive preferential treatment. Receiving debate questions in advance and having a chairperson in the DNC changing rules to favor her may not be outright illegal, but goddamn it should be.

Receiving debate questions in advance

Wasn't just the one question? I mean that's still not okay, but people were blowing it out of proportion.

DNC to receive preferential treatment.

The DNC is a private organization and they have the full rights of one so they can pretty much do whatever they want. That's why it's important that we get someone like Keith Ellison in to change the mindset of the DNC.

I still attest that Trump is the single best thing to happen to the Democrats; democrats are finally organizing and uniting, and stopping their apathetic ways. We might have to suffer in the meantime, but the future looks bright.

I get that the DNC is a private organization. They can utilize whatever policies they want, but they don't just outright skip primaries and put the person they want as their nominee because then Democrats and independents allowed to vote in primaries would see that it isn't a democratic process. They may as well though, since they'll do chickenshit things like use superdelegates and at the last minute change contribution rules to favor Clinton.

There is no real democracy in the primaries and that is my beef. This is the system that determines ultimately who is president because it produces one of the two choices. I think primaries should be subject to extensive transparency rules that make it more Democratic and fair since it ultimately produces the choices for which vote in the general election.

Are you off your rocker bro? This election wasn't about either of them, it was about who was in control of choosing the vacant Supreme Court seat and any potential future vacancies.

You idiots in t_d were looking at corruption v corruption instead of reasonableness towards the court v fucking retardedness towards the court (as evidenced by his own flagrant preoccupation with law suits of all kind).

How the fuck this was about him or her to any of you people and not who was going to be in charge of deciding the court's future is the biggest fucking WTF.com to me.

Y'all fucked up. T_D and all trump voters are a bunch of naive gullible bitches. He conned people like you every day of his life and you and your lot proved just how dumb and how susceptible you are to a good con.

Fuck everyone on t_d with their fake misplaced racist as fuck sense of nationalism and pride. Trump played the shit out of you people because he knew exactly how America works best, but gawking at the idiot box.

retardedness towards the court (as evidenced by his own flagrant preoccupation with law suits of all kind).

To be fair Gorsuch was a decent replacement for Scalia. I'm pretty scared/worried to see who he replaces RBG with, though. She's one of the most liberal on the Supreme Court right now.

Because those fucking idiots at t_d probably don't even know how the Supreme Court works, let alone the implications of Donald appointing a corrupt and biased justice to the court for decades.

If they had the ability to think ahead they wouldn't have voted for Trump in the first place.

"You people trashing Trump supporters are exactly why Trump won!"

-The fragile Trump bots who can't handle criticism

He conned people like you every day of his life and you and your lot proved just how dumb and how susceptible you are to a good con

Seriously. This is a man who'd hire your uncle to retile his hotel bathrooms, promise him a huge payday, and then stiff him on the bill because he knows your small-business uncle can't afford to even go to court against Donald J Trump and his legion of lawyers.

This isn't fiction, it happened hundreds of times. He gobbles up the hard work of small business owners and shits on them when it comes time to pay. He says things like, "Doing business with Trump will pay more than our money could ever pay" but that good advertising doesn't pay for all the supplies you used to do his work.

Trump University was a literal scam school, and he was being sued for it during the election. He was running for President while being sued for scamming people. Then he just settled like a bitch for millions and millions of dollars while everyone was distracted with his "tremendous electoral victory".

He's always been a con artist, scamming people every chance he gets to recoup a couple bucks here and there, small change, pennies for a "billionaire", but he still does it, scams, bullies, sues, and then settles like a bitch if they don't run away. And these idiots welcomed him into their open arms because they suddenly think he's going to start scamming people for them.

Insane. Trump doesn't care about you or your coal job, or your economic anxiety. He only likes you until he's gotten money from you, then he is done with you. T_D are just Johns who think that Stripper really liked them because she smiled when he paid her.

you are the literal picture of the idiot huddles next to a trash fire because nuclear winter going, "Hillary would have brought us all down!"

You think cracking down on weed is the equivalent to a nuclear winter? Get a grip, please.

Hillary and Donald are both so awful, the absolute bottom of the barrel of humanity, that it is pointless to try to say who would be worse. They both represent the same ideologies and represent the wealth class in very slightly different ways. They pander in different ways but their actions are very similar.

colluding with the DNC

a private entity preferring their highest ranking member over an outsider who simply joined the party to have a (D) next to his name on ballots is not some shameful behavior. What primaries were rigged? Last I checked she won the vote by millions over Bernie.

Easy now. The head of the DNC stepped down following these revelations. It's not okay what they did. Guess where she immediately got hired? Hillary's campaign.

That's a problem.

Also the fact that the head of the DNC gave Hillary the debate questions early. If you didn't know the DNC, especially the head of the DNC, is supposed to remain 100% neutral. Not to mention that Hillary hired her just hours after she was exposed for working with Hillary as head of the DNC.

Is it the most corrupt action in democratic politics? Fuck no, far from it. But it just blatantly showed how corrupt and scary Hillary was. And before anyone trashes me, Hillary would have been a much better president overall. She would have been a shit president, and I would have critiqued every action she did but she wouldn't have been as terrible or unpredictable as Trump.

The DNC is a private entity. They could hand pick their GE candidate every year if they wanted to. Wait, is this the reason you people hated Hillary Clinton?! You stupid gullible mother fucker!

That's what Trump wanted you to believe. In fact I dont think she is as bad of a person as people want you to believe. You succame to political propoganda!

Yes she was absolutely crooked and a shitty candidate but Jesus fuck how does that even measure to a dude who is responding to criticism by banning news organizations from the white house, spreading obvious falsehoods and lying blatantly at every step, and looking ever more convincingly like he is selling out his country to a foreign government...

As dumb as trump is, clinton would have been more dangerous to the middle class. She would have some of the exact same wall street people in her cabinet. The difference would be that she would have co-opted the left allowing wall street to get anything it wants with all the mainstream left organizations staying quiet. With trump and his wall street cabinet, the democrats are there to pretend to oppose corporate policies.

I'm afraid that I don't know how to reply to such feebly conceived hypotheticals other than to say that simply because you claim that they would be the same in these ways does not make it so. Trump is taking the same dirty tricks of traditional politicians and bringing them to an entirely new level and since he somehow was able to dupe you into believing that he's an "outsider" you take his word for it rather than give his actions any serious critical thought or scrutiny.

Hillary would have caused actual genocide. Her death count would be 2-3 million people at least. Nothing Trump has done or could do is worse than this.

Fucked up thing is that I can't even tell if you're trolling or are genuinely diluted into holding that view... says volumes about the current state of affairs.

Do you actually know anything about geopolitics? I wasn't talking about a genocide in America you dumbass. I was talking about Syria.

Hillary wanted a no-fly zone in Syria, and an expansion of military aid to terrorist groups like Islamic Front, Fatah Halab, etc. Look, I'm no fan of Assad, but the truth is that the Syrian government is the only thing holding the country together. Russian airstrikes was the only thing standing in the way of the Syrian government's collapse. If Hillary did implement these policies, Assad's government would fall and the result would be unthinkable.

The Syrian Army is the only thing protecting ethnic minorities. Already, in areas of the country controlled by rebel/salafist groups, ethnic and religious minorities are being systematically cleansed and driven into sexual slavery. Not only ISIS, but also Al Nusra, Army of Conquest, and other Saudi-backed Wahhabist groups like Islamic Front have targeted minorities, like Shiites and Christians, in their territories.

If Hillary Clinton implemented her policies, and the Syrian government fell, there WOULD BE GENOCIDE. There is no disagreement on this point by most serious Syrian analysts. Islamist and Wahhabist groups would systematically "cleanse" Alawites, Ismailis, Christians, and Kurds. They are already doing this, and if there is no stable government in the region, they will become genocidal. Kurdish Democratic forces realize this, and have already established militias to protect from genocidal action by Wahhabist groups. Kurdish leaders implored the Obama administration to stop supporting the Wahhabists, because they wanted the Kurds dead.

There are 4 - 5 million Christians, Ismailis, Alawites, and Kurds in Syria. There is already widespread racial and ethnic violence against all these groups. The first genocide will probably be against Alawites because of their control of the Syrian government, and then the other atrocities will follow. By the end 2-3 million would be dead.

It would be the worst humanitarian crisis in the twenty-first century and make the Syrian war up until this point look like nothing. NOTHING Trump has done or is suggesting to do would be more destructive than collapsing the Syrian government, and potentially causing genocide.

Alright so that's a lot more complex than when you simply said "Hillary would have caused actual genocide." Still, I'd like to see some source on these claims about Assad being the only thing stopping genocide from happening in the region.

I reckon trump was the lesser of two evils. My reasoning is that Mr T is absolutely horrible at keeping stuff secret whereas Hilary is a seasoned veteran at the secret collusion game. With T in the white house we have a actual chance at examples of how badly people want to fill their pockets, with Hilary it would have all came out towards the end or long after she stopped being pres, irregardless of the good things she achieved during her presidency. Much like obama tbf, he did a lot of great stuff but he also bombed a bunch of muslims.

While I don't agree with your statement that Trump was the lesser of two evils, I think you have a very very good point with the fact that Trump is far worse at keeping secrets than Hillary. I just really hope all this Russian stuff gets exposed, he's already doing a damn good job at hiding keeping his Russian connections from interfering with his presidency.

I certainly hope you are right. Unfortunately I am less confident that the price we pay for this fool will be low.

In a sense, if our country goes to shit, we can try and build it back up. Hillary would continue a long line of establishment power and she could cement TCF in our political future.

Just playing devils advocate. Sometimes it takes electing a jackass to find out we need something new entirely.

As a Bernie supporter, I was no fan of Hillary. But at the very least she was competent. And while a sell-out, not the evil devil the GOP made her out to be.

Honestly, was 4 more years of the same an apocalyptic scenario? These people man...

I'm really glad to see that this sub is finally starting to come to its senses. This place was insufferable for a good while with the blind Trump support.

"But our president would never lie to us!"

Definitely Trump. Lierally stocked his cabinet with the swamp he was supposed to drain, is the laughing stock of the world, and has the frailest ego of any "politician" in my lifetime. Hence the post-election rallies (gotta keep fanning those flames or the fire dies). And banning news organizations? I'm not sure he realizes the ultimate consequences of the path he's chosen

I can't say who is worse

Really? Cause it's a pretty easy decision. If you can't see Trump is worse... you probably shouldn't make important decisions in general.

You can hate The_donald and support Trump. Both are mutually exclusive.

Both are not mutually exclusive.

ftfy

Yeah, my bad.

I wanted Hillary to win to keep the status quo of an opposition Congress. The republicans having unfettered control is terrible.

It's not as bad as 08

The Dems had a super majority

The republicans dont

It's already worse than 2008.

Honestly i've been a conspiracy nut my whole adult life. My perspective has always been that both sides work together to control the public. The end goal being complete control and consolidation of wealth and power. I think the "war on drugs" is an aspect of control committed by or on behalf of the ruling class. Donald Trump is a shill just like everyone else.

Exactly, the idea that someone could "sneak through" the republican primary, and not be completely approved by the machine is just nonsense. All this divisiveness in the republican party at the top levels is likely just kabuki theater

Seriously. I shill pretty hard for Trump on reddit for giggles, but honestly hes just a cog in the machine. Terry Pratchett said it best with the lizard people quote. Party warfare keeps people distracted from the real elites and at our neighbors throats instead of theirs. Trump went to Epstein's private island too, they're all in this together.

Thinks legal weed will "fix the Mexican immigrant problem." Lol.... I have yet to be shown any data that suggests immigrants of any kind are a problem, let alone Mexicans who pay taxes. What fucking idiots. They'll never learn.

Hillarys even more against pot than sessions nerd

Came down to one simple thing for me. With Hillary i know i will get the same shit and we are fucked. With Trump i rolled the dice.

Its been a month. Calm down people.

As a WA resident who gets all my weed from rec stores, I say from my cold dead sticky fingers. Come and take my weed bitch. He seemed alright but at first but now all my hope for pizza prosecutions are dead as well.

I'm glad you agree with me based sober man.

Hang tight on Sessions handing Podesta the bill for the pie. That's a really messy situation, takes more time than any of us want.

As for your magical plant, at this point it really sounds like Spicer ran his mouth. Check some of Trump's older statements. Unless something has been said since Spicer said that one thing after he said to ask the DoJ?

Spicer wouldn't still be there if he was saying things that weren't approved.

He was pretty careful to first say he was the wrong person to ask. That's called covering yourself.

If what he said wasn't approved he wouldn't have said anything except for "I'm the wrong person to ask."

I'm basing my assertion that he ran his mouth on the fact that he's crossed Trump before.

What are you basing yours on?

Off the fact he wouldn't want to keep doing it. As it said in the article, Trump wasn't happy with him.

Speaking of Conway, where is she? Haven't seen much of her since she said something he didn't like.

Off the fact he wouldn't want to keep doing it.

So you're going with your gut. Ok.

We have the nimblest navigators.

Why did they change positions then previously they stated they would take no action and leave it up to the states. Now they are saying they are going to heavily enforce. Which is it. And why the sudden change of heart?

Sessions is AG.

What does that have to do with anything? I know he is against mj but I thought Trump was "for states to govern this themselves."

Because Sessions is against it, a large chunk of Trump's base is against it, and marijuana is one more drug that can be tied to Mexican cartels, illegal immigrants, etc. Law enforcement likes it illegal, if only because if they can catch a guy with a nug of weed they have cause to look for other drugs if they think there's more to find. And there's likely no money (currently) in it for Trump and his freinds to gain if its recreational.

"States to govern themselves" is a nice catchphrase for putting off comment or decision on what Fed powers they want for handy use, and what responsibilities they want to pass on to others so they can avoid blame on unpopular stuff.

I know the reasons behind it. I have a friend who works for HS. He gave me some very good reasons as to why it should be illegal at a federal level. I also don't disagree with it either. Like you said it allows a fair bit more leeway for the fed to crack down on cartel movement etc. Most local law enforcement I know consider mj a hassle that has weird laws from lots of different angles.

My biggest frustration is the consistent support for a person who has been so erratic and unpredictable in his decisions. How can people fervently feel like he is doing a good job when he doesn't even know what direction he is going in

I do though disagree that trumps supporters were for mj crack down. Just look at op. Trump was supposed to be anti establishment. He was. He has just been pro financial establishment instead.

Have you not been following Trump? The number of things he's flipped on is astounding. Then flipping stances on this isn't the least bit surprising.

I was responding to maga not you I agree with you. I'm not a fan at all and I'm shocked with all the Russian connections he gets so much support.

He's done 1 good thing so far in killing the TPP. other than that there has been no positives.

Why are you taking the staement of one man, who said he was the wrong man, to be a change in position? Again, a second statement will make things a lot more interesting. This is just stirring shit up.

To take eyes off Podesta?

I'm taking what the us press secretary said. If he's not the voice of the Oval Office then why has been talking at all for the last month.

Why would they want to take eyes off Podesta. I thought they were going to crack down on human trafficking and the whole pizza gate thing.

You want to admit Spicer has made a mistake, and then claim it is therefore impossible to do it again.

Go on.

I don't disagree he has made mistakes. Typically the second go at a statement is the correction. Not the error.

This is the second time they have spoken out about marijuana the first time was to say they would leave it up to the states. Now it's that they want to crack down.

What your saying is that they needlessly made a comment about their direction on mj regulation with little to no reason. Then they also got it wrong.

And all they asked is that when they're right, you say they're right.

If they're wrong, we say they're wrong.

Thank you.

Lol, see if you're so gung ho when you're in prison for 50 years working as s slave and being bumfucked on the daily.

Woah. Scare tactics. Trying to appeal to gay panic. You sound like a shill. Just saying.

