The fun trick is... Mike Pence has no legal force to go after an Australian living in the UK in the Ecuadorian embassy that published unclassified files that the CIA has yet to admit originally belonged to them..

CIA - "No comment"

https://www.cia.gov/news-information/press-releases-statements/2017-press-releases-statements/cia-statement-on-claims-by-wikileaks.html

hey, just like Alexa

I think he's 3-D chess in the situation. This was said to buy time and help postpone whatever retaliation the DState has in store soon. He said this because he had to at this time for the situation. We don't know everything and don't have the whole story yet. If they actually try to harm Wikileaks before Chapter 2 drops than start to worry. The DState hates the attentions, and really hates the heat of the spotlight when they're being called out.

I think the deep state grows weaker every day... when Fox News talks the "shadow government" every night for a week straight... Ex-CIA doing interviews on CNN... Clapper running around like a chicken with it's head cut off...

If they couldn't stop Wikileaks before the election there is no way in hell they can do it now... especially with companies patching all the vulnerabilities the CIA previously used... but who knows how many foreign governments are in with the baddies?

All of them. More than one group of baddies though.

It is CIA’s job to be innovative, cutting-edge, and the first line of defense in protecting this country from enemies abroad. America deserves nothing less.

What the fuck happened to "all enemies foreign and domestic"?? Funny how they fail to mention the most important threat: enemies from within.

It is also important to note that CIA is legally prohibited from conducting electronic surveillance targeting individuals here at home, including our fellow Americans, and CIA does not do so. 

Yeah CIA, even the normies don't buy that.

Of course we do. Everyone buys it. I can say for almost absolute certainty that the CIA does not spy on American citizens not likely involved with foreign intelligence.

It's the FBI's job to spy on American citizens.

The CIA routinely breaks domestic and foreign laws every day. The Vault 7 report confirms what tons of people already knew, and we've had proof for decades alone that the CIA traffics and sells drugs directly and to the major cartels, if they don't own them outright. They're not even technically a domestic agency: the CIA is in service to the Crown of England, NOT our country, and work for the banks and Wall Street. Interestingly, in 1996, the House of Representatives' Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence released a huge report entitled "IC21: The Intelligence Community in the 21st Century." Buried amid hundreds of pages is this paragraph:

"The CS [clandestine service] is the only part of the IC [intelligence community], indeed of the government, where hundreds of employees on a daily basis are directed to break extremely serious laws in countries around the world in the face of frequently sophisticated efforts by foreign governments to catch them. A safe estimate is that several hundred times every day (easily 100,000 times a year) DO [Directorate of Operations] officers engage in highly illegal activities (according to foreign law) that not only risk political embarrassment to the US but also endanger the freedom if not lives of the participating foreign nationals and, more than occasionally, of the clandestine officer himself."

Good thing they definitely don't do that here! /s

The FBI does domestic surveillance, the CIA is only chartered for foreign surveillance. You have to keep in mind that everything they do is illegal. No country is going to allow the U.S. Intelligence services infiltrate their governments. Every op is criminal. The whole organization is basically a criminal enterprise that steals information. While I don't have too big a problem with that on foreign soil I don't want it here where I could be put in jail by the secret police.

Every other country does it to us, and we should be doing it to them, but when that type of work is internalized it becomes a danger to the citizens where the force of the federal government could be brought down on citizens. The DoJ combined with the Big Brother Arm of the CIA is a terrifying thought. That is the NSA. The government is basically a blind giant that will crush you if it takes an interest in you, but it's vision is getting clearer, and the NSA is the giant's glasses.

The CIA has no respect for the 4th Amendment or any of the Bill of Rights for that matter. While they provide a valuable service outside of the U.S. they should under no circumstances be allowed to operate inside the U.S.

The other troubling issue is the politicization of the CIA. How can we as a people trust an agency with the power the CIA has if they have an agenda other than the defense of the nation. They should be concerned with defending American interests abroad, but they seem to have lost their way over the last 40 years. Ever since bush Sr got the reigns the agency had been corrupted, and they have pursued a unilateral advancement of their own power. That really gathered stream after the fall of the Berlin Wall. The Cold War was over, budgets were being cut, they needed a new Boogyman, a new purpose. They needed an undefined enemy to build their budgets back up. Keep the criminal enterprises well greased with tax dollars.

And here we are today...

creating foriegn fingerprints not only serves the CIA's purposes abroad, it allows them to routinely break the law forbidding them from domestic spying at home. it gives them (gave them) plausible deny ability when they do (did).

whatever "good" they do abroad is buried under the mountain of pure evil they do and have done abroad.

they didn't lose their way, they were born bad.

i'm 45, and they were an established evil before i was born. up until now, the only people I've ever heard defend them were hardline cold warriors and the willfully blind (everything they were accused of having done in the 1960s-1990s, have been confirmed).

dulles was never a good guy. he seeded the CIA with nazis (real ones).

they're not mutually exclusive

"A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murderer is less to fear." — Marcus Tullius Cicero (42 B.C.)

Trump is just another pawn, glad you're still thinking freely!

O agree he is a puppet

Needs more upvotes lol nicely put

Mike Pence has no legal force

this guy thinks they're going after Assange with "legal" force 😂

🕵

Why even go after Assange? "Make an example" of some leakers, find some of the grunts doing the work behind WikiLeaks, and make it so no more dumps come from WikiLeaks so Assange cannot stay relevant.

because if they don't come out hard against Wikileaks, their opposition will jump on them for working with them and 'letting them off the hook'.

Pence and Trump have to give the media and the establishment as little ammunition as possible until things calm down. I think a lot of this was lip service, which is only reinforced by the point that Pence has no legal jurisdiction over wikileaks or Assange.

And if you think that people haven't been trying to kill Assange, you haven't been paying attention. He's well protected.

I have to kind of agree. It's the game they have to play. You don't think Trump who hates the CIA isn't snickering when Vault 7 dropped in privet? I bet Trump and Pence are smiling and laughing on the inside. The CIA already threatened Trump when he came out against them. It's a farce and if people don't get the game Trump as to play yet they never will. Have they said what or how they will handle WL? No because they know WL is very helpful but can't say that obviously.

...Trump and Pence are the establishment.

Don't be a fool.

The only fool is yourself if you cannot see how Trump and 'the establishment' are opposed - he has been under fire from day 1. They are the same people who were behind Clinton and their master plan of a 'pied piper candidate' blew up in their face.

Pence may be part of that group - I can't say for sure. Trump never had an option to go nuclear on the government - he needs the Republican party to play nice with him or else they could just handcuff him or remove him. The president really doesn't have that much power with the rest of government working with them.

Don't take this to mean that Trump doesn't have his own flaws and interests, but he is NOT part of the established powers in Washington. He has been the butt of their jokes for almost 30 years now - they dont' like each other much at all. Remember that Trump was a registered democrat for over 20 years before 2008 (when he went independent). He doesn't have many friends in the Republican party either.

Trump is just one flavor of the establishment. Some on the right realize how badly he's playing out and are publically distancing themselves, but they still push his agenda when the cameras aren't on.

He doesn't give a shit about you, he doesn't give a shit about the country. All he cares about is his name, his power, and his legacy. I mean, he's a walking caricature of narcissism. Everything has to have his name on it, and everything has to be gold.

War on Whistle Blowers is already a thing. It already destroyed the Reporter Confidentiality in the 4th District Court. That is a blatant attack on freedom of the press. Democracy requires a functioning 4th estate. Attacking sources and journalists is totalitarianism. The alternative is to require government agencies to function within the boundaries of the law. Why is that so controversial?

