Sounds like a pretty pragmatic way of going about things.

"They tend to be on the far right" Explain what exactly does far right mean to you?

That's really not far right at all. If that counts as far right then gay marriage counts as far left.

LMAO BYE Generation Z has been flooded with talks of sexuality in their childhood because of the gay agenda. I'm not against abortion and gay marriage for any religious reason. Its simply just not good ideas. We need to improve adoption and foster care systems so no baby needs to be murdered to protect the mother's well being. We need to stop with all the talk of sexuality in children so kids stop having sex. I'm interested in how things will affect our country in 10 years, not immediately. I'm interested in the well-being of children. Abortion and the lgbtqiiaappxyz agenda damage society, culture, and the futures of our children.

Muh Christianity!

My argument comes from a place of first hand experience, not religion. Muh narrative!!!!

Were you turned gay or something?

My generation was promiscuous and unhappy. Abortion showed us children can be discarded and the world is hopeless. Lgbtqqiiaappxyz agenda made kids start thinking about sex way younger. Who they would like to have sex with, their sexuality, etc. We struggled with self harm, premature sexual activity, depression, anxiety. Abortion and the Lgbtqqiiaappxyz movement played a major role in creating the most miserable, mentally ill, confused generation yet.

Says who lol. How old are you?

Says everyone in my generation. Says many intelligent adults. I'm 18.

Interesting. I haven’t noticed the same thing. I’ve heard a lot about it, but never witnessed it firsthand. For example, I’ve never actually seen a “safe space” either.

Did you have any trans kids at your high school? Or a large gay community?

Also, have you considered that people aren’t really changing and rather they are only now feeling comfortable to come out, where before they would have kept these things to themselves? Kinda like the sexual harassment situation.

My best friend in middle school came out to me. I was bisexual for a long time. My sister is the biggest dyke you could ever meet. I had less straight friends than gay ones. Not too many trannies though, but loads of "non binaries". I dont think theres an epidemic of gay kids. There IS an epidemic of kids engaging in sexuality at younger and younger ages. There IS an epidemic of kids growing up much too fast. Middle schoolers act like high schoolers. Highschoolers act like college kids. So we have kids from 10-14 experimenting with sex or straight up engaging in it. You have 15-18 year olds sleeping around like nobody's business. Children should not be behaving this way and it is not natural or healthy.

Abortion is muder, gay marriage has lead to the sexualization of children and the normalization of pedophilia. These things are awful for the children.

Abortion is sane policy. Banning it outright is tantamount to joining the Taliban. You want to force additional generations of unwed mothers, lifetime welfare state recipients in the form of down syndrome and retarded children and incest babies - not to mention plain old unwanted children, who comprise most sociopaths, psychopaths and criminality in society. How can any sane person look at the effect of abortion bans and say "Yeah, I want my society to look like that, because Jesus."

The sexualization of children was well under way before the gays started wanting to get put two grooms on a fucking cake and pedophiles run every government on Earth and have for recorded history.

Look around at the actual children of immigrants and their history in the US. Irish, Italian, Eastern European, Syrian, Sikh, Chinese, Japanese, Indian. All these communities are integrated, own houses, work jobs, value education, have a major stake in society. And all these communities were once demonized by American society in the way modern migrants are now. If you think this is not true it's because you dwell in a basement and never meet any of these people in day-to-day life. your baseline ignorance is appalling, and belongs on /pol, not reddit.

My best friend is a fag but oOKAY

The “put up or shut up” campaign is more effective.

Seriously. I'm just some left-leaning idiot and I'm hoping the Republicans release it. Either it's actually something damning and we'll get corrupt shits out, or it's actually nothing and I'll get a chuckle. Unfortunately more likely is them yelling for it to be released despite them having all of the power, and blaming democrats if it isn't released. Exact same thing happening with the imminent government shutdown.

What interests me is all the people who don't want it to be released. I voted for trump last election as a disclosure. I want it released so we can see if it is real or fake. Get over with this shit. But seriously I can't understand people who don't want to see it. I am too curious now and my curiosity must be satiated.

