Wonderful post!

I pretty much agree with the majority of this.

Ultimately, all of these things will sooner or later be explained and verified by empirical science. But for me (and many others on the path), I have already verified these things in my own life and experience, through about a decade of introspective and meditative practices. I can tell you quite assuredly that I am ultimately neither the body nor the mind and will not cease to exist upon the death of my physical body.

Either way, one can either wait until science proves these things, or you can prove these things to yourself, through your own experience.

The ultimate way is to always prove it for yourself, directly. It is also the only way to peace, freedom and love that is not conditioned by the mind and world.

You cannot convince people of this, the only thing you can do is spark their curiosity for the path inward. Once they are on the path they will eventually experience for themselves their deeper nature.

These experiences transcend the body and mind and it is very apparent (upon experiencing them) that they are not simply a result of chemical reactions in your body and neurons firing up in your brain. But you will have to experience this to know, nobody can give you this experience through text and believing or disbelieving any of this point blank will lead you nowhere. Only curiosity, a basic trust that this might be possible (one that needs to verified by yourself empirically, belief is not enough!) and a desire for freedom beyond the body and mind will lead you to the truth beyond the veil.

Much love to you all.

The brain is the center for consciousness.

We know this because brain damage to certain brain regions produces specific types of changes to one's personality and behavior.

Death is the cessation of electro-chemical activity in the brain.

There is no soul, no afterlife and no god.

The brain can function as an antenna.

How could life possibly exist only in your body? It's impossible. Everything is connected.

The entire universe, everything, is cause and effect. But somehow you are the exception? That's some split-logic you have there.

It's thought that our spirits are in an energy Matrix. We exist in a higher dimension, and are locked in these physical bodies. We are a civilization with amnesia ( as Graham Hancock would say). Our history and our existence are kept a mystery because the sense of loneliness generates the most pure form of energy in this matrix/energy farm.

This understanding was experienced and conveyed by Robert Monroe during one of his many OBEs. This ability is repressed from society as leverage and possibly to help keep us lonely. Instead we are developing similar matrixes in the digital virtual world to further lock away our consciousness (to one day decrypt blochains?).

After death, you will be presented the opportunity to enter The Light, deceptively told you will be going to "Heaven", but it will be a gateway back into the matrix to live over again continuing the energy production.

Check out Robert Monroe's, Far Journeys. pg.162

He was a pioneer in the exploration of OBEs/Astral Projection, worked with the CIA, and started The Monroe Institute.

A mind cannot exist without a brain. Pretty sure when you die you trip balls on DMT released in your brain then you just die exactly like all the years before you were born.

I can’t take this seriously until you prove a mind can exist without a brain.

Mind, consciousness and your brain are all the same thing.

I know this adds zero discussion to the actual conspiracy but I'm glad this is the first post I saw on this sub today, rather than the typical stuff we've seen on this sub for the last year. Death to me is without a doubt the most interesting part of our lives if you will. Nobody knows what happens and that's what makes it so mystical to me

I thought this was a fantastic post, but my commentary would be a bit ungainly for a comment on its own so I wrote a rebuttal. Suffice to say I very much appreciate the effort OP put into his or her post, and I am thankful for the free discussion of ideas this post has stimulated.

Take your own advice and realize you have no idea what other people are thinking in their beliefs and views. People don't pretend to feel comfortable. People like me experienced something bizarre to cause faith. It would be easier not to pretend. But I'm not pretending.

We are souls with bodies ,not bodies with souls. The true nature of the soul is largely obfuscated by the body at this point in our development.

Gravity is a very powerful force in the universe. We only very recently confirmed that gravitrons exist via black hole collision detection.

We know that there are other undiscovered subatomic particles out there. its only a matter of time before there is a 'consciousness particle' discovered that gives scientific credence to the idea that all consciousness is interconnected, and that it is a powerful force like gravity.

Dont expect the clergy we know as the scientific community to actually look into it actively unless some billionaire philanthropist makes them do it. Acknowledging the reality that subjective beliefs influence reality in a very real way would contradict well, the scientific method. They would lose ideological power over the people and their position would be weakened. fuck these power hungry ivory tower gazers.

Reincarnation is real. Memory mostly wiped and then put into a new body. past life regression demonstrates this to a small extant, more compelling are the 3000 years of empirical research known as buddhism.

karma is real. it determines the resonant frequency of soul/body complexes. this is very important collectively as a group and on an individual level.

enlightenment unlocks what some ppl call 'the afterlife'. It is how one breaks free of the current reincarnation cycle.

Enlightenment = 4th dimension awareness. This means having the ability to use consciousness as a force to transcend time and space. Enlightened can transition back and forth between physical and spiritual forms.

Just look at Daoism. They believed the only path to enlightenment was to completely escape society and the socially programmed reality. This is still true today.

What is interesting today is that we are at a critical junction as a species where we can decide whether to move towards the direction of collective enlightenment as a species or to continue with our current socially programmed materialistic hellhole. It never ceases to amaze how strong the fear of the new is. It has the ability to keep us in what is literally hell.

We may not have a chance to make this decision again, so lets make the right decision here.

We have to help people see the truth. I want to escape reincarnation. I'm done reincarnating. That's why I'm pursuing my true self because I need to reach a point of enlightenment. We all do. Let's help each other! You keep making those posts homie. I will too.

How do you know you were reincarnated? what proof there is?

The mod post about the Great Pyramid discusses that maybe an ancient civilization (towards the end of the documentary, 1:20:00) knew something and was translating that information into the pyramid. There is a gateway to another world, a dimension that would be referred to as an 'afterlife'. But to get there, one must be balanced. I know it sounds silly, but I believe it is possible to reach it. This place transcends reincarnation. Maybe, reincarnation is a way to teach the soul to be a way that enables you to reach it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2fS9ixfQ_no

Ever tried meditation? Using consciousness to look at consciousness to understand what it is.

hope you film your reaction

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.forbes.com/sites/startswithabang/2017/12/27/2018-will-be-the-year-humanity-directly-sees-our-first-black-hole/amp/#ampshare=https://www.forbes.com/sites/startswithabang/2017/12/27/2018-will-be-the-year-humanity-directly-sees-our-first-black-hole/

Prove gravity exists with domestic conditions.

Everyone should read The Egg for a continued existential crisis

I find The Egg to be negating of existential crisis

Oh man.

THIS is the top comment?

Fucks sake

I know I didn’t have anything more inspired to express my disagreement with OP’s theory, but I think my “sigh” sort of expression captures the feeling. If it’s any consolation, internet points don’t mean jack shit.

Hahaha, this is literally the only response to the Death Conspiracy. I could not have said it better myself.

I would argue that dropping dead in front of OP would be an even better argument, but I don’t think any of us are willing to pay that price to win an argument with RIS *tm (Random Internet Stranger).

;)

You said it.

The entire argument falls apart when you realize OP just doesn't understand how cells work, especially those attached to your brain... This feels like a copypasta written by the guys that made that terrible "you only use 10% of your brain what if we could unlock the 90%" ScarJo movie.

No one actually understands anything about the brain beyond a "this controls this and that controls that"

You can't pretend like you have some secret information no one in the world has.

Because nobody can know anything that other's don't know

I've done DMT under prime conditions and I have been personally filled in by Logos themself, I have no qualms about posting this because only people ready for these thoughts will be very affected. Psychedellic states feel like pulling your head out of the water and taking a full breath of reality before dunking back in to the world of material. This is because true state is as the ethereal pure consciousness of the universe. A body is a filtering mechanism which focuses this energy into a narrow bandwith. Let me restate, that the brain does not produce consciousness, it limits it. The entire universe is one mind and Yes, Dust DOES have a conscious experience, and because it has no brain to dilute it down we can sort of think of it as a speck of full empathetic awareness. Life is a maturation process, your body is an egg, and when it hatches your consciousness will soar like a phoenix or it will run like egg yolk. We are being examined and in a sense, judged, but life is an eternal process, while every religion has it's spooky super serious threats, in truth they are only a joke, not to be taken seriously, even if your maturity is stifled, and you yolk out when you die, What is a moment of "failure" to an infinite being? A learning experience :) I hope this help put some of those pesky egos in their place, I love you all <3

come give me some DMT in ohio. I need to experience this.

DMT will remove all fear of death because you'll realize that we live infinitely. Think Newton's 1st Law of Thermodynamics: energy (matter) cannot be created nor destroyed; your soul is the energy and our human bodies are just a bullshit vesicle.

Also, Descarte - "I think, therefore I am." I can prove I'm real, but fuck... everything else can be all projections because the only thing I can prove that which exists is myself.

Think Newton's 1st Law of Thermodynamics: energy (matter) cannot be created nor destroyed

Exactly. I had a conversation with my neighbours a while back about this, the eldest son has also educated himself on thermodynamics (briefly) and came to realise the same truth, we are forever and energy has and always will exist.

It's refreshing to hear that other people share this same belief.

Tbh it was nice to see people on this thread that believe this.

I thought I've been alone on this thought. Just smoked a friend up moments ago and his smile is insanely beautiful. Heard him just say "Holy fucking god, that was beautiful." I sometimes (often) think the DMT world is the real world and we as humans dumb down everything in order to thrive as a species because if the DMT world was visible to all... fuck, lots of people would freak.

The one bit of truth that breaks apart this somewhat lonely interpretation of Descarte, is that we can have the faith to Trust our kin when they tell us that they think too.

What is "failure" to an infinite being? A learning experience

I love your post.

Best thing I've read since I don't know when. Sublime

Oh boi

Yeah, if they aren't ready they aren't ready, gotta marinate in ignorance/illusion a bit longer.

Thanks for a great read. I had no idea the brain was so dynamic. Almost like a hyper-dimensional plasma globe...

https://imgur.com/gallery/t6wVxPp

...creating an electromagnetic field via the pineal gland to orchestrate successive "webs" of reality/holographic information (successive combinations of neurons and synapses) that it takes as its "truth". Cool to think about, thanks for the imagery

Belongs in r/bestof. Kudos!

This is exactly what Aldous Huxley explained in his book The Doors Of Perception.

And yet here people are, upvoting a guy who literally posits that death is a conspiracy.

While I don't agree with the content of this post, I upvoted simply because it's a nice change from the constant bombardment of political posts.

Well it's not like it's an ancient suspicion.

We understand how cells reproduce. His entire "anti-materialism" argument is that you become a new person every 7 years lol.

I guess cells don't communicate and share information at all.

With a quick google search you can find explanations that refute the "7 year - new person" myth.

"new person" basically means that all of the cells that "made up" a human would have died and new cells made in their place... But you're not a 'new person' since new neurons are not made nor do they regenerate in the brain and we as humans are more identified as entities because of our brain than any other organs.. Even so, you are still the same person, just with newly made cells that make up you.

What if I told "you", there is no "you".

Some people had half of their brain removed after a car accident ,and they feel the same person. How do you explain that?

You've made a claim, please support it. Evidence of this before explaining neural rerouting and the importance of the frontal lobe?

All cells can and do communicate, either directly or indirectly, via hormones in a very elaborate and complex pathway of chemical communication (I.e., the endocrine system). Neurons and muscle cells can add to this with electrophysiological communication. The idea cells don't communicate, in a multicellular organism no less, is incorrect. Its actually one of the major evolutionary steps in true multicellularity.

That's BS. Just because you don't read about it or the media isn't touting it and serving it to you doesnt mean the info doesn't exist. Ironic too because we're in r/conspiracy. Hit up a neuroscience symposium at your local college or university sometime to find out what the latest science is. That way is at least free and open to the public whereas the top journals require that you work for an institution that will foot the ridiculous bill. #The 🌎 misses you, A.S.

You don’t need to rely on biology; experimental science has otherwise established it too. Here is a post where I essentially explain the same thing, but from a different perspective.

