I believe there was a former employee who said they didn't have alarms on the room doors. I didnt see the original comment, but I saw someone reference it a earlier today or yesterday.
I agree, I wonder if there is anything in public records about what security company they used, and if we are able to get a hold of them. I'll look around and see if I can find anything.
Cool, I've been looking into it a bit, they do manufacture networked alarm systems for hotels, but there don't seem to be too many vendors. Usually places log events (card swipes, card ID, times, etc) on the reader itself, and if something happens they go to the door to read the event log.
This website sells a system, but there aren't many other similar competitor sites and that one looks like it was written by a non-native English speaker.
I've worked with systems that require card access. Our system would let us know anytime a door was locked, unlocked, opened, closed, or held open. It would even inform us if a door was forced open where card access was required.
Good idea, it could be arranged through fiver.com. They must be on extremely high alert though, I wouldn't want to be wrong about this and get someone hassled or possibly hurt, or waste security's resources. That experiment wouldn't exactly be decisive either, they might just not respond for other reasons.
The inner door (the one closest to the actual stairs) was braced shut from the hallway side of the door. The outer door (that opens directly into the hallway) wasn't braced shut. The theory is that Paddock had the outer door propped open while he put the brace on the inner door.
But, as others have pointed out, Campos said he was actually going to check on an open door alarm for one of the guest rooms.
And the sheriff stated that when campos discovered the stairwell door wouldnt budge, he went and tended to the door alarm first, while he was on on the way to apparoaching the stairwell door from the other side
I feel like they are being deliberately vague regarding why Jesus was there in the first place. It first went from smoke detector to open door alarm, but we have not gotten a definitive answer on what door. Probably because it never happened.
It was never smoke detector. That came from a self-claimed eyewitness speaking to CNN. The LVMPD refuted the smoke alarm rumor when they were asked about it in one of the first press conferences.
Yeah I was also confused thinking I swear they said smoke alarm.
But they also stated in the beginning that it was a door alarm from a suite few rooms away at first which made no sense.
Friday October 6th:
An open door a few rooms away from the Las Vegas suite of the man who was gunning down concertgoers at a music festival set off an alarm that prompted a response from a security guard, Clark County Undersheriff Kevin C. McMahill said Friday.
That's the story they stuck to, that it was a guest room near Paddock's, but unless it can be proven that might be a gaping hole in the story. If there are no sensors on the doors, that is a lot harder to spin than the timeline. We would have caught them in a lie.
There would be a sensor on a stairwell door. There is a reason why they are heavy and have that closing assist damper on them. They would be part of a system that controls air flow to the common corridors keeps all stairwells at a higher air pressure. There would be a physical annunciator panel for the fire dept to read but the main security desk would have all the sensors in the system on a computer graphic interface. The room doors would probably be on the security and card key system. Most likely independent of the fire and smoke detection system.
Good info, and that makes sense that both the fire dept. and secuity would have access to those sensors, but they have reported that Campos was responding to a sensor tripped by a guest doorway, not the fire exit so I'm still wondering what type of sensor they have for guest rooms. Most hotels log card swipe data on the lock itself, they usually are not networked.
They would see an open door on their display so alarm kind of means silent unless it is the kind that is right on the door like a fire door on a secure floor.
Security makes hourly rounds 24/7 of all fire doors to physically ensure their operation and status. Campos might have been doing this but I wouldn't have expected him to be so fat.lol. Usually the security guy carries a device that reads a bar code which documents his rounds with timestamps. Maybe a little different now .
If that was the case, It seems like they would have gone with the simplest narrative: "He was on a routine patrol, found a barricaded fire door and proceeded to investigate." I still think it's worth it to find out whether or not the guest doors are networked because:
A. It's a hole in the story that they can't retroactively cover up.
B. It would be relatively easy info to get.
C. It might imply that other means were used to dispatch Campos to that location that Mandalay Bay doesn't want to reveal to the public, some other form of guest monitoring ... maybe in the shooter's room? Shooting is an incredibly common tourist attraction in Vegas, security is probably used to seeing weapons in rooms, but maybe they keep tabs on those people and when Paddock started to act more suspicious than the average gun owner, they went to check it out.