They’re all actors. Jeff Flake called Trump Stalin days after voting to keep 702.

The GOP cried outrage at everything Obama did. The DNC does the same for Trump.

They’re all fucking LARPing their way through governing our country.

Very well put.

How many times have we heard politicians on both side state how “shocked!” or “outraged!” they are at minor trivialities?

The GOP runs the House IC committee. They have the votes to release the memo.

#putuporshutup

The GOP Congressmen who are shouting about this are some of the biggest untrustworthy assholes around. Steve King? I mean...c'mon, people!

Ha! Thank you. Been a fast few years.

There's probably no bigger cunt in Congress than Steve King.

It's competitive.

I don't know. Have you seen Louie Gohmert? Actually I don't really think he is a cunt just dumb. So I guess you might be right.

I just look it as a trip to Disneyland. Sometimes you wait in line for hours and the ride sucks. Actually, most of Disneyland sucks. But every now and again, you have some fun. Most of the time the real memories are made between the rides though.

The sub DOES do better. I think you are getting lost in the chaff and disinfo. Just because there is a flat earth post doesn't mean we all buy flat earth. Just because I go into a Q thread and read and participate like it is real, doesn't mean I think it is real at all. It just means I enjoy suspending disbelief and participating in the discussion. I don't know why people get so bent about subjects they don't find interesting or believe at all. You may think chemtrails are totally real and killing everyone, but I don't. I am not even particularly interested. So, I just don't get involved in those threads. It ain't hard. I don't feel this compulsion to challenge the beliefs of everyone around me all the time. I don't need to convince anyone of anything, it is not my job nor my place.

lol.

"Not your job" yep exactly. I'm the same. Now ask yourself why do some people impose themselves? It actaully is their job.

Yep.

Preach, the moment it comes out and shows what they claim, I'll be the loudest proponent of those involved facing consequences, but until then King and Meadows can fuck right off.

Can't disagree with concerns that the memo is tainted by a narrative..

That being said..release the memo...then..hopefully, the Dems push to release the whole thing...that way...we get to see "all of the information".

We can't make a truly informed decision or ascertain the truth with only part of the picture.

In politics context can become everything/anything regarding information. Out of context falsities have often become the gospel truth in this manner. It's not what this sub is about.

If only the memo is released...then naysayers will have ample reason to question the context and the narrative.

I'm not saying the memo alone won't provide insight and new information...but I am saying no one will be able to point to the memo alone as an unarguable source of truth.

I'm not saying the memo alone won't provide insight and new information...but I am saying no one will be able to point to the memo alone as an unarguable source of truth.

Logically I agree with this. Realistically if just the memo is released there will be people using it as an unarguable source of truth. There are already politicians who have not read the info the memo is based on who are using it for spin right now.

when the memo comes out we will have the word of one politician who had proven himself to be a Trump cockholster. The memo is bullshit without context of the whole report.

That's the right approach for someone who hasn't deep dived on this story yet, for sure.

As far as I'm concerned, however, most of what is in the memo has already been alluded to by Nunes and others. There's a lot out there to suggest to me that the Obama Administration was, at the very highest levels, conducting an espionage campaign against their political rival in a Presidential election.

Say what you want about Nunes and co., but the fact that any Congressman, much less the head of the Intelligence committee, seems to be making such a huge deal about this memo says a lot in my opinion: either Nunes is a hopeless, cynical partisan making a last-ditch effort to keep Mueller at bay by abusing his position or we are witnessing the unfolding of one of the largest political scandals in American history. Or both, frankly.

There's a lot out there to suggest to me that the Obama Administration was, at the very highest levels, conducting an espionage campaign against their political rival in a Presidential election.

Do you believe this and then not believe that the Trump campaign/GOP was colluding with Russia?

I can entertain Obama admin were illegally spying (although I doubt it's illegal with the FISA reauthorization) but not if it's an attempt to derail the Mueller investigation. Two separate investigations? Sure have at it.

