This is just how people are conditioned. Israel and Hamas. I have no love for either, but the way people think if you are against party “a” you are automatically for party “b”

Rrrrriiiiight, and Jews haven't turned the full force of the propaganda arm of the government to make themselves look like the good guys. "Conditioned", right. We're breaking the conditioning. Who do you guys think you're fooling.

I agree totally with the Free Palestine thing. What gave you the impression that I didn’t ? Because I don’t support Hamas ?

Yep. Odd, that. A completely new phenomenon. Mostly they've tried to keep this all under wraps, but since that's not working, now they're going with the "well let's be reasonable there's no such thing as a bad guy" route.

The bad guy ? The Israeli government is clearly the bad guy. Does that mean I have to be pro-Hamas automatically ?

I love how this exchange is taking place considering the post's title.

Hamas ?

Fuck. I thought it said “hummus”

Sorry

"Oh no they're not buying it!"

😂

https://i.imgur.com/zJwDwKy.png

What do you think about this, my pro-semitic friend

The majority of my posts here are very critical of our relationship with Israel, so unless you think it's 'part of my disguise' you may need to reconsider your assumptions.

Regardless, I'm not blind to the fact that a key part of asymmetrical warfare is provoking retaliation upon innocents to crucify your opposition in the global press (see Western engagements in Vietnam) so let's not pretend a portion of those deaths weren't sought by the opposition in Palestine. Israel is clearly garbo for their actions and parts of the Palestinian opposition is trash for using innocents to their own ends. Sorry your revolutionary hashtag campaign isn't working out little fella

so let's not pretend a portion of those deaths weren't sought by the opposition in Palestine

I think you're projecting your own semitic tendencies onto an innocent people.

any criticism of Palestinian opposition is Zionist propaganda

I'd love to adopt a worldview that black and white but I'm not that #woke yet 😂

any criticism of Palestinian opposition is Zionist propaganda

Oh, the problem you're having arose because you typed that out rather than quote me directly

My mistake, must have gotten that from the same place you got my pro-Israel stance from 😏

Putting words into other people's mouths≠Inference, friend. I can understand why you would want to imagine so, but alas

And how did you make that inference? Was it because a critical comment was made of Palestinian resistance tactics or did you somehow imagine any part of the comments to be explicitly pro-Israel?

Either way, I'm not going to cosign the actions of the Palestinian resistance and you seem to refuse to believe I'm not typing these comments out on my iDreidel X so we seem to be stuck here.

Was it because a critical comment was made of Palestinian resistance tactics

Yeah you got it, champ. First try, too. Knew you had it in you.

That's why they call me 'champ' 💪🏼

Free Palestine? I’ll take it. calls Israel “I have something you might want...”

It'll cost you...that's right, all the matzo

Did you know that matzo has been made with the blood of male gentiles under the age of 7, and that this had been going on for millenia? It is the direct cause of 100+ of their 400+ expulsions from host nations.

I don't like Israel but that is literally one of the oldest anti-semitic accusations placed on Jews and one that doesn't even adhere to Kosher dietary restrictions.

Yes, that is the narrative they would like you to believe, but you should read this incredibly suppressed book, written by an academic Rabbi no less, detailing the history of Jewish blood sacrifice.

In addition to, or in the place of the book, you should watch this documentary detailing the same, but in a more approachable way https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ynce_945vl4 It's called Darkness Visible, and finding a working copy is very hard, so if you like it, you should save it.

Here is a brief summary (as brief as can be), of some of the more famous cases, many of which resulted in the entirety of the Jewish population being expelled from whichever host nation they were then preying upon.

If you really want an esoteric treat, check out this OC of mine detailing exactly how the mythos of vampirism arose in Eastern Europe, and why it was a result of Jewish immigration to the area at the same time. http://archive.is/Ugm66#selection-1653.0-1653.231

That should just about dispel the false notions you've been taught, and it's ok that you have them, but now you don't have to fall victim to propaganda any longer, so, happy day!

Enjoy :)

I'm not the kind of person who changes their mind based on the last thing they read so no, your sources will probably not dispel any "notions", but I will be looking into their credibility.

but I will be looking into their credibility.

Please do so with all the earnestness you are able to muster!

