Question: Do you do all your own research?

It's pretty impressive. Appreciate the posts.

I've been saving all of these into this sprawling doc. Love this shit.

Me too. Saved them all. The amount of info is unreal. Serious amount of hours put into all this...as we both know.

Me three. I have a direct link on my sub to this users posts.

Which amounts to an unsourced (and unsourceable) rant and wall of text peddling blatant disinformation, with the intent to shift blame and attention from the Zio-Ango-American alliance (and the elite of the elite among them) to their Italian lackies and subordinates.

It's a pretty obvious tactic, and a shame to see this sub falling for it, not just once but repeatedly. He could literally be making shit up off the top of his head (which he is) and people here will still mindlessly upvote it and take it as gospel, which is pretty sad when if actually think about it.

hmmm... i wonder why you are tagged as propaganda poster 2

I don't know. You tell me.

pay no attention dude is a shill

Yeah more nonsense and inconsistencies, when it isn't just vague common knowledge or random facts taken wildly out of context to fit your own BS you literally just made up yourself.

Is this your alt? It kind of looks that way, to be honest. And I'm the last person who could be remotely classified as a "shill" being a former mod here, and regular contributor to various conspiracy-oriented subreddits, a majority I also currently moderate. WTF kind of shill would post shit calling out the CIA and USG on a regular basis?

you shill for various websites. it obvious looking at your post history you have some vested interest in the websites you spam all over reddit.

I post from literally dozens of websites, on a daily basis, primarily to subreddits I moderate, because a) I enjoy contributing content and want to give something back b) some of these smaller subreddits hardly get any content and would be dead otherwise and c) these are issues the MSM does not cover adequately that I believe more people should be aware of.

I apologize. I just found it odd you posted links from questionable sites as often as you do. Your explanation makes sense so again I apologize.

No worries man. I'm over it. And I apologize if I was a little short last night. Lack of sleep and pointlessly arguing over the Internet will tend to do that, occasionally.

Also I never attacked ur character from any other account. Do I have alt-accounts yes, but they never post on this sub or any other sub you moderate.

That's a bold-faced lie, and wouldn't even be necessary or make sense to do so. You're only saying that to distract from the fact I called you out on various inconsistencies and literal bullshit in your post.

To clarify, from a previous comment with this person:

If you want to know what I changed, I'll show you, for the sake of transparency:

Which amounts to an unsourced (and unsourceable) rant and wall of text peddling blatant disinformation, with the intent of shifting blame and attention from the Zio-Ango-American alliance (and the elite of the elite among them) to their Italian lackies and subordinates. It's a pretty obvious tactic, and a shame to see this sub falling for it, not just once but repeatedly. He could literally be making shit up off the top of his head (which he is) and people here will still mindlessly upvote it and take it as gospel, which is pretty sad when if you actually think about it.

I removed the unnecessary 'when' from the last sentence because it made no sense after I read it. I also see I typo'd Anglo, accidentally typing Ango instead.

So why would you falsely claim I removed a remark that I study Hermeticism, which I actually made later in the conversation and did not remove or edit? That makes no sense whatsoever.

Your original thesis for attacking my post was backed up by your claim to studying Hermeticism.

You claimed the Medici family was 'running' the Golden Dawn, excuse me, Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn. As someone who has studied this order and related subjects extensively, I asked for proof or a source, to which you responded with more vague unrelated facts that provided no proof or direct or even indirect connection. When you could no longer get away with changing the subject with walls of texts consisting of unrelated or vaguely related topics, you then began to attack my character by blatantly lying about an earlier comment I made, then using an alt account to accuse me of being a "shill" (which is laughable considering my history here) and now by calling me a "snake".

I was expecting an honest and civil debate, or some kind of verifiable information ideally, or at minimum a questionable source or two to back up your claims, which you have failed to produce, instead resorting to personal attacks and outright lying about what you claim I said which wasn't even relevant to the discussion, aside from you attempting to use it to further attack my character, which only makes me further question your motives and intentions in doing so, and your posting what appeared on the surface and now moreso after further scrutiny to be a form disinformation.

