I agree. People can’t determine what’s real or fake anymore. And that is disturbing to say the least.

And I think that's just what TPTB want.

Well, we know the Democrats were falling for Russian narratives and attending fake Russian protests to sow discord, so who knows... maybe they still are.

And Trump was on national tv talking about foreign policy back in the 80s. The whole thing is orchestrated, and we are all just being herded like sheep, baby

With confusion they maintain control

People are forgetting we can be confusing RIGHT back at them, like what often happens with 4chan. Especially the 2016 PepeKek stuff.

An entire political party is even saying inanimate objects were behind it. Total nutjobbery.

What on earth are you talking about? That's nonsense.

One party is actively trying to find solutions to this.

The other thinks repeatedly sending "thoughts and prayers" will magically fix it. That is "nutjobbery."

You're fucking retarded. Nobody thinks a gun did it by itself you clown. That's what exactly zero people mean when they say that.

Ok fine. TPTB is using yet another crazy to try and disarm us. They also have a literal army of foaming at the mouth idiots who believe in heat seeking baby killing bullets and “reasonable regulation for guns” where certain paint colors are illegal for their lethality.

Downvote all you want, you’ll never convince me that legit “conspiracy” sub users will argue for disarming the population.

These idiots are numerous, they vote by the hearse, and they make their opinion known the only legal one on Facebook, you tube, twitter, and Wikipedia.

I bet you were one of those people who screeched that Obama was coming to take away your guns for eight years, aren’t you?

Spoiler alert, nobody is going to take away your precious bang bang toys, that’s just been a Republican talking point for decades.

You can be pro-gun without walking around assuming the other half of the argument is retarded.

Hypernormalisation.

Watch it, it's a great documentary.

Link?

Here you go

Fantastic documentary, highly recommended.

Sweet! Thx!!

Thanks for this so good !

This. Cognitive dissonance run amok.

Putin’s strategy described there perfectly matches what we’re learning his troll farms are doing to social media. Sew chaos, play both sides, and make everyone question what’s real or fake.

They are in this very sub

You mean the CIA's strategy? Our disinformation campaign will be complete when the public cannot something something discern fact from fiction something something...

Them as well. But Hypernormalisation talks specifically about Putin's strategy and his rise to power using that strategy to maintain power. And it's interesting that we can see him almost openly doing it in the US. The difference with Putin that is covered in Hypernormalisation is that Putin doesn't hide it. Which makes people question everything even more.

Too many holes in the story.

Kids are on the news saying they were told there were going to be drills with police firing blanks and actors pretending to be shot and taken away.

THIS SHIT WAS CLEARLY STAGED.

I don’t follow your logic. Isn’t it just as possible that the shooter knew of the drill and planned to attack on that day? I recall there always being advanced notice of drills when I was in high school.

Not likely, would you plan a shooting for when police are on scene? I wouldn't always the chance there will be live fire as well as blanks.

The normalization of this "shooting" drill blows my mind. When I was in school, we had fire drills and basketball drills, but WTF is a shooting drill? Isn't practicing a massacre a little bit traumatizing for a little kid to go through? Just the fact that these drills exist are beyond bizarre 1984 shit.

Right? Remember the outrage about metal detectors?

They are molding our youth for their future. They won't have to take our rights away. They'll brainwash our youth into giving them up for us.

Given a choice I would not allow my kid to go through a "shooting drill". I've never heard of such a thing. Seriously, I'm 36 years old, I've heard of a lot of school shootings over the years unfortunately, but never a drill for one. How in the fuck does that become something that is good for those kids. subjected to fear and paranoia and violence. Just to clarify also, no matter if this is the biggest batshit conspiracy since bigfoot fkd the mothman, at the end of the day our superiors, the police, the government, the school system think it is a good thing to expose young developing minds to the fear of a school shooting via a shooting drill.. I'm just sayin i'ts an exercise in futility, are you trying to make people behave more efficiently in a mass shooting environment?? seriously.. even if you were trying to get data, or evacuation times, or emergency response times, these things can be obtained in other ways than exposing kids to some looming threat of possible violence.. I just dont fkng understand I guess.. and the fact that the drill was supposedly going to occur the day of the shooting? but the shooting occurred instead? Can someone please interject

There are tens of thousands of schools, some of them, do in fact have live shooting drills so that everyone (staff and students) will at least have some experience on what to do in case a real live event occurred. Just like in the 60s they had Nuclear Bomb drills. Although those drills would have resulted in everyone being killed instantly because hiding under your desk during a nuclear attack is probably the stupidest idea I've ever heard. :-)

yea next to hiding under your desk from a murdering psychopath with a semiautomatic AR

Isn’t it just as possible that the shooter knew of the drill and planned to attack on that day?

Oh, look, again: a claim supporting some moronic, badly done faked event, and the claim is backed up, yet again, by ... wait for it ... absolutely no evidence. In this case, not even some faked claim by an "anonymous source"

People can’t determine what’s real or fake anymore.

The majority of people still believe in the moon landings.

This isn't a new thing.

you say that as if the moon landings didnt happen...

They didn't

More clear opinions on the subject

Then explain these reports, lunar experiments, and voice transcripts from the Apollo program

I’m with you also

And my bow.

You can count on my steel!

https://archive.is/dyLFC#selection-23271.0-23271.17

I think stuff like this just happens, and then the media and/or government swoop in to spin it how they see fit.

Don't forget about opportunists of capitalism.

I mainly see socialists trying to use this for politics to infringe on people's rights.

I think it's the other way around. I think the NRA and the arms manufacturing lobby has bought out republican politicians and use them to obstruct any meaningful reform on gun laws.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for the second amendment and the right to defend yourself from tyranny, but the US needs a much better process for gun ownership.

Canada also has a very high rate of gun ownership per capita, and I know a lot of people with guns, but they all had to take a course beforehand, fill out a good deal of paperwork, and then buy a gun afterwards. You can also get automatic weapons here, but you have to take more courses and do more paperwork. I've heard the mental screening for automatic weapons is very rigorous, as it should be.

Canada has a similar rate of mental illness, we have a lot of guns, but our mass shooting rate is way lower than the US because we have stricter gun ownership laws. The only reason why your country doesn't have a more reasonable stance on gun ownership is because the gun lobby doesn't want any regulation interfering with their bottom line, even if it means psychos get easy access to automatic weapons.

The problem is the USA oligarchy does not want to make any type of commitment to helping out mentally ill people. Mentally ill people are their false flag ammo, their hobo sent in to stab a target in an alley, their discardable humans to use as they see fit. Not only that, but people are losing their second amendment rights for smoking pot legally! So having some kind of clause about mental health to be interpreted by a government that wants to disarm us is a scary fucking thing because it can and will be abused.

Mental health is a very, very very fine line to walk on because it is.... wait for it.... SUBJECTIVE.... and based on opinions of people who believe they know more about you than yourself because they read some books on how people behave. Once it gets rolling it becomes a nightmare of censorship, throwing people into hospitals and violating their rights as a human being to being able to say what goes in and out of their body. Shit like the baker act and involuntary hospitalization is criminal in my eyes and only necessary when there is a literal danger to society.

I think it's a bit more than that though. Any ground lost is ground ceded. Forever. And while I'm sure there is quite a bit of money at play here, I think this is also a consideration of the NRA. I don't know the details very well of how this kid in Florida was able to get the guns, so maybe better gun laws will help. But I'm pretty sure in the Vegas incident those guns were purchased legally and even tougher background checks wouldn't have made a difference. The mental health angle is something we should be looking at. If the mother of the sick fuck who shot up Sandy Hook would have had to at the very least had her shit locked up, that nightmare may have been avoided. I'm not saying that we shouldn't have better gun laws. Not at all. I just don't believe that there is an easy fix for this type of shit. I truly believe we should be looking at the many variables that played a role in this and other mass shootings here. Because again, it can't be just one thing that went wrong. Life's entirely too complicated and shit like this even more so.

I think the NRA and the arms manufacturing lobby has bought out republican politicians and use them to obstruct any meaningful reform on gun laws.

The NRA actively lobbies FOR gun control

Yeah.. no.

That's the distraction. That's a polarizing issue which takes people's attention from the truth staring us in the face that a child was just assassinated along with 16 of his classmates to provide FUD.

Honest question, which child do you think was assassinated?

Yes! There was a politician in Britain who got fired for saying 9/11 was a good day to bury bad news.

Gary Condit sure benefitted from it

I may not be up to date on the news, but the only people I've seen spinning this into something non-obvious is on "conspiricy" websites. I honestly think this is a case of "we see what we want to see".

I don't think so man. People aren't that crazy for the most part.

These manufactured events that reek and smell of being manufactured are exactly that - manufactured.

That is why conspiracy exists; the people who can't deal with such randomness in the world seek to logic out reasons things happen, with the hope that they alone can prevent it from happening again in the future (or so they can say "told ya so").

I think mass shootings are a symptom. More or less guns won't change anything, more or less drugs won't help. These young men have been twisted up by a system that doesn't care about and devalues them at every opportunity.

its just too much coincidence. Drills on the day of the shooting? telling the students to expect blanks being shot and carrying students out on stretchers?

There are conflicting accounts of what you just stated as fact. The only agreed upon point is that there was 1 fire drill, all the rest is very debatable at this point.

I don’t understand what conflicts the accounts of the drills. I’ve see two videos where the students admit there was suppose to be a drill.

Two videos compared to many more which didn’t claim the same thing. There are multiple narratives out there, I don’t understand how you aren’t already aware of that.

Do those vids contradict the videos talking about drills?

Some of them. I would consider it contradictory when the videos omit mentioning something as significant as there being an active shooter drill when they go in depth talking about the fire drill and fire alarm.

Okay so no. Thanks for answering my question.

Did the interviewees report there wasn’t any mention of safety drills that day?

No, most are reporting there was one fire drill in the morning and that was it. They also mention how some children were confused and believed when the shooting started that it might have been a second drill because the fire alarm was going off.

The fire alarm was pulled twice.
If they report one their statements are questionable.

No, one drill. Not one alarm. You realize those are two different things right?

I'll be honest, if I'm gonna shoot a school up, I'd do it on a fire drill day.

Did the shooter know that? He didn’t even go to the school because he was expelled.

Probably all over social media.

? you post about fire drills/shooting drills on social media? Specifically 'all over' social media.

Social media could mean the Facebook/Twitter page for the school. He could still be following them and they could post info like this. Schools also post public calendars so parents are in the loop.

