What is your actual point here? You hate us Jews?

I saw a thread earlier talking about Iran and Israel's nuclear capabilities. Someone arguing in there was heatedly arguing some point, and apparently unaware of this subject. I would have to dig back through posts to know if this was the other guy, but I'm guessing OP took that as a sign memory of this needed refreshing.

Not all of us hate jews that criticize Israeli policy, man. I criticize their state just like I criticize the US "state". Doesn't mean that has anything to do with how I feel about jewish people or americans.

Fair enough sir. I was more just wondering.

And you might not even be wrong. Just happened to notice the earlier thread.

“Holohaux”

Well only thing i can say is even zionists dont agree on what it means. For me i think we have the right to exist and the right to the Temple Mount But ... i also support a two state solution and land there for both peoples. I feel though one thing people miss is how often Abbas goes to iran. They fund Hamas and Hamas will never negotiate. Even though i dont like her.. hillary had a 2 state solution worked out per Michael Orens book “ally” and Abbas said no. My hope for palestine is they get a govt that isnt hamas and peace can be forged.

As a Jew, can you simplify why Israel gave the land back to the Muslims to sanctify and worship on, when they had possession?

Btw, I think most reasonable people here that talk about hating Jews don't refer to average Jew, instead referring to the ashkenazi or the other word I can't remember at the moment.

We never gave land back. It was always taken or taken back. No one thinks of how many times we have been occupied.

I could be totally wrong, but I thought Israel was the aggressor in most wars?

It's far from black and white, but I think it would be hard to argue that they were the clear aggressor in the majority of the conflicts since 1948. The clearest case of the contrary might be the Yom Kippur War of 1973 when neighboring nations launched surprise invasions of Israel. Who started the other wars is somewhat more complex -- in the original Israeli-Arab War of 1948 it was several Arab nations invading Israel after it had declared its sovereignty, but that was following a bloody civil war in which many Arab citizens were killed or displaced. In the Six Day War of 1967, again Arab nations were massing troops in preparation to invade, so Israel struck preemptively, and of course that's simplifying a much more complex situation, but who's the aggressor there? I guess that's my main understanding of the many conflicts large and small in that region- they're almost always more complex than one group attacking another.

You say Israel "struck preemptively" but don't know who the aggressor is in that situation?

You started with 'I could be totally wrong', but now you know all the complex military situations? I'm not an expert like you, and I'm not sure if 'aggressor' is a useful term in that situation. My understanding is that Nasser planned and was prepared to invade Israel and ordered naval blockades which he knew would be seen as acts of war. I think the question would be more whether Israel was justified in attacking Egypt out of self-defense or not. Again I'm not an expert, but I'm certainly not intentionally muddying the waters- maybe they're already muddy. Regardless rather than argue with a fool like me I'd recommend reading the history of those many conflicts, they're tragic, interesting and perpetually relevant.

I'm not trying to argue, and I wouldn't characterize you as a fool. I was looking for honest conversation, and if I've said anything to indicate otherwise, I'm sincerely sorry.

My main issue is that if we as a species continually look back and try to justify horrific acts on fellow human beings, war will be inevitable. They'll start killing each other over justifications of past killing.

Have you watched Abby Martin's videos in Israel? There was an interview of two kids, no more than 15, advocating murder. Can you guess who they were advocating killing?

I apologize, I probably mistook your tone and responded with a bad attitude, that's my mistake.

I agree with your main issue, I think you could even argue that just about all war is based on different sides seeking retribution for past violence, muddled by their different versions of the past. I'm not sure what the solution to that is though, do you have an opinion?

As for the video, I haven't seen it but I believe you. Planting violence into the mind of the young is maybe the worst sin I can think of. That said, I have no doubt you could find the same thing on the other side. There's no shortage of extremists in any group. But again, I just don't know a solution to extremism other than education of our commonality, but that approach has never seemed to make much difference in preventing atrocities.