Rule #10

Rule #10

My bad, ill be better about that. Are you guys just like hotkeyed whenever the word shill is used to triangulate on the user. I said he sounds like a shill, didn't call him a shill. Its amazing how quick you responded, that's crazy.

I think the pizza arrests are coming.

Seemed alright at first? Yeah fuck Muslim Americans but take my weed??! Oh no!

Lol i fucking hate the term but the white privileged in this thread is actually fucking astounding.

It's almost like it's a real thing that people aren't just making up to make white people feel bad!

Seemed alright at first?

Yeah. I had the audacity to hope.

Yeah fuck Muslim Americans but take my weed??!

Difference is I voted for weed. Taking my weed would be proof of tyranny and non democracy as it was something I voted for, that I've had for years that I'm told I can't have. Told my vote didn't count. Its not the weed its the principle behind it. And who said anything about fucking Muslim Americans? Just fuck the rest of em. /s eat shit with your strawman argument that I didn't say, you may or may not shill person. ✈✈🏢🏦🚩🚩🚩

maybe we wouldnt have a fucking mexican immigrant problem if our CIA didn't destroy their country for drug money

aaaaaa fucking mennnnnnnnnnn

Yes, this is the middle-ground argument that you never see made. While technically many Central and South American people have come to the US illegally, even if you staunchly disagree with that it's important to remember that these people are escaping violence that the US is very much responsible. I consider them refugees, more than anything. That part of the world has been devastated by drug violence

Look at this list of cities with the highest murder rates, it's not hard to see the pattern...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cities_by_murder_rate

And here's the really crazy part: Mexicans have every reason to hate the US. We fought an aggressive war and took away part of their country... twice! (Texan rebellion & Mexican War--then we bought another chunk of land off them because we made them an offer they literally couldn't refuse) We have fucked over their country every which way for decades now. But the Mexican elite keep the populist sentiment tamped down, historically because we threatened them with invasion if they every got rowdy, but more recently due to economic ties.

And Trump is destroying those ties! He wants to build a wall? Not only that, he wants to revoke NAFTA! I don't care what your position is on either of those--you can agree that those things will make the average Mexican very pissed. Mexicans have been fucked over by their elite for their country's entire history. Nieto currently has something like a 12% approval rating.

The stage is ripe for a populist Mexican President to take over. If we're lucky, it'll be Evo Morales. If we're unlucky, Hugo Chavez. Think Mexico would miss our money? Ha! Imagine how much China and Russia would pay to have a major ally right on our border? And this isn't the sort of shit that would go away just because Trump leaves office. This could be a long realignment.

Donald Trump might actually turn one of our strongest allies, one of only two neighboring nations, into a hostile nation. I doubt he would have the same vitriol for us as Chavez brought. They probably wouldn't welcome Russian missiles like Castro. But allow a Russian or Chinese naval base? Why not? After all, we have troops in Poland. We have bases in South Korea and Japan.

It's entirely possible that all this stupid fucking Mexico hate coming from the White House could result in the greatest geopolitical fuck-up in US history by taking out a national asset we've always taken for granted: that the nearest a hostile country could project power has always been at least an ocean away.

At least Trump isn't boring, but I'm no longer so sure I want to live in interesting times.

//////

Not to mention, welcome /u/2016pantherswin . Coming from being a Trump supporter to realizing that you can't trust his words is going to be a hell of a paradigm shift.

If you keep going, you may get to the point where you see that he's setting up economic and regulatory policies that expand and solidify the control of elites (Goldman Sachs running Treasury, billionaires running our schools, oil companies running the EPA), massive tax cuts that will almost all go to the wealthy, rubbing shoulders with drug and private prison companies... and then you also realize that he's systematically attacking anything that gets in the way of his power ("so-called" judges, "fake news" media, "paid" protesters--the judicial branch, the media, and free speech all being pillars of our democracy) shit starts to get real. I only expect it to get worse as he gains more power.

Lol. The media is not a pillar of our democracy. It's just a PR arm for the elites. The very people you're supposedly railing against.

Well said.

It's not all black and white. A lot of historical injustices have reduced in intensity because of the media glare on any matter that nets them eyeballs.

Sure. This is true. But how many injustices uncovered were done so because someone benefited politically or financially? Just look at "reefer madness" for something supposedly done in the public interest motivated by private interests.

You'd rather live with no media at all then a flawed one?

I'd rather that old news media just died at this point. A bunch of yokels on youtube have a better sense of ethics and desire for the truth. Not some fat cat cunt with friends that need a public shine job so they can push through the next piece of legislation that fucks over more people for profit margins of a few share holders.

The media is absolutely a pillar of our democracy. Our democracy just isn't all that great.

It really isn't. And hasn't ever been. Journalists are not the noble idealists the media has tricked you into believing.

Freedom of the press was absolutely important to the founding fathers in the first years of creating a new state and during the revolutionary period (led to things like the federalist papers and numerous other inflammatory publications) and they made a point to explicitly state that fact and make it a pillar of their new country.

That being said the press is often controlled and manipulated like all the major news outlets today are, both left and right. But that isnt because the press is shit, its because those are symptoms reflecting a shit system. Of course most journalists aren't idealists looking to shed light on the truth just for the betterment of humanity, but neither are judges, and the courts are certainly a pillar of american democracy, neither are the cabinet members and the different branches of government but they certainly are pillars of american democracy. As difficult as it is for a lot of Americans to realize, not even the mythical founding fathers were idealists looking to make a country full of justice for everyone and shit, they were just a whole bunch of pretty well-off businessmen who got the fuckin chance in a lifetime to make their own country and they made the best possible country for them.

So yeah if a country is full of corruption, from the cops to the judges to its industry leaders to its secretary of state, dont expect its news corporations to be clean either.

You misunderstand me. I'm not making any kind of value judgment. I don't call it a pillar of our democracy in order to convey a mark of nobility but as a simple observation. The press is not just a PR firm, though they may act in that capacity. It's something much deeper and more complex than that. It is a collection of separate agents exercising authorship over our historical record and over consensus reality. It's a collection of institutional norms and social doctrine that spin the threads from which our discourse is woven.

The press and the state are two of the major pillars of the system that governs our country today. Our country was practically founded by the printing press and it is the press that lends the state a large portion of its public legitimacy and vice versa. De-legitimization of one affects the other and each exert great influence on the speech and actions of the other.

I don't disagree with you that that is what the purpose of the press should be. It's just that I feel that it no longer serves the public in general. Or that when it does it's the exception. Not the rule. I think it's time that old media died to make way for smaller, agile and more accountable organizations. Clearly the old way of doing things is not going to work in an age of click bait with these faceless corporations more concerned with access than being the adversary to the establishment that they should be.

Not american.

Your argument deserve gold.

When you refer to someone by their last name in Spanish you can use their first last name or both, but using only the second is wrong.

Peña Nieto or Peña

Not just Nieto

Wow I don't care.

Says whom? I'm Hispanic and I call people by their second name all the time.

Good for you but that's definitely not common. I don't even know the second last name of half of my friends.

When you have 4 friends names Alex.... You start to call them by their last names. Ortega , Ortiz, etc.

Doofus, we are talking about second last names!

I feel dumb ....I'll take the L . 😥

Ahhh, I didn't know that, thanks.

A fucking +

I agree with much of what you have to say, but it's important to remember just how hated NAFTA was by the Mexican left and in particular the Indigenous communities in Mexico. The Zapatista uprising happened on January 1, 1994 specifically because that was the date NAFTA went into effect. NAFTA was responsible for a really unfair trade relationship between Mexico and the US in many ways, but particularly around corn as a commodity. Corn is originally from Mexico (the genetic predecessors and original human breeding is from the Oaxaca valley) and is deeply entwined in the spiritual and philosophical systems of many Indigenous groups particularly in southern Mexico. NAFTA at that time served to undermine heirloom corn by flooding the Mexican and world markets with cheap GMO corn from the US. Mainstream capitalist Mexicans now might like NAFTA and want to keep it, but the grassroots and left Mexicans (and folks in the US for that matter) hated NAFTA when it went into effect and fought against it with mass mobilizations. I'm not saying Trump's economic policies are good, and I assume and "renegotiation" of NAFTA will probably likely favor the rich, but NAFTA on its face hasn't been welcomed by the many Mexicans.

Very good point. That said, NAFTA has been good to the Mexican GDP. Specifically, note how much more Mexico was hurt by the 2008 Financial Crisis than either Brazil or China. A lot of that growth is coming from being so heavily integrated into the US economy.

Meaning that while NAFTA screwed over a number of people, a large number of people are now directly tied to its success. And as you mentioned, Trump is the type of person that--if he does try to "renegotiate" NAFTA--will attempt to do so from a "positions of strength," meaning that he'll try to get as much as he can for us at Mexico's expense, forgetting that you can fuck over small-time contractors as a developer and not have to worry about their lawsuits, but you can't fuck over neighboring nations without serious backlash.

NAFTA grew Mexican GDP, but it also increased wealth and income inequality in Mexico. The Mexican economic elites and middle-classes support it, but Mexican farmers and the poor despise it. The Mexican immigration crisis was largely due to the economic dislocation caused by NAFTA. Trump's trade policies will do good for the Mexican poor.

American here who has lived, studied, and worked in Mexico.

You are absolutely 110% correct. While Mexico is no saint, we could have dealt with them in a much better way, starting decades ago. Instead, we've propped up their elite and allowed them to send their poor and disenfranchised to us. We've been bad neighbors in every sense. Do people think Mexicans are eager to immigrate? They're not, they'd rather stay with their friends and family and not be forced to learn a new language and work bullshit jobs. Problem is, their country and economy has been systematically fucked by both internal and external forces. And we haven't been good neighbors and helped out when and where we could - we chose to profit off their misery for misguided short-term political and economic gains.

I have worked alongside people from Mexico, Central America and South America for well over a decade now. The vast majority from Mexico came from the Northern states where the drug trade has had the worst impact. Most from Central America are from Honduras and Guatemala where US funded wars have turned the countries into dangerous places. They are doing work that most US born citizens wouldn't do and they take pride in their work regardless of what it is.

It makes me sick to think that so many good people and their families will be thrown out when all they were trying to do is provide for their loved ones in a safer environment. If anything they are the embodiment of the American dream; Immigrate here, take any work you can, work hard, create new opportunities for your family.

One thing to add to this is that Marijuana was outlawed initially because the US wanted to take land owned by Mexican Americans in the Midwest and West. Much like opium was outlawed to make it easier to subjugate the Asian immigrants out West prior to that.

Mexicans hate NAFTA too. Look at articles before Trump was elected. Killed they're agricultural economy, worker safety, crime all time high, pollution; NAFTA didn't benefit anyone but the corporations. Even Zack DeLa Rocha sang songs against it. Let's not pretend it's wonderful nite that Trump wants to get rid of it.

If we lose Mexico's friendship we also almost completely alienate ourselves from our hemisphere's politics. We have an awful relationship with almost all of Latin America because of our imperialist history and because we refuse to enter any sort of league with them which might require America to capitulate to the odd regulation or two.

We really don't want to sit here with our only friends an ocean away.

Thats the whole point of extreme vetting. The people who are causing the problems in Europe are the large groups of Adult males who are not tied to any form of family. These are the people that are destabilizing countries.

He literally kicked out green card holders. Those are the people who came in legally. When you kick them out all you are doing us making sure that people who want to come here do it illegally so that they won't be kicked out every time some hack wants to pull some more racist grandstanding bullshit. Trump just made the illegal immigration problem a lot worse than it was.

Comparing the vetting that the U.S. does to that of Germany and Sweden is disengenuous. Plus, we've admitted something like 3,200 refugees compared to the hundreds of thousands in those smaller countries.

It all starTs at WHINSEC

http://soaw.org/about-the-soawhinsec/what-is-the

This has always been my policy on immigration. We create the conditions they are trying to escape while simultaneously decrying them coming to "our back yard!"

I'm mad at myself for even for half a second doubting that Trump was a Neoconservative piece of shit

And trump already cozied up to the CIA...

I know soon as I post this, the Trump shills will come here and spout out their little creative justifications as to why he's doing this, but is still anti establishment somehow...

"He's playing 4d chess!"

Lmao...That's such a fucking lame statement...If you have used this line in regard to Trump before, than you are goofy as shit, I'm sorry..

"Keep your friends close, and your enemies closer.."

Sure buddy, and keep your delusions just as close...

"Look, he comes from the baby boomer generation. They all think weed is bad!"

You're fucking with me right? This corporate big wig wealthy douchebag isn't aware that marijuana is illegal to allow for maximum corporate profits? Sure dude.....are you interested in purchasing a bridge?

"He's just playing the game. If he were to legalize weed, his cover would Be blown"

Which is it? Is he blatant anti establishment, or undercover good guy? Fuck off with the wacky bullshit guys, nobody here was born yesterday, you're not fooling anyone.

Just so you all know, CTR here tries to paint this sub as a trump conservative fuckfest to make us look stupid and racist. Can we maybe like....just accept that, understand it, and develop a way to counter it? Because they're scaring off lots of new subscribers on the liberal side who we could redpill by making this place look like "Limbaugh Land"...

Sadly you're right about the 4D chess line. As much as I wish it were true, it only sounds like delusional idiocy when people say it.

It's fucking comical. Every report suggests that the administration is mired in incompetence, he spends more time golfing than listening to security briefs (this after persistently shitting on Obama for every vacation), and his fuckups result in the death of American soldiers and civilians (see Yemen). His press conferences are comically inept. No chess, just idiocy.

fucking hell yes dude he's playing 12th dimension monopoly

What is 4D chess? I can only assume that chess is the 'game' of running the country from the political side and 4D means Trump's thinking of other 'dimensions' which is meant to make him sound clever or some shit.

Yeah like there's another dimension that we might not be aware of and so might not understand the moves he makes at the time. I do think he is a shrewd person who thinks ahead, but when they try to use this phrase when he appoints Goldman-Sachs bankers to his cabinet I have to roll my eyes.

I think the extra dimension is him orchestrating how to make his fans feel positive about him still (which is clearly working, as you can see in the tumour that is /r/t_d), while he does stupid, selfish, corrupt shit to benefit him and his mates.

Actually creating a 4d chess wouldn't require another dimension could probably be turned into a competitive game that requires more foresight than chess which is what I think these people are getting at with their metaphor.

Basically, whenever Trump makes a mistake, large or small, people will claim that it's intentional and that he's just "playing 4d chess", and that we simply don't know what masterful plan he has.

Sadly you're right about the 4D chess line.

Yep, look at this guy's post for example:

I still have a little hope that maybe this is a master plan/trick or something.

Manipulative people believe that 100% of the rest of the world is also manipulative and it's just that some people are far better at it than others. They don't believe someone can say what they believe outright, no, everything is a game, a plan, a trick, "or something".

CTR tries to paint this sub as a trump conservative fuckfest

the CTR is now shilling for Trump. Really makes you think.

Not shilling FOR trump, they just want to associate him with US, with the "conspiracy community", to delegitimize us.

People like you unfortunately will never be happy to run a program/administration for time without seeing instant success.

You are the hipster of the political world. You feel its " not cool " to like Donald Trump no more he was so " yesterdays news " " hes just like the rest of them"

Dont be like this , this makes you angry and bitter. Have hope even just a little. Feel free to point out the flaws but have some hope what we have now is not perfect and probably never will but remember what we have now will always be better than what could of happened.

Small steps , Trump is not the savior but hes a small step in the right direction and we need to make sure whoever his successor is follows at least the same direction and as each administration comes and goes America improves. We have moved a small inch in the right direction we would of been taken a mile back under Hillary.

The fuck? This is a fake post right? You forgot the /s

Are you honestly telling me hes going to be worse than what would of been with Hillary?

come the fuck on.

I just spit cereal onto my phone, this was hilarious.