My son's school has their drills on their public google calendar. It is not that far fetched to know of a drill even if you don't go to the school.

Not like someone could've told the kid this was happening.

Or, better yet, not like he couldn't spread the rumor himself if he had friends there. It's a highschool. Word gets out.

OK I'm getting tired of the drill thing the one earlier was a fire drill what is believed that happened is that the shooter pulled a fire alarm to lure out students yes the blanks drill could have happened but it would be a waste of time having 2 drills in one day. For those who don't trust the mainstream news one of my favorite apolitical personality uploaded this inter view https://youtu.be/oXY1HSKzydU

It's just a coincidence that kids thought they were having an "active shooter drill" and had been told to prepare for one.

Given that active shooter drills are as normal a party of children's lives today as were fire drills when I was a kid, this is hardly surprising.

It's not that weird if the shooter knew about the drill. Would add to the mayhem.

70% agree. 30% we should still explore all avenues to make sure that is indeed the case. There are some oddies here, but at the end of the day without a break in the case or new info it could be tough to prove otherwise.

Never underestimate the stupidity of the general population. I'm sure there are many who share your views.

You see a lot of the same names around here and a lot of the same posters. I swear after every mass shooting, I see a flood of posters I don't recognize coming to push the idea that the shooting was a false flag. Happens every single time. It's possible that certain people only care about that particular issue and will come post about it when it happens. But it seems odd to me. Cause they disappear right after the issue goes away.

It always disturbs me when I get post replies from accounts that are literally hours or less old. I got one today in reply to a posting about a local police shooting, even though my post was pretty neutral.

Maybe its a group of people who instinctively see any shooting as a danger to their right to own a weapon, and so go about finding the best story that fits their narrative which justifies their ownership of a firearm, or at least paints the event as designed to help take away that ownership.

I swear after every mass shooting, I see a flood of posters I don't recognize coming to push the idea that the shooting was a false flag.

Funny, for me it's the opposite.

This is rich.

User claiming the “shooting is authentic” is accusing brigadiers of pushing a false flag/hoax narrative!

Are we taking crazy pills now? Is this sub not called r/conspiracy ?

We’re literally living in 1984.

Guess who makes millions of dollars every time there is a mass shooting? The NRA and gun manufacturers. So having a bunch of people running around the internet pushing the idea that the government creates false flags to take your guns away only puts money in their pockets. Maybe that's the actual fuckin conspiracy.

You people are losing the plot.

The central banks print money as they see fit. The power struggle in this world isn’t just about money because if it were they’d have won already.

It’s ideological spiritual warfare, if you haven’t figured that much out, you’re likely a lost cause.

Oh sure bud this is just one big Lord of the ring war between orcs and elves. Sure.

I could care less what you believe.

The thing that tickles me though, is that from a purely pragmatic perspective, you should pray.

If you’re right and this is all just godless nothing...cool, no sweat off my back when I’m dead and gone. No one to judge me for being wrong!

But if I’m right, and you have to stand in the light of judgement from the creator that you denied? Well it’s going to suck to be you.

Sleep tight.

That's hilarious. You should also write notes to leprechauns then because who knows. I might be right.

The crisis actor kids dropped the ball this time... They are all politicians in the making.

yes. you're the only one. i just surveyed the entirety of the earth's population (including insects, giraffes and prizefighters).....

you're the only one. must feel pretty nice.

I did but have changed my opinion to uncertain. The hyper focus of media to the drill really raises red flags. The more I learn about the district to the kids preaching on t.v. the less I believe it was some random event.

Yes. Same here.

This.

Come on Rocket Surgeon, are you suggesting that the TV and government might conspire to lie to us about death?

No fricken way.

Never. I believe the 4 mega rich men who own the MSM are looking out for our best interest. More tax, regulation, no privacy no guns and absolute peace while enslaving us. You are 2 steps behind Jebby

He was a radical Right winged terrorist. Calling him anything less is nonsense.

Nah, most of these crazies are fringe tier left wingers.

Nah, most of these crazies are fringe tier left wingers

(Citation needed)

100% untrue.

How many left wingers shoot up a planned parenthood?

Do you have proof or evidence he was a right winger?

He’s just a white supremasist. I don’t he knows or cares for fiscal policies https://www.cnn.com/2018/02/16/us/exclusive-school-shooter-instagram-group/index.html

Anyone other than CNN reporting this?

He left many racist and anti-antifa comments on the internet (Youtube and Instagram), his instagram pic was of him with a MAGA hat and he was filmed by his neighbor in his backyard target practicing with said hat. I know you guys have a hard time accepting it when yet another one of your ilks gods beserk but it’s the truth.

Edit : Facts being downvoted

If he was, and he shot up a black church, or a gay parade, then I would have no questions. But whytf would a right wing “nut” shoot a bunch of white kids? Makes no sense

On the same boat. That being said, after talking with some of my extended family this week, I'm really sadden to hear how willingly they are able to give up there right to own a gun.

If they don't own one and never intend to own one then from their perspective they're just willing takes away everyone else's rights. It's selfish, but easier to understand how normal people could be for losing rights. The same applies to free speech; people who believe they'll never be oppressed are more willing to give away the rights of people who are.

A lot of people I know who own guns and are avid hunters are in favor of tougher gun control measures. They want a ban on guns like AR-15s and universal background checks.

Everyone I've spoken to don't want a ban on their constitutional rights, and that appears to be the popular opinion in America.

This is factually true. Most people in America do not want to lose their constitutional rights. However, most people in America also want higher restrictions on guns. This article has links to Pew and NPR studies on multiple topics like it.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.businessinsider.com/americans-gun-control-beliefs-las-vegas-shooting-polls-surveys-2017-10

It's still their right, just because they don't use it. And frankly if they think their safety is impacted by it they have every right to voice that concern too.

The 2nd amendment is written into the constitution to defend people from a tyrannical government. To surrender your right to oppose a government and then surrender your ability to revolt against it, is the implication. I would prefer to keep my right than surrender it.?

I don't think that banning or confiscating guns is what most people want but how about background checks and a gun safety course? Seems like that would weed out most of the people who shouldn't have guns.

Some reasonable gun restrictions and regulations etc =/= banning of guns.

The kid was a trump supporter so it is safe to say that he was confused, clueless and angry at everyone around him.

No, I don't believe he was a Trump supporter. Where is your evidence of this?

The pictures of him wearing a trump hat.

Can you provide me with the picture and any evidence that it is real?

Here you go. I fucking googled you fucking retard.

https://www.snopes.com/did-shooters-instagram-picture-maga-hat/

LOL! Snopes? Try again.

It wouldn't matter what it was. trump/Russia supporters only believe trump/Russia.

It really doesn't matter if he wore a hat or not. Democrats have done shootings too.

These people are mentally ill. Or possibly having negative side effects from medications.

https://www.cnn.com/2018/02/16/us/exclusive-school-shooter-instagram-group/index.html

Anyone other than CNN reporting this?

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/5582982/nikolas-cruz-facebook-instagram-account-cruz_nikolas-florida-shooter-suspect/

Okay.

I just made a comment a few minutes ago to someone else, so I'll say it to you too. It doesn't matter if he had on a MAGA hat. Democrats have done shootings too.

The problem is these people are mentally ill. Or possibly having negative side effects to prescription medications.

Well, you seemed like you really needed to make sure whether he was or wasn't.

Well, I'm a Trump supporter. I am a perfectly sane person and would never do something like this (shoot someone). I'm a very kind person in real life and online too.

(The only things that rubs me the wrong way is Curling. ANYONE can do it! You don't have to be in shape, so they are not Olympic Athletes!)

Okay, that is the only thing that bugs me. LOL!

Whataboutism is strong here.

CNN is fake news.

lol There’s also a video of him target practicing in his backyard and he’s wearing his MAGA hat

Maybe normally, but those quotes from his social media are real. Read em’

That sounds like Hillary after she lost the election.

I am so glad that we didn't get Hillary for president. If we did the right would still be getting everything they wanted (like with Obama) but the left would be tricked into supporting it. At least now everyone is waking up to the bullshit.

I mean, how do you fake it? Just disappear 17 children? Well no, the parents would have to be in on it. As would the corner in charge of the bodies. As would the emt's who would recognise if the bodies they were pulling out were actually injured or not.

The list just grows, and the number one rule of any conspiracy is the more peopel involved, the less likely it will remain secret.

Have you SEEN 17 bodies? That takes care of coroners, emts. No bodies, no parent s and nobody to be in on it.

Not saying I believe it. I would think, if TPTB had anything to do with it occurring, they just didn’t do anything to prevent it. Look at how many people are saying they alerted [XYZ Authority] about this kid and he STILL legally bought the weapons and did this.

BUT, if you want to bring up regulations as is all the rage in msm now, what do you do? Get the guy to legally buy the guns. Now we have a real demon to tackle, no?

So 17 children just got fabricated into existence for the sake of the shooting?

Well now you have to make birth records, SS numbers. ALSO, you still need a coroner since someone has to sign a death certificate, which requires them to see a body and provide cause. You also now need to convince an entire schools worth of children to be complicit to your conspiracy, since they would sure as hell realise if absolutely no one knew these 17 children that were killed. And teachers, and the entire administrative board would need to be silenced aswell.

Your alternative method would actually result in a larger amount of people needing to be in on it then before. 1 "non existent body" is a pretty tough trick to pull. 17 is impossible in my opinion.

I'm not here to talk about regulations, I've already put the idea of convincing Americans to restrict killing tools to reasonable levels to bed. They just don't want to in most cases, and the ones who do are almost always called out ad hominem for it. No problem for me, not my countries kids who keep getting murdered.

Well now you have to make birth records

No, you do not. Where are the 3000 birth records for the 'victims' of 9/11?

Have you ever gone looking for them?

No, so what makes you assume anybody else has?

Because if none were found it would be talked about by conspiracy theorists forever.

People do talk about this very thing. And we tend to get downvoted by 'conspiracy theorists'.

Straight up have to say I don't believe you. If 3000 birth records were missing from people who died at 9/11 then there would be articles, blogs, someone writing about it and documenting that oddity sometime in the past 20 years. If you can give me a link to somewhere that proves those claims (obv "proving" is tough but beyond a weird you tube video like the current florida birth record claim is relying upon)

If 3000 birth records were missing

Have you looked? Be honest.

Dude they could and have probably made up millions of people, citizens, bank account, voting records etc that don't exist.

