Shill

;)

Well, I happen to know for certainty though personal experience that many of your 'taking it too fars' are the precise truth. ET life is here, and people are having direct contact right now. Ancient ET interaction is fact, hidden advanced tech is as well... I could go on but those are some pretty big ones to consider. Disclosure is coming very soon.

Manipulation is all-encompassing and HAS been happening for about 26,000 years to be exact. It is so pervasive that everyone assumes these are just facts of our existence.

If you really want to know what is true you have to start without preconceived notions about what is possible. The grand conspiracy of our existence is so big that you have to throw most common assumptions out the window.

There is no proof good enough for those who don't have an open mind. And if you do set your intent on finding truth, then you will, and you will know it when you find it.

Disclosure is coinciding with an evolution in human consciousness, which is happening worldwide. This is why everything seems so crazy and polarized right now. People are waking up, but many are still confused about the big truths... The Schumann resonance is the frequency of the earth, which is also rising with all life on earth. Soon, when everything is vibrating within 5th Density, the Pleiadians will be the first to reveal themselves to humanity. The only reason why this hasn't happened yet is because of our fear.

This is a free will reality, and we have to CHOOSE to take the next step.

Ok such as what? Where, show me somethinf

There is no proof good enough for those who don't have an open mind

Lol that's the same thing religious nuts say.

"You don't believe because you're not open enough to the idea! Never mind the fact that I have no evidence..."

Why don't you present what proof you have and let us decide for ourselves.

There is no proof good enough for those who don't have an open mind.

The game is over. I'm sorry to say, you didn't win.

If there isn't proof that's strong enough for a "closed" mind, AKA a skeptic, then it's just blind in a belief you find appealing. It's faith, not science.

Good for you man believing that. I want to but can't.

Can I just draw a parallel to what you said and religion though? Might want to have a think about that is all.

Wot?

Netflix documentary.... think it's called Men In Black.

damn that's back on netflix?

Yeah, well thought out thread but some in the "too far" category made me say hold up hold up hold up.

I hate when people claim aliens built some of the ancient wonders (not saying its what you're implying, just saying) humans are or were depending on your opinions brilliant engineers and designers, plus the didn't have the distractions we had today, not to mention slaves. Anything is possible with time and man power.

Except for the fact that even with today's technology, we could never recreate the Pyramids of Gizeh, let alone do so with the materials they used.

Of course we could - that's preposterous, it would just be insanely expensive and not worth it.

If you want to look at modern "legacy building" by the powerful, check out Elon's desire to retire on Mars.

Preposterous? Are you aware of the mathematics and "watchmaker's precision" that went into the placement of the stones (which came from a source several miles away), the perfect cuts of the stones (of which you couldn't even stick a blade between), and size ratios of the pyramid? It's far more than simply a bunch of blocks stacked together. Even if it were possible using today's tools and technology and knowledge, which did not exist back then, it would be a VERY challenging task.

In my undergrad I took a bunch of classes in anthro, archaeology, and the like - I really enjoy the topic and while it's not what I do, I'd like to think I'm pretty well read on the topic. Ancient construction techniques are amazing, but not impossible to understand, nor are they all that "remarkable" when you think about the vast amounts of time and manpower it took to complete them. The idea that we couldn't do it today is absurd. Not only could we build the Great Pyramid of Giza today, but I imagine if we put our minds to it we could build it to tighter tolerances, taller, and substantially quicker.

I'mma just leave this here: http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/ancient-egypt-great-pyramid-giza-lopsided-thanks-building-error-1566681

Beyond that, I imagine we could build it so that it could last longer, or better yet, if we were willing to put our whole society (as the Egyptians were) behind it's construction, I imagine we could build it on the moon. Humans are badass - don't sell us short.

Have you ever heard of a lever?

This is laughably false. There are guys mimicking Egyptian pyramid building methods in their backyards.

That's false information spread by the "Ancient Aliens" crowd, spearheaded by Zacharia Sitchin. We could if we really wanted to rebuild the pyramids, but you're right, we wouldn't be able to do it all modern tech. The Egyptians built it in an upward spiral fashion moving from the outside to the inside, using a tunnel and greased up roller system which was discovered recently in 2015 IIRC?

Also their pulleys and rollers system was so effective each block in the pyramid could be moved moved by 144 men (they moved them with more men, but it could have been done by less). All their timber was Cedar tree's imported from Lebanon, and the stones quarried from about half a mile away.

In my personal opinion the Pyramids of Giza are the greatest accomplishments of both engineering, design and human strength in recorded history, don't detract from that by spouting unfounded rumours.

This link will provide you with more examples of engineering marvels thoughout the ages.

You think Zacharia Sitchin spreads false information? Do you have anything to back up this claim?

That link to the video I put up is full of Sitchins lies.

This link is where he's directly and intentionally mistranslated information on the nephilim. The ancient Hebrews were notorious for their meticulous record keeping, they wouldn't make a mistake like he's claiming they would.

Here is where he's intentionally falsely interperated Sumarian (a language which left it's own dictionary, so we know he's full of shit.)

I could do this all day, the guy is a fraud and huckster. His arguments don't hold water, he's on the same level as David Wilcock as far as nutters are concerned.

David Wilcock and Corey Goode stuff? Because they are a bit loopy IMO.

Thank god someone agrees that those dudes are nuts!

Wilcock I like. I don't agree with everything he says but he seems genuine and has some of it right imo.

Goode, I'm not so sold on.

I used to check out his stuff on AA, then I saw some of his recent presentations. Holy fuckballs!

How do we know that you aren't a CIA disinfo agent, posting here to distract us from an even greater conspiracy?

I hate this ancient ET bullshit, it assumes ancient people were dumb and is a weird "casual racism" of low expectations.

Aliens didn't chill in Egypt - the Egyptians were just really fucking smart.

Although through use of psychoactive substances they may well have gained access to knowledge of the afterlife not currently understood by many on this earth.

Wut? Source for that? And...also, what? That's kind of a non sequitur, no?

I mean, I don't doubt that the Pharaohs indulged in all sorts of drugs - they're powerful people, but "may well have gained access to knowledge of the afterlife not currently understood by many on this earth" seems like a bit of a stretch. How does that relate to the casual racism of "they couldn't build that - they weren't smart enough" point that I was trying to illustrate?

If disclosure doesn't come in the next 2 years would you accept you are wrong about alien life or would you keep thinking "soon".

I disagreed with a few details but it was still worth an upvote.

a lot of 'taking it too far' is people false flagging and hate hoaxing to discredit the truth seekers.

"The Jews did 9/11"

Rabbi, please.

you did a bang up job. i'm always trying to argue the exact points that you outlined, and i come off as someone who drank the mainstream koolaid.

there can be wrongdoing or corruption without needing to involve the reptillians or satanic rituals.

There is evidence to back up some of the "Taking it too far" points above.

I think we have to be very careful of making generalizations, "The truth always lies in the middle" is still a generalization.

Every subject needs to be researched on it's own in as much detail as possible

If you can prove it then prove it or cite sources where it's proven. People saying shit like that bothers me, happens so much on here.

Precisely! Generalizations like the ones the OP make are just as bad as "All conspiracies are true" or "All conspiracies are false" type thinking

Yeah man, people need to learn up votes are for high effort content. Down voting things you disagree with (into oblivion at least) also buries the responses that correct false info

I think the "taking it too far" points should be read as "less likely but still possible". For example, the Saturn Moon Matrix theory is MESSED UP and sort of possibly makes sense and sounds like the holy grail of conspiracies due to its wide scope. I don't see enough proof to believe in it 100% but if it's true, then David Icke wasn't bullshitting about reptillians.....shiiiiiit.

I mean damn....what's that hexagon/hexagram/whatever on top of Saturn???? Is Saturn the only planet with a damn hexagon on the top? This theory (if true) might explain why the elites are satanic ass kissing idiots. If you thought a global corporate banker cabal was messed up, a solar system reptillian cabal is even worse. I don't believe in it yet but I'm still entertaining the idea just in case. It may be the ultimate red pill....even though we should also focus on worldly affairs too. It's of course possible that this theory is just disinfo, but it's best to keep all plausible theories on the table until more evidence proves/disproves it.

Take a look at some interesting fluid mechanics and geometric reasons for why that could be, it is just a swirling ball of gas in the end

http://www.space.com/30608-mysterious-saturn-hexagon-explained.html

I'm under the belief that the majority of 'ridiculous' conspiracy theories are invented as a hobby by a diverse group of people who are looking to entertain themselves.

I myself made up an elaborate multi-level conspiracy to entertain a group of friends for a roleplaying game. Obviously I didn't post it onto the internet where it would be confused for being proposed as how the world actually works but I could total relate to someone who does

Well I'm not sure the majority of the "out there" theories are people spreading fiction for fun, that seems like a pretty low life thing to do lol. It's probably more likely that some of the crazier stuff were baseless or weaker theories that some people assumed were fact and spread like that. Just as how religion (which has at least some falsehoods/misleading information if not mostly lies) was assumed (believed) to be the true words of the creator...

But we won't know if this theory is complete BS to take the zionist globalists off the hook morally (hence "THE DEVIL MADE ME DO IT!" bullshit) or if there is some truth to this odd phenomenon. I do think that just because there's a vague physical explanation, doesn't mean there isn't more to the phenomenon.

E.g. "the illuminati triangle is JUST branding, nothing significantly more" which is probably not true, I think there's more to it than that. The geometry aspect may not just be random physics. Another example: "9/11 can be explained by explosives planted by the elite, nothing satanic about that! Just human scum, that's all."

But the satanic link runs quite deep, it's difficult to believe the satanic shit is random, a popular baseless religion among (relatively educated) elites or that they're all psychotic by chance. I think in this case, the smoke leads to the fire.

I might be wrong, but I think it would be unwise to stop at this point, and instead consider it a possibility until evidence proves or refutes major components in the theory. Disinfo is still a possibility but we can't assume that so quickly.

I don't think you are going far enough on a few of them and you may want to inform yourself a bit more.

Also, left off a few big ones... JFK?? MLK?? Pedogate?? Russia rigging the election??????????

You created post called "Which conspiracies are true..." and left off JFK... all I'm saying.

I know Russia didn't rig election. The CONINTEL program to generate that story is a true conspiracy.

Yeah, but to be fair, all anyone knows about JFK is that he was killed. From there it goes in too many directions to cover the more outlandish theories. The truth on that one is most likely that no one will ever know, because those who do are dead or will never talk.

Going to far on JFK, Challenge accepted! Remote controlled bullets that can change trajectory mid flight TWICE.

Also too far: the driver delivered the fatal shot.

Stop trying to get credit by association for Pedogate by throwing it in with real shit like JFK.

they released emails by the democrats, where the democrats were rigging the election

You have proof they did this? I'm more likely to believe that our own intelligence agencies leaked the info considering it's heavily redacted on the more important bits. Unless, the Russians also wanted to blank out a bunch of the names?!?

Shit you're right. Brain fart. I am thinking about the FBI documents. Those were so fucked with redaction.

It was pretty clear that the democrats got caught rigging things, they even fired several people due to getting caught

I am not questioning that part. I am just more weary about going down the path claiming that Russia released e-mails. We still don't know what is the source for WL nor how many people the leaks came from. It can possibly be Russia

, but phrasing this as "Russia rigged the election" is just downright newspeak

I agree with that statement. It's just so the goyim can voice their "opinion" in small understandable soundbites that don't need an explanation. It takes so much time to clue someone into this whole thing step by step.

So you have any information showing that the Russia story isn't just made up?

the moon landing? flat earth? hollow earth?

The real conspiracy is that Russia uses this subreddit as propaganda for Americans and Russians alike.

The dogs talk to each other. Sometimes I wonder what we'd hear if we could speak their language.

ruff ruff din dins ruff ruff walkies ruff ruff back off ruff ruff come here ruff ruff sleepy time

repeat...

For what, to change the minds of 445,000 people? i live in a city (relatively small) that has more people than this. I highly doubt using a conspiracy subreddit for propaganda is an efficient way to spread misinformation. It seems to me that too many people here think that every single post that doesn't bode well with the majority of subscribers is instantly labeled as shilling, when in reality, it's probably just people with differing opinions. Trying to change the minds of only 500,000 out of 7,000,000,000 by using a fringe subreddit just sounds ridiculous to me.

I'm not denying that this happens, I'm just saying this isn't a "shill battleground" and if there's 4,000,000 million people viewing this then it would take a hell of a lot more than a few shills to change the narrative.

I read the link you sent, thanks. I've already known about that and I think we all know it's nothing new. My point is if there's theoretically 20,000,000 people looking at shit on Reddit, how many "shills" would it take to change the narrative?

Versus several million, posting 24/7, over several years?

Its a trick question. The answer is 20,000,000. 1 to change the narrative and runaway and 19,999,999 to accuse each other of being "Shilletist Scum"

They aren't here to shape public opinion. They have the rest of Reddit for that. They are here to discredit this sub.

Nice segue... /S

By the way... DAE TRUMP??

Then why is there always some anti-Russia shit on the front page? Seems more likely that the US government is the one using it for propaganda.

Yeah talking about this subreddit specifically. There's always front page news about the bad stuff Russia does because Russia does a lot of bad stuff. The US does too, and that makes it to the front page constantly as well.

It's good to see your content springing up again, Magnora. Keep fighting the good fight.

Really? People seem more aware than ever for me. However, the chess pieces of the elite have been moved into very strong positions while we sleepwalked so it does feel as if the battle is already lost in some way.

There's always brigading going on here at some level....

That said, I think there's plausibility to nearly every one of your "taking it too far" examples. The reason is something called "The Big Lie." It's something of a maxim.

The concept of the big lie is that the worse crime you commit, the more people are unwilling to believe it, even when provided evidence. The reason for this is because people instinctively want to live in the security that they understand the world around them. Every one of us tries... To a point... To reach our version of what the world is. And once we reach that, we form incredibly strong biases against anything that shakes that foundation.

Any institution of power knows this... It's why it's so easy for the American people to demonize Trump for his villiany, but it was impossible to get the same people to acknowledge Clinton's. The only difference between Trump and Clinton is he doesn't pretend to be a good guy. All the Clinton's have to do is pretend, and no matter what they do or how much proof, people are unwilling to believe a politician can be so different from how they represent themselves. And even those who think they buy into the criticism will criticize policy, but will refuse to believe that the dem primary could have been tampered with, or that the continued foundation never actually provided any aid...

A perfect example is going on right now in another thread... An American university is implicated in medically experimenting on Hondurans without their consent, and top comments link a score of other cases of human experimentation by our own governments... Not conspiracy theories, but accepted history. Yet to suggest that such history is being repeated today would be met with absolute rejection. Big food and big pharma have nothing to fear, because the average American would rather suffer an invisible poison than admit they live in a world where their institutions could harm them.

Now... If you're a secret government agency, or a multi billionaire family dynasty, or a multinational mega corp... What's stopping you from going from one extreme to the next? The further out you go, the less likely there are to be consequences.

The insane part is to think we can try to prove anything in this thread. First of all there's no such thing as absolute proof, even of our own existence. We're always dealing in probabilities. If this then that. If not A, B, or C, then surely D, E, or F. All of the cases above in OP's description deal in such possibilities, and have degrees of rationality. It is in those degrees and what they say that gives our questions value. Not in binary "true or false" fallacies.

And the disbelief of the more extreme theories is rooted in another social phenomenon: our tendency to answer to the extreme. It's easy to confront the most irrational feminist on Tumblr, and think that you're learning something about feminism. You're not. You're learning about how feminism manifests in assholes. This is why 99% of scientific responses to the anti-vax movement pick those who don't understand the science of the studies that were done to boater their claims, and speak from an accusational, emotional perspective rather than a rational one.

The same thing happens here. Extreme theories take extreme documentation, and complex relationships of data and premises. The average commenter here is more focused on their emotional reaction to getting fooled by the system than interested in understanding the proofs of the claims to the point where they can communicate them effectively. They want the catharsis of camaraderie within the loneliness of having a worldview alien to that of your peers. They want to be agreed with. They want a worldview to lock onto so they too can stop questioning and find an ontological footing that is stable. So in reading what they do, they believe it, and start sorting the people around them into those who "get it" and those who don't. It's quite understandable from a psychological perspective, but it makes for extremely poor argument.

What this leaves us with is akin to a bunch of undergrads contemporary with Isaac Newton becoming his greatest fans. They boast about calculus to their friends and passers-by, who conclude from their ramblings that calculus is pure nonsense.

And that's where we leave ourselves here. If you want to decide on a binary "truth" and be done with it, then you'll be busy forever sorting those around you into those who get it and those who don't. The things that are true and the things we can write off categorically. But if instead you look at the strengths of premises... And start asking "if blank then blank" statements, then the world will rapidly become much more nuanced and complex. And truths go from being right or wrong, and sane or crazy, to likely or not likely, or "is my life enriched or can I enrich the lives of others by seeking the parameters of truth on this issue, or are my energies better devoted elsewhere?"

My favorite example of a person who exemplifies this kind of thinking is ufologist Richard Dolan His interest, and his scholarship, start with basic, plainly demonstrable ideas and move on from there with the degrees of proof or conjecture contextualized along the way.

Excellent comment....Although towards the end I could no longer understand what you were trying to say haha

r/iamverysmart

Rule 5

Well written and a pleasure to read.

underrated comment saved for future reference

Holy rationality, on the internet of all places! AAA+ comment.

Wow, you should turn this into a full on post. More people need to see this and I'm sure it will stir up some great discussions. Great job!

There's always brigading going on here at some level....

That said, I think there's plausibility to nearly every one of your "taking it too far" examples.

[...]

Nice try Trump brigade.

This may be the best, most even-keeled post I've seen on this sub.

It's just more gatekeeping bullshit. Who is he to say what is 'too far' or even what is definitively true, never citing any evidence either way for anything?

I'll just leave your opinion right where it is.

Exactly. Take 911 - To believe actual planes where involved. That is taking it to far. There is no way in hell an airliner could have crashed the way it did and that the entire wreckage stayed in the building (apart from the alleged engine and landing gear). But this is what they want us to believe and that is why all this gatekeeping is going on. And it stupid BTW. It makes it easier to get to the actual truth. If something is heavily opposed despite it makes sense, then its probably true

septemberclues.info

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Thanks :) Don't know, but I do know I've been a guy incapable of grasping physical anomalies for the better part of my life, but 911 finally woke me up, and quite a bunch of others it seems. You fucked up bad with this one dear tptb :)

And if you wake up and don't get fooled by all the disinfo and conspiracy candy they put out the it's not that hard to figure out the other Big lies - Space travel, Nukes, Medicine etc

r/fakeology

Why are space travel, nukes and medicine big lies?

Look into it http://cluesforum.info and at my subreddit r/fakeology

911 is the entrance to the rabbit hole. Total media fakery has been going on the entire 20th century. The purpose? To keep us in place and in relative poverty.

That website looks exactly the way I expected it to look. Created by a schizophrenic.

much of this is just vague platitudes with no evidence...

Thank you so much for this.

I've felt alone on this sub for awhile and it's refreshing to know that there are other conspiracy theorists that exercise skepticism.

Stop whining about downvotes.

Dude its 86% upvoted with 500 votes. Thats only 70 downvotes (roughly).

You said it yourself, 4 people downvoted it. Thats all. There are a large number of people in this sub which disagree with what you said, they aren't shills for downvoting.

You're reading way too much into it. Check out /r/leagueoflegends, every new post is at 0 points 50% upvoted. Or /r/dankmemes. Thats just the way reddit works for big subreddits, no matter what the content is.

One might even say he's "taking it too far".

A lot of people come here from T_D where it's sub policy to pay attention to upvote % and keep it above like 80. Really transparent when they come here and expect the same thing. There's no mandate to agree with you OP stop whining about downvotes!

Oh shit, it's another conspiracy

You're 100% spot on.

Some people were trying to keep it from getting to the main page.

And a LOT of those downvotes are from other conspiracy people trying to get their stories out.

Your post would have to contain information in order for that to apply.

I mean it's literally a post about conspiracies to r/conspiracy

You're asking people to tell you what to believe.

You made a number of claims - Perhaps some people don't like what you said and decided to downvote?

Doesn't mean there's some agency trying to shut you down.