Very frightening when you forget the /s though. Delusional and frightening.

4d chess? over on /pol/ they are claiming he's playing 33d.

He's playing D&D 3.5e

CTR doesn't give a shit about this sub, dude. CTR probably doesn't even EXIST as the caricature you (and many others) have created in their heads.

If CTR is operating on Reddit anymore (which I HIGHLY doubt- the election is over and there isn't even a democratic frontrunner for DNC chair yet), then they would be operating on the major default subs....not this sub with its whopping 2000-4000 active users. That's just me thinking critically.

No sir. I've been on this sub in some shape or form for nearly a decade now. If there's ANY group shilling on here, the answer is far, faaar more obvious than everyone here thinks: it's the group that blatantly copy-posts/cross-posts the exact shit that's on THEIR front page to here. Hint hint, starts with a T and ends with a D.

The newbies being scared out of here aren't being turned away by big bad CTR. They're getting turned away by the Donald folks and the mods who have banned them for whatever flimsy reason they could cook up. It's not even a secret. The mods BRAGGED about it a week or two ago.

Pretty sure the dnc chair was elected yesterday

The CIA isn't filled with people who are out tonget the US. it's just headed by those people. Have you heard of the Doolittle commission? it's what gives the CIA covert ops powers and outlines their goals separately and independently from what the President can control. Trump won't be able to oust the secret heads/funders AKA brown brothers harriman clients. there has to be a large movement of citizens who out right reject this structure. and that's unlikely to happen as we trifle over these little details

""He's just playing the game. If he were to legalize weed, his cover would Be blown""

They said that about our last president and said that he'd legalize with one of his last actions in office. Look what happened...

Cozied up to the CIA? The CIA hates Trump and is leaking info.

"Our CIA"... c'mon goyim you should know this by now

Great point, but

this

you should already know by now means you should take that up with OP

^{c'mon redditor}

Been saying this the whole time.. illegal immigration is certainly a problem that should be addressed but building a wall is just a waste. Better to ask ourselves what we can do to make their country not so shitty rather than just trying to keep them out.

You'd think it would be in the best interests of the US to not have a a neighboring country become a haven for organized crime, but we've done nothing to help them and have actually only made things worse But doing that would require a drug policy that aims to stop the drug problem rather than just creating jobs for police and private prisons while lining the pockets of the officials who perpetrate this injustice on Americans and Mexicans alike. They're not interested in curtailing drug use, they just want to keep this scam going as long as possible.

Maybe trump is one of the ten kings in the bible who hate babylon so much that god gives them the power to destroy it

No.

Or maybe he is a corporate shill out to help his fellow billionaires?

Building a wall is a waste because planes and ladders are a thing.

Not to mention most drug trafficking and illegal immigration happens by air or sea. Even fucking T-shirt cannons

I have a friend from Nicaragua and his family fled during the contras. CIA fucked up his country too.

Same for Syrian refugees.

No shit, as someone who's seen first hand how Honduras really operates it's obvious who's in control and preventibg any meaningful democratic movement. The country with the biggest military base in the country/region.

Remember the Alamo?

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What tons of people in the US dont realize is that this isnt 'theory' outside of the US, its pretty much accepted narrative.

Were not hated abroad for no reason. From drones to drugs our government and big businesses are using their power and influence to do things that are really fucking up the lives of everyday people that just happen to live on a different patch of dirt.

Wait I thought it was because of undercutting mexico on farm prices?

In my opinion full gung ho support for a candidate should end once they're elected president. Then you need to step back and look objectively and hold them accountable for being a bad person or a good person. Don't blindly support a president because you voted for them

exactly. now he is in power, and we need to be rooting for the country, not the candidate

Seriously. I liked Trump over Hillary, but now that he has won, no matter what side you are on, you should be hoping he does well. When he does something I disagree with, I (and anyone else who agrees) should hold him accountable. It's not character assassination, it's trying to make sure he does as good as he can.

I hate Donald, but I do hope he does well... I just hope his stated and implied goals are never implemented.

The_Donald isn't a sub where they hold him accountable, it is a 100% pro Donald sub.

It isn't the place to talk about weed, it is the place to support Donald 100%.

People still fail to realize this. The_Donald is not the place for debate, at all, never was.

What has he done so far that you've liked? And what has he done that you've disliked?

Well he's kept most of his promises very well. He moved the Dakota Access Pipeline farther away and made sure it was built with quality materials, which is a good compromise for both sides. He's already diffused tensions with Russia somewhat, which I think will be beneficial for both sides, and he does seem to be working towards other promises like removing Obamacare. He does seem to be keeping up to the deal-making promise of his campaign.

On the bad side, I think the most pressing issue is his press secretary, he in particular seems to have no interest in telling the truth. This is not much different than previous administrations, but it is certainly no improvement, and honestly might be even worse. I also thought that (while not some human rights crisis) the "Muslim ban" is a largely ineffective measure and that some of his cabinet picks (Ben Carson for HUD, what the fuck?) seemed very stupid.

That's what citizens should do. Contrary to what some think, nationalism isn't bad unless it's taken to the extreme. Don't idolize Trump, just support the country and the Constitution.

Dont ever blindly support someone. Although I do understand your point.

We democrats blindly supported Obama. Party members blindly support their candidates. No one ever takes this advice themselves, we just expect it of the other.

That isn't true. Here in California we were proud of Obama but talked constantly at his lack of courage on certain subjects. One week after his swearing in the DEA ramped up the raid on marijuana clinics around here and people were pissed. We were also pissed at the never ending wars, etc.

Glad to hear it. I found it difficult to find a platform to discuss his shortcomings. We were all so happy when he won, we really wanted to just extol his virtues. When he started engaging in actions I disliked, it was hard to have those conversations.

Right now we are trying to confront issues within the DNC, and it is still hard if not impossible, to question the actions of Obama and the Clintons without being shut down.

Our forefathers warned us against this! The two party system is the real problem. You have to chose one or the other to have a hope of getting some things you want and they both have some extremely old and register beliefs that don't line up with modern life.

We need ranked order voting, and we need Bernie to start a new party (if Ellison isn't elected).

Speak for yourself. I didnt "blindly" support Obama. In my eyes he was a War Criminal just like bush. I thought that of him well before his second term.

My "blind support" ended shortly into his first term, but it was a heartbreaking process.

I'm talking about our party collectively. It's still hard for many democrats to criticize him, and you sure don't see it happening at the establishment level.

I will hijack this post.

I am a Trump supporter. Earned 40,000 Karma on t_d. Got banned for asking mods to stop censorship and to stop banning people for not agreeing with Trump.

They banned me. I sent a PM to many t_d users with proof of censorship. I got a common themed reply from a lot of people. Lots of people are pissed at the mods for massive censorship but they can't say anything because they will get banned. They can't go to other subs to discuss because those subs ban them for the flimsiest of reasons(still better than what the mods on t_d do).

TL;DR - Any Trump supporter who questions mod authority on t_d gets banned. Most users know the mods on t_d are steaming pieces of shit.

Then why isn't another pro-Trump or at least Trump-neutral sub created where people can objectively criticize (or praise if deserved) Trump? If the mods are shit, a new sub should be created to rival t_d.

Because it is not easy starting a new sub. The_donald took 1 full year to grow to the massive size that it is. If I knew how to make a sub, I would have made a sub with the requirements you mentioned.

Yeah, I know it can be tough to start from scratch. It is however the only suggestion I have at the moment.

Regarding creating a new sub- I'm not sure because I haven't participated in creating one yet, but as far as I know it's as simple as pressing the 'Create subreddit ' link on the homepage. Of course then you'd have to promote it etc... but the possibility is definitely there if there is a will to make it happen.

There are plenty of anti-Trump subs, why wouldn't there be more pro-Trump ones as well?

There are plenty of anti-Trump subs, why wouldn't there be more pro-Trump ones as well?

I think if Hillary had won, there would be plenty of anti Hillary sub popping up. When a side wins, they relax. The ones who lose become more energetic - Tea Party is a prime example.

r/Donald_DMZ/

Here you go. Feel free to try and get some discussions going. I have no intentions on keeping this sub (I didn't create it for myself, I created it based on a need) so eventually, moderation may be handed over to someone who is able to run things in the spirit of the sub. Neutral.

Brilliant description and rules on that subreddit pagefault404!

CHOO CHOO so you're chugging along on the hype train, and notice something is amiss in your favorite Trump sub. You point it out, and suddenly, you're banned.

What the fuck mate!?

lol thanks.

Agreed and sub'd.

128 subscribers... I have group texts with more participants.

Well, we can't all be part of Vitalife MLM schemes.

Haha just teasing, we all gotta start somewhere

I figured it wasn't a serious quip. Appreciate ya

Yeah but the paid shills are the problem and I think that is what the OP is addressing at the donald. Any negativity about Trump and you gone. Basically all those that are left will only be able to say positive stuff so those who are reading that sub w/out much knowledge will believe that everyone really loves Trump that much and the media is just hatin.

Yes, T_D has become unbearable.

Has become?

It used to be fun before election night because you had to ignore Trump's faults for the win. But it makes no sense to be blind to his faults once he has won.

But it makes no sense to be blind to his faults once he has won.

Bravo.

It doesn't seem as bad as r/politics . I can't make a comment on there without being downvoted to oblivion no matter how reasonable I try to word it.

You can make a comment praising Trump on r/politics. On r/t_d if you criticise Trump you get banned.

Read the rules

What?

This is kinda frustrating me is everyone just forgetting what the Damn sub is about its a Trump Sub of course its gonna be tight on that kinda stuff. You know where would be a perfect place for criticism and discussion by both Trump supporters and critics r/politics oh wait.

I don't think people would have such a big problem with it if they didn't often pretend to be a bastion of free speech, rail against safe spaces, and ban so many actual Trump supporters.

"become"

The rest of Reddit is just fine tho.. gotchya

T_D used to be good at certain points - when JCM ran the sub it was fun.

As for reddit, I filter out the spammy subs.

Smart on you. Too bad the majority are still being suckered into the delusion.. and their plan to control the majority of minds soldiers on. But again, fck the Donald.. they're the problems here lol

get used to it, it's only going to get worse in the years to come as his lemmings dig in even harder and block out all forms of reality.

only reality I'm worried about is the lunatic Democrats who thought putting a rapist who face fucked a woman in the oval office back into the white house was anywhere close to a good idea.

Yep now you have a real rapist in the Oval Office

Listen, I know a trustworthy person when I see one

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KiIP_KDQmXs

I hate always being the last comment in hilarious debates. come on! at least fight back a LITTLE.

did you forget to take your meds this morning?

Rule #10

interesting, so the next time I get called a shill should I come crying to you or will you be ready to jump in and take care of it?

Do you see the report button? Use it. In this case you were just being demeaning.

yeah, i was, how about that.

So it's north Korea

It's a little more complicated than that. The gist of it is that you click that button, but then you need to figure out the options. The hardest part was the name.

Once it's submitted and created, however, the options are staggering. I think I have figured most of them out. I created a subreddit based on the need that was presented here.

Because pro-donald organizations don't need to dump millions into shilling on reddit

Your obvious bias made your otherwise possibly good response invalid.

300,000 subscribers, never more than 14k online. It's the sub that bots built.

Thats how we berniecrats felt when /r/politics became ground zero for HRC's campaign and CTR. It was a dramatic change, and we had to find other subs.

Hey, I just created one, it's called /r/ourpresidenttrump. I plan to keep the hive mind of The_Donald out. I am actually a Democrat but I am a huge fan of free speech and will not censor things that are not breaking site wide rules.

Because it will get absorbed and infiltrated by the same paid mods.

And people will have to face the reality none of them want to face: that Trump was shilled for just like Shillary since before the election. And the reason?

He's a Zionist puppet just like the rest. His appeal and style are simply evolved marketing tactics.

Yes I agree with that, it's just that people frequently face that kind of reality and come to those kind of realizations more easily if they have a platform (in this case a neutral Trump related sub) to discuss these ideas/realizations on .

while I'm no fan of Trump I find it interesting that someone who is a "zionist puppet" would have a guy like Bannon in his inner circle.

you probably forgot what sub you are in right now.

The Jews control everything!!11

duh, sorry, my bad.

PIZAAGATE EMAILS BENGHAZI

or I as I like to call it, 99% of what's posted in here these days.

Right. Back to our regularly scheduled debate: "WAS HITLER ACTUALLY A JEW????"

I'm jewish, and I'm not self-hating, as far as I know. However, there are several large donors who happen to be jewish, and who's primary and only issue is Israel. In the service of that singular concern, much influence has been purchased through donations.

Sabin donated 7 million towards the construction of the DNC, and is the DNC's top donor (and was HRC's top donor) and they were close, having donated 10 million to the campaign, another 10 million to the Clinton Foundation, and more. He felt Hillary needed to be more to the right of Obama on issues related to Israel. He accused Ellison (the DNC nominee) of being anti-semitic.

This is difficult to talk about without sounding anti-semitic. I don't believe that there is a "jewish conspiracy", but I do believe that powerful pro-Israeli donors exert an outsized influence on our politicals lives right now.

The issue with Israel remains complex. I'm unresolved on how to understand the issue. I see both sides, but I am clear that I would like the Israeli's and their advocates to stay the fuck out of my government. People are worried about russia hacking the election - how is this different?

Yeah it's not some evil conspiracy , it's Israel trying to protect its intrests. It's become a problem as they dump more and more into making sure politicians are pro Israel.

there are several large donors who happen to be jewish, and who's primary and only issue is Israel.

Just like there are several large donors who happen to be farmers, and their only issue is farming oversight. or how there are several large donors who happen to be part of the military-industrial complex, and their only issues are starting more wars.

People doing everything to defend their interests is nothing new. And the fact that different people have similar interests gives absolutely no indication that they're secretly all working together. If anything, they're probably disagreeing with each other in many things, or might even be actively working against each other. Remember that any group or subgroup has arguments within the group. To think that all of it is one big conspiracy of people working together is fundamentally misunderstanding how people work.

Trump himself literally said he "would be the best friend Israel has ever had". His first meeting as president was with Netanyahu.

If you think everyone on this sub thinks like that, you are sadly, very mistaken.

You forget that some born again Christians see Jews rebuilding the temple of Solomon and a massive war in the middle East as essential to Christ's return.

http://christinprophecy.org/articles/the-third-temple/ one link of many

Note: I don't think most Christians feel this way, but a lot of Baptists, those crazy fucks that speak in tongues, and southern rural Christians feel this way.

Pentecostals speak in tongues way more than the Baptists. The Baptist denomination is pretty mainstream in the south.

Oh i know they don't but I'm aware of the desire that they hold.

I know of a born again Christian (turned catholic) that believes this (my brother-in-law). I roll my eyes whenever he talks about these things. I play along of course. He would be a Trump supporter if he lived in the US. He believes the fake news bit. He believes that immigrants and their religion are the root of all problems. He doesn't realize that people come to our countries for a reason. Their beliefs do not match the beliefs of their radical countrymen. Granted that some of them have evil intentions, but we have that already in our countries. We deal with it and move ahead. I don't understand why there has to be a number set and a time line set for refugees, when we could just accept refugees who have passed certain tests (speaking English, society integration, learn beliefs and values of communities that they are moving into [even though it may not be their own], etc) , at a slower pace.

I don't think most Christians feel this way

I think most do, and even Christian Palestinians think that most of their western counterparts do. It's sad.

Trump's campaign rhetoric calmed way down after he met with netanyahu. Oh, and fuck the two state solution. Also bannon thinks "islam" is an enemy so it makes sense he'd encourage trump to be friendly with israel.