Down voated for that smilie face.

you better not have any fun over there

they're called emojis now

Can you tell your dad to take his weiner out of your mouth. And stick it bak where it belongs. Wait. Three Hours.

they'll just drone crash the embassy

whoops look at that accident the russians caused

The Obama admin is no longer in power.

And drone attacks are up significantly.

He knows that and that's exactly why he said it the way he did. They were trying to catch him in a trap they could use against him, could you imagine if he said they weren't going to do anything about Wikileaks? It would be all over the news that he's okay with sensitive classified information getting out. He answered it the best way he could

Legal force is not the point. The dark state does not care about legal, and Pence has been tied into the dark government since at least 9/11.

He is a Christian Zionist. He will order Jesus to go after Assange in an Israeli tank.

Yeah that's what I was wondering.

they're brainwashed by propaganda into thinking that everything trump does is good, because he told them he had the best everything and they're simple minded folks

Trump DOES have the best everything. Problem is, he ain't gonna share it with anyone

Getting scared on reddit is a full time job for some.

They're not simple minded at all. The US economy has been making the richest 1% richer for thirty years largely at the expense of the people who voted Trump in. They voted for him because, like Obama in 2008, he was a candidate that promised dramatic change. Many were willing to hard swallow Trump and all of his glaring problems because they could see Hillary was the epitome of a status quo candidate.

Hopefully, the DNC will finally come to realize this, and not try to hammer a square peg through a round hole in 2020.

Probably so, but I think there's plenty of that brainwashing on both sides. Personally I think it's more of a problem on the left since they pushed me away with the amplified groupthink hysteria.

Im hoping this is 8D chess - but probably not...

Of course it is. Pence looks like he's against leaks because they are about to nail internal leakers hard. Can you imagine if he praised Assange? He'd be eaten alive by the people he jails within government. He knows damn well the US government can't touch Assange and so nothing will come out of it anyway. Win/win scenario.

Hope so man.. I'd hate it if Pence has been a mole of the swamp all along..

You hope they come down on leakers?

LOL. You guys don't even try to pretend anymore.

Not ones leaking to wiki, but those who leaked the info reguarding the non-controversy surrounding Flynn. Dem Deep State Boiz.

Flynn lies multiple times to the American people: Nothing to see here folks!

Good job Comrade!

Ya there have been rumors he is but nothing for sure.

Why are all Trump supporters calling everything they don't like XD chess? Voice your opinions and don't put your trust in the government. The "they know what they're doing" attitude is why we're in this mess in the first place.

Not bizarro world... Kek's world... Chaos is chaos and doesn't pick sides...

Stockholm Syndrome.

It's the equivalent of defending bush while he was in office.

What's expected?

Trump seems to be fighting the system but Mike Pence is siding with the establishment. There also appears to be other pro-establishment moles operating within the Trump administration. We should not fool ourselves with partisanship. There are just as many compromised Republicans as their are compromised Democrats. Both parties need to be flushed down the toilet. Trump himself is an independent and a patriot who is at war with both parties.

Trump seems to be fighting the system

Hahaha, this is just an illusion. He's just some rich fuck that got into power saying whatever he had to in order to do so.

Ahahaha. Oh man. I genuinely feel sorry for you.

I promise, it's ok to have buyer's remorse. There's literally no point in sticking with your guy if he doesn't live up to who he promised to be.

Trump is a billionaire who will use the office to further his own gain. Why people like you keep trusting rich elites is beyond me.

And I'll preempt this because people like you also seem to think in binary: Clinton is also a rich elite that seeked the office for her own gain

Why people like you keep trusting rich elites is beyond me.

No one with less than a few hundred million has enough security to make it to the top without being compromised and intimidated into doing what intelligence agencies want. Look at Bernie during the DNC, there was fear in that man's eyes.

If I have to read one more god damn "Trump is establishment mannn" post, I am going to lose my shit.

He was a better option than Clinton. That's it. That is why he won.

Fuckin' Christ.

What exactly makes him so disgusting?

Other than the petty, trivial hard left bullshit that liberals always cry about?

I don't know, I think the President of the United States acting like a petty little petulant child is a pretty big reason to dislike him pretty hard.

I don't give a fuck if the President goes on twitter rants.

I give more a fuck about them turning this country into a police state, taking away rights, starting wars, financing terrorism, engaging in black ops, being associated with people who deal in human sex trafficking. You know, shit that actually matters.

Police state - * Been actively trying to give police more power and authority. * Wants to bring back stop and frisk policies

Taking away rights * Supports civil forfeiture * Repeated attacks first amendment

Starting wars * Wants to start a war with Iran

Financing terrorism * Just recently approved a arms deal for Saudi Arabia

Engaging in black ops - Yemen massacre and disaster

Being associated with people who deal in human sex trafficking - Praised and hung out with Epstein - Multiple quotes about sexualising teens

Again, I don't think anyone believe Donald Trump or his policies are perfect. As I mentioned, he won because he was a better option than Clinton.

What I want to know is, why did none of this shit bother lefties when Obama was in office?

It's because people like being lied to. And if there is one thing Clinton had on Donald Trump (besides corruption) is that she was better at selling you a shit sandwich than Trump is.

Everything you mention about Trump has been implicated ten-fold on Clinton.

So what exactly is your argument?

Because Trump isn't the 2nd coming of Christ, we should have reverted to the same old dog and pony shit show?

I am glad Trump is in office for the simple fact that it's caused internal conflict between the elites. Let them go into civil war and blow the whole thing wide open.

What I want to know is, why did none of this shit bother lefties when Obama was in office?

You're absolutely right, there are partisan hacks on the left - just like there are partisan hacks on the right.

Who here was singing Obama's praises? Yet you're here slobbing on Trump's dick, spouting off what is essentially State propaganda.

And now you've basically moved the goalposts now that your BS was called out - because Trump is everything you dislike about Clinton.

Is Clinton shit? Yes. But so is Trump - so maybe stop defending his ass at all costs.

It did bother lefties.

Liberals always shit on Obama's foreign policy.

Everything you mention about Trump has been implicated ten-fold on Clinton.

Yeah, Clinton definitely was a cop lover. /s

Give me a break.

Because Trump isn't the 2nd coming of Christ, we should have reverted to the same old dog and pony shit show?

I want people to stop sucking Trump's cock, and start holding him accountable for his actions. Clinton lost. Who gives a shit now. Get over it and stop obsessing over her.

Trump is the president now. Hold him accountable for his corruption and actions, or don't say any more shit about any other politician.

Are you fuckin' kidding me?

All lefties do is protest over rights they haven't lost. Make statements like "Not my president" and want California to secede. Abolish the electoral vote, etc. They are the ones that need to get the fuck over it.

They are so fuckin' butthurt over losing, that they want him to fail. They refuse to acknowledge any positives that he has done and want to turn every decision he makes into some catastrophic nightmare and they've been doing it since before he was elected.

For example, he says "Mexico is not giving us their best and brightest" or "A lot of illegal immigrants are rapists and drug dealers."

And somehow that turns into "Trump is racist!" "All hispanics will be deported", They blow everything out of proportion to the point where, even if Trump did do something wrong, it would be hard to tell from their point of view because everything is treated like the holocaust.

Thus far, nothing Trump has done has affected me negatively. Yet, I see all these privileged first worlders acting like their personal utopia is being shattered and it's fucking pathetic.

You were just implying that Obama was trying to take away our rights, and now you are saying that liberals are protesting over rights they haven't lost yet.

California seceding is funded by Russian groups. It's a stupid thing to do.

Abolishing the electoral vote dumb. I agree with you there.

They want him to fail because they think his policies are bad for America. They want him to fail, but want America to succeed.

What positives has he accomplished so far?

Even Republicans and his own administration have been saying his administration is in chaos and something needs to be changed fast.

He didn't say a lot of illegal immigrants are rapists and drug dealers. Here's the full quote.