Given your post is now 86% upvoted, doesn't that disprove your claim?

Or the people manipulating reddit really don't have very much power if your post is still allowed to get to the front page with 86%

But I got too many upvotes too quick, and got out of the new tab, so they weren't able to keep me down.

If a few quick upvotes is all it takes to break 'their' hold, then they're not very good at manipulating discussion.

How do you distinguish between a manipulation and just users voting as they see fit?

Why do the voting patterns change so drastically between the new tab and the main page?

Because when your post is fresh, a single downvote can bring it down to 50%. The more votes, the less of an impact each individual vote has.

Why am I hated in the new tab, but loved on the main page?

That's a silly question. If your post reaches the front page then it's already been upvoted and seen as good.

Does that not imply some sort of desire to manipulate the main page against the wishes of the community?

No.

Seems another conspiracy theory has gone too far... off the cliff!

I'm sure a lot of people who browse the new tab do it because they want to be kind of like a pseudo moderator/curator. In other words, they have higher standards than the average user, and therefore are more likely to downvote things.

True: People clearly are trying to manipulate reddit, it's well documented

Taking it too far: If a post gets downvotes, there is a coordinated effort to prevent that specific post from getting on the front page.

A well balanced post.

A well balanced post.

Well you didn't provide sources to back up anything you said so maybe that's why you are down voted

You're taking it too far, man. Why would someone be trying to censor your post?

Nice example of "taking it too far".

"They" are trying to bury it...uh huh...a mysterious "they" that is all powerful and monitoring individual reddit posts that advise people to approach conspiracy theories in a logical manner. Right.

"They are downvoting this! 4 downvotes of a perfect and reasonable post in 10 minutes that noone could possibly disagree with!" Riiiight. It couldnt possibly have anything to do with the vote fuzzing algorithm that has been in effect since reddits inception OR because many redditors spend their time in /r/new voting on posts they find interesting or disinteresting regardless of what sub its in.

You do understand the above right? That downvotes happen automatically per the reddit source code that is freely available online https://github.com/reddit/reddit and its always, very transparently been this way? Or that manual downvotes by actual people can happen in any number of ways and doesnt in any way mean that downvotes came from the subreddit members? It could have come from people looking at new posts in /r/new and those people might not even be members of the conspiracy subreddit?

Mossad absolutely had a hand in 9/11. This is just a continuation of the ancient semitic war on the rest of the world. They can't win as humans because they're fundamentally a foreign, satanic presence to the world of men.

I don't know why any legitimate user of this sub would downvote this

Because it's fucking retarded?

I'm late cuz now your at the top of tnt front page. But some of your taking it to fars are laughable and no one thinks that way.

I like most of what you're putting down but you put the nix on a lot of cool conspiracy theories, like Archons. Maybe that is the cause of some of your down votes. Looks like plenty of people dig it though. I agree with a large percentage of what you're saying. Lizard Demons though, read up on them.

People will downvote any thread that leaves an opportunity to say pizzagate is bullshit. Pizzagate is 100% bullshit, and so now it's time for myself to get downvoted.

I agree with most of your post, right up to the point where you discuss 'aliens'. Based on how the world operates, the witnesses/historic sighting​s, ruling class that never seems to change, and age and size of our galaxy compared to the Earth and human history is it really a step too far to conclude 'our' planet is under non-human management? Personally, I think it's the only logical, reasonable conclusion.

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With the thousands of excellent arguments out there that disprove the spinning ball nonsense, you are claiming that the Earth is a spinning ball because of the flight from Argentina to Australia? That proves nothing. If, the earth was a spinning ball, the evidence and facts would be so overwhelming there wouldn't be a "Flat Earth Theory" discussion. Flat Earthers would look like idiots. But they don't. They are looking better and better everyday.

I don't know what exactly we live on, but it sure as Hell isn't a spinning ball.

Have you researched the Flat Earthers' arguments?

I think I've recently come to understand the "why" of flat earthers not the what.

I think flat earth is the mainstream expression that the reality we live in is not real. Which is true. this is just the sound byte version of that idea.

Why don't you give us the best most incontrovertible argument that shows we don't live on a spinning ball? Also might I suggest you look into visiting an observatory at some point?

I just don't understand what would be the point of hiding the fact that the Earth is flat.

Two people watching the sunset one on top of a skyscraper one at the bottom of the building. Who will see the sunset first?

Can I ask what your job is that involves the shape of the earth?

True - Global child trafficking ring

Taking it too far - Hilary Clinton personally runs a child sex ring in the basement of CPP

Which is why the term Pizzagate has hurt more than helped

And the title 'pedogate' is too broad to be credible. When people talk about Watergate, it is in reference to the mischief of the Nixon administration, not all political wrongdoing since the dawn of time.

The term "pizzagate" originally had nothing to do with CPP.

What was the context? I saw a video from 2011 of Trump saying pizzagate.

I saw that, too. It had to do with Trump eating pizza with silverware or something like that. The filthy brute!

To me, the latest pizza gate is about the strange emails. People started searching for pizza related keywords which led them to CPP emails to Podesta.

Yeah, it made me laugh since that whole Pence/Trump time machine shitpost. He was talking about Wienergate and it sounded like he said pizzagate as well.

and cooks them as an offering to Moloch/Baal/Satan/Beelzebub/InsertBadSoundingArchaicNameHere

Oh, I know that one. It is actually Lucifer, and I believe they eat them raw.

https://youtu.be/gVDIYFSygLg

Baal dont care, he just wants the worldstone

Diablo 2 ftw

"My brothers will not have died in vain!"

This guy Diablos

Matter of fact I follow every Blizzard game but sc - mainly because I suck at it

Wtf. You forget kek

topkek

Saying Hillary personally runs anything is taking it too far. Things are decompartmentalized. So the top doesn't actually know the specifics of the operation.

Things are decompartmentalized. So the top doesn't actually know the specifics of the operation.

So then compartmentalized.

Sry thanks.

lol, no reason to apologise, everyone typoes, I'm just playing around. :)

She's clearly too incompetent to do anything

she didn't get to where she is without being smart

Or a puppet that is easy to control.

Taking it too far: pizzagate

The entire thing is based on a trolling 4chan post where someone just decided that words have second meanings, from there it was a ton of work to try to make normal things fit this insane conspiracy

I'm still wondering how Obama spent $65,000 on pizza and hot dogs though.

Can't tell if serious... catering for large orgs is extremely expensive. That's not suspicious at all.

It is when the white house has their own chef.

Flying in hotdogs to DC from Chicago would be fucking retarded.

Uh, no? It was from a place they like in Chicago... Where they're from.

Logic. It's not magic.

While I think flying in hot dogs and pizza to eat at the White House is strange and at the very least a little suspicious (in my opinion), the bigger issue I have is with something else in that same email chain.

I'm not asking this for a debate, or anything. I'm just curious what you think of the reply in regards to the hot dog/pizza party:

If we get the same "waitresses," I'm all for it!!!

Aaric S. Eisenstein

STRATFOR

Since you don't find the email suspicious, what is your opinion/speculation about the word waitresses being in quotes?

I don't think it's wrong to say that in general, among English speaking people at least, when a single word has quotations like that it's implied that there is/could be another meaning besides what we usually associate the word with, if that makes any sense at all.

I apologize if I'm not being entirely clear here, but if i came across something like that anywhere I would assume that the person does not mean actual waitresses. Do you agree with that, and if so what do you think "waitresses" could be referring to in this instance?

Well to start it just comes from some dude not associated with Obama saying "I think Obama spent about $65k flying in hot dogs"

If I include in an email chain that I think pilgrimboy spent about $100k buying anime do we need to wonder how you spent that much money on anime?

And then add, "We're going to use the same source."

You're welcome to provide evidence that Obama spent $65k on hot dogs

This was an email chain at Stratfor literally about having a Chicago hot dog Friday to celebrate "all you hot dogs out there." It's a work event based on a silly pun, which is pretty normal, he'll I have a "popcorn popup" meeting at 2:00 today. Fred Burton replied joking that they should use the same source as Obama.

None of this has anything to do with trafficking children.

Because why not spend $65k on hotdogs for 100 people.

So you expect someone without subpoena powers, warrants, etc. to be able to provide evidence?

What you are saying then is that anyone can make a claim and you should assume it's true.

So if I jokingly say that my penis is literally a rocket ship that flies around at night you should believe it as true fact because you can't subpoena me.

Pizzagate doesn't make sense, it relies on trying to fit innocuous normal things taken out of context into a conspiracy created out of a 4chan troll post

I don't claim anything. I think there is enough there to investigate. I'm pretty sure if I had done the Instagram stuff Alefantis did, I would be investigated.

And personally, whether it was $65,000 just for real pizza and hot dogs, that should be investigated. I just don't think that sort of money should be spent by our government. However, now we have Trump in Mar-a-lago every weekend probably spending that much. Our system is broken.

The $65k isn't a real number though, it was a joke

Okay. How do you know that?

Because I read the email where it came from

And they said it was a joke?

And fly in the same "waitresses"

No. It's in the leaked email correspondence and it's a confirmation of what occurred.
I believe it was a fund-raiser event and they made $65k not spent it.

No, it's in a Stratfor email joking about Obama and getting hot dogs for Stratford party friday.

Would I play dominoes better on pasta or cheese?

yeah that james alefantis instagram with all its imagery is just edgy stuff bro. By the way the shooter that was also an actor that shot the one bullet in comet ping pong, hit his computer hard drive through a door. Muh coincidence.

Hilary Clinton personally runs a child sex ring in the basement of Comet Ping Pong

I dont think anyone has said that?

Although she is very involved in drug Trafficking, child trafficking and quite possibly also involved into organ harvesting in haiti

I dont think anyone has said that?

I don't know if anyone ever has, but that's the strawman that the corporate media uses to "debunk" pizzagate.

My shitlib friend describes pizzagate as exactly this.

That's actually helpful in a way though. Because then you just say that you don't believe that either. Lending some credibility.

Sort of. But then if I add a "but" you can see his nose screw up, and his eyes get ready to roll

How did this garbage get most upvoted? Shill bots or just plain dolts?

Russians, the upvoters are sitting in a room in Moscow trying to undermine democracy.

i wonder if some of them looked at the evidence and then came to their own conclusion. Naw probably all idiots and russians. Cool story.

Hillary can't run anything lol, she's just, well was, a convenient face of the people who were pulling her strings easily.

That said, she is certainly aware of the sick goings on with many of the people she knows, possibly her husband, and it's more of a don't ask don't tell type of policy with elites even though everyone knows what everyone is up to as far as gay sex parties, hardcore drugs, kids, etc. Everyone has their vices, some have all of them.

Most people fail to understand the root of it is that these people are nihilists, there is no good or evil to them, no karma. What they do is for their own enjoyment and advancement while they are here, ending a life or abusing a life means nothing to them in the grand scheme of things, we all die eventually, it's all for nothing, the universe doesn't care, reality isn't real, this is what they actually believe, rituals and mystical shit are just theater for fun.

I think she believes she is a mastermind which is why we have all these mistakes she makes. TPTB are smarter than talking in emails about illegal things or talking smack about other politicians on official channels. Obama knew this and used an alias with her. He wasn't signing his name to anything in her illegal and wide open private servers and certainly not talking even in code about pedogate or drone bombing Assange (to be fair she did that over several meetings in the White House).

No, what makes me worry that Trump is playing antiestablishment is that she had dug herself a huge pit full of shit and would have drowned in it if they didn't have almost all if MSM and Comey and DOJ and Obama even bailing it out almost as fast as she piled it in on herself.

She is reckless to the extreme and her pride and absolute disdain and disregard for anyone else even her so called peers made her a huge liability. I have no doubt in my mind that she bungled Benghazi and they had to scramble go cover for her using her terrible lie about a spontaneous protest.

If I were, God forbid, an evil master elite running the world Hillary Clinton would be the last person I'd trust as POTUS. She would start droning everyone who criticized her and had any proof of her bad dealings. She'd probably nuke Russia just because Putin irked her and she has wanted revenge for years.

Whatever her illness is, probably that brain rot from cannibalism, she would be a huge risk of exposure for everyone in the lofty positions.

Unless either way we were supposed to protest and escalate and start riots so the president could slam down martial law.

The only people who said Hillary fucked little kids in the basement of a pizza shop was the Hillshills themselves, sarcastically, to try to discredit pizzagate.

good thing she is not known for projecting

Classic astroturfing comment by a shill. Nobody is saying what you're saying, stop trying to detract from the whole thing with your stupid comments.

She doesn't run it but she's related to it one way or another.

Judging by her performance at the 9/11 memorial I'd bet the farm Hillary can't run at all.

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I think this entire statement is "taking it too far."

Conspiracy theorists are actually some of the more open-minded people I've met, and I've seen many people here say things like, "hm, maybe" or, "I'll look into what you've said, but as I see it." Trotting out the line that conspiracy theorists are narrow-minded and judgmental is as tired of a stereotype as vegans being PETA harpies. It just doesn't bear out.

cough cough flat earth

Eh, the Earth is flat. Its gravity just wraps it around itself.

There's 2 kinds of people in this world, those that argue to better understand and those that argue to win.

Conspiracy theorists are actually some of the more open-minded people I've met

I've yet to meet a self-described conspiracy theorist who's ever admitted they were wrong, except so that they can stop expending energy defending Conspiracy A and focus on defending Conspiracy B.

E.g. how many birthers ever admitted that not only was the "Obama is a secret Kenyan" conspiracy theory wrong, but that they'd been duped by Republicans into spreading this theory? A big fat zero, unless you count the people who said, "Ok I concede he's not a secret Kenyan...but he's definitely a secret Marxist."

Like others have said, self-described "conspiracy theorists" tend to fit a psychological profile: lonely, delusions of grandeur, overestimating their own intelligence, rejecting anything which suggests they're mistaken, rejecting anything which says they're too stupid to understand the science behind something like global warming, etc.

I believe there are lots of genuine conspiracies which have been proven to be true over the centuries. A good example is the way Big Tobacco hid the link between cigarettes and cancer for 50 years, or how Big Energy hid the link between coal/oil/gas and global warming for 50 years.

The Tuskegee experiments - actual conspiracy. Documented false flags - actual conspiracy. "Obama is a secret Kenyan Muslim Marxist" = partisan bullshit promoted by people who are too stupid to figure out they're being manipulated by political opponents of Obama.

Yes I agree that there are many bullshit conspiracy theories. But the opposite holds true too; it is possible that there are a few true ones.

Most people turn a blind eye too soon and that is the dangerous thing.

Like that time alex jones warned us the government was gonna jade helm us all into abandoned walmart based fema camps? If only we would have listened.

Dude, that actually happened though. You don't remember because the fluoride in our water, when combined when the fallout from chemtrails and the effects of measles vaccines, gives you amnesia. Al of this was directed by Obama from his secret Kenyan jungle fortress.

Time to get woke my friend. Here, take this blister pack of 36 redpills.

The obamacare death panels approved my ticket to the FEMA camps ages ago but I haven't heard back from them, I know they've got a plastic coffin with my name on it waiting for me.

What a load of horseshit

Horeshit? You are talking about (extreme) political beliefs, which are comfortable in their own way, but are hardly closer to fact than those you dismiss outright.

A real live birther in 2017, wow.

I could go into it, but honestly I don't care.

This sounds like a 3rd grader's defense.

No, I honestly never cared. Even at its height I didn't care. The American people voted Obama in. He grew up here, that's American enough for me.

And I don't feel comfortable talking the conspiracy theories about the birth certificate. I was never heavily into it. But I do think there was seriously suspicious behavior. Why did it take so many years to reveal his birth certificate? I mean for fucks sake, proving citizenship is literally in the constitution. It makes Trump's tax returns look childish in comparison.

Then when he did release it. People went to work, did their investigating and determined that is was a fake. I don't know the specific details, I forget them. And talking to you isn't worth my time.

But finally, when you prosecute someone, motive is a important component. Barrack Obama had motive.

Don't let those birth announcements in Hawaiian newspapers poke a hole in your bubble. It might let oxygen in, then where would you be?

Lol that was gay as fuck

As I mentioned above, I spoke to an old Hawaiian man who knew Obama's grandparents. They were shocked to hear he became president because they knew he wasn't born in the US.

That's all the proof we need!

there was also a lot of crossover between the obama is a secret muslim not born in the us and the "OBAMMY IS GONNA TAKE OUR GUNS!!!" crowd. and still today if you bring up that obama didnt take our guns they go into well he added this regulation or he would have if X didnt happen etc etc, but they will never admit that it didnt even happen. its so strange.

Also, it'd help if every piece of evidence wasn't thrown together in some weird 4chan collage. Take a few moments to make the connections in a clean and more professional layout. It helps.

It's an easy way to present something which appears to stupid people as multiple sources corroborating a story.

None of the people who post 4chan collages as "proof" ever mention the fact that everybody posts as "anonymous" on 4chan so there's no way to know if two posts were written by the same person...and no way to know who the original poster was.

Reminds me of the aftermath of pissgate, when some guy started spamming a poorly photoshopped 4chan collage which showed "evidence" that pissgate was a 4chan conspiracy.

Yeah, I forgot to mention the anonymous thing. Anyone can go on and say "I am a Six Sigma Blackbelt FBI Ninja, with direct access to intel on the president" and make up bullshit claims, like "Trump wears a pink cotton sock over his dong that was sourced from llama slave labor".

And suddenly it is posted here. Have some self-respect. It may be hard to get super reputable sources, but do your own research and digging. Look at those kids that exposed their principal for having fake degrees. They dug around, made calls, researched (not the Youtube kind). They didn't just post memes to 4chan and make collages.

self-described "conspiracy theorists" tend to fit a psychological profile: lonely, delusions of grandeur, overestimating their own intelligence, rejecting anything which suggests they're mistaken, overestimating their own powers of perception, inconsistent burdens of proof on dissenting evidence, and a total inability to think critically.

I think this is normal for 50+ percent of people.

This is why propaganda is so effective. Why shouldn't "stupid" people have their say?

self-described "conspiracy theorists" tend to fit a psychological profile: lonely, delusions of grandeur, overestimating their own intelligence, rejecting anything which suggests they're mistaken, overestimating their own powers of perception, inconsistent burdens of proof on dissenting evidence, and a total inability to think critically.

I think this is normal for 50+ percent of people.

This is why propaganda is so effective. Why shouldn't "stupid" people have their say?

self-described "conspiracy theorists" tend to fit a psychological profile: lonely, delusions of grandeur, overestimating their own intelligence, rejecting anything which suggests they're mistaken, overestimating their own powers of perception, inconsistent burdens of proof on dissenting evidence, and a total inability to think critically.

I think this is normal for 50+ percent of people.

This is why propaganda is so effective. Why shouldn't "stupid" people have their say?

self-described "conspiracy theorists" tend to fit a psychological profile: lonely, delusions of grandeur, overestimating their own intelligence, rejecting anything which suggests they're mistaken, overestimating their own powers of perception, inconsistent burdens of proof on dissenting evidence, and a total inability to think critically.

I think this is normal for 50+ percent of people.

This is why propaganda is so effective. Why shouldn't "stupid" people have their say?

self-described "conspiracy theorists" tend to fit a psychological profile: lonely, delusions of grandeur, overestimating their own intelligence, rejecting anything which suggests they're mistaken, overestimating their own powers of perception, inconsistent burdens of proof on dissenting evidence, and a total inability to think critically.

I think this is normal for 50+ percent of people.

This is why propaganda is so effective. Why shouldn't "stupid" people have their say?

self-described "conspiracy theorists" tend to fit a psychological profile: lonely, delusions of grandeur, overestimating their own intelligence, rejecting anything which suggests they're mistaken, overestimating their own powers of perception, inconsistent burdens of proof on dissenting evidence, and a total inability to think critically.

I think this is normal for 50+ percent of people.

This is why propaganda is so effective. Why shouldn't "stupid" people have their say?

self-described "conspiracy theorists" tend to fit a psychological profile: lonely, delusions of grandeur, overestimating their own intelligence, rejecting anything which suggests they're mistaken, overestimating their own powers of perception, inconsistent burdens of proof on dissenting evidence, and a total inability to think critically.

I think this is normal for 50+ percent of people.