TL;DR

The parent mentioned New York Stock Exchange. For anyone unfamiliar with this term, here is the definition:^{(In beta, be kind)}

The New York Stock Exchange (abbreviated as NYSE and nicknamed "The Big Board"), is an American stock exchange located at 11 Wall Street, Lower Manhattan, New York City, New York. It is by far the world's largest stock exchange by market capitalization of its listed companies at US$19.3 trillion as of June 2016. The average daily trading value was approximately US$169 billion in 2013. The NYSE trading floor is located at 11 Wall Street and is composed of 21 rooms used for the facilitation of trading. A fifth trading room, located at 30 Broad ... [View More]

^{See also: Knight | Royal | Electronics | Shell | Controller | Dominant | Honorary | Bench | Temple | Banco}

^{Note: The parent poster (AhuwahZeus) can delete this post | FAQ}

good info if you alllow me to ask who owns big automotive groups like wolkswagen daimler chrysler land rover ferrari

Where and when, exactly, did the Medici family ever 'run' the Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn? I've studied the HOGD extensively, for years, from their formation, their precursors (the SRIA, Fratres Lucis, Nascent Dawn, Order fo the Golden & Rosy Cross, etc), to their present day incarnations (both esoteric and exoteric ordres, and their derivitives, and have never seen a shred of evidence or reference to the Medici family being involved with this order.

If you have any evidence or sources to back up your claims, by all means share them, because it's apparent most of what you're saying is your own theory based on your own assumptions with little to no evidence to back it up, if not intentionally deceptive disinformation.

You repeatedly take fragments of truth and unrelated facts and blend them together to form an inaccurate and deceptive narrative (i.e. disinformation).

The fact that they practiced Kabbalah and Alchemy isn't surprising, and doesn't prove they ever 'ran' the Golden Dawn, as there have been countless alchemists and kabbalists before and since.

On the contrary, I've looked at your source and found it irrelevant to the question I asked. Your source implied they practiced kabbalah and alchemy, which was practiced by others for centuries before the Golden Dawn even existed, and countless others who have come since.

Not intentionally, and basically irrelevant as Hermeticism is only one of the various currents present in the HOGD, nor is the Golden Dawn the only order practicing a form Hermeticism (far from it), let alone proof that anyone vaguely associated with Hermes or Hermeticism is somehow 'running' the Golden Dawn as you claim (without proof or evidence or a single source stating so for verification).

I'm more than familiar with Hermeticism, enough to know it is as integral to Rosicrucianism, (esoteric) Freemasonry, Hermetic Qabalah, Thelema and other groups as it was/is to Golden Dawn.

The vague connection to them revering Hermes does nothign to prove an association with the HOGD. You're basically making up a connection where none exists based on vague similarities (to anyone who actually knows what they're talking about).

Apparently you didn't read my response either, as it still does nothing to prove an association with let alone that they ever 'ran' the Golden Dawn.

If you'd like to learn more about hermeticism you can start by reading the Emerald Tablet of Hermes, containing the source and origin of the hermetic axiom / law of correspondence 'as above, so below,' purportedly authored by none other than Thoth / Hermes himself, in the form of Hermes Trismegistus according to esoteric lore.

You will find the additional translations and commentaries here:

• The Emerald Tablet of Hermes (History of the Tablet with Multiple Translations and Commentaries)

• (Tabula Smaragdina) The Emerald Tablet - Solve et Coagula

• A Hyper-History of the Emerald Tablet - AlchemyLab.com

• The Emerald Tablet | Hermes, Thoth, Alchemy | Authenticity

• Various Pieces on the Emerald Tablet - The Alchemy Web Site

And for other works and resources pertaining to hermeticism:

• The Divine Pymander of Hermes Mercurius Trismegistus

• The Corpus Hermeticum & Hermetic Tradition -- The Gnostic Society Library

• Hermetic Fellowship: What Is Hermeticism?

• Hermeticism - Hermetik International

• Hermetic Texts - HermeticSource.info

• The Golden Dawn Library - Hermetic Collection

• The Hermetic Library - Hermetic Library

• light.org | Hermetic Studies

• The Ritman Library » Hermetica

• Initiation Into Hermetics by Franz Bardon

• Contemporary Hermetic Essays - The Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn

Hermeticism and alchemy are not mutually exclusive, and certainly related if not deeply intertwined, but to claim Hermeticism is a 'Satanic' cult is a bit of a stretch (to say the least).