Umm Why? Bannon is pro zionist.

http://www.haaretz.com/world-news/u-s-election-2016/.premium-1.753416

http://www.breitbart.com/jerusalem/ (Israeli office)

Breitbart News Network really got its start in Jerusalem, http://www.breitbart.com/big-journalism/2015/11/17/breitbart-news-network-born-in-the-usa-conceived-in-israel/

Sorry if this comes off as disrespectful but you clearly don't know anything about Bannon. He has worked with Israelis for years and there's a breitbart office in Jerusalem. He was painted as antisemetic as an attack not because it's even close to reality.

sounds a lot like pizzagate.

This 100%. People love reality TV shows, so that's what they got. He's not some messiah. Just a reflection of our current societal issues.

Hey, I just created one, it's called /r/ourpresidenttrump. I plan to keep the hive mind of The_Donald out. I am actually a Democrat but I am a huge fan of free speech and will not censor things that are not breaking site wide rules.

In my experience as a mod, allowing free speech is pretty much a sure way to make sure the sub starts leaning to the right. So it may work out in your favor as an ostensibly pro trump sub, while allowing criticism of 45.

-UncleSamuel

I mostly wanted a space to talk about the current presidency with out descending into insults.

Because they sub is just about shit posting...

Do any Trump supporters want to have a real conversation? Lots of places to do it already...

They had the whole time to make a serious sub and nobody did or cared. Too busy shit posting.

Because they sub is just about shit posting...

That is a good point, very little actual mature discussions take place on T_D about policy, politics, law etc.

C'mon, let's be real. The VAST majority of participants in the_donald aren't even old enough to vote let alone have any desire to actually be politically active. People take that place waaay too seriously. It's a meeting room for LoL/4chan/etc trolls. That's it. Politics, especially in its current state in the US, is just such an easy topic to troll.

Would you stand in a daycare and get frustrated by the lack of meaningful, mature discussion? Now, you'd obviously not even try to engage in that manner with a room full of rowdy children.

Only difference is I'm not worried about daycares indoctrinatly future people with insanity

I try to have a discussion on redacted and always get at least 30 downvotes.

And he rest of Reddit is a beacon of transparency and real conversation.. lol

Comparatively? Yes.

Riiiiight. That's a good one..

R/Ask Trump supporters is for this

Nah they changed the rules so that non supporters are limited to what they can post.

r/conservative might fit that bill.

Not even close, they're ban-happy too.

Hmmm... sensing a common thread here

Better check your panty bulge, I've been banned from /r/Socialism and /r/LateStageCapitalism too.

So, all the conservative subs are the equivalent to those^{^} ??

I got banned on r/LSC for saying that virtual reality was just a fun toy and not Valve trying to control the proletariat with happy fantasies.

Conservatives are generally gigantic pussies who are afraid of everything that doesn't confirm their worldview. They also have the memory of fucking guppies.

"we were quiet when obama was president"

hahahahahahahahah wat.jpg

"respect the office"

Oh, wait, you're serious.

Let me laugh even harder.

Right?

I lean right and have been banned there three times. Just last week, a user with the top comment in a thread was banned. No reason given.

r/conservative mods are a bunch of cocks.

there is /r/trump, but that has been dark for a long time. It was a very civil discussion oriented sub about Trump.

r/AskTrumpSupporters is very good, they could be much better though if they stopped banning people for the stupidest of reasons.

Well, people were going over and "asking" "how can you support (name his latest egregious action here)"? Not really "questions" but rather attacks disguised as questions, or rhetorical questions where there really isn't a desire for an answer.

Not that I can't understand how that could happen, but I did observe that, and Trump supporters may have felt like they were being punished for being open.

I posted a question in there and just got a bunch of personal insults as responses.

Take the emotion out of it, people are saying Trump is a disaster and a shill, why are they wrong?

I'm not sure how your comment relates to my comment? My comment was why /r/AskTrumpSupporters is getting hair-trigger with banning, and I was proposing an answer.

You then seemed to defend the fact that they were being attacked.

Sure. If you want to attack people, then attack them. But don't be surprised if they don't line up eagerly for the experience.

So they aren't wrong, got it.

Huh? I'm just saying, this is an opportunity to engage in a dialogue.

But if you feel you are beyond dialogue with them, that's fine. I'm not judging you, just talking about the purpose of that particular sub.

I'm not a Trump supporter and don't agree with a single thing he's done, and have been horrified by many of his actions.

I just fear the growing polarization between us as citizens and so appreciate opportunities for balanced and reasoned discussion.

I don't think it's an attack. It's a question. Yes, kinda unpleasant question, which is entirely expected in a political subreddit where proponents of different parties argue with each other.

What kind of questions do you expect?

Rhetorical questions aren't questions. You may want to yell at them, but most people don't like being yelled at.

So, I guess the question is, why go there if all you want to do is yell at them?

I think it's best to go with a real question, where you really are curious about the answer.

Given that we hope to encourage them to not vote for Trump in the future, they've presented us with an opportunity to converse, learn about how we democrats failed to attract their vote (for future strategizing), and perhaps persuade them come over to our side. That won't happen if all we do is yell.

These questions aren't rhetorical.

These questions aren't rhetorical.

Which questions?

I don't think that makes sense. They will simply recite stuff they've heard from "conservative media".

Well, then, best to insult them - that will really bring them over. /s

Which questions?

Questions like "What do you think about Trump doing <X>?".

If being asked to defend the actions of the person you are ostensibly there to defend feels like an attack, maybe you shouldn't be fucking defending them.

The forum is for people who want to have a dialogue. A dialogue is different than a fight.

Diplomacy versus conflict. You pick your approach. But that sub was there to promote diplomacy, for what it's worth, and I think all olive branches need to be valued. Fighting is easy. Finding common ground is harder.

I posted a question in there and just got a bunch of personal insults as responses.

Yeah The Donald does have a very strong influence there, and the mods are biased as hell. Keep digging though there are some good posters there.

I asked "why pepe of all things, can't you expand?" 1 hour later. Responses dodge the question, I'm banned for trolling...

r/asktrumpsupporters is also heavily scrubbed.

The rules of "Be Civil, Not posting in Good faith and No trolling" are all HEAVILY enforced on non-supporters but supporters can circlejerk about how "Shairablue shill are all over this sub" and "Democrats are just evil" and not even be slapped.

There CAN be discussion, but your walking on ice that's about to crack in 2 seconds.

They recently changed the rules where non supporters are only allowed to reply in the form of a question asking for clarification.

I had a post deleted where I was actually agreeing with a Trump policy because it wasn't a "follow up question"

There is. It's called askthe_donald and it too is getting to be as bad as the_donald. It used to be a place to ask why people supported Donald Trump. There was a question about whether or not people could sue shareblue/CTR and I asked if there was any evidence of either of these two still operating on Reddit because I had been accused of being a CTR shill and the mods banned me for trolling and bad faith participation.

Pro Donald subreddits rely on all people believing the narrative because otherwise when Trump does something completely stupid like he does daily the dissenters can't change the narrative.

I can't really comment on /r/askthe_donald, because I rarely go there, and I'm a progressive who didn't vote for him, but the Shareblue issue is real, and effects all of us (democrats included).

None of us should like this approach to messaging and media: Here's the link: https://www.scribd.com/document/337535680/Full-David-Brock-Confidential-Memo-On-Fighting-Trump#from_embed

Oftentimes, when any of us, from any political persuasion, decry the presence of shills/astroturfing, etc., on Reddit, there's always someone to deny it's existence, and it gets frustrating after a while, because it is a big issue for reddit as a whole (forget which party you belong to).

Oftentimes, when any of us, from any political persuasion, decry the presence of shills/astroturfing, etc., on Reddit, there's always someone to deny it's existence, and it gets frustrating after a while, because it is a big issue for reddit as a whole (forget which party you belong to).

Ignore the people who are shills. The problem is t_d actively promotes people acting like paid shills on his behalf. That is why no one wants to talk to trump supporters. The ones who are still left are clinically retarded 99% of the time in my experience.

Ignore the people who are shills.

No. It's not a problem which should be ignored.

Sure, there are some dogmatists on all sides of the aisle - some would say that I "shilled" for Bernie, but I wasn't paid, and the Trumpster's weren't paid (unless you have evidence that they were).

Being paid to shill really is an important part of this, and it matters to the integrity of the citizen journalism which is what Reddit's about.

it matters to the integrity of the citizen journalism which is what Reddit's about.

I don't think reddit is really about citizen journalism. It gets used that way for better or worse sometimes, but at it the heart It's just a content aggregation site.

but at it the heart It's just a content aggregation site.

Maybe for you, but for many of us it is a place to share and deconstruct information. That's why there are discussion groups and voting and so on.

If all you are doing is reading articles, why are you even here, talking to me?

I don't doubt upvotes and downvotes are being bought-- by political parties, as well as countless companies, but commenters being called shills is when it starts getting ridiculous. More often than not these account are 3+ years old with full and varied comment histories.

The only time I've personally found real "shills" (dummy account that push one relentless message), are month old pro trump accounts that seem to go around trolling (and they make it pretty obvious).

but commenters being called shills is when it starts getting ridiculous

Look, the evidence for shills is now established. Here's the latest article to confirm it's existance: https://www.forbes.com/forbes/welcome/?toURL=https://www.forbes.com/sites/jaymcgregor/2017/02/20/reddit-is-being-manipulated-by-big-financial-services-companies/&amp;refURL=https://www.reddit.com/&amp;referrer=https://www.reddit.com/#4739b1054c92

Shilling has been happening. Instead of blaming us for complaining about something that really is wrong and is destroying Reddit, how about complaining about the destructive phenomena of shilling instead?

Its kind of like you are blaming the victim for complaining about being victimized, rather than looking to the perpetrator.

What? I think you misread or read into my comment.

I'm not blaming anyone, and I wasn't even saying you're wrong. And yeah, I've seen all those articles, and the video that the forbes article is about.

It's just that the amount people cry wolf and call everyone a shill is absurd. The shills aren't 4 year long accounts with consistent comments that are 'in it for the long con.' That's ridiculous. If everyone on the subreddit, for example, that's been called a shill, was actually a shill- they would be only be like 50 "legitimate" people on here.

But I guess if I'm not 100% with you I'm against you? Yet I wasn't even disagreeing with you...

The shills aren't 4 year long accounts with consistent comments that are 'in it for the long con.' That's ridiculous. If everyone on the subreddit, for example, that's been called a shill, was actually a shill- they would be only be like 50 "legitimate" people on here.

None of us should like this approach to messaging and media

What exactly do you think is so bad about the strategies described in this document? I read it, and the idea for Shareblue basically boils down to, "Write articles and create graphics that are critical of Trump and that lots of people will want to share."

Write articles and create graphics that are critical of Trump and that lots of people will want to share."

Who decides what goes into those articles? We liberals are not of the same mind right now, so who gets to decide what messages are pushed out?

You're concerned that someone might write an article on the internet that you don't agree with? Really?

Nobody's going to force you to share them on Facebook.

You're concerned that someone might write an article on the internet that you don't agree with? Really?

I'm concerned that the democratic party is pushing out messages that I may not agree with, using media.

But if you love propaganda, then this is a great time for you, and you should celebrate!

I'm concerned that the democratic party is pushing out messages that I may not agree with

You think that an organisation meant to appeal to roughly half the population of the entire United States shouldn't have any positions that you personally disagree with?

Regardless, you realise that Shareblue is not "the Democratic Party", nor is it run by the Democratic Party, right? It's run by some people who support the Democratic Party. So the situation is "some people who support Democrats are pushing out messages that you may not agree with". Are you honestly saying that everybody who doesn't line up with you on literally everything should just shut up? It's pretty hard not to describe that as "purism".

You can describe people disagreeing with as some sinister exercise in "propaganda", all you want, but I'm afraid that it is literally always going to happen.

So the situation is "some people who support Democrats are pushing out messages that you may not agree with".

And those messages are driving the democratic agenda. You think I shouldn't have a voice?

My aren't we authoritarian.

How does someone writing an article online prevent you from "having a voice"?

And you are vastly overestimating David Brock's ability to singlehandedly shape the Democratic Party. He's a Clinton loyalist, but even some people on her team (he's not "on her team"; he operates independently) don't really like him.

Keep on defending propaganda... you won't like it much when it doesn't promote your idea, but that's a worry for another day.

In the meantime you are helping to pave the way to tyranny... what establishment democrats do so well.

What exactly is so awful or unusual about this strategy? I would really like to understand it - they're not asking for shill accounts or fake news there.

Because there is a large apparatus generating journalistic pieces, talking points, catch phrases, and arguments to promote a particular perspective, and the goal is that all of us exposed to those media elements will eventually adopt the view being promoted.

The goal is to shape opinion.

But who gets to decide what the opinion should be? What if you have different views than those being pushed out by the media apparatus? If you are unfortunate and don't subscribe to the establishment narrative, your idea will die.

This is what we call propaganda. I would hope that if you have at least one liberal bone in your body, this would be concerning to you.

Why is Shareblue and CTR such an issue but thousands of paid Russian trolls in support of T_D ignorable?

Why deflect attention away from yourself? Why not take responsibility for your own actions?

Why suppress analysis and reflection on the part of the party?

Why defend propaganda?

Then why isn't another pro-Trump or at least Trump-neutral sub created

My conspiracy take on that is that the Trump support on Reddit (some of it) is far from genuine so such a sub would never take off or get noticed by enough people to prevent it from becoming a dead sub.

the Trump support on Reddit (some of it) is far from genuine

This is simply untrue, you cannot buy the type of supporters T_D has, if you could Shareblue and the other attempts would have been successful, T_D is the result of Trump being a huge underdog (Odd for a billionaire to be an underdog) and people get extremely passionate about underdogs, he was also running on the message of representing the average Joe, and the average Joe see's themselves as an underdog and thus empathise with a billionaire.

Trump won on passion, which is why the posts on T_D are so passionate, you can't pay for shitposting like that.

Take it from a T_D regular, we all know we're playing this online persona but it's strictly for that sub, check the accounts of people shouting MAGA and GIVE THIS GUY A COAT etc, outside of that sub it's just normal users chatting on other subs, but once you go to T_D you're a 110% Trump cock blower and happy about it too.

To me that's what /r/politics SHOULD be.

But you can't even say "I sorta maybe might see where Trump is coming from with that one statement" there.

/r/politics is overrun will shills, like u said...one positive comment on DJT and downvotes to oblivion

Ah, just like how the slightest negative comment on any Trump sub leads to an insta-ban.

Or maybe--just maybe--most of the people on that subreddit don't like Trump?

Why is it easier to believe paid agents are downvoting you than legitimate people disagreeing with you?

Or maybe--just maybe--most of the people on that subreddit don't like Trump?

Yeah, the whole "I got downvoted, NO ONE WANTS TO TALK TO ME" shit is retarded. Most of the die hard Trump supporters at this point are so far up his ass that they twist themselves around in the worst ways, and talking to them basically results in them doing 2 or 3 things:

1. Blame Hillary
2. Blame "Tolerant Left"
3. Tell us to shutup and he won

I've had a few good conversations with Trump supporters. The ones who are polite and not totally useless morons who just derail any conversation with childish calls of "FAKENEWS REEEEEEEEEE" it's tiresome to deal with.

Yeah, I think /r/politics is pretty much impossible to salvage for any useful purpose at this point :)

It would need a complete overhaul and I just don't see it happening (maybe in the future? Who knows...)

yes you can. You're being hyperbolic. Plenty of comments about the Gorsuch nomination were positive. You have to admit that's the only decent thing he's done in a month, though.

r/MAGAjuana

The media's agenda is to make trump look as shitty as possible

Let's be fair: he does plenty to make himself look shitty. Of course stuff will come through a filter, but then you have unedited videos, his own twitter posts, and of course his actual actions (removing transparency for oil companies, removing EPA safeguards, for-profit prisons, the bathroom stuff and now taking a step back on pot). Maybe if the man would do some things to actually make himself look good to the majority of the country, but you can't blame his abysmal ratings on just "the media".