This is why propaganda is so effective. Why shouldn't "stupid" people have their say?

self-described "conspiracy theorists" tend to fit a psychological profile: lonely, delusions of grandeur, overestimating their own intelligence, rejecting anything which suggests they're mistaken, overestimating their own powers of perception, inconsistent burdens of proof on dissenting evidence, and a total inability to think critically.

I think this is normal for 50+ percent of people.

This is why propaganda is so effective. Why shouldn't "stupid" people have their say?

self-described "conspiracy theorists" tend to fit a psychological profile: lonely, delusions of grandeur, overestimating their own intelligence, rejecting anything which suggests they're mistaken, overestimating their own powers of perception, inconsistent burdens of proof on dissenting evidence, and a total inability to think critically.

I think this is normal for 50+ percent of people.

This is why propaganda is so effective. Why shouldn't "stupid" people have their say?

self-described "conspiracy theorists" tend to fit a psychological profile: lonely, delusions of grandeur, overestimating their own intelligence, rejecting anything which suggests they're mistaken, overestimating their own powers of perception, inconsistent burdens of proof on dissenting evidence, and a total inability to think critically.

I think this is normal for 50+ percent of people.

This is why propaganda is so effective. Why shouldn't "stupid" people have their say?

self-described "conspiracy theorists" tend to fit a psychological profile: lonely, delusions of grandeur, overestimating their own intelligence, rejecting anything which suggests they're mistaken, overestimating their own powers of perception, inconsistent burdens of proof on dissenting evidence, and a total inability to think critically.

I think this is normal for 50+ percent of people.

This is why propaganda is so effective. Why shouldn't "stupid" people have their say?

self-described "conspiracy theorists" tend to fit a psychological profile: lonely, delusions of grandeur, overestimating their own intelligence, rejecting anything which suggests they're mistaken, overestimating their own powers of perception, inconsistent burdens of proof on dissenting evidence, and a total inability to think critically.

I think this is normal for 50+ percent of people.

This is why propaganda is so effective. Why shouldn't "stupid" people have their say?

self-described "conspiracy theorists" tend to fit a psychological profile: lonely, delusions of grandeur, overestimating their own intelligence, rejecting anything which suggests they're mistaken, overestimating their own powers of perception, inconsistent burdens of proof on dissenting evidence, and a total inability to think critically.

I think this is normal for 50+ percent of people.

This is why propaganda is so effective. Why shouldn't "stupid" people have their say?

self-described "conspiracy theorists" tend to fit a psychological profile: lonely, delusions of grandeur, overestimating their own intelligence, rejecting anything which suggests they're mistaken, overestimating their own powers of perception, inconsistent burdens of proof on dissenting evidence, and a total inability to think critically.

I think this is normal for 50+ percent of people.

This is why propaganda is so effective. Why shouldn't "stupid" people have their say?

self-described "conspiracy theorists" tend to fit a psychological profile: lonely, delusions of grandeur, overestimating their own intelligence, rejecting anything which suggests they're mistaken, overestimating their own powers of perception, inconsistent burdens of proof on dissenting evidence, and a total inability to think critically.

I think this is normal for 50+ percent of people.

This is why propaganda is so effective. Why shouldn't "stupid" people have their say?

self-described "conspiracy theorists" tend to fit a psychological profile: lonely, delusions of grandeur, overestimating their own intelligence, rejecting anything which suggests they're mistaken, overestimating their own powers of perception, inconsistent burdens of proof on dissenting evidence, and a total inability to think critically.

I think this is normal for 50+ percent of people.

This is why propaganda is so effective. Why shouldn't "stupid" people have their say?

self-described "conspiracy theorists" tend to fit a psychological profile: lonely, delusions of grandeur, overestimating their own intelligence, rejecting anything which suggests they're mistaken, overestimating their own powers of perception, inconsistent burdens of proof on dissenting evidence, and a total inability to think critically.

I think this is normal for 50+ percent of people.

This is why propaganda is so effective. Why shouldn't "stupid" people have their say?

self-described "conspiracy theorists" tend to fit a psychological profile: lonely, delusions of grandeur, overestimating their own intelligence, rejecting anything which suggests they're mistaken, overestimating their own powers of perception, inconsistent burdens of proof on dissenting evidence, and a total inability to think critically.

I think this is normal for 50+ percent of people.

This is why propaganda is so effective. Why shouldn't "stupid" people have their say?

self-described "conspiracy theorists" tend to fit a psychological profile: lonely, delusions of grandeur, overestimating their own intelligence, rejecting anything which suggests they're mistaken, overestimating their own powers of perception, inconsistent burdens of proof on dissenting evidence, and a total inability to think critically.

I think this is normal for 50+ percent of people.

This is why propaganda is so effective. Why shouldn't "stupid" people have their say?

self-described "conspiracy theorists" tend to fit a psychological profile: lonely, delusions of grandeur, overestimating their own intelligence, rejecting anything which suggests they're mistaken, overestimating their own powers of perception, inconsistent burdens of proof on dissenting evidence, and a total inability to think critically.

I think this is normal for 50+ percent of people.

This is why propaganda is so effective. Why shouldn't "stupid" people have their say?

I've yet to meet a self-described conspiracy theorist who's ever admitted they were wrong, except so that they can stop expending energy defending Conspiracy A and focus on defending Conspiracy B.

Maybe because you're going into the conversation with the preconceived notion that you're right and they're wrong?

I've had nearly the opposite experience; people who don't believe in any conspiracies - or think they are few and far between - refuse to even look at evidence that goes against their narrative, or their fall back to authority without caring for substance. Meanwhile, people who are more accepting of the idea of modern conspiracies generally want you to provide them with new evidence. Even if it doesn't change their minds, at least they'll look at it.

Well said.

Lol you don't know anything. I spoke to a local man who knew Obama's grandparents. When they first found out he was president their reaction was "how? He wasn't born in the US"

"Obama's grandparents said he was born in Kenya."

Adds that to the list of #credible Obama conspiracy theories.*

Lol you don't know anything. I spoke to a local man who knew Obama's grandparents. When they first found out he was president their reaction was "how? He wasn't born in the US"

thank you, couldnt of put it better myself (as a tin-foil hat wearing vegan)

I guess we must be getting too close to the truth on something.

I love this one.

The thing I love about conspiracy is we don't care if were wrong, a debunk if proved wrong is as good as a no debunk. If it was a conspiracy in the first place its worth checking out.

So if you're wrong you'd still stand for it?

Lol I know this

Psst. You misunderstood him.

I don't blame you. I'm not totally sure I understand it myself. I took it to be a message praising us for being open to be proven wrong and open to having debunks proven wrong, too. De-debunkability is not quite a universal trait, nor an easy one to reference.

Interesting info! Thanks for the data, and the reminder that my symbolic processing capabilities can be exploited by machine learning. It wouldn't be the first time. Only some of the time I've spent chatting with bots was deliberate.

Speak for yourself!

Seconded.

True - JFK was killed by the CIA using Oswald as a patsy

Taking it too far - Saying anything other than that

As in Oswald did kill him but he was just the CIA's cover story? This is the conclusion that I've come to from what I've read, he was a CIA/ONI spy, which is why he went to the Soviet Union and was allowed back in and given a state department loan.

There were multiple shooters.

wasn't there a photo of Oswald outside the building looking at the motorcade ?

I don't think I've seen that, but I have seen many people lay out the timeline and Oswald's makes no sense. Right after the shots his boss and a cop saw him in the lunchroom enjoying a cold drink a few floors down and didn't appear out of breath or disheveled. He would have had to sprint down the steps and cross multiple floors to get there in that short amount of time. And no one ever wants to talk about the black fella that was eating lunch on the floor right beforehand and he also never saw Oswald on that floor.

There is a photo believed to be of Oswald outside, yes. Establishing his presence, but nothing more. I think it is shown in the Rich Man's Trick documentary.

Just watch the movie "JFK." It explains the "turkey shoot" thing.

Why multiple shooters, though? I definitely believe he was killed by the CIA, but it only takes one bullet to kill someone if it's well-placed. Watching the video, it seems like there was only one bullet. Do you think they just had other people ready to fire in case the first one missed?

There is no answer, it was just Oswald. And even latently, the CIA could've known what Oswald was gonna do and let it happen

You need to check out the new HD stabilized Zapruder film. You can see he goes behind the sign and when he comes out he's holding his throat then about 20 feet later his head all but explodes. There was at least 2 or 3 shots. One hit from behind and one hit from up front or up front and to the side.

Yeah, there's obviously more than one. I can see that even in the unstabilized version. I must have just remembered it incorrectly.

It's not the multiple shots that points to multiple shooters for me. Its the fact that he had a hole right at the top of his back going out his throat and I think that's the bullet that hit the Governor. Then he was hit in the front of the head, which is why his head snaps back and his brains/skull hit the trunk. They tried to cover up the bullet hole in the throat by cutting it open and saying they gave a trach tube when he came in. Half of his head is gone, why give a trach tube to someone that's been dead for 10+ minutes?

And there is no way Oswald (a very poor marksman) could hit a moving target through a tree at such a steep angle multiple times. No. Way.

Holy shit. Just watched it. You can see Jackie turn to him when he starts holding his throat, she can see his distress and reacts. Unless he just swallowed a bee or something (seconds before being shot in the head, which such unknown distress would likely take a shooter off aim), I totally believe multiple shooters now...

I don't know what theory is correct for JFK, but as far as why multiple shooters, the CIA and pretty much all effective organizations have contingency plans for all operations.

One shooter can easily miss, be discovered early, change his mind at the last second etc. Too many variables.

The best theory I know of was a shooter in the sewer that took the final headshot from a few feet away and the shot through the front windshield of the car.

This is also how 9/11 would have worked. It is entirely possible that the terrorists were real and did come up with the plot, and were helped along by an invisible hand that made sure it had maximum effect. Even if the terrorists were plants, it's the same scenario, explosives ensuring total collapse, possibly guided aircraft systems to ensure the hits.

Why the sewer instead of the "grassy knoll"? The shot came from the same direction. The sewer seems like a completely complicated setup to take a crappy line of sight shot. The shooter would have to be lower than the car and off to the side. Another reason i think "everything is a rich mans trick" uses mostly truth to spread effective disinfo.

I believe the main theory with multiple shooters has one shooter and likely the final headshot in the sewer. That doesn't mean more shots did not come from the grassy knoll and book depository or other rooftops.

It was in "The Men Who Killed Kennedy" and a number of books, here is a basic breakdown I found with a quick google search on ATS (which is not a site I would normally link) but they address it in the comments pretty well:

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread313169/pg1

They missed on the corner turn. That's why they needed multiple shooters, the black umbrella was a signal that the operation failed and they just ordered a hail of bullets to get the job done.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cZSyNVoUk04

Multiple people fired. One of the rounds went through JFKs neck and hit John Connally at an angle which suggests it came from the back. Another shot hit kennedy in the head knocking it backwards and to the left suggesting another shooter in front. I mean if there really was a large conspiracy involving multiple people and the CIA instead of a lone gunman, why would they rely on only one gunman? That's a much higher chance for failiure.

why he went to the Soviet Union and was allowed back in and given a state department loan

Do you actually believe the Cold War was more than Kayfabe?

I'm not an American, but why would the cia want to kill jfk?

He distrusted his advisors and the CIA over the Bay of Pigs (which they totally mislead him on), he completely disregarded what they had to say in the Cuban Missile Crisis, which is a good thing because they wanted to start a nuclear war. He had backdoor discussion channels with Castro and Khurschev that he used to build ties and try to find peace. He fired Allen Dulles over the Bay of Pigs, and he was not going to put combat troops in Vietnam.

His American University speech shows that he wanted disarmament and peace, which went completely against the military industrial complex and the CIA. To them he was a subversive president, only because he went against their business and military interests, which were so detached from reality that if Nixon was president in 1963 we would not be here talking about it, because he would have taken their advice and started a war over Cuba.

I think he was intelligence, but setup by other intelligence. ONI and CIA aren't 100% friends. Also, CIA is compartmentalized, and groups can go rogue.

Check out "Libra" by Don DeLilo. It's literature, but it gives a good idea of what could have happened. Very interesting insight into intelligence, compartmentalization, and the thrust of history.

You can start by reading Don DeiLilos articlce on 9/11 and see if you'd want to read his (highly acclaimed) book on Oswald and the JFK assassination. It doesn't get all the facts right (nor is it meant to), but it's probably the piece that gve me the best understanding ofJFK.

https://www.theguardian.com/books/2001/dec/22/fiction.dondelillo

you had me....and then you lost me...

where exactly?

the first line, almost certainly true IMO. the second line, certainly and completely false...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mII9NZ8MMVM&app=desktop this should explain.

sorry...but what will that explain?

JFK was killed by the CIA, it was setup by Johnson, and taken care of by good ol Texas Boys Edward Clark and George HW Bush.

Winky Winky

I was "somewhere in Texas" that day

Picture 1

Picture 2

Never mind the CIA memo that was sent to a George HW Bush, conveniently the CIA says it was a different Bush. That one didn't have the clearance to be receiving the memo sent to Dallas.

I'm very certain George H.W. Bush was involved in the assassination and subsequent coverup, but I never heard about this memo you speak of. Do you have a source?

I pulled the information from this specific part of a very detailed article into Bushes connection to the JFK assassination.

The source document of the memo is here, along with the affidavit of the other George Bush as well where he denies ever having received the memo.

i think its safe to say that's not him

It's a lot more complicated, but that's a good start. Let's avenge Kennedy. r/OccupyLangley

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cZSyNVoUk04

It's possible JFK killing was an accident. There is a sound theory that his own secret service accidently killed him. Oswald and all the rest was a coverup of the accident.

It was the fact that JFK was the last president to stand for the people but the final straw was the Federal Reserve which is about as federal as Federal Express. He made a new American currency backed by gold and silver this means the economy will be based on something of value and will create a stable economy. The bill was passed and would have worked. 6 months later he went to Dallas, never to return. The first act of the replacement president, who had very close ties to the banks, was to get rid of the new stable currency.

Dont forget the "I will splinter the CIA into a thousand pieces" thing. JFK fired Allen Dulles who was a member of the Warren Commission to investigate JFK's death, appointed to the position by the guy who took JFK's place as president (Hur-Dur conflict of interest anyone?)

You should read Libra by Don DeLilo, it's fiction (really literature), but it's the best researched book on Oswald I've ever read. It keeps making me look things up, and he's always right on. The man did his research.

Check out Don DeLilo's article on 9/11. If you like it, then you should check out Libra. If not, oh well.

https://www.theguardian.com/books/2001/dec/22/fiction.dondelillo

JFK wasn't killed he just continued on as jimmy carter Turns out the freedom fighter was the globalist Jew the whole time

True: The government has technology that is about 20-30 years ahead of what we have, and they hide it and use it to give themselves more power over others.

False.

Yeah, it's what people want to believe. I remember when it was true, but it's been a while.

The military industrial complex has access to the largest resources since quite some time. The implications of that fact alone...

Because that's the way life works. Just throw money at the problem and the result must be good.

Its not only money. They dont have to abide to the rules like the Rest of US. They can keep everything in secret. They can eliminate opponents. Etc

It's much more exotic in your imagination that it is in reality.

One should not have to argue the point from a position of ridicule.

The very claim you make states that we just learned last year of technology the military had 20 - 30 years ago.

Your claim:

In 2016 we learned of military technology they had 1986 - 1996.

In 2015 we learned of military technology they had 1985 - 1995.

In 2014 we learned of military technology they had 1984 - 1994.

etc.

There should be THOUSANDS of examples of such actual technology to call on to prove the argument is true. And yet, you supply exactly zero.

Too vague. Be specific.

"Nightvision" was widely used back in WW2. If your claim is to be true, then you must supply evidence that the government had the technology in the years shortly before 1915 - 1925.

Same as the rest. You supply no dates, no actual examples. Nothing to show the "20 - 30" year gap is anything but imagination.

So you run away when someone makes good arguments against some of your points? Are you just here for upvotes or do you just like to say you keep an open mind

You think the energy thing is too far? Have you looked into tesla at all? Shortly after he announced free energy for everyone his lab was stripped apart and everything confiscated

I'm not going to pretend to know how he did it. All I know is that he was murdered and his lab ransacked after announcing free energy. Everything else he described is true why would he lie about free energy?

I don't think he was wrong at all

http://www.lawofone.info/results.php?q=Tesla

I can appreciate the rationale and reason you're exercising here man, but random guy on the internet saying Tesla misunderstood the field he dedicated a lifetime of study to is unbelievably arrogant.

Oh, Nikola Tesla. I thought you were talking about the modern company, Tesla. History was never my best subject.

Where's all the work with COP >1.0 motors? Japanese companies know how to make them, but get financially destroyed for trying to touch it. What about Tesla's single wire transmission work? That had some really interesting stuff involving DC pulses rather than AC. Also what about his principle of using the ionisphere to generate energy, which can be demonstrated on a tall building, or a Tesla coil generating scalar waves? Or Zenneck waves, surface waves which travel extremely long distances and we use for long-distance radar now?

Until we see COP 2.0+ generators and alternators everywhere, and single wire phase retarded transmission, with maybe even scalar or Zennck wave broadcast worldwide internet, I'm not sure we've even got close to what Tesla was really talking about.

I think the next two years is going to be very, very humbling for those who think they have this world figured out.

This world is nothing like we thought it was.

Some of the things you said to be taking too far come to the light.

You need to experience some of this first hand. When you wake up to the truth of your consciusness you see with fresh eyes.

Both happen. As long as we operate from a separated state of consciousness we cant get out of our material experience of life. When we abandon our minds identity of ourself we will rise to our true essence as infinite consciousness unified with all of experience that we experience in the moment. From this way of experiencing you arent the body or mind, you experience yourself pure spirit or awareness.

That state opens our eyes to the non material.

Basically try ayahuasca.

Well you could try shrooms or acid. But I don't think they replicate the experience quite as well.

It's bollocks and not worth the time. Deliriums just suck.

DMT/Ayahuasca is not a baby step.

Try some brain damage.

RemindMe! 2 Years

I will be messaging you on 2019-04-06 15:33:58 UTC to remind you of this link.

CLICK THIS LINK to send a PM to also be reminded and to reduce spam.

^{Parent commenter can delete this message to hide from others.}

You are the one who stated the government/military has tech 20-30 years ahead of the rest of us.

I'm just saying that technology is on an exponential curve. 20-30 years ahead is become more and more ahead of us as technological advances accelerate. At this point? Who even knows what the fuck they have anymore?

If it's world changing (at least in a good way) us proles will never know.

You are a personification of verbal diarrhea.

So the vaccum isn't empty like it was assumed, there is energy there. This is a good realization. However, the energy that is harvestable is so small, that it's basically worthless from a practical standpoint.

Richard Feynman is credited with saying

"In one cubic meter there is enough energy to boil all the water in all of the oceans on Earth."

Any device capable of harvesting this energy is considered an "Open System", therefore it is not "creating" energy and does not violate the second law of thermodynamics.

From what I've researched and seen, I'm 100% convinced that this is possible.

So the vaccum isn't empty like it was assumed, there is energy there. This is a good realization. However, the energy that is harvestable is so small, that it's basically worthless from a practical standpoint.

Is it? There are neutrinos with massive energy moving about all around us quite often. That isn't "vacuum" but is close enough to the "invisible energy source" realm that it could fit the bill. However once you get far enough down the "fabric of spacetime" route, you realize that /r/HoloFractal seems suspiciously accurate at explaining some things. But further you realize the "electric universe" concept may actually the prime mover in astrophysics, suggesting that our universe is filled with energy all around us. It doesn't seem so bizarre to be able to tap into some of that by exploiting edge case circumstances of nature, particularly through Tesla's fascination with resonance and vibration.

Further, his ideas weren't about harnessing lightning per se so much as putting a balloon up into the ionosphere and having a ground lead to the earth, and using a certain circuit to manipulate the long wire like a huge antenna of sorts.

The Kawai engine is real and totally buildable by anyone with either a rotor with the proper geometry or with a resonant switching circuit - Jim Murray's SERPS is probably the best demo of this.

Glossing over it a bit; I know how to do most of those things but you can't get an economical return on it because the power-density is just too low.