Do you believe this and then not believe that the Trump campaign/GOP were colluding with Russia?

I think it's possible that Trump has had legally and morally scrupulous dealings in the past with Russian oligarchs in his real estate business, but so far I've seen no compelling evidence that would even tend to suggest that Trump knowingly colluded with a foreign power to subvert the electoral process. I am not saying it didn't happen - I certainly think it's possible - but in my opinion the fact pattern surrounding the Russian collusion story, from the FISA warrants to the Mueller investigation, is more consistent with a coup attempt to depose a sitting President of the United States.

Trust me, it's hard to actually write that out. But that's what it looks like to me.

There seems to be a very clear pattern surrounding this case of FBI agents/DOJ being thoroughly compromised by elements within the DNC/Clinton campaign. For example, Andrew McCabe's wife received $500,000 or more in campaign donations for a relatively unimportant state level election from a close Clinton confidant. Another example is Peter Strzok, who referred to an "insurance policy" in the event that Trump won the Presidency. He also spoke of a meeting with "Andy" (referring to Andrew McCabe) where they supposedly discussed this insurance policy. What the fuck was he talking about? A third example is Bruce Ohr, whose wife worked for Fusion GPS around the time they would have been working on the Dossier. Add to all of the above clear partisanship at the very highest echelons of the DoJ such as Lynch's tarmac meeting with Bill Clinton (what the fuck was that about?) and - at least to me - it becomes rather obvious that the entire Justice Department and FBI were compromised at the very highest levels. That Mueller then hired on Strzok to help work on the probe does absolutely nothing to assuage my concerns. I think when you really start to delve into the details the Russia collusion story falls apart.

Sorry for the TL:DR

There's a lot out there to suggest to me that the Obama Administration was, at the very highest levels, conducting an espionage campaign against their political rival in a Presidential election.

What suggests that? I've seen no evidence to suggest any of that - no evidence that Trump was monitored, no evidence that Obama had anything to do with surveillance, and no evidence that any secretly obtained information was used against Trump in the election.

You haven't been paying attention.

Great, thanks for all that info.

I've been paying keen attention, which is why I'm aware that these are empty and baseless smears in order to obstruct justice.

https://www.theepochtimes.com/assets/uploads/2018/01/18/Fusion-GPS-Map_The-Epoch-Times.jpg

You people can never explain your conspiracy theories - it's just memes and charts with arrows, or nonsensical buzz words. If you have something intelligent to say, feel free to say it.

What exactly do you need spoonfed to you?

US investigators wiretapped former Trump campaign chairman Paul Manafort under secret court orders before and after the election, sources tell CNN, an extraordinary step involving a high-ranking campaign official now at the center of the Russia meddling probe.

The government snooping continued into early this year, including a period when Manafort was known to talk to President Donald Trump.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/09/18/politics/paul-manafort-government-wiretapped-fisa-russians/index.html

Details about persons associated with the incoming administration, details with little apparent foreign intelligence value were widely disseminated in intelligence community reporting. Third, I have confirmed that additional names of Trump transition team members were unmasked. And forth and finally, I want to be clear, none of this surveillance was related to Russia, or the investigation of Russian activities, or of the Trump team. The House Intelligence Committee will thoroughly investigate the surveillance, and its subsequent dissemination, to determine, a few things here that I want to read off:

Nunes: Uh, we don’t know that yet, that’s why we need to get the information. I will say this, the NSA has been very, very helpful. They know how important these programs are, they are in constant communication with our team, and as you know they partially complied with our request last week, and I expect them to hopefully get more information by Friday. And I have spoke to Admiral Rogers about these concerns, and he wants to comply as quickly as he can.

Reporter: And was the president also part of that incidental collection?

