Exhibit A

"The fire that collapsed the 3 buildings"

Bold statement in this sub.

/s?

Down voted for a joke about the sub lol okay. Believe what you want.

And how was that a joke? He also just clearly said he doesn’t believe that narrative..

This kind of thing happens so much more often than might seem reasonable... I don’t see the problem.

As far as I’m aware, they did.

Don’t have one. I’m remembering something from a documentary I saw a long time ago, I think, and there was a watch that survived? Maybe a wallet, too?

lol, wat?

Items surviving catastrophic incidents despite rationality assuming they’d be consumed by flames, sunk to the bottom of the ocean, or otherwise lost.

Happens all the time. Makes sense; something has to survive.

...not in pristine condition.

Totally in pristine condition, sometimes.

I’m reminded of the chandelier still hanging in the Titanic. Or, hell, banknotes and papers from safes in it, too. Decades underwater, still readable after a quick wash.

Seems a comparable amount of damage as a plastic-wrapped passport coated in jet fuel being in decent condition.

Seems a comparable amount of damage as a plastic-wrapped passport coated in jet fuel being in decent condition.

You just compared a passport to metal, and paper inside an air tight safe. Throw a passport into a fire for ~8 minutes and see what happens...

The presumption is that the passport was ejected as the plane crashed into the building, was coated in jet fuel, but was ejected quickly enough that it escaped the fireball and did not ignite.

I’m making a broad generalization about how shit can survive extreme situations, man, chill.

So, a two whole planes vaporized, along with all the people and such inside of them, but.... a passport survived proving it was a terrorist hijacking. You're really saying that? Do you really believe that's probable?

Uhh...

The fuck would we need the passport to prove it was a terrorist highjacking for? We knew what was up as soon as the second plane hit, and the identities of the highjackers were known almost as soon as passenger lists were assessed properly. The passport was in no way, shape, or form a crucial piece of evidence. Just a curiosity that it survived.

As far as it actually surviving, yeah. Presumably, it was on the highjacker’s person in the cockpit. If so, it would have had the best chance of escaping from the impact and nearly simultaneous explosion.

We almost certainly found pieces of the other passenger’s belongings too, but none were identifiable or traceable to the right person. There wasn’t nothing left of the planes, people, or stuff inside. Just very small bits.

Mass. Ants can fall without being hurt, people will die from falling short distances. The low mass of the passport makes it likely that it could escape unscathed.

Mass v surface area also makes it less likely to have gained the velocity to be ejected and even less likely to have moved very far from the ejection point.

I see some argument that it could have been ejected with the body but then what happened to the body?

Regular poster in r politics and just general mindless trump bashing. Is here to derail, like in other threads.

And my fire proof passport materials service still hasn't taken off...

Jet fuel is way different from kerosene.

Yes, I know, the point is that three hours isn’t enough time for a jet fuel soaked passport to dry. Or kerosene soaked.

Have you tried to burn a passport?

They don’t burn that easy

You can melt steel beams before destroying a passport. Passports are extremely versatile.

people think that jet fuel can't melt steel beams is the trump card,

but have you seen the WTC 9/11 Pot Hole?

this thing is amazing, and yet nobody talks about it because they way it was covered in the media

have a look

https://www.google.com/search?tbm=isch&source=hp&biw=1634&bih=1111&ei=wOA0WtS1C8KKjwTOvZyQCw&q=wtc+9%2F11+pot+hole&oq=WTC+9%2F11+&gs_l=img

Kerosene is actually quite oily and doesn't evaporate that quickly.

We should make protective gear using passports

That a passport survived is not unbelievable. Lots of things survive explosions. It is rather unlikely that someone would find it so quickly, though.

I don't see why anyone would fake it, though. Find a passport there doesn't prove anything. We only know of Satam Al Suqami because his name was on the Flight 11 manifest. Without that, finding his passport at the scene wouldn't mean anything. And his passport doesn't add anything to the fact that his name was on the manifest, either.

However, according to the 9/11 Commission, the passport is actually discovered by a male passer-by who is about 30 years old and wearing a business suit. The man gives it to New York City Police Department Detective Yuk H. Chin shortly before 9:59 a.m., when the South Tower of the WTC collapses. The man leaves before he is identified. Chin, according to the 9/11 Commission, will give the passport to the FBI later in the day.

Oh, well in that case...

Very nice!

From take same article:

Barry Mawn, the director of the FBI’s New York office, will say that police and the FBI found it during a “grid search” of the area.