I agree that the narrative is scrambled and broken. I was just trying to give info from what I know of building systems and what I remember from working nights in secure high-rises.
Their is some sophisticate stuff installed. While most homes have infrared sensors some buildings would use three different sensors-- motion, temperature and sound. And this was years ago so as far as security systems go I am probably behind in my knowledge. Fire systems are probably of the same tech as when I worked with them.
I think that Mandalay Bay would have a very advanced state of security system. It would not surprise me if they did not sense a pressure drop in 'Paddock's room when he or the shooters broke out the windows.
That is very possible, I remember hearing that they sometimes screw with the air pressure and oxygen levels in casinos to keep people gambling, so it would make sense that the system would be very sophisticated and controllable. Maybe the casino wanted to conceal that info because it's kind of a dirty trick.
The best info I've seen (sorry, no sources at hand) say it wasn't an "alarm" per the common definition. The claim was that the hotel uses a system called HotSOS that does, in fact, have a door monitor (not "alarm") on every room. The system is meant to help them manage such a large number of rooms by coordinating room service for when you're actually out of the room.
One feature of the system, beyond monitoring when you've left, is that it will alert the front desk if a door is ajar for more than a few minutes. It can send alerts through text message or voice, email etc.
What we should look into is how Paddock hear the door close after he was shooting an automatic firearm inside? He wouldn't hear shit either 1) His ears would be ringing or 2) He's wearing ear protection and still can't hear shit.
Good info, and that makes sense that both the fire dept. and secuity would have access to those sensors, but they have reported that Campos was responding to a sensor tripped by a guest doorway, not the fire exit so I'm still wondering what type of sensor they have for guest rooms. Most hotels log card swipe data on the lock itself, they usually are not networked.
29 comments
1 ShallowendPirate 2017-10-20
I believe there was a former employee who said they didn't have alarms on the room doors. I didnt see the original comment, but I saw someone reference it a earlier today or yesterday.
1 illithid_business 2017-10-20
I'm hoping to get a response from someone in the security industry that knows if these systems exist and how they are used.
1 ShallowendPirate 2017-10-20
I agree, I wonder if there is anything in public records about what security company they used, and if we are able to get a hold of them. I'll look around and see if I can find anything.
1 illithid_business 2017-10-20
Cool, I've been looking into it a bit, they do manufacture networked alarm systems for hotels, but there don't seem to be too many vendors. Usually places log events (card swipes, card ID, times, etc) on the reader itself, and if something happens they go to the door to read the event log.
1 ShallowendPirate 2017-10-20
Did you find a company or contractor?
1 illithid_business 2017-10-20
This website sells a system, but there aren't many other similar competitor sites and that one looks like it was written by a non-native English speaker.
1 bricox171 2017-10-20
I've worked with systems that require card access. Our system would let us know anytime a door was locked, unlocked, opened, closed, or held open. It would even inform us if a door was forced open where card access was required.
1 illithid_business 2017-10-20
Cool, that's what I was looking for. So now the question is whether or not Mandalay Bay has that type of system.
1 Some-Sort-of-IxFx 2017-10-20
How long has it been since he worked there?
1 ShallowendPirate 2017-10-20
I couldn't tell you. I saw someone reference the comment. I know that's not any help. Sorry.
1 jaydwalk 2017-10-20
On the Ellen show Campos said the door was barricaded and had to take the elevator up to get to the other side...
1 Some-Sort-of-IxFx 2017-10-20
He discovered the barricaded door on his way to investigate an open door alarm. Two different doors.
1 36in36 2017-10-20
The door discussed during the Ellen interview is not a room door, but a fire door near, or in, a stairwell area.