Another wall of text taking vaguely related concepts, a handful of facts and armful of your own opinions to form a narrative that isn't wholly accurate. Again, a source for this assertion (outside of your own opinions) would be nice.

A retort, based on my years of research into this particular order, as to their origins and practice, easily verifiable with sources and one's own research:

As for the Golden Dawn, it's also worth noting it was and remains a syncretic amalgamation of various practices originating from a variety of currents and lineages of esotericism, not solely or perhaps even primarily that of Sabbatean or Lurianic Kabbalah, which would be but one among many that have contributed to its ritual and curriculum, but in addition to the following:

Rosicrucianism, Hermeticism, Hermetic Qabalah, Alchemy, Freemasonry, Kemetic / Egyptian Mysteries, Greek Mysteries, Neoplatonism, Theurgy, the Tarot and Enochian magic, among others.

The source of the Sabbatean current would have arisen from one of its concurrent and direct predecessors, the L’Aurore Naissante (or “Nascent Dawn”), a Rosicrucian lodge descended from the Fratres Lucis (in turn descended from the Gold und Rosenkreutz Orden), which was one of the few lodges at the time to allow Jewish initiates, who by nature of joining such a lodge would have been drawn toward mysticism in general, and due to their heritage would have explored the Kabbalah. Some of those deeply involved with the L’Aurore Naissante lodge were also known to have Sabbatean leanings, hence the influence of that current on the subsequent Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn.

A basic overview of the Golden Dawn's lineage(s):

Fratres Rosae Crucis of German (ca. 1450) -> the Fraternitate Rosæ et Aureæ Crucis (R. et A.C.) (1580 or 1517) -> Orden des Gülden und Rosen-Creutzes (1710) -> Gold und Rosenkreutz Orden (1757, 1767 & 1777) -> Asiatic Brethren / Fratres Lucis (“Brotherhood of Light” or “Illuminati”) (1780) -> L’Aurore Naissante (or “the Nascent Dawn”) / Loge zur aufgehenden Morgenrothe (“Lodge of the Rising Dawn”) (1807) -> Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn (1888)

&

Fratres Rosae Crucis of Germany (ca. 1450) -> the Fraternitate Rosæ et Aureæ Crucis (R. et A.C.) (1580 or 1517) -> Orden des Gülden und Rosen-Creutzes (1710) -> Gold und Rosenkreutz Orden (1757, 1767 & 1777) -> S.R.I.A / Societas Rosicruciana in Anglia (1865) -> Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn (1888)

The original Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn's founding members and grade structure were largely derived from the S.R.I.A., while the bulk of their ritual and curriculum was derived from the enigmatic 'Cypher Manuscripts' and eventually 'Flying Roll' documents of the R.R. et A.C., presumably originating from the 'Secret Chiefs' of the L’Aurore Naissante, if not another more secretive order.

In short, there was a fair amount of cross-membership between certain Masonic lodges of the time and the Golden Dawn. The founding members of the G.D. for example had used the degree/grade structure from a lodge of which they were initiates, the SRIA or Societas Rosicruiana in Anglia, a Masonic-Rosicrucian appendant body still associated with Freemasonry to the present day, a lodge descended from the Order of the Golden and Rosy Cross, which the SRIA in turn had borrowed its grade structure, and worth noting while it was primarily a Rosicrucian order the Order of the Golden and Rosy Cross had required its initiates to be Master Masons in good standing.

As for the enigmatic Cipher Manuscripts, from which the ritual and doctrine of the G.D. was formulated, it would appear likely they were originally authored by what the G.D. regarded as their 'Secret Chiefs' or rather the high-grade initiates of the third and inner order of the L’Aurore Naissante (or Nascent Dawn), itself an offshoot of the Asiatic Brethren or Fratres Lucis (Brotherhood of Light or Brotherhood of Illuminati), which had itself also in turn arose from the Order of the Golden and Rosy Cross.

So there you have it. There isn't a direct link between Freemasonry and the G.D. per se, rather a variety of indirect links consisting of cross-membership between their lodges and partial concurrent lineage or ancestry diverging at certain points in history.