The hijackers passport isn't even the only passport found, that fell from a plane after crashing into buildings in NYC. See Cory Lidle.

You can attack Mueller all you like, in order to run interference for Trump's crimes, but it isn't going to work. More indictments incoming.

he also covered up the anthrax attacks that were conveniently going on while the PATRIOT act was being signed

Just to play devils advocate here:

If the passport if from a hijacker perhaps standing in the cockpit, not strapped in. Then upon hitting the tower (at ~500mph), the hijacker himself would continue out through the cockpit window also at 500mph. He would be totally ejected (this is seen all the time f.ex. in carwrecks with passengers not wearing seatbelts).
So as the plane explodes, he is flying out the window at 500mph and out through the building. In the process he is basically shredded, his clothes is shredded. Passport etc. flies out (also at 500mph). A jetfuel explosion is actually not very fast, so likely the flames don't even reach him before he and his passport etc. is ejected out the building (at 500mph thus traveling pretty far away from the crumbling buildings). Also, passports are made quite sturdy. Ever try to burn a book? not so easy.

Discuss.

I doubt that he would fly out the front window into the building, with enough force and velocity to out run the explosion and burst out the other side of the building sending his passport (that was soaked in jet fuel) flying blocks away and landing on the ground, to then be found by a mysterious man in a suit who gave it to the police department and left before being identified.

It's just like in car-accidents. If you don't wear a seatbelt you WILL fly straight out the front window in a head-on collision. Basically the plane stops but you don't.

I know they will fly forward, But I don't believe it's realistic that the passport would have survived and been found in the manner it did

Nothing about that day was realistic. It was the most surreal day I've ever experienced. Judging the accuracy of official and unofficial timelines based on what makes sense and what's "realistic" is the wrong approach, IMO.

I just don't believe they found the passports like they claim, before 9/11 you didn't even need a passport for a domestic flight, why would they even have them?

It's plausible. Passports are designed to withstand heat. Ever try to light a passport on fire? It's mostly plastic.

I don't think a random passerby that no one bothered to say hey what's your name is plausible though. When I was in the army I was military police then I went and became a CID agent before ditching the military and law enforcement for web dev. And we were always tough get the info of anyone you talk to at a crime scene.

I think this would be especially relevant because this was evidence and you have to be able to document the chain of evidence

I'm pretty sure I could light one on fire if I through it into a blazing inferno

definitely a possible scenario if you live in a bugs bunny cartoon

Or real life. I see you've never seen what happens in a car wreck if you're not seat belted huh

yes, in every car accident i’ve ever been in, the contents of my pockets have gone flying right out of my pants, outside of the car, through a ball of explosive jet fuel fires like a circus animal through a ring of fire, landing on the ground where it’s found within the hour.

You're not going 500mph.

Ever try to burn a book? not so easy.

People burn their passports all the time

This is the very first 9/11 post that has made me doubt the narrative. Interesting.

Building 7 much?

I used to use Building 7 as the smoking gun to prove there's fishiness in what happened, but then I actually did more research into it, and if you really look into it, the way Building 7 fell can be explained by what actually happened. The majority of videos we see of the collapse don't show the whole thing, and the penthouse on the top starts to fall in first, which then causes the rest of the building to collapse, and nothing about it suggests that it was a controlled demo. It definitely looks that way, and trust me, I was on that train for a long time, but at this point it really just doesn't work anymore.

Not saying that means that the "official story" is the word of god, far from it, and we should still be investigating what happened. However, the real conspiracy isn't in "the planes were actually missiles" or "building 7 was a controlled demo", but rather who was truly responsible for what happened. And for that you just need to follow the money.

The 9/11 truther movements get too worked up in stuff like Building 7 and other "anomalies" that have since been debunked, which hurts the cause of finding those who were truly accountable. Those who were funding/supporting the hijackers and their organization, and then those who were funding the funders.

WTC 7 collapse is indistinguishable from a controlled demolition

Buildings should be made out of the material used in those passports!

California should build houses out of these passports

https://www.cpexecutive.com/post/larry-silverstein-shares-insights-on-trump-win/

I guess you guys never heard of that plane that crashed at a speed higher than the speed of sound and still stuff survived:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pacific_Southwest_Airlines_Flight_1771

After two days of digging through what was left of the plane, they found the parts of a handgun containing six spent cartridge cases and the note on the airsickness bag written by Burke, indicating that he may have been responsible for the crash. FBI investigators were able to lift a print from a fragment of finger stuck in the pistol's trigger guard, which positively identified Burke as holding the weapon when the aircraft crashed.