Because, well, it's Trump!!

The_Donald only exists because it is subject to "mod rule".

Start something about Trump and it only has two possible directions: Either it is managed, criticisms pruned, tailored to fans, nay-sayers deleted...

...or it evolves to represent what Trump actually is: an empty character who was never going to drain the swamp, puts his right-wing corporate cronies in high places and panders to the lowest common denominators of fear and anti-establishment sentiment (which, for most of his voters, are now clearly revealed as the lies that sane people have been seeing forever).

A new, "honest" Trump sub would fill up with so much criticism that not even former/excommunicated T_D's would enjoy it.

To paraphrase a famous quote "Reality has a distinct anti-Trump bias"...

T_D exists and remains pro-Trump for the same reason that the White House barred some valid accredited news outlets from a press conference yesterday: Trump support cannot win on a fair playing field.

T_D exists and remains pro-Trump for the same reason that the White House barred some valid accredited news outlets from a press conference yesterday

Not being invited to be included in a meeting held in a small room IS NOT THE SAME as being "banned"! All the outrage is just more manufactured FAKE NEWS! Those not present were given copies of the pool report; they didn't miss a damn thing! And there will UNDOUBTEDLY be other occasions when these whiners are invited and others (the smaller outlets) will not be. Will you be pitching a fit when this happens? No! Your one-sided agenda is just so painfully obvious that it's hard to understand why you're not too embarrassed to pursue it; you're just making absolute FOOLS of yourself.

And where is the outrage over the exclusion of reporters of all the small media outlets who are prevented from attending the official press briefings because the room will only hold about 50 people? WHERE IS YOUR (FAUX) OUTRAGE ON THEIR BEHALF? Report back to your masters at Clinton News Network (or whichever other fake news outlet you work for) and let them know they're only fooling themselves and DRIVING MODERATE VOTERS FURTHER AND FURTHER AWAY! Keep up the good work!!

What a calm and well reasoned response /s

Screaming fake news every time you disagree with something is retarded. For the most part, Donald has been criticising the media for their "dishonesty" and has been actively running his mouth talking about instances which never happened or stating "alternative facts". He has since picked up criticisms from news outlets for the hypocrisy he is creating around himself and looks to have subsequently forbid them from taking part in a press conference. He is simply giving fuel to a fire.

He doesn't help himself in these scenarios. If he can't take criticisms then he is not in the correct job. Every US president in modern history has had their critics. Trump looks to be creating more and more every day with his, and his team's actions.

You're joking, right? This is sarcasm? You don't actually believe any of this, you're just parodying an extremist supporter, right?

Right? Because it's becoming harder to tell the difference.

I am not a trump supporter and I agree completely. I think there's so much division that everyone is doubling down to the point of unfairness. People who blindly praise trump are failing to address legitimate concerns. The other side is anxious so any news that comes out will be distilled into an anti trump talking point without considering all the facts.

For example the recent transgender controversy will hurt transgender people, yes. But the arguments about title nine were complex. It's likely that trump was motivated to act in order to appease his anti LGBT supporters but it's very reductive to say title nine was only about transgender bathrooms.

I've also been reading a lot about the health care issue and while I am insured and dependent on the ACA some of the ideas the gop suggest are not bad. Opponents imply everyone will lose coverage right away and die in order to scare us but that's not accurate. It's important to have all the facts.

he rescinded obamas executive order on transgender bathrooms to set up moving marijuana into the limelight as a state's issue. the bill is in congress. there is no threat to weed coming from trump, it is up to the senators now to pass it. he will sign it.

^ Redditor making a reasoned comment.

The_Donald only exists because it is subject to "mod rule".

EVERY sub exists because it's subject to "mod rule". That's what the moderators are there for. To enforce the rules. Don't like the rules? Start your own sub and make your own rules.

Someone's TRIGGERED LMAO

Nope. Not at all. I think it's hilarious that you have to go to conspiracy because you may or may not have gotten banned on T_D. So your feelings got hurt? Extremely funny.

They all got triggered and came to this thread to defend themselves and skew the voting a little while ago. It happens. Best to just downvote and move on.

youre negative votes indicate you're right. shariablue is dominating this post. concern trolling /r/conspiracy with a post on marijuana? how is this conspiracy related??

I frequent conspiracy a lot. You can definitely tell when a post gets brigaded from the outside. Conspiracy is normally one of the extremely few places on Reddit where both sides can have civil conversations. Shariablue definitely doesn't like that.

i agree, i rarely post here but was surprised at how brigaded this post is

The big Milo post from last week was like this as well. In all fairness, a lot of the brigading may be because the post made the front page.

Some people actively prefer to be in an echo chamber, it reduces cognitive dissonance.

I consider t_d to be the cognitive dissonance event horizon.

Mmm tasty librul cucktears.

*sees safe space *

RRRRRRREEEEEEEEEEE

You're delusional if you think t_d is the problem.. and also believe the rest of Reddit is the beacon of truth and honest discussion.

Roll one up and calm down.. nobody is taking your weed away, good lord...

Because I said anything about pot or trump... Right?

Oh. Wait. I didn't.

Just hijacking your comment mate. I wasn't disagreeing with you.. just wanted people to see that they are totally freaking out over a comment Spicer made, who clearly doesn't know what he's talking about.

He's the voice of the white house to the press. If he misspoke, he should correct himself. Otherwise, I'm going to take what he said at face value.

It's the first time weed has came up since the campaign. Trump would be an absolute fool to all of a sudden start criminalizing states that have already passed it through vote. He already said it was a states issue and 70% of America agree. I don't see him committing political suicide on an issue he already supported..

Congress may have the necessary motivation now to pass through law and decriminalize it. Then you all can thank the scary Trump monster..

being two faced about what actually falls under state rights is like...a move straight from republican play book

And illegal immigration/ sanctuary cities from the Democratic Party.. government is fcked

Remember when he was an LGBT ally too? But there goes some transgender protections that were totally safe.

He appointed Jeff Sessions. If you think he intends to be kind to legal weed you're not paying attention.

And Trump is a fool - how many times must he prove it to us?

If congress decriminalizes marijuana than Sessions will have no problem following the law.. I know it's weird for people to have an Attorney General that actually follows the law. I'm sure we'll get used to it tho..

hooray for baseless claims.

see Hillary Clinton.. lol

I'm not a democrat, didn't vote Hillary - but I live somewhere that it was irrelevant (which is a problem in itself, I think state votes should be split like NE/ME, not winner-take-all). I'm so sick of Trump supporters still bringing up Hillary. He's president now, it's time to stop trumpeting the electoral victory and start leading the country, which he has done very little of in his first month. He has signed a bunch of EO's for theatrics and ultimately just repealed some environmental and consumer protection laws (nice?). I'm waiting for him to do ANYthing that does GOOD.. for people who aren't coal executives or predatory financial brokers.

Trump supporters ALL seem to have this internal ability to translate his intentions. Which is wrong, and dangerous as fuck - especially since they deny his actions. The man is an idiot and idiots around the world are listening to him and reaching into their guts to pull out this deeper meaning. Nobody knows what the man intends to do with things like legal weed because we have no accountability of the guy. He lies and changes his position on a whim, he's petulant and reactive.. his own staff can't even get on the same page for the press. His supporters either don't care or stay unaware in their safe spaces, making nonsensical claims - usually rife with hypocrisy and double-standard. Not willing to get into a true fact based debate - it always spirals into this emotional (and usually xenophobic) argument. But whatever, anybody who claims to be a republican at this point is firmly party over country - that has been their whole platform since the TEA party reared its ugly head, it's been a disgraceful show.

What has Trump done?

And yes, I master in translating Trump tweets and scary rhetoric so let me know if you feel too afraid. It seems like you don't understand what is happening in the world..

And yes, I master in translating Trump tweets and scary rhetoric so let me know if you feel too afraid. It seems like you don't understand what is happening in the world.. illegal weed should be the least of your worries it keep living in fantasy land if you want. It's a free country.

Moron.

Is that a RRRRRRREEEEEEEE that comes shortly before smashing somebody under a bulldozer and punching it until it explodes?

You're right, but wouldn't even the least bit of self-awareness cause issues? I'm really curious about how it continues. The event horizon analogy was fantastic, by the way.

So, there are different ways people can confront cognitive dissonance. The straightforward way is to accept that your worldview is incorrect, and alter it to match the new information. For people who cant seem to do that, they can employ ego defenses such as rationalization, denial or projection to offset their dissonance. T_d is like a beautiful museum of ego defenses, you can see the whole array of them on display whenevet Trump does something extremely difficult to defend. When the level of dissonance gets really overwhelming, they will collectively pretend that the bad news of the day (that is plastered accross the front page of every newspaper and news website) simply never happened. Like I said, its beautiful in a perplexing way, like some kind of fantastical outsider art.

The straightforward way is to accept that your worldview is incorrect, and alter it to match the new information. For people who cant seem to do that, they can employ ego defenses such as rationalization, denial or projection to offset their dissonance.

That requires your worldview to have been incorrect in the first place. To judge whether people are actually experiencing that you'd need to full understand their world view.

Ego defenses would also only be necessary if the change to world view needed was so dramatic that they'd prefer to not accept it. I have yet to see any combination of actions by Trump severe enough to justify that myself; other people may be different.

You also need to take into account the social forces in play, ingroups are always fortified when they are under threat. This changes the cost - benefit ratio a lot.

People can, and do, live with cognitive dissonance on a daily basis. If they didn't then every persons believes and world view would have to be a perfect match for society.

T_d is like a beautiful museum of ego defenses, you can see the whole array of them on display whenevet Trump does something extremely difficult to defend. When the level of dissonance gets really overwhelming, they will collectively pretend that the bad news of the day

That's based on the assumption that people in t_D never leave t_D. So you can't really assume that just because it's not on t_Ds front page that people there are ignoring it. You could say exactly the same thing of places like r/politics - when something bad happens its never there.

Ego defenses would also only be necessary if the change to world view needed was so dramatic that they'd prefer to not accept it. I have yet to see any combination of actions by Trump severe enough to justify that myself; other people may be different.

The dissonance becomes unavoidable when an event happens that makes Trump look bad whether one accepts it as fact or denies it. An example of this is when Trump's own scotus nominee Gorsuch harshly criticized Trump's handling of the immigration executive order. To accept Gorsuch's criticism is to infer that Trump made a bad mistake with his executive order. To declare that Gorsuch is a hack is to infer that Trump's claim of having impeccable judgement is false. It's a lose-lose situation for people who consider Trump to be infallible, and just as I expected, I found zero mentions of Gorsuch on that day or the day after that story came out on r/the_donald, even though he was their hero up until that point. The denial ego defense was in full effect.

That's based on the assumption that people in t_D never leave t_D.

I saw a post on t_D where subscribers were discussing their disbelief that much of reddit distrust Trump, and someone said they were unsubscribing r/pics because they saw a post critical of Trump. That's the kind of thing i'm talking about, if they don't like it, they turn on the blinders, i.e. protecting the ego.

You're right, but wouldn't even the least bit of self-awareness cause issues?

Cognitive dissonance is overrated to start with. It does describe accurately and experience you could have in a given situation but the idea that its explains everything is laughable.

OP seems to be operating on the assumption that everything happening with Trump is inherently contradictory to what people expected. What is actually happening is that OP is taking his own perspective on the current state of affairs and wondering why t_D isn't collapsing from dissonance. You can't really generalise like that.

You first need to understand what the individuals in question actually believe before you can determine if their beliefs are directly contradictory.

I supported Trump for several reason, none of which have yet been undermined by actions Trump has taken. Why would I experience cognitive dissonance about that?

Then there's the question of whether cognitive dissonance is even worth discussing in this case. People hold contradictory beliefs all the time, it's not unusual it's actually probably the norm. Often the actions of an individual don't match what they believe so how does everyone survive.

A more appropriate thing to consider would be cost - benefit analysis. Especially in this situation where both sides are so hostile to each other.

That's true to an extent, but have you had good experiences in making "voice of reason" comments on worldnews or politics? Anything less that pure vitriol gets downvoted to oblivion most places..

Every other sub on reddit manages to allow dissent. If the T_D community is so toxic that not even creating a new sub with different rules would solve the problem then there is a much bigger problem with that sub than censorship

then there is a much bigger problem with that sub than censorship

I mean ya no shit.

its not censorship when they lay out the groundrules in the side bar. mods are not censoring, its a pro-trump subreddit and it says so in the rules. there are hundreds of anti-trump subreddits. pretty much every single one.

No I don't give half a shit about the censorship. I don't go to the sub, and as a mod I understand the necessity of curating content anyway.

What I give a shit about is that the userbase is so toxic GLaDOS could use it to kill research subjects.

What I give a shit about is that the userbase is so toxic GLaDOS could use it to kill research subjects.

As t_d lamers would say: kek.

well if all you give a shit about is a fictional hypothetical then maybe you should focus your energy elsewhere. The_Donald is not toxic, it is just pro-trump. why is that toxic? so many truths have been revealed there. nothing, imho, is more toxic than the democrat identity politics platform. it divides people into groups and makes them hate each other. donald trump is preaching "i dont care what color you are, how much money you have, what gender or sexual orientation you prefer: i just want to get us out of debt and remove corruption from government so we all have a better experience." how the fuck is that toxic? where in his policy or his actions has he expressed anything different than that?

Righhhhhhht. I'm sure the couple dozen people I banned yesterday for telling other users "kill yourself you cuck" that have a history almost exclusively in T_D are just figments of my imagination. Not toxic at all.

lol, i'd love to see what you said to elicit a response like that

If they were saying it to me, I wouldn't bother banning. I don't care what people say to me, it's my other users I care about.

which one of your 397 subs was it in? trumpgret? why isnt that a "toxic" sub?

lmao Trumpgret doesn't get nearly the traffic it'd need to ban that many people even if literally every comment there was uncivil. Nottheonion.

Also, it's not toxic because the users more or less stay there, and don't spread out over all of reddit.

meanwhile, its on record that The Left is hiring hourly, round the clock, to spread anti-trump propaganda with dozens of baseless, factless subs, and to brigade the_donald like crazy everytime some nugget of truth hits the feed. isnt that toxic? suppression and misleading? i feel like a bunch of pissed off trump supporters getting mad at being wrongly labeled nazis is more organic than it is toxic. if only the left knew how to argue with facts...

Hell yes, paid shills are toxic as FUCK. I was a sanders supporter, trust me I'm very sympathetic to that. They suppress reasonable discussion on and from both sides. I'm also not in favor of labeling people nazis and racists due to what can trivially be a simple lack of exposure to different viewpoints.

HOWEVER, that also doesn't mean that nazis and racists don't exist. That doesn't mean Jeff Sessions is acceptable.

Jeff Sessions is much more acceptable than loretta Lynch who refused to prosecute anything unless it benefitted the DNC politically. Sessions will judge Trump as fairly as anyone else presented to his department. he literally killed the KKK in alabama and stood hand in hand with john lewis and coretta king at a march in selma. the racist argument is nonsense. why is he unacceptable? i have yet to hear a valid argument as to why he is not the most fair and qualified person to become AG in 50 years.

I'm sorry, this is the Jeff Sessions that said the kkk was "OK until I found out they smoked pot"?

maybe it was in PresidentTrumpsTwitter? how come you need 22 mods for a sub with 70 readers? oh thats right, because youre paid by CTR. i get it now. keep spreading the hate, we are a movement of love and Jesus always wins. Always. your day will come.

how come you need 22 mods for a sub with 70 readers?

Because it's a mod circlejerk, duh. It's for laughs.

but isnt all of reddit a mod circlejerk? isnt that why you hate Trump so much, because he's putting power back into the hands of the people?

but isnt all of reddit a mod circlejerk?