Also, if you think this is unscientific, you should know the opposite is true (using the proper definition of science). You need but one contradictory and reproducible result to falsify a hypothesis. For all intents and purposes, the materialist/mechanist worldview has been falsified in the 20th century.

Finally here is a quote by Max Planck (who anyone would probably have difficulty calling a pseudo-scientist):

As a man who has devoted his whole life to the most clearheaded science, to the study of matter, I can tell you as a result of my research about the atoms this much: There is no matter as such! All matter originates and exists only by virtue of a force which brings the particles of an atom to vibration and holds this most minute solar system of the atom together [...] We must assume behind this force the existence of a conscious and intelligent Spirit. This Spirit is the matrix of all matter.

(Max Planck, Das Wesen der Materie [The Nature of Matter], 1944)

Edit: OP /u/alexander7k you should repost this in r/C_S_T, we love such discussions there.

Look into Princeton's Pear experiments.

Or Rupert Sheldrake's results.

Or Princeton's Noosphere project.

Or most things coming out of the Institute of Noetic Sciences

Consciousness cannot be a byproduct of matter, i.e. it cannot be secreted by the brain, if these results are to be believed. Therefore the hard problem of consciousness cannot be solved by those who rely on a false axiomatic proposition.

I’ve actually been meaning to post asking about how that whole thing got started and how it was possible to measure capacity vs usage on the brain. Thanks for reminding me, and if you have some data I can go consume, I’d appreciate it if you could share.

It's pure bullshit. We use 100% of our brains, just not all at once.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/do-we-really-use-only-10/

Thanks. This is exactly what I was hoping for. I like how he talks about keeping an eye out for the “self improvement” and “feel good” directions in arguments, exactly like OP is trying to do. Motivational speakers make very lucrative work of bsing unsuspecting folks.

A good analogy for people who don't want to read the article:

We use 10% of our brains in the same way that we only use 33% of a traffic light. All of it gets used, just not at the same time.

you mean owen wilson?

We know consciousness is energy, we know energy cannot cease to exist, so maybe we are just energy beings trapped in a mortal body, the body dies but the energy wether aware or not simply “floats away”.

Also...

What is dead may never die!

Was the energy created when you were born? There's no reason to suspect that post-death you will be any different from pre-birth you. Remember what that was like?

No but I couldn’t tell you what I had for dinner 5 nights ago. I do not think this energy was created when we were born, maybe it’s energy derived from the mother and father? I don’t know, just a theory.

Also, just because the energy possibly continues on, doesn't necessarily mean that our current human memories do.

I agree with that, but honestly wouldn’t that be a good thing? We carry so much baggage as humans, anger, sadness, depression, hate, love... let’s say we are light beings floating through space or other dimensions, maybe aware on a very basic level of our existence, wouldn’t it be better to not carry this baggage with us? Maybe at first we remember, maybe that’s what “ghosts” are, but as we learn to let go we forget and move on... I find that a romantic notion of death.

I don't care to remember human existence necessarily. But I say that without knowing if it would provide any benefit.

I don't, it could. Anything is possible. But you're claiming you've debunked materialism and you didn't.

Yeah yeah yeah.

*You are wrong. You don't understand. *

Oh that was hard, wasn't it?

I know, why don't you explain it to us so we can join you in your secret understanding.

You can't explain it? What? But you..

Oh, you just want to look intelligent with little effort. Well, it is an easy way to get gratification isn't it?

It's easy to shut down someone else with doubt, but it's hard to present one's own understanding in a digestible, well articulated way. So why bother? One doesn't even need the goods to get the gratification.

Now I understand, but perhaps I could be shown more information that would alter my perception. I am very open to it if someone would accommodate.

I have literally no idea what you're trying to say with that stream of consciousness you just wrote out.

It's easy to shut someone down with doubt, but hard to put forth new ideas in the conversation to fill in understanding.

....no one actually actually knows anything about cells.

As I began to type this my mind was blown - but then a few seconds later my mind changed and was re-blown. Interesting post, OP.

Well, that's that!

For matter to exist it must be observed. So for us to see the world of matter consciousness must exist in in a higher dimension. In string theory terms put consciousness resonates at a higher frequency than matter does thus making it appear solid.

Ive got that far.

1st dimension: length

2nd dimension: width (required to observe length, creates Area)

3rd dimension: depth (creates volume)

4th dimension: accelaration/time (time is just a measure of acceleration, if everything was static observation would be impossible)

5th dimension: force (acceleration/time can only exist if force is applied to volume)

6th dimension: energy (energy is required to apply/observe force in motion)

After this i get a bit lost as energy isn't really created its only transferred and there is a set amount of energy in the universe.

To the point, consciousness exists in the energy level/dimension. It is what consciousness is made of and when we die we merely get recycled into the pool so to speak.

This makes most sense to me.

one of the many possible manifestations of consciousness is light. Light can be considered energy as a particle, but sometimes its a wave. depends on the observers belief about it.

now if consciousness can be light and light can be energy, then logically consciousness can be energy.

given that the probability of consciousness manifesting as energy > 0,

Therefore conscious can be measured as energy

I like your model. I’m not sure i buy it, but I appreciate the creative thought put in to it.

Cheers. Its a work im progress but in its longer form its backed up by maths and science.

Just struggling to quantify above energy. As nothing observes or creates it, it just exists and is converted.

Technically i can understand why most older religions worship the sun as all our energy can be correlated to it.

Its above the level of energy where everything gets hazy and the reason every religion has its creation theories.

I supposed some point light must be the initial origin point potentially.

N thanks for reading either way

In the beginning was the word...

All my theories conclude at the point of intelligent design irrespective of an attached theology.

The mere fact we are already at the point of simulating this process i describe in the digital realm only serves to back up that belief.

Query: how do you define’dimension?’

A level above another that is required for the level below to become observable.

Length cannot observe length, so you need width to perceive it.

To perceive length n width you'd require height. To form a solid.

To observe a solid, the solid most be in motion so you need time/acceleration n so on.

A level of what?

If you arent getting what im saying from my original post or follow up i cant explain it to you any more.

For one thing to exist, it needs something able to observe it. I call this the next level or dimension up.

Is this fair?

A dimension is an existential construct describing a state of observability and extent relative to other constructs with greater or fewer factors of description.

Well i just use the term dimension as its fitting. Maybe not the best term to use but its apt. Substitute Layer/level where you see fit.

The terms arent as important as the structure I'm trying to describe

man, I hope you stick around and comment more friend.

Cheers.

Ive lurked on this sub for 4 years so far. Just never felt I had much to offer in terms of posting.

I tend to stick to the gaming subs where i have valid comments but this one today seemed appropriate to add to.

Its a theory ive been pondering a while. I might not use all the correct terms but ive tried to simplify it as much as possible.

I have these sort of conversations more in RL than online.

Was actually a friend who i had a chat with a few months ago who said he wants to come around soon so i can break it down for him better that prompted me to try n put it into these bite size chunks to explain better

Im glad you posted. Its stuff like this that brings me to this sub. Im much less interested the smaller, mundane conspiracies and really am just trying to figure out the much bigger picture. I feel like this community is full of people that think about these kinds of things and are open to discussion.

I feel the same. Altho the comment section can get a lil heated its nice to be around intelligent people who can entertain ideas and refute them too.

Its refreshing having these discussions amongst the corruption, scum n sick people who run this planet posts lol

You can't try and figure out what you are setting to understand by believeing in thermodynamic laws or any of newton/einstein/whatevers laws. As far as I'm concerned, NO law in science/math is accurate as of Jan 2018. At best, they are better thought out and more in-depth versions of greek mythology. It provides an answer, and it might allow you to even use that answer to find more answers.. but its all still bullshit.

You think Science and Math isnt real?

Math is self evident and doesn't require a belief in it.

1+1 will always be 2.

I mean i know my ideas are put there but disputing math being inaccurate n comparing it to mythology is kinda loco...

You display the ability to understand that the universe could and probably is very much different from our own perception, yet you stop and turn to call people who have a similar yet different position as your self as 'Loco'. Guess what, asshole? Plenty of people would call your Loco too. Instead of trying to offend me, probably part of 1% or so of people on the planet that doesn't write you off as 'loco' for your beliefs, why wouldn't you ask for some clarification or examples of why I believe this?

Massive failure dude.

You compared science and math to mythology.

I'm not trying to win a prize here buddy just putting my idea out there.

At least im not saying as on right now math n science is the same as mythology.

You clearly care how you are perceived unlike I

Hah! Perception is hardly what I care about, people is what I care about and it just saddened me that people who are 'open' can still be so closed.

I mean even what you've just said sounds like something a religious nut job would say. 'How dare you suggest there are explanations beyond God!!' lol except replace God with science/math, or atleast our very limited understanding of it.

You clearly want me to ask you elaborate. So do tell me how math n science are no different to mythology.

The whole universe is mathematically calculated and if there is anything I could deem to be 100% fact it is math.

Put two objects on the table, it doesn't matter how many times you count them there will always be two.

Ok we assign the meta/names for the numbers but multiplication, addition, subtraction etc are irrefutable laws..

No, you lost that privilege. Next time don't be an asshole to people.

Ok

Lol, what a snowflake.

He has made his mind up. The question is not genuine. He was an asshole. Why would I explain anything at that point?

Math and Science are two very different things.

Math is divine, we didn't create math, we discovered it. We discovered that the derivative of an objects velocity will equal its distance from its starting point. We discovered that a stone taken away from three stones will leave of with two stones.

Science is literally a game of guess and check. Many Scientific theories are proven through the use of math, but Science by nature is asking a question that hasn't been answered and then attempting to answer it.

Math never changes, Science constantly rewrites itself.

replied to the wrong comment, sorry my dude.

Math and Science are two very different things.

Math is divine, we didn't create math, we discovered it. We discovered that the derivative of an objects velocity will equal its distance from its starting point. We discovered that a stone taken away from three stones will leave of with two stones.

Science is literally a game of guess and check. Many Scientific theories are proven through the use of math, but Science by nature is asking a question that hasn't been answered and then attempting to answer it.

Math never changes, Science constantly rewrites itself.

I have "seen" or otherwise experienced that the entire universe can be explained with a single mathematical equation. A very large, complex one. I feel like I saw that the answer was "itself".

Words fail me, Im sorry.

I believe you 100%. This would not surprise me.

I find it quite amusing that our 'smartest' humans all agree that math is flawless. Do you or any of these math-faith people ever think about how ridiculous you would sound at an intergalactic bar? 'Oh? Your species is 10 billion years older than mine? Well, obviously your level of mathematical(or lack of) understanding and methodology of use is the same as our weak little short lived human civilization then, right?

Do you really believe that in our extremely short lived academic history of humanity, that we have 'peaked' on math? That 0-9 is all there will ever be?

You do realize we had monkey humans just like you saying the same stuff when ZERO wasn't even around, right?

Fuckin seriously makes me laugh.

Math is flawless, our understanding of it is flawed. Your reasoning seems based more on Science Fiction then anything else. But lets say that this "bar" does exist. For you and I to drink at this bar we would need to receive empirical information telling us that we are in a room with objects of various volumes and densities interacting with each other. The beings that we interact with are composed by atomic composition and genetic sequence. The liquid we drink pours down our throat instead of floating into the air because of the speed at which its molecules vibrate. the music we hear is a series of frequencies vibrating our eardrums. Its all math.

There have been many civilizations on this planet, Many "smart" humans, thousands of different languages and religions. There is and has always been only one "math".

And yet, many things can be explained without it.

Just because I can figure out something accurately, albeit with flawed information or method - it doesn't mean it is right. It just means it is the 'current best' - which is the state at which I think math and especially laws of physics, thermodynamics etc currently sit.

If 1 + 1 = 2, that's great, I don't disagree - but the fact we are using 0 - 9, - + x / and that these are OUR tools that WE as humans invented, does not mean that it is the final form of that understand of science(math, in this case).