This podcast deeply affected me for days

I mean anxiety, depression, hopelessness. But after a while the realization that I can only do my part and be good to the people around me and not let my emotions dehumanize other people and blind myself to their own struggles. Because that is honestly what I think it is. It's been passed down like an heirloom, the fear of the other within our own species. I feel like it's a very basic struggle in each individual's psyche, and some are more inclined to dehumanize others to the point that they are "targets" or "insurgents" or whatever handle is fashionable these days. We should have basic respect for each other, because as it stands now we are a highly mechanized ferocious species with no idea how to stop ripping ourselves apart.

Is that not the way to do war? Our country prefers to strike first

I think the best way to do war is not at all, but hey.. I'm a dreamer

Well for sure man. I agree. But if you check recorded history.. we as humans dont go long without it and i can assure you its not just jews. We just get hated for it. Yugoslavia. Czechoslvakia. USSR. They all changed and split ... crickets.

I do my best not to hate anyone as an individual or group. I don't understand the perception that only Jews are "hated" for it, honestly. Calling out barbaric shit for being barbaric isn't hatred, it's an act of love. It's an appeal to the base human nature in everyone to stop killing each other for god's sake. The US has committed multiple war crimes, and that's where we got the eloquent "they hate us for our freedom" quote. No, they hate us because we've been trying to bomb them into submission for a few decades.

I love this nation with all my heart but i can see why ISIS or others like them hate us.. most of the pics of ISIS are the age group that saw us kill their parents or relatives in the 2 iraq wars or afghanistan. Even if we were justified .. they could never see it that way. If the chinese invaded here 2 times.. you bet id wanna fuck them up.

And that spiral of hatred is utilized by the military industrial complex to make profits while people are dying on the other end of the product they're selling.

One thing i dont get though and maybe you can answer.. so on this sub they call us zionists, jewish pigs, worse... but pur homeland is so tiny. Its 8 minutes across by plane. Yet causes utter rage and hatred. Yet other nations seize land. Change hands. Change names. Change govts by coup. No one says a word. We have a tiny tiny little piece of land. I just dont get the hate. The british granted it. The UN recognizes it (i hate the UN though). Israel is an ally to us. They are gonna give Mattis the specs to the Iron Dome. I truly dont understand the hate we get when we are not a burden to society

Ok first off. You need a jacket for this sub, cuz it can get a bit shilly sometimes. So don't take the stupid posts of "all jewz suck" as serious.

I don't think anyone is really mad about the size of the land. It just happens to be the most crucial city for the top 3 "western" religions. I think that's the main impetus for the conflict, although I could be wrong. Maybe it is all just political.

People are saying things about all of the corruption inherent in our modern world, you just have to listen. Granted, there's a lot more noise with the Internet. But people have seen it for a while now

Khazarian?

That's the one, gracias.

I gotchya back.

You're one of the few posters here I consistently agree with and am grateful towards for saying what I'm thinking so that I can just upvote you instead of having to type out one of my gloriously long run on sentences because I wasn't taught proper punctuation as a child.

Ashkenazi is a whole group of people, so you hate a whole community?

You don’t even research on the people you hate then?

I research, are you saying they are a community to hold amour?

Huh?

Ok. So are you saying they are a group or community of Jews that do the things that some countries historically have hated them for? Or are you saying they are misunderstood? Or are you saying something else?

No, ashkenazim don’t do anything. Oh my.

And all of us have been prosecuted, from the Ethiopian Jews to the ashkenazim. So I don’t know if you think there’s a special brand of Jews to rule them all 😂

You don't think there is a heirarchy of Jews? Doesn't seem the darker Jews are as welcomed in Israel as lighter skin ones.

And who said anything about one special brand of Jews to rule them all?

I am a black Jew and I was born and raised in Israel All the racism I’ve encountered has been by non Jews 🤷🏽‍♀️ particularly arabs they are very anti black.

Racism in Israel exists of course but I rather walk the streets of Israel with my black skin than in any city of the USA.

And no I don’t think there’s a hierarchy, some of us just have smaller numbers of people in our groups. Like I am half romaniotes and full blooded ones are dying down.

And that is basically what you are saying. Your conspiracies are based on Jews but you don’t seem to know much about the community. Not to mention that you make up different types of Jews I’ve never heard in my life

What is a Talmudic Jew?

u/putinlovescats is much wiser and better informed of the historical deeds or misdeeds of the Jewish niche groups.