Thank you. It's true, and these are the best and the finest. When Mexico sends its people, they're not sending their best. They're not sending you. They're not sending you. They're sending people that have lots of problems, and they're bringing those problems with us. They're bringing drugs. They're bringing crime. They're rapists. And some, I assume, are good people.

Illegal immigrants is nowhere mentioned in that.

I don't need Trump to do something against me negatively, to care how his actions affect others.

My wife is a immigrant, and luckily she's not a immigrant from a Muslim nation.

Obama has tried continuously to take away our rights, but I am referring to liberals who (now that Trump is in office) suddenly think women do not have equal rights. Or that we have somehow reverted back to the 1950s after the inauguration.

What about his policies are bad for America? Not allowing every immigrant in the world to just come here with any sort of background check or identification?

The TPP is dead in the water, thanks to him. Obamacare is dead in the water, thanks to him.

I see nothing wrong with his quote. Do you think Mexico's doctors and scientists are smuggling themselves across the border?

It's people with problems coming here. And while having problems doesn't make you a bad person, guess what? American citizens have problems too and they need to be addressed first.

Your wife is married in. You have nothing to worry about. And besides that, he has said that if you are not a criminal and do what is necessary to come here legally (which I agree needs to be fixed) than they are more than welcome.

What rights has Obama tried to take away?

Liberals aren't saying women don't have equal rights all of a sudden. But, it's about acknowledging that sexism and discrimination does still exist (and yes I know it happens against men as well). This last election has allowed a lot of it t come out, and ignoring these types of issues is not going to make it go away.

His travel ban is one of the fucking stupidest things ever. It just antagonizes our allies and embolden our enemies. We already have one of the most insanely through vetting systems in the world. Do your self a favor, and talk to experts at the immigration office and ask them to tell you what the vetting procedures are.

The TPP wasn't perfect, but I supported it. I hated the court system that it would impose, but I do support free trade and believe that TPP was important for maintaining our power in Asia.

Trump had nothing to do with shooting it dead in the water. Congress was going to shoot it down no matter what. Trump's action was just a formality.

I fully support Obamacare. It's not perfect, but it's stupidly ridiculous to repeal it instead of just repairing it.

Quote: You're moving goal posts now. Your point was that he was talking about illegal immigrants, but he wasn't. He said most Mexicans that come to the states are rapists and drug dealers.

All - some(he assumes) = most.

American citizens have problems too and they need to be addressed first.

Republicans say this type of shit, but as soon as government assistance programs are talked about, republicans shout "Big government! take care of yourselves you bums!"

If my wife was from those 7 countries, she would be at serious risk of not being able to come into the country, or at least at the minimum being detained for several hours or possibly days at the air ports.

I think his point is that it doesn't really matter how shitty Clinton is, doesn't mean we shouldn't be criticizing the current administration for shit they pull.

I understand criticism.

But, it gets really annoying when these anti-Trump people make posts like we all have the wool over our eyes because we voted for Trump instead of Clinton.

You're in r/conspiracy. This sub shits on the establishment and they see Trump as part of that. If you don't think criticizing politicians and import figures is part of this sub, you're in for a rough time. Sure, the last 8 years was shitting on Obama but that's because he was in power. Most of the people in this sub don't look to one party or the other for salvation, as they see them as two arms of the same body. After this past election though, there has been a serious influx of Trump supporters (which there is nothing wrong with) but they can't handle the spirit of this sub which is to question everything.

So yah, if you are annoyed with posts in R/CONSPIRACY criticizing the president (who I'm assuming you voted for), you might want to leave or at least provide constructive criticism about why you find the opinion of the original poster to be incorrect.

I have no problem with criticism, when it is merited.

But, this constant doom and gloom scenario where I'm supposed to gasp and think "what have I done" because I voted for Trump is ridiculous.

Trump is going to do things I don't like. He is also doing things I do like. But, I am not gonna sit here and act like we fucked up big time because Trump is in instead of Hillary.

Alright, I can understand that.

Who gives a shit if you regret your vote or not. That's not the point.

The point is holding him accountable.

But, it gets really annoying when these anti-Trump people make posts like we all have the wool over our eyes because we voted for Trump instead of Clinton.

Who the fuck here is arguing that Clinton was a good choice either? Saying shit like this is a red fucking herring. You're not a fool for voting Trump over Clinton. You're fool for voting for either of them and thinking it was a better choice.

What's even worse, you come here defending him at all costs, trying to muddy the waters for any real discussion.

From what I gather from this sub, a lot of people on here want to spin this narrative that Clinton was the way we should have went all along because Trump is just a psy-op, double agent, shit show whom the elites "really wanted" in office all along.

It's bullshit. The elites did not want Trump in office. If they did, then they fucked up because Donald Trump has single handedly made being a conspiracy theorist "cool". People who otherwise, wouldn't have given a shit about politics are now trying to figure shit out because they're so pissed off Trump got elected and want to find dirt on him so bad so they can have their "ah ha!" moment.

Trump is a better choice, whether you want to acknowledge it or not.

You talk about defending him at all costs, show me some fucking proof on anything you guys claim.

All I read about this guy is petty, high school level drama.

From what I gather from this sub, a lot of people on here want to spin this narrative that Clinton was the way we should have went all along because Trump is just a psy-op, double agent, shit show whom the elites "really wanted" in office all along.

Again, you're muddying the waters. Calling out Trump's bullshit doesn't mean you support Clinton instead.

It's bullshit. The elites did not want Trump in office.

Donald Trump is the poster boy for the corporate elite. He's literally bragged about buying off politicians.

If they did, then they fucked up because Donald Trump has single handedly made being a conspiracy theorist "cool".

No, he's energized a large group of people, such as you, to chase conspiracies against his 'enemies' while ignoring or dismissing anything against him.

Trump is a better choice, whether you want to acknowledge it or not.

You are a very well behaved and compliant Citizen. Keep up the good work, Comrade.

You talk about defending him at all costs, show me some fucking proof on anything you guys claim.

When +75% of your posts in 1 month are defending Trump? Yeah...

All I read about this guy is petty, high school level drama.

And this is the big problem. People like you don't

Like I said, it's one thing to criticize something Trump does that you think is not good. But, a lot of what I read on here is speculation from people who wanted Clinton in office instead.

See, I don't buy that he's poster boy for the corporate elite. The elite want to remain in the shadows. They don't want someone exposing them left and right, even if he is gloating.

I think he's in this position because he believes he can fix it. He might be wrong. He might be ego-driven, but I don't see him being a pawn, at least not willingly.

He's doing things the way HE thinks they should do things and will probably get assassinated at some point if he steps on the wrong toes.

I have read the conspiracies and attacks on him. Every single thing is petty bullshit. "He doesn't respect women because he called Rosie a cow", "He's racist because he said Mexico brings in rapists and drug dealers" waa...waa. It's crybaby bullshit and it doesn't compare to satanic, human trafficking sex rings. I'm sorry, it just doesn't. You have proof that he's part of it too? Show it. I have no allegiance to evil.

But, a lot of what I read on here is speculation from people who wanted Clinton in office instead.

Bull. Fucking. Shit.

At most, you might see that opinion when a thread makes it to /r/all.

See, I don't buy that he's poster boy for the corporate elite. The elite want to remain in the shadows. They don't want someone exposing them left and right, even if he is gloating.

What's better, hide in the shadows forever - or normalize the behavior so you can do it openly without reprieve?

I have read the conspiracies and attacks on him.

Yep. Because literally the only concerns about Trump are him being sexist and racist. That's it. Nothing else to see here folks. That's all we should be concerned about.

Keep up the good work Comrade!

You think its r/The_Donald if people don't immediately come out swinging and hating Trump or assuming the worst of his character.