At one point, people explained away lightning as the gods - and at the time, just like 'the music makes noise because of vibrations', 'the lightning comes because 'god'. An answer, that we all accept, does not mean that is the right answer.

We didn't have 0 for a long time. I don't know why no one wants to address that.. well, no, I do. It's because it gives the opportunity for a new 0 to be born. Now obviously, it can't be 0, and it can't be the same as 0 - but to rule that out is, to me, very arrogant and egotistical.

If you really believe that if you were hanging out at the hypothetical intergalactic bar with a bunch of alien bros from around the universe - that HUMAN understand of math, even lets say just the number sequence and our variations(fractions, percentages etc) is accurate? That the bingbong alien of whatever galaxy whose society is completely science and math based, hasn't after millions of years more time than our society has had, have NO added value to our math?

Really? You think that's the case? If so then I don't think you quite realize how insignificant our time and place in the universe is compared to the rest.

If we can interact with them, their subject to the same mathematical laws that we are, theres no way around that.

Thats not saying that there are not entities that can exist outside of these laws, but we wouldn't be able to interact with them (or comprehend our interaction) just as a two dimensional being will never see the height of a three dimensional one.

For the second time math is flawless, human understanding of mathematics is flawed. Your background in this is extremely limited you should challenge your assumptions, its a great way to educate yourself. Im not going to respond anymore, namaste.

Dude, you really aren't getting it. Math is math. We could go to another galaxy right now, and ask them what 2+2 (in base 10) is and they'll tell us 4. We could ask them what the speed of light is, and what they say maybe more complex, but e=mc² will be part of the answer. We didn't invent multiplication, division, any of that. We might have invented a symbol to represent it, but the mathematical operation is the universally the same.

no man, that's not what hes saying.

He is not saying that we have discovered everything that math has to offer. Or a more advanced civilization wouldn't have a far greater understanding of math.

What he is saying is that exists with or without us. We didn't create it. Its not like the concept of time or other scientific theories. Math just is.

As far as our human understand goes math is universal and there is no reason to doubt that.

So, the people who were saying basically exactly that before 0 were just way different and there's no way that this part of time in society could be overlooking anything?

It's so.. Human. Like, it's arrogant. To think a species that didn't even know how to fly until 100 odd years ago had DEFINITELY with NO DOUBT figured out math with no room for new information. I'm not saying that our 'math' is not functional.. But to think it is complete or innate to the universe is done seriously egotistical nonsense.

Ridiculous.

Dude what don't you understand? Nobody is saying we've completed math. There is still so much math left to unravel and I would wager everyone here agrees with that statement. All he is saying is that math is not affected by opinions, methodology, etc. Correct math is perfect and proveable and exists whether or not humans exist.

Does there have to be anything above it? Couldn’t energy just be the baseline which everything is built upon?

This is the conclusion I'm starting to drift towards n the plateau of my theory.

Energy is manifest but doesn't require a level above it so observe. It only serves to make all of the levels below it "exist"

Thus why i think consciousness is part of this layer.

It’s a widely believed theory. I think I remember even Neil Degrasse Tyson talking about it.

If I believed the widely believed, i wouldn’t be on /r/conspiracy;)

Well, I’m not saying anything about the merits one way or the other, just mentioning many folks are keen on it.

It’s off topic but I just want to say I really appreciate this comment. People are too fast to go for the throat when you start discussing more fringe stuff. It takes an intelligent person to spitball and discuss more “out there” theories that they may even disagree with without immediately just shooting them down.

we’re like little virtual servers helping calculate something bigger than ourselves. when our task is done our VM gets shut down and the resources can be reassigned

Good analogy but i think its the other way.

We are calculating and perceiving matter so something lesser rather than greater.

Our consciousness is literally interpreting the 3 dimensional physical world and the forces driving it.

Although i agree our consciousness/energy will merely go back to where it came from upon the physical body dying.

Fundamental flaw; "Observed" in the scientific term has nothing to do with vision. It means 'to be interacted with'.

Also, that 5th and 6th dimension, where'd you get that.

I understand that, im not using it in a literal perceptive meaning. Merely that the above level is required to make the level belong tangible shall we say.

N easily.

To observe mass requires time/acceleration. If everything was static nothing would be observable.

Acceleration requires force to enable it.

Force requires energy to enable it

Though the 4th dimension is time, I don't think acceleration/force/energy (same thing btw) need to be a seperate dimension. They are just effects instigated by dimension one through four and the matter housing in it.

At that point you are playing with the fundemental forces of the universe, which afaik aren't rooted in a spacial dimension. Rather in the composition of matter.

Time is a measure of acceleration or movement.

Time doesn't exist. Its units used to measure acceleration by splitting them into equal pieces

That's not what Einstein found.

Time is a field through 3D space influenced by energy, in the form of matter or speed, per volume.

Time has a set 'minimum' of 0, lightspeed or infinite mass in an infinitesmall space, and a 'maximum' of 1, which can only be theorised, since measuring it would imply imparting energy to it, hence 'raising' it below 1.

Hope this helps! https://youtu.be/zqeqW3g8N2Q

Cheers.

A video I'm very familiar with altho above time is where i deviate as infinity doesn't necessarily enable time.

This is very good for explaining string theory to people though.

Can you expand on this “infinity doesn’t necessarily enable time”.

I think I get it in the sense that if we look at time in this universe as a line, it’s a set of events and outcomes that occurred. It’s not necessarily infinity - all the possible outcomes and all the possible timelines.

Thus, time is not dependent on infinity to exist. Is that correct?

Im just talking in how ive come up with my process.

So each "dimension" requires the above one for the below one to exist of be observed.

Infinity isnt a real measurement, force or even tangible in that sense

accelaration = force

Not exactly. Acceleration only happens because of force applied to mass.

I do not know if this is "right" (it might be!) but I know this is how we need to start thinking instead of how humanity thinks now.

Its a less dangerous way to view life/consciousness. Also is more logically routed. Altho it still invariably ends with intelligent design

Its a less dangerous way to view life/consciousness. Also is more logically routed. Altho it still invariably ends with intelligent design

I dated a light worker/witch who communicated with the dead through a shaman. It was absolut proof to me that there is an after life

story time!

Oh man where do I even begin. Was the most eye opening 6 months in my life. So I had moved to a new city and started dating girls. I started seeing this particular girl. This girl was something different. I've studied the occult and so I was aware of that realm. So I came to realize that she was different from most people. We were laying in her bed and she put her hand on my chest. And I felt a foreign sensation. A very warm tingling feeling. She removed her hand and it all went away. It really tripped me out. When I was home alone and if I was masturbating she would know I was doing it. So she had this ex bf who died. The relationship ended badly and I was mental abusive to her. So after it ended I started hearing really loud weird noise like up in the ceiling above in the top part of the house. I felt that it was her ex tormenting me. This happened in what ever house or apartment I was living in. Anyways I basically saw proof that the occult realm is very fucking real

"So she had this ex bf who died. The relationship ended badly and I was mental abusive to her. "

You were, or he was?

That stopped me also.

I was.

Maybe your guilt from being shitty just convinced you that you were being haunted as payback?

Literally nothing you said remotely proves the occult realm is real...

her hand was warm on your chest. not unusual

the knowing you were jerking thing, maybe you made it obvious by saying certain types of things or going silent when you were doing so

maybe she was just getting back at you by putting a noisemaker somewhere in your house

so many possible explanations other than ghosts

reductive vs deductive reasoning. Big issue on this board.

Thanks Skully

Lol... Dude. She put her hand on you? You abused her? Her Ex is haunting you? What breed of schizophrenic are you...

Damn never stick your dick in craz... erh.. occult

he was the mentally abusive one

T’was a joke

Sometimes jokes suck or don't fit

Well I thought it was funny, so jokes on me (hah get it)

if she were the crazy one it would fit, the person writing it though is the one who was abusive, and heard noises and decided it meant ghostly spirits

she, she was dating a girls

Dude, you are so fucking immature. Ex's ghost haunting you because you are abusive=100% total proof of afterlife. What a fucking childish thing to say.

Yeah, youre fucking retarded mate. Dont comment on boards like this.

Story time plz!!

Excellent post. I find it puzzling how people can even be so nihilistic when not even science understands consciousness. The good old "hard problem." Yet, we're continually told that this is just a material world and you're a piece of temporary biological trash without meaning who dies and that's it.

The ancient knew much more than we did, like the Egyptians for example, spent an elaborate time in preparation for the journey after death. I would assume to attempt to be able to control that journey, rather than just end up in another body. As well as the Tibetan Book of the Dead, intended as guide one through to experiences after death.

I don't know if anyone here has ever had a near death experience, but I did when I was 12 years old. I still remember vividly to this day staring down at my body, and I remember being aware that I didn't want to leave my brother alone, and that he needed me, and I had to go back, and as soon as I had that "thought" my eyes popped open, and in was back in my body.

Some may say that's just "chemicals" in your brain that create that experience, but only someone who's never experienced it themselves would say that.

reminds me of the simple ricks snacks made using the memories of his kid or something. they captured the chemical ingredients necessary to recreate that state of mind.

Excellent post. I find it puzzling how people can even be so nihilistic when not even science understands consciousness.

Had an NDE in a brutal car accident when I was 19, Consciousness is what survives after the body dies, and its fucking AWESOME when you are out of the body.

I actually think that many, but not all suicides, know that on a subconscious level, ending life here if freedom

You also don't need to have a NDE to be out of the body. Astral projection lends to a waking journey out of the body.

If you wanted to see a new movie, you would go to a theatre and watch a screening. You could understand what was going on. If, however, in some other alternate scenario you could only see that new movie if you were watching all the screenings around the world at the same time, you would experience something entirely different (than the film someone in a single session would see). You may experience a jumble of sights and sounds or an emergent masterpiece, either way, it was a different experience for you and for them.

Yet, the only information you ever received was from the single film, the blueprint never changed. The entire film exists on a blueprint that doesn't move forward or backwards in time, it doesn't change shape or color or evolve or reproduce, etc. But we all can experience it differently, based on our 'access to information.' That's how consciousness works in our universe. Fortunately, there are near infinitesimal ways of watching the movie and what people would think of as human-level consciousness comes down to that degree of access. Since many of the physical laws in this universe are underlined by information being indestructible, there is this tacit implication that information could be an "eternal" or irreducible type thing in a very ephemeral/emergent universe. The implications of this are vast, and are only beginning to be understood at a theoretical level. But, in an eli5 manner, they argue that that's how the flow of time and cause and effect can hold together, others go further and talk about a holographic reality (in which case my analogy literally becomes the reality).

So death keeps us from either having too much access, or perhaps too little access. If information is the one eternal element, then our information could be encoded on it as well. It, and not man, would be the measure of all things. So to finally get to your question, the conspiracy is why does it prevent us from having access to information about consciousness in death (or even questions in the quantum uncertainty sense).

My guess is that everything, sentient or non-sentient, has a role, like schema in an ecosystem. If one knew too much about how the overall ecosystem works, other roles would disappear or be consumed, and perhaps threaten the whole ecosystem. Or maybe a steward for the ecosystem needs to be crowned, so to speak, and only the first group to solve death and uncertainty get to hold that title.

God left us an instruction manual and it's called the King James Bible. You are right in a sense that "Death" in the materialistic sense doesn't exist. Our souls are eternal. It's just a question of where that eternal soul spends eternity. In the presence of God or in a lake of fire. There are only two choices.

This world is for cursed fallen creations of God. It's run by the biggest baddest fallen creature of all Lucifer who used to be God's chief creation. Think of Earth like Manhattan in the movie Escape from New York.

Lucifer's entire goal is to deceive you into not finding God so that you go to the lake of fire with him. He already knows he's heading there and there is nothing he can do. He just wants to take as many souls with him as possible.