For additional research into these subjects, I will refer you to the following:

• Freemasonry and the Occult

• Roots of the Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn

• The Origins of the Qabalistic Tradition of the Golden Dawn

• The Sabbatian Qabalah and its relation to the Golden Dawn

• The Golden Dawn FAQ

• The Golden Dawn Cipher Manuscript

• An Overview of the Alchemical and Magical System of the Gold- und Rosenkreuz Order

• Rosicrucians of the Orient (or Brethren of the Orient or Asiatic Brethren)

• Asiatic Brethren: Esotericism, Intolerance, and Conspiracy in the Age of Enlightenment

• The Magical Revival by Kenneth Grant

And which Rosicrucian Order would you be referring to? As there are dozens currently, and have dozens more that have arisen and faded into obscurity.

Even if that were accurate (which I would find surprising at this point) how does that prove the Medici family was ever involved with let alone had 'run' the Golden Dawn?

I'm asking because it seems like you're spreading false information, either intentionally or unintentionally, and hate to see this sub mindlessly upvote obviously false info / disinfo.

You admitted you are involved with Rosicrucianism and Hermeticism.

I never said I was 'involved' with Rosicrucianism or Hermeticism, but have studied it among other topics pertaining to the occult and esotericism extensively, for years, yes.

The official AMORC is what I am referring to.

The AMORC is only one of the numerous Rosicrucian orders currently in existence, and often regarded as one of the least credible and most spurious among them.

Once again you left out the word Hermetic when referring to the Golden Dawn.

Yes, because that's what most people tend to call it, and if you're going to repeat the name of the organization repeatedly it isn't practical to type out HERMETIC ORDER OF THE GOLDEN DAWN in each sentence. Most people just say HOGD or Golden Dawn for short.

Seriously? That's your response? You think anyone who calls you out for your bullshit is in a cult, as you stretch the facts to fit your narrative without any evidence or sources to back up your actual claims.

I never edited out that I studied Hermeticism. I told you I studied Hermeticism in a later comment explicitly. What I edited was a typo that made no sense reading it after the fact, and now you're literally putting words in my mouth.

So why do you need to resort to lying? Because it's obvious I have no reason to change that when I clearly stated I studied Hermeticism later in the conversation, and wouldn't make sense for me to mention it in that comment regardless. It's a moot point, and shows you're being deceptive.

If you want to know what I changed, I'll show you, for the sake of transparency:

Which amounts to an unsourced (and unsourceable) rant and wall of text peddling blatant disinformation, with the intent of shifting blame and attention from the Zio-Ango-American alliance (and the elite of the elite among them) to their Italian lackies and subordinates. It's a pretty obvious tactic, and a shame to see this sub falling for it, not just once but repeatedly. He could literally be making shit up off the top of his head (which he is) and people here will still mindlessly upvote it and take it as gospel, which is pretty sad when if you actually think about it.

I removed the unnecessary 'when' from the last sentence because it made no sense after I read it. I also see I typo'd Anglo, accidentally typing Ango instead.

So why would you falsely claim I removed a remark that I study Hermeticism, which I actually made later in the conversation and did not remove or edit? That makes no sense whatsoever.

That isn't even an accurate assessment of Hermeticism.

I can see this debate is pointless. As such, I'm not going to waste any more time engaging you further. Enjoy the rest of your day/night/holiday.

Again, you're taking vague similarities and random factoids to make bold claims that aren't even accurate.

Assuming the above is true, in regard to their erecting a statue of Hermes and practicing Kabbalah (or Hermetic Qabalah), which wouldn't surprise me, it's a far cry from being proof that they 'run' the Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn as you claim.

Jesus man

You mentioned

Pierre Louis-Dreyfus

Has Julia Louis-Dreyfus, the actress from Seinfeld, any connection here. Her family are billionaires iirc.

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You admitted you are involved with Rosicrucianism and Hermeticism.

I never said I was 'involved' with Rosicrucianism or Hermeticism, but have studied it among other topics pertaining to the occult and esotericism extensively, for years, yes.

The official AMORC is what I am referring to.

The AMORC is only one of the numerous Rosicrucian orders currently in existence, and often regarded as one of the least credible and most spurious among them.

Once again you left out the word Hermetic when referring to the Golden Dawn.

Yes, because that's what most people tend to call it, and if you're going to repeat the name of the organization repeatedly it isn't practical to type out HERMETIC ORDER OF THE GOLDEN DAWN in each sentence. Most people just say HOGD or Golden Dawn for short.