Ya pretty much.

isnt that why you hate Trump so much, because he's putting power back into the hands of the people?

If by "the people" you mean "billionaires" and by "putting power" you mean "selling power", then yes that's part of it!

youre nuts. hes cutting taxes for the middle class and jacking it up for rich people. eliminating taxes if you make less than $25,000. hes returning wasteful federal regulation issues to the people by deregulating and shrinking the federal governement. the defecit has decreased $12bn in his first month, compared to a $200bn gain in Obama's first month. the people in his cabinet are not corrupt and he has forced them all to sign a 5 year anti-lobbying agreement, which also places a lifetime ban on lobbying for foreign countries. what exactly has he sold? other than the 20% of our uranium futures to russia. wait, oh yeah that was hillary. i forgot. she walked away with $150m. funny how her foundation closed less than a week after election day. if it was so charitable and beneficial you'd think her supporters would be flooding it with donations.

In the first month of a presidency, the president has not had time to effect meaningful change on the defecit. The defecit right now is still following the trend created over the last 8 years by Obama. Same for the first month of Obama's presidency, following the trend set by Bush.

I am not defending Hillary. She's not as bad as trump, but she is by no means good.

A movement of love? If you agree with us

They're lingo is fucking annoying. "REEEEE," "CUCK." Its the stupidest shit I've seen.

It's totally anemic to any kind of conversation, ya.

Yeah right definitely not toxic, that's why half of reddit has it filtered and the other half downvotes their BS that hits the frontpage (hint: these people aren't Hillary shills)

lol, reddit is owned by the sponsors. you have no idea what the real numbers are.

Its toxic in the sense that it is a test ground for controlling mass supporters. That sub is being run by people and being watched by people who are thinking we can operate in this manner in real life.

You can already see it. The administration banning dissenting news organizations.veryone that disagrees with them fake news thus the followers become to conditioned to only believe certain sources or Trump only.

That sub is way more than a sub it really is a the administrations frankenstein.

lol, reddit is exactly what youre describing, but on a much bigger scale. banning dissenting news orgs? i thought the NYT and CNN purported to be unbiased? why would they be dissenting if they are unbiased? nobody is preventing them from writing whatever they want. they are only called fake when they misrepresent with a dishonest headline or just flat out lie, which they do all the time. the first amendment guarantees nobody can be arrested for speaking their mind. it does not guarantee that people have to listen to your bullshit, especially if it is dangerously dishonest.

TD does and is doing exactly what the left does just only with a pro Trump twist. It isnt organic and it is manipulated by a power structure.

Lol, bigger power structure than the Washington establishment? I don't think so. Trump held rallies everywhere. People woke up

bigger no. new yes.

you dont unseat the establishment power structure over night

new - no, its called democracy

TD is the true definition of fascism

Lol, you're a really progressive thinker huh

Im a Trump supporter bro. Although it gets harder and harder everyday.

If you can not see TD is Fascism Im not sure what to tell you. That sub fits the definition and actions of a fascism to a fucking tee

What dictionary? What is the definition of fascism that you're applying to this semi anonymous online forum?

instead of trying to push that garbage conspiracy theory bullshit about The_Donald being a "test ground" for the admins of reddit (who i guess secretly love Trump?), focus on REAL conspiracy taking place, like this: http://imgur.com/a/gQBUI

TD is being gamed the same way that reddit is being gamed by the left. If you cant see it then im not sure what to tell ya.

The wall is going to add more debt. The government is going to be as corrupt as it is or even more. The Muslim ban was on countries that haven't caused recent terrorist attacks in the US. Coincidentally, the countries he didn't banned were countries who HAVE caused terrorist attacks in the US and COINCIDENTALLY are countries that Trump has business ties with.

Trump is such toxic, immoral, and a liar. He manipulated so many to vote for him by using fear and intimidation towards others. He demeaned women, he generalized muslims, and to him, the only "illegal immigrants" are Mexicans who "rape and kill."

Trump is filled with so much bullshit.

People like him because he speaks his mind, but guess what, half of the shit he wants to enforce would be illegal under our constitution. Making trump our president was clearly a step back instead of a step forward. What a fucking shame.

illegal immigrants cost over $120bn to the country in welfare every year. the wall will cost $20bn. removing the non-team players will cost like $1bn. its a net win. get over yourself. trump has already reduced the debt by $12bn in 35 days so the wall is half paid0for. you're throwing around ad hominems with ZERO statistics or reports or claims. your argument is based in opinion, which means its not really an argument ar all. How does the Saudi Arabian government, who gave hillary clinton $150m dollars to win, treat women? how do they handle illegal immigrants who wish to make them adapt to ther beliefs? they kill them. with stones. or cages that they throw in the water. Trump is the anti-sharia. sharia is the enemy, it is not welcome here. he has done more for women than any executive in his field. maybe if the general muslim population was more proactive in the fight against jihad and domestic terror, they wouldnt be generalized into the caterogy of "accessory." their silence is bringing the generalization on themselves. trump got elected because most of the country agree with what he was saying. i havent heard any bullshit from him tho, just this http://www.track-trump.com and i am holding him to his promises made. he is through about 40% of them, and it is less than day 40 of 100, so he is ahead of schedule. his platform is open and transparent, it prioritizes veterans and the middle class over immigrants and criminals. if he fails on it we will call him out. if he has actually committed any kind of illegal breach, he would have been destroyed already. you need to stop being such a worry wort, go out an do your job and make money, add to the GDP, and enjoy life. trump is the most qualified president to have ever run in our lifetimes. everything is going to be ok.

I would agree with your statements regarding money if there was really no conflict of interest. The president of the United States who owns several businesses will only run this country as a business for his own gain because his businesses are some of the worst that this country has seen. He is an individual that claims so many riches but can't even pay taxes.

Something that I hate when arguing about trump is how the other person will always bring up Barack Obama or Hillary Clinton. Who even brought them up into the statement? No one. Can you please tell me something that trump has done for women besides belittling them?

You CAN NOT say his administration is transparent when he just banned several news outlets from his briefings.

"Trump is the most qualified," is a statement that you should keep to yourself because quite honestly, half of the world knows he's not.

What did he do to lower it by 12b?

Because that's all bullshit? Actions speak louder than words and all that's come out of Lord Orange is lies.

Which userbase? R/politics.. R/EnoughTrumpSpam.. R/vids.. R/worldnews.. half of Reddits' Leftist propaganda?

Nooo.. fck t_d and the only place Reddit allows for them.

Lots of people are blind on Reddit, including this post. But fck those nasty Trump supporters lol

Roll one up and calm down. Nobody is taking away your weed for goodness sake

I'm outa weed atm ;_;

Yes, I view /r/politics as fairly toxic, ETS as annoying as all hell, and /r/worldnews is a different beast altogether. But all the subs you mentioned combined can't touch T_D's toxicity.

Also, they're sure as hell tryin, but that's literally the smallest complaint I have with the Trump administration.

Just wait for action. Getting tired of people freaking out over scary rhetoric and leftist narratives..

It's the Trump administration's rhetoric though...

Nobody should care is my point.. Wait for actions, not words. The same administration who said they'd lock Hillary Clinton up..

It's far more difficult to undo an action than it is to prevent it. You get the largest effect for effort by being preemptive rather than reactive.

Get congress to decriminalize it then. Sessions said he was going to follow the law.. a rare phenomenon for Attorney General I guess. People are so used to getting away with anything that it's culture shock once the laws on the books start becoming enforced.

Getting a republican congress to decriminalize weed, that's a good one. I'd have a better chance of setting up a colony on mars.

Nearly every Democrat would vote for it in spite.. and you'd only need a handful of Republicans to get it through. If it were to ever happen.. this is the time

I honestly don't think that's the case. But even if it were, republican congressmen right now are a hivemind. Voting in absolute lockstep.

Nahh.. both parties of pretty fcked at the moment. Republicans have to stick together if they want their cabinet to go through in a timely matter.. Democrats are running obstructionism to slow everything down.

Nahh.. both parties of pretty fcked at the moment. Republicans have to stick together if they want their cabinet to go through in a timely matter.. Democrats are running obstructionism to slow everything down.

Their cabinet is awful though. They range from just incompetent to actively malicious. The only exceptions I can think of are Mattis and... McMasters I think it was.

You never know. They might surprise ya.. People wanted change 8+ years ago and in this last election. So now you've got it.. let's see where things shake out without killing and crying over each other

Justifying the current administration with "But change" is like justifying burning to the ground every tree on the planet with the justification that wildfire is good for forest. Sure occasional fires improve the health of forests, in fact they're necessary for continued survival, but if there's nothing left to regrow at the end you're entirely fucked.

Nice analogy. What would make more sense is to.. start cutting more trees down in forest fire territory and using the wood to benefit the US economy and infrastructure building.. glass half full

The US is in serious economic and social trouble. To go down the same road is fcking stupid.. and I'm sure mistakes will be made. Atleast you'll know about it and won't be hidden behind the Leftist media and CIA, or whichever of the 17 intelligence agencies that are doing god's work for all of us. Waking up is a bytch.. I get it, but we're long overdue.

The US economy has been steadily improving for the last 8 years. DOW hit an all-time high, unemployment went from ~10% to ~4%, the housing market has been recovering, etc. To keep going down that road would have been the smart choice. Are there areas of the US that haven't seen a lot of that improvement? Absolutely. Some parts of middle america are hurting bad. But coal jobs will never come back. Automation has already made most factory jobs obsolete, and outsourcing low-skill labor is far, far cheaper than our labor will ever realistically be barring a new great depression. We need to reach out and retrain and help people in those areas, not feed them lies and false promises.

And off topic, but cutting down trees in forest fire territory actually doesn't make sense. The forest need the fertile ashes, and the undergrowth needs to be burned away so new growth can thrive. That's why firefighters generally conduct controlled burns rather than simply cutting down growth.

Lol you rolled out the unemployment propaganda numbers I see.. Conveniently leaving out the people who gave up trying to find work because there no longer enough jobs since they all left for China and Mexico under Obama's watch. Unemployment is still around 10% and the jobs people have are part time as welfare and Medicaid skyrockets every year. Negative trade deficits with nearly every country.. middle America, you mean 90% of the land mass that doesn't live on the highly populated coast. Yea that's a big fcking problem.

Speaking of the DOW.. what does the stock market and business think of Trumps' plan?

Steadily improving= the first time in history economic annual growth hasn't reached 3% in the last 8 years. Doubles the debt to $20 trillion and borrows an insane amount of money that we'll never be able to pay off. All while fighting in endless culture wars around the world that will cost us a hell of a lot of money and lives.. Brilliant!

Let's do both. Cut and burn.. Change

Unemployment is still around 10%

It depends on how you measure it. Using the measure traditionally reported, unemployment is ~4%. Other measures measure it differently, obviously, but all measures have decreased by approximately the same amount. Source.

middle America, you mean 90% of the land mass that doesn't live on the highly populated coast. Yea that's a big fcking problem.

It absolutely is a big problem! But land mass doesn't hold jobs, people do.

Speaking of the DOW.. what does the stock market and business think of Trumps' plan?

Too early to say. The market's been all over the place since his inauguration. His administration is too unpredictable.

Steadily improving= the first time in history economic annual growth hasn't reached 3% in the last 8 years.

Steadily improving, yes.

Doubles the debt to $20 trillion and borrows an insane amount of money that we'll never be able to pay off.

From nearly 10% GDP deficit to 3.3% deficit

I'm in favor of change, I wanted Sanders. But we need a controlled burn, not an unrecoverable wildfire.

See Venezuela.. socialism is the end of America and contradictory to the American Dream but everyone loves free shyt! Why not slow down immigration and worry about the people already here that are struggling to find work, put food on the table, pay for mandated health insurance.. Fck off big governemnet, stay out of my life! You're driving everyone crazy...

See Denmark, Sweden. Democratic Socialism leads to two of the happiest countries in the world.

lol Sweden is so fcked.. along with the rest of the EU

It amazes me people don't see what's happening. Things have been too good for too long.. I don't know how it's all going to shake out but everyone's due for a wake up call to life. Bet on it.. prepare

Man what happened? We were having a solid, policy and facts debate. But the moment actual sources and numbers come out, you switched to T_D talking points :(

Sweden is in a good place right now. I have several friends over there. They're doing great. It's consistently ranked among the best places in the world to live.

What do you mean things have been "too good"? Life doesn't have to be pain! Life can be friends and family and good food and good music. It can be farming and guns and ranches and big trucks. That's the american dream. But to get there, we all need to contribute. We need to help the poorest among us so even more people can join those of us that have more than enough.

$20 trillion debt.. too many loans

Too many people to feed. Do the math.. it all doesn't add up

As a species, we produce more than enough food to feed everyone. It's a logistics and politics problem more than anything else.

Government debt is not the same as household debt. This is a fairly good post that explains the difference.

Exactly! It's not censorship if we change the definition of censorship ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Every other sub on reddit manages to allow dissent. /r/politics lul

Every other sub on reddit manages to allow dissent.

Not every one. GamerGhazi and other far-far-left subs don't allow dissent or questioning. It's one of the many things they and t_d have in common.

People who say horseshoe theory is bunk are missing that it does describes the Actions and rationalizations of far left and right as being similar, not the entirety of the philosophies. This is another example of it in action.

Every other sub on reddit manages to allow dissent.

Go to /r/GamerGhazi and simply disagree with anyone about anything.

There are many subs that do not allow dissent. Trying posting something even a tiny bit critical of feminism to one of the women subs or even /r/relationships and you'll be censored and possibly banned.

But that's fine as nobody ever claimed some of these subs were not echo chambers.

Back when t_d was gaining momentum, they specifically claimed it was not one of the only subs where free speech is allowed.

So if honest criticism is being censored, they've really gone downhill.

I've never tried visiting them and likely have a black mark because of my extensive post history in theredpill. No regrets.

^{Read this post at own risk and presume this has been modified by Reddit Inc}

Shit, even when it had 0 momentum, i got banned for suggesting that some trump supporters were bigots (some, not all, that was my point on that particular post). That sub straight up turned into a cult

There is no such thing as free speech on that sub. Then again, lots of left leaning subs do the same shit, however they dont pretend to be an open space for discussion

Right of dissent is fundamentally antithetical to a fascist system, and thus has no place on t_d...

Because, well, it's Trump!!

The_Donald only exists because it is subject to "mod rule".

I think the_Donald only exist because the political subs banned anyone who supported trump, to the point people made alt account/subs to support him.

Why were they banned, hmm? It wasn't just because they were trump supporters, was it?

Not it was not. All the Trump supporters that got banned from /r/politics conveniently forget to mention that they broke rules.

The most common one I saw was accusations of shilling/CTR.

On /r/politics, that is an insta-ban. Whether that's fair or not is a different convo, the point being that they violated the subs rules.

It's as though there was a concerted effort to get banned and then claim victim-hood, yes? I was banned from Politics as well... twice. I did my time and didn't whine like a little bitch about it.

But I'm not a precious Trump supporter, either.

Strange. You can see Trump supporters in most political subs, including anti Trump subs. I wonder if the Trump supporters who were banned did something egregiously wrong...

And most of them are on alt accounts because it's a bannable offence to support trump.

That's simply incorrect. This weed issue is absolute bullshit elevated by corrupt media outlets. It's a topic you care about so when a headline gets published that trashes Trump you jump on the train but it is just like the other articles full of lies and manipulation. Take a step back rewatch his answer to the question, Spicer says they'll follow the law and then refers to the DoJ in regards to how that law will pan out. You're being mislead by people who don't care about you and who want to leech of off you to gain more money and power for themselves.

