Want proof of which "team" is doing the most brigading? Sort the comment sections of each of these posts by Top for your answer.
32 2017-07-27 by DontTreadOnMe16
I'm so sick of this nonsense. Even though I know I'm wasting my time because this post will be flooded instantly with trolls, I still feel it's worth writing.
Which side of the argument do you see with the most upvotes on BOTH posts?
Then, for some additional entertainment, sort the comments by Controversial and see how the conversation changes.
Vote counts mean nothing anymore.
Edit: I'd like to make this as clear as possible: this is not a left vs right issue. Both sides can go fuck themselves. This is about a group that is meddling with a sub that I have been an active and contributing member of for years, and I can't stand seeing what it has become.
40 comments
1 ArchonFall4All 2017-07-27
I don't think their goal is to even convince anyone of what they're saying. Nobody here is fooled by it. I think they just want to make a lot of noise and drown out any meaningful discussion
1 DontTreadOnMe16 2017-07-27
True, but I think it's also for the people that are not into conspiracy theories at all, who stop by because they heard something about Awan, or saw a post reach r/all. These are the people they want to dissuade from listening to anything us "crazy tinfoil hat wearing conspiracy theorists" say. Just have the top few comments being completely against the idea, and anyone passing by will walk away thinking that must be the idea with the most consensus.
Otherwise, what's the point of just making noise to drown out meaningful discussion?
1 ArchonFall4All 2017-07-27
Yeah, that's true. They heavily attack anything that reaches "Hot", which seems to be targeting the casual or new users. But the fact that normal users can see through the BS means that these groups have to keep up their charades indefinitely. I wonder how much money they're willing to waste to fight a losing battle
1 MissType 2017-07-27
New users become regulars, and regulars know what's going on.
1 DontTreadOnMe16 2017-07-27
Not enough of them, sadly.
1 Nogrim6 2017-07-27
exactly, all they need to do is annoy people enough that they just stop bothering to sift through it and they are successful.
1 CG28 2017-07-27
It's obvious to anyone who is looking.
1 DontTreadOnMe16 2017-07-27
Agreed. My goal is to try and make it obvious to those who aren't looking.
1 FealessReader 2017-07-27
Obvious jokes are obvious
1 mastigia 2017-07-27
Whewie, I saw those threads go down last night and avoided them for obvious reasons. But ya, that is pretty stark.
1 ForRealThisTimePlaya 2017-07-27
Post bitching about left wing shills: 544 upvotes.
Post bitching about right wing shills: 244 upvotes.
So you're positive that shills are brigading the comment section. How do you know it's not the exact opposite? What if the community is sick of being overrun by shills spamming the front page with the_donald talking points? How do you know that there aren't bots upvoting the posts and staying out of the comment section? Why are you so sure that left wing bots would ignore post upvotes and just focus on the comment section?
The answer is you don't. Both sides are constantly accusing the other side of shilling. It's stupid. We should just have a discussion instead of just throwing around accusations. It's just a waste of time.
1 DontTreadOnMe16 2017-07-27
As if the left wing bots are incapable of intentionally upvoting the opposite one so that people like you can say "SEE!!!?? The pro-Trump one got more upvotes!!! It's obviously them!". Same exact tactic as that whole "Proof of T_D bot accounts" post that they use as their only supporting evidence that this place is overrun with T_D trolls.
My conversations with other users are rarely (if EVER) derailed by "T_D"/right wing shills. But I have to deal with pro-MSM, left wing, anti-conspiracy theorists on a daily basis.
This is not about parties, this is about who is really fucking with this sub. And after being here essentially every day for years, it's glaringly obvious who the real problem is. Sorry if it happens to be the party you attached your identity to.
1 ForRealThisTimePlaya 2017-07-27
Haha right. So left wing shills are on here constantly upvoting anti-left wing posts just they can whine about all the anti- left wing posts on the front page all the time.
That's a fuckin joke right?