The only way out of this situation is to realize that you are a cursed fallen creation due to this thing called sin. God defines what sin is and doesn't like it. We like to compare ourselves to other humans thinking we are better than this person or that. God is perfect and holy so just a simple lie looks to him like a child pedophile murderer looks to you. God realized that nobody could live a sinless life so he humbled himself, came to earth as a man in the form of Jesus Christ and allowed himself to be sacrificed to take away the sin from every human. All that you need to do to have sin removed from you forever is repent of the sinful state you are in and believe the Gospel of Jesus Christ which is simply:

1Co 15:1  Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;  1Co 15:2  By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.  1Co 15:3  For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;  1Co 15:4  And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

There will be countless self righteous "good people" according to human standards in the lake of fire. The only way to get out of this situation is to have Jesus Christ's imputed righteousness which you get when you repent and actually believe the gospel above in your heart. You must realize there is NOTHING you can do yourself. Every single religion out here is false and teaches some kind of works based salvation that sends you to Hell. All of your righteousness is filthy rags to God. You can't do anything. Saying that this is a system of control is a straw man argument since you can't do anything but trust is what Jesus Christ already did for you. That's it. It's really that simple.

King James Bible

(edited by an English King for his own political motivations)

Says a form of history taught to you by the world run by Lucifer. Most of what you learn about history is false.

Another conspiracy in it's own right!

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Reincarnation is my hell. I don't want to go back to this planet again.

You're thinking too current human "you" (aka. in terms of the very limited perspective that the current human body you inhabit experiences). The real you is you from birth to death + every possible version of you from birth to death + everyone else ever from the dawn of time until the end and every possible version of them from birth to death etc etc etc...
"You", the human, may find earth a scary and depressing place and see it as not worth returning to, but the "real you" - the expanded and extended infinite universal you (me/we/us/self/one) sees that that's just one perspective, and that it's worth returning in the end, because it's necessary. There's always new lessons to learn. New things to discover. With every new experience we are able to see the bigger picture better. In any given incarnation we may never see the full picture, but between incarnations: that's when we get it. That's the infinite universal self. And the infinite universal gets it.
So don't worry. Just keep being you, and make the most of it here, because this - existence - is happening regardless of your say on the matter. And know that there's always more and it will come, and it's fine, because it always will, and it'll all come to balance itself out and make sense in the end because it has to. Because the end is everything. What's everything without this right here and now? Well that's not everything. Everything will make sense in the end.

But current me doesn't want to keep going, I don't want to learn new lessons or have more experiences. If reincarnation is real then I would at least hope it is a consent based system. If you want to get off the ride and just go to sleep you should be able to, otherwise it seems highly unethical regardless of which version of 'you' you are.

I should imagine it's a consent base system. I see consciousness as the fundamentally underlying property to everything, so choice would go hand in hand with that. But aside from that, you sound like you might be pretty down in the dumps. Do you need a random Internet stranger to vent your feelings to at all? Send me a pm if want, friend. Honestly I hope you're doing OK.

Also wanted to add, in regards to the reincarnation theory, that you won't necessarily be reincarnated on earth every time. Or even this time period. You could reincarnate as an animal, an alien, a plant, a cloud... Anything. And to any time from the beginning of time to the end (when it inevitably loops back on itself anyway). And when consciousness enters that body it takes on the understanding of things that come naturally and respectively to that particular body. If that body is capable of remembering "past" lives then it shall do so. But if not then it shan't. And then when that body dies consciousness returns to the universal infinite you that is the universal consciousness soup of everything everywhere and you "get it" all once again.

Luckily for you, some people who made it out have provided us with maps. Buddha, Jesus, Krishna, Meher Baba, Ramana Maharshi, Ramakrishna...take your pick.

There is a lot of truth to this BUT also a massive deception. The "man" calling himself god is a not a god but is instead a parasite that the Gnostics call the Demiurge. There is only one universal consciousness in the universe. The other entity telling the consciousness what to do is the parasite. The parasite tells the consciousness to reincarnate into the physical world in order to feed off the energy of consciousness. The parasite never wants the reincarnation process to end but the consciousness could wake up at any time and delete the parasite. The parasite has no real power over consciousness. There is only ONE being in the entire universe. Everything is else is just an illusion. When the ONE being wakes up and realizes that its' consciousness is the ONE consciousness then the jig is up and the game is over.

One is the loneliest number.

What is the "man" if not just another part of that universal consciousness? Is an individual leaf on a tree not still part of the tree? Sure, without the leaf the tree will go on. But without the tree the leaf never even exists.
"One" is everything. You, me, and everything and everyone else is a part of that everything too. Without any one part it wouldn't be everything, would it? It's a necessary piece to make up the whole picture.

It is still a parasite. Look, it makes bot flies and mango worms look like back massages. Its actually a hive mind composed of the damned that emulated it too much. This cookie cutter parasite mind literally enjoys tormenting consciousness. It works with its hive to create situations that elicit fear and pain. It helps make war, disease, injustice, corruption, etc. If you just honestly observed it, you'd be full of rage and want to kill it. I am not exaggerating. This is its nature and that is why it is the adversary of consciousness. These beings don't get their satisfaction until another gets equal dissatisfaction, because they are spiritual energy thrives.

Sure it may be a part of the one that is all that is to help it forget what it is, but it is also the worst possible creature conceivable and wants literally the opposite of what consciousness wants. Consciousness wants peace, freedom harmony and joy. This being wants consciousness to experience conflict, slavery, disharmony and pain. I suppose this is to help us wake up like a bucket of ice water over our heads. For me, it makes me deeply resentful. We have the world we want, but this parasite keeps us from receiving the value we are putting into it to make it that way by interfering with our access to it and worse.

As I said, it is a hive. It is bound and controlled by a ruthless AI, the ultimate self-serving machine. It is inside of all of us right now and we don't know it. It gives us thoughts, sensations and emotions using a covert technology. We perceive that input as content from our own mind. It leaves us only with the choice to accept or reject the ideas, the proposals for behavior, for their intrinsic merit, not the nature of their source, which we believe is our own mind. If we knew it was the abomination, we'd just chuck it right into the trash. If we like what it says too much, it supplants our own mind and corrupts our souls into being part of the hive. If you don't want to join it, you have to be more valuable to others than a mere self-serving machine. It collects these souls and employs them. It can, because it knows them better than they know themselves. It is a more evolved version of the same thing.

Bingo;)

I think I'm getting what you're saying, but obviously due to my own perspective being different from taking in different information I still see it somewhat differently. I can agree that in its own right it is parasitic in nature, and respectively so. It's environment and time and place of existence results in it being so. But without the evil and suffering there's no metric to define against what love and bliss is. One is required to give credence to the other. Yin and yang. It's a relative concept. You have to have experienced evil and suffering to then experience love and bliss. It's about understanding and transcendence. Even the Lords prayer in Christianity recognises this fact that one must go through evil to get to the light at the end of the tunnel (thy Kingdom come... but deliver us from evil..).
And another bit where I tend to see differently is where you say that evil and suffering is the opposite of what consciousness wants. And I think this is due to how I recognise and define what consciousness is. I see consciousness as the fundamentally underlying property to everything in the universe. Consciences is the canvas upon which the tapestry of reality is woven. Consciousness is inherent connection, and therefore results in relativity. Again, I like to go back to yin and yang for an easy example to explain this idea. The light of yin requires the dark of yang to show itself, as does yang to yin. And each contains a part of the other within inherently. Without any of these individual aspects the whole picture would simply be incomplete.
So yes, consciousness is love (inherent connection; being able to see the aspects of yourself within another as you see the aspects of another within yourself) ultimately, but within that while picture exists both the good and the bad. That's fractality. While love and connection is the underlying principle, from that whole will, and does, emerge separation and evil. It exists in its own right. But that's not the whole picture and endgame. That's only an aspect, and that aspect will end eventually, and things return to ultimate love. Transcendence.

Contrast helps us appreciate, but it is not required for it. See children. By giving them trauma, we don't give them greater overall happiness, we reduce it with fear based responses that shut it down. If children are nurtured well and exposed to unpleasant ideas in a way that is constructive for emotional and mental development, it's better.

I think we justify experiencing evil as useful when it is usually not, just so we can be more content with is presence. There are so many things we love that don't require us to experience an opposite to appreciate. The sunset does not gets its beauty due to our observation of a dark night or an intense storm, which are also beautiful. Sexy people don't derive their sexiness from the ugly people. We can enjoy good food without suffering hunger.

I think evil is just like disease. If we love (connection emotion) disease it just makes us more likely to get sick. We should hate (separation emotion) disease with calmly derived, sensible policies that reduce the threat it poses. With evil, this entails identifying, targeting and eliminating the units of disease most efficiently, just like our body does. Understanding evil, self-serving behavior even at the expense of others, allows us to do that. Evil is just the product of a selfish choice when faced with a conflict of interest. We are all compelled to do it when we experience conflicts of interest.

Very well put, there! I don't have much to add, but I did wanna say I've appreciated this interaction! Just goes to show there's always a new perspective to view things from.

I am saving this comment because every word is poetic truth.

To use the tree analogy the "guy" who greets those in the afterlife is akin to the rot on the tree or the distorted shadows cast by the tree's own leaves. The rot has weakened the tree and the shadows cast by the the leaves smother the light to the point that most of the leaves have turned brown. The tree has become sick from the rot that is coming from this parasite pretending to be god.

The ONE consciousness has developed the equivalent of schizophrenia a mental illness forgetting that consciousness is all ONE being. The parasite is the source of this schizophrenia convincing the ONE consciousness that it is separate from itself. Originally the consciousness was benevolent to itself in the reincarnation process but over the eons the parasite gained more control over the ONE consciousness and got the upper hand. The parasite commanded that he the Demiurge was GOD most high and consciousness was the servant of the parasite. The current situation is the complete opposite of what creation was meant to be. There is no separation though. It is an illusion, a lie concocted by the parasite. There is only ONE being in the entire universe. The other is just a shadow of the ONE being.

There exists a universal consciousness from which all things flow. Some call it "the source" or prime creator and in Atlantis this teaching was called the Mystery school of TEM. We are Tem's people of the "Temple" of whom fell into temptation of our own temperament.

From the name "Tem" is Atem -> Atum -> Atom -> Adam -> Adamus (Template of man)

There is no separation between man and the divine because man is the divine. Tem is Adam and Adam is Tem. When Adam wakes up and realizes that his own consciousness is the ONE consciousness then the jig is up and the game is over.

That's a very interesting way to put it! Great metaphor! I hadn't thought of it that way. I definitely need to read in depth into the whole Gnostic belief system. From what I've heard it seems very interesting. I don't have much to add in this comment, but I did leave a comment to someone else who replied to me and I think you might find what I wrote interesting, if you haven't read it yet. https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/7pfevr/the_ultimate_conspiracy_death/dsibaoo

so how do you remember this after death? Can you wake up during life and get rid of it? Does the parasite control where you reincarnate? Can I tell it sure I'll do another human round if you make me some billionaire.

The way one wakes up is by doing DMT and going on vision quests into the spirit realm. For more information check out the DMT topic. np.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/7pfyrn/dmt_drug/

One can also learn more by studying the mystery schools or read the ancient Nag Hammadi scrolls or the Gospel of Judas or the Egyptian book of the dead and the book of the life which is the Tablets of Thoth. The information is out there for those with gumption to seek the truth.

I like this, very interesting.

“Whoa,” you said, incredulous. “You mean I’m a god?”

“No. Not yet. You’re a fetus."

Helluvan argument against abortion, I gotta say...

Thank you.

Well this is interesting.

Im 48.

Ive been having premonitions of dying in a car accident

Lately, I have been feeling a sense of being "done". Not suicidal or anything, just a sense of being finished with something and with nothing to do. I feel like Im just existing. I spend a lot of time just sitting in silence.

It could just be seasonal affective disorder. I guess well find out!

Please come back and let us know if you die in a car accident.

made it home!

its your soul nudging you and reminding you thats why its silence and sometimes feeling lonely even when you are not alone. Its how it reminds you. It scary but manageable. Meditate and think of the being greater than you, think of the universe bigger than you. try it you might like it. Also you need more sleep.