Compelte with (when necessary) perfect CGI models of people that have never existed, with voices, features, etc characteristic of unique humans. Welcome to computers and the 21st century.

Faking 17 people is completely nothing, don't be completely naive to suggest that it isn't easily possible.

there is a difference between a hollow citizen record used to fake voting, as the method of faking a shooting with non existent people.

And if you really think perfect cgi models, fricking holograms, are the answer then I don't know what to say besides provide me one source of commerical hologram technology anywhere close to what you are suggesting. and then consider how that could be done seamlessly, as all times, without a projector.

Not at a highschool it aint, unless the whole school doesn't exist.

May ask you, i what kind of reality you live?

It may be new to you, but CGI is for films and TV and doesn't work in real life.

Yeah bud that's what we call a fucking stupid, close minded viewpoint

Perhaps be careful, not that your friends turn out to be CGI holograms created by the CIA and FBI to take your guns... ^{^}

Did you not see the video with the kids huddling in a classroom with gunshots blasting? What's your explanation for that

My explanation would be the part where I said the kid legally bought the guns and went to the school and shot it up. Or did you miss that part of my post?

So you think it's likely he came to the school shot it up and didn't kill anyone? And then they paid all these kids to lie about witnessing the murders?

Sorry, no. I was only explaining in the first part that I think it’s not so hard to say there were 17 deaths and see no bodies.

I fully believe that this kid did it on his own accord. I find it odd though that so many people were warned about him and nothing was done. Then the fact that he was able to buy 10 rifles in a year before this added to that.

My mistake for not being clear and confusing the reader.

Has anyone figured out how he got the money to buy the guns? Seems like a lot of money.

Meh, it’s Florida. I haven’t been following the details too closely, but I know some people down there and when the want to make money there’s always numerous options. I personally know guys who go doctor shopping all over the state.

It would be a good lead to follow, I never thought about that. There’s stories about how the fbi helped people to commit acts like this and got caught. Maybe they helped him buy them too?

I’ve read that he worked at Dollar General or similar.

Yeah, I read that too. Maybe that coupled with living with his parents/foster parents he just saved up. It’s not like he had any real expenses like rent, food, loans, it would seem.

Also, he was 19. I’m sure credit card companies were giving him cards like no other, so it’s possible he used that too.

Your friend is full of shit. Doctor shopping is near impossible now a days because every pharmacy is linked up and reports that shit and you will get arrested for it now. If hes talking about the good ole days then maybe so. The minute you try to turn in a prescription from a different doctor before 28 days after your last prescription you are busted.

He could be considered disabled and get disability, he could have income from the estate of his deceased parents

And the video of the students huddled next to the dead body surrounded by a pool of blood while the kids sob and shake uncontrollably.

I've seen that video many times. Funny thing is that the body laying in the pool of blood and plasma was that of a black girl, and out of the 17 deceased, there was not a black girl. Just saying...

She wasn’t black. Her name was Helena Ramsay. She had curly kind of frizzy hair and dark skin. You’re wrong.

Maybe she lived

You're right. Once again, inconsistencies. Every fucking time

Has anyone made a submission about this? That's a pretty major inconsistency

Not sure why we're being downvoted for literally just stating facts and observations...

Not saying this was the case here, but you do realize you can take any video sequence and put any audio track to it, right?

So I could take, say, a harmless video of some teenagers wrestling in the snow, all blurry, etc. And then place some wicked loud as fuck gunfire and women screaming bloody murder to it, black-out the blurry video, and then claim it was a video of something else. This would fool a shitload of people.

Not saying this was the case here, but you do realize you can take any video sequence and put any audio track to it, right?

Wait, you mean video footage can be faked?

Shiiiiiiet, there goes literally ALL of our evidence that this event was real.

But the telescreen wouldn't lie to us, would it?

Let's ask Harley Guy!

Do you not realize a false flag doesn’t necessarily mean no one was killed? The people who think no one was killed are a subset of those who think this was a false flag.

I'll also add to your point that they can claim 52 people were killed in Vegas (or other such events), but through the razzle-dazzle magic of the media and the pre-designated list of 3-4 marquis victims, they can get away with only needing a handful of "real" people to make the entire country think it was really 52. The others are just a wall of facebook faces.

And all of those peoples' connections are fake? And the tons of people who witnessed people being shot? I have an ex-marine friend who was there and described a good amount of the horror to me. He escaped with his shirt covered in other peoples' blood.

Why am I getting into this... nvm

the tons of people who witnessed people being shot?

'Tons of people' lol

You guys are too obvious.

comrade vladimir here, vegas shooting happened, it wasnt a false flag, your just mental, signed kimmy jon un

what?

His point was you don't need 53 actual verified dead bodies to make the public believe so. Vegas was a mix of tricking crisis actors into being in a live false flag in my opnion. People died, but they had layers of deception to fool everybody and throw off the conspiracy community.

I believe they are going to go with this type of blueprint from now on. As it seems this Parkland shooting has both signs of being real and signs of fakery as well. Drill on same day? FBI warned about this person multiple times but no action? But real kids died as well? See the coincidences there? Truth mixed with lies works the best at fooling people.

but you can verify them. you can look for histories of anyone who died, you can find all the connections they had whether they be work, friends, or familial. my boss's wife had a close friend who died in the shooting, and while i don't remember the name offhand it wasn't someone really being profiled in the media. also, why would you need crisis actors if you're firing live bullets? I am very sure my friends who were there were not crisis actors

and i don't see any odd coincidences there unless you're trying to make them odd.

Can I list what I think are the other possible options. I'm open to looking at this form all possible ways

A) this happens and those known kids died and the "msm" are using it in a particular way

B) this did happen and the powers that be knew it was going to happen, and then let it happen to enforce stricter gun controls?

C)The powers that be made this happen and played a role in setting up crisis actors and the like to get maximum possible impact from it occurring (somehow pushing the shooter or such like)

D) The shooter didn't even do it, it was a team of multiple shooters or such like?

Are there any others?

I like how "the powers that be" are this all knowing, all powerful force who can control the government... but still needs to false flag a shooting of 17 kids to fail to get a bill passed.

I am just using that as a catch all term to be as general as possible. I personally don't believe this was any sort of FF, but I'm willing to openly discuss why someone might think it is the case.

I’m not a conspiracy theorist but it feels like there is more to it than gun control. The Governor asked for the FBI Director to step down like the day after it happened.

Wondering if they are leveraging this to reorg the FBI.

Who are you TPTB?

I like how you believe the constitution can just be subverted that easily with a public senate vote without the country rioting. Number 1 and Number 2 would cause mass chaos in the streets if they just were voted away casually. Why do you think they pick and prod and pry at them very slowly... because they are the ones they hate the most. That and that darned #15 that guarantees our right to privacy with raising our families. The satanists want that one gone big time.

If one of us wants Beer to be legalized and another wants it to be illegalized both of us will have our propaganda ready. And we will be waiting for an event. So when someone drunk drivers, there’s already stories written about alcohol. When North Korea screws up something there already hundreds of stories ready to go and they just mold them around the event.

It’s not as much of a false flag as it is news with an agenda. And again the purpose of these news agencies seem to be to fracture the population into distinct groups rather than one meaningful entity.

But how much can you "mold" a story around a school shooting. What are you changing? Unless you mean the witnesses are being coached or such like?

Although I do agree the news definitely plays a role in dividing people, I don't know where I would strictly put the blame. Its a chicken and egg scenario since we all know divisive news sells well, and that encourages papers to write divisive news, or move towards more radical positions. Because it gets viewers.

Although along with that when many news outlets take their hints from places such as twitter, you can certainly make a case that one of the key affects of shills in places like twitter is that it presents a false image to news outlets that there is a higher demand for divisive / extreme news then their actually is.

I appreciate the analogy, and I do agree that what you're say is plausible. I just don't consider it that conspiratorial, and more a modern problem in journalism.

Well, in the example of a school shooting you have two ongoing dialogue about violence, control restriction and this dialogue angers people to the point they don’t want to discuss the issue with each other. So if your goal is to fragment the population then you want to focus on the mental health or the gun control but only focus on the conflicts and never on actual solutions. That way the whole incident becomes a polarized “meme” In which any meaningful change is sideline.

For example no meaningful change will come out of this last shooting. Except for people hating each other that much more because of their political views on guns or violence or the president. So if your goal is to fracture the group mind into tiny hateful pieces then the school shooting is the perfect frame for those agendas. For example no meaningful change will come out of this last shooting. Except for people hating each other that much more because of their political views on guns or violence or the president. So if your goal is to fracture the group mind into tiny hateful pieces than school shooting is the perfect frame for those agendas.

Someone advising Nancy Grace telling her OK Nancy, next time we have a school shooting we’ve got to get these people really whipped up into a frenzy. Now that’s emotional manipulation. And it would be based on a true fact but it’s nothing to resemble journalism.

So rather than just a school shooting it becomes a propagandized take on a school shooting. And then that feels insincere and cast doubt on the integrity of the process

I follow, but casting doubt on the integrity of which process? The rule of law?

Casting doubt on the integrity of investigative journalism and what we see on the news. Instead of hearing the facts we are hearing the facts with agenda filter.

Now somebody who is distrustful of their honesty is going to be watching the news closely for facts. But instead of facts they get opinion bending facts. On the ‘news’.

I can see how this could encourage somebody with conspiratorial thoughts to believe that they are only seeing fake news or manufactured events. When an event like this happens and opinion pieces are released immediately it is obvious that they are ready already waiting for the names and dates and numbers of deaths to be filled in.

It is a form of manipulation of information and if you didn’t trust the system might make you see everything as a manufactured event. But it’s really just propaganda and spin if that makes sense.

Reasons to believe he was under surveillance already:

got expelled

posted on youtube hes going to be a shooter(they claim FBI cant get ip from atleast 1 of 10million youtube employees)

had mental health issues

2 parents dead

posted photos of his gun collection

bought 10 guns no hassles immediately, uttered death threats constantly

talked about killing animals

random guy living in your house with bag of guns

reported on by friends and classmates multiple times(for talking about killing people) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A1LEprbmIow

known to have a temper

living in a home (with the SNEADS previously on WIKIPEDIA they said his LAWYERS home) with a bunch of guns. Would you let a teenager known to have issues live in your house with a bag full of guns?

Secret service called to school, shooting training drills, had to go home to get gunbag and uber back to school

After all this when asked OFFICIAL response was Assessed to not be a risk (ie we already watching this guy). Typical CANNED heavy surveillance response

So even though he was under heavy FBI surveillance he could still get away with this? Who was in charge of this? Are they in charge of anyone in FBI working under Mueller investigation? Let me know whats going on regarding all those long boring more maturely written long-winded Mueller articles.