1 DontTreadOnMe16 2017-07-27
Not constantly, no. But there are definitely examples of this, absolutely. Does that sound implausible to you?
1 ForRealThisTimePlaya 2017-07-27
Dude most people who use reddit don't event leave comments or browse the comment section. I'm sorry but this theory of yours just makes no sense at all. Why would a left wing company pay people to up vote right wing material to the front page for the sole purpose of whining in the comment section about all the right wing material on the front page?
If I was paying people to manipulate reddit, the best use of your time and money would be to get posts that forward your agenda on the front page of what ever sub you're manipulating. Can you imagine right wing companies paying Trump supporters to up vote anti Trump posts just so they could whine about how liberal Reddit is? That just makes absolutely no sense to me.
1 thealiensarejealous 2017-07-27
It's called reverse psychology and it's one of their favorite tricks.
How do they gain people's support for someone? They make the mainstream narrative "against" them. Not hard to understand at all.
1 DontTreadOnMe16 2017-07-27
I can't really tell if you're legitimately interested in hearing more about why I believe this to be true, or if you're just asking a bunch of rhetorical questions and have already written me off as a crazy "alt-right" conspiracy theorist and nothing I say will matter.
If you'd like to have an honest discussion to try and at least understand the other side's viewpoint, then I'd love to explain a little more about how and why I've reached my conclusions. But if it's the latter, I'm learning not to waste my time with closed-minded trolls who are just here to make fun of people who don't see reality exactly as they do.
I'm not trying to be your enemy here.
1 Diarygirl 2017-07-27
Did you read what you wrote? You pretended to be non-partisan at first but then you not only out yourself as very partisan toward the right.
1 DontTreadOnMe16 2017-07-27
All I did was state a legitimate observation that I've seen from my years of being here. And unlike the shills that claim to be "long time r/conspiracy user", my history will clearly demonstrate that.
And in this particular instance, it looks like the left is significantly worse than the right. I despise when either side does it, but if voicing my opinion that the left does it more makes me "partisan toward the right", then it's just for this specific topic. That doesn't mean I'm partisan toward the right for every other issue.
1 willistheillest 2017-07-27
Based on the amount of Podesta, Hillary, DNC stories on the front page, I have the exact opposite observation. I also notice that the top comment in those stories is someone shitting on the story 50% of the time. So where do all those upvotes on the post itself come from?
1 CG28 2017-07-27
I find it funny how you come here defending the DNC when nobody explicitly said which side was being attacked.
1 atavisticbeast 2017-07-27
Stop pushing the left-right/ R vs. D paradigm.
The elites are the enemy of the people. Period. Doesn't matter what "team" they play for, they don't give a fuck about you and me.
1 DontTreadOnMe16 2017-07-27
This has absolutely nothing to do with left vs right. This has everything to do with the people who are fucking up my favorite place on the internet. Check my history for yourself, see for yourself how anti-two party system I am. But as a long time r/conspiracy contributor, I can see exactly who is really responsible for turning this place into the shit show it has become since 2016.
I literally tell that to at least one person every single day of my life. Glad to see you've got the right idea, but that does not apply here.
If one side is fucking with something I love, pointing it out doesn't make me automatically pro-the other side.
1 atavisticbeast 2017-07-27
I think it's incredibly obvious that this board is heavily astroturfed by both liberals and pro-trumpers.
Generally, if people disagree with that, I assume they are harboring some partisan bias.
I do realize that is premature and unfair, however, and I apologize.
Me too. Keep up the good fight, brother.
1 DontTreadOnMe16 2017-07-27
That's a great point. I'll edit the OP to try and clarify how much I don't want this to be a left right issue.
1 buzzsum1 2017-07-27
I have been a lurker on reddit for quite a while. I rarely post on any subreddits, this is one of the most underexposed problems in America today.
1 WooTs_67 2017-07-27
They are going to come to this thread as well
You know what the mods should do for threads like that.