Until, I see some wikileaks drop of Trump being implicated in these Podesta emails or conspiring with terrorists or something concrete (not speculation, not opinions) then I am going to keep my opinion of Trump of what I think he is: a loud mouth asshole with an ego. A typical "rich guy". But, that isn't in the same league as "suicide you if you cross me", "fuck your children, drink their blood" Clinton.

I don't think it's The_Donald. I know it is. Most people here stumping for Trump literally have most of their posts there.

Apparently you realized that it's a bit too transparent, so you created an alt account to hide it.

Until, I see some wikileaks drop of Trump being implicated in these Podesta emails or conspiring with terrorists or something concrete (not speculation, not opinions) then I am going to keep my opinion of Trump

Interesting that you've yet to AT ALL recognize the conspiracies about Trump and Russia.

And again, like fucking clockwork, more gatekeeping. I won't argue for or against Pizzagate, but I will note that it all started with speculation and opinions on some funny sounding emails. That's how conspiracy theories start. So again, to raise the requirement on what you think should even be considered here because it's against Trump, is just ridiculous.

Until, I see some wikileaks drop of Trump being implicated in these Podesta emails or conspiring with terrorists or something concrete (not speculation, not opinions) then I am going to keep my opinion of Trump of what I think he is: a loud mouth asshole with an ego. A typical "rich guy"

ok that's reasonable

But, that isn't in the same league as "suicide you if you cross me", "fuck your children, drink their blood" Clinton.

the child-fucking, blood-drinking Clinton isn't speculation. got it

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Makes me wonder if you're just a fanatic from The_Donald...or...?

Nailed it. Happily, it looks like evidence that this administration is turning out precisely as any alert, attuned person could have predicted is making them squirm and vacate the premises.

You have the wool over your eyes because you voted for that orange clown instead of a third party or nobody

I don't hate Donald Trump.

That sounds like a personal problem for you.

Exactly.

What I want to know is, why did none of this shit bother lefties when Obama was in office?

Don't construe the left with liberals. Plenty of leftists were criticizing Obama; Chris Hedges, Noam Chomsky, Glenn Greenwald, Medea Benjamin among many others.

Exactly (Angela Davis, Cornel West, to add a few more). And these leftists were criticizing Obama on shit that mattered like expanding the drone program, being cozy with banks like Goldman Sachs, continuing imperialist policies, expanding the surveillance program, expanding the police state through militarization, etc.

The right were criticizing Obama on stupid shit like "he's a secret Muslim", "he's Kenyan born", "he's a secret Marxist", "he wants Sharia law", etc.

The most scathing criticisms of Obama came from the left, the right meanwhile came up with wild theories when that bad shit he was doing was staring them right in the fucking face.

These people then think the "left" never criticized Obama because they ignore us because we're actual socialists, Marxists, anarchists, etc and they've been taught by the very media they condemn that those things are bad. They only see liberal Democrats (who also try to demonize us) as "the left".

These people then think the "left" never criticized Obama because they ignore us because we're actual socialists, Marxists, anarchists, etc and they've been taught by the very media they condemn that those things are bad. They only see liberal Democrats (who also try to demonize us) as "the left".

Fuckin' A right.

the right meanwhile came up with wild theories when that bad shit he was doing was staring them right in the fucking face.

Typical distraction tactic, par for the course really.

"Oh but Hillary's emailz!!11! Just overlook that the Neocon controlled CIA was smuggling weapons out of the State Dept annex in Benghazi to Wahhabi jihadists!!"

Nothing new really, the conservative establishment has used liberals as proxy for their bullshit for decades.

Don't forget that he's a drug warrior who wants to lock up non-violent drug offenders in private prisons.

Trump was a better choice than Clinton but he's in office now and needs to be held accountable. Trump on the campaign was interesting but in action he seems pretty status quo in a neo-con to me.

I don't give a fuck if the President goes on twitter rants.

You should, he is after all, our head diplomat.

Maintaining close relations with the biggest state funders and supporters of Wahhabism and refusing to institute a travel ban against Qatar, Turkey, Kuwait, Pakistan, and Saudi Arabia.

The expansion of the MIC and continuation of the policy of interventionism that fuels unsustainable military spending.

Instituting policies to destroy the free and open internet.

...among many other things.

I have zero doubt that Hillary would have signed the TPP and started WWIII by now if she had won.

I don't agree with him or his administration 100 percent, but I don't regret my vote at all.

Exactly.

How would she start WWIII?

She wanted to start WW3 by re-hashing the Cold War and eventually going full scale war with Russia.

How progressive!

Clinton is shit, but this is beyond hyperbolic, nearing straight up propaganda.

Really? I suppose you think funding terrorism in the middle east through ISIS to destabilize the region is not an act towards world war 3.

Hilarious how you seem to be content with an administration that did exactly that, but somehow seem war is more likely from someone who was talking in jest about going to war over a middle finger.

Hilarious how you seem to be content with an administration that did exactly that

How did anything I say indicate that? Stop the with the strawman. They're both shit. But you seem to only selectively smell the bullshit.

You are trying to justify a dispute to my claim that Trump was a better option than Hillary and that is why he won.

Because you don't understand that the turd sandwich is no better than the giant douche.

What is state propaganda about what I said?

Anything that Trump says or does is state propaganda now.

He's the president.

You did say that.

Please quote the exact sentence.

Saying a no-fly zone over populated cities in Syria != WW3, does not at all indicate a position on the US Government's supporting of terrorism in the mideast.

Russian Generals have directly, openly and officially said that if US attempted that, then Russia would not allow it and shoot ANY planes down, which meant including US, which furthermore meant war, unless you know, US wasn't going to do shit back. Ya right. The nuclear citizen drills in Russia by the millions were not for fun. It's not a thing they do normally, even though it's Russia.

How did Clinton signal that she wanted another cold war and full scale war with Russia?

Her administration and Obama's administration have been trying to demonize Russia for awhile now.

And it's all because Putin has adopted a capitalistic approach to Russia's economy and they see it as a threat to their global agenda.

Russia was always demonized. Are you new to US politics?

Nobody has really given a fuck about Russia since they collapsed.

It hasn't been until Putin started acting more like America by acting more capitalistic and imperialistic that they are trying to make them some super power threat again.

Are you serious? Do you not remember all of those years of the Republican party attacking Obama because he was too weak on Russia? You don't remember his town hall debate with Romney?

I'm not a Republican either. I did vote Republican this time however.

But, I don't believe Trump is really a Republican. He just chose that ticket because he wouldn't have made it as a moderate independent.

That has nothing to do with what I just said.

Russia being a boogeyman has been a new development ever since Trump got into the picture. They have to blame someone for his success. Heaven forbid that it was legit.

Russia being a boogeyman has been a new development

Wut..

I know, I'd say that his/her response is shocking but... history repeats itself over and over and some people just choose to bury their head in the sand.

I'm wondering if he's a young kid or a foreigner.

Me too. I remember when I was younger I expressed different ideologies than my parents to spite them but that shit didn't stick once I became an adult and did my studying.

Are you new to conspiracy? Because you're really noobing out here. Have you looked into conspiracy starter kits to blend in better?

Blend in better? Why would I want to blend in?

I'm just pulling your leg. It is very true that Russia has always been demonized. Remember all those Arnold action movies and alike, where they had the evil Russians all the time lol. Sure there might have been a hint of truth in there but it was always probably overexerted not only make the movie more fun, but to do exactly what we are discussing; to demonize. It's been put out, ingrained in us.

However, since (the?) Ukraine and Syria, things have escalated to another level between Russia and US, especially in the info war area and financial sector through sanctions and other intimidation methods. Now the media says the sanctions were deserved but when one looks at the whole picture, it paints something different than what the media has been painting for us.