Yes, scalar waves generate over-unity power but do so in miniscule amounts and would not be worth pursuing. The Zenneck waves are best for communication or wireless transfer, not generation either. However, resonant power generation with COPS>1.0 is 100% possible and people are doing it right now. That would be the equivalent of taking every single generator motor in the world and allowing it to generate 2-3 x more energy (just imagine!) with the exact same energy source it was using before. All the sudden, every energy source can be multiplied, because we are harnessing not just the initial kinetic force but also the energy contained in the permanent dipoles of magnets used in the generator.

For something more suited to space travel, radioactive battery cells with Strontium 90 have amazing potential. But we also have true ZPE figured out with red mercury and relativistic mercury generators. These work by creating a superfluid with vortices moving at relativistic speeds, allowing for REALLY cool effects. This is the "secret space program" sort of tech.

There's so many ways of generating over-unity energy, it makes me want to bash my head against a wall.

I watched that video and now I have cancer.
That's not legit.
To get a COP > 1.0 you have to build a device that extracts power from its environment.

+1

Yes, I have looked in to this quite a bit and I know quite a bit about the field of study too.

You should check out his documentary then: Zero Point - The Story of Mark McCandlish and the Free Energy Fluxliner Space Craft

Such a craft/device would not violate the second law of thermodynamics, and the supposed physics behind it is fascinating. They also touch upon alleged alien abductions, back engineering ET craft etc. Just watch the first 5 minutes before knocking the concept.

Also, it appears you have some reservations about 9/11. I always thought the details of the event were suspicious, but I didn't start to firmly believe the official story was bullshit until I watched this documentary about a week or two ago: National Security Alert - 9/11 Pentagon Event. It's a relatively short, low budget, very well put together documentary that compiles loads of physical evidence and witness testimony. It's truly eye opening, but don't just take my word for it.

Great post OP, you make excellent points. I like Alan Moore's (author of Watchmen) take on conspiracies. He wrote a halfway nonfiction comic book about government plots back in the 80's, and said that while doing the research he found that yes there are schemes and chaos, but there's virtually no way it is all organized, in his words, "The world is rudderless".

True: Amy Schumer is a comedian.

Taking it too far: Amy schumer is funny.

It's just hasty, and full of oversight and doesn't characterize many of these conspiracies in their relative balances. I still largely agree, but it's not clear from your post that you have any knowledge about any of these issues in any depth.

Hold up though

Taking it too far: We are being intentionally poisoned using mind-controlling chemicals to keep us docile. People with calcified pineal glands are spiritual zombies.

Maybe excluding the pineal part I don't think that is taking it too far. Maybe not "mind-control" drugs, but there is definitely something that is being done to us on a massive scale.

Could be, I'm not totally dismissing that in reality

Haha thanks :) it would be cool to realize we actually had some cool powers. Who even knows?

I would say go further than just fluoride. Think about all the things we take in over our lifetime. Air chemicals, vaccines, water, meat and vegetables. I'm just saying that there are multiple sources of injection for these chemicals or whatever they are using, if they're using something at all.

how many people had to approve this nationwide for it to take place.

You don't need too many. You just need to control the very top and the rest fall in under compliance. When you own the banks you have a lot of influence.

Firstly, excellent post. Really cuts through all the partisan bullshit that swaps this sub - the vast majority of conspiracy theories are peddled by right-wingers looking for ways to point the fingers at left-wingers, so a list like the one you posted should at least provoke some thought in these people.

As you said there's zero evidence that fluoride is harmful - it's a conspiracy theory pushed by the mentally ill, who lack a basic understanding of chemistry (and likely all science).

That being said, there is definitely a push to get more people to take addictive/harmful prescription meds. If it's a "conspiracy" it's one motivated by profit, I'd say - it's not unprecedented that a corporation would sell something harmful/addictive to the citizenry which also has the side effect of making people more docile and susceptible to propaganda.

vast majority of conspiracy theories are peddled by right-wingers looking for ways to point the fingers at left-wingers,

lolwut? JFK, MLK, RFK assassination conspiracy theories, CIA drug conspiracy theories, manmade AIDS virus, vaccination conspiracies are mostly from the left, and 9/11 truth originated in the anti Bush left. Moon hoaxers and flat earthers are bipartisan groups. There are plenty of conspiracy theories on both sides.

zero evidence that fluoride is harmful -

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fluoride_toxicity

Fluorine is the most electronegative element on the periodic table it has a high affinity for electrons over any other element it causes oxidative stress on cells and tissues and an amass of the substance is toxic to organs. Chemistry major .

I remember reading that fluoride allows aluminum to pass the blood-brain barrier, and that aluminum is found in the brains of alzheimers patients.

Question: Have you ever taken psychedelics, or delved heavily into lucid dreaming?

I say because before that period of experimentation in my life, the notion of calcification of the pineal gland was completely lost on me.

We have tooth paste with fluoride to clean our teeth. Fluoride in drinking and bathing water serves another darker purpose.

I think that "something" you're talking about may be something a bit more abstract--propaganda. We've become a part of one giant propaganda machine that has managed to psychologically manipulate at a terrifyingly deep level that would be almost impossible to achieve with a chemical or biological agent without losing that effect over generations.

Harvard found that fluoride is irreversibly toxic to the brain in 2012. Perhaps this is it?

https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/news/features/fluoride-childrens-health-grandjean-choi/

I doubt the chemtrail stuff.

I know about cloud seeding. Chemtrail believers think every contrail is a chemtrail it seems.

Copy that.

I also doubted it until a couple weeks ago when a another redditor convinced me. I see it everywhere now. Mostly clouds where there weren't any clouds before. Just planes passing through leaving a trail.

I live in a small town that big planes just don't happen to fly over. I have only ever seen one contrail since I have lived here. We have fairly dense population, there is just not that many square miles. What would be the point of leaving us out of the chemical treatments.

I don't think it's like chemical warfare on Americans. But something to do with weather.

Here are a few government documents regarding weather modification/geo-engineering dating back to the mid-60s:

A Recommended National Program In Weather Modification - 1966 (NASA)

Weather Modification: Hearings before the Subcommittee on Oceans and International Environment of the Committee on Foreign Relations, United States Senate - January 1, 1974

Weather as a Force Multiplier: Owning the Weather in 2025

Atmospheric Aerosol Properties and Climate Impacts

And from the USCode: 15 USC Ch. 9A: WEATHER MODIFICATION ACTIVITIES OR ATTEMPTS; REPORTING REQUIREMENT

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/mar/24/us-scientists-launch-worlds-biggest-solar-geoengineering-study

True: the government and a good portion of those we worship in Hollywood like to fuck kids. And a good part are probably involved in the trafficking business.

Taking it to far: that one pizza place rapes kids in their basement RIGHT NOW

Good post. Well thought out.

True - Russian propaganda is massive, worldwide and damaging every democratic election in process.

http://www.rand.org/content/dam/rand/pubs/perspectives/PE100/PE198/RAND_PE198.pdf

Sure, the difference is that Russia is literally undermining elections to help Alt-Right candidates win. This helps to level the playing playing field, because Russia is a shithole, that doesn't have the rights or public goods most democratic nations do.

The Senate hearings covered a lot of this, but they were explicit (multiple security firms) that Russia is light years ahead of anyone in cyber warfare.

As I watched some of the same hearing he apparently did I'll try and explain a bit of what he said.

While I don't think Russia is actively seeking out "Alt-right" candidates, Russia does have a long and successful history of propaganda and persuasion campaigns against others. According to the experts testifying, Russia uses these campaigns to make up for their other weaknesses. Lack of a powerhouse economy, lack of modern economy, etc. The experts did say Russia was ahead of most when it came to cyber/influence campaigns though.

Oh I agree the CIA has been doing it on their own. Probably mostly countering Soviet/Russian things. I wouldn't be surprised if the US has done things attributed to Soviets/Russians. I also do believe that Soviets/Russians are good at what they do though.

Russia doesn't hold a candle to the amount of election tampering conducted by the United States on almost every other nation.

Chemtrails are an attempt by the wealthy and powerful to hide the Planet X Nibiru flyby and Poleshift from the panicky public.

UFO spacecraft visible in our solar system with Nightvision goggles.

Biblical worldwide Flood imminent which elite will capitalize on to depopulate the planet to reasonable level.

Chemtrails are an attempt by the wealthy and powerful to hide the Planet X Nibiru flyby and Poleshift from the panicky public.

UFO spacecraft visible in our solar system with Nightvision goggles.

Biblical worldwide Flood imminent which elite will capitalize on to depopulate the planet to reasonable level.

Sorry about that, not sure what happened. Great thread, by the way!

The Bible says the Lord will never flood the planet again?

Any proof or info on ET life and this UFO in our solar system?

Chemtrails can melt steel beams.

Chemtrails are an attempt by the wealthy and powerful to hide the Planet X Nibiru flyby and Poleshift from the panicky public.

UFO spacecraft visible in our solar system with Nightvision goggles.

Biblical worldwide Flood imminent which elite will capitalize on to depopulate the planet to reasonable level.

Chemtrails are an attempt by the wealthy and powerful to hide the Planet X Nibiru flyby and Poleshift from the panicky public.

UFO spacecraft visible in our solar system with Nightvision goggles.

Biblical worldwide Flood imminent which elite will capitalize on to depopulate the planet to reasonable level.

Chemtrails are an attempt by the wealthy and powerful to hide the Planet X Nibiru flyby and Poleshift from the panicky public.

UFO spacecraft visible in our solar system with Nightvision goggles.

Biblical worldwide Flood imminent which elite will capitalize on to depopulate the planet to reasonable level.

Chemtrails are an attempt by the wealthy and powerful to hide the Planet X Nibiru flyby and Poleshift from the panicky public.

UFO spacecraft visible in our solar system with Nightvision goggles.

Biblical worldwide Flood imminent which elite will capitalize on to depopulate the planet to reasonable level.

Chemtrails are an attempt by the wealthy and powerful to hide the Planet X Nibiru flyby and Poleshift from the panicky public.

UFO spacecraft visible in our solar system with Nightvision goggles.

Biblical worldwide Flood imminent which elite will capitalize on to depopulate the planet to reasonable level.

Chemtrails are an attempt by the wealthy and powerful to hide the Planet X Nibiru flyby and Poleshift from the panicky public.

UFO spacecraft visible in our solar system with Nightvision goggles.

Biblical worldwide Flood imminent which elite will capitalize on to depopulate the planet to reasonable level.

Chemtrails are an attempt by the wealthy and powerful to hide the Planet X Nibiru flyby and Poleshift from the panicky public.

UFO spacecraft visible in our solar system with Nightvision goggles.

Biblical worldwide Flood imminent which elite will capitalize on to depopulate the planet to reasonable level.

Fluoride doesn't help teeth? Gonna need a source on this. Dentists use fluoride when they clean teeth, fluoride is in toothpaste.

but what concentration of fluoride is harmful? The amount you get from water or toothpaste is negligible.

its like saying flying on the plane is dangerous because you receive a monthly does of radiation.

Some people do fly that much.

I dont like all of your narrative or the attempts to decide what is or isn't "taking it too far". For example, I've seen decent proof that the planes were just visual effects added into the media footage. Those towers were definitely taken down with just explosives- explosives possibly installed by Israelis.

I'm telling you. There was a video posted on here that showed irrefutable proof. It compared the various media coverage of the day. That crap was definitely effects. Different stations even had the same synchronized glitches and rendering errors show up on tape

That video is a video of just the media coverage of that day and the days after. The coverage of the incident and their own footage is what gives it away. I don't buy that 1000s of people actually saw the planes and any media report of such is all part of the narrative. The second plane was even more poorly added in than the first

Whoa there, looking at evidence is "taking it too far" apparently.

there's thousands of videos of the second plane.

There are 53 videos, not thousands. Most are very low quality.

So you believe the official story, and that the only conspiracy is that Bush didn't do enough to stop it? You cannot have looked very closely at the official story then.

A lot of the time it's difficult to tell, but I will say that after spending years researching the topic, the moon landing hoax still seems pretty unlikely to me. Also, Occam's razor alone basically kills the flat earth theory. Weirdly enough, the one about Elvis living past his official death is surprisingly credible

Yeah I think we landed on the moon.

IMO The biggest proof that we landed on the moon is that the USSR didn't deny it.

This too is my goto response for the moon landing. One person responded that the same people who owned the US also owned the USSR so there wasn't a reason to deny it. It made me laugh until I realized there is a zero percent chance that it wasn't a real person who thought that.

Yeah but what about convex earth?

Even stupider than flat earth, if that's possible.

welp judging by my 8 downvotes such a blatantly retarded idea is taken pretty seriously by the folks 'round here

Errr... no, they're downvoting you because your idea is so incredibly incoherent that even the people in this community (where interdimensional aliens and vast Jewish conspiracies are taken seriously) find it beyond the pale

my idea?

Lol, sorry, bad phrasing, the idea of whatever crackpot wacko with zero knowledge of astronomy, earth science, and physics

well yeah, that's kinda the point. I wasn't suggesting it seriously. Just bringing it up because it follows from the mention of flat-earth theory and the fact that it's hilarious

It really is hilarious. The YouTube videos in support of it would be straight up satirical art if they weren't so dead serious

why do you come to r/conspiracy just to debunk it, 24/7?

something something its personal

something something it bothers you that people believe in it

right...

Personal hobby. I was very into conspiracy theories, particularly regarding aliens, when I was a young boy. That led to a real interest in science, which led to my introduction to real critical thinking, which placed me on my current path, which I'm very excited about. But to get to the science part, it took some people telling me that the conspiracies were stupid. I hope to play that role for someone. But, I also enjoy browsing the page, and I keep an open mind to theories that aren't totally dumb. But concave earth is objectively totally dumb.

Also the fact that you posted it three times

didnt realize that, was on mobile, my bad

Yeah but what about convex earth?

Yeah but what about convex earth, huh?

I agree with you, I believe man has been on the moon. You can see the reflectors that were placed there and the dune buggies' tire tracks from Earth. However, there a number of anomalies in the video footage and pictures that were allegedly taken up there (which I'm not going to link to but you can research yourself). I personally find this explanation does the best job of reconciling the two.

I've come to see that explanation as a possible intersection between the "didn't go to the moon" and "aliens were already on the moon" theories. I still think the footage appears real, but it's something to consider.

I still think the footage appears real, but it's something to consider.

I agree, the footage definitely appears real (for the most part), and I'm sure a lot of it is genuine. I can't say for certain what was encountered up there, but if you take into consideration all the many UFO reports of the era, the Roswell incident, the hundreds of alleged alien abductees around at the time etc. it only makes sense that the government (i.e. NASA and co) would have a contingency plan in case we ran into something up there that they wouldn't want the public at large to know about. What I'm saying is that even if everything had gone smoothly, they'd still have backup fake stock footage of the moon landing to potentially splice in with the real footage in the event that things goes awry.

Some push-back here:

Taking it too far: They have secret zero-point infinite-energy technology. They have for thousands of years. They can communicate with aliens through a hyper-dimensional internet. They can communicate with the past/future and are far more powerful than you can imagine.

Very, very large assumption you've made here. I'm not saying I subscribe to those theories, but I'm fully aware that my ignorance in regards to classified/black R&D is of an unknown degree.

Taking it too far: ......The Jews did 9/11......

The young Israelis arrested on 9/11 said they were there to 'document the event' I.e. an admission of 'complicity' when coming from a professed ally.

Taking it too far: The aliens come to earth all the time

They've been here, they've made their presence known and they're here with us now.

Taking it too far: One cabal runs the whole world and everything in it.....This world is a hologram simulation matrix......

1. How do you know there isn't 1 at the top? But since you've gone this route, who has joint custody of control in your opinion?

2. There is evidence for this. Dr. James Gates III is a good place to start, but the simulation hypothesis has many adherents.

Taking it too far: Leftists are commies and the US is going to become communist Hitler Germany if we let liberalism win. Rightists are hidden neo-nazis who are all racists and want to control those who don't look like them through fascism, so if we let the right win the US will become fascist Hitler Germany.

To what extreme it will go I do not know, but I know that they've given themselves legal totalitarian authority and won't be afraid to use it against resisters and dissenters.

Why would they be on tv? UFO sightings are never on the tv

Ye, cuz that can totally just happen.

I think they(powers that be) want us to go to war with them(aliens). Look at all the movies about humanity banding together to fight off them damned bugs!

Why do the disclosure until you have to? Idk. I think if they are here, they are far more advanced than us. We are still here, so they can't be warmongering. If they aren't warmongering, then they are benevolent. If they are benevolent, Our governement would have to hate them.

I dont think they will "show themselves" until we take the power back.

Hahahahahahahaha people HAVE leaked it. Please check out the Disclosure Project! Whatever people say about Steven Greer, those testimonies are interesting!

No offense, but you seem to have a lot of opinions about aliens while having done very little research on the subject. The Disclosure Project is about a decade old now, and that's only one of the high profile things to look into. Most of the really good stuff is harder to find.

There's a difference between "Jews did 9/11" and "Mossad did 9/11" I'm saying the former is not true, because it isn't, but I said nothing about the latter.

They're one in the same - the Mossad is one of their spears.

No they haven't made their presence known or else they'd be on TV.

You're defining 'presence known' to strictly a broad sense though - 'presence known' can come in small doses, like the dubbed 'foo fighters' of World War II seen by Allied and Axis airmen alike.

Because the world is too complex and chaotic. There may be 1 at the top for a short period of time, but it never lasts, and people are always vying for that position.

Careful on the absolutes though. And have you ever considered that the chaos is by design? Set in motion on purpose, kind of like the post Iraq invasion plans that has subsequently destabilized an entire region followed by many other parts of the world via massive refugee waves from failed states ravaged by virtually unrestrained warfare.

I'm not against the simulation hypothesis, I'm more against the idea of "this isn't real and therefore doesn't matter so I will stop trying"

What? The Simulation Hypothesis makes our conceptualizations of everything null and void because we are a simulation. Does the actions of the avatars on The Sims matter? They're a simulation.

I appreciate your thoughts, for real. The pushback is welcome.

Thank you, it was my pleasure.

Whichever one supports your narrative, duh.

Where have you been for the past 2-3 years?

The 9/11 thing is ridiculous, not only is the concept of Bush "allowing the attacks to happen" ludicrous on its face, anyone who has rudimentary physics knowledge and is familiar with the details and circumstances of the "plane crashes" can decry all Four of them as frauds. Even the newly released Pentagon photos show NO PLANE and nothing to confirm the government narrative.

Speaking of disinformation...

10s of thousands people didn't see a plane. This is, perhaps, the most absurd exaggeration and misconception that is commonly touted about 9/11.

You don't have to posit any explanatory hypothesis about holograms to know that the plane crashes that were shown on television had to be faked, unless Bush also allowed the laws of physics to be circumvented that day.

Well your entire post is grounded in a bizarre series of baseless assertions so I don't know why you would stop them now.

Yeah, whatever.

Let me just state for the record that a Boeing hitting a World Trade Center in real life would be a lot more like throwing a tomato at a stationary tomato slicer than shooting a bullet into an apple, which is what the television depicted that day.

You think we landed on the moon too, apparently. Best step aside and let the actual critical thinkers discuss, rather than presume to speak as an authority on which conspiracy theories are real and not.

Obviously your criteria are as follows: if it sounds kind of too weird to me, I can dismiss it with no knowledge of the relevant evidence.

You're using both straw man and special pleading fallacies, repeatedly.

actual critical thinkers

lol

You think it's "critical thinking" to make declarations that if a conspiracy theory sounds unbelievable or far-fetched, it's therefore not true? With no evidence to support why you actually think this?

Can you really not see how back to front you have this?

I don't need to provide any evidence, you are the one making the claim.

Look at what you actually wrote. I think giant beavers secretly control the oil industry, do you think it's "critical thinking" to dismiss this with no evidence to say why you are dismissing it?

I laughed because your definition of critical thinking is [b]literally[/b] the opposite of critical thinking.

How are they suppressing the citizen journalists with footage of explosions happening sans plane crash? Lots of people were videoing when the second plane hit.

Ignoring one vaguely worded warning about a terrorist attack is not "allowing it to happen".

You're missing the point with 9/11. You say that is was "allowed" to happen but also say Bldg 7 was demolished?

You don't think both towers also being demolished as far more likely? What about the lack of plane at the pentagon?