Okay. I like this. I'm open to discuss some of this. As you can probably tell I am sceptical but I'll be open to it. I'll post another response later but could you post more sources for this information if possible? I'll still respond I would just like to see (especially the lawyer part) where this is being said?

Raises a lot of questions for sure. I’d for one like to know how a teenager could get that much money for all those weapons. When I was that age I worked and had a shitty car I could barely put gas in, let alone have $5,000 in firearms.

So the HS students wouldn't know that those names they are listing as the deceased are no one they know?

You kill 17 children to cover the assassination of 1 so there is no investigation.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manhattan_Project#Secrecy

Ah yes, because the manhatten project, which took place in a time without smartphones, involved a race to the finish against another world power, and which DID have a spy in its inner circle (Codename Prometheus) is comparable to FAKING THE MURDER OF 17 PEOPLE.

Comeon now, one was the secret design of a bomb, for what appeared to be the only salvation for humanity, the other is fooling police officers and emts and cornoers, for what most people would see as despicable reasons.

From what I’ve seen so far I believe it was a pyscho kid on antidepressants but I am open minded on incidents such as these.

Very interesting that they warned the kids there would be a drill that day with blanks, wonder if that kid knew this beforehand and took advantage, or if it could hint to something bigger

There are a lot of stupid people who believe whatever the MSM feeds them.

Until someone bothers to explain the 21 year old "senior" who was interviewed on TV, I am going to wait and see.

https://imgur.com/IcOCa8p

Where the hell is that top information from? Possible aliases?

It looks like it's from a generic site where you can search someone's name. There's no good reason to believe the information provided is accurate.

Yeah that looks like bullshit. Possible aliases are all Jake? If you go to her Facebook page and look at her albums there is one from late 2013 and she looks all of 14, definitely not 17.

I'm guessing, if it's not just pure bullshit, it was sourced from a site she joined and lied about her age. Because kids do that all the time.

I have no idea, at this point. Need to read, watch and collate first.

Same with me. I like to do my research for a few days before making a decision.

Need to read, watch and collate first.

And from whom will you source your evidence?

As many as possible hopefully.

What better way to spread fear then have the incident occur in Parkland... supposedly Florida’s safest city. Spreads the “if it can happen here, it can happen anywhere.” mentality.

So who paid and who got paid in this situation?

The government is trying to disarm the public.

So who paid and who got paid, you didn't answer

He does have a point. The payment (if someone or some entity wanted to disarm the public) would be the disarmament of a populace. Now who paid? That’s a question I’d like to find out, too. A defenseless population is very easy to control.

I got the idea behind it what I'm getting at is the logistics of pulling it off. Who paid is the easier piece of the puzzle. Who gets paid is the real question to answer because there's a lot of people that would need to get paid and not leak later. Idk how that could even be accomplished. Shooter, witnesses, investigators, parents. You'd have to keep the real emts out of the school. You'd have to have someone lie about where the bodies were taken. Crisis actor kids pretending to have witnessed murder, etc

And then you either have to have fake teachers/coaches no one has heard of at the school or have the real teachers disappear forever. I mean it's silly

Oh, no I know it really happened, that kinda shit would be way too complicated to fabricate and keep under wraps. It’s way easier just to have the media pretty much do it for you.

Ah ok. Ya I agree with that for sure

Go sit in a hotel lobby in Vegas for about two hours and count how many people take rolling racks full of luggage from their cars into the elevators and up to their rooms. No one searches them, nor should they. AR-15’s break into two easily concealed pieces, the upper and the lower. Any jackhole could take an arsenal up to a hotel room in suitcases without anyone noticing anything.

I have heard SO many people say “How did they not notice him taking all those weapons up to his room” like he was walking up there like Robin Williams in the movie poster for The Survivors. Come on, people. Think!

technically with a room key he was able to bring his stuff from the garage to the room via elevator. he didn't even need to walk through the lobby.

Still. Zero video?

Ongoing investigation

Are you doing PR for them?

I wish. I could use the money. I'm wary of some of the facts regarding Vegas, but I also don't expect the FBI to leak stuff in the middle of an investigation.

How many rounds were fired?

What kind of bullets?

Can we see pictures of the bullet casings and pictures of the ballistic damage?

Who was the dead black girl?

What parts of the school specifically was the shooter in?

What was in the bodybag being taken out of the school?

Why was there the instant call to demolish the school?

How come Browardschools.com was created in 1996, while Browardschools1.com was created last year?

Are any autopsy reports going to be released?

Why did the ALLEGED shooters brother get sent to a psychiatric facility just days ago?

How did the laptop get shot and still have a functioning backlight?

Why is there no transparency?

I'm not a human embodiment of Wikipedia. You want all the answers after a week then God speed.

Also I'm not saying you shouldn't be asking these questions. Please hold the powerful accountable and ask for answers. I'm just saying the answers aren't going to be clear while an investigation is ongoing.

All good questions!

You can shoot a hole in many modern monitors and still have a functional monitor. I seen someone get mad and throw their keys. Hit TV and stuck in it made hole all the way through and the show kept playing

How did the laptop get shot and still have a functioning backlight?

lmao

What's the purpose of releasing such a video? It doesn't show the attack, it presumably wouldn't show anything other than him carrying bags. The only purpose of releasing it would be to satisfy (jk, it wouldn't) a small number of conspiracy theorists.

If the video shows Paddock carrying dozens of large, heavy bags up to his room then you're right!

But what if the video shows him carrying only one small suitcase up to his room? What then?

All of the conspiracy theories, speculation, and conjecture could easily be laid to rest if the video was shown....but they refuse to show it.

Why do you think that is?

No, literally none of them will be laid to rest, and you know that. They'll say the video's fake, try to find little things to make it seem like it's not him, etc. When has releasing evidence ever quieted conspiracy theorists? And no one else is asking for such footage because his body was found in his room.

Lots of things were found in the room. Like a door locked from the OTHER SIDE that led to a room from where shots were fired. In order for Paddock to get to that room he would have had to go out into the hallway...which was full of officers.

I'm not saying Paddock didn't do it...but I'm also the kind of person that doesn't believe what someone tells just because they told me. I don't care who did the shooting, just show me the evidence without hiding, obfuscating, outright lying, constantly changing the story, constantly changing the timeline, refusing to show the security camera footage, and completely ignoring questions that punch holes in the official narrative.

I just want to see the evidence. I guess that makes me a conspiracy nut. What a world.

But no one's questioning whether he was there except for a few people here. The police&hotel shouldn't have to do whatever conspiracy theorists want them to, when they know it wouldn't even help anything. It's not obfuscating it's just them not doing unnecessary stuff.

You and I both know releasing the security footage would do nothing to help the investigation, and would do nothing to quell the minds of people who think it's a false flag or whatever. Even if it showed Paddock bringing bags to an elevator, and that's actually what happened in reality, there would be immediate front page threads on this sub yelling about camera manipulation or him looking like he has a different haircut from far away.

I don't know that at all. I guarantee if the footage showed Paddock lugging guns up to his room it would plastered on every TV screen from Seattle to D.C.

It all really depends on what the footage shows. I guess we'll never know. Would have been nice to not have to take the word of those who stand to lose a lot of money over it.

But surely the hotel wants videos of a mass murderer wandering around their property being shared all over the internet! /s

Honestly that’s the real conspiracy here: wealthy ass hotels flexing their muscles to silence the reports to not impact business.

The video is part of a civil case. It's their right to keep their property from being used against them before their cases are heard.

This is also a likely explanation for Jesus Campos's "disappearance" and controlled appearance on Ellen afterward. They're a multi-billion dollar company operating in a corrupt industry in a corrupt city, and they're facing hundreds or thousands of lawsuits including dozens for wrongful death. They have both the power and the incentive to make a witness disappear and only reappear with handlers, but it doesn't mean the shooting didn't happen the way police say it did. It just means they're afraid the guy will say something that will open them up to even more liability.

With that said, I still have several reasons to be skeptical about the Vegas shooting. The discrepancies between in the LVPD's various accounts of the timeline, Paddock's background and income sources, the disappearing hard drive re-appearing with child porn, his house being burglarized while under FBI surveillance, etc.

They'd want to be transparent. Guest safety at high-profile hotels is pretty far up on the priority list. There are rules in place to make sure people and their room numbers aren't linked by other guests unless the guests themselves disclose that information. We can't even tell you if your brother Steve Unique is in house, let alone if he's due in or checked out. Even if you have a valid ID with Bob Unique on it, you aren't getting any info about Steve Unique from a trained employee.

That being said, this could be the exact reason the footage isn't being leaked. It might not just be him on the film (likely isn't just him). There are probably parts they could show without revealing other folks but I imagine the footage of the hallway, like... idk, Right after the shit hit the fan?/s That footage might be worth having a look at.

Lol you over thinking.

Out of sight, out of mind.

I know right...especially since its not already on every news station on the planet!

The media releases videos on every shooting. Every fucking shooting. But with this one, in a casino full of cameras and facial recognition software, they release nothing. Thats fucking suspicious

No they don't? They occasionally show an attack or the lead-up to an attack if it was recorded. Maybe casing a place before attacking it, but he shot outside the hotel. There's no question (in most people's minds) of what happened, any anything of importance to that was not recorded. Releasing video of him walking around the casino is about as relevant as a video of him pumping gas on his way to Vegas. All it would show is that he was there, which we already know, and would do literally nothing to change the opinions of conspiracy theorists no matter what it showed.

Well we actually don't know that he was there and a video of him in the casino would verify that. All we got was a valet ticket and a room service receipt

and you think any conspiracy theorist is going to be satisfied by such a video? no one else is questioning that he was there

It's not up to the media. It's up to the owners of the property. And it makes no sense for them to release it.

MGM releases photos of every other crime and robbery that happens in their buildings though.

Are you trying to equate someone running off with casino chips to 50+ people massacred by a shooter in their hotel? You don't see how those two may be handled a little differently?

No, I dont see why MGM won't release images of Steven Paddock on their property. Not one image...

Let's say I'm part of MGM ownership/upper management.

The choices in my court: 1) Not publicly release any images of the perpetrator of the deadliest mass shooting in US history on my MGM-owned property, or 2) release images to be plastered all over the news, where viewers directly associate images of gunman/shooting to Mandalay Bay/MGM.