However, it then it started to spill into deaths. Basically on the brink of a real war between USA and America. In Ukraine in a was a proxy war but in Syria, BOTH Russians and Americans were present, so any small move or mistake could have triggered something major. And considering the tensions and what was at stake for US (pipeline domination and a shitload of investments into moderate revels for) it didn't seem they would be too forgiving. Neither would Russia. But neither seemed to have been willing to back down. I was genuinely scared shitless of our future under Clinton. She is insane. Trump acts insane, that's the difference. She is a war criminal with nothing stopping her, as in regard for human life. If she could get away with it, she would do it. And she was able to get away with a lot unfortunately. A lot believe US was trying to provoke Russia in order to remain in power, because should a war had started, there would be a state of emergency or whatever it's called when the country is under war, which meant no elections, no leaks, more money, more control.

In my opinion, these world leaders are like pure gangsters. Putin is trying to overtake the arms sale in the world by stealing markets, and US is struggling with their sales to the terrorists since their plan wasn't going to shit they needed a bigger war to keep the money machine going.

Those who were following the war news closely from the start, every damn day, from a non-MSM narrative, doing their own research and digging, know the dangers and intentions of the elite, which Clinton would have been happily a puppet for and on board with their plans. That is if she would have been it through her health even. It seemed her health wasn't even going to keep her stable for long enough. A lot of people felt she was only there as a prop to remain power, and then all the moves would have been made by her controllers, whether she was still in power or one of their next puppets if she had to go because of health. The point is, the keys would have been handed to people who USED ISIS to their advantage. It wouldn't even surprise me anymore if they were even behind its creation.

wait wait wait so Hil and Barry were demonizing Russia?
Because...because they were threatened by Russia's capitalism?
Do I have that right?

Wow

They're demonizing them to make the election appear fraudulent. Hacking? Give me a fuckin' break. If anyone hacked the election, it was the CIA.

This dude is acting as if the tensions between US and Russia the last 30-40 years was never a thing.

Has he never watched Rocky 5?

I'm pretty sure a lot of people supporting Trump are young people who haven't watched any 80s or 90s film..

Hollywood did go from Russian/Eastern European bad guys to Middle Eastern terrorist recently, but they are making a come back.

I can't wait until all the movies come out based off of this election.

It got lost in all the chaos of the election but the news was talking about how US Government hackers were going to hack into Russia and shut off all electricity and internet for the week surrounding the election to make sure that the Russian hackers wouldn't be able to interfere with our voting machines.

Unrelated to the electric grid shutdown... but I'm a big fan of Susan Lindauer so I'll use this as an excuse to drop off this link...

Susan Lindauer "A Vote For Hillary Clinton Is a Vote For World War 3." - The Richie Allen Show

Have a source for Clinton wanting to shut down their electricity and internet?

It was just the Obama administration in general... I just think a lot of people attributed it to her cause she was the only higher up openly vocalizing a lot of Russia hate at the time... there are plenty of stories about the hackers shutdown of the power grid, but who knows how much of that was just fake news with a bunch of anonymous sources?

What stories of shutting down the grid?

Those two in my previous post should get ya started...

Thanks for the sources. Looks like they didn't do it though. That's still not a indication that Clinton was going to start a war with Russia.

Might just be that so many attribute anything Russia related to her cause she was the one that originally was getting people whipped up over it when there wasn't much Russia talk going on in America at the time...

by putting a no fly zone on Syria, while knowing the fact that she would make any US-Russia relations go down the drain and possibly cause WWIII. This is the only source I can find for this information, though.

Didn't Turkey do the same and literally shot down Russian military Air craft?

they did this in 2015 and Russia shot them down with a Sukhoi Su-24.

December of 2015.

And did WWIII break out?

no, but this event made the Russian government hate Turkey afterwards.

But, no war.

Russia didn't shoot back?

no, as the turkish F16 that shot the Sukhoi Su-24 took out the Russian jet.

What? Can you clarify that sentence please?

a Turkish F-16 Jet attacked the Russian Sukhoi Su-24 and took the Sukhoi Su-24 out of the sky because the Sukhoi Su-24 went past a Syrian border.

Ok thank you. Your first sentence made it sound like Russia was the one that attack or retaliated.

Where have you been? You seem pretty highly opinionated around here yet you're clueless on how Clinton was going to start a war.

I like asking questions and clarifying people's stances before I attack strawmen.

It's better to be on the same page, and argue/debate based on the merits of source material.

The whole mission of US against ISIS was a facade in Syria. They were literally uninvited there and had to come by force by creating false flags events. Even if the sarin gas incident was not deep-state fabricated, they sure try to utilize it their advantage to jump on Russia and Syria without any proof whatsoever and get themselves into Syria.

If Russia were to simply kick them out, they would have to do it by force, which would result in a war, which now seems US wanted all along, considering how much bear poking there has been. It seemed Russia was not interested in this and made a stern decision not to react no matter what. Oh and the poking got worse and worse. But in the end, it seems they got what they wanted and didn't give in to the bully. Eventually the bully had to leave the school yard. Had the bully managed to provoke a fight, he could have used that to his advantage to not get kicked out of the schoolyard longer, or from the school itself for that matter. No fight, no get to stay longer.

If the only argument to vote for some one is: "the other candidate sucks even more" maybe it's time to rethink...

It is absolutely beyond me how anybody can actually think that trump is capable of that position. He is literally the personification of what is wrong with this world. The 1%. And he is supposed to be the guy to finally save us from the establishment??? Smh

Who is capable for that position?

I mean, we've had nothing, but one rotten, evil snake after another ever since JFK died. It's not like the position has any sort of righteousness to it anymore.

So to follow your logic... that means we don't even try anymore?

The fact that these two candidates where our choice is what should make us angry. But still, not one single person was protesting

People were protesting, but Clinton and Trump supporters were too busy calling use socialists as if it's an insult

And we should still be pointing out the biases, corruption, and flaws of his admin, because he wasn't an ideal choice.

SUPRA SUPRA FORUMSLIDER THREAD

Its trump supporters all the way down.

I do not like this talk by Pence, but at the same I wonder if it is strategy: There are a lot of scared chomos out there and I am sure they do not want Wikileaks to expose them, and I'm thinking that it is their main motivation for wanting to shut them down. Now, if he actually started taking public steps, I would have to revise my opinon. My thought at this point is just conjecture.

Even Marco Rubio was warning Republicans about this during the election.

Leaks were fine and dandy when they were benefiting them. Now every government agency is leaking like a sieve, and they're afraid of what Wikileaks might receive.

I'm a trump supporter but I am also an Assange supporter. Fuck Pence

http://www.cnn.com/2017/01/04/politics/kfile-trump-wikileaks/

Well, get ready to not like Trump too because he will not end up siding with Wikileaks. The chickens have come home to roost buddy.

Also, Bernie can still win.

Hey, recycling the same old shit to stay off topic will only get you so far. Best of luck.

Its going to be a long 24 years of trying for you.

How in the world can you still support Trump other than hating Democrats. What is he giving you?

Why 'support' anyone? What do you personally gain by being emotionally tied to a 70 year old politician?

IMO supporting politicians/presidents is the dumbest fucking thing in America, I believe support for a politician should completely be removed once they become president, as there literally is no point in supporting someone who's one of the most powerful men in the country.

Because they're just partisan Trump supporters

Remember when Trump said Snowden and Manning are traitors that should be killed?

Remember when Trump said Snowden and Manning are traitors that should be killed?

He didn't say they should be killed, but Pepperidge Farm remembers.

https://twitter.com/realdonaldtrump/status/472447734860218369

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/824573698774601729

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/jul/2/donald-trump-edward-snowden-kill-traitor/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_5uYQgrm0k

“You know, spies in the old days used to be executed,” Trump said. “This guy is becoming a hero in some circles... This guy’s a bad guy and, you know, there’s still a thing called execution."