The 2 planes weren't holograms or some BS like that, but it certainly wasn't orchestrated by the Saudis like you're suggesting.

bush and mossad did 9/11 end of story. also key wall street entities were involved

You've kinda contradicted yourself with your logic here. You're saying 'have an open mind and accept that some things are not as you've been told', but only up to a certain point, then 'you're just being stupid for not believing things you've been told.'

You've listed things which there is no proof of, just very solid reasoning and in some cases basic common sense, but then you've also demanded proof from other people in this thread on the more outrageous aspects of those theories.

I appreciate your perspective here. Shit isn't as we've been told but that doesn't mean everyone has to go off the deep end about it, I get it. But say the truth is that strange, what then? At the moment you are stuck in a cognitive dissidence of being open to the potentials of conspiracy theories so long as they are still relatively 'normal' in their causes. I'm not going to debate all your points cause I agree with a lot of them and at the end of the day I know just as much as you do.

The one I would argue against is the aliens one. In my view we absolutely know aliens have been here and my proof is the pyramids and other structures that use the same construction methods over the globe. Modern architects and engineers will tell you that we would struggle to build the pyramids with today's technology. Couple that with references from almost every major ancient civilisation that speaks of either visitors from the stars, divine kings, or an ancient cataclysm. To me it isn't so much a conspiracy theory as it is a reality, you just have to do the required reading. By your logic I'm a yahoo taking it too far because I believe in the notion that aliens have comes here, built a bunch of impossible structures, and ruled over early man. But the proof is there in the old writings we have translated and the giant stack of rocks that has endured for millenia and teaches mankind mathematics via its dimensions.

The point of this rambling is to say definitely keep a level head, but don't let that desire for concrete proof blind you to other possibilities. The whole point of 'conspiracy theories' is too discuss the notion that something is being kept from people deliberately. Saying 'hey guys, things are a little fishy but let's not go overboard here, I'm sure there is a somewhat rational explanation for all this' is counter productive to the greater discussion.

I personally don't think they left at all, but if I brought that up in the last comment I'd imagine you would have wrote me off as a crackpot. I say that in a non-aggresive way. That was also what you asked another guy for proof of, alien contact. I'd link but I'm on a phone and am not that technical.

In regards to the manpower argument, the more you look into it the less likely it is that even a mobilised slave population could accomplish that. And the precision is more what I'd use as my main argument against the manpower theory. The same way that building 7 in the 9/11 conspiracy highlights that something is up. Mankind barely has the technology know to make something with the precision of the pyramids, let alone 8,000 years ago using rocks and chisels. There is a documentary called 'Revelations of the pyramids' give it a watch if you haven't already, that's what finally sold it for me.

I personally don't think they left at all, but if I brought that up in the last comment I'd imagine you would have wrote me off as a crackpot. I say that in a non-aggresive way. That was also what you asked another guy for proof of, alien contact. I'd link but I'm on a phone and am not that technical.

In regards to the manpower argument, the more you look into it the less likely it is that even a mobilised slave population could accomplish that. And the precision is more what I'd use as my main argument against the manpower theory. The same way that building 7 in the 9/11 conspiracy highlights that something is up. Mankind barely has the technology know to make something with the precision of the pyramids, let alone 8,000 years ago using rocks and chisels. There is a documentary called 'Revelations of the pyramids' give it a watch if you haven't already, that's what finally sold it for me.

You cant link something when you're on your mobile phone? Yeah right. Sounds more like you dont have anything to link in the first place.

I meant a link to him asking someone for proof in this thread. Read through it if you're really that sceptical.

What does a civilization that can travel accross the universe need idiot monkeys to rule. Cos for taking stuff from bottom of atmosphere to top is more costly than just making or gearing resources somwehre else.

It's more costly with rockets. If you have anti-grav technology or even advanced magnetics you can use naturally occurring forces to break atmosphere. I say that causally, and I'm sure it's way harder in practice, but my point is its only harder if you think about it in terms of stupid monkeys using combustion.

And if you listen to Icke or a number of other people they exist in more than one dimension and feed off the negative energy they create in our society. Which sounds initially ridiculous until you read into a lot of eastern philosophy such as Hindu and Buddhism which have millenia old teachings on the nature of energy currents in the human form and the nature of a collective conscienceness. Which also sounds ridiculous initially. But anyone that meditates regularly or even someone who has done a decent hit of LSD/peyote/Ayahuasca will tell you there is a lot more truth to that then you'd think. It all goes back to what I was saying in my first reply, keep and open mind cause you never know what might turn out to be true.

With enough levers I could lift a car with my little finger. With enough time I could carve a rock into a cube exactly as long as a stick my boss gave me. With a knowledge of simple geometry I could make sticks that match the 2nd dimensions of a pyramid, precisely, by laying them on the ground at particular angles, without even needing to use units of measurement.

Whilst I'm not disagreeing with you I hear the argument that because there are pyramids in different countries all over the world, built by ancient civilizations that had no contact with each other is proof of an outside agency rather a lot and there's actually a pretty simple explanation.

In modern times we tend to make buildings roughly square or oblong shaped because this offers the maximum amount of internal space. With modern building techniques (extensive foundations, internal steel structures, lighter building materials) we can make square buildings pretty tall.

Ancient peoples also made square buildings but found that these had to be limited to fairly small buildings such as houses. It didn't take long for ancient peoples to work out that if you wanted to build something huge and imposing a mound shape was the best way to go about. Pyramids represent the gradual refinement and evolution of this mound building and it's not too much of a stretch to suggest that separate groups of ancients came to this realisation on their own. Even a child eventually works out that you can build a taller, more stable structure with building blocks by using a pyramidal shape (or any shape with a wide base, tapering as you go higher) than by stacking the blocks one on top of the other.

I'm not saying your argument is completely without merit. There are still plenty of questions with no easy answers. All I'm saying is that suggesting that because isolated ancient societies all built pyramids is evidence of some connection does not stand up to close scrutiny.

I was more referring to the precision of the great pyramid. Stacking rocks is all well and good buy measurements within fractions of a millilitre over long distances, how does reason explain that?

Like i said, there are plenty of difficult to answer questions and that's definitely a good example of one. My point was merely that pyramids in separate locations is not necessarily evidence of a connection.

We would Not struggle today to put rocks on top of rocks, we simply would not. Nor did they in the days of old.

Like I've said in replies to others, it's the precision that you have to look at. How could ancient peoples make the great pyramid with the precision down to fractions of a millilitre?

The idea that aliens would come here and build stone monuments for us is fucking silly. Pyramids are a super stable structure, which is why we see them all over the world. The fact that most cultures have crazy religious myths lends literally zero credence to the idea that aliens were visiting us regularly. What you're describing is 100% a conspiracy theory because it seems to assert that every single archaeologist and historian on earth is either too ignorant to realize what you've realized (despite devoting their lives to studying the past), or every single archaeologist and historian on earth is conspiring to lie to everyone else.

Actually it's neither of those. Most archaeologists study their field or era, not all of them. That's why we reference the works of several archaeologists. And I think it's a little condescending to call the belief and customs of ancient peoples 'crazy religious myths'.

Your point about archaeologists studying specialized periods has no bearing on what I said.

Beliefs and customs of ancient peoples were, without exception, baseless religious myths. Without a selective process to distinguish bad ideas from good (e.g. a tradition of intellectual criticism and comparison of hypotheses with experiments/observations), the chances of hitting by luck on actual knowledge about the world is negligible. That's why science is so powerful at discovering how the world works, and that's why every other way of interrogating the world has failed for thousands of years to make strides in understanding that science has achieved in a few centuries.

I stopped reading when he dismissed the flouride conspiracy, as Harvard proved in 2012 that it is irreversibly toxic to brain health.

I think the best way to look at this is extremes.

Has no one tried to influence US presidential elections and/or has anyone who tried been foiled? Of course not. Has someone attempted to influence US presidential elections and achieved some degree of success? Absolutely. The real question is who and how much.

Did the 9/11 hijackers totally catch all the world's intelligence agencies off guard and achieve their goals without any inside help? Or did someone somewhere in the system know something and at the very least not do their job? Again who and how much.

Are Jews to at least to some extent acting tribally and gaining undue influence. Are they totally acting as if there is no in group preference? Again who and how much.

It's also valuable to look at your basic detective skills: MMO - means, motive and opportunity. Syria: who had MMO to gas people in FSA territory? ISIS? FSA? SAA?

Who had MMO to do 9/11?

Who had MMO to do Sandy Hook?

Taking it too far: Leftists are commies and the US is going to become communist Hitler Germany if we let liberalism win. Rightists are hidden neo-nazis who are all racists and want to control those who don't look like them through fascism, so if we let the right win the US will become fascist Hitler Germany.

This one is a bit different. Fascism is 100% of the time a reaction to communist violence and degeneracy. This is historical fact. The left has turned the US and EU into a simulacrum of Wiemar Germany. Fascism is the natural reaction to the damage of liberalism. It must happen to undo the damage.

If you have any questions about this I'm happy to discuss it.

I like this post a lot. It provides a nice framework for debate, especially with family and friends who might not wanna touch the more out-there stuff.

Here are a few I'd personally shift a little on the likelihood meter:

Closer to True: Extraterrestrials/time travelers/interdimensional beings have visited earth and influenced our development (these are the closest words we have for who they are, semantic differences are due to our primitive language constraints). Some governments/individuals have have proof, and may be holding their technology.

Taking it too far: The aliens come to earth all the time, and run all our governments.

Closer to true: Powerful players you mentioned above (Banking cabals, government intelligence agencies, media conglomerates, multinational corporations, religions) are deliberately deceiving the masses with propaganda, to keep us uneducated, pissed off, and living paycheck to paycheck. The Planet is actually incredibly resource rich, but most of it only profits the 1%, while huge amounts are literally blown up and burned in acts of war (a la 1984). The devisions in that top 1% are very real though--see the current state of Syria.

Taking it too far: One cabal runs the whole world and everything in it. Everything is perfectly controlled.

Those are the biggest ones I can think of

PS: I'd love to take all comers in a reasonable, civil debate, but any name calling or rudeness will not be responded to. Also these are conspiracy theories so I'm not guaranteeing a response that "satisfies" your need for proof. This is more an intellectual excersize. I wish I didn't have to write this dumb postscript, buttttt some people act like they're retarded on these threads.

this is my take on aliens. i never see it mentioned here or anywhere but i think its quite plausible.

First, consider that right now a VAST majority of life on this planet id totally unaware of you. Not just are they unaware of you, but they are unaware of humanity entirety. Shrimp, grasshoppers, every single plant (even house plants), lots of fish, some birds, reptiles, etc..... ALL of them totally unaware that we exist. YET, we are growing them on our kitchen counters, keeping them in our aquariums, catching thousands of them in nets and eating them. They remain oblivious.

Now some creatures have become aware that we exist: apes, dogs, cats, domesticated farm animals, some birds, etc...

However, every single plant and a vast majority of animals are totally oblivious to humanity.

Is it so farfetched to think that maybe that is going on with us? Humans like to think they are the most advanced species. But doesn't every animal think that? You think ants are saying "Man, look at those humans they really got it together"? You think birds are saying "Look at these guys walkie-talkie around building giant wooden nests, we should do that"?

No, they are totally unaware that we exist and they think they are the dominant species.

What if there's a type of life that is far more advanced than either plants or animals? What if there are animals that are much much more intelligent or advanced than humans? Using the fact that MOST animals that are not as smart as humans are unaware of them as precedence, it would be logical to assume that if there is a more advanced species, then we are unaware of it.

So i DO think that "aliens" are among us all time. And i think they probably have some effect on us.

I don't think they come from other planets. I don't think they have much interest in us either. You have an effect on bugs when you put pesticide in your yard, but its not like you are trying to meticulously control the bug world. You just want them out of your house and they are clueless to you. I think "aliens" operate in a similar way. And, i think it would be very naive to think we are actually the dominant species. Litteraly every animal thinks its the top dog (pun intended).

oh no, i disagree that they rule humans or are in contact with governments and things like that. i don't think they are an influential force at all. how much do you influence say the grasshoppers in your backyard? you probably have SOME influence on them albeit, unintentional. But they remain unaware even though you litteraly built a giant house on them. I think "aliens" are like that. maybe when the wind blows that is "somebody" but shes so large and moving past so much stuff. sure she blew some paper out of your hand, but not on purpose and you didn't wven notice "her"... shes not controlling the world or government. shes just the wind, and shes too much for us to understand or fathom, so she carries on doing her thing.

i don't actually believe the wind is a cognizant being (although im open to the possibility upon seeing corroborating data), but my point is. Life has the pattern of getting more complex from single celled organisms to humans. and i think its naive to believe that humans are the top end all be all of that spectrum. SURELY, there are greater things than us. and they are probably building giant houses right on top of you, but you just don't notice.

exactly what i mean. there are DEFINITELY "aliens" its just that they're not alien they've been there doing their thing the whole time. it just goes un noticed. they might even have some small effect on us they way you might have had an effect of a mite colony living in your bathroom or something. but they're just part of nature. i just think its silly that most humans really think that were at the top. of the spectrum in nature. we definitely are not. there are trillions of lifeforms that are microscopic small and there are probably trillions that are lightyears wide and everything in between.

The idea that aliens have a major influence on us i think is dubious but i can think of a plausible scenario.

Lets say you're a cow and you live with other cows in the wild and never encountered humans.

One day some humans start building a village near you so you and some cow buddies go check it out. They end up enslaving you to work on their farm. Generations pass and cows as a species begin to change and adapt to their life on a farm. After a while there are 2 kinds of cows: the wild ones (undisturbed by humans) and the new cows which are slightly different.

Lets say the new cows escape one day and go back to mingle with the original cows. Well is it farfetched to think that these new cows might have learned a bit about SOMETHING from being with the humans for so many generations?

If there are lifeforms more intelligent than us on this planet (and i really think there are but i don't think theyre "alien")... and they did enslave some humans, then possibly thats where human intelligence came from. The same reason my dog is smarter than a wild wolf. My cat is smarter than the ones behind the Chinese restaurant. maybe the homosapiens are smarter than the neanderthal for the same reason. because we were domesticated.

now i don't necessarily believe any of this im just throwing out a plausible scenario. but i really do think there are more advanced organisms than us.

like you said, if a then b and if b then c... then if a therefore c.

if grasshoppers are unaware of humans even though we are right here breeding them even for fish bait sometimes , then its not so farfetched to think that maybe we are just small stupid creatures in relation to greater ones. (and those beings are probably small stupid beings to an even greater one and so on)

i agree humans aren't capable of keeping a secret which is why i think we must be so petty to these beings. you haven't gone and conspired with the top worms and taught them all complex math and given them technology to rule the other worms. you just simply don't really give a shit about the worms in your yard. i think "aliens" don't give a shit about us. there's no secret to keep cause they're not telling us anything. were to petty to care or understand and they have their own problems are aspirations and instincts and tendencies to deal with.

Very well put together and a post like this is refreshing once in a while to get back to the basics of the subreddit. However I do think there's information being concealed about extraterrestrial life and their possible visits to this planet. And I believe advanced civilizations are not as young as we are taught but regardless great post and upvote

I think the truth is very bizarre, but we are in a holographic "matrix" of some sort and magic and things unseen are very very real so almost anything is possible if we dream it up.

I'm working on it daily! Gotta get that collective intent.

Things can't be very real, they are either real or not real. It is a binary concept. Are the fairies that live in my teapot more or less real than the pixies that live in my suit pocket?

That's both true and false, if we live in a holographic reality and what we think is real is electrical impulses interpreted by our brain then we can have a completely real reality in our head but one that never manifests materially.

over simplification of these topics.

Regarding 9/11, there is a lot of grey space between your two examples. Holographs? No. Remote controlled? Certainly possible. It's LIHOP, MIHOP and then your "taking it too far" example which are the three main beliefs on the subject. And then, you know, the official story (the one that helps most people sleep at night).

Let It Happen On Purpose, and Made It Happen On Purpose. Old school shit by now.

Most of the time the Sith deal in absolutes

This is worth the upvote for how friendly this post is for newcomers. Should be stickied as a reminder to keep your head on straight when researching this shit.

it's like just outside of the rabbit hole is common sense and so many people don't bother to tie a line before venturing in.

Glad I could help!

if we could just get people to realize that the people that are in charge are not our friends that would be enough. also that there is no choice of who your leaders will be. its an illusion of choice. that would win the day i think. all the wars were banker wars and the killed us to make profit... once you know this you can't keep working for them and want decent leaders.

yeah mate, i've been exhausting myself trying to wake people up these last few years.... i keep having to condense it down. the only way i can work out to win is to just wake up enough. i've already put myself in a state of abundance knowing about the money system and learning about natural health... but what good is that as i see all the misery all around me.....

True: The government has technology that is about 50-100 years ahead of what we have, and they hide it and use it to give themselves more power over others.

You aren't understanding the Overton Window quite right.

There is an acceptable range of ideas (overton window), and then there is the truth. To see this in action just think back to right before Snowden's leaks and do one more example: the surveillance state.

True: the NSA and CIA spy on other country's citizens and even infects their computers with malware to listen in.

Taking it too far: your TV watches you even when it is off and everything is stored for future use by the intelligence agencies who are prevented by the constitution from operating on US soil.

Let's take this one for example:

"Taking it too far: They have secret zero-point infinite-energy technology. They have for thousands of years. They can communicate with aliens through a hyper-dimensional internet. They can communicate with the past/future and are far more powerful than you can imagine."

Why did the FBI and CIA drop a significant amount of documents concerning Tesla? These things that you say are taking it too far are things the government itself disclosed it was spending large resources on. But let's say they are disinformation. Wouldn't the bigger conspiracy in your reality be that the government is behind this narrative about ET and multiple dimensions, all for what? Why would they leak that?

What about the 1800 UFO contacts PER YEAR over the United States disclosed by the US commander of NORAD? 30+ attempts at intercepts, zero successful. If these things aren't operating under the physical laws Tesla was describing then what are they?

There is an incredible amount of proof for this, yet it is outside of the Overton Window so it is ridiculed rather than being debated on CNN and every other media outlet.

And finally, what if there was actually extra dimensional intelligences, and what if they did choose to reveal themselves, isn't everything that is happening exactly what you would expect from something that is far more advanced and different than anything we had imagined.

I mean, for fucks sake, we had video of a giant space worm in Wikileaks and nobody batted an eye!

Link to giant space worm: https://wikileaks.org/podesta-emails/emailid/11839 (check attachment - notice the file name: STS120 - that was a space shuttle mission)

Link to Zero Point Energy (Tesla's Physics) being discussed: https://wikileaks.org/podesta-emails/emailid/1802

Megathread as the leaks were coming out and people realizing there was a theme emerging: https://np.reddit.com/r/DNCleaks/comments/594ww2/aliens_megathread_2/

The core of my perspective on it all is that if you look at exactly what Wikileaks and others have disclosed it tells a story much more coherently than anyone else has been able to. The information is the same, but what we find acceptable is limited. Most people haven't looked into it very far because they can't accept that their information is controlled and everything they have slaved away for is a lie.

Wow... a sane person in r/conspiracy. Impressive. Yeah this is were I stand. I think the world could be a lot worse so don't obsess about it.

I'm glad you said this. I enjoy this subreddit but I feel like a majority of folks here assume some grand design of ill intentions behind every little thing that's ever happened.

I agree with op hard on pretty much everything here. Especially the part about pushing the extreme bullshit as part of disinfo campaigns. I don't really have anything to add, just wanted to say that I agree on basically everything there.

True: There is probably alien life out there somewhere. Taking it too far: The aliens come to earth all the time, and run all our governments. Most youtube videos about UFOs are real. Lizard people walk on earth. Disclosure is coming any day. Project Bluebeam will probably happen.

Um, any intelligent person will concede that intelligent life outside of Earth is a reasonable possibility but we don't have evidence of it, yet.

True: There is fluoride in our drinking water, and studies show it does not help teeth at all. Before we put it in our water, it was an unprofitable waste product of aluminum mining and the original advocate of fluoride in water owned an aluminum mine. It is now a profit center. Taking it too far: We are being intentionally poisoned using mind-controlling chemicals to keep us docile. People with calcified pineal glands are spiritual zombies.

Fluoride in things is, at best, a net neutral thing. Dental decay has decreased since the push for water fluoridation.