From a simple business and PR perspective - I'm going to pick the option that mitigates public association and impressions of my brand and property with the shooting. You're inviting nothing but risk to your business by doing so. Imagine tourists reenacting photos in the exact places Paddock was depicted and sharing via social media - it's a PR nightmare. That's not even taking into account any liability risks associated with images as well.

The investigative authorities already have the security footage, why damage my brand further by releasing it publically? Who would want to have their casino/hotel - a place people go to for leisure, entertainment, and fun- be further marred with images directly linking it to a deadly massacre?

Casinos don’t want video of bad things happening in casinos. Anything to (further) scare off tourists from Vegas or their property in particular isn’t going to be voluntarily made public.

What about the survivors of the shooting who claim there were multiple shooters?

Theres always "survivors who claim multiple shooters", but we never find any hard evidence indicating that fact.

The hard evidence is the video with clear sound of different caliber weapons being fired at the same time. Unless dude was dual wielding assault rifles...

you're right, there was multiple shooters but the swat team, police, etc are all covering it up because they have so much to gain by doing so.

So it was either a fabricated attack with two shooters while there's no benefit of a second shooters but the planners somehow decided to have two shooters and try to obscure this fact, or some people in their most stressful and disorienting situation of their life panicked and unknowingly made incorrect claims. What makes more sense to you?

The benefit of multiple shooters is to cause more damage. False flag narrative. "Look how much damage this lone crazy guy did with guns! We need to regulate guns!!"

Edit: there is almost 100% proof that some of these shootings were false flags. Some of the sandy hook videos for instance, on hooktube. Do your own research and you'll see the common misinformation tactics used in each event.

I had friends who were there, one of whom is an ex-marine. They said it sounded like the shots were coming from everywhere, because it was so loud and echoing around the area. But they didn't see anyone and had no reason to believe there was anyone else. Those situations can be very confusing, people don't know where shots are coming from and can mistake law enforcement for another gunman

Also, no one was found shot out of the range from where the shooter could've shot someone

The shooters likely weren't spread out far. The hotel had a large roof area closer to the ground, that led directly to, and attached to, the parking garage. Perfect line of sight for a second shooter, perfect escape route.

yet there's still no proof of multiple shooters beyond people making false reports in the confusion. i said what i said because even an ex-marine friend of mine in the middle of it couldn't figure out what was going on, but didn't specifically see anything to give the idea that there were multiple shooters

Of course there is no proof..they won't release even the hotel security camera footage. The sound of multiple guns firing at once is all the proof I need friend.

Its a common theme with false flag shootings. The survivors claim multiple shooters (happened with the Florida school shooting as well) while the media denies it.

One time, when I was a kid, I heard a crash in the front part of my house and heard someone shout. I thought someone was breaking into the house and ran out the back door. Turns out a tree fell on our house. I didn't maintain that someone broke in when I found that out.

The media gathers facts from both witness accounts and the police investigation. Witnesses don't always know what's exactly going on. They might see a guy with a gun at street level and think there's a second shooter, but it's a cop. The cop doesn't become a second shooter because of a mistaken account. In fact, the cops didn't even know if there were other shooters until the situation began to calm down. Witness accounts can be very unreliable, especially in situations that most of them haven't been in before. It's easy to think you'd be in that scenario and be able to judge everything that's going on accurately.

Also, this took place in the middle of the strip. There's a bump stock+the sound echoing off of other buildings. Despite there being thousands of people in the area, many of whom were recording videos and taking pictures, no one recorded any other gunmen.

They never recorded any gunman..just saying.

Luggage? In a hotel? How dumb do they think we are?!

This comment got 145 upvotes but contributes nothing to this sub. This is why this sub isn't what it used to be.

Yeah god forbids we use humour on this sub

I’ve never seen regular people use employee elevators in Vegas.

He wasn’t regular people. He was rich af. He owned 2 planes and was a high roller. His room was a giant suite. That’s how you get to use service elevators.

The guy spent more money at a casino than most people make in a year. It's not like the service elevators are luxurious, so why the fuck wouldn't the hotel let him use them if he wanted?

How often do you scope out employee elevators? I’ve used service elevators in hotels before, especially resort hotels during Sunday check out time. Just locate the elevator and hit the button. I’ve never had the operator say anything to me or my friends.

I'm a regular person who has gone with not regular people before. We usually stay in 24-125 or 24-135. We use the service elevator because it lets you off way closer to the suite than the regular elevator all the way at the end of the hall does.

If you read the police report it also says that they let him use the service elevator for his luggage because he was a big spender. So not many people would have even seen him with his bags anyway.

Video or it didn't happen.

Bro he had a lot more than 1 ar-15....

And? The point is they don't have ways to stop people from bringing guns up. People roll into suites with commercial equipment, huge party supplies, video shoot hardware, crates and crates of stuff that look no different than huge military crates. The fact that we have no video of him exploiting a common fact of hotels means absolutely nothing in terms of suspiciousness of this being a false flag.

There's plenty of types sizes of luggage that could fit multiple assembled AR's. I have no idea why this is a talking point.

Have you ever had your bags searched at a hotel?

Yeah I never understood what was so hard to believe about that. I guess cause I have experience traveling with firearms I'm part of the coverup. My favorite was people saying "well it would've weighed a lot" while there's carts in the lobby for just that. I've rebuilt an engine in a nice hotel room in Tahoe so Paddock sneaking in guns way pretty easy to believe. Serious questions need to be answered though.

Show me the security video.

It would be very simple to dispel all the conjecture. Just show the security camera footage. Don't want to show the footage? Well, this will cause me to doubt you because you have the footage but refuse to show it.

Yeah, people who say “it would have weighed a lot” have never picked up an AR. Mine weighs 8.2 lbs unloaded. Let’s raise that to 9 for Paddock’s ARs, cause they had longer barrels and those bump stocks are heavier than Magpul MOEs. So, figure 9 lbs per Paddock rifle. 3 of them in one suitcase and he’s not even clearing 30 lbs. Two smallish suitcases on a luggage dolly, and wham bam thank ya m’am, he has six AR-15’s in his room. Two trips and he has 12. Four trips over the course of 3 hours, which f-king no one would notice, especially in the damn service elevator, and there ya go.

Hell he wouldn’t even need to make trips no one has ever looked at a guy with a loaded to the brim luggage dolly and thought it was suspicious. I’ve done it in Vegas with military rolling duffle bags. How he got that shit into his room shouldn’t be part of the conspiracy but for some reason it is.

Very simple. Show me the security video of Paddock lugging dozens of large, heavy bags up to his room.

I agree but why not show 1 or 2 video clips . To not show video to the public is irresponsible as the public should learn how to identify certain behavior . That reason alone is enough for me question the situation.

But there is not even footage of him bringing any luggage upstairs to that room.

Pretty easy to get a crazy person to shoot someone. That's what happened with Reagan.

He was perfectly sane. Just an evil supremacist.

Nope. I agree. Of course, the vast vast vast vast majority of people also agree.

Of course, the vast vast vast vast majority of people also agree.

Now what makes you say that or are you just pulling that statistic out of your ass.

He's talking about outside this echo chamber

Well in that case, no shit.

Was just watching this video with students talking about multiple shooters and one student who I believe states that she was with Nikolas Cruz soon after hearing shots fired.

They always use the multiple shooter thing to discredit the false flag

Yes you are

I think it more possible that it is indeed real but the assailant was driven to it by exterior forces.

He was a depressed kid most likely on mind altering drugs without a dad in the house. All three of those things commonly occur in mass shooters but nobody talks about those facts, just what guns they used.

Oh! The dadlessness is a new angle to consider. The psych drugs is definitely a thing:

https://np.reddit.com/r/WayOfTheBern/comments/7yvmvl/us_children_grow_up_on_prescription_drugs_6_of/

Absolutely it's also a problem within lower income families going without a father figure can ruin good people

Or you could call it how it really is: a white nationalist with a long history of posting alt right talking points who just decided it was time to take action against a school predominantly made of 'le joos".

I'm from the south, and you have to look hard as hell to find anyone that would openly speak or act racist in any way because everyone knows it is WRONG. He was on pharmaceuticals and had a track record of being crazy. That can drive anyone to commit a tragedy. Stop making everything about race. It only divides us just like the red and blue sides in politics.

No. You don't get to misdirect on this one. The MAGA-hat shooter has been proven to be a white supremacist with who had been planning this for a long time. Here's a couple links to get you started:

https://www.cnn.com/2018/02/14/us/nikolas-cruz-florida-shooting-suspect/index.html

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2018/02/florida-school-shooter-linked-to-white-supremacist-group.html

If he was such a white supremacist, why did he kill mostly white people? The kid was crazy, and crazy people do crazy things. Here are photos of the victims from CNN:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2018/02/15/us/florida-shooting-victims-school/index.html

White supremacists don't consider Jews to be white. Did you not know that? The school was 40% Jewish and the shooter was even Jewish himself. His alt right beliefs led him to believe that all Jews are the enemy and should be murdered. Nothing about his beliefs are out of line with his political movement so you'd have to consider a very large chunk of the US population to simply be insane for the "mental illness" angle to work. Do you think we should lock up all Trump voters in mental hospitals?

So you expect anyone to believe that he went around shooting only Jews?! Are you serious? You know an awful lot about racism. Trump voters are not mental. That doesn't even make sense, but it probably does to you.

No I expect you to acknowledge the fact that his online history was filled with hate in social groups and on 4chan. His stated goal was to kill Jews. You can't just brush him of as mentally ill without jumping through serious mental hoops.

Do you have links to that? How do you know you are looking at the right social media profiles? I have heard absolutely nothing about the guy being on a Jew hunt.

That's sort of been the major theme of his online presence.

https://www.cnn.com/2018/02/16/us/exclusive-school-shooter-instagram-group/index.htmlhttps:/www.cnn.com/2018/02/16/us/exclusive-school-shooter-instagram-group/index.html

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/02/17/florida-shooter-left-chilling-trail-anti-semitic-racist-homophobic/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

https://www.snopes.com/did-shooters-instagram-picture-maga-hat/

4chan attempted to curb this by spreading a fake story about him being tied to a specific white nationalist group and therefore undermining the credibility of "fake news". This backfired when the outlets who reported it did the fact-checking that all real news sites do and then issued the retraction.