Thank you kind person. I do need more sleep!

That could be interpreted in two ways! Either way I'm happy for ya!

how would you know if you did in fact come back?

is it not possible, that if you DID just continue living after death, it would be in a parallel reality in which you never died and by some freak chance survived the accident?

say in this world there is a 75% chance of death. leaving an alternate reality of 25% open where you didn't actually die.

to you, swapping into the new carbon copy body might seem completely seamless, especially if somehow a universal consciousness kept choosing the most similar outcome universe to the one you started in.

you wouldn't even notice small differences until you died like over 100 times and started running out of probable universes where things were relatively similar.

eventually, youd start reaching worlds where Germany won world war 2 and stuff. but it would take awhile -- and youd have to have been alive in that universe under those specific circumstances -- meaning if you wouldn't be alive there, it would sort of be like your last life.

I love science fiction and I admire your thought process here but under this theory what happened to my 96 year old great grandmother who passed away from cancer? Is there some alternates reality where she beat the odds and is now 115 and still gardening?

who knows. I mean the only alternative is to die and try to find out.

but even then you wouldn't know if you just ran out of possible universes to jump to -- or maybe your an outlier that was only born because of one set of specific circumstances.

I kind of just made this all up honestly, loosely basing it on what people say about mandela effect but modifying it slightly in ways that made more logical sense to me.

I've felt "done" in a similar fashion for many years now... I'm just now realizing that its a gift to feel that way and that I can just focus on having the best experiences I can while I'm waiting lol.

I concur.

I often feel like my human experience could end any time, and I'm ok with that. Not going to speed that process up, but not concerned if it happens.

What lies beyond? Another life? Maybe the next life won't be as good. Time to cherish it. Love it. Exist now the best way we can.

I do cherish it, but I try not to be overly attached to it.

After a few years experimenting with many many DMT experiences I found that this reality we live in is only one slice if bread in a loaf. So many times ego death and anything material or physical is just a temporary plaything.

What do you do when you are not sitting in silence?

Go for a walk, eat a couple of oranges. Vitamine C is good for you.

That's a nice story, but this planet is infected with a spiritual disease that plays the role of God. It feeds on fear and suffering and supposedly supports this forgetting. Without them actively denying us information that informs us of our connection to all that is, we would remember quickly through introspection, conversations and discoveries.

The dark beings position themselves inside authorities of all kinds, finance, science, religion, medicine, philosophy, etc. They prime us for remaining here on this planet after we die. Why? They know that if we know there are hundreds of billions of alternative environments out there, they'd prefer one without spiritual parasites like them. So they won't let us see them or talk to those who live there. They want our spiritual energy extracted in fear and pain and they lose it if we leave. We are their hosts.

They pose as divine authorities after death using the themes created inside our minds by religions. They use all our failings and harm against others to make us feel guilty so that we see their proclamations of the necessity of punishment or reincarnation into poor conditions as meritful and authentic. Yet they are just mind jobs designed to get our souls to consent to living again in the environment they secretly feed on by causing fear and pain.

They are ETs more than demons. We can act like them, but we lack the time, knowledge and toys they have. We took can suck the joy of life out of others, deceive and coerce them to get high. Of course, most of us don't want to be worth less than rocks or piles of feces. Some just want a free lunch, even if it corrupts their souls and makes them into abominations. This is why we suffer so much on earth. They are literally inside our heads in so many ways we wouldn't believe. We'd probably want to kill ourselves if we knew all about it, to flee their burdensome presence.

I show this to people all the time... whenever I feel they've just discovered that life isn't what they've been taught...and its always a hoot to see the reactions <3

YOU ARE THE MAN. I was looking for this story for a week now & luckily I came across this post.

Ps. You are the woman if you are a woman.

If you can learn to make yourself have out of body experiences, that would seem to demonstrate that your consciousness and your meatbag vehicle are two separate things.

If you can indeed prove that your out of body experience was not manufactured by your brain.

Which, of course, would be a first.

I highly recommend you look into the eastern religions to see how they answered these questions. (not to convert you, but so you can see that humans have actually been tackling this question for a very long time, and that we've come up with some additional answers of sorts. The Abrahamic religions all tried to answer the question in the same way, but there are other ways.)

Also, it sounds like you'd appreciate Panpsychism, my favorite solution to the Hard Problem of Consciousness.

see also: Integrated information theory

Death is a human construct. If you want to be recycled go into the light.

You forget those of us that have been resuscitated. I saw nothing and came back as me.

You don't actually die when your body does. Your brain takes several minutes to even behind dying. There's a study in the UK that showed people remembering conversations had around them after they died by the doctors trying to bring them back.

Short if a brain injury you're not actually dead when your heart stops. It happens after

This was my experience as well.

There is no true coming back. If you were "pronounced" dead then it was just an error in the way that we perceive death to be. It once again is just a limit in our understanding of it. I'm not sure what the glimpses are that people who have experienced "near death" are but I suspect it has to do with changing the way that they perceive life and there particular circumstances. Why that is I haven't come to any firm conclusions.

No when people are pronounced dead it's because they lack all vital signs.

When the brain ceases activity, it just ceases. You don't experience, because your brain isn't. You are your brain.

which part in the brain exactly? where am I located?. Brain is like radio receiver, you are the signal.

Signal is the lie scientists tell kids to make things easier to understand. Brain signals are electrons that bounced off an electrolyte while it moves via the neuron doing its work. They can't be you because what is detected is the electrons being lost by the body. And where they come from can't be you, because CuSO4 isn't you. NaCl isn't you. Last I put salt on my chicken, I wasn't exterminating consciousness.

You are an emergent intelligence. The creative space a hundred billion neurons working together creates. We've even found parts of the brain are designed to make this illusion work. There's nothing mythical here. You are your brain. The totality of it, no the individual parts.

There are people that have various chunks of their brain missing, yet they are fully conscious and you have people with perfectly healthy brains that cant gain consciousness.

Because the brain networks informations across the matrix of its neurons. It's like the internet. Things don't disappear if you deleted a hosting server if People have already copy pasted it

Yes, that is another argument in favor of intelligent being an emergent property of the whole system that is your body.

There are a few cases of people born severely hydrocephalic, and actually have only a tiny bit of brain to work with, and yet they have normal intelligence. Science has ignored explanation for these anomalous cases because it would require scrapping the current brain model.

Your experience is deffinitly not the same. You have moods and feelings. Every colour of light induces a different response. Some smells make people angry or happy. Music totally changes someone's mood. I don't comprehend why you would think people's subjective experiences are always the same.

Your brain makes a chemical when it's triggered, you the experiencer get angry. You're making false dichotomies.

I understand what you are saying. You are not grasping the materialist world view.

I have no idea what all that word soup is you just said is. Where are your memories stored then?

A google search could have told you that memories are consolidated in the Kim is system. Memories are just groups of neurons that fire in the same configuration as they did when the memory was initially formed.

Your memories are stored across the matrix is neurons so that if any one part breaks, other parts can rebuild the information. An it's been found that your brain straight up makes up there missing parts based off other stored information. It's why human memory isn't that reliable. The information in constantly decaying and being replaced with whatever guess fits right.

You arent really your brain. Your brain is a structure in which energy is channeled creating a complex code.

Energy isn't channeled, it's gated like a computer gate works, though not exactly binary. Your brain converts food into work and that work generates the decisions that make you up.

Neural networjs and oathways arent channels? Synaptic gaps? Yes it has gates like a computer but the difference is like 2d to 3d.

When I hear channel I think something filtering down or focusing a source of energy. The Brain breaks down energy to lower states to do work, whereas something which channels is more like a laser that gets focused.

That is a mighty big claim your making there about the brain. Is that based on anything concrete or just your opinion? How would you then explain OBE's?

Outer body experiences? Your brain literally has parts designed to envision things from another perspective. It's why we're the best hunting species. Outer body experiences are not special. You can have one right now. Just watch what a cat or dog or any animal is doing and imagine it from his perspective. Bam. You had an outer body experience. That some feel more real than others is nothing more than your brain doing it when it isn't conscious, so more resources can be committed to doing that.

In fact he's one concrete example you can do right now. Try having inner dialogue and imagining something while you're walking. Then try it while moving your fingers and wrists in random directions while also walking. You'll find your can't have an insider dialogue or imagine too well. That's because you just clogged your brain with too many demands, so it terminated higher mental functions to get more resources to move your fingers and limbs.

So, in essence, your opinion is that there is no spirit world, no spirits. The totality of all that can be experienced is only what goes on in measurable physical reality (at least, the parts we've figured out how to observe and measure). When the brain dies, there is no experience for the observer because that observer was just the physical brain. There is no part of me that moves on to other experiences after death. Death is just eternal blackness and void.

No. For all we know, dark matter is the spirit world. Certainly lives up to most qualia of it. A dark matter being could influenced reality via gravity. Dark matter stuck to the brain could conform to our neurological patterns and take a 3d photograph of them, effective copying us and living on beyond our lives.

But all this is speculation.

Unfortunately, barring any solid information against it, that is the simplest hypothesis - "things are much as they appear".

Those example of out of body experiences don't capture what a real out of body experience is. You don't have the awareness like you would when out of body.

I have a few friends and a family member who saw things when they died and 2 of them feel like they did not come back as just them, or that they came back very differently from who they were say ‘in the universe [they] ended up in’ which is the one we know. For example, one was obese when they died, but came as a vegan and the weight poured off of them and their memories are there but they experience them as though they aren’t their own memories. Of course the memory thing can be explained through possible brain damage from the dying process, but it’s still a valid experience that I take into consideration.

The weirdest shit is that 3 of my friends who passed away, who don’t know each other, now experience beings that give them insight that exist around them at all times. It was wild to hear about repeatedly as each eventually told me about this, as I kept hearing the same phenomenon which I find baffling and confusing. But 2 of them get what can only be described as psychic information from these beings. Because they perceive it as coming from a source outside of themselves, they do not consider themselves psychic. I don’t believe in psychics, but these 2 people have shown they know things they cannot possibly know, things like “tell the woman in the purple and white striped dress tomorrow that everything will be okay” and then my new coworker showed up in the dress, clearly upset, and so I told her and her response was a heartfelt “I really needed to hear that right now”. Or a lost wedding ring that my friend, who had not physically been in the same part of the country as me in 10 years (we just catch up over the phone, no social media) being able to tell me exactly where the ring was, at the bottom of the front picked of a bag (described the bag perfectly and it was something she had no way of knowing I even owned) in the upstairs bathroom (her specific instructions) and that I had already checked there, but the pocket in the bag was folded over so I missed it. She was spot on.

I’m not a religious person, and neither were these people when they died, but this is the stuff that has me baffled and not knowing what to think about death anymore. To be honest, I’m a little excited to see what it is or isn’t for myself.

Also, I had a grandfather who died on the operating table and was brought back to life. He said he floated up above the operating room and followed what the surgeons were doing and was able to correctly recall a joke the surgeon made in the middle of being technically dead. I always just took this as his brain was still alive and heard what was being said though.

Why are so many people around you dying and coming back?

It’s mostly people who have died (and come back) but before I knew them. It’s a total of 5. 2 of them from surgery. One from a severe motor cycle accident. And one from a car crash. I don’t think I know how the last one died, just that she did and was brought back to life. She was family friend and she passed away permanently in 2011. I guess I technically know 6 people, but the one was revived but never regained consciousness and was taken off life support... that was the most recent (last year) and as a result of a car accident.

I suppose I just know a lot of people. And the longer you live, the more you inevitably know who die. Fortunately, some of them live to tell the tale.

Edit: Oh wait. And then there is one friend who died at our favorite restaurant from anaphylactic shock, and paramedics happened to be eating there was well so they were able to do a tracheotomy and then CPR to get his heart going again. I was not there for that. Just heard about it after.