Your insight is appreciated though. I am glad to hear black Jews aren't being sent back to africa. Simply googling "Ethiopian Jew racism" seems to come up with many pieces, even Newsweek MSM: http://www.newsweek.com/2016/10/07/why-ethiopian-jews-israel-face-discrimination-racism-police-brutality-502697.html.

No we are not being sent to Africa, the majority of Ethiopian Jews don’t live there anymore, there’s some Jewish African communities in Uganda that still remain in Africa. As far as I know efforts are being done so they can make their Aaliyah too.

The African immigrants that are deported are the ones that immigrate illegally to the country. But they do that in every country too.

But I mean doesn’t that happen in the USA too? And in every country, I have had Racial encounters everywhere. And Didn’t they just tried to hang a biracial child? I mean racism is everywhere. And discrimination in Israel is not like the American one. In the 90s,- 80s soviet Jews weren’t given proper treatment when they immigrated in flocks and this is well documented. They are ashkenazim too, and weren’t given the same treatment as other groups. So much for hierarchy.

The majority of Israeli Jews are of Arab descent, Jews that we’re expelled from their countries during the Islamic revolution. Jews of all colours hold high positions in the Knesset. But Israel is a country just like any other, except that it is a Jewish state.

Hmm, good to know, I appreciate your perspective. Thank you.

Well my view isnt the same as others.

This isn't even IMPLIED in the post.

You're not going to get downvoted much because your post is against Jews. If it was against Rome, then be prepared for the mass downvotes.

The land was not stolen. That's a fact. You continue the lie that it was stolen is you twisting the truth to fit your narrative.

There's no genocide happening. Israel could commit genocide if they wanted to but that would benefit nobody. Hamas and PLO want to commit genocide, as they've said many many times before, but they do not have the capabilities to do such a thing. And even though they say they want to kill all Israels, I don't think they do. Hamas and PLO are getting a lot of money that is meant to build Palestine, but they are just funneling that money into their wartime government through lies. Most Palestinians believe Hamas and PLO are corrupt, and most Palestinians want a two-state solution right now to end all of this.

the world would be in a much better place if we all worked together.

If only the videos weren't on YouTube showing the Israelis being so heavy handed at checkpoints or random stops. If they don't consider themselves dominating bullies, they wouldn't let happen what happens a lot based on the many many videos of uniformed thugs beating kids and elderly Palestinians.

It wasn't stolen?! Can I use my grandfathers deeds to claim his house back in Jaffa or an alternative piece of land there as compensation. Millions of Palestinians are still on refugee status to this day. It was stolen like it or not, that's a fact. That's why there is so much tension between Arabs and Israelis.

Your "facts" are conjecture, but you're correct in that Israel could wipe out both the West Bank and Gaza easily – plus any remaining Palestinians in Jerusalem and elsewhere, but they have to keep them alive to keep the issues alive (the "two-state solution" and all that nonsense). Plus, if anyone else bombed the fuck out of Israel, they'd be taking out these people as well, who are innocent of the international war crimes perpetrated by their captors. They're a great deterrent.

The Palestinians look to any group that can offer hope, because they're basically concentration camp residents.

You now understand the real reason why Israel is adamant about preventing Iran from developing nuclear weapons: A country with nuclear weapons can never be invaded.

Except by aliens 👽

Correct. Illegal aliens

I was talking about the aliens that mess with nuclear tests... But sure, let's talk about a wall.

With that in mind; how can a state built on stolen land (via Zionist Balfour Declaration) have the guts, power, and audacity to pursue such policy towards ALL OF MANKIND.

The founders of Israel control the West's money supply. Also, they're Talmudic Satanist Banker Pedophiles who would rather destroy the planet if they can't control it all.

So very true. Our evolution out of it needs a quorum of us to be able to handle all of it.

u/putinlovescats is much wiser and better informed of the historical deeds or misdeeds of the Jewish niche groups.

Your insight is appreciated though. I am glad to hear black Jews aren't being sent back to africa. Simply googling "Ethiopian Jew racism" seems to come up with many pieces, even Newsweek MSM: http://www.newsweek.com/2016/10/07/why-ethiopian-jews-israel-face-discrimination-racism-police-brutality-502697.html.