Nunes: Yes … yes.

http://www.ajc.com/news/national/read-transcripts-rep-devin-nunes-news-conferences-about-trump-surveillance/NdZ4qQv7uBnjcH9E3HSRPJ/

Susan E. Rice reportedly sought to unmask the identities of Americans connected with President Trump's campaign and transition who were mentioned in foreign surveillance intelligence reports. And with that news, which was first reported Sunday by conservative social-media agitator Mike Cernovich and confirmed Monday by Bloomberg's Eli Lake, Washington spawned a huge game of Choose Your Own Adventure.

All this is highly unusual — and troubling. Unmasking does occur, but it is typically done by intelligence or law-enforcement officials engaged in anti-terror or espionage investigations. Ms. Rice would have had no obvious need to unmask Trump campaign officials other than political curiosity.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2017/04/04/susan-rice-isnt-a-smoking-gun-but-she-does-have-some-explaining-to-do/?utm_term=.a593b5596318

So your evidence for wrongdoing is that Nunes claims that there was some kind of excessive surveillance of the Trump transition. Firstly, let me point out that your original claim was about espionage in a presidential election. The transition is obviously after the election. So you've still presented no evidence at all for your original claim.

But let's move the goalposts for you and pretend this is about the transition. The basis of the complaint is some documents that the White House fed to Nunes, way back in March of 2017. And what happened after that?

After a review of the same intelligence reports brought to light by House Intelligence Chairman Devin Nunes, both Republican and Democratic lawmakers and aides have so far found no evidence that Obama administration officials did anything unusual or illegal, multiple sources in both parties tell CNN.

One congressional intelligence source described the requests made by Rice as "normal and appropriate" for officials who serve in that role to the president.

And another source said there's "absolutely" no smoking gun in the reports, urging the White House to declassify them to make clear there was nothing alarming in the documents.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/04/11/politics/intelligence-contradicts-nunes-unmasking-claims/index.html

So... nothing. Nothing happened after that. No criminal wrongdoing was found, and no evidence to even believe that anyone may have done anything wrong has arisen. The end.

President Obama spied on Donald Trump during an election.

But they literally didn't. It's insane that we went through all this info just for you to bury your head in the sand and keep reasserting lies.

Reporter: And was the president also part of that incidental collection?

Nunes: Yes … yes.

You're quoting things he said last March, when he failed to provide any evidence for his statements while everyone else disagreed with his assessment. So what's your point?

Yeah, I'll agree with you that there isn't definitive proof of this yet. Just what the House Intelligence Committee chairman says. That's why we need to #releasethememo.

Why do you keep calling the transition the campaign? Those are two different things, as I've already said. Let's start with that.

Sure, just like the redacted 911 pages. Yak all about it, don't release it.

I also feel like everything is “worse than watergate” now. Like watergate is the bar and depending on who’s presenting the info it’s either way worse or it’s nothing compared to it.

trafficgate

Omg canadian here ... No idea what this memo stuff is about..... Anyone wanna fill me in with an elevator pitch version?

Devin Nunes wrote the memo based on reports about FISA warrants and such. Basically the Republicans are saying that according to the memo the previous administration abused the FISA system to spy on Trump, or at least that is the theory of what is in it as no one has really seen it yet besides congress. The Democrats who don't want it released are saying Nunes cherry picked info and left out context to make it seem that way.

I personally feel that Nunes is, to put it bluntly, firmly in Trump's corner. I don't think just the memo should be released. I think the reports it is based on should be released with it so we can see who is doing the spin here. The other problem I personally have with this is that the Republicans who are calling it worse than Watergate and such don't have access to the reports it is based on, so all they are going off of are what Nunes put into the memo.

Why does your country always take sides on this stuff? ....Republicans vs Democrats... Yawn.......As if one is better than the other ..... Just a mind trick to divide people .... All the same arseholes playing a dualism game

Yes, but it is just how our system is set up. It is compounded by our politicians feeding the flames of the turmoil it can cause so they get votes for themselves. Additionally a lot of our voters are single issue voters, like abortion for instance. Republicans run as anti-abortion, even though everything they do raises abortion rates but I digress, so regardless of what other issues harm a Republican voter because of Republican policies they will still vote for them because of the abortion policy Repubs run on. Dems have the same things too. We are a hot mess.