Wait for a bit, let the comments get upvoted, then set it on contest mode. That would probably piss them off
1 Ignix 2017-07-27
Not a bad idea. Hey /u/mastigia, /u/axolotl_peyotl, what do you think about using contested mode for hot topics?
1 mastigia 2017-07-27
I think it is a good idea, but every time we bring up contest mode everyone calls us names.
1 MissType 2017-07-27
The people name calling tend to do it anyway, regardless of what you do. They won't like this idea because it'll have a financial impact.
1 Ignix 2017-07-27
Then it is an excellent idea to implement. It will combat the vote manipulation we are seeing and throw a wrench in the propaganda machinery.
Just do it!
1 fuster_cluq 2017-07-27
This is a good idea, don't worry about name calling, the real users in here would support you. As a mod, you are on the front lines of the shill battle and you mods should represent the actual users in this sub who want it to flourish. Seriously, you mods are our only hope to retain a forum which allows the free flow of information and ideas, we will support any efforts at maintaining the integrity of this sub
1 axolotl_peyotl 2017-07-27
What if whenever a post reaches #1 in the sub it automatically goes to contest mode...it's usually only the top posts that really get hit.
1 Ignix 2017-07-27
No, it happens on pretty much all political submissions from my experience.
1 MissType 2017-07-27
Yes! Contest mode is generally disliked, but I really like this idea. All that hard work for nothing. They need help realizing they're wasting their time here.
1 ArchonFall4All 2017-07-27
Mods should seriously consider this.
1 RecoveringGrace 2017-07-27
That, and opt out of r/all and allow totesmessenger bot to alert the thread when it's been X-posted to another subreddit.
1 sudo-tleilaxu 2017-07-27
I can make the case that mods should put all current event MSM posts of any political, right/left paradigm on contest mode. Especially if it is just a link without any supporting commentary by the OP.
If the OP makes a valid case for why their submission is particularly germane to /r/conspiracy in particular then the comment section can stay in the traditional upvote/downvote format. If someone makes a submission and makes their case as to why it fits the sub it sort of acts as a CAPTCHA / Turing filter by default. Putting the politics and left/right agenda-driven posts in contest mode is fucking brilliant. I am all for this idea.
1 MissType 2017-07-27
Very good point. Regular (actual) users see it, but unfortunately anyone visiting the sub won't be aware of the manipulation at first glance.
1 TomSwirly 2017-07-27
This idea people have? That if someone disagrees with their ideas, they're a paid commentator or shill?
I can't imagine another idea that's better for shutting down any sort of rational, respectful discussion!
Let me be brutally frank here - given the wretched quality of most of the logic and arguments I see here for either side, there is no need for shills. Oh, I imagine they exist, but what need is there when we constantly shoot ourselves in the foot without them?
Any questioning but skeptical person would come here, see the endless and evidence-free whining about "brigading" and "shills", and close the page with a laugh.
1 DontTreadOnMe16 2017-07-27
I've seen far more evidence of this than pretty much 90% of the conspiracies discussed here. This is so much more than just "someone disagreeing with ideas". The fact that just because maybe YOU don't notice, doesn't mean it's a laughable idea. Do you post here often?
1 wanking_furiously 2017-07-27
If the top comments go against a highly upvoted post, it is usually means the the post has been brigaded/botted up. You're providing evidence of right-wing shilling.
1 DontTreadOnMe16 2017-07-27
I agree with you on the first part. In this case, the difference it was two superset posts promoting the complete opposite idea, and the top comments on both posts were from the same side.
1 Landiesaw 2017-07-27
Your conclusion is one possible conclusion, but I don't think it's the only one. If the top comments on both were left leaning, it could mean a left leaning bot brigade, but it could mean as the above commenter suggested, that bots are upvoting a right-wing thread but not touching the comments. It could even mean something more benign, that right leaning users are upvoting threads more, but left leaning users are upvoting comments more.
It's definitely an interesting experiment and worthy of discussion, but I think it's premature to herald it as proof of any specific conclusion.