1 Some-Sort-of-IxFx 2017-10-20
Source?
1 RMFN 2017-10-20
That Ellen interview though. So sketchy
1 Facts_About_Cats 2017-10-20
Somebody staying there should prop open their door and time his long it takes for a security guy to appear. I bet one never does.
1 illithid_business 2017-10-20
Good idea, it could be arranged through fiver.com. They must be on extremely high alert though, I wouldn't want to be wrong about this and get someone hassled or possibly hurt, or waste security's resources. That experiment wouldn't exactly be decisive either, they might just not respond for other reasons.
1 AdamAAndrews 2017-10-20
Wasn’t the door braced shut? Wouldn’t that mean it was closed? Why the open door alarm?
1 illithid_business 2017-10-20
They said it was an alarm from a different room, not the shooter's.
1 LoneStarMike59 2017-10-20
There were two fire exit doors
diagram
The inner door (the one closest to the actual stairs) was braced shut from the hallway side of the door. The outer door (that opens directly into the hallway) wasn't braced shut. The theory is that Paddock had the outer door propped open while he put the brace on the inner door.
But, as others have pointed out, Campos said he was actually going to check on an open door alarm for one of the guest rooms.
1 mediocrityisevident 2017-10-20
And the sheriff stated that when campos discovered the stairwell door wouldnt budge, he went and tended to the door alarm first, while he was on on the way to apparoaching the stairwell door from the other side
1 dustbowldano 2017-10-20
I feel like they are being deliberately vague regarding why Jesus was there in the first place. It first went from smoke detector to open door alarm, but we have not gotten a definitive answer on what door. Probably because it never happened.
1 walkerhead 2017-10-20
and the engineer's last name is "Schuck" sounds like "schmuck"....go figure...and Jesus "saved so many lives" so....there's that too.
1 Some-Sort-of-IxFx 2017-10-20
It was never smoke detector. That came from a self-claimed eyewitness speaking to CNN. The LVMPD refuted the smoke alarm rumor when they were asked about it in one of the first press conferences.
1 its_spelled_Hawaiian 2017-10-20
Yeah I was also confused thinking I swear they said smoke alarm.
But they also stated in the beginning that it was a door alarm from a suite few rooms away at first which made no sense.
Friday October 6th:
I wonder what happened to that sheriff.
1 illithid_business 2017-10-20
That's the story they stuck to, that it was a guest room near Paddock's, but unless it can be proven that might be a gaping hole in the story. If there are no sensors on the doors, that is a lot harder to spin than the timeline. We would have caught them in a lie.
1 its_spelled_Hawaiian 2017-10-20
In the original report they say "few rooms away", but now it's the stairwell door that set off the alarm.
Complete fuckery in this story and it's only getting worse.
1 illithid_business 2017-10-20
Oh, OK. Yeah it's hard to follow the twists and turns, especially when they change the story so much.
1 janisstukas 2017-10-20
There would be a sensor on a stairwell door. There is a reason why they are heavy and have that closing assist damper on them. They would be part of a system that controls air flow to the common corridors keeps all stairwells at a higher air pressure. There would be a physical annunciator panel for the fire dept to read but the main security desk would have all the sensors in the system on a computer graphic interface. The room doors would probably be on the security and card key system. Most likely independent of the fire and smoke detection system.
1 illithid_business 2017-10-20
Good info, and that makes sense that both the fire dept. and secuity would have access to those sensors, but they have reported that Campos was responding to a sensor tripped by a guest doorway, not the fire exit so I'm still wondering what type of sensor they have for guest rooms. Most hotels log card swipe data on the lock itself, they usually are not networked.