But thanks for the reply, at least I know it's not interesting or important to me now

I get the impression the memo is very editorialized by the Republicans running the committee. The Democrats aren't going to vote to release it because they would basically be endorsing the memo. This is very different from releasing the transcript of a testimony.

I'm expecting the Republicans will unilaterally release it eventually, but they're doing some marketing currently. They're establishing it as a damning memo that Democrats don't want you to see.

The memo itself will be pretty pointless because it'll be a partisan interpretation of evidence that we can't see. Trump defenders will play it up and then freak out that others aren't giving it enough attention. The memo itself will have about the same value as an editorial.

I only have a vague idea of what this memo business is about and am wondering why it's dominating the whole front page of conspiracy. My gut says it's another big nothing burger, just grandstanding. The cynical part of me says nothing will come of it, haven't we seen this so many times before? You want change, change yourself first. Stop waiting for stupid fucking memos from your puppet masters... /grumpy

If the people calling for the release of this memo actually believed that there was criminal wrongdoing they would be calling for the release of the actual FISA application, not a memo based on a report on the application. It is a distraction being pushed by bots and partisans.

I wouldn't say it's hype for some simple reasons. This memo names names. Why would career pols write a memo with such serious allegations that literally name people if they aren't 100 percent positive. That opens them up personally to huge lawsuits and the end of their careers. Thats one thing.

Another thing is this memo is written from docs DOJ and FBI have been dragging their feet in since August. Nunes got so pissed with them, he threatened to hold them in contempt if they didn't hand them over. Wray and Rosenstein were so paniced when they deadline came close that they went to Paul Ryan's office to beg to still not to hand them over. But Ryan wae backing Nunes amd would up hold contempt of congress charges. That is where the memo comes from. Why the hell do people work that hard to conceal something? Also the repubs habe no problem releasing the docs they wrote the memo from. They want the memo amd the evidence out there.

Third, stupid Evelyn Farkas all but confirmed on national TV that Obama was spying on the trump campaign and trying to get to the info to the hill. She is soooooo stupid.

Fourth, the FBI director and Rosenstein never flat out say to congress that dossier was never used to gey FISA warrants. Why not just say No. That would literally end it, but they can't bc they did.

"Don't Putin a President"

Why are we twisting the meaning of an independent counsel?

Robert Mueller, a registered Republican, has the reputation of having unwavering morality and being experienced, fair, responsible, tight-lipped, and dutiful. There won’t be trumped up charges or fabricated evidence if there is nothing there. The innocent will go free. Let the investigation run its course without any hullabaloo or character assassinations. Anyone that believes external forces have backed off bots or intelligence gathering against America’s democracy, doesn’t live in truth.

Before anyone jumps on the bandwagon that the FBI or the DOJ have gone rouge for political reasons, here are facts to better help you form opinions:

The Intelligence Committee chaired by Devin Nunes has lost focus on the concern of Russian intelligence and bots interfering with our past election or the cybersecurity interference from foreign adversaries. No legislation has been introduced to protect the independence of our voting process from foreign influence. Historically, America’s priority has been our concern with external attacks, both physical and intangible. Devin Nunes, who served on Trump’s transition team, recused himself from the Russian investigation because of his furtive mishandling of classified information between the White House, yet continued to sign the committee’s subpoenas as chairman. Read More: http://www.slantedonline.com/putin-a-president/

trafficgate

Yes, but it is just how our system is set up. It is compounded by our politicians feeding the flames of the turmoil it can cause so they get votes for themselves. Additionally a lot of our voters are single issue voters, like abortion for instance. Republicans run as anti-abortion, even though everything they do raises abortion rates but I digress, so regardless of what other issues harm a Republican voter because of Republican policies they will still vote for them because of the abortion policy Repubs run on. Dems have the same things too. We are a hot mess.