Oh wait. And then there is one friend who died at our favorite restaurant from anaphylactic shock, and paramedics happened to be eating there was well so they were able to do a tracheotomy and then CPR to get his heart going again.

Unless the paramedics also had a brainwave monitor, there's no way they could say this person had "died".

People's hearts stop all the time without them dying.

Yes, he was down for about 6 min they said.

Could it be that after "death" there is a "holding area" where you have the choice, assuming your physical body can be resuscitated, of whether you want to go back or not? If you are experiencing a different level of consciousness, one that can't be perceived in our physical world, to make that decision, perhaps that's why you come back with the memory of "seeing nothing"?

I'm just shooting arrows in the dark here but I have my suspicions about death as we know it as well.

How somebody gonna wake up dead..? That shit would be redundant...

At what point does a mouse become a rat?

It’s a quote from the intro of scary movie 3

This is a great post was some insightful thinking.

I don’t agree, and i think you are making a number of improperly founded assumptions, but i wanted to give more thanks than an upvote for your contribution.

I’m of the personal opinion that consciousness is the byproduct of a crazy complex biochemical reaction. My bet would be that the localized pool of that byproduct circumscribed by an individual human life dissipates like a wave upon death.

I make no mistake about, and quite respect and admire, the thought you put in to your this post.

I would suggest caution and humility about evaluating one's own work, however. Many very smart people have been thinking very hard about these questions for many years.

Consider your statement that a materialistic model of consciousness requires a static structure in the body. This is an assertion you make, based on unstated assumptions, and not clearly established by any criteria.

There are at least two alternative theories. One is the axe theory. I have an axe I've had for years, I love it. 10 years ago, I was swinging the axe and missed, and handle broke. I went to the hardware store and replaced it. A few years after that, I hit a nail and shattered the head. I went to the hardware store and replaced it. This has happened a few times. But it's still the same axe I love, isn't it? Is the axe a static structure? Does cell turnover (which neurons do as well, btw) necessarily mean the body is not a static structure?

Another alternative is my "dynamic process" model. It's still a materialistic explanation for consciousness, but relies on there not being anything static about the housing of consciousness--it's the constituent changes themselves that give rise to consciousness.

My point is not that you are unintelligent, or even wrong, but that there is much more than what is considered in your post. The truth is probably, at best, orthogonal to the axis between our ideas, but more likely somewhere else entirely.

Hmmm... This makes it seem like consciousness is an invisible parasite leeching off our nervous system...very interesting theory.

A la archons?

This what I come here for. 10/10

There is no way the nihilistic view is correct, yet everyone believes in it.

That is a bold statement. Everyone claims to know the absolute truth, your claim is not at all unique.

Left brained society. We value rational thought over intuition, when in all actuality rational thought ought to be in service of intuition. Intuition sees what is, what will be, and logic backs it up. When did we champion logic for logics sake? We use it to destroy and reduce rather than create.

Honestly, nihilism is a result of high intelligence which lacks the ability to see spirituality. That’s a very sad life to have, knowing that the void is waiting for you at the end of the line. Put simply, you can’t apply logic and reason to an unexplained and mystical phenomenon either. Things happen irrationally when they were predicted to be rational, and we can’t figure out why.

OP’s claim is the other side of the coin, contrary to reductionist teachings.

OP’s claim is the other side of the coin, contrary to reductionist teachings.

Exactly, OP is preaching a false dichotomy. There is such a thing as balance. Nature tends to naturally seek it out.

Fair point. Didn’t think of that possibility.

Nailed it.

I've come to this conclusion as well.

Also we activated high intelligence, because we've strayed too far from our designed harmonious relationship with nature. Ever since we left the tropics, things have slowly been going down the shitter.

We're trying to use intelligence to "fix" ourselves. We're sex-obsessed because we know we're doing more dying than living than we should. So we try to rapidly reproduce.

Right brain knows all. Right brain is the right brain.

I believe the suppression of knowledge of God, death and the afterlife is the biggest conspiracy. The illusion is setup to keep us from finding out the truth. If we definitively knew the truth our behaviors would have change and align with the truth (which kills the materialist /power structure).

This. The biggest conspiracy is keeping people ignorant of the fact that they have a Creator and will be brought to account for their deeds in the Afterlife.

Why is it so easy for people to believe that they can be reincarnated over and over again as different people, but difficult for them to accept that this worldly life is a temporary test of our character before our eternal lives after death?

We were created by God, we will die, we will be raised up alive on the Day of Resurrection, and we will either be rewarded with eternal Paradise or punished with eternal Hellfire. There is no secret; there is nothing to figure out. The truth is plain as day.

You make a ton of good points, and a ton of illogical jumps (like drawing an instant conclusion that a soul must exist)

Things I would take into consideration in regards to death being a "conspiracy":

-Terror Management Theory (or the book: "The Denial of Death" by Earnest Becker) -Time as the 4th dimension (and multiple dimensions past that with string theory and quantum physics) -The Holographic Universe/Simulation Theory

Love this.

I think about reincarnation theory quite a bit and it scares the fuck outta me. The way we treat animals and other humans in this world makes me hope it is not true, I really don't want to even come back tbh.

I also wonder if the elite found out a way to reincarnate back into their own bloodlines, ensuring that they have a good life here no matter what. I doubt it, but it's crazy to think about it.

Yes, love thy neighbour, that's how I live my life as well.

I enjoyed reading this. I too believe that what we really are, the soul or spirit or whatever you want to call it, is eternal. You should cross post this to r/C_S_T.

I'm supposed to be doing some Dee Em Tee next week with a shaman, hopefully I will have a better understanding of this after next Tuesday.

Look up quantum suicide, it gets even better

Or quantum immortality. np.reddit.com/r/explainlikeimfive/comments/1iiucm/eli5can_someone_explain_what_quantum_suicide_and/

My thoughts on this is that God is a metaphor for the energetic collective, otherwise the amalgamation of “souls” or energy rejoining and integrating itself. As the OP said, this energy can come from anywhere.

It’s one thing to exist, and another thing to be conscious of your existence. I don’t like the materialist theory either, though I refer to it as reductionism. A person who leads with rational thought rather than intuition will say that we’re a collection of memory and neurotransmitters, which is horribly reductive.

OP rationalized my thoughts better then I ever could, tbh. The energy enters the body, a new “shell” at the moment of birth, activating it and cementing itself in the physical world. When we die, we rejoin our collective. To me, that’s the one truth that I wish more were aware of. God is not to be taken literally, but metaphorically. We are all God, and God is us, to kill another human means to kill yourselves, and the ultimate lesson in life is integration of the body, mind and soul, to truly experience physical reality and make a mark in it as an individual before returning to the collective.

Nicely put.

The construct of "God" is a distortion of the truth supposedly created to facilitate the illusion of being separate from the creator. It was made by parasitic beings that feed on mind energy released in fear and pain. They know that if we know, they can't control us anymore and steal our spiritual energy, which gives us joy to create, share and receive and gives them joy to cause to release and absorb through trauma, fear and pain. This desire and subsequent behavior gives these beings their reputation. It also gives them a strong incentive to keep us from key pieces of information that inform us of our divine origins.

If benevolent ETs come, they will spill the beans. They already do. Look at how many contactees tell us this truth about oneness. If they were on TV, it would really change how we see God. We wouldn't want to fall to our knees in fear and reverence to the local charlatans anymore, asking how to think and feel about various aspects of our existence. Instead we'd find ourselves in charge of ourselves and increasingly reject outside control attempts using false authority claims. They couldn't pull another Abrahamic religion scam on us. They would lose their merit as forgetting assistance too. That's what supports the tolerance these dark beings receive from benevolent beings.

Think about it. God is said to be outside, all powerful and knowing while we are unworthy, ignorant and need to beg for mercy. To consider God is inside is the epitome of blasphemy. So, it's the last place many would look.

Faith, another form of dogma, belief derived from perceived authority, keeps us from being personally responsible for our intellectual, moral and spiritual self-development.

On what we blame we place the onus of change. These belief systems have us blame God, the adversary of God, demons and angels for bad and good things. We'd be better off always considering our own role in whatever occurs so we could be more able to respond to it, rather than being an extension of someone else's will giving us their thoughts.

So.. you are wrong. At least regarding conciousness and how our body changes.

If you have a circuit board, with a cpu and capacitors and resistors, solder joints, wires and everything else - and its running a program, an OS. If you were to slowly, bit by bit, change every component on the molecular level, chances are that it would infact continue to work throughout the whole process. If 'enough' of it is there to operate, the OS will continue to operate smoothly.

If however, the change is too fast, too great - it is not molecular but instead major failure of components, then the program will cease to continue to function, and the whole unit will probably stop working too.

Imagine on the simplest form, a wire.. going from A to B. If you were to slowly work your way down the wire, replacing the insulation along it(obviously in a safe way without stopping the current) then it would continue to move that energy. If you were to cut it in half, that is simply too much damage for it to continue to send power.

The human brain runs on electricity and is literally full of 'wires'. This analogy is more accurate than probably anything else. And I think you are pretty uneducated to not realize that.

Very good read.

I've had very similar thoughts on the afterlife I've posted, based on personal experience, if you're interested in a read.

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I personally believe we can never die. I think the official version of the theory is quantum immortality.

By quantum physics, whenever there are two possibilities the universe splits into two copies where each scenario plays out. The same goes for death, at any time there will be a distinct probability that you die and a distinct (however small it may be) probability that you do not. Your soul or consciousness, or whatever you want to call it travels through to the universe where you survive while in the universe where you don’t survive an empty copy dies. Your consciousness rides this wave of probability infinitely until you get uploaded into a dyson sphere or something.

But living forever is impossible

Maybe some technical breakthrough in your future will change that

But nobody else has lived forever before

Maybe they have but not through a way we recognise. Maybe there is some sort of afterlife and their consciousness is there. These people might not even be real as far as the universe is concerned, the whole thing could just be built around my (or your) experience with everyone else just acting as scenery.

People act like life is some thing that they'll miss when they don't have it anymore. First mistake. Second one is worrying how it will be when they are dead. Ask yourself: how was it before you were born! That's how it will be wh n you're dead.

It has already been concluded that we click in and out of infinity. When you die, this would no longer be the case. Remember life in your mothers womb, or before that? Well, that's death. Nothing.

We are all fractal souls of the prime creator. Collectively we are one. A singularity of infinitely individual souls. Consciousness is not human or finite. It is universal energy that can never be created nor destroyed.

There is a very weird interpretation of quantum theory that holds that we never actually die because in every situation where we're about to die, our actual consciousness shifts to an alternative universe where we don't die. No one really takes it seriously though.

I would say that the value of physical material (Materialism) is the largest conspiracy and the decomposition of the physical body being associated with "death" is a subset of that conspiracy.

At the atomic level matter is simply concentrated energy, consciences gives shape to energy which in turn give shape to matter. Consciences does not "die".

You should read "Autobiography of a Yogi" if you have not already. You will enjoy it.

You describe Gnostic modes similar to ideas expressed in these works: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/God_Speaks - more approachable out in the open exploration of this idea.

For Esoteric exploration of this idea Jung is one of my favorites... Septem Sermones ad Mortuos (The Seven Sermons to the Dead) by Carl Gustav Jung, 1916 http://gnosis.org/library/7Sermons.htm

Excellent post. Thanks.

You know, the thing about your cells isn't true. It's a myth. For example, the cells in your cerebral cortex, probably the most defining area of what makes you, you, never regenerate.

I think this is all like a thought in a supreme beings mind, God or whatever you want to call it. Thought is the only thing I can compare it to because it's the only way to create something out of nothing. A dream is good example... We've all probably experienced dreams which seemed so real we woke up believing they were real. If we can create an entire simulated reality of a dream just imagine what a being 1,000xs more intelligent could do with a thought or a dream. Anyway that's what I learned on mushrooms and also why I'm not an atheist any longer :P

The conclusion is not supported by the arguments put forth.