Please stop taking these media outlets seriously, they are using headlines to generate ad revenue at the expense of your desire to know the truth. The Russia story, the weed story, the barring outlets story, and many more issues have been sensationalized not for the truth but for greed. They are stabbing you in the back by feeding you lies for clicks and throwing journalistic integrity to the wind.

Spicer says they'll follow the law

Yeah, the Federal laws, and then refer back to Sessions, who said he would "aggressively enforce federal laws" in regards to recreational marijuana states.

Think about that.

And then realize that it is YOU who is being mislead by the media and those you trust.

Trump certainly can come out alright if he just sticks to his most important campaign promises: bringing back jobs, punishing big corps that offshore and use visa workers, enforce immigration, pick judges who support the Constitution and sane gun rights, and generally ignore the screeches of the virtue-signalling SJW / ultra PC crowd that much of the country is tired off.

The minute he starts going after pot smokers, the majority of long-term illegal immigrants, transgender and gays, abortion rights - things that many of his non-republican supporters, like me, just don't worry about much, he's going to start getting criticized for the things he's now getting a free pass on such as stupid tweets, big ego, and a few awful cabinet nominees (e.g. 1st Dept of Labor choice).

I love that quote about reality being anti-trump. So true and sums up the mentality of pro-trumpers online. Those facts are fake news! Anti-trump! Oh wait he actually said that!? Oh well he didn't mean it like that!!

There's /r/debatetrumpsupporters.

With the amount pro Trump content and subs are censored on here, it's impossible to start any other sub and have it gain any traction. The_Donald just benefitted because it existed before Reddit realized how popular the candidate was, and got too big to completely shut down. New subs are just brigades, spammed, and consoled to the point nobody ever finds out about them.

We tried to create many alternatives but the people chose t_d

We tried to create many alternatives but the people chose t_d because of its momentum paid russian troll army

fixed that for you.

Wait do people unironically believe the Russian stuff?

To be fair, the russians do have a known internet brigade team or whatever. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Web_brigades#Background)

If you believe in CTR/Shareblue shilling, but don't beleive the other side does the same shit. Even if it isn't russian guys shilling, there are clearly shills for Trump is all. Just like there is the shareblue/whatever people.

Although you're right a good deal of them could just be people who are idiots going along with everything else they see and essentially "shilling" for free.

But do you not acknowledge any evidence of mucking around in our shit?

There is literally direct evidence available to the public of ShareBlue/etc. interacting on reddit. None for Russians. I go by evidence, that's all. Probably a hard concept for some to understand nowadays.

There is literally direct evidence available to the public of ShareBlue/CTR/etc. interacting on reddit. None for Russians.

Show me direct evidence of Shareblue/CTR though, I've never seen it.

You act like you go by evidence, but can you explain why the FBI is bothering to investigate russia then?

Investigations ≠ evidence. I'd say the same if they were investigationg Shareblue.

Also every time I have to explain all this I lose a little more faith in humanity since this is publicly available knowledge to those actually seeking the truth, but here we go again:

http://correctrecord.org/

Check out their website. They specifically have an "online taskforce" or whatever, that's specifically for "correcting the record" on Twitter, Facebook and Reddit.

TASK FORCE WILL HELP CLINTON SUPPORTERS PUSH BACK ON ONLINE HARASSMENT AND THANK SUPERDELEGATES

http://correctrecord.org/barrier-breakers-2016-a-project-of-correct-the-record/

The task force currently combats online political harassment, having already addressed more than 5,000 individuals who have personally attacked Secretary Clinton on Twitter. The task force will provide a presence and space online where Clinton supporters can organize and engage with one another and are able to obtain graphics, videos, gifs, and messaging to use in their own social spaces. Additionally, the Barrier Breakers 2016 task force hopes to embrace the creativity of Hillary Clinton’s supporters by sharing their efforts and content with other groups.

Here's a t_d user's findings of odd behavior that is pretty obviously shilling from an objective standpoint: https://www.reddit.com/r/The_Donald/comments/4vsyul/rpolitics_taken_over_by_paid_campaigners_andor/

Here's a leaked email that provides evidence for this kind of thing happening as well: https://wikileaks.org/dnc-emails/emailid/8351

Here's an article about it: http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2016/04/21/hillary-pac-spends-1-million-to-correct-commenters-on-reddit-and-facebook.html

Hope that helps.

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Investigations ≠ evidence. I'd say the same if they were investigationg Shareblue.

Also every time I have to explain all this I lose a little more faith in humanity since this is publicly available knowledge to those actually seeking the truth, but here we go again:

http://correctrecord.org/

Check out their website. They specifically have an "online taskforce" or whatever, that's specifically for "correcting the record" on Twitter, Facebook and Reddit.

TASK FORCE WILL HELP CLINTON SUPPORTERS PUSH BACK ON ONLINE HARASSMENT AND THANK SUPERDELEGATES

http://correctrecord.org/barrier-breakers-2016-a-project-of-correct-the-record/

The task force currently combats online political harassment, having already addressed more than 5,000 individuals who have personally attacked Secretary Clinton on Twitter. The task force will provide a presence and space online where Clinton supporters can organize and engage with one another and are able to obtain graphics, videos, gifs, and messaging to use in their own social spaces. Additionally, the Barrier Breakers 2016 task force hopes to embrace the creativity of Hillary Clinton’s supporters by sharing their efforts and content with other groups.

Here's a t_d user's findings of odd behavior that is pretty obviously shilling from an objective standpoint, although this obviously isn't evidence of ShareBlue or CTR doing it: https://np.reddit.com/r/The_Donald/comments/4vsyul/rpolitics_taken_over_by_paid_campaigners_andor/

Here's a leaked email that is pretty damning IMO: https://wikileaks.org/dnc-emails/emailid/8351

Here's an article about all this: http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2016/04/21/hillary-pac-spends-1-million-to-correct-commenters-on-reddit-and-facebook.html

Hope that helps. Keep in mind that CTR has been revived as ShareBlue along with some other shadow organizations that basically have paid users spending their time spreading propaganda against the political opponents of their bosses. It's why I don't take /r/all's political stuff seriously anymore, because reddit admins let it happen.

Also every time I have to explain all this I lose a little more faith in humanity since this is publicly available knowledge to those actually seeking the truth, but here we go again:

Ha, people are always going to ask for evidence though. At least you can actually back up what you say with something.

Investigations ≠ evidence. I'd say the same if they were investigationg Shareblue.

That's fair.

If you are interested, here is the rather (damning as well) technical break down of the DNC hack and why someo believe think russia was behind it. (https://www.crowdstrike.com/blog/bears-midst-intrusion-democratic-national-committee/)

SeaDuke information: https://attack.mitre.org/wiki/Software/S0053

However, security people aren't 100% on it, mostly because a lot of the releases from the USGov on it were funny:

The DHS list is none of these things, as Lee, founder of the cyber security firm Dragos, discovered when he ran the list against a stored cache of known clean traffic his company keeps around for testing. The results stunned him. “We had thousands of hits,” he says. “We had an extraordinary high amount of false positives on this dataset… Six of them were Yahoo e-mail servers.”

Obviously nothing is perfect though. As it stands nothing is 100%.

Hey, I just created one, it's called /r/ourpresidenttrump. I plan to keep the hive mind of The_Donald out. I am actually a Democrat but I am a huge fan of free speech and will not censor things that are not breaking site wide rules.

Why not create a mixture of the policies of KiA and the message of t_d. I know i would join in a heartbeat. T_d is getting a little too echo chambery for me anymore. We voted him in now we need to hold his feet to the fire, he works for us.

Why not create a mixture of the policies of KiA

KiA people are the problem with a lot of Trump supporters. I swear to god gamergate fucked a bunch of peoples perception of the media up because they grew up trusting retarded "gaming journalists" who were nothing more than internet fanboys who wanted to get free shit.

I've had more than one person tell me that gg exposed them to the "corruption of the media"

They are corrupted, yes, but not in the 100% fiction fakenews pushing way people want to believe now.

The problem here is that any neutral subreddit will be 95% critical of Trump, because 95% of what he does is horrible. So you'll just think that it's controlled by the Illuminati to oppose Trump.

Because it wouldn't grow on reddit. There is no way to get the original subs growth, especially with all the conspiracy and vitriol floating around.

There is a few. There's the MrDonald one and the ask trump supporter ones

Then why isn't another pro-Trump or at least Trump-neutral sub created where people can objectively criticize

Reddit is way more orchestrated than you realize. Mods and power users spend all day on reddit and as soon as they see a sub like that popping up, they can hijack it.

You see the videos about shills on reddit recently and think that there arent both left and right? There is a reason you rarely hear such polar conversation in real life. Not everyone is so crazy and thinks in such absolutes.

There is influence and power in controlling the conversation and its been proven time and time again that it can be pretty easily done. As long as they can hijack a sub before it gets very popular by either astroturfing it, downvoting all the posts, or getting their own users into mod positions, its not going to get enough traction to become what it was intended to before it is corrupted.

r/Neutralpolitics

please please please can it be le_Donald?

Because they are actual paid shills on reddit, that much is not a conspiracy. t_d has to be the way it is to balance that out and a neutral place would be a war zone.

/r/AskTrumpSupporters is a pretty solid subreddit. I've not been there in a bit, but there was a ton of great discussion and the moderation was pretty solid.

There is askatrumpsupporter. So far this is all talk. I would be disappoonted to see.him take any actual action as well as surprised.

"Trump-neutral" I like that term.

Ask Trump Supporters was supposed to be the discussion sub.

Apparently they cracked down on what sort of things you're allowed to ask though.

/r/AskTrumpSupporters is like that. Sometimes they question what Trump does.

Wow. This makes sense. I'd love that sub.

In an ideal world there'd be a sub with both negative and positive opinions on him. Right now, you either delete all criticism or drown in shills. They chose the censorship option so as to at least have one place you can see support for him.

/r/AskTrumpSupporters

/r/AskTrumpSupporters ?

That sub should be r/ politics. But it's not, it's corrupt

I've been enjoying /r/asktrumpsupporters lately but i don't know if there's any mod drama there or not yet.

Every time I see an article on the first few Reddit front pages on Trump ALL I see is negative comments on Trump. THIS is why they are kicking people out, plain and simple. And I don't blame them. It's hard to even get any kind of conversation going on Trump b/c of this. It's censoring his supporters who want to debate issues and the sad part is I would like to have discussions with people about Trump but when people can't even see you're there unless they filter through all the comments then there's no point.

All conservative and Republican subs are very ban heavy and they control their narrative very carefully. You'll notice on most days in conservative and Republican subs, that the mods make up a bulk of the front page submissions; often half or more of the front page. These are subs with tens of thousands of users and yet consistently mod posts will be on top of the heap.

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There's "asktrumpsupporters" real easy to get banned here as well though..

you know whats up.

Post history checks out. I'm glad you saw the light. Same shit happened to me when submitting a post on weed legalization.

I always knew the mods of t_d were pieces of shits. Under jcm however, the mods were kept under control. He was ousted due to his own stupidity but he kept a leash on mods abusing their power.

However, before the campaign, I played along because making Trump win was more important. Now, holding him accountable is more important.

More importanter*

importanterst'velyiest

Has Trump's hypocrisy or the fact that information on t_d was so heavily filtered of dissent changed your view on any previously held beliefs? Particularly in regard to media criticism of Trump?

Mods in all the popular subs have cracked down in a sometimes unreasonable way. I'm currently enjoying a week ban from politics for telling someone they seemed "sheltered".

Mods are the worst part about reddit.

I'm banned from /r/worldnews for life. Reason? "Wow slow down friend" because I went through the new comments on a thread and tried to explain to everyone who didn't read the article and was confused what a certain policy was. I was just trying to inform people but they rather keep the people ignorant I guess.

I got banned from /r/politics for being mean to someone and calling them a shill for three days but I guess I deserved it. I'm super anti-Trump btw.

I've had multiple posts deleted from /r/conspiracy for being anti-Trump, including one that reached /r/all #20 and then the mods deleted it because they were scared. Honestly worldnews etc subreddits are really uptight but this sub is the worst when it comes to censorship, almost on par with the_donald. I've never been banned or had my post deleted for my OPINION from any subreddit, except for this one, the_donald, offmychest (because I post on KiA) and ShitRedditSays. So I hate it when people try to lump in news/politics/worldnews with places like SRS and t_d.

I'm a gay socialist feminist atheist who respects gun rights and doesn't think Christian bakers should have to do fucking anything they don't want to. There's basically nowhere for me to be honest these days.

It's almost like people who worship an authoritarian tend to be authoritarian themselves...

Like I said, a lot of people on T_D don't accept what the mods are doing.

They 100% accept what the mods are doing because they continue to post there. They simply don't like it.

Maybe. I complained and got banned. Not going back.

It's possible a lot of them simply don't know or care. /The_Donald feels very much as if it's mean to project the idea that Trump is right and that no one outside of there believes he can do wrong. Everything there is always spun to be a positive for Trump, regardless of what it is. I really wouldn't be surprised if the sub was intentionally set up to make Trump look good and as popular as possible.

Well it's definitely curated. It was tolerated during the election but it's gone so crazy by this point.

Nah, I personally talked to /u/ind4trump via PM after he was banned. Even referenced him 2 days ago in a post on T_D. Was threatened to be banned by 2 differnet mods for "concern trolling". I didn't/still don't support him being banned for making an observation. Being that T_D is the only place on reddit that will support T_D, it's nice to post in your safe space from time to time.

I thought the Donald hated safe spaces and found them to be shielding people from reality? Oh wait. For what it's worth, safe spaces and hug boxes for anything resembling intelligent discourse is bullshit. Is the majority of Reddit unfriendly to the opinions of donald trump and his supporters? Yeah absolutely, it's part of an ongoing polarization among mods and subs that's essentially become cancer. This having been said, donald trump supporters don't exactly make it easier on anyone.

I don't always post in T_D and I don't always agree with them, but there are times where I just like to shitpost and circlejerk. Do I always agree with what the mods do? Nope. But I'm not a mod.

See this is what people don't understand about dictators. They don't have universal support, in fact most are disliked. People just don't want to do anything about it. It's not even just dictators, almost every voting system has flaws yet rarely is there an effort to fix it. If you don't like something but continue to participate in it then you are propping up its support.

It's like disagreeing with a company. It not boycotting it.

r/the_donald_too

And Trump bans reporters. As above so below.

So did Obama, nice shitpost though... /s

Link proof.

He's being sarcastic, hence the /s.

He did it to Fox News. Just do a search. It ain't rocket science.

No he didn't.

The Treasury department did not include Fox news on a list of people to interview Feinberg. Fox news said they were being banned.

The White House immediately apologized and let them interview him.

Later on, it turns out they were excluded because they never requested the interview with Feinberg.

http://skeptics.stackexchange.com/questions/37385/did-the-obama-administration-ever-attempt-to-ban-fox-news-from-the-press-pool

Found the real story after two minutes of searching. Nice try, bub.

sad.

Trump Supporter, but not blind supporter and will always question and call out the b.s. That is just wrong.

This is exactly how their president is running the country as well.

I'm sick and tired of this bullshit about private prisons. They house 6% of prisoners. SIX PERCENT! The vast majority of prisoners are in public prisons. If you really did want to make more profits for the private prison companies, privatizing existing facilities would be a FUCK TON more effective than expanding the pool of prisoners. There are plenty of prisoners here already that you could just relocate to private facilities. Why not do that?

Private prisons make a few billion dollars a year. They're a tiny industry. The entire private prison industry is probably 1/20 the size of Lockheed Martin, a single military contractor. They simply don't have the size to muster significant political influence. The private prison industry is probably 0.02% of our GDP.

Far more significant are the contractors who build and supply public prisons and use public prison labor. The Trump administration has already taken steps to fight these interests and the perverse incentives they create, by abolishing no-bid contracts, using smaller local contractors rather than national monopolies for federal prisons, ensuring transparency in the contract process, and cutting down on private use of prison labor.