1 Some-Sort-of-IxFx 2017-10-20
Have you checked this out?
https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/77gtil/jesus_campos_says_he_was_responding_to_a_door/dolrzg2
1 illithid_business 2017-10-20
No, I didn't see that. Thanks for the link
1 janisstukas 2017-10-20
They would see an open door on their display so alarm kind of means silent unless it is the kind that is right on the door like a fire door on a secure floor. Security makes hourly rounds 24/7 of all fire doors to physically ensure their operation and status. Campos might have been doing this but I wouldn't have expected him to be so fat.lol. Usually the security guy carries a device that reads a bar code which documents his rounds with timestamps. Maybe a little different now .
1 illithid_business 2017-10-20
If that was the case, It seems like they would have gone with the simplest narrative: "He was on a routine patrol, found a barricaded fire door and proceeded to investigate." I still think it's worth it to find out whether or not the guest doors are networked because:
A. It's a hole in the story that they can't retroactively cover up.
B. It would be relatively easy info to get.
C. It might imply that other means were used to dispatch Campos to that location that Mandalay Bay doesn't want to reveal to the public, some other form of guest monitoring ... maybe in the shooter's room? Shooting is an incredibly common tourist attraction in Vegas, security is probably used to seeing weapons in rooms, but maybe they keep tabs on those people and when Paddock started to act more suspicious than the average gun owner, they went to check it out.
1 janisstukas 2017-10-20
I agree that the narrative is scrambled and broken. I was just trying to give info from what I know of building systems and what I remember from working nights in secure high-rises.
1 illithid_business 2017-10-20
Yeah, I appreciate the info, you definitely know this kind of stuff well.
1 janisstukas 2017-10-20
Their is some sophisticate stuff installed. While most homes have infrared sensors some buildings would use three different sensors-- motion, temperature and sound. And this was years ago so as far as security systems go I am probably behind in my knowledge. Fire systems are probably of the same tech as when I worked with them.
1 janisstukas 2017-10-20
I think that Mandalay Bay would have a very advanced state of security system. It would not surprise me if they did not sense a pressure drop in 'Paddock's room when he or the shooters broke out the windows.
1 illithid_business 2017-10-20
That is very possible, I remember hearing that they sometimes screw with the air pressure and oxygen levels in casinos to keep people gambling, so it would make sense that the system would be very sophisticated and controllable. Maybe the casino wanted to conceal that info because it's kind of a dirty trick.
1 janisstukas 2017-10-20
On the games floor they might add oxygen. I would hope that it automatically turns off if the system goes into alarm
1 ASUSundevil23 2017-10-20
So there are door alarms but no window alarms when two when's get shot?
1 oxfouzer 2017-10-20
The best info I've seen (sorry, no sources at hand) say it wasn't an "alarm" per the common definition. The claim was that the hotel uses a system called HotSOS that does, in fact, have a door monitor (not "alarm") on every room. The system is meant to help them manage such a large number of rooms by coordinating room service for when you're actually out of the room.
One feature of the system, beyond monitoring when you've left, is that it will alert the front desk if a door is ajar for more than a few minutes. It can send alerts through text message or voice, email etc.
https://www.amadeus-hospitality.com/amadeus-service-optimization/hotsos/
1 illithid_business 2017-10-20
Ah, OK. Thanks for the explanation.
1 OstrichPiIIow 2017-10-20
What we should look into is how Paddock hear the door close after he was shooting an automatic firearm inside? He wouldn't hear shit either 1) His ears would be ringing or 2) He's wearing ear protection and still can't hear shit.
1 illithid_business 2017-10-20
They changed the story to say that Campos found Paddocks room before the shooting started, there was a press release about it.
1 illithid_business 2017-10-20
Good info, and that makes sense that both the fire dept. and secuity would have access to those sensors, but they have reported that Campos was responding to a sensor tripped by a guest doorway, not the fire exit so I'm still wondering what type of sensor they have for guest rooms. Most hotels log card swipe data on the lock itself, they usually are not networked.
1 illithid_business 2017-10-20
Yeah, I appreciate the info, you definitely know this kind of stuff well.