Also, it is bad form to downvote a person who is trying to help you. :(

It's not a "narrative". I have a formal Jewish education. Consuming blood of any kind (except, oddly, fish blood) is prohibited under Jewish law. A significant part of the procedure for making meat kosher is getting all the blood out.

Of course, you'll probably just call me a lying shill.

Nah. Of course they wouldn't teach this in Jewish schools. It's not something that every Jew engages in. The most evil people in the entire world hide behind your religion and you need to take some time to seriously the consider the truth within the statement "until good [blank] stand against bad [blank], there are no good [blank]", because once the world at large becomes aware of this in full, they will want to be able to tell the good from the bad, but if you don't give them any way to, well, you run the risk of being the baby thrown out with the bathwater, to put it in a nice way.

Any Jews who engage in the behavior you describe are heretics and liable for the death penalty under Jewish law.

Yes, and in any system of law the world over, for good reason. I think you skipped most of my earlier reply.

It's not something that every Jew engages in. The most evil people in the entire world hide behind your religion and you need to take some time to seriously consider the truth within the statement "until good [blank] stand against bad [blank], there are no good [blank]", because once the world at large becomes aware of this in full, they will want to be able to tell the good from the bad, but if you don't give them any way to do so, then, well, you run the risk of being the baby thrown out with the bathwater, to put it in a nice way.

Hey buddy, where'd you link my replies to? I wanna go see what your friends had to say.

I didn’t link them.

Oh come now

It’s run-of-the-mill anti Semitic bullcrap on r/conspiracy.

Oh come now

Nevermind I found it. https://www.reddit.com/r/Drama/comments/88xocx/theyre_on_to_us/dwoloys/?context=3

Tisk tisk

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Wasn’t me. I mean, if you really want, I could repost this to r/isrconspiracyracist or something.

sure sure pal

Fine. You got me. I denied that I'd reposted it when in fact I had using an alt. Also, in between talking to you, I've murdered eight hundred children and drunk their blood while it was still warm, because I'm Jewish, and therefore I'm pure evil.

bahahahaha ok

Removed. Rule 6.

Ah, there's a name I'm not familiar with. Hello, new mod.

I’m against anyone that mistreats another person without good reason to. Israel seem to be repeat offenders of this. I don’t hate Jews. I hate bad people. A lot of Israelis right now are coming off as really bad people.

I have only meet four Israelis outside Israel, and all four were sexual harassers (two straight rape).

Two were at professional conferences and had to be flown back.

Jews might be great people, but Israelis seem to be shitty human beings.

Then again, I seem to have only met the worst four imaginable.

Yes, there are groups of Jews against Zionism. They beleive that they should not have a homeland until their messiah returns.

I'm not talking about just (ultra) orthodox,

I'm talking about American 'liberal-Jews'.

Jews by ethnicity who dont believe in ethno-nationalism.

Jews who dont need collective belief systems to see, as an individual, that Israel is EVIL. Who can call themselves Jewish and consider themselves something else, just as any other American can call themselves, polish-American/German-american/African-american.

To be honest with you, it's specifically duel-citizens with a history of 'all-jew' youth camps; there is fucked up ethno-national shit taught there.

kids raised (only) with fellow Americans, low and behold, think like most fellow Americans.

We agree on all of this.

The Harvey Weinstein and Dan Schneiders.

OMG, it must be cultural or something.

never thought about that, but they all (in Hollywood) seem to be Jewish pedos. Or, at least, its a lot of jewish pedos in hollywood.

Weinstein was using Israeli spies referred to him by the former Isreali PM to track and attack his victims.

IfNotNow.org

Way to make a generalization of an entire country based on 4 interactions.

go anyplace, meet four people of any type, and tell me if they all get removed from the country from sexual harassment or rape.

if you cant get 4/4, I think my personal assessment stands.

They seem like horrible people. If they can say thins about Palestinians, I ca n say it about Israelis. Fuck them.

Legit question - where do you live to have only come into contact with 4 israelis in your life?

There is only 7 million Israelis.

I have lived in the USA, Serbia, Canada, and Italy.

There is 345 million Americans, X-million Serbians, etc.

A fraction of 7/400 +/- million people is not hard to believe.