GEO Group, one of the nation’s largest for-profit prison operators, donated $250,000 to support Trump’s inaugural festivities, Pablo Paez, the company’s vice president of corporate relations, told USA TODAY.

That’s on top of the $225,000 that a company subsidiary donated to a super PAC that spent some $22 million to help elect the real-estate magnate. Another prison operator, CoreCivic, gave $250,000 to support Trump’s inauguration, recently filed congressional reports show.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2017/02/23/private-prisons-back-trump-and-could-see-big-payoffs-new-policies/98300394/

Trump's campaign cost hundreds of millions, 250,000 is nothing.

No kidding you fucking idiot. It should have been obvious to qnyone over the age of 5 from the start.

Downvote away, but you're an asshole.

Calm down, dear. Take a deep breath.

Time for your meds.

He said in r/conspiracy

t_d as in the same people who praise themselves on "not being an echo chamber"? HA, what a joke.

It is the worst echo chamber on reddit.

It is an echo chamber. They don't even try to hide it. It's in the rules!

"We are a circle jerk. We love to suck each other's dicks. Then we proceed to shriek at the rest of reddit" - T_D rules.

You clearly don't remember our conversation 2 days ago where I defended what you were claiming.

Eh. It's a mirror image of /r/politics. Both are full of "my team or nothing" morons.

Which happened first? Action.. reaction

You won't be banned for going against the grain in /r/politics. Dissent is actually allowed and that's a huge difference. I really don't understand this false equivalence.

You will be downvoted to oblivion.

Not the same as banning

That's not on the mods though, that's reddit users

Same result though. Massively downvoted posts in popular threads are as good as removed.

I expand downvoted comments all the time.

/r/politics at least feels like it's mostly people who can tie their own shoes posting.

All t_d is copy/pasted memes and propaganda. I've had many conversations with reasonable conservatives and even trump supporters there.

The problem is most trump supporters just want to deny anything bad all the time, continue to point to hillary/obama (seriously, when will they get over that and accept that tehy can't blame someone who didn't even get elected) and deny that anything anti-donnie is posted by "very fakenews"

You can tell when you're dealing with a brainwashed Trump supporter really fast.

No, that would be /r/politics. The_Donald isn't far behind though.

"We're the best echo chamber on Reddit, no the world! We'll echo chamber so hard that everyone will be sick of echo chambering when I'm done, we're the best"

For people who want to ask questions about the Trump administration you can visit. r/AskTrump

you're a sucker who got what he deserved.

just consider what happened to you on t_d as a preview of what's going to happen to you under trump

No. I still support Trump. I don't support him regardless of his faults - something I did before the election because in an election you gotta win. After winning, you hold the government accountable.

Same with T_D. I have complained numerous times, got banned, came back and fought for Trump. Not because I liked the mods but because Trump's victory was more important. Now that Trump has won, holding his feet to the fire is more important. It makes no sense to support the mod's censorship now.

I am fairly consistent in my reasoning.

As for suckers, liberals are the biggest suckers IMO. At least Trump is keeping his promises.

At least Trump is keeping his promises

You can do that with executive orders, but not with the support of most Americans. Unless everyone in the United States jumps up and says "I love dictatorships!" it will ultimately backfire. Trump is rolling back whatever hard earned protections for Americans he can, it'll be just easy to roll them back when he leaves office... with executive orders

because in an election you gotta win.

Just curious, but we're you a Trump supporter in the early primaries? I ask, because it frankly seems like most of the things he's deserving to be criticized on were always there.

Not attacking, the election is fucking over, just curious.

Just curious, but we're you a Trump supporter in the early primaries? I ask, because it frankly seems like most of the things he's deserving to be criticized on were always there.

Supported him from day 1. Was fan of apprentice.

You....you supported him because you like his tv show?

I like people like Trump. Contrarians who do rather than talk.

Ugh. I'm not gonna lie, I think that's a pretty stupid reason, but to each their own. It's not like that isn't a pretty common statement from his supporters, and that is how most of the world knew of him before the past 2 years.

I should have phrased my sentence better. I like the apprentice because I like Trump. I like the fact that he is willing to take on everybody to win and does things rather than talk about doing things.

What do you think about his accountability?

What do you mean? I do think he holds people responsible and accountable. You will see it in the future. Problem is media thinks firing is a bad thing. Anyone who has run a private enterprise knows that firing is the most important part of human resources.

Haha no, sorry, I should have been clearer. I'm talking about his personal accountability. I can't think of a time where he admitted he was wrong or even that it was a possibility. I find that troubling because it means I can't trust him to be honest about himself. His press conference last week is a great example of him lying to the American people and I just can't rectify that with a good leader.

But I don't mean to go on a diatribe because Im more interested to hear what you have to say about it.

Yes, that is a bad part about him.

So, without putting words in your mouth, you see it as a problem but it doesn't concern you too much?

Do I want Trump to be more of a statesman? Yes.

Will he be one? Doubt it.

Does it concern me? Yes.

Is it enough for me to stop supporting him? No.

What would a hypothetical tipping point be for you to stop supporting him?

Debt and deficits. If he can't bring those two things under control, he will have lost my support. My hope is that he reduces debt held by the US by at least 40% after his first term ends and gets a balanced budget at least once.

That'd be seriously impressive considering 40% of our current debt is north of 7 trillion dollars and the US government only collects around 4.6 trillion dollars in a year, federal and state. I think you'd probably have to cut military, Medicare, and social security expenditures in half to accommodate that amount of debt paid off in one term.

Well, anyway, thank you for being patient with me and answering some of my questions, I appreciate it.

Can I ask you a question? And do not take this as an attack. I am really curious. I watched for years people complaining about Obama playing golf and the cost of his trips to Hawaii. Even Trump was tweeting about it. How do Trump supporters ignore or justify his trips to Mar a lago and the insane costs to secure Trump tower? It frustrates me. Maybe if I can at least understand their reasoning, I will feel a bit better.

Are you basing it off the Washington Post report? Few thing to keep in mind -

A. It is an estimate by WaPo. Not hard data.

B. WaPo, in its estimate, includes expenses for protecting every Trump family member. It's not Trump's fault that his family has received threats.

C. Trump apparently and correct me if I am wrong on this, paid for Abe's trip to Mar-a-lago. Something WaPo didn't consider.

So the fact that more money has gone into Trump's trips is not only misleading(as he has a bigger family than Obama) but also not based on hard fact.

If it does come out, based on hard data, that Trump(&not his family) cost tax payers money for travelling while NOT working, then yeah, I wouldn't like it. But if he does diplomacy, like he did with Abe, during these travels, there is no problem. The gripe with Obama was that a lot of the money was spent on his vacations. If a lot of tax payer money is spent on Donald Trump's vacations, sure I would be pissed.

That's what they don't get. His economic policies are going to fuck those over who "memed him into office"

And then they came for me..

Why not start r/the_donald_uncensored?

And soon that will be our country, thanks for that.

And soon that will be our country, thanks for that.

No.

RemindMe! One year

Remind you of what? Both clauses are facts.

Trump verbally attacking the press is neither new

Obama did and a lot of other presidents before him have done it.

nor is it against the 1st amendment.

Factually true.

Remind you of what? Both clauses are facts.

It's a bot that will pm me to look at this comment again in a year.

Obama did and a lot of other presidents before him have done it.

Obama had one incident where Fox was left out, either intentionally or unintentionally depending on who you ask. He never outright blocked organizations from a press briefing. To compare the two is hilariously disingenuous, just like most comparisons you people use.

Factually true.

You're arguing against things you've decided I've said in your mind. I never said it was? Nothing your mods are doing are against the rules either but it's still shitty and despotic.

Usage of the reminder bot implies you think I was making a prediction. False. I was stating facts. You can't disagree with facts.

Obama had one incident where Fox was left out

That doesn't matter. All I stated was that what Trump did was nothing new. President's have gone after the press. I never said Trump's attacks were more or less aggressive.

Also, you conveniently left out the point where I said verbally attacking the press is not against the 1st amendment. Convenient.

Usage of the reminder bot implies you think I was making a prediction. False. I was stating facts. You can't disagree with facts.

I made a prediction?....

That doesn't matter. All I stated was that what Trump did was nothing new. President's have gone after the press. I never said Trump's attacks were more or less aggressive.

Except it's not clear it was intentional which is the key point...

Also, you conveniently left out the point where I said verbally attacking the press is not against the 1st amendment. Convenient.

You're arguing against things you've decided I've said in your mind. I never said it was? [against the first amendment] Nothing your mods are doing are against the rules either but it's still shitty and despotic.

I know reading is hard but at least fucking try ffs

I will be messaging you on 2018-02-25 15:02:51 UTC to remind you of this link.

CLICK THIS LINK to send a PM to also be reminded and to reduce spam.

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I got news for ya-- DT LOVES the press.

Yes. Feeds off it.

That's pretty ironic.

A whole sub full of people loudly bemoaning Reddit censorship whilst aware their own community is being actively censored

Yes. They should call themselves the_irony.

It is not accurate to compare censorship on t_d with r/politics for example. T_D is specifically a forum for supporting a certain politician. Obviously they should be able to kick people out of the community who do not support him. If I start a club for people who love Star Wars, it's reasonable for me to kick people out who hate Star Wars and complain about it. However, if I start a club for debating about Star Wars, then it would be a dick move to kick out Star Wars haters. In a similar way, /r/politics is not supposed to have a political agenda and is supposed to be a neutral forum. I do not have a problem with r/hillaryclinton kicking out Trump supporters, nor r/the_donald kicking out Hillary supporters. My problem is with allegedly neutral subreddits that have been hijacked by a political agenda.

You need to be able to talk about the negative stuff he does. People can support a person and not support all of his policies.

Literally every other sub on Reddit. There is only one place where you can see a pro Trump message, cry me a river.

It is a pathetic circle jerk where people lie to each other.

You're like the ugly girl in high school bitching about the cheerleaders. ;)

The Donald is afraid of communicating with people. So yeah, very much like high school kids.

The_Donald is a reddit forum, it doesn't have feelings.

If you're referring to the members, well you're clearly full of shit, as one is communicating with you right now.

Aww, that's cute. You subscribe to a weak safe space where the mods protect you from the truth. Incredibly sad.

You want the truth?

You're salty as fuck, because you can't formulate a rational argument and people are waking up to the decades of bullshit that has been coming from the political establishment. The_Donald wouldn't exist if Trump supporters hadn't been silenced and banned from every other sub.

The left is in ruins, and it's thanks to people like you.

You could have tried to state your position, made some feeble attempt at formulating an argument, instead all you want to do is mock and insult.

Like a chirping cricket, all you contribute is noise.

Dude, trump does nothing but lie to you. When people point that out they get banned. It is pretty simple.

You want the truth?

I don't want you to change the subject like a triggered little internet diva.

Okay, hypocrite, I was only responding to unfair criticism. I guess you're the one who needs safe spaces.

https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/5umqfy/youre_being_gamed/ddvr9tv/

See you at the top of The_Donald!

I was banned. So when the president lies about something I cannot help you guys out and correct the president's error. If anyone does that they get banned. Enjoy the echo chamber of lies for people scared of the truth.

See you at the top of The_Donald

Oh god the cringe

You can still support someone and criticise their policies. I support Obama, but i acknowledge that he did a lot of stuff that i disagree with

Except here is your problem, when you start titling your posts "it be a shame if r/all" or "hey r/all..." you are inviting criticism. To censor it then is to claim that everyone agrees with you.

And r/Star Wars is fine if you don't love all the movies. Why can't t_d be okay with people not loving all of his policies. I was an obama supporter and didn't like drone strikes, was a little disappointed with how long it took for him to come around on gay marriage and a bunch of other things. Once he was elected there was no need to be a cheerleader it was time to make sure he kept his promises.

Except here is your problem, when you start titling your posts "it be a shame if r/all" or "hey r/all..." you are inviting criticism. To censor it then is to claim that everyone agrees with you.

I personally think these post should be banned.

And r/Star Wars is fine if you don't love all the movies. Why can't t_d be okay with people not loving all of his policies.

T_D is more like a grimy strip club, and you're a customer complaining about nudity, Asktrumpsupporters is the bar next to the strip club that normal people go to.

Once he was elected there was no need to be a cheerleader it was time to make sure he kept his promises.

I agree, on this occasion with the weed thing it'd be like complaining there were no tits at the strip club and the club kicking you out for conplaining, Trump said he'd leave it up to the state and even if he didn't he was elected with the idea that he'd have a business savvy mindset to it aswell, there is nothing business savvy or clever for the country about harsher weed enforcement.

I said this in a previous post, we Trump supporters pre-election bragged and boasted that we actually had the better weed candidate and everyone was stupid for worrying, should this go ahead and Trump not say or do anything, rub our faces in it loud and happily, because we sure as fuck would have done it to you for Hillary.

So basically you guys helped turn this site into a bigger shit pile than it already was, and we've all got to deal with it?

If this site is a shit pile, why are you using it?

Besides the few subs I frequent that weren't completely ruined by the 2016 election, I'm not entirely sure.

Imagine how Trump's cabinet/staff must feel.

They must feel pretty good. Trump has repeatedly stated he is fine with Cabinet members holding a different POV.

Lies. What about Betsy DeVos opposing Trump undoing the bathroom transgender protections? Or did you forget about that already.

What about Betsy DeVos opposing Trump undoing the bathroom transgender protections? Or did you forget about that already

What about it? Did Trump admonish Betsy?

You guys can discuss it in my sub r/HarryPotterRipOffs It was meant to be a joke in the form of Harry Potter titles. Like "George bush and the steel beams" But it never took off

its like r/pyonyang over there

China is looking for Kim Jong Un's replacements. The top mod on the_donald is top contender right now.

Do they actually support NK, not sure....

Just got banned from there for a very civil contradiction. Had a bitchen response, couldn't post it

Yes, it is a cesspool as are most political subs. T_D has become the worst.

If only they could see it.

same here. banned for asking questions then muted and ignored.

I had the same experience, but from the opposite side. This was my first (and last) post on t_d:

This sub is also very quick to ban people who voice dissenting opinions, so it should be surprising that there are so few comments compared to the number of downvotes.

Of course many t_d regulars responded to tell me how/why I was wrong, but ironically my post was remove by the mods and I was banned shortly thereafter, so I never got a chance to reply. Instead of just leaving it at that, I decided to PM several people who responded and ask if they could explain or justify my ban, since it didn't seem to fit the explanations and defenses they gave to justify the strict moderation and censorship.

While I kept my PMs civil, I honestly wasn't expecting much...figured I'd probably get called some names and maybe hear some MAGA rhetoric, then move on. To my surprise, I actually had some reasonable and insightful conversations with t_d regulars who seemed angry and frustrated with the moderation and general direction the sub is headed.

Yes. Mods are fucking lunatics on the sub. Ruining it.

Most mods on reddit are power hungry assholes. Except for this one of course

I was banned for saying that a meme, where Bernie Sanders is dressed as a Nazi was disinfo because at his extreme he would be more akin to a communist than a Nazi. I guess someone's feelings were hurt. I tried to dispute my ban with the mods and they muted me from replying to them. It's funny when you pair that with the constant threads that complain about other parts of reddit censoring opinions.

I am for full free speech but it is hard to argue Bernie wasn't a nationalist socialist, which Hitler too was. Take it as a compliment though as commies killed more people than nazis. I don't like Bernie but I don't agree with banning those who do.

Instead of banning me and leaving me bitter, someone like yourself could have made this argument and I would have went on my merry way and learned something. I guess that's the benefit of having a conversation who'da thunk it? Not the mods over at The_Donald.

Bernie was a national socialist in that he believed in social democracy for America. That's a far cry from the ideology of "national socialism."

Bernie was a national socialist