Thought for the day: Why didn't anyone care about mass shootings, when it was the Indians who were being wiped out of their land?

23  2018-03-01 by Awesomo3082

I was talking with another user, and I found myself saying how these mass shootings are a "modern" development.

Sure, from the perspective of a white guy like myself, it's easy to say that, but I think I was wrong.

Native Americans have been dealing with mass shootings since before anyone cared about mass shootings. In fact, they got mass "shooted" so often, and for so long, that they pretty much lost everything, with most of them being funneled into rural slums with no hope or future.

In their case it was the government, along with "the church" and business interests that drove them out. Now that the Indians have been thoroughly pacified (cointelpro finished the job), are we just the next demographic on the government's list of people to terrorize and steal from?

Maybe nobody else will care, but I think this thought will keep me occupied for the rest of the day. Here's an incomplete wiki of Indian massacres to get the ball rolling.

38 comments

Yep. They live to go on about their "biggest mass shootings" but conveniently leave out this fun fact. Mass shootings are only ok when it's the government who does it, and especially if they want to round up some fire arms, for your own safety of course!

"THE LARGEST MASS SHOOTING IN US HISTORY HAPPENED December 29,1890. When 297 Sioux Indians at Wounded Knee Creek on the Pine Ridge Indian Reservation in South Dakota were murdered by federal agents & members of the 7th Cavalry who had come to confiscate their firearms “for their own safety and protection”. The slaughter began after the majority of the Sioux had peacefully turned in their firearms. The Calvary began shooting, and managed to wipe out the entire camp. 200 of the 297 victims were women and children.

Wounded Knee was among the first federally backed gun confiscation attempts in United States history. It ended in the senseless murder of 297 people."

Even with dozens (hundreds?) of shootings to pick from, that one is so chilling. Not just that it happened, but it could be tolerated, and even excused away.

The ideology of white supremacy, duh.

That's true. But it's not limited to whites. We have jew-supremacists doing the same exact thing in Palestine. We have Murica-supremacists who cheer on any war we can start in the middle East, Africa, and Asia. It seems that any time people can be convinced there's an "us vs them" scenario, they just lose their god damned minds and act worse than animals. Just look at our sports fans. Raiders fans will stab Broncos fans in the parking lot "just because." (for example). Soccer fans get real psychotic.

Now, we even have people who (half) jokingly advocate "glassing" places like Iraq, Iran, NK, etc. Just because the media told us we're supposed to hate them. It's even come out of the mouths of my own family members. It's disgusting.

People sometimes pretend that white supremacy doesn't exist. But sometimes they also blame only that, and pretend that the other bad forms of "supremacism" aren't existing right now.

But sometimes they also blame only that, and pretend that the other bad forms of "supremacism" aren't existing right now.

Honestly dude, no, they don't. This is extremely rare.

What actually happens is that most people you talk to talk about white supremacy because it's the dominant ideology in the West, and thus has global impacts because of the West's geopolitical position.

I see what you're saying, but there are still lots of blind spots people have, in this area. Black people or Hispanics get executed by police, people (of all colors) blame the victims. In Israel, many of the same ones who consider themselves SJW's can't see the racial oppression of the Palestinians. Westerners of all colors see the evil mooslim terrerists as the cardboard cutout the media makes of them.

White oppression has been the most dominant form of it in recent centuries, and gets more headlines (rightfully), but I think that we have more modern variations that are just as dangerous, and they're not limited to whites.

Not to mention Asians who have oppressed, slaughtered and looked down upon each other for centuries. Pretending white supremacy is the only powerful force of evil in the world is dangerously naive. There's definitely a western vs eastern power struggle going on, with some nations taking advantage of the situation. Will humanity ever unite...

so do they not happen or are they rare, you literally contradicted yourself in the first 2 sentences

Hail to you for actual thought.

There’s always some justifying reason whenever whites commit atrocities unless it’s against other whites.