Thanks! I was pretty sure I remembered this but wasn't totally sure and didn't want to make a blunder. Looks like I made a blunder in my anxiousness.

Is there any point where he says Manning should be killed?

http://www.cnn.com/2017/01/04/politics/kfile-trump-wikileaks/

Thanks

Snowden gotta go, cause Snowden is CIA.

You still don't understand Trump is siding with the CIA here?

Remember when Trump said Snowden and Manning are traitors that should be killed?

I'm a Trump supporter and I 'member. It's not something I agree with him on, but it played little role in my choice of supporting him as the alternative held the same position expressed in softer terms.

Why do you have to support either of them?

"You", as in the general member of the public, don't have to do anything. I supported Trump because I agreed with some of his core policies, and those I didn't agree on I didn't find objectionable enough to be an impediment; I also thought a Clinton presidency, which was the realistic alternative, would be disastrous for more than the US.

Hat is a very nuanced position and therefore very problematic. It would help everyone do their jobs if you could just ascribe to one one the predetermined strawmen that the talking points are designed for.

People don't expressed nuanced opinions on reddit because both sides instantly downvote anyone who might look like they're not with them. For example, this is an anti-Trump thread, hence my explanation of why I supported him gets downvotes; it would be the opposite in a pro-Trump thread.

This. Just because you voted for Trump doesn't mean you support everything his administration says or does. Before someone says I'm a shill, trust me, I'm not....

For many, Trump seems to their one and only hope, but he's only one man and it will take a concerted effort by millions of outraged Americans to see any meaningful change in the rampant abuse of governmental powers that is directed far more against them and their best interests than any foreign government or would-be terrorists.

I saw voting for him and putting him in the oval office as being similar to adding a neutral catalyst to two stable and otherwise incompatible elements to create a reaction and a brand new combination out of them that wasn't possible without that catalyst being there.

Trump's stirred-up half of the country and riveted their attention on Washington and now the other half is getting steadily pulled in to watch the whole ugly spectacle, like it or not, and see it for what it truly is.

Trump's unaffiliated presence and uncertainty about what he might personally take an interest in, or choose to do something about on his own initiative has created this gigantic shit-storm that's got everyone quivering in their boots, not anything that he's actually done because he's barely had time to actually do anything of any real significance or that was in any way unexpected.

You can't say he's actually exposed anyone or anything beyond a taunt or a tease or a jeer that has had his opposition in such a mad frenzy of indignation over it that they've been exposing themselves right, left, and center for the bunch of self-serving two-faced liars, hypocrites, crooks, and thieves they all actually are.

How dare Trump suggest such a thing about them? Who does he think he is, the President of the United States or something?

As a matter of fact he does and for anyone not paying attention he actually is.

Bizzarro is a great album by the Wedding Present. Didn't expect it to turn up in this Sub.

This sub and the conspiracy movement were gamed by a loose cabal of Communist State sponsored Russian commentators and volunteer Tea Party/Mainstream Republicans. They've used it as a tool to selectively smear the Democrats for years, so they are surprised that they can't keep doing this after the Republicans take and own all sectors of government.

Now, is when the Real community of Conspiracy starts again, now that the party of choice for the world orders, The Republican party have been installed in power.

Instead of a revolution, expect more of the same: Rich get richer and poor get poorer.

The short answer is "yes", and the world has always been somewhat bizarro but it is now teetering on becoming completely and quite possibly even insanely bizarro with things becoming completely undone and cut-loose to such an extent that virtually anything can happen next.

It's also an opportunity to make all kinds of things happen that weren't previously possible that can be good or bad depending on your outlook and how you approach it.

Clearly bad thoughts are bringing bad things to bad people at the moment, so it would seem that the converse should also apply to maintaining a good and positive outlook to see good and positive changes emerge and settle down in place out of the unpredictable storm that has everything up in the air at the moment.

We must try to envision what it is we want to see come together and begin to act and behave as if they already existed as the way to actually make and see them become a reality.

I DO NOT support the Trump administration attempting to silence Assange/WikiLeaks.

That said, I'm not convinced he plans on acting on this yet.

Why? Because Trump would take this public stance even if he actually supports them.

If he publicly endorsed WikiLeaks, it would negatively impact both parties. Trump would seemingly be supporting the compromise of U.S. intelligence, making him easily labeled a traitor. For Assange, public collaboration with Trump would do nothing but discredit future leaks and steal attention from the actual content.

I'm not jumping to any conclusions just yet.

Cognitive dissonance is a bitch!

Some people on here suck so much Trump/Pence dick they now can't figure out what to do when an organization exposes misdeeds of the government and "their boys" come out against it. They round that square and continue to defend them anyhow.

in other words, business as usual

Still trying to work out how much of Pence actions and words are the result of Trump's orders. Think he is more his own man then people make out. Know enough of history that Presidents and their VPs don't get along even to the point of sabotaging the others Presidential elections.

Pence worries me a lot. If Trump goes we may have a POTUS who swallows Neocons lying war mongering whole and without question.

Don't believe in Russian hacking narrative. To many anonymous sources and MSM people falling over themselves to blame Russia for everything just like the politicians and msm did with Iraq WMDs. This, plus DNC refusing to let the FBI look at its servers tells me the DNC hack never happened.

Because as VP he can't support the release of classified documents by anyone. Will he act on it, I doubt it so but he certainly can not publicly endorse him.

Then how come the president can support the release of classified documents while the VP can't?

Trump constantly praised the people who leaked Podesta and the DNC's email, and even endorsed more of it.

Podesta and DNC emails weren't classified

Doesn't matter, he still praised and endorsed any leaks that involved his rivals, but as soon as leaks start coming out against him and his administration he throws a bitch fit on Twitter.

It's quiet obvious that he only supports leaks and hacks when it involves his political opponents.

He threw "a bitch fit" because he knew Obama/Clinton/the CIA were spying on him. Perfectly reasonable. Then, when vault 7 came out, he said nothing. Also, his wiretapping "bitch fit" came right before the vault 7 release. Both things exposed CIA corruption. Do you think that was a coincidence?

Is Trump supposed to invite Assange to the White House for tea and a game of badminton while they chant "down with the CIA" on the front lawn?

This is how propaganda works folks, Trump sent a 100 character tweet out, and it implemented an idea in your head and now your online defending him.

Tell me, how does Trump 'know' that Obama was spying on him? He definitely didn't get it from his briefings, so that leaves the media, Steve Bannon or the rest of his corrupt administration to give him the idea, even fucking white house officials said Trump got the information from a fucking Breitbart article.

He provides zero proof, and only tweets out a couple characters and now all of you guys are here defending a president who's lied hundreds of times within the last few months alone.

I get it, you guys don't trust the media, so you seriously think trusting our president is the next best thing?

Also it's no coincidence that Assange has never once talked bad about Donald Trump, nor has he released a single bit of information about him. It's almost like Assange and Wikileaks have their own agenda!?!?

Also you said 'both things exposed CIA corruption' yet Trump doesn't even say the word 'CIA' in the post and provides zero proof, speculation or reasoning for his twitter fit.

I was wrong but it doesn't matter because...

okay lol.

It's quiet obvious that he only supports leaks and hacks when it involves his political opponents.

He's never supported hacks, and hasn't strongly denounced this leak, just tacitly - going against the CIA is no joke.