Now, the fact I have only met shitty human beings from that country. All men. That's something to think about.

Yikes. Stormfront much?

what part of the his argument do you not agree with?

The whole "have you ever met a Rabbi" thing is blatantly anti-Semitic. If I said that about an imam, priest, etc I'd be called a bigot, and rightly so. I'm all for criticizing Israel but it took about 2 comments for this devolve into criticizing Jews.

Lol sorry you have no power here.

I am a moron - trying to reason with anyone on a conspiracy subreddit.

How are the women ? They kinda look hot... But are they normal ?

In your mum's pussy. What a fucking retarded question.

I love you :)

Send boob pics with today's newspaper.

Many tourist destinations have signs that say no Israelis because they have committed crimes from rape and murder to vandalism to attacking other guests randomly.

Citation please

Citations? Bitch you've been watching too much internet arguments.

I love watching innernette argument!

So why in the world are you generalizing all Israelis as "shitty"? wtf

they are.

I have never met a good one. Also, fuck them all. They are horrible people who think horrible things, and do horrible things.

You’ve met four Israelis... and you’re saying “I’ve never met a good one.” Then you say “also, fuck them all.”

Gtfo dude. This is incredibly shitty. I’ve been to Israel, Palestine, and Jordan and all three places i had interactions with generally good people. The ONLY bad encounter I had there was with a group of the locals (can’t remember the name off hand) at Petra in Jordan. They weren’t Jewish or Israeli, either. Yet my interaction with them doesn’t make me think they all suck.

He stated many other reasons for his opinion. You just don't like his opinion.

Just because you met some bad Israelis doesn't mean all millions of Israelis are the same. Wtf.

Because fuck you.

Contrary to that: I used to work security at a mall and the dead sea cosmetics people were all Israeli (Cept one) and they were all good people. A little pushy when it came to selling their product but that's to be expected.

My point is your anecdote is just that. An anecdote. As is mine of course.

Dude, the two that raped my friend worked at a mall kiosk.

Damn. That's rough. I'm sorry that happened. :(

(Note: Yeah the dead sea Cosmetics is an Israeli company and its kind of like a working vacation thing. They get a job and go sell the stuff somewhere.)

Damn. That's rough. I'm sorry that happened. :(

Yeah. I dated her for a while after, because im stupid and try to help people, and fell for her the more she talked about her life.

It was strange, and her bad habits started to direct upon me. The drinking and depression. She actually left me after I brought up seeing a therapist for her issues.

Time heals all things. I suppose my anger could diminish with time as well, if I allowed such. She was the one carrying the trauma after all.

SO, thanks for taking me down a Socratic path towards helping me realize im holding onto hate.

I'm glad I helped a little. :)

So go to the police and smack them with an international arrest warrant.

Have you considered that in fact it is all mall kiosk workers who are rapists?

So what's you fucking point ?

2 citizens don't represent a country of 6M.

They do when they're presidents.

The core choice of evil is to prefer you and/or your own over others instead of being fair when there are conflicts of interest.

Every race and religion has evil people. I think both of these countries have evil people in power, but also have good people in power leading them. Unfortunately the line between them gets blurred.

By not letting tens of thousands of people, organized by Hamas, crash their border?

their border?

You have not been paying attention.

There's always another side of the story.

How rational would you be if you had weekly rockets flying into your neighborhood?

Both sides suck. You can't blame one and not blame the other.

both sides fight and act like by not supporting them, you agree with the other.

sounds familiar

very much so.

The BBC just had the Israeli ambassador on in the UK, but no Palestinian representation to tell their side. Sad really as much as blatant agenda pushing.

The BBC just had the Israeli ambassador on in the UK, but no Palestinian representation to tell their side.

as usually

It's all the Abrahamic Desert-Slaughterer Sun-God Shtick. A pox on all their houses. All of them practice:
1. Group punishment
2. Generational curses
3. Collective guilt.

The Old Testament curse, pretty much.

The conflict isn't about religion it's about land as usual. The Jews could be Christians and the Pals pagan and it would still be the same story of the conqueror vs the conquered.