The people who cared didn't matter in those days (e.g., plebs, natives, and women).

Are you asking why society has changed it's view on what is and isn't acceptable? The Native Americans were being slaughtered at the same time slaves were owned, colonies were a very real thing, and full-scale wars between the worlds superpowers was commonplace.

You're wondering if the government is going to turn around and start slaughtering it's own citicizens? What makes you think that's even close to happening?

Are you purposefully being obtuse?

You just pointed out how this has happened throughout history, then turned around and acting like I'm the one being obtuse for pondering if it could be happening again.

Do you think slavery ended? That nation's aren't at war with each other? That colonies don't still exist? Are you sleepwalking? Changing the names of these old oppressions doesn't mean they just went away. Or do you think that Hatians working for $2 a day is somehow not slavery? I guess it's not, since they could just choose to starve, right...?

Weird...

Nobody said the world is perfect and that these issues don't exist anymore, but they are certainly demonized by the US and the west.

You seem to be ignoring the plethora of human rights laws that were passed between when the US slaughtered Native Americans and today. The West doesn't have the authority/resources to go in and force other countries to follow these advances in human rights, the only thing it can do is give incentives and intervene in extreme cases.

Are you concerned that the government is going to come take your land? That they'll slaughter your family and move you to a work camp?

Human rights laws which are ignored daily by the nations that wrote them. We've exported our most grievous offenses. Our slave labor is exported to China, where they need nets on their buildings just to keep the workers from jumping off. Our wars aren't at home, they're everywhere else we need to spread "freedom". Africa has been pillaged for centuries, and we continue to extract everything we can out of them.

But now we have a pretty lady on the news channel telling us it's alright, so don't worry about it. Just worry about all those evil terrorists and shooters that we need to find and kill in the next country/county.

Would you ask the same ridiculous question of the first Indians who met a pioneer, in the American west? The eradication of the Indians took hundreds of years. There's more of the rest of us, so I'd expect that subduing us would take slightly longer. Maybe it'll take a decade. Maybe another century or two.

But keep up the incredulity. We'll just keep amusing ourselves to death while the noose tightens, and we wake up one day completely helpless to feed, clothe, or even basically take care of ourselves. Maybe our rulers will be kind enough to give us some worthless barren land like they did for the Indians.

Alright, so it sounds like you're in deep with believing the government is conspiring against you/the general public and wants to enslave us all. Don't think I'll be able to reason with you beyond that, so have a nice day.

Alright. Keep on believing that the things that have happened throughout history couldn't possibly happen again. Sounds well reasoned to me.

Have you ever had a thought that the media didn't tell you to have?

If you don't think the elites control the govt and that the govt aims to subjugate us you need to read some primary sources.

It's undeniable that elites control the government, I just don't think there's some grand scheme of 'subjugating' the people - at least in the US federal government (state/local governments may be more susceptible to this).

Cause there was no internet.

Because manifest destiny.

I cared, but I didn't keep a blog back then.

I’m pretty sure a lot of ppl are against what the Americans did when they came and took the land of the natives. They brought disease, beat them, raped, did horrible things. I don’t think we’ve ever excused that part just like slavery. It was a black eye in our development as America.

It hasn’t been brought up as much as school shootings bc well I mean this happened recently and slavery and us taking over were much longer. I mean look at Vegas, the worst modern shooting in history that happened a few months ago is just a faint story every few weeks(not even that often). It was only a story for like 2 weeks, now pretty much forgotten.

We like to jump on what’s current is my guess. The problem is a lot more threats are happening, it seems to be more and more often now.

When I was in school during columbine, it felt like a rare occurrence and really wouldn’t happen again.

Nowadays it feels like a real possibility a shooting(not just school) can happen at any time. When we took over the land many were savagely killed, but it also took a colony to take over. Nowadays give one man a gun and he can hurt 600 ppl with 50+ dead included in that number.