You said he was after Jews, but that first article literally says he hated and wanted to kill everything from latinos to small animals. He wasn't just after a specific race or religion. You can certainly infer that he was racist from comments , but it's also clear he hated everyone and everything. He had mental health issues, clearly. My problem with your approach is that you are not acknowledging his mental health, but choosing to solely focus on his extremist comments leading up to the event. If he was not mentally ill, this likely would have never happened. For example the people in his group said they were racist too, but they also said they would never take it as far as killing others. His mental health allowed him to take it over the edge, not his hatred for everyone and everything.

Can you find any sources proving this link between mental health and violence? This study failed to establish such a link and even found tht mental illness over time LOWERS violent tendencies:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4318286/

On the other hand we have one of the largest hate sites in the world, if not the largest, 4chan. When I first browsed the site it was fairly new and the vitriol seemed to be ironic. Many years later it's now a primary hub for white nationalism and acts of violence are celebrated. The Day of the Rope is the stated endgame and those who murder liberals and ethnics are hailed as heroes.

Are we to believe that the rise of racial extremism has nothing to do with violence against targets these types of people claim to want dead? White supremacists are now the deadliest extremist faction in the nation. They are far more of a threat than ISIS but those same people who claim to want to keep us safe with Muslim travel bans refuse to even look at the elephant in the room. Instead they throw up boogeymen like "mental illness" despite evidence to the contrary glaring them in the face.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/white-supremacists-committed-most-extremist-killings-2017-adl-says-n838896

You can believe either theory. I'm personally not taking sides atm. But one thing is you didn't point to any evidence to back your theory, or counter evidence against their theory. Basically all i see is you're looking for other people to validate your beliefs. Not to be confrontational but that's what i see in this post.

I'm with you also. Apparently this means I'm a paid shill.

That kid with 5 bullet holes in his but would like to talk to some of you

I believe it was real - however, I also feel like there is an ongoing effort to encourage these types of thoughts & behaviors. Why or how, I haven't an idea, there's too much mis/disinformation to sift through - which may be by design, or may not be. We're in /r/conspiracy so I can never actually be sure of anything.

The fact we have trouble determining real from fake is a part of the misinformation campaign to put real thinkers in the same box as people who believe the earth is flat. Its a well oiled machine were resisting

We need security camera footage is all I’m saying. They know people are questioning it.

something about the interview with the kid who said they were prepared to hear gunshots because of a drill is almost too much of a coincidence for me to let go.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=32&v=qp0g2ZFE6Ns

FBI / CIA knew this kid was going to do it and tried to maximize the carnage for gun-control.

Is it possible that the entire event was a made-for-TV movie?

I'm asking you, is that possible?

hu-what?

It is a simple question.

Is it possible, in your opinion, that this entire event is a fabrication, a charade, a ruse?

Not the ENTIRE thing. I am not suggesting people weren't killed.

In other words 'not possible'.

How open-minded you are.

You're the one who asked me if it was a TV movie. what kind of a dumb ass question is that? I hope you don't get paid much.

I wouldn't get to involved in an argument with him... its really not worth it...

step2thejep thinks no one died in 9/11, or sandyhook or any mass shooting... actually he does not believe that anyone died in Syria or any war in general... actually he does not believe neither dinosaurs nor ancient greeks nor Tesla existed... or that space, the moon, the sun, a round earth, atoms, gravity, relativity, missiles, or evolution exist...

He has a website, the he used to try to shill on reddit that charges $20/mo, that he now has stopped because he was banned from some subreddits and warned to stop on others... but anyways he calls himself "the world's leading skeptic"...

Which roughly translates to if he cannot see it, its not real... or whatever other impossible standard of proof he sets under a misunderstanding of basic science or research...

Which leads us the point the he is the best example of a the Dunning Krueger effect that I have ever run across.

But anyways he now comes here to ask for evidence like a 3 yearold playing the "why" game so I would save your efforts.

Holy shit lol, downloaded that vid.

What a joke.

what do you mean?

That video is green screened as well!

It's known that orchestrated mass shootings and false flags are often precipitated by "terror drills" done in the area days or weeks before an event.

Secret service were at the school giving training about a possible active shooter situation a couple weeks prior to the shooting.

On the day of the shooting, teachers were told there would be a “code red” or “lockdown” drill in the near future but had not been told the date.

If that's not at least a little suspicious, I don't know what would be.

My feeling is that they are using "targeted individuals" as shooters.

Secret service were at the school giving training about a possible active shooter situation a couple weeks prior to the shooting.

Well some sick minds, bearing a lot of anger and violent fantasies in them would perhaps take this idea to an real event. Not unlikely that the shooter heard of those things and then deceided to do it in reality.

Mind controlled kid. The voices TOLD HIM HOW TO DO THE SHOOTING. That's coaching by the CIA using voice of God weapons.

I totally buy that some/many of these were by people that were on drugs where people know this is a risk, and maybe even encourage it.

I also buy that survivors are coached by media to get the biggest reaction.

I do not buy that there are completely falsified shootings.

I didn't say that. I said the shooter was given instruction by the CIA using voice to skull technology (ie. using technology to induce a "auditory hallucination")

I must have replyed to the wrong thread.

Oh well, you might not be too far off.

Do you have any evidence that this is true?

If they can do it in 1962 can u imagine how far the technology has progressed since then?

http://www.physiology.org/doi/abs/10.1152/jappl.1962.17.4.689?sid=7c073ad2-6324-4b47-94e1-124dc0a5f154

Is there any evidence, however slight or circumstantial, that it was used in this case?

"He told authorities that voices in his head told him how to carry out the shooting"

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5398625/Demon-voices-school-gunman-attack-cops-called-39-times.html#ixzz57mZieo8D

Not even sandy hook?

Kill 17 to hide 1.

What makes you think this? Was it an ELF weapon?

There are a lot of frequencies that can be used on a target I don't know.

People keep equating the term False Flag with Hoax.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_flag

The USS Maine did blow up.

The Reichstag did burn down.

The Gleiwitz incident did actually occur.

There really were actual terrorist attacks in Iran that helped install the Shah.

The thing about a false flag is not that the event did not happen, it's that who were told was behind the event was not the ones who actually did it, but the ones telling us it was those guys.

A Mentally disturbed kid did acquire weapons and went out and killed 17 people. That happened.

Did certain parties nudge it along, or (purposely) allow it to happen? That is what determines if this is a false flag or not.

You seem to be under the impression that a false flag can't also be a hoax.. eg.. staged terrorism with no real victims apart from the attacks on Muslims that often follow.

White hats?

Why bother when actually killing people is so much simpler?

rationality is NOT welcome

It's not simpler when relatives demand real investigations and just because some may be psychopaths doesn't mean everyone they work with is too nor would they choose to risk being busted for murder over fraud.

What is easier to silence? A couple 3 letter agents with a psychoactive drug injector, or a few dozen blabby actors?

If it does leak which is easier to discredit, a "crazy disgruntled ex-gov employee" or someone who is literally supposed to be dead and buried?

Considering how many times they've staged shootings and terrorism, clearly the steps they are taking to keep people quiet is working. It could be money, fear or believing what they are doing is for a good cause, who knows but it still makes no sense to kill children for real when they can fake it.

it still makes no sense to kill children for real when they can fake it.

You only think that because you aren't a sociopath. It is uncomfortable to think that there are people in the world that can snuff out a child with no more care than you would have for swatting a fly, but unfortunately there are. There are actually lots of them.

Yes but they are very unlikely to work in the same department and openly discuss it, who broaches the subject? and the motive? an individual isn't going to risk life in prison over gun control, it's just too big a stretch.

The CIA had plans to bomb Miami to incite war with Cuba that president Kennedy shot down. Kennedy was then killed by Lee Harvey Oswald who we now know with certainty was a CIA agent.

If you don't believe people would do this shit you are closing your eyes to reality. (I am not commenting one way or another on this particular incident).

Yeah they do assassinate individuals all the time, they even go to war for profit on a regular basis but they still aren't sitting around in a board room discussing which kids in their own state they will kill for something that doesn't matter to any of them all that much. I've researched so many of these events so I know they aren't killing people for gun control or even for their mid east agenda.. not since 9/11 at least.

I certainly don't know. Just...nothing would surprise me.

I think this is intentional. And I think the hoaxer wing has some people in it making sure all we talk about is the hoax theory and kids being actors and nothing else. And then bringing up crisis actors and fake blood in any false flag discussion. Even mainstream political aides and Trump kids are picking up the actor angle it’s gotten so popular.

This leads to victim shaming and harassment by the conspiracy community. It leads to community infighting and ridicule from the outside. People rightfully are disgusted when victims are called frauds and laughed at. It taints everything.

The enemy is not the victims. The minute the community started targeting victims as much or more than the elites you know we’re being misdirected.

This has been there MO since sandy hook.

Your spot on, the media has even used than angle of shamming.

This. So much this. I wish everyone would wake up. We are heading (globally not just the USA) in a very bad direction. And the way they get away with it is misinformation, and publicly shaming/discrediting anyone talking any kind of truth or sense.

We are in for some dark times.

OP what are your thoughts on and or rebuttal to the above comments?

u/Inietai27 I know you are a young age and most likely did not mean to do this intentionally, but if you are going to post in this sub you need to back up your points. Otherwise you are just creating noise here and helping people distract the community from quality posts.

Might be buried but did this post have an SS?

The FBI has been known to find someone easily manipulated and coax them along. I could imagine if they were tipped off about him they could be lying that they "did nothing"

Not to bring back the ghosts of 1898, but I thought it was agreed after the fact (i.e war with Spain) that the USS Maine likely sank due to internal spontaneous combustion of its coal bunker.

No, its not agreed.

So what's the alternative hypothesis? The Cubans did it? How? I'm asking honestly..

A naval board of inquiry concluded that the blast was caused by a mine placed outside the ship. Lots of people go with this. Even on this, some claim it was an act of self sabotage in order to justify war with Spain, while others say it was actually done by the Spanish.

There have been a lot of books based on researching the incident with various conclusions, including the one you mentioned, but no "agreed" to settled explanation, except perhaps in HS textbooks.

Exactly, did FBI knowingly ignore the tips?

Absolutely. Just like the kid who turned himself into the FBI and then went on to shoot up the airport in Florida unabated. It's right in front of our faces, but people are too scared to even think about it.

Did certain parties nudge it along, or (purposely) allow it to happen? That is what determines if this is a false flag or not.

and its a tinfoil hat theory if this is your first thought - and is an assumption you are looking to believe.