True: Some people have reactions to certain vaccines or vaccine schedules, and the government has awarded a quarter of a billion dollars in compensation in vaccine damages over the last 25 years. Taking it too far: Vaccines are designed to make us all sick, and are a secret plot by the medical industry to make everyone sick or disabled so they need medical care, which is profitable for the medical industry.

Taking it to far: Vaccination is not in the top-5 of greatest medicinal interventions in human history. The other ones are germ theory and, well...ok. Vaccinations are top-2.

True: Our mainstream society, thanks to the media and schooling system, is relatively abusive and power-seeking.

Welcome to all of human history.

True: Bush allowed 9/11 to happen, he was briefed on it repeatedly and ignore the briefings. The CIA and Mossad had a relationship with the Saudis to foment terrorism so they can continue to get funding and advance their geopolitical goals by stoking fears in the public. The pentagon was hit in the exact part that contained the documents documenting the missing Trillions of dollars the pentagon had announced the day before. Building 7 was demolished, and was not hit by a plane, and also contained many floors owned by the DoD. Taking it too far: The planes were not real and were holographic. The buildings were exploded by mini-nukes. Bush personally hired people to do 9/11 and organized it himself. The Jews did 9/11. No one died on 9/11. No one was in the planes.

The true portion contains a great deal of speculation. GWB was briefed on the risks of terrorism but not on 9/11 because 9/11 wasn't a known thing.

True: The government has technology that is about 20-30 years ahead of what we have, and they hide it and use it to give themselves more power over others. Taking it too far: They have secret zero-point infinite-energy technology. They have for thousands of years. They can communicate with aliens through a hyper-dimensional internet. They can communicate with the past/future and are far more powerful than you can imagine.

Well, that's just a whole lot of garbage. First off, 20-30 years ahead is a pretty vague timeline.

Oh, you know everything about all these conspiracies? Give me a break

Taking it too far in your estimation... "The planes were not real and were holographic. The buildings were exploded by mini-nukes..." and yet you then go on to admit that you also believe it is perfectly true that "The government has technology that is about 20-30 years ahead of what we have, and they hide it and use it to give themselves more power over others."

Well, did 9/11 give the government more power over others or not?

So what you're suggesting here all sounds pretty contradictory and inconsistent to me, to say the very least.

Now if you believe that the government has technology at it's disposal that is 20-30 years in advance of what we're aware of then it is certainly within the realm of possibility and not illogical to surmise that it could have mounted a holographic-hoax of some kind based on the potential we already know holography has and rumours about it being secretly worked on to create realistic illusions to create confusion or psychologically affect large numbers of people for military purposes that were circulating long before anyone ever connected that to the 9/11 incident. That didn't simply come out of thin air. It had been previously discussed and hinted at in technical venues by professionals in the field, which is where those rumours started.

There's also very plain evidence that video and film footage of the planes display very unusual anomalies that would be consistent with holographic imagery and some that is more consistent with compositing, masking, and putting different sources together for a combined result, take your pick. That's what you get when you examine that evidence closely as many independent professionals have and have subsequently reported. Do we ignore or take that into consideration?

The same is true about the possibility of some kind of mini-nukes or nuke-like weaponry being used based on the potential we already know exists from the limited developments on fission, fusion, scalar, and electro-magnetic weaponry we've been allowed to know a little something but not exactly a whole lot about.

Both abnormally high levels of tritium as well as traces on nano-thermite have been independently confirmed in dust samples taken from ground zero. There were also at least a hundred vehicles in the streets surrounding the WTC that were bizarrely and peculiarly flashed, burned, and burned-out, consistent with the flash and heat wave of a nuclear blast having hit them. So did one or is there some other way to conceivably explain that?

So those aren't unreasonable nor illogical suppositions. They are all well within the realm of possibility and anything that's within that realm shouldn't be discounted out of hand nor can we say with any certainty that taking them into consideration is taking things too far, by any means.

It all depends on what evidence can be found that is consistent with those suppositions and there is, in fact, some that very much does in those instances or they wouldn't be being discussed contrary to what you may think.

They may seem to be remote possibilities but their remoteness all has to do with our own limited and restricted perspective concerning the amount of development that may or may not have been secretly done or was perhaps going on even long before it was considered safe enough to allow the public to know as much as it presently does regarding those examples or permitting the limited amount of commercial exploitation that was possible based on revealing that much but no more than that about them.

In virtually every instance of taking it too far as you call it, there is a fair portion of it still in the truth zone, if it can be called that, before you lapse into your own over-exaggeration that I haven't seen any real evidence to support or suggest it's typical or a problem in this forum.

There are certain right wing elements that do in fact have a fascist social agenda as well as any number of crypto-Nazis pushing a corporate agenda that is virtually the same as existed in Hitler's Germany, that if you actually know something about that is quite apparent. Not large and significant numbers of them but that's not the point. It only takes a few such individuals in a few key positions to create what they want by manipulating events and falsifying or distorting information to advance their own particular ends. As Sherlock Holmes famously said "Once you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, no matter how improbable it is, must be the truth."

The Koreans have been getting on the cutting edge of holographic presentations. Go to 2:33 in this promo vid and watch...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CeQBGjf2zB8

I'd also agree that it's somewhat far fetched but I wouldn't go so far as to say that it's utterly impossible or completely out of the question or not worth discussing and finding out what others like yourself happen to know or think about it.

It's the existence of far too many suspicious and convenient unknowns and unusual circumstances surrounding any event that leads us to consider the possibility that a conspiracy might be involved.

I don't participate in any discussions because I'm convinced there's a conspiracy involved with those issues but rather because I'm not convinced that there isn't one and with important issues that often have unforeseen negative effects on large numbers of people that a select few happen to benefit enormously from I consider that possibility to be well worth exploring and being aware of, don't you?

According to William James who wrote the most definitive and comprehensive "Principles of Psychology" that I would recommend that everyone should take some time to familiarize themselves with, the opposite of "belief" isn't "disbelief" but rather "doubt".

Disbelief is quite simply another set of "beliefs" based exclusively on opposing someone else's beliefs. That is the province of "de-bunkers" who like to maintain that they're skeptics when there's nothing skeptical about any of their attitudes or actions at all.

They're all firm believers trying to peddle an opposing view. A true skeptic doesn't take sides or feel compelled to choose when there is an inadequate amount of information and simply chooses to "doubt" and accept that in all such cases both sides may be equally wrong with the real truth being something else again especially when someone takes the position that if they can prove the other fellow wrong they must be right by default and have quite deliberately structured their all their arguments to imply or infer that it must be some either/or proposition or nothing else.

Ten or fifteen years ago everyone thought quantum computers were at least half or even a full century or more away yet the D-Wave is out there today and has already sold a dozen or more units operating on quantum principles or that it would take far longer for the NSA to ever reach the stage where it could surreptitiously monitor and indefinitely store everyone's electronic data communications on an ongoing basis and fairly quickly pull-out reports on what any one of them did on any particular day or any time of that day even years ago because we now know they actually can and have scoped, scooped, and stored it all, ISP logs and records, banking and online credit databases, and pretty much the whole enchilada. A genuine government conspiracy and hidden agenda of almost unimaginable proportions that was nothing if not far fetched the day before we learned of it.

I like this post. It's very, very easy to fall into the trap of "everything is wrong and there is no more good in the world".

Conspiracies are just conspiracies, not world-ending, Independence Day-level, every day is a Tom Clancy novel, absolutely crazy ideas.

We do have terrible things going on in the background and many in the forefront, but it's not all doom and gloom. Occam's razor is always in effect, even if it's not always the right discipline.

There isn't a "farness" attribute to an idea that when extended too much, it becomes true or false. Things are either true or false.

People will build falsehoods upon truths. These aren't truths taken too far. They are falsehoods.

The important part isn't deciding how far you should take an idea, it's to decide what's true and what isn't. Some things are false no matter how far you take them.

Here's a list of conspiracies I believe are legit

• Flat Earth
• Israeli iron dome hoax
• Nukes being a hoax
• Cold war hoax
• Moon landings
• Mars rover
• Bataclan (done by mossad)
• Sandy hook
• 9/11 (obviously)
• Dinosaur hoax
• ISS hoax
• ISIS/ISIL being a mossad/cia fabrication
• Titanic having been sunk on purpose
• Einstein being a total fraud
• Stephen Hawking being replaced
• Hamas being Israel controlled
• Aids
• Ebola
• Global warming being anthropogenic
• Satellites
• Andreas Lubitz suicide (plane was crashed via rc)

Do I win the conspiratard award? Time will tell...

I am new to this sub and very open minded to a lot of conspiracies. Would you explain the background behind these or (if not all of them)

Flat Earth Nukes hoax Sandy Hook 9/11 ISS hoax Stephen Hawking AIDS and Ebola

Also my grandfather was an Apollo astronaut and I would love to ask him about stuff and possibly even question him about some things. Anything I should ask?

If I was to guess, I'd say a lot of people on this subreddit think you grandfather is a liar.

Which is sad as space travel is one of the few things I think all humans could get behind and are fascinated by.

Apollo was legit we now have literally pictures of the landing sites to prove it. Of course everyone on this site will say its "photoshop" anyway.

https://www.nasa.gov/sites/default/files/images/584641main_apollo17-left-670.jpg

Check out Cluesforum.info

I have a small sub called r/fakeology

Interesting to hear that your grandparent was an astronaut since I'm of the opinion that space travel is not real. Why didn't any Apollo mission photograph any stars? Why bring cars to the Moon instead of a telescope capable of transmitting images back to earth?

Aliens sank the Titanic.

The titanic fell off the end of the flat earth

How can you believe the Earth is flat? What piece of evidence sold this one for you? Who gains from the massive lie?

I guess if you think the earth is flat it would be hard to believe in satellites and I can see moon stuff getting wrapped up in there.

Have you ever tried to travel around the world and test the flat earth and non GPS theories?

Continuing to believe flat earth is honestly impressive at this point.

I like the work of a philosopher named David Coady on conspiracy theories. He is fair and does a good job of demarcating what is rational and what is irrational about them. Give it a read. This is an article published in Episteme:

https://i.imgur.com/9D8uqvC.png

https://i.imgur.com/9ZoTBiX.png

https://i.imgur.com/UT2Sbb4.png

https://i.imgur.com/qZiCUid.png

https://i.imgur.com/w7xq0P0.png

https://i.imgur.com/op4IrTG.png

"Taking it too far: aliens come to Earth regularly" How would this be taking it too far..? If people believe an in an omnipotent God this shouldn't be too far-fetched. Come on now

I know you think you're being reasonable, but I think you've gone way too far on many of these.

That is to say: As ridiculous as you think your "taking it too far" items are, I think your "true" is just as if not more ridiculous.

But you don't have to worry about what I think, because I would never do a post like yours. That would be ridiculous of me.

Ha ha, no way man, there is no way I'm having that conversation. I'd say half the sub would end up banned but we wouldn't have to worry about that because the resulting fervor from all would surely break reddit for good.

I don't see this as you posting your ideas about the world to talk about with others. It looks very much more like you telling people what's correct and what's not correct. Not even presented as your opinion but instead as objective reality. All while seemingly missing that there are those who think you've gone too far but would never crank a megaphone up to 11 to let you know.

If you truly see this post as you humbly presenting your ideas to the world for criticism, comment, & feedback, then we just disagree.

i didn't see any "truth" that was far off the mark or doesnt have evidence supporting it. hell even some of the "going too far" bits are touching on real possibilities.

True: this redditor is jelly False: this man has sekkrit informations which would cause such a fervour it would break reddit

He's not telling people HOW to think, he's expressing his perception of the conspiracies in the world and how he attempts to stay grounded in hopes that it cause discourse and fresh thought on the topic.

Unfortunately, your comment read as EXTREMELY self-righteous and closed-minded, concerning the last paragraph. At least that's my perception of your statement and your opinion on the matter. I apologize if I've hurt your feelings with this comment, but unfortunately as they say colloquially, "you reap what you sow". And here you have sown self-righteousness (be it intentionally or unintentionally). Perhaps open up to discourse WITHOUT resorting to passive-aggressive nastiness in the future. 🤗

*This doesn't apply to the first two paragraphs you wrote, as they were concise and expressed a sound response to your perception of his statement and the topic he brought up at large. Differing views should be explored mutually for the benefit of all parties and I thank you for offering yours here! 😊 I wish you luck in your future endeavors.

This would be a lot better if you had links for the true statements, and preferably not links to YouTube videos, or extreme fringe online news outlets. The best sources would be multiple archived msm articles for each point.

I checked, the quality seems to be the same or less. Okay work overall man, i agree with your perspective partially, but without citing your arguments you're wasting your efforts imo.

True - Flat earth demands very convincing evidence for such a seemingly outlandish claim. However (much evidence exists both for the flat earth and against the nasa model)[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pGl8I3l-5ac]

Taking it too far - Flat earth hypothesis is too absurd to even look into so all evidence presented can be dismissed all at once. A

He just gave you a video link. One single argument will not prove the flat earth so quit fucking asking for one bit and go do the research or you are a shill. There is plenty of scientific explanation that proves the flat earth. Its a plane not plane(t).

The earth is flat you autist iq too low too see it I suppose

Best piece of evidence is that the earth is flat lol. Shouldn't even type because clearly you don't actually care or youd spent on minute looking into this yourself.

We can see things like lighthouses and the "Chicago skyline mirrage" even though they should be 8 inches per mile (squared) lower due for hd curve but we don't. Look at the Bedford level experiment where it was proven also. Also experiments like the michelson-morley experiment proved it's motionless.

In that link all sorts of evidence is gently spoon fed to you, I mound up countless great evidence as well as a full history of the flat Earth just to make it zero effort and as little time as possible. If that's too much, you are stuck just being ignorant on the subject and shouldn't comment until you spent a few minutes understanding​ the best evidence presented.

Also for the record, sometime it take people a few hours to reply to reddit comments. That the person your talking to doesn't live on Reddit isn't evidence you're right about anything.

The whole flat earth thing is just a fun discussion of trying to twist facts in order to fit the outlandish model into reality. Its a fun "head scratcher" so to speak.

I used to be a member on flatearthsociety forum and it was clear from the discussions there that people just enjoyed trying to explain the possibility of flat earth in a way that would be really hard to debunk and it worked there were pages and pages of cool philosophical discussion about but I am CERTAIN most people on that forum did not actually think the earth was flat it was more of a brain tease kinda thing.

While I Agree with most of this, I don't think one can take it too far when it comes to questioning what is true and what is not, unless there is irrefutable evidence supporting the respective claim.

One of the only things I know to be 100% true is that we don't know what we don't know(I know, that really goes without saying). And what we don't know has a direct effect on how we percieve what we do know. I think that most of us know that there is a ton of stuff that we don't know because knowledge and facts are purposefully hidden from us by those "in charge".Thats is something I think we can all agree on. Because of this, we constantly have to question what we do know.

This is like a double-edged sword because this questioning can open up discussion and help find us to hidden truths, but it can also lead us down the wrong path. It can cause us to come to false conclusions if we disregard facts and let our skepticism get out of hand, and it can dilute truths that are already in front of us, potentially creating the many conspiracy theories that many people associate with tin-foil hats more than they do with the truth.

All this causes us to become unfocused, makes it harder for us to connect the dots, muddles our minds so much that we'll be likely to lead ourselves astray just as much those who intentionally do so.

I don't really know where im going with this, I just think that it is important for us as a whole to focus on something we do already know to be true and focus on that instead of the lies or diluted truths we know are fed to us. Perhaps focus on a common goal we all share and then strive for that goal regardless of whether this conspiracy is true, or that one isn't, or this event was false flag but that one wasn't.

I don't know, I just think we need some sort of anchor to keep focused on what really matters so we dont get caught up in all the divisiveness that seems to be inherent on the path to finding the truth. Hope that made sense

I do agree with you. There are always going to be people that disagree with each other. I will not deny that. However, I think that most of us generally want the same thing, and that is a better world where we are not lied to and our rights are not gradually infringed upon under the guise of security. That should be our ultimate focus rather than who's right and who's wrong

One of the big problems is how we go about doing such a thing, because are inevitably going to disagree about how we get to a better world. We'll even disagree on what defines a better world. You're absolutlely right about agreeing to disagree. We suck at it. We've thrown compromise right out the window it seems

This attitude that someone is "in charge" is common on this subreddit. That's the big joke of it, despite the outrage, people believe it because it is comforting to think someone, somewhere is in control. The reality is we have a bunch of disparate groups all out for their disparate interests and the world is the equilibrium point of that.

Yes, hence the air quotes. I also said people, not person.

You seem a bit defensive, i wasn't critiquing your post, just adding to it.

Sorry, that was defensive. Don't know why I thought you were talking about me specifically. Guess that's the "dust in the ego department" that Magnora was talking about. I won't assume next time.

Aren't they just... quotes?

Technically yes, but if I was speaking that comment out loud I would use the air quote gesture. Im not actually quoting anyone

I've noticed more & more that people are saying air-quote as they actually put their fingers up & do it. It's nonsensical & stupid. And now people call them air-quotes even in text.

This is a great comment. It's relevant to how to properly analyze stories/ narratives. Understanding known knowns, known unknowns and unknown unknowns. The problem with conspiracy theory is that you are up against authority. lack of complete information, and disinformation designed to cloud fact and reason.

But it's also important to realize that things aren't black and white. Just because you can't say for certain that things are true (other than math) doesn't mean we can't use that information to base the rest of our judgements off of. We have to recognize some things as true, even if we can't say for 100% certainty that they are.

As far as OP's post goes- it's a scale. He is comfortable committing to the "truths" as known knowns. The "going too far" allegations don't have the evidence and critical analysis to back them up.

As a skeptic/conspiracy theorist, I tend to work from what i know to be true- about how systems are structured and how people think and communicate. This helps me to debunk stories that have obvious agendas behind them. I find that knowing untruths and understanding why they are being communicated is a huge step towards recognizing truth.

This is why I try to think of truths in terms of percentages of how likely they are to be true.

The more evidence I see for some conspiracy the more I move it up the totem pole of likelihood in my head.

I never usually put anything at 100% true or 0% true because as you said at the end of the day it's difficult to find the right path and it's mostly group guesswork and educating guessing anyway.

Is it too simplistic to say

1. Truth has to have credible evidence

2. Taking it too far = getting carried away with speculation

Magnoray7 is a spiritual zombie!!!! Eeeek!!!

Jokes aside, I found your premise promising but your lowdown lackluster. You went too far, and not far enough.

This, I think, is why they're downvoting you.

Pretty much wouldn't call out anything as too far fetched after all the revalations that have emerged lately.

So pretty much the whole "gone too far" bit that discredits reasonable theories like: all domestic humans act abusive, the US acts facist, hyperdimensional intelligence, Zionist/Mossad involvement in 9/11, secret technologies...

All commercial plane exhaust has the potential to form contrails, atmospheric conditions can get zapped to induce overcast or clear skies. Pilots cover this up because denial, a love of flight, and dolla dolla bill yall...

Weaponized vaccines and flouride. Calcified pineal glands. Spiritual zombies. Aliens. Hologram matrix doesn't preclude free will. ...

Sssso, you know.. basically everything but flat Earth, which I allege is a disinfo narrative to discredit hollow Earth and Antarctic nephillim.

I just want to say this is a great post, and I agree with most of your comparisons.

The only ones I don't quite agree with:

Taking it too far: We are being intentionally poisoned using mind-controlling chemicals to keep us docile. People with calcified pineal glands are spiritual zombies.

It's possible, see here - but it's not necessarily a dark scheme where they are trying to intentional do it).

Taking it too far: One cabal runs the whole world and everything in it. Everything is perfectly controlled. This world is a hologram simulation matrix. Nothing is real, this is just a video game or a dream.

I think there is some decent evidence for the overarching one-cabal idea -- the black pope and the jesuits who control the vatican are at the centre of everything, have extreme wealth, and potentially a ton of secrets and artifacts.

I'm starting to believe our perceivable reality (ie. this dimension) and all other realities stem from a source holographic light "simulation." Each dimension arises through wave function collapse and the observer principle.