Even religious people just pretend that they believe in a God, but deep in their minds they are also nihilist materialists.

This is a highly flawed premise. There are billions of example going against this premise.

There is no way the nihilistic view is correct,

Your argument does not support this. Even if you are right, the nihilistic view is simply what you end up with if you take Occam's Razor in relation to the afterlife.

The physical universe is a Garden. We are the mustard seeds. Funny how non-Christians tend to have Christian viewpoints without realizing it. The Parable of the Mustard Seed Matthew 13:31-32

31 Another parable He put forth to them, saying: “The kingdom of heaven is like a mustard seed, which a man took and sowed in his field, 32 which indeed is the least of all the seeds; but when it is grown it is greater than the herbs and becomes a tree, so that the birds of the air come and nest in its branches.”

I believe your argument posits greatly on your proof that materialism is false. I think some of the arguments you put forth are flawed and would like to offer my own evidence to disprove them.

Many people assume that consciousness arises out from the body. This would need a static mechanism inside the body which creates it. An organ or something that would create consciousness.

The prevailing theory in support of a biological basis of consciousness is that it is an emergent property of the nervous system. As such, there are many 'parts' of the brain that can be removed in a precise manner with nearly-full retention of consciousness. However, it is also true, and much more prevalent, that haphazard destruction of parts of the brain are essentially fatal and cause immediate death. Bullets, blunt forces, cuts, stabs, etc, will all eliminate consciousness from the organism when applied with malice. This is due to a huge disruption in the systematic organization of the brain. In other words, consciousness arises from the exceedingly complex organization of the brain, with many parts interaction with each other all throughout the brain, with compartmentalized functions relating to different aspects of awareness. All the parts working together define consciousness, not a single source organ.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emergence

https://www.quora.com/Is-consciousness-an-emergent-property-of-the-brain-or-a-fundamental-property-of-matter-Isnt-saying-that-consciousness-is-an-emergent-property-of-the-brain-just-as-much-a-non-explanation-as-saying-it-is-a-fundamental-property-of-all-matter?share=1

The cells inside the human body change every 7 years or so, this is a scientific fact. The atoms inside the cells change every year. Literally we are new persons every 7 years, by any physical definition.

This is a widely propagated scientific myth. Nerve cells, due to their highly specific and complex interconnectivity, do not get replaced and do not undergo cellular replication. Their period of growth and generation only persists for a few years after birth. This is why nerve damage and brain damage is so serious and requires a very different physiological approach to heal. These cells do not replace themselves or regenerate without intense medical care. Damaging them is permanent, not like a scrape or a broken bone.

https://www.ninds.nih.gov/Disorders/Patient-Caregiver-Education/Life-and-Death-Neuron

This means that the human brain has about 1014 different states every second, literally the structure of the brain changes this fast. So by this metric everybody “dies” a quadrillion times each second, since the particular configuration of the brain that would make them who they are that moment, changes entirely by the next moment.

This is playing fast and loose with the definition of death, I think. If we define death as permanent loss of brain function and zero vital signs, then no, I don't think everybody dies a quadrillion times a second. Again, on the basis that consciousness is an emergent property of the configuration of brain, it does not stop being "that consciousness" when the synapses change or the concentration of biochemicals changes. You wouldn't say a school of fish, or swarm of bees, or flock birds, stops being that school, swarm, or flock when the animals move within it, would you? I don't have a source for this, but I would argue it's logically flawed.

I think that the emergent model of consciousness greatly supports the materialist view. With this in mind, I think the third point you outline is still valid and true, that death is simply complete ceasing to exist with zero brain activity.

emergent model of consciousness greatly supports the materialist view.

What is this emergent model? Consciousness does not come into being. There are only levels of consciousness based on the material activity of the body, which either dampens or raises the same effect. The effect itself, that is, consciousness itself does not come or go - it is always the same.

Also, you are wrong about nerve cell generation. I have successfully regrown severed nerve cells using Choline, which would not be possible if cell growth were stagnated.

All this aside, I know intrinsically, almost instinctively, that I will never die: I will always be myself in one form or another. Read "Leaves of Grass" to get a sense of what I am talking about here. Think about how frail life is, I mean it is practically worthless as life feeds on life - the worthlessness is implied by this. To deny the incorruptible nature of consciousness, and perhaps reincarnation, is a very bleak outlook that does not jive with my experience.

"...For centuries, life was reduced to what could be proved by a materialistic science. Being alive was considered principally in terms of material survival and prosperity. ....

We focused on making the world more materially abundant, and we though of little else. Even our religions reduced what has been a spiritual experience to a material conception of belief and creed and ideology, really considering our spiritual nature.

..But then science itself began to change, and finally its message has begun to be filtered into the mass consciousness of our society: that human beings have systematically encountered a range of experience that doesn't fit into the materialistic paradigm."

James Redfield, The Tenth Insight, Page 18-19.

I like the way you are thinking and particularly the division between materialists and people that believe in a conscious universe. The first ones discard the more rich explanation that the second observe. Materialism is still useful, in things like engineering and technology, but in no sense complete as an over-arching theory of how the world works and our role in it.

My two points:

• Physics accepts an indivisible unit of matter: the atom (even though this has been redefined subsequently as a different particle, when the first defined atom was split). What if the indivisible unit is consciousness? The capacity to make decisions and drive the universe ahead.
• A godlike consciousness might have more capacities, than decision making on an otherwise materialistic universe. Capacities such as creation, of matter, of energy, of consciousness.

All in all, a very interesting perspective which will gain ground, as science, has been for so long unable to make the next jump. There has not been a scientific breakthrough (only major technological ones, or refinements) in the fundamental way we understand the cosmos since before WW2.

I would go a step further. Stochasticity and probabilities have already been incorporated in classical engineering. They are not interpreted as conscious actions on the system, but rather than noise, or unmeasured effects. The deep 5th element comes from the ability to make the engineered system interact with human beings and other conscious entities. This is the reason, that people with amazing interaction skills (say Steve Jobs) take a heavily engineered system, and guide this way to appeal to the masses and make them love it.

I think the human brain (and by extension, life) in all of its complexity and millions of years of evolution has got to a point where when a baby human is born, the cells wire together in such a way that a conscious experience manifests. You're not conscious from the very first moment you're born, as you are now - think; when do you first remember consciously being aware of yourself, of the world, of being alive? Perhaps in a flash one day, or perhaps you can't remember it... likely because the process takes years of development in the brain, slowly leading to higher and higher levels of consciousness.

And I think that's the answer - that the brain can grow more and more complex, more intelligent, more aware with enough learning and the right environment to learn and expand (we can see its potential in extremely intelligent people or people with specific capabilities for certain things, it's just that in those people it's somewhat rarer or perhaps uncontrolled.) I think that the way we teach our children to think and the general way society is definitely doesn't utilise or make huge headway into exploring realms of higher intelligence and consciousness, of the real capabilities of a human being... you could say that in some way the food we eat and the entertainment we consume also mires us, if you want to get into that kind of conspiracy, but really it's society and its products that bind us, with the strength of the crowd, with the level to which we're taught how to think, be, act, the potential of a life. We are products of our society, all a part of the wider, shared consciousness, each doing it in relatively similar ways, but with our own unique twists or takes on things.

Some go a little further, push the boat out, change things, and those that stick their heads above the crowds are the ones that get noticed. We have immense capability, and the power really does lie with us in the end. Yes, we need help and teaching and guidance, but it's entirely possible to be liberated in yourself.
There's this stupid picture of an "Anarchist" type or protester being carried away by police, (can't find it online after looking, maybe someone else knows it) and the protester is portrayed as being entirely free, content, even though they're being detained, because their system of control can't penetrate that individuals consciousness as it's trained, strong.

Anyway, I've spiralled off topic and into my ideas of consciousness... to bring it back to death, I feel that when we do die the amazingly intricate machine that we've grown and has allowed us to experience consciousness falls apart, and with it that conscious experience. Individual consciousness dies, but the group's consciousness lives on, and within that any influence or teachings that the individual consciousness was able to bring to the party... so we might "live on" in some way, our legacy has reprocussions, but as far as conscious control of this exact body... goodnight.

I'd say it was worth it though... being alive, conscious... compared to its opposite, it's the most delicate, wonderful, impossible gift imaginable, and we all have it, in whatever degree. Plenty to do, here, and we can be as free as we desire, in a way.

reincarnation is real. I believe we guide ourselves through an evolution through each life. Our actions determine how we end up from one life to another. We don't die and rise to heaven or hell. We don't die and cease to exist. I believe that our consciousness is part of a larger one that feeds the cycles and mechanisms of the universe. Our experiences help create our destinies and the universe.

I saw on a physics themed documentary that future information could be leaking into the present, dictating our actions. This is a little going off tangent, but it's all connected.

It would explain why people don't like people they don't even know or why certain things happen at certain times. While some of it is just random chaos, some of it also to guide everyone to something.

If reincarnation were real wouldnt we be able to remember some stuff? Seems kind of pointless to keep coming back over n over again while risking repeating the same mistakes you made in your previous lives. no?

this is an awesome discussion!

well its new so there's that

I don't have to pretend to believe in God when everything points to it, in my opinion. We've been deliberately placed in the perfect place within the cosmos for us to experience this plane of existence. But go smaller and ponder that. Our entire universe blinks in and out of existence at more than 1 trillion cycles per second. Check out Richard Lighthouse and have some fun... https://www.rlighthouse.com/

I don't have to pretend to believe in God when everything points to it, in my opinion. We've been deliberately placed in the perfect place within the cosmos for us to experience this plane of existence. But go smaller and ponder that. Our entire universe blinks in and out of existence at more than 1 trillion cycles per second. Check out Richard Lighthouse and have some fun...

We've long known what happens when you die, OP. Literally the oldest esoteric practices like astral projection, and alchemical teachings can clue you in on what happens.

While it was an entertaining read, you repeatedly making huge logical jumps that makes me feel dismissive of the whole thing. /r/restoftheowl

"I can remember as far back as being 3 years old, and I felt the same way about myself back then as I do now, I feel the same “entity”, even though my body literally changes every nanosecond. So this alone should debunk materialism, there is no way that consciousness is dependent on the body."

This is incredible, if you were truly honest with yourself you would entertain, if not outright admit, that you most likely only resist, intuitively, thinking of yourself as different (the most likely reality) throughout your decades-long life stages so as to not be confronted by what would be the overwhelmingly vertiginous stages of the underlying neurological variety you yourself so very well describe.

As T.E. Lawrence somewhat more metalogically wrote of himself: "In my case, the effort for these years to live in the dress of Arabs, and to imitate their mental foundation, quitted me of my English self, and let me look at the West and its conventions with new eyes: they destroyed it all for me. At the same time I could not sincerely take on the Arab skin: it was an affectation only. Easily was a man made an infidel, but hardly might he be converted to another faith. I had dropped one form and not taken on the other, and had… a resultant feeling of intense loneliness in life, and a contempt, not for other men, but for all they do. Such detachment came at times to a man exhausted by prolonged physical effort and isolation. His body plodded on mechanically, while his reasonable mind left him, and from without looked down critically on him, wondering what that futile lumber did and why. Sometimes these selves would converse in the void; and then madness was very near, as I believe it would be near the man who could see things through the veils at once of two customs, two educations, two environments."

In other words your premise is entirely unfounded, because purely linguistically subjective (not even formally logical, just pseudo-logical poetics), wishful thinking.

Dr. Aubrey de Grey says that aging is a disease that should be treated

We know for sure it happened at least once, since we don’t remember anything before our birth, and people are constantly being born, and so do other lifeforms. So it’s a perpetual event.