'He's never supported hacks' -/u/st0netear

"Boy, I love reading those WikiLeaks!" - Donald Trump

"Russia, if you're listening, I hope you're able to find the 30,000 emails that are missing," -Donald Trump

And now he's saying "The press should be ashamed of themselves" for running stories based on leaks

I get it, you voted for Donald and are emotionally tied down to him at this point. But vigorously and constantly defending him on every single subject on an anti government (and historically anti president) conspiracy sub then you need to go back to the circlejerk/echochamber you call The_Donald.

leaks != hacks. but nice try.

Lmao what? The DNC emails were hacked and then leaked, you can pressume the same happened to the CIA. You do realize that for leaks to happen people need to be hacked right?? Do you seriously believe Podesta released all his emails lmao.

But nice try at blatantly ignoring every point and then picking apart the most miniscule of details. Classic move from a The_Don cult member

You do realize that for leaks to happen people need to be hacked right??

Nice try at blatantly ignoring how most leaks happen (insider whistleblower) - classic move from a shill.

Lmao, you're an idiot. You seriously think Tony Podesta's personal emails got leaked by a whistleblower? You're a moron and you just proved my own point.

Seriously what the fuck are you even arguing for? You're literally a pro trump propaganda bot, all you do is praise trump here, it's sad almost.

You say I'm a shill, yet all you do is actively defend and praise a politician? Sad

You always move the goalposts and resort to strawmen and cookie cutter insults. You may not actually be a paid shill, but you wear their clothes.

You seriously think Tony Podesta's personal emails got leaked by a whistleblower?

Nope, that was the only one that was a "hack" (actually just social engineering and bad password security on his part)

Hack:Verb;use a computer to gain unauthorized access to data in a system.

He was praising the Tony Podesta and DNC email hacks you moron, please research what you're blindly defending before you blindly defend him like a blind Obama supporter.

Seriously, what are you arguing for? You are apart of the propaganda machine, and I like how you call me a shill because I'm being critical of the president on a fuckin' conspiracy sub. If anyone's a shill, it'll be the person who is blindly defending everything the president and government do and stand for. But I would never call you a shill because that's only what the dumb fucks over at The_Don would do.

Again you misrepresent my arguments, it's almost like you do that purposefully 🤔🤔. Podesta emails were hacks (although hacks that literally anyone could pull off). DNC emails were not hacks, they were leaked by an insider.

How do you think that insider got the personal emails? Do you think the emails were just sitting on someones desk? Please, explain to me how all the emails from all the different democrats got 'leaked by an insider'.

Do you understand how ridiculous you sound? I'm not saying Russia hacked it, but someone other than the various people who wrote the emails was able to log into the various accounts/servers and retrieve the emails.

That classifies it as a hack, personal emails from tons of different politicians isn't 'leaked by an insider', please at least try to think before blindly defending your government based on words.

Your arguments aren't misinterpreted, they're blatantly wrong lmao.

The insider was in the IT department and had access to the emails. Notice how you always resort to namecalling and histrionics at the end of each of your diatribes?

Since you seem to have completely forgotten the definition already, ill show you again.

Hack;V:use a computer to gain unauthorized access to data in a system.

Did the IT guy get the OK from every democrat that he leaked? No, that means he had unauthorized access, that classifies it as an act. And I'm calling you a moron constantly because you don't even know what you're blindly defending and I'm also assuming the same from your post history. All you do on Reddit is praise a politician, I personally find that shit stupid as fuck, combine that with the fact that your blindly defending our government on an anti government sub and I think that allows me to use a word or two.

Just stop, I assume you're a troll at this point if your going to argue about definitions and be blatantly wrong about it. But please, tell me how the IT guy got authorization from every democrat he hacked.

You must realize that you are being pedantic, and that no one considers copying files on a machine you have access to when you are "unauthorized" to copy that data to be "hacking." And you are calling me a moron because you are projecting, not for any valid reason.

You realized I just went along with your shitty IT tech story for the sake of your argument right? Please, provide any sort of source for your on the spot story. I tried looking for it and it seems like you're full of shit and are classifying your comments as if they are fact, when in reality you don't have a single source.

Provide me any sort of proof or evidence of how 'The IT guy' just 'copied the emails from the dozens of politicians'. You can't? That sucks, because your entire argument now is based on that fact.

We're both working on conjecture here because Assange has refused to reveal his source, and no one has proof of who leaked the documents. One telling sign for the DNC leaks though is that they refused to let the FBI look at their servers to trace the "hacks".

So you were just guessing that the 'IT' guy was the one who did it, yet your original comment implies that it was a fact?

If it wasn't the actual emailers who leaked the documents, it would be classified as a 'hack'. I'm not the guy who writes definitions, but when you wanna start a defence war based on the definition of a word I'm gonna have to take you up on that.

Listen dude, I know me and you are on the complete opposite ends when it comes to politics and government, but I'm only arguing that whoever leaked the emails to assange had to hack it to get it. I'm not saying Trump did it, or the Russians did it, but In terms of definitions I am one hundred percent cerain those emails were obtained by 'hacking' as stupid of a word as it is.

I'm sorry for calling you a 'fuckin moron' I only half meant it. Point is, neither of us know shit for certain, and this whole argument is fuckin ridiculous at this point lmao.

I don't even see any people defending Mike Pence in the thread.. What is OP talking about? I see a lot of Trump supporters displeased with Mike Pence's stance..

But go ahead and attack this sub and Trump..

Because to me, it sounds like Pence is blowing smoke up everyone's ass. Why would Pence say this and not Trump? On top of that, go after them for what? WL was one of the reasons they won the presidency and WL released absolutely no damaging emails that implicate Trump or Pence. It just seems that Pence is "towing" the line because they can't publicly come out and support them. I.l could be completely wrong in all of this.

There was a post on this sub before about how Pence's best friend was on a list of pedophiles. Maybe he doesn't want that coming out?

Definite possibility. There is just so much shit we don't know and it's frustrating.

Trump has literally said "I love wikileaks". So idk where pence is coming from

Any real friends you ever had are still your real friends, but the idiots are getting exposed left and right, and yes, it is a Bizarro World out there at this point.

Because we are so god damn tribalist that sometimes people feel like they have to defend their side even when that shit makes no sense.

We are a young country, and people are afraid. If Trump admin goes after weed, or puts whistle blowers in prison, you can be sure there will be extreme backlash politically.

which would be a welcomed change.

trump is a blessing in disguise, because he is reflexively hated and feared so much by the dems, the neocons, the neolibs, the MSM, and establishment repubs, that everything he does is met withoutrage, outrage strangely missing for the last 8 years, and largely absent for the last 27, for the same exact things.

aside: i tried to find an something on the independent voters' opinion of the CIA, but the results were are fucked up with russia bullshit. i did however find a facebook page for citzens for an independent america whose official self chosen accronym is CIA.

https://m.facebook.com/CitizensforanIndependentAmerica/?hc_ref=PAGES_TIMELINE

we are too tribalist. peop,e need to stop using cague amorphous words to describe things. there is no left/right dichotomy, there is only top/bottom.

geopolitics has 4 quadrants:

statetist upper right capitalist box is keynsianism, economic liberalism, and neoliberalism/corporatism.

all are capitalist, so it is not helpful to understand them as moving from left to right, but from bottom to top. the difference is how global and brutal the level of capitalism is, how interventionist and brutal their foriegn policy is, and how much of a police state they have. keynsianism is least of all three, neoliberalism is the worst of all three.

bush, obama, and both clintons are all neoliberals. bernie is a kensyian, but also an imperialist, which makes him unpredictable and unreliable, as reflected in his actual voting record. rand paul is a classic economic liberalist, but an anti-imperialist, which likewise makes him unpredictable.

the statist upper left box are socialists and communists, moving from bottom to top based on who owns the means of production and distributes the value of labor generated, along with the level of inwardness/isolationism, how reactionary they are internally, and the level of the police state.

under socialism, the workers themselves own the means of production, distribute the value generated. it is the least inward/isolationist, the least reactionary internally, and has the weakest police state. under communism, the state owns the means of production and dustributes the value produced. it is the most inward, the most reactionary, and has the strongest police state.