Hey, disagreement can lead to great insight sometimes :)

Thank you for taking the time to explain your viewpoints, and rational discussion with two oppossing viewpoints is one of the best ways to explore an idea! It's hard with these types of things because -- while the truth is surely out there -- it is so complex, deep and shrouded in mystery, that to truly claim you have a full grasp on any of the deeper conspiracy subjects would be silly.

If it was clear as day, we wouldn't be talking about it, researching it, discussing it, etc.

Absolutely approve. You are a very smart cookie /u/magnora7

Taking it too far: The aliens come to earth all the time, and run all our governments. Most youtube videos about UFOs are real. Lizard people walk on earth. Disclosure is coming any day. Project Bluebeam will probably happen.

Alright the YT stuff being "mostly real", and Bluebeam lines are not true, and are true bullshit, but there's a deep rabbithole, and acting like a "realist" and thinking there's so such thing as reptilians or anything because "it's a fantasy tale, cus science and history, and no evidence"

The next five years will prove you wrong, and they will be very dangerous times, so don't act like a "realist" and be open about things.

Even history corroborates the reptilian stories. In every corner of the globe, there are ancient stories and legends involving "naga" (and all related words), people who came "from the heavens", serpent-worship, dragons, etc.

True: All social and civil services (Education, Food, Health Care, Media etc.) are sabotaged.

True: The final move to bring forth the NWO is a Russian Chinese joint blitz on America.

True: Neither Trump or Hillary or any other politician will save you from the NWO. The only person who can save you from the NWO is yourself.

True: The times of modern peace is almost over. We are about to see another age of massive war and disaster, and we will be totally unprepared for it.

True: Rascism and Sexism is an excuse to push away from real problems and to silence opposition.

Fake: Reptilians. No explanation needed. It is created to discredit alt media.

Fake: NWO wants a nuclear Fallout. The truth is they want control, no total destruction. Total destruction is liberating.

Fake: Flat Earth. It is created to discredit alt media.

A joint Blitzkrieg from Russia and China? How did you came to that conclusion?

If anything that the current political currents go, america is being set up for a china and russia joint blitzkrieg. What it does, and has shown itself in places like ukraine, korea and south china sea/hong kong is asking for world war iii. Plus with the falling conditions of the us army due to the past obama administration (Transexuals, Women etc.) as well as america being in the verge of a phony soros revolution to overthrow trump and starting a civil war, it would not be hard for russia and china to blitzkrieg the area.

Be noted when it happens, the administration which is very likely not trump (Since a phony revolution to overthrow him has happened before this), but hillary or other marxists, and thry will make all the right descisions for russia and china.

Maybe you're getting downvotes because this is a shit-tier post, not because of another conspiracy.

Despite what the percentage says, this is a bad post.

"Our mainstream society ... is relatively abusive and power-seeking."

That's not even a conspiracy, that's just social commentary.

If you want likes, post this to Facebook.

Bloody hell what happened to credible evidence.

Is this a joke? Do people genuinely believe this crap? The gov has tech 20 years in advance? What a fucking joke.

Things they had 20 years in advance: The internet

Look up what arpanet was capable off.

It wasn't even powerful enough to load a single website even if you were to backport all code.

nightvision,

Same deal; they had prototype tech that's mediocre today.

drones, GPS, and many many more.

Same fucking deal

Why is it a ridiculous concept that they have a very well-funded R&D department? Why wouldn't they?

Because you're pretending they have magic future tech, rather than crappy but operational prototypes of not that futuristic tech.

And wouldn't they mostly keep that stuff secret until they couldn't anymore?

Because they can't keep shit secret? Nevermind Snowden doing it for the betterment of mankind. There's TRILLIONS to be made with the kind of tech you claim the gov to have.

I'm not pretending they have magic future tech. They had all that tech before anyone else! Of course it was not powerful early on, that doesn't invalidate the fact they had it before civilians did.

You do realize civilians (read: corporations) have piles and piles of prototypes that are not yet ready for consumer use?

They ARE making trillions on it. It's called WAR.

Yeah no. The poor sods researching don't get paid the millions they'd get for selling any reasonably impressive tech.

http://i.imgur.com/cseyfyA.jpg

Yes yes nice meme. Irrelevant though.

Yes I realize corporations are doing it too. Government just has the biggest budget for R&D so they get the most ahead, that's all.

You're missing the point. The gov spends a load on r&d and develops a bunch of really expensive prototype tech, but they don't advance faster than the civilians.

Yeah you're just trying to rescue your opinion, with a contradict.

Good work. This sub is a bunch of idiots.

this is great. best post on this sub in a long time. thanks

I like and appreciate you. The initial post and your responses to the comments that have followed are well thought out and articulated. You get a golden banana sticker from a stranger on the interwebz.

Downvoted because you dismissed the existence and presence of aliens on Earth.

Any intelligent researcher in these subjects should know by now that all truth is buried in disinfo. Just because you haven't spent more than 10 minutes looking into something, or have found lots of bullshit stories, doesn't mean 100% of it is bullshit.

I probably should have added the word "perhaps" in there. But considering you weren't even aware of the Disclosure Project, it makes me wonder how much time you've actually spent digging in this subject.

I agree that it can be hard at times to sift through it, and it takes a fair bit of patience and discernment, but it's worth it when it comes to something so important. Don't let the existence of bullshit deter you from searching for the reality behind it.

Aliens were invented by the CIA to cover up the jet and rocket testing in the southern US. Adam Curtis did a great documentary about it called "HyperNormalization" its a must watch.

True: JFK was killed by many different factions and organizations like the Mafia, CIA, FBI etc. because of his anti-war rhetoric towards Vietnam (he signed a memorandum to withdraw 1,000 military personnel from Vietnam), good relations with Russia and Cuba (the prevention of Cuban Missile Crisis, inviting the Soviets to begin a coalition for space research), his call for the Israel government to give up their nuclear weapons. and so on.

Taking it too far: JFK didn't die, he and everybody in the car enacted a complicated plan to fake the shoots and fake the death of JFK. The plan was supported by the US government.

The theory on how he didn't die is also quite intriguing. They claim that the government deliberately puts stupid theories on their official stories like the magic bullet theory to distract from the real truth. What are your thoughts on this theory?

Great response. I am not sure if you have ever seen the film "Conspiracy Theory" but there is a line in that film where Mel Gibson's character says that the best conspiracy theory is the one that you can't prove. If you can prove it, it means that they [the conspirators] messed up somewhere along the line.

Yeah, it is pretty cool. Anyways, it was great chatting with you. See you around.

This post is a breath of fresh air.

That's a really well thought out post you made. Certainly in the wording. A ton of information and vague ideas poured into a nutshell, with only the most plausible facts remaining. You triggered some people but not too bad, and even react to most of them in a neutral objective manner.
How long have you been doing this, do you do this as a job? You seem so good at it.

I genuinly believe your post is an example of how we can bring the current trend of polarizing every single discussion to an end.

No one ever claimed that the 9/11 planes were holographic. Did you even research this stuff??

There were no planes. The ones you see were editted in, live. With video masking.

You sure have a nack to make everything sound more rediculous than it is.

Same as how all shills claim that we thing that "hillary has sex under a pizza shop xxddddddddd" its not as simple as that and making it sound that simple and stupid is just a shill tactic to get people to think that we are just loony's.

Wait so anyone that was outside and watching the Twin Towers didnt see any planes at all? And no one has ever said anything about them claiming that the building just blew up? Weird.

Are you this daft and ignorant? Did you even do the slightest form of research about this subject?

There are enough recordings of people saying that it blew up and didnt see any planes.

I can explain every bit of it to you but I'm on my phone right now and not feeling to type whole paragraphs of text. Self-research that shit. Just lookup a video on youtube about "the key" of 9/11. Its about a masking tool.

"video masking" we are talking about 2001 here not 2017 do some research about the technology available at the time that's all you need to debunk that theory immediately. I myself in the photography business and was employed at the time and we were still shooting on film. The technology in 2001 was just not there to accomplish ANY kind of live feed masking give me a break.

Stopped reading after your first sentence.

Star wars the phantom menace was made in 1999.

You must be utterly stupid to think they barely had any tech in 2001.

Shill confirmed.

It took several months of 24/7 computer work to render Star Wars, we are talking about LIVE digital compositing and masking which was absolutely not possible how can you even compare a movie that takes many months to render to a live picture?

Oh, really?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rml2TL5N8ds&t=813s

where does it explain what equipment was used to create this?

Maybe watch the full 45 minutes? Maybe do a little more research yourself? Jesus, you stink like shill (not claiming you are one, but you smell like one)

If you have to rely on circumstantial evidence you know its bs.

But you're in this thread, right? OP was nothing more than just an "article" that was written on subjection.

my bad you video linked to a specific part in the video I thought that's the part you wanted me to watch.

You make some good points but if CIA was indeed complicit in the conspiracy to take down the Twin Towers, they might have had the technology to doctor the footage in time, but it is unlikely.

Still, we have no idea what CIA is capable of regarding the videos and photos. It is quite scary actually.

How did they stop citizen journalists who were filming the first fire when the second explosion happened from publishing the video proving this?

You're acting like the government can't just shut people down. I mean, they killed a fucking president and still got away with it. You really think someone would miss a few of those journalists? It might sound harsh, but they just aren't known enough to be cared for that it will trigger some red flag.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rml2TL5N8ds&t=813s

I simply can't believe that there were no planes because my uncle told me he saw the second plane hit the building. Also, every news team with a camera in a van anywhere in NYC was trained on the WTC at the moment the second plane hit... the extent of the cover up you are suggesting is so massive, about such an emotional event, that the human factor alone here makes your claim fail to stand up to scrutiny even without my anecdotal evidence of someone I know being there.

I am willing to entertain a lot of theories about 9/11 but the idea that no planes hit those buildings is not one of them.

There are a lot of people out there that claim the planes were holographic. Some even claim that 9/11 was perpetuated to test the capabilities of the Project Blue Beam technology. I think it is very outrageous and I have yet to see any kind of evidence to back it up.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rml2TL5N8ds&t=813s

Thanks for the link. No doubt, they doctor everything from the Zapruder film to the 9/11 footage.

What does it matter? This is a place for people to discuss openly and freely topics that they find to be conspiratorial and/or pertaining to their held beliefs on certain topics we're not normally allowed to discuss. Too much I AM right in a place that's supposed to question everything (even your own beliefs).

I did a lot of research on contrails recently and the scientific community is starting to track contrails and noticing how they turn into cirrus clouds over time and modifies the weather. So regardless of whether or not they are cloud seeding or not condensation from plane exhaust causes weather modification.

all you have to do to debunk this is calculate how much energy will be needed to "modify" the weather. No amount of jet planes can generate enough heat to affect the "weather" in any way. You can start by doing some basic simple calculations.

Compare the energy of the Sun that earth surface receives each day to the output of the jet engine and you will see how silly and laughable your theory is I am sorry to burst your bubble but laws physcis are not on your side.

Looking through this, it seems to me that the actual truth is somewhere between what you state as truth and what you state as taking it too far for a bunch of them. There are enough signs and evidence to point to further issues in many of these examples to say that there could be more and sometimes less than you are accepting.

The first one is probably fine, we know the government has technology the public doesn't have access to. We know the government has further access to tech we do have than we do. Those advances probably vary based on the different tech however, and in some instances, they may have things we won't see for the next 60 years.

On to the 9/11 stuff, I don't know where the actual truth point is, and it could even be less government involvement than the truth portion of your statement. The reality is that we don't know, but there are idiots on both sides of the equation claiming that they definitively know things based off of faulty experiments, or just bullshit. The sad part is that we won't know because we allow groups to investigate themselves, or allow national security stand in the way justice and the truth. The reality is likely that national security in this instance is politicians and intelligence agencies covering their asses.

Chemtrails on the other hand, that's where your truth is a little less informed than it should be. With the chemical testing the military has done in places like St Louis and San Francisco, we know they aren't above uncontrolled testing on the civilian population. To beleive that they wouldn't go from using roof top sprayers and fans to airplanes is a bit naive. We have the Tuskeegee experiments and other medical experiments that have gone on. None of this is to say every plane is dropping mind altering chemicals on people, it's just saying that it's very possible they have used a chemtrail like system to drop chemicals on people in the past for any number of experiments.

Then if we go to what we are being fed, it's a pretty big ass jump from not trusting what we are told to flat earth. Not trusting what I have been told does however make me question official statements about several things. Living in Washington State, I question just how safe the Hanford Nuclear reservation is. I also feel thankful that I don't live down stream. The government, and nuclear power lackies won't admit just how dangerous it is, and they tell people in the tricities area that there is no link between the nuclear reservation and increased cancer rates.

Brings me to the next one, which is vaccines. Vaccines are great, my family is vaccinated. That doesn't mean that there haven't been unauthorised uses for pacified populaces that have willingly submitted to medical authority on a subject. There was just the article stating that Johns Hopkins, a trusted and renowned medical facility giving out "medical treatment" while actually infecting people with STDs in Guatemala. If we blindly accept what is told to us, it makes the population more susceptible to these kinds of things. John's Hopkins medical professionals had no problem doing this and keeping it secret until it was uncovered by a reporter in 2010 despite it happening in the 1950s.

The fluoride stuff I don't have too much of an issue with, you summed up most of my concerns other than medical professionals not even stating fluorosis being a concern when there is no reasonable way of ensuring the dosage of the fluoride given due to flouride concentrating, and the amount of water someone drinks combined with those who use fluoridated tooth care products. There have been studies showing that the levels were too high in some places that were fluoridating.

The rest seems mostly in line with what I consider reasonable. I just wanted to point out the things I did and state that just because an entity investigates, that doesn't mean it found all of the facts. I would actually surmise that many times, those facts are covered up or obscured when people get too close.

Reasonable sometimes can be hard to come by on reddit, and especially in controversial subs like this. I think your post here puts quite a bit of it (being reasonable) on the table but I just wanted to qualify and give some perspective on a few things that I felt hadn't been stated. I also think that there will likely be plenty of people who support your post even if they don't comment, so thanks for putting it out there.

Best post I have ever seen on this sub!

I agree with you on pretty much all of this.

Where's your proof?

I have researched very thoroughly and studied the NASA photo archive and documentation well enough to conclude that US and NASA did reach and landed on the moon 6 times and its not a conspiracy.

I believe there is more than enough evidence that it happened 6 times from 1969 to 1972.

Heh, 69

^{I am a bot, bleep bloop. I am still in development, PM me if you have any concerns}

You are generally going the right direction.

Yeah, well, that's just, like your opinion man

Big disagreement. We've been an occupied nation. That's exactly why they put that fluoridated crap in our water. Soft kill politics is a real thing.

The fluoride thing is way off base in terms of ruling that out. Fluoride and compounds of fluoride are major active ingredients in psychoactive medication.

Making profit off a servile nation.... BONUS!

nothing is disinfo, everything is a product of human thought, if even 1 human thinks of 1 think for even 1 millisecond, an entire universe pops up to support that thought, it creates it to be true. so, if that is true, what should you be thinkining? more /r/upliftingnews or /r/worldnews?

what one thinks is not important, what the entire hive thinks, happens, right here

exactly what I said, the particle of life, listens to the will collectively

anyway, the question you should be asking is this, why are there no uplifting conspiracies? why only dark death fear red? why no blue? why not think, those who control the world are doing shit to do good, why not think that there are conspiracies abounfd, secret stuff to do good, why are there no conspiracies of good ghosts, no conspiracies of individuals being MK Ultraed to be gods not soldiers? and so on? ther eis uplifting news and regular news, but only regular conspiracies! why don';t you suspect good secret shit the govt is hiding from you? why do aliens have to mean the govt is bad, why not mean the aliens have established contact and are doing everything to improve earth back to balance? why no tsee all the vents unfolding as part of THAT grand ploy? why is it important to OWN. NWO why does it evoke fear? If ther is no war, how is that bad?

You don't have to hide the good stuff, that's why.

That's your opinion and that's ok. I (and many other reasonable people) do believe though that the rabbit hole goes deeper than you think.

For example, there is a lot of credible evidence that ETs are and have been visiting Earth (for a long time in fact).

How is "no one was in the planes on 9/11" too far? Drones are a thing. Big drones are a thing. Why is it unreasonable to think that they used big drones that look like planes?

Phone calls can be faked, and people can be forced to make phone calls against their will. There's a video somewhere describing a situation where the plane could have been redirected and landed somewhere else and a drone could take its place and continue flying.

If the CIA orchestrated the attack, that means the terrorists were probably working for the CIA. They could have protected the plane to protect the terrorists.

But don't the terrorists want to become martyrs?

If the terrorists are actually Muslim, sure. If they're CIA agents, their goal is to influence public opinion of Muslim countries, and they're not actually Muslim.

And also there wasn't time enough for those planes to take off and land and then remotely take off again to hit their eventual targets

The drone would be flying at the same time as the plane. When the swap happens, the plane would divert its course and start heading somewhere else, and the drone would take its place and continue flying the same path that the plane would have taken if the plane didn't swap. I'm talking about two different objects, not taking the people out of the plane then flying the same plane remotely.

The point of the swapping is to trick radars and allow them to take the plane full of people away without being noticed. Something like that, anyway. It's been a while since I've seen the video and I don't want to sift through them to find the exact one I saw.

Anyway, the point I'm trying to get across is that everything in your original post is debatable. You're just posting a bunch of your opinions, stating them as the absolute truth, and saying that everyone who disagrees is "taking it too far".

Not true - 19 arabs plotted in secret to hijack 3 commercial planes and flew them into buildings.

Not true - two brothers plotted in secret to blow up a marathon.

somebody definitely personally orchestrated 9/11 OP. It's completely physically impossible for the buildings to have collapsed the way they collapsed without the aid of explosives of some kind.

How do you feel about the premise that the general public is deliberately being initiated extremely slowly into a conspiratorial worldview - one in which our rulers are actively evil in an explicitly horrifying and paradigm shattering way, and are using occult powers against us - for the purpose of leading people to draw the conclusion for themselves that we must engage these same occult powers to understand them or stop them?

well, how familiar are you with what happens as the result of engaging said occult powers?

here's some additional data points for your perusal, at your leisure, sir: 1, 2, 3, 4

that's a difficult question. I believe occult power operates on earth chiefly through psychological and memetic avenues, that is, in the minds of humans and in the realm of information transmission. But I also believe that the functionality accessible by these avenues is so far outside what is known or expected to be possible that the phenomena is effectively best understood as supernatural.

You are wrong about how much the gov had paid out due to vaccine injury..the number is 3.2 billion dollars to over 4k families.....also that they pay it.... Its actually a tax on every single vaccine that we pay for that goes int the fund. Pharmaceutical companies are EXEMPT from damages. THANKS GWB.

I disagree that government technology is 20-30 years ahead. Unless you have a specific type of tech in mind that I'm not thinking of. Software is the dominant tech at the moment​. Everything software does now it could do 20 years ago... it just does it faster now and is easier to create and deploy. Does the government have secret tech that makes building roads more efficient, or construction more cost effective and eco friendly? Why are they hiding it? How did the government get so far ahead in R and D of say, Samsung? Medical research is a global academic effort with ample but limited funding awarded based on merit but apparently only the secret government projects make huge breakthroughs.

TRUE: secret weapons exist False: these use technology not available to the private sector

The secret space programs have technology at the level of Star Trek (instellar travel, portals, zero point energy, healing of diseases, extend life spans, etc.). For nearly every major problem in the world today they already have the technology to fix it.

They got so far ahead because they got some initial help from ETs and they kept all the great discoveries over the past 70 years secret.

They are hiding it because of all the consequences it would have if they released it. A lot of people would have to go to jail and it would create a society where the controllers are not needed anymore.

That is incredible!

• It is not what the man of science believes that distinguishes him, but how and why he believes it. His beliefs are tentative, not dogmatic; they are based on evidence, not on authority or intuition. - Bertrand Russell

Pizzagate isn't real

Fuck off.

Who made this guy the czar of conspiracy? The Archons conspiracy is one of my favorites. OP is probably a government lizard! JK, but honestly who knows?

Anyone claiming to know for sure should not be trusted. If it was that easy, this forum wouldn't exist.

Are you sure?

No, actually I'm not!

Saying fluoride doesn't help our teeth is taking it too far. It is a net positive yet you've taken it too far in your initial statement.

Google Microwave Auditory Effect before you dismiss the idea that the powers that be can communicate or receive information via space or hyper space. Our technology may be linited but other worlds it may be different.