Are you comparing a piece of metal to a piece of paper soaked in jet fuel while discussing the likelyhood of them surviving an explosion?

and the note on the airsickness bag

Hilarious!

I see. Sounds like there was a lot of recoverable evidence in this case. I'll look further in to the details.

So in your opinion, how did the passport gain the velocity (after initial impact, which soaked it in jetfuel) to eject unscathed?

random luck. Many things survived all the crashes including baggage tags, cushions etc. When you think only a passport survived you'd be suspicious but most of the things surviving the crash were just not newsworthy. Lot's of stuff survived but were later buried under the falling towers.

Did you know that an experiment including worms survived the Columbia space shuttle explosion completely intact. And that explosion was fueled by much more than the planes.

I didn't know that... what's your take on flight 93 then?

In what way? It's essentially just a plane crash, many objects can survive those.

Nothing was found by the coroner. You would expect bone fragments, blood, pieces of the plane, body parts, something... nothing... just a hole with small shards of metal.

Not typical of an air to ground collision.

Where did you hear that they didn't find anything like bone fragments at the crash site? The descriptions I found say that along with shards of metal, there were bones, teeth, tissue, etc at the crash site.

Apart from, here and there, a finger, a toe or a tooth, all that remained of the 44 souls aboard, churned into the soil or hanging from the branches of nearby trees, were small pieces of tissue and bone.

Edit: Also from the same article, apparently paper survived that crash too:

Flight 93 was carrying 7,500 pounds of mail to California – and other papers from the plane were found eight miles (13km) away from the scene of the crash.

After two days of digging through what was left of the plane, they found the parts of a handgun containing six spent cartridge cases and the note on the airsickness bag written by Burke, indicating that he may have been responsible for the crash. FBI investigators were able to lift a print from a fragment of finger stuck in the pistol's trigger guard, which positively identified Burke as holding the weapon when the aircraft crashed.

Also incredibly implausible. So this was bogus too. Wonder what the circumstances were around this crash? For example, in what way did it benefit Israel?

Wait so he made a law that said people couldn't sue? Where did he get that power? Didn't know he could change the federal code.

He & Comey also oversaw the bungled the Anthrax investigation, leading to the DOJ having to pay out $5mil+ to an innocent man after they decided on guilt first and the went digging for evidence to fit the narrative.

Interestingly, part of the lawsuit centered on the fact that the FBI was leaking info to the press to make it seem like the guy was guilty.

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/remember-the-botched-anthrax-investigation/article/2623822

https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2010/05/the-wrong-man/308019/

As US Attorney in Boston he also covered up for mobster Whitey Bulger and the feds, and wrote letters opposing clemency for 4 guys framed by the FBI.

Years later when asked about it Mueller said “I think the public should recognize that what happened, happened years ago.’’

lol, wat?

So, a two whole planes vaporized, along with all the people and such inside of them, but.... a passport survived proving it was a terrorist hijacking. You're really saying that? Do you really believe that's probable?

The only provably correct bullet point in metabunk is that the study isn't yet finalized. I'm gonna go with the team of structural engineers that have been analyzing this system for the past several years over a few rando skeptics on metabunk that think they know all the details. There are questions about the study for sure, but those will prove out as the report reaches completion.

Of course, this study never should have needed to be independently funded and researched at a university. NIST should have made the data publicly (or at least privately for research institutions) available. Their excuse for not doing so is laughable and potentially endangers the public if they've truly uncovered the magic bullet for making steel high-rise structures crumble into their own footprints with medium sized fires.

Anyway, metabunk can be an echo chamber in the same way /r/conspiracy or /r/politics can be. Their goal is to aggressively debunk even when the data overwhelmingly point elsewhere. I'll be curious to see what they say after thorough peer reviews are complete.

I see that now. I was recalling early reports.

I dunno... but when I imagine it it looks like a cartoon.

And they knew it was on him in the cockpit how? Could have been in a bag in the overhead bin . Zero to say it was actually on his person at the time of impact

I agree. And It was most likely planted on the scene.

life comes at you fast

can you elaborate on ‘unscathed’? i don’t think i’ve ever seen a picture of the magical passport, just curious if there was damage to it, and if so, what the severity is. thanks!

the comment got deleted, care to re-create it?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whitey_Bulger

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winter_Hill_Gang

this guy is sketchy af too

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louis_Freeh