(note: the USSR looked outward on a reactionary basis, it had a nuclear arsenal aimed directly at it and its western bord from top to bottom was lined with tanks, missles, and troops. it took over the countries to its west to provide a buffer zone so as to have time to counter another OPERATION BARBAROSA, which killed 20 million of its soldiers and 14 million of its civilians).

the anti-statist lower right are libertarians. the anti-statist lower left are anarchists. the basic tenet of both is that all people everywhere have the inalienable right to be left alone to live their lives as they see fight so long as they abide by the anti-aggression rule (libertarians) and the anti-oppresion rule (anarchists). they also fundamentally differ regarding permissability of heirarchies and ownership of land, minerals, water, access to food, housing, clothing. anarchists say now to both, libertarians say yes to both.

however, push come to shove, being anti-statist and pro-self determination make them far more similar to each other, than to any statists. anarchists cheif critic of libertarianism is that it will always devolve in statism because property et al require a state super structure to enforce and that heiracrchy is inherently aggressive. they likewise say that anarchy will devolve into statism, though i've never been clear on what grounds.

all other supposed left/right divisions are moral/existential and i herently personal. they have business in political debate/dichotomy because there is no way 350 million people will ever agree on anything. families can't even agree. believe what you want to believe, live according to your own creed, but respect everyone else's right to do so as well.

Havent seen any post defending Pence anywhere else. Where is the proof , OP?

This debate is stupid. We had two choices, a war criminal with decades of scandals and controversies, an establishment politician, and a guy who hasn't had a chance to fuck up in politics yet. Seems like a clear choice to me.

Better the devil you don't know than the devil you do.

If he actually is a fan of them, doubt he'd be flaunting it

Because this is a r/the_donaldo safe space.

I voted for Trump and I definitely feel the need to defend and support anything he and his people do, so I get it. People put a lot into this election and are fully invested emotionally. It's hard to put all that effort in and then step back and realize that you aren't going to agree 100% with everything they do. No one is going to do everything I want and it's unreasonable to think one person will all the time.

People defending those attacks against Wikileaks are either very gullible to believe that after a change of cabinet you should blindly trust the government, or really more interested on superficial controversies to win against democrats or liberals, rather than really concerned about the current state of freedom, democracy and free speech.

The only problem with Wikileaks is that the worst and more urgent things for the people to know aren't published right now.

People can support their politician of choice all they want, I don't give a fuck.

What really rustles my jimmies is how people expect others to blindly defend and trust their president on an anti government conspiracy subreddit.

This place can't be a safe space forever, and we can only repost the same anti Hillary/Obama articles so many times before going insane. At some point we'll have to critique our current president, but that's not gonna happen when The_Donald lurks /new and downvotes any Trump conspiracy that paints our government/president in a bad light.

Seriously, I haven't seen a single anti Trump post Since this one was removed by the mods within the first few hours, and this was months ago

This pro Trump bias needs to stop, take that shit to the echochamber that is The_Donald if you can't critique your own president on an anti government sub.

We should be praising these people who expose corrupt government. Not condem them. You can tell who is a real patriot by how they react to these leaks. Whether left or right. If you are against truth and would rather attack the messenger, then you're part of the problem.

Who in here is defending him?

Wikileaks showed Americans that there were maggots and rat droppings in the sausage that is the DNC, and the truth is uncomfortable.

Because most of the sub is russians

You're in r/conspiracy. This sub shits on the establishment and they see Trump as part of that. If you don't think criticizing politicians and import figures is part of this sub, you're in for a rough time. Sure, the last 8 years was shitting on Obama but that's because he was in power. Most of the people in this sub don't look to one party or the other for salvation, as they see them as two arms of the same body. After this past election though, there has been a serious influx of Trump supporters (which there is nothing wrong with) but they can't handle the spirit of this sub which is to question everything.

So yah, if you are annoyed with posts in R/CONSPIRACY criticizing the president (who I'm assuming you voted for), you might want to leave or at least provide constructive criticism about why you find the opinion of the original poster to be incorrect.

But, it gets really annoying when these anti-Trump people make posts like we all have the wool over our eyes because we voted for Trump instead of Clinton.

Who the fuck here is arguing that Clinton was a good choice either? Saying shit like this is a red fucking herring. You're not a fool for voting Trump over Clinton. You're fool for voting for either of them and thinking it was a better choice.

What's even worse, you come here defending him at all costs, trying to muddy the waters for any real discussion.

Thanks for the sources. Looks like they didn't do it though. That's still not a indication that Clinton was going to start a war with Russia.

I'm just pulling your leg. It is very true that Russia has always been demonized. Remember all those Arnold action movies and alike, where they had the evil Russians all the time lol. Sure there might have been a hint of truth in there but it was always probably overexerted not only make the movie more fun, but to do exactly what we are discussing; to demonize. It's been put out, ingrained in us.

However, since (the?) Ukraine and Syria, things have escalated to another level between Russia and US, especially in the info war area and financial sector through sanctions and other intimidation methods. Now the media says the sanctions were deserved but when one looks at the whole picture, it paints something different than what the media has been painting for us.

However, it then it started to spill into deaths. Basically on the brink of a real war between USA and America. In Ukraine in a was a proxy war but in Syria, BOTH Russians and Americans were present, so any small move or mistake could have triggered something major. And considering the tensions and what was at stake for US (pipeline domination and a shitload of investments into moderate revels for) it didn't seem they would be too forgiving. Neither would Russia. But neither seemed to have been willing to back down. I was genuinely scared shitless of our future under Clinton. She is insane. Trump acts insane, that's the difference. She is a war criminal with nothing stopping her, as in regard for human life. If she could get away with it, she would do it. And she was able to get away with a lot unfortunately. A lot believe US was trying to provoke Russia in order to remain in power, because should a war had started, there would be a state of emergency or whatever it's called when the country is under war, which meant no elections, no leaks, more money, more control.

In my opinion, these world leaders are like pure gangsters. Putin is trying to overtake the arms sale in the world by stealing markets, and US is struggling with their sales to the terrorists since their plan wasn't going to shit they needed a bigger war to keep the money machine going.

Those who were following the war news closely from the start, every damn day, from a non-MSM narrative, doing their own research and digging, know the dangers and intentions of the elite, which Clinton would have been happily a puppet for and on board with their plans. That is if she would have been it through her health even. It seemed her health wasn't even going to keep her stable for long enough. A lot of people felt she was only there as a prop to remain power, and then all the moves would have been made by her controllers, whether she was still in power or one of their next puppets if she had to go because of health. The point is, the keys would have been handed to people who USED ISIS to their advantage. It wouldn't even surprise me anymore if they were even behind its creation.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/jul/2/donald-trump-edward-snowden-kill-traitor/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_5uYQgrm0k

“You know, spies in the old days used to be executed,” Trump said. “This guy is becoming a hero in some circles... This guy’s a bad guy and, you know, there’s still a thing called execution."

Lmao what? The DNC emails were hacked and then leaked, you can pressume the same happened to the CIA. You do realize that for leaks to happen people need to be hacked right?? Do you seriously believe Podesta released all his emails lmao.

But nice try at blatantly ignoring every point and then picking apart the most miniscule of details. Classic move from a The_Don cult member

Again you misrepresent my arguments, it's almost like you do that purposefully 🤔🤔. Podesta emails were hacks (although hacks that literally anyone could pull off). DNC emails were not hacks, they were leaked by an insider.

You have the wool over your eyes because you voted for that orange clown instead of a third party or nobody