Cozy conspiracies. Goldilocks conspiracies. Not too hot, not too cold, just right.

My problem with drawing a "too far" line is that I don't think there is anything "too far" for the banking/military cabal. They use banks to control governments to create war to make more money, and they don't really care how many people they have to kill to accomplish their goals. They run drugs to get black money and they don't care how many lives they destroy. To think that anything is "too far" for them is dangerous thinking. They will incrementally move the goalpost until you are left standing in the ocean saying to yourself "Well, at least I can still see the shore." (sorry if I broke the metaphor)

I agree with you that many of the specifics that you put in are likely disinfo (holographics planes, etc) but the idea that the some of the things in your too far are not in fact their goals (flouridating and chemtrailing us into a complacent stupor) prevents any new truths in that direction from being seriously considered.

I feel like if you had written this 10 or 20 years ago, your "truths" would have been much softer, and your "too fars" would have been much broader.

Whoa. Reasonable points made.

True: The government has technology that is about 20-30 years ahead of what we have ...

lol. No.

Hi, my mother was a captain in the '90's. As she's told me many times, and as history has proved numerous times; I'll use the pre-civilian military internet for example; they do consistently have technology developed that's 20 years ahead of commercial technology. That's what DARPA does, the reason they exist.

Technology that DARPA has is not rolled out in the field.
Lots of us can do shit on the bench in the lab long before it's field-ready and economical viable.

True: There is probably alien life out there somewhere.

Taking it too far: The aliens come to earth all the time, and run all our governments. Most youtube videos about UFOs are real. Lizard people walk on earth. Disclosure is coming any day. Project Bluebeam will probably happen.

Sometimes, what we don't say speaks volumes. I find it interesting that you worded your first sentence so extremely in your "taking it too far" reply.

I heard Oswalt was actually trying to kill the man in the front seat. That others actually shot JFK. This sounds reasonable when you look at the bullet shots and wounds. However the bullet trajectory, shots, wounds by themselves could lead to a lot of alternative scenarios. Have they done any forensic analysis on the bullet fragments and barrel?

True: Stanley Kubrick, or at the very least film techniques he pioneered, were used as plan B to ensure we won the space race against Russia in the minds of the public. Some of the footage initially shown of the moon landing may have come from a studio on earth, to make the whole thing more impressive. At the very least, Stanley Kubrick heavily alluded to this conspiracy via references in The Shinning, in order to add an extra layer of subconscious creepiness to make the viewer feel uneasy, without consciously knowing why.

Taking it too far - We never went to the moon, all of the footage was fake, there's a radiation belt we can't survive surrounding the earth, the moon is hollow or a hologram or the death star from star wars

People believe God's son was born from a virgin and a great beard man flew to the moon on the back of a horse. With that in mind, you are entitled to believe any theory you like and don't give a fuck to what others think.

True: The government has technology that is about 20-30 years ahead of what we have, and they hide it and use it to give themselves more power over others.

This statement has to be prefixed with "In very few areas." Some technologies are simply driven by corporations and consumers, and there's very little that they can be 20-30 years ahead in.

Do the government have access to faster processors and computer equipment than the rest of us: Yes, most likely.

Is this equipment more than a few years ahead of enterprise-level processors? No. The fabrication plants and techniques haven't been created for far-future chips, and government datacenters will likely be build using similar equipment to major corporation data-centers.

Does the government have access to better smartphones than the rest of us, or better cellular coverage and bandwidth? Again, no. They'll have the latest devices, and maybe some use unreleased phones, but the evolution of smart phones is driven by Apple, Samsung, Google, etc. Are they using 5G before it's released to the rest of us? As a mobile network manager, I can tell you absolutely not. They of course can get priority when on the network, but they're not using protocols and standards not available to anyone else.

Where they do have technology far in advance of what we know, are things that consumers don't use or have access to daily. Do they have a satellite network capable of real-time video from any spot on the planet? I would bet money on it. Do they have drones and aircraft more capable and faster than we think? Definitely.

Bravo.

True: The government has technology that is about 20-30 years ahead of what we have

That's not true. The government(whatever "the government" is) has access to technology that any decently large company has access to, WE just don't have access to it because it's too new to mass produce and make cheap enough to care about.

This is one of the most lucid, circumspect, and realistic posts I've ever seen on this sub.

It's not aliens that are running things. Its satanists and the demons that possess them.

Aliens are always demons. They aren't from another planet. Usually you see demons if your cognitive abilities are lowered such as through circumstances that involve one these and other similar conditions: drugs, lack of sleep, being half awake, meditation and yoga. There are bloodlines that have generational demon contracts and people born into those families are made to worship as satanists like their parents.

It seems like your way of deciding what is true or not is based on a Dep seated trust in authority.

Some of those "Too Fars" might not be as far off as you think, or at least parts of them.

I'm specifically talking about the pineal calcification one. Not only do most people have closed perceptions of the world, but calcification has lead to higher amounts of neurological diseases and lower IQ.

I recently did a research paper on the biological factors of the pineal gland for school. I couldn't include any pseudoscience (history of the pineal gland / spiritual properties) because my teacher wouldn't allow it, but anyone who is interested is welcome to check it out!

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1--sGkdeZSShx3PC0F3Je0UoqvsQ59IiOJt7dA4YXI78

Regardless, this is an awesome post and I thank you for it! :D

This post perfectly sums up the struggle taking place in this sub every day. Well said OP.

Taking it too far: Leftists are commies and the US is going to become communist Hitler Germany if we let liberalism win. Rightists are hidden neo-nazis who are all racists and want to control those who don't look like them through fascism, so if we let the right win the US will become fascist Hitler Germany.

Nazi Germany and Hitler were socialists, not communists. There's a difference between socialism and communism.

For the first one, I am not sure 20-30 years is very fair. I sincerely doubt they had they technology of today 20-30 years ago. Just think of what has changed in the last 20 years, and Moore's Law suggests its only going to be changing faster (unless some big advances are not made).

All of them.

excellent work

("illuminati" the secret society that connects all other secret societies) Their technology is highly advanced, what they reveal for public is nothing compared to theirs, even what Snowden revealed is not all, illuminati also has a lot of puppets to create disinformation through some new theories, to let your focus shift away from the important questions unto nothing, to brainwash you again, their zionist puppets such as Alex Jones, Paul Joseph Watson, create a lie through methods where they give like 90% of TRUTH, but the most important part, the 10% is a lie, to put you into wrong direction, Alex Jones never talks about the fact that jews and their puppet catholics/jesuits/muslims control all media worldwide, all huge corporations which control a lot of medium corporations, they also control UN and governments. Be careful about the "Truthers" out there, examine their behaviour and what they say and what they do not focus upon, and you should see most of what is TRUTH and what is a lie, but of course, no human can know everything, we only know small parts, only revealed by controlled oppositioners from secret societies, why would they know information that only the insiders know, David Icke is a deceiver and his things are not in TRUTH

TRUE = False Flags (CIA/Mossad/arab intelligence agencies do terror attacks, mass shooters are MK Ultra victims), chemtrails (toxic), vaccines (depopulation + illness and possibly changing genes into weaker ones), modern food industries put a lot of toxics into the foods of what you eat everyday, and also into tap water, MK Ultra.

True: MKULTRA created hippies.

Taking it too far: Hippies are still being controlled by mkultra. I call BS on that one. Anyone who has spent enough time trying to herd hippies knows that herding cats is much,much easier.

TRUE = Abortion is a human sacrifice for a fallen angel

Generally decent list, but there's no doubt that the Mossad and Israel initiated the 9/11 plot. It is connected up and down at every level of the conspiracy to Israeli nationals, Mossad agents and dual citizens, and there's no doubt that at least Dubya, Dick Cheney and their cronies were fully aware of the plot.

True: Assad is an asshole.

Too Far: That he would use chemical weapons when A) He is winning with conventional weapons and, most importantly, knows exactly what happened to his nieghborhood for merely possessing old,out of date chemical weapons. Chemical weapons that were being stored under UN supervision, at that.

True - The government has created entirely fictional stories involving children getting killed in order create a pretext.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yaR1YBR5g6U

Taking it too far - Saying that the government would never do this, and getting outraged at anyone that suggests they would.

80/20 rule, 20% are fake

I truly believe there is a massive conspiracy in space travel involving space agencies all around the world. r/Astronots

Jew here AMA: True: Isreal has gone too far in the Middle East in a lot of instances, and a lot of clandestine behind the scene Zionist operations are going on in an effort to distabalize arab countries.

False: All Jews are involved in some sort of Zionist cabal along the lines detailed in the Elders of Zion, we are ruining the world, we killed Jesus, Ashkenazic jewery are all false Talmudic white khazarian cave devils, we serve Satan blah blah blah. I cannot believe the amount of hate spouted off here regarding Jewery, the majority of which comes from people that probably should do something about thier miserable lives instead of blaming an entire race for their own failures. I shouldn't feel like some ate up fanatic grandma is going to ask to see my horns under my kippah every time I turn a corner in the grocery store.

I'm a mechanic, I work 40 hours a week, have a family, study Torah, try my best to pray three times a day, eat kosher, etc. Woo hoo scary am I right?

That is all, ShalomAliechem r/conspiracy

how is the jews did 9/11 too far ?

obviously not, if you say "America's are involved in wars all over the world" you don't mean every american supports and pushes for war...

I appreciate your post. I would like to point you to one little bit about 9/11 which I find indicated direct involvement by the Bush.

Barbara Olsen's phone calls did not happen, which means her husband, Ted Olsen, made them up. Ted Olsen was and is (IIRC) the Solicitor General of the United States. Why would a person of such high standing lie so creatively, and in such spectacular fashion about something so important?

It's also strange that he mentioned that the terrorists had knives and cardboard cutters insofar as his account, reported to the FBI on the afternoon of 9/11, predates the exposition of any and all other evidence that the terrorists were armed merely with bladed weapons.

No one, including Ted, could have guessed that, yet somehow he just knew.

Turns out he and Bush have a long history together. He defended Bush in Gore vs. Bush, and later had Bush at his wedding to his second wife...

In truth most of the theories you believe are wrong.

This is due to the nature of truth, that there is often only one correct answer to a problem but a million possible wrong answers.

Anyway, vote this sht down.

you got part of the 911 part wrong the planes weren't holographic but they likely weren't planes but missles and there was pretty much mini nukes involved.

False- it matters at all

Here's an actual conspiracy: r/conspiracy is teeming with shills and retards who deny real conspiracies.

Sorry friend: Your lame classification of "taking it to far" changes nothing. The "Khazars" actually did 911. It is true. Aliens and UFO's are real. Also true. Vaccines caused Autisim and Aspergers in many children. It is a fact. One cabal runs the whole world and everything in it. This world is a hologram simulation matrix. This is 100 Percent True. Ridicule or disbelief changes nothing. Nothing...

no. just....no.

Actually most of the things you say are "going too far" are actually real conspiracies. It gets MUCH worse than this. When you die you will be pulled into the "Fake Heaven" which is actually an Astral Holding Area. After a period you will be judged by the "Archons". They will then say you must return for "More Lessons" and to remove "Karmic Debt". Both are complete scams. Your memories will be erased and you will be reinserted into this hellhole. We are used over and over as "Energy Slaves". The Archons are Parasites, and the Earth Global Elite work for them.. Search: 1)Archons White Light 2)Archons Reincarnation 3)Archons Lords Of Karma 4)Archons Reptilians 5) White Light Trap 6)Gnostics Archons 7)Illuminati Archons 8)Illuminati Lords Of Karma 9)Reincarnation Memory Erase. If you take the time and search all these, you will come across a large amount of information.. Watching "David Icke" videos on youtube will explain everything and is something everyone should do. Cameron Day. Jay Weidner and Jeff Rense and Henry Makow are all excellent sources. This world is inching closer to an eventual WW3. People need to know all the truth now. Everything. Nothing is more important...

True: Bush allowed 9/11 to happen, he was briefed on it repeatedly and ignore the briefings. The CIA and Mossad had a relationship with the Saudis to foment terrorism so they can continue to get funding and advance their geopolitical goals by stoking fears in the public. The pentagon was hit by a missile in the exact part that contained the documents documenting the missing Trillions of dollars the pentagon had announced the day before. Building 7 was demolished, and was not hit by a plane, and also contained many floors owned by the DoD. Taking it too far: The planes were not real and were holographic. The buildings were exploded by mini-nukes. Bush personally hired people to do 9/11 and organized it himself. The Jews did 9/11. No one died on 9/11. No one was in the planes.

There is a difference between what you are willing to accept about certain events, what conspiracy communities commonly label as fact or disinfo, and what actually happened. There is definitely disinfo about exotic weapons being used (see Judy Wood), but that is meant to detract from serious allegations of non-conventional ordinance being used. Tactical nukes have been around for a long time, and more recent generations of the tech can be tuned for specific blast purposes, such as minimal radiation and maximum blast wave damage. If you are interested in researching this instead of writing it off as "that's too far, because it's hard to believe", here are some resources:

Video of a tactical nuke test in late 50's

USGS dust analysis found strontium in WTC dust

Department of Energy found tritium in WTC dust, which they claim came from the dayglow exit signs in the planes, as well as being in scopes of rifles in an armory. . .)

DoE personnel from the Office of Secure Transportation seen in WTC 7

The U.S. Department of Energy/National Nuclear Security Administration's Office of Secure Transportation (OST) provides safe and secure transportation of nuclear weapons and components and special nuclear materials, and conducts other missions supporting the national security of the United States of America.

Incredibly loud explosion seconds before north tower collapse

Wargame exercise list from 9/11 comission, search "WMD" "Terrorist group that has will and means to strike North America with WMD. TRACK MONITOR: FLY TRACK AS THOUGH IT MIGHT BE GOING TO NY OR WASHINGTON DC" -10/21/1999 "Terrorists with explosives who plan to detonate them over NYC" -9/9/2001

Nuclear Emergency Response Teams sent to training exercise in Europe on 9/10/2001 to 9/15

Continuity of Government plan designed to keep the govt running in the event of nuclear war was activated by Counterterrorism Czar Richard Clark on 9/11, some time between 9:45 and 9:56 am. The south tower collapsed at 9:59:00am, so the CoG program was activated somewhere between 14 minutes and 3 minutes before the "collapse". If it wasn't a detection of radiological ordinance that caused CoG to initiate, what else could explain that measure being taken?

This info seems to suggest that some sort of exotic tactical device was used in addition to the nanothermite that took down the shell structure. The core of the building was stronger than the steel skin around the perimeter, and watching how the cell antenna started to drop before the external structure gives credibility to the core of the building being destroyed before the exterior. That timing lines up with the loud boom in the tripod video.

"But what about the radiation?" Take a look at the occurrence of rare cancers first responders and people in the area have died from, including an astoundingly high rate of Hodgkin's lymphoma. Blasts could have been tuned for minimal radiation, but there would still be some. It's also interesting that nothing was build over the old foundations of the buildings. Instead there are two fountains that constantly flush water over the area.

"It's hard to put it into words, and maybe one doesn't need to"

these ideas are hard to communicate on here without writing a huge paragraph. i believe about 90% of this, but if youre on mobile and try to say these things you get called a shill. ive thought for a long time that there was a pedo/human trafficking ring. its not a conpsiracy, its a fact. but if you tell people that comet ping pong had nothing to do with it, you get called a shill. its gotta be black or white with so many people on here, it gets tiring.

furthermore, the whole pizzagate thing is a fad and it is thankfully dying out on here. but now it seems people are very pro govt. i never thought id see a conspiracy theory group that was pro govt. i guess you could be pro trump but anti govt, it wold be like a senator saying they want smaller govt. youre talking out both sides of your mouth. because if youre pro trump, youre pro govt, because he IS the govt. ist ahrd for some people to wrap their heads around, the idea that the government is bad except for the guy at the top. the notion is ridiculous.

Harvard proved flouride is toxic to health.

https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/news/features/fluoride-childrens-health-grandjean-choi/

I used to check out his stuff on AA, then I saw some of his recent presentations. Holy fuckballs!

Hahahahahahahaha people HAVE leaked it. Please check out the Disclosure Project! Whatever people say about Steven Greer, those testimonies are interesting!

it's like just outside of the rabbit hole is common sense and so many people don't bother to tie a line before venturing in.

What was the context? I saw a video from 2011 of Trump saying pizzagate.

Also too far: the driver delivered the fatal shot.

You're welcome to provide evidence that Obama spent $65k on hot dogs

This was an email chain at Stratfor literally about having a Chicago hot dog Friday to celebrate "all you hot dogs out there." It's a work event based on a silly pun, which is pretty normal, he'll I have a "popcorn popup" meeting at 2:00 today. Fred Burton replied joking that they should use the same source as Obama.

None of this has anything to do with trafficking children.

Horeshit? You are talking about (extreme) political beliefs, which are comfortable in their own way, but are hardly closer to fact than those you dismiss outright.

And fly in the same "waitresses"

The fluoride thing is way off base in terms of ruling that out. Fluoride and compounds of fluoride are major active ingredients in psychoactive medication.

A real live birther in 2017, wow.

Take a look at some interesting fluid mechanics and geometric reasons for why that could be, it is just a swirling ball of gas in the end

Errr... no, they're downvoting you because your idea is so incredibly incoherent that even the people in this community (where interdimensional aliens and vast Jewish conspiracies are taken seriously) find it beyond the pale

Uh, no? It was from a place they like in Chicago... Where they're from.

Logic. It's not magic.

Lol, sorry, bad phrasing, the idea of whatever crackpot wacko with zero knowledge of astronomy, earth science, and physics

I could go into it, but honestly I don't care.

This sounds like a 3rd grader's defense.

Also the fact that you posted it three times

http://www.space.com/30608-mysterious-saturn-hexagon-explained.html

I'm under the belief that the majority of 'ridiculous' conspiracy theories are invented as a hobby by a diverse group of people who are looking to entertain themselves.

I myself made up an elaborate multi-level conspiracy to entertain a group of friends for a roleplaying game. Obviously I didn't post it onto the internet where it would be confused for being proposed as how the world actually works but I could total relate to someone who does

As I mentioned above, I spoke to an old Hawaiian man who knew Obama's grandparents. They were shocked to hear he became president because they knew he wasn't born in the US.

Well I'm not sure the majority of the "out there" theories are people spreading fiction for fun, that seems like a pretty low life thing to do lol. It's probably more likely that some of the crazier stuff were baseless or weaker theories that some people assumed were fact and spread like that. Just as how religion (which has at least some falsehoods/misleading information if not mostly lies) was assumed (believed) to be the true words of the creator...

But we won't know if this theory is complete BS to take the zionist globalists off the hook morally (hence "THE DEVIL MADE ME DO IT!" bullshit) or if there is some truth to this odd phenomenon. I do think that just because there's a vague physical explanation, doesn't mean there isn't more to the phenomenon.

E.g. "the illuminati triangle is JUST branding, nothing significantly more" which is probably not true, I think there's more to it than that. The geometry aspect may not just be random physics. Another example: "9/11 can be explained by explosives planted by the elite, nothing satanic about that! Just human scum, that's all."

But the satanic link runs quite deep, it's difficult to believe the satanic shit is random, a popular baseless religion among (relatively educated) elites or that they're all psychotic by chance. I think in this case, the smoke leads to the fire.

I might be wrong, but I think it would be unwise to stop at this point, and instead consider it a possibility until evidence proves or refutes major components in the theory. Disinfo is still a possibility but we can't assume that so quickly.

there was also a lot of crossover between the obama is a secret muslim not born in the us and the "OBAMMY IS GONNA TAKE OUR GUNS!!!" crowd. and still today if you bring up that obama didnt take our guns they go into well he added this regulation or he would have if X didnt happen etc etc, but they will never admit that it didnt even happen. its so strange.

Never mind the CIA memo that was sent to a George HW Bush, conveniently the CIA says it was a different Bush. That one didn't have the clearance to be receiving the memo sent to Dallas.

I guarantee 100% that those aren't accurate replicas, for many reasons.

Prove it.

nah the documentary is about many different things its worth the watch for sure.

Like i said, there are plenty of difficult to answer questions and that's definitely a good example of one. My point was merely that pyramids in separate locations is not necessarily evidence of a connection.

i think its safe to say that's not him