I have no idea what is what anymore. I keep seeing these "drills" that occur during tragedies, and that is what makes me suspect of this one. There's no doubt a mental case could shoot up a school or anywhere for that matter.

Unfortunately, you’re probably not alone.

Just throwing in as a regular reader of this sub who doesn’t believe the “crisis actor” narratives.

My only conspiracy theory on this one is that the FBI was planning on setting him up like that other retard from a few years ago, but fucked up and didn't keep tabs on him when he went through with it while they were waiting on a better time to trap him.

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/oklahoma-city-bomb-sting_us_5993c045e4b04b19336162fd

Here's my overly cynical view of this sub. /r/Conspiracy is part of Reddit and, as part of that system, people have an implicit desire to seek rewards that the system has to offer. Each sub is a marketplace of ideas and, as conspiracies go, there is a certain limitation in terms of good content because, well, there are only so many conspiracies and it's not like someone can provide "original content" for conspiracies in the same way that someone can create original content in other subs. Sure, you can have new videos or theories about conspiracies, but it's considerably more difficult finding new conspiracies and related content than in other subs. So, that creates a rush to be the first to post about anything that could be a conspiracy to reap the sweet internet validation--it creates a culture of looking for conspiracies in every conceivable place in order to fit into the crowd, to benefit from the niche. And that's not saying that what people find or post are wrong (however you define that), but /r/conspiracy definitely breeds a culture of looking for conspiracies wherever someone can find them. The Florida shooting is just one instance--stick around the sub and literally any time there is an act of mass violence in the U.S., someone will inevitably try to connect the conspiratorial dots and how it's somehow a false flag...because /r/conspiracy is a niche and people want content in that niche, so there's a feedback loop in creating content for that niche.

I'm not sure if that makes a lick of sense, but that's where my heads been at since this whole mess happened recently.

Fuck, I did until I saw the videos of the kids saying that an active shooter drill was held the same day and that the police would be firing blanks.

There are too many anomalies. Also, think about how easy it would be to take advantage of someone like that. No parents, mental illness, no one to look out for him. And most importantly the gov has done this before.

Too many people giving their opinion, connecting dots that are not there. If I believe a conspiracy, imma read/watch anything to support my way of thinking.

IDK there was the thing about the FBI visiting his house 30 times in the month before.

If that doesn't scream suspicious, nothing does.

Not the FBI, Broward police

From what I've been reading, people don't think it's a false flag so to speak but that crises actors are being used to push an agenda. I.e. Gun ban vs health care issues.

The story is either gross or willful neglect on account of the school, local police, and the fbi, or that some agency out there is using tips as a way to target individuals to be pushed over the edge.

Why the 911 style drill on the day?

I was 95% certain that this was an unorchestrated event. Then, out of nowhere, the improbable started stacking up.

In a staged event: 1. It is typical for central figures to have a criminal history that can be used to control their actions. Does David have a criminal record? Was the shooter on the FBI's radar? 2. It is typical for there to be drills before the event. Were their drills for this event? 3. It is typical for central figures to have a connection to the FBI. There are only 35k FBI in the US, out of 320 million people. That's one in a thousand. Does David have any family in the FBI? 4. It is typical for CNN to focus on a few witnesses, out of hundreds? Did that happen? Have we seen the same people over and over? 5. It is typical for central figures to ignore the pharma connections and focus on gun control. Did that happen? In a country where a majority of people are pro-gun, did anyone who was interviewed say, "We wish we had armed security or armed teachers to deal with this menace"? 6. References to Sandy Hook and Columbine are a MUST. Did that happen? 7. It is typical that no one cries or loses their shit (anger). In my High School, a person died in a drunk driving accident, and a quarter of the students were either apoplectic or bawling. Do these kids seem like they went through a school shooting?

I think it is correct to question this event, now.

Shill

I'm not sure what's going on. Why were they having a drill and they were told cops would be firing blanks? Or people would be taken out of stretchers--but still, it's just a drill? There's something a little off about this. It almost seems like they ignored the Cruz kid on purpose, though, doesn't it? I'm waiting for more proof of what happened to make up my mind. I just don't know. I think there's something hinky going on here. But it could just be that a mentally ill kid was ignored to give someone the talking points they desired. I mean, a kid hearing voices--think how easy it would be to manipulate that kid. One of the other kids interviewed even mentioned he would do whatever someone asked of him--either part of his mental illness or he was so desperate for a friend.

No one was told cops would be firing blanks.

I don’t understand the point of making a thread on a conspiracy board to say you don’t believe a conspiracy to be true. We just going to post all the things that happen around the world and in the news that we don’t think to be “conspiracy”?

Nikolas Cruz isn't in jail and is playing one of the actors calling for gun control. You are all being fooled by actors! The false flags will continue if you people keep falling for them! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g8d9x1C7O9Y

So even if one were to believe this is a false flag or a hoax or whatever....that video you offered is literally the worst proof ever. That was the most nonsensical bullshit I’ve ever seen. Half of it made no sense, and if his whole point was the moles on the face....the facial ones sure are lacking on the courtroom photo and he convieniently didn’t zoom in on said photo to show those facial moles. Try harder next time.

How many "false flags" are you people going to call before you realize that the big bad government hasn't actually done anything as a result of them? If anything wouldn't it make more sense that the NRA or gun manufacturers are the ones responsible? I mean the gun laws have actually gotten weaker and sales jump every single time there is a mass shooting. But that doesn't fit the narrative.

People here are willing to make the biggest leaps in order to arrive at a predetermined conclusion.

This is a sad place full of people who want to feel special.

I think he was a mentally insane kid and he was on pharmaceutical drugs that probably did more harm than good.

Weather someone influenced him or not, that is another question.

Just MHO.

Posted this in another comment, but I wanted to drop it in the main as well and get y'alls thoughts.

My real, real hunch here is that some fake broadcasts are being put up as well. That would be a play. All this shit flies onto the internet unverified through social media, news outlets pick it up in their frenzy for ratings and those pictures become canonized into the event. Wouldn't take much for a bad actor to start the narratives about crisis actors or fake a CNN broadcast. These events are a known vulnerability in our culture, we become extremely easy to manipulate while we process our grief and disbelief.

That's what I'd be doing if it was my job to fuck up a country. Worth thinking about at least.

This post needs Clark Pest Control.

Why are you here then?

Well look it does not help that the four spokes children made to be the leaders of this attempt at taking away other American's civil liberties are one white male/female, a black girl and androgynous queer multi racial zhe. Dressed in hip teen fashions and a make up job that makes them look about ready to do a photoshoot.

They have made these four look so perfect for a ready made production they have triggered the uncanny valley effect in millions of people. That in turn is driving people to start making up conspiracy theories.

For the record I do not believe its a false flag, hoax, or any other term as you said in your text. However you would be disingenuous to tell me this is not a production run by Gun Control groups and the News Media enablers at this point going forward. Brian Williams interviewed one young person who did not support taking people's firearms and that only happened because MSNBC was desperate for someone to go on the air and he surprised him.

Want to bet how often you will be seeing children who do not support gun control now compared to the ones being pushed into the front of the media storm that support gun control?

I find it weird that these types of events always bring top level/"hot" page submissions from people who have never commented or posted in this subreddit before.

I am all for having an organic conversation about the merits and falsities of a theory, but I felt like I needed to point out this observation.

Note: I am not accusing OP of pushing a narrative. Occam's Razor leads me to believe that these types of events bring new people to this sub. At the same time, I think it is good to be aware of post histories when national narrative's are being set, and public policy is being pushed.

He was a product of MKUltra

How the hell is this garbage post so upvoted?

I mean, I know how it is, but come on!? It’s like you’re all not even trying to be subversive anymore.

Tl;dr: DAE in this CONSPIRACY SUBREDDIT, think this highly suspect and repetitive narrative is completely above suspicion?

What a fucking joke this place has become. Literally buzzing with inorganic activity since this shooting.

This sub itself has become nothing but a battleground for shills and bots trying to push whatever political issue.

How tf’s your TL;DR gonna be longer than your actual post lmao.

It’s a tl;dr for the op, not my comment.

This was OP's first ever post to this sub as well..

It has proven to be above substantive, well-reasoned suspicion thus far, so I guess it depends on your standards and self-image.

You are not the only one, no.

The difference in coverage between this and the Vegas shooting are tonally different. The optics are more clear in this most recent one, no weird cloud hanging over it.

Not the only one. Don't think there is any real conspiracy with the Florida shooting. Its people wanting to believe so much they invent things. And some unscrupulous agents with an agenda are getting involved now that there are active attempts to discredit one of the kids after this march on Washington protest announced.

Nope this sub is just full of morons grasping at straws to make themselves feel smart and like they uncovered some grand mystery

The event is real, but the immediate popping up of 15 media slick, camera ready, diverse teenage kids who can give speeches on gun control policy seems a bit shady ...

I mean news outlets would pick the ones deemed more attractive to parade around as survivors doesn't mean it didn't happen also I'm pro 2 but it seems both this sub and cringeanarchy have fallen to a sissy fit over one of the kids wanting better gun laws then just thoughts and prayers.

No, you are not alone.

I'm with you, at least to an extent. I think it was just a six kid who couldn't make it in a sick culture that just snapped, like many kids do, although the growing severity is alarming. I mostly keep out of it though. The ones looking into hoax/FF leads are here for the same reason I am, so there's no good reason to poo-poo their investigations.

The problem is that there is an organized machinery that moves in RIGHT AFTER a crisis, and either invents stories from scratch or coaches people there. So you have a real crisis, but at the same time you have these idiots who are so fake and obvious, that people start wondering, wait a second.... what's going on here, and the low hanging fruit is that it's a conspiracy.

Now, This might have been real, but you can't look at Sandy Hook videos and think those people were NOT actors.

So either way, we're left with the REAL conspiracy which is, who is organizing these massive events RIGHT AFTER a crisis like this happens. Obviously people like GEORGE SOROS and his SON.

I agree with you and it hurts credibility of conspiracy theorists because I still need to know what happened in Vegas. Don't just assume somethings a false flag until theres shit that makes absolutely no sense.

Definitely mentally ill. But the FBI were aware of it but didn't do anything about it and now people clamouring for gun control which is good for the FBI.

If he was a Muslim mentally insane kid, he'd be a terrorist

It boggles my mind that we can have people doing terrorism in this country and they aren't considered terrorists because they're pale.

Li mean terrorist get labeled cause their attacks are politically driven I just think the kid is a piece of shit

He supposedly has autism dude. You think people with mental disorders are pieces of shit? At best, society failed him and then called him a monster.