The dehumanization of those who are sitting on top of what you want dates back to biblical times and before.

or drone attacks

I think it's because that was so long in the past that some (myself unfortunately included) think it's an irrelevant topic to bring up. I can't say I'm happy that those things happen, but I am finding it difficult to have empathy on a topic that is so far removed from me it mine as well be "where the fuck were you when the dinosaurs were wiped out!"

I might be a cynic, probably a bit of a dick, but I'm not a bad person. Again, just hard to relate to something that was so far in the past and an event my family had nothing to do with (Polish immigrants)

I’m regretfully in a similar position. Being indigenous Australian (or Aboriginal) my people have suffered many atrocities and still do to this day, albeit on a smaller scale. I constantly wonder why others don’t seem to have empathy for our past struggles. But when I hear about other races and countries’ issues and I unfortunately can’t seem to feel much for them either. Don’t know why, wish I could. It feels like I’m constantly comparing struggles between countries and races so maybe that’s why. I think understanding and empathy are a couple of the keys to world peace.

I never even thought about it like that. In WWII the Axis Powers in the European theater, we have been told (it's hard to trust anything these days) that the Nazis hated THE JEWS (we have all heard it a million fucking times) but you hardly EVER hear about how Poland was also fucked over. It's like, if no one gives a fuck about my ancestors, why should I give a fuck about theirs?

Also, this is in the "im a bit of a dick" category, but the takeover of America from natives to Europeans has been so long ago it's like "hey what are we really supposed to do here?" America has too many humans in one place for anything to really not get divided.

Why do we have school shootings? We have millions of people that's why. There are bound to be some crazies. There are ideas that can be used to prevent violence, but there are just too many people to outright purge it.

I don't think it'd be helpful for people to get all weepy, crying a little tear, or roll on the ground in sorrow. But we should be able to learn from it. At some point, the people supporting this genocide were considered "normal", "sane", "good christians", etc. But they enabled and supported psychotic behavior.

But there seems to be a disconnect for people, in understanding that this kind of stuff used to happen, but can't even process that it could still be going on today, and in their own attitudes. How many people support the crimes we've committed in the middle east? Or our other "pre-emptive" attacks? Or sparking/arming bloody civil wars in South America and other places?

It's not the emotional detachment that's worrisome. It's that people can't even consciously process that they could be participating in or supporting the same exact problem, even now.

Indians care. Why do you automatic not think of them as "anyone"? Is "anyone" supposed to be only people of Europeans descent?

I'm Native American and it's hilarious watching these butthurt losers get more offended than I can even bother to be.

You're a disgrace to your roots.

Probably. The Indians were the first, the blacks seconded, other minorities third, and now who's next?

People forget this is the way of the world. Every population has done this to every other. English to 100s k Irish. Muslims to 150 million African and European. Chinese self cleanse of 60 million. Soviet union self cleanse of 50 million.

20th century alone 262 million by governments https://www.hawaii.edu/powerkills/20TH.HTM

this is ridiculous. this is the same reason why no one cared about vivisection during ealry ages of modern medicine....

it took WWII for humanity to at least start realizing that limits are needed. it was also after this that the eugenics movement took a big hit, and any sort of conversation regarding it taboo among academics

Would the Holocaust have happened if the Jews had a second amendment?

Vikings got there first.

No hashtag.

I see what you're saying, but there are still lots of blind spots people have, in this area. Black people or Hispanics get executed by police, people (of all colors) blame the victims. In Israel, many of the same ones who consider themselves SJW's can't see the racial oppression of the Palestinians. Westerners of all colors see the evil mooslim terrerists as the cardboard cutout the media makes of them.

White oppression has been the most dominant form of it in recent centuries, and gets more headlines (rightfully), but I think that we have more modern variations that are just as dangerous, and they're not limited to whites.

so do they not happen or are they rare, you literally contradicted yourself in the first 2 sentences