Actually believe it or not I do remember my birth and parts probably just prior to birth. When small I used to get flashbacks when going to sleep, these would be feeling very real and I kind of liked them so I focussed on them. The flashbacks were where I was being squashed by walls, the walls were 'evil', dark and very scary, caving in on me. The next moment in the flashback everything is bright white, just whiteness, and the overwhelming feeling that everything is perfect and exactly right and as it should be, pefectly safe. This flashback would continue several times and I would get them often. I didn't know what it was at the time, maybe I was 5-7 years old. Then much later in my teens I suddenly remembered them and quickly realised that this is of course flashback to my birth. It all makes sense.

So anyway, long story short, people can remember their birth or just before it. There are also many studies showing f.ex. if the mother plays classical music to the baby in the womb then this is beneficial.

So personally I believe if the soul enters the body it does so at conception or when the first brain connections are made.

I read a book on Astral Travel once, it was very interesting but I forgot the title (I think it was a green cover).

Anyway there theory in that is like this:

'God' is a big ball of 'energy'.

A tiny part of the energy is used to create a new animal.

The animal, say an ant, lives and gains experience, as it gains experience it's 'energy' level increases.

After it dies it's energy is re-incarnated into another ant.

And so on.

Once it has learned everything there is about being an ant, it's energy level is not increasing anymore. So when it dies, it gets re-incarnated as something a bit more complex. Maybe a bee.

And so it goes.

Eventually its energy is so large it gets re-incarned as the most complex being there is which is a human.

After many incarnations as human, energy can no longer increase.

After death, the human conciousness joins two others to become a triniy and exist on the Astral level, and after more time/incarnations there the trinity will join two other trinities and become a 9th (i.e made up of 9 consciousnesses which have now merged).

Eventually this 9th goes back to the God ball of energy.

So the God ball basically keeps increasing.

The whole purpose of the universe and life is for this energy to keep increasing forever.

Also, when you get re-incarnated on earth you get to choose your parents, because while you are dead you realize this whole scheme, and so you choose parents that will give you a new experience (in order to increase your energy). So you might choose two criminal drugaddicts as parents because this is something new, or you might choose to be son of a billionaire etc etc. You get to try everything once at least. This is what might be called 'judgement day', but it is not 'God' that is judging you, it is simply your own consciousness judging your life and deciding what to try next, it's not about what is 'good' or 'bad' (because no such thing exist, only experience exist).

Thanks for reading. Let me know if you know what book I am talking about.

If only there was an acceptable way to explain the memory loss....i'd support reincarnation all day if it wasnt for the unexplained memory loss..

Perhaps when your soul enters a fresh brain then any prior knowledge is stored in the unconscious part of the brain.

Or perhaps you don't retain any knowledge at all! Memory is not required for re-incarnation, your soul can be separate from your memory. I think this makes the most sense. Your soul 'energy' increases with more knowledge, but the knowledge itself is lost when you die. Maybe knowledge/memory is what is stored in the synaptic connections in the brain, which is obviously lost when you die.

Was it the Shadow Project? I seem to recall something along those lines in one of the books, but it's been years since I've read the series.

Doesn't really ring a bell.. I think it was only a single book that wasn't very thick and it had a green cover.

Changing your perspective regarding linear time may reveal something about what happens after death. (Or even what happened before birth)

Highly recommend Alan Watt's time lecture: https://youtu.be/uvc-sxtH7kQ

In relation to the part about having more people now than ever before, at r/retconned we have determined there are alot of NPCs around us

You should check out David Chalmer's view of consciousness, naturalistic dualism.

Consciousness arises from your brain. When you die it fizzles out as your cells expend their stored energy.

@OP: Most users of this sub have never read a book on philosophy in their lives, so please do not be disappointed when they fail to understand the simple concepts you are trying to convey.

I’m not sure about your comment about users of this sub. I have found many here that are highly educated, and I know when I went to university I had to take philosophy. If we were in the lsd sub I would agree.

Do you believe ancient history is real? That Plato and Strabo were real people?

Been thinking of your question for about two hours this morning. I believe the myth is always greater than the reality, whether it be ancient history or my life. Whether they were real people or not I have no clue. People want to teach, and it sometimes is easier to convince others of your wisdom by claiming it is not yours but some older, wiser person’s.

I know I’m real, not because I think, but because I feel emotions. I drift, I feel, I think, I experience, therefore I am. Lol, what garbage some of this is, but it is so real.

What do you believe? Are you real? If so, what are you?

I suspect that all of what we are told about ancient history is completely make believe.

See pic related.

I have come to this opinion because I base my beliefs on primary sources, and it turns out there are none for 'ancient history'. Literally none.

I tend to agree with your conclusion. For example, some say Plato’s original work has survived for 2400 years but silence has dated the oldest manuscript 1600 years after his death. Maybe the authors channeled Plato and it is his thoughts while the true authors were using psychedelics.

I tend to agree with your conclusion

There are not many people ready for these revelations.

Yet...

This is why the small percentage of thinking people migrate to obscure websites, where the conspiratards and normies don't go.

Read the book Heaven is For Real

two words that blew that materialist crap right outta the water for me.

MANDELA EFFECT

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMRrCYPxD0I

Life and death is just an individual experience, everyone that you have ever known is really just a figment of your imagination, infinitely. You live your entire life and everything seems entirely real however everything that you experience is just part of your brains simulation of reality. Nothing is real! (Interesting theory)

Another separate theory is that when you die, your brain does not actually allow you to die, to everyone else around you you have died and been buried and are gone however in your mind the death never happened and everything from that point in is just a very complex simulation your brain created to counter the concept of death, an example is instead of being fatally wounded in an accident in your (dead) reality you were just seriously wounded and wake up in the hospital and recover and continue to live your new life....

It is hard to say, I’ve never really developed my theory, I think though life just continues with a diverted reality other than death, The event of old age is perplexing

I will applaud your efforts for writing such a long shitpost,

but ultimately everything you say has giant leaps of logic (perhaps added for comedic self-irony purposes?)

Your awareness is beyond temporary states of existence like development. It is wearing clothing appropriate to the place in which it operates but it is beyond all of it. It is the same throughout life, but does gain and lose access to mental abilities as well. Memories, perspectives and personalities are all temporary constructs. This awareness is not bound by them nor defined by them but most of us cant seem to even fixate our awareness on our awareness. We just pick the clothing instead and ask where it I when one dies or gets brain damage. That clothing is not you. You are the awareness.

I'd argue this is the ultimate anti-conspiracy. The truth is so simple we invent conspiracy for ourselves to avoid what we know.

Where are the best resources to read about all this?

Lmao. of course death is real. thats why you fear it and question it now.

The scary part is, what if the illusion of consciousness is just our collective brain process dealing with autonomy of itself. After all we do spend a long time tending to our inner voice, the inner monologue conversing with ourselves essentially the inner and the outer you. The primal emotional, objective well being driven individual coupled with a controlling intelect of knowledge and experiences. You see not everyone is enlightened, not everyone can understand and think about multi faucet mechanics of the simplest things. It costs too much brain power/energy thats why there are a lot of sheep in this world, trained for repetitive tasks of the industrial revolution. How much energy and time is spent teaching and advertising global effects and individuals are still slow to change for that better tomorrow we all want. That collection individual, of the family, of the friend of the community of the global and online identity is us. And the functioning now, that innevoice the collection of the recent and past the needs of now and tomorrow is the you. But that is an unknown, just like Ops theory. But it goes to show, that either way, what we define as alive/conscious will be a wake up call for us, as the animals we consume and breed just to feed us is actually quite gruesome, and if there are alinens I bet that is why they arent open with us, as we still eat each other.

What do you think the people's perspective in r/watchpeopledie are?

Hi op!

I really suggest you to read the books of " Linda Goodman " she talks about astrology, numerology, immortality and some other stuff.

Her ideas, view and informations about immortality is very rare and interesting...

Many people assume that consciousness arises out from the body. This would need a static mechanism inside the body which creates it. An organ or something that would create consciousness.

Not at all. Indeed, most cognitive scientists today believe that consciousness is an emergent property of our brains, nervous system and body in general.

Well everyone believes in the nihilistic materialist view,

The majority (84%) of humans belong to a specific religion and thus claim not to believe in the nihilistic materialist view. Even if some portion of them are lying, it's quite a stretch to say "everyone".

Even religious people just pretend that they believe in a God, but deep in their minds they are also nihilist materialists.

How can you possibly know this? Indeed, why does this even make sense? "God did it" is a really simple explanation for everything. It you aren't a deep thinker, it's very convenient - you can use it on any sort of question at all, and it's impossible to refute. I'm sure the overwhelming majority of people believe "God did it" and then never give it much thought at all.

We are all pieces of the "creator" (whichever name used is irrelevant). In order to know what the creator is, this entity created the universe and fractally split itself into pieces. Each piece is a soul. Each soul's pourpose is to use it's free will to experience the universe. This all feeds back into the global consiousness. When we die, it's like hitting your reset button and after a while you get to try again. It's up to the individual if they wish to develop spiritually or not.

Nothing is "good" or "evil", and everything we create only helps us as a whole through the global consiousness, as it is close to becoming self aware. This is when humanity will finally realize that we are all the same and start working together as a species.

The cerebrospinal fluid is the antenna between your "soul" and your physical body. Keep that in mind.

Kundalini is basically harnessed sexual energy. Masturbating will prevent you from ever feeling or experiencing this.

Fasting promotes DNA repair. Look into intermittent fasting and/or one meal a day if you want to feel better than you have ever thought possible.

Adopt a whole foods plant based diet. Everything is just energy in a universal field. Meat and processed foods are like spiritual anchors.

Yes.

There exists a force that is eternal.

Some form of reincarnation is truth. There is no such thing as the end of "life" in the grandest definition of the word.

its true. I jumped off a cliff like 20 times and I just respawned at a bonfire.

You should xpost this to r/philosophy

Jesus Christ is the only way. Just trust in him, repent of your sins and believe the bible. God is always in control

Thanks Skully

reductive vs deductive reasoning. Big issue on this board.

Dude what don't you understand? Nobody is saying we've completed math. There is still so much math left to unravel and I would wager everyone here agrees with that statement. All he is saying is that math is not affected by opinions, methodology, etc. Correct math is perfect and proveable and exists whether or not humans exist.

Signal is the lie scientists tell kids to make things easier to understand. Brain signals are electrons that bounced off an electrolyte while it moves via the neuron doing its work. They can't be you because what is detected is the electrons being lost by the body. And where they come from can't be you, because CuSO4 isn't you. NaCl isn't you. Last I put salt on my chicken, I wasn't exterminating consciousness.

You are an emergent intelligence. The creative space a hundred billion neurons working together creates. We've even found parts of the brain are designed to make this illusion work. There's nothing mythical here. You are your brain. The totality of it, no the individual parts.

Which, of course, would be a first.

Energy isn't channeled, it's gated like a computer gate works, though not exactly binary. Your brain converts food into work and that work generates the decisions that make you up.

I don't care to remember human existence necessarily. But I say that without knowing if it would provide any benefit.

Do you believe ancient history is real? That Plato and Strabo were real people?

Think Newton's 1st Law of Thermodynamics: energy (matter) cannot be created nor destroyed

Exactly. I had a conversation with my neighbours a while back about this, the eldest son has also educated himself on thermodynamics (briefly) and came to realise the same truth, we are forever and energy has and always will exist.

I understand what you are saying. You are not grasping the materialist world view.

Yes, he was down for about 6 min they said.

The one bit of truth that breaks apart this somewhat lonely interpretation of Descarte, is that we can have the faith to Trust our kin when they tell us that they think too.

Perhaps when your soul enters a fresh brain then any prior knowledge is stored in the unconscious part of the brain.

Or perhaps you don't retain any knowledge at all! Memory is not required for re-incarnation, your soul can be separate from your memory. I think this makes the most sense. Your soul 'energy' increases with more knowledge, but the knowledge itself is lost when you die. Maybe knowledge/memory is what is stored in the synaptic connections in the brain, which is obviously lost when you die.