But it doesn't matter, because the whole thing stinks just like every other mass casualty event in the news. It's amazing people still fall for this shit.

Not saying he's shitty over his mental health I'm saying he's shitty cause theirs lots of people with mental health issues and they don't shoot up their schoold

Do you understand what mental health issues even means?

Yes, Muslims who shoot up places tend to do so for terrorist organizations and their religion. What’s your point?

This is just another bullshit white guilt argument.

My point is, if he happened to be Muslim and he didn't do it for religious reasons, but he did it because he was mentally disturbed, they would still spin it as a terrorist act. But since he's a white guy, like every other white mass murderer, they only have mental issues.

Not the closet gay dude in Florida who just so happened to be Muslim. He used his religion as an excuse to cover up the fact he was a raging homo who couldn't live with himself anymore

Why couldn’t he live with himself anymore? Maybe because of... his religion?

More like his culture and an embarrassment to his family. If he cared about his religion he wouldn't be drinking alcohol and going to gay clubs on the side. His religion was just an excuse he used. Guy was a raging homo who couldn't handle living a lie anymore. Either way, all the shootings are from terrorists no matter what they're excuses are; everyone is a terrorist

I’m saying his religion was the source of his misery. He knew how anti-gay Islam is.

No, obviously you're not alone in that belief, but this is the conspiracy subreddit, a place designed to be a hub of conversation centering around questioning the common narrative. The common narrative is exactly as you described, so why would we fill this subreddit with more of the same shit everyone else is saying when this place is designed to be exactly not that?

Lol then why are you posting here

At this point I suspect this is just a mentally broken guy that shoot up a school. I think at this point the liberal media had a plan of action as soon as the "next one" happened and are pushing harder for gun regulations.

There is slipping through the cracks and then you have a complete failure of the system for years across many contact points. Will see what kind of meds he might of been on but I suspect he will plead insanity which might actually be the right call here even though the actions are terrible.

I got to agree. I also believe that drugs may have played a role. The side effects can be very dangerous.

It was a straight Hoax. Footage of the "survivors" practicing lines. Contradicting stories, Exercises and drills scheduled the same day, DEMOLISHING the building/crime scene. This event hits every check box for Hoax.

No, you are not the only person who doubts a conspiracy here, obviously. But the fact that you needed to make a thread (and it's somehow top post) despite this sub traditionally being about open-mindedness and exploring all possible outcomes --- well something here just stinks.

Threads like this make the whole situation more sus. The brigading is at an all-time-high and completely transparent.

My question as an American isn't whether or not it was a hoax or a charade or an insane kid. I'ts what the result is going to be after.

If the kid had mental health problems, then perhaps we need to look into the cause of that and how we can identify the signs of a troubled teen earlier. Or maybe we should concentrate on security measures at schools or public buildings. I don't think that these logical, and possible solutions to preventing tragedies like Florida from happening again will be the flagship, Mainstream, consensual result. I personally think citizen gun ownership will take the hit, and as an American who's rights are in a constant state of limbo and erosion I would like to see a more intelligent and thoughtful proposition...

I'm sure that's exactly what happened.

The real conspiracy is revealed in what happened afterwards.

Am I the only that remembers Robbie Parker laughing and the total shitshow that was Paddock/Vegas incident?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O43REmjUnLg

When ppeople say False flag I think they mainly mean a self inflicted wound that was intentional. The FBI didn't stop this kid, that's a false flag how ever you cut it. If I said the same shit he did right now on reddit, I'd have a microscope so far up my ass they would hear my breathe. They would follow me around, Try it, Say what he did and see how long til you notice you're being followed.

This is a Conspiracy sub for god sake. How the hell we allowed all these anti conspiracy users and posts to hijack this sub?

You could probably just talk in a closet if you are looking for an echo chamber.

Absolutely not. Everything I've been reading about the guy points clearly to him being a person that is a danger to himself and others, and should have been adjudicated mentally defective, barring him from passing NICS. For some reason things never got that far though, and now we have this.

I don't think it's mutually exclusive that a person can be mentally insane AND that the CIA or whoever can use their devices to tip him over the edge.

I do agree this one feels a little bit different.

I don't care who did it or why, but it's asinine to talk gun bans when people hate the world so much they want to kill themselves and take a ton of others with them. Guns don't do that, and banning guns doesn't prevent that.

No. It's disgusting how people could think this was a government action. Same as the Sandy Hook deniers or the 9/11 truthers.

The conspiracy is that all events are conspiracy. None are actually just crazy people doing evil things. Wrap your head around that.

Along with Vegas being a false flag, no video recording of him, and he got all of those weapons up there without being noticed?

You're going to make that statement and you've never been to Vegas? That's pretty sad.

One of the victims of Sandy Hook was one of my best friends.

Just sayin.

Feels a bit shilly in here, better put on a sweater.

When you look at all the evidence compiled against the official narrative, it makes sense to believe something different happened. Multiple kids saying the administration told them there would be blanks used. Multiple people reporting more than one gunman. Not to even mention the kids they use for these interviews are actors. Its all a show, the media is allowed to use weaponized propaganda against the citizens. Thats legal now (Thanks obama).

Youre not the only one who believes that, but you are limiting yourself because you stopped asking relevant questions, like why are multiple kids saying school admin told them there would be blanks used? Why is the David Hogg kid interviewing a girl in the MIDDLE of the shooting? wtf? Why is David Hogg rehearsing lines for the news and being fed lines by the guy off camera? I could go on and on.

Conspiracies are like religions - people have to have faith in something. To some it is a great and all powerful government without incompetence.

The idea that some random people can take a jet and nock down tall buildings. . is too scary to be believed

the idea that some kid, mad that his mom spent to much time at a school, shot up a bunch of 5-6 year olds is too horrible to believe

this goes on and on and on

For some its easier to have faith in a great and controlling comfort of a government where nothing bad happens, unless the government says so

that is a odd form of comfort. . .and not entirely rationale in my book

This kid, like the others, is a bit deranged but probably sane. he had access to a lot of weapons. He bought ammo without anyone noticing. A Uber driver $#@$ dropped him off at the school with his bags of guns.

It is scary to some that can happen

better to blame the govt.

Let’s see what Ben Swann has to say about it. Nope sounds suspicious https://youtu.be/vVws4ohBHH8

To be frank, I'm willing to concede that America has a mental health problem, disguised as a gun problem.
But, if you aren't willing to concede to that, I might as well put the Overton window between this and false flag, because that's what I've seen other do, in the opposite direction.

So, it's somewhere between a mental health issue, or, we'll start looking for the connection between those murders, and the other from the Clintons.

Not one inch anymore, BAMN, right?

This post having 400+ upvotes while anything else posted in this sub struggles to get 10 have me believing the opposite of what you claim.

Propaganda is legal now. This literally means they can make propaganda movies. That look real. That aren't. AI has the ability to make faces of people who do not exist. A few documents online here and there and boom you have victims. I'm not saying this is what happened, because with all the gaslighting how are we supposed to know? One thing I do know is these kids being prepared to get on their soapbox almost instantaneously, doesn't bode well for the this is real narrative, which seems to be on this sub for some reason.

The fact that this post was so highly upvoted on this sub is disturbing.
There's a whole lot of people here who don't belong here.
People who can't be bothered to do even the bare minimum of research into why the legitimacy/authenticity of these events is questioned.

I believe it was very real. I also believe someone slightly altered some things to make the outcome much worse.

Not mentally insane. Opposite.

I fully believe the events at that school happened. What I don’t believe is the story we are told in the news. We never get the full story. We are never told the full truth. MSM is too powerful of a tool for nobody to use it to their advantage. I believe first hand accounts and police chatter when things are going down and then come to my own conclusions.

Add in SSRI

It always disturbs me when I get post replies from accounts that are literally hours or less old. I got one today in reply to a posting about a local police shooting, even though my post was pretty neutral.

Maybe its a group of people who instinctively see any shooting as a danger to their right to own a weapon, and so go about finding the best story that fits their narrative which justifies their ownership of a firearm, or at least paints the event as designed to help take away that ownership.

LOL! Snopes? Try again.

They always use the multiple shooter thing to discredit the false flag

I swear after every mass shooting, I see a flood of posters I don't recognize coming to push the idea that the shooting was a false flag.

Funny, for me it's the opposite.

Of course, the vast vast vast vast majority of people also agree.

Now what makes you say that or are you just pulling that statistic out of your ass.

Not the ENTIRE thing. I am not suggesting people weren't killed.

What on earth are you talking about? That's nonsense.

One party is actively trying to find solutions to this.

The other thinks repeatedly sending "thoughts and prayers" will magically fix it. That is "nutjobbery."

This is factually true. Most people in America do not want to lose their constitutional rights. However, most people in America also want higher restrictions on guns. This article has links to Pew and NPR studies on multiple topics like it.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.businessinsider.com/americans-gun-control-beliefs-las-vegas-shooting-polls-surveys-2017-10

You're fucking retarded. Nobody thinks a gun did it by itself you clown. That's what exactly zero people mean when they say that.

This is rich.

User claiming the “shooting is authentic” is accusing brigadiers of pushing a false flag/hoax narrative!

Are we taking crazy pills now? Is this sub not called r/conspiracy ?

We’re literally living in 1984.

Absolutely it's also a problem within lower income families going without a father figure can ruin good people

Show me the security video.

It would be very simple to dispel all the conjecture. Just show the security camera footage. Don't want to show the footage? Well, this will cause me to doubt you because you have the footage but refuse to show it.

Yeah, people who say “it would have weighed a lot” have never picked up an AR. Mine weighs 8.2 lbs unloaded. Let’s raise that to 9 for Paddock’s ARs, cause they had longer barrels and those bump stocks are heavier than Magpul MOEs. So, figure 9 lbs per Paddock rifle. 3 of them in one suitcase and he’s not even clearing 30 lbs. Two smallish suitcases on a luggage dolly, and wham bam thank ya m’am, he has six AR-15’s in his room. Two trips and he has 12. Four trips over the course of 3 hours, which f-king no one would notice, especially in the damn service elevator, and there ya go.

OP what are your thoughts on and or rebuttal to the above comments?

u/Inietai27 I know you are a young age and most likely did not mean to do this intentionally, but if you are going to post in this sub you need to back up your points. Otherwise you are just creating noise here and helping people distract the community from quality posts.

you're right, there was multiple shooters but the swat team, police, etc are all covering it up because they have so much to gain by doing so.