Without 'religion', there wouldn't be millions of "Christians United for Israel"; although I agree that Israel and its enablers are acting like colonizers. No colonizer from Warsaw, Khazaria, Moscow or New York has or ever had any claim to the "Mideast" except for the God they say 'promisied' it to 'them'.

What's the difference between Israel and any number of New World colonies, claimed "in the name of God" by Dutch, Spaniards or Englishmen?

CUFI is the result of the Israeli Tourism industry encouraging them, "Do the Holy Land Tour!" It's the same indoctrination tour as the Birthright trips for American Jews - there were no "Christian Zionists" until a few decades ago. It's basically a huge scam. Turn to any Christian TV channel, it's 24/7 begging for donations to Israel, "lost" Ethiopian Jews, impoverished Russian Jews, etc. It's all coming from one place and it's not America.

...then they ought to be registered as an agent of a foreign government.

Well, yeah, so should AIPAC. All of these entities trace to the same place though, the Israeli gov.

You forgot to add genital mutilation.

What about this thing I've heard about incest in some mountains in Europe ?

I think I missed that one...

Why should we be against Hamas? An enemy of an enemy is a friend.

An enemy of an enemy is a friend.

That's what they thought about Stalin while he was killing a tens of millions of his own.

I got banned from the labour uk party sub for calling out Israel, you literally can't say shit about zionists or the state any more without being called an anti semite

You gotta reckon the jews in the labor party are shielding themselves by creating draconian speech laws. Its a shame.

Ain't that true that jews ruin everything they touch?

Are you saying that the Jewish debate is irrelevant to 99% of the British people?

Yes.

Don't translate small insults into what you think of as "big words". It comes off really cringey.

What in the ever loving fuck are you talking about?

The spirit through which you all most regularly express yourselves gives you away.

every single person I know sees this BS for what it is. A smear on Corbyn... u know like the terrorist, communist, spy smears b4. Corbyn has spent his life campaigning for equal rights, human rights, nuclear disarmament etc. Sure you might dislike him and his policies but ask yourself who do you think has the good of the people at heart? The dude that has spent his entire life trying to get a better shake for the normal joe in the street and pushes talk and diplomacy over war or the millionaire elite of the current tory front bench.

There is no Jewish debate in the UK at least not like the US, and if we allow this Zionist propaganda and manufactured outrage to continue we will run the very real risk of ending up like US politicians that are unable to ever speak out about the shit Isreal gets up too without being called anti-semites.

There is no Jewish debate in the UK at least not like the US, and if we allow this Zionist propaganda and manufactured outrage to continue we will run the very real risk of ending up like US politicians that are unable to ever speak out about the shit Isreal gets up too without being called anti-semites.

I say let it happen. Every single time they decry valid criticism as "anti-semitism", the word comes yet another step closer to being synonymous with "being alive".

Also, isn't it illegal in the UK? Questioning Jews, that is.

nah it's not illegal, although at this rate who the fuck knows. If the Tories get their way we'll all be bio-tagged before 2 long :)

ha no worries my dude. We'll fix this one way or another. Can you feel it in the air? The lion is growing restless.

problem is people would rather vote for millionaire Tory criminals because they all think JC is some sort of Communist/terrorist instead of a dude that spent his life campaigning to improve peoples lives and advocating diplomacy over war.

If May gets her way we'll be logging our own internet activity and daily itinerary and mailing it directly to GCHQ. Obviously, I exaggerate but slippery slopes and all that.

Slippery slopes indeed. They tend to wake people up, though, and so I focus on that because yeah, like you see too, shit is going to hell quickly lol

Man, good luck to you guys over there!

It's more like 99,5%, but who's counting ...?

JIDF, apparently.

Yes, it is a shame. I agree with legal liability for those who call for violence against any ethnicity or race, but jailing people for expressing doubts about the holocaust or expelling people from a major party for being critical of the actions of people of certain ethnicity? wtf.

banned from world news and news.

The censorship is what reinforced the notion, there is sick shilling going on, and it's NOT for Palestinians.

Exactly. Guess we know their new angle. "Th-they're both bad guys! No, I'm not sweating. You're sweating!"

Be careful if you are in the UK, because you can get charged with a speech crime.

It’s the same thing in Germany. They passed / extended a law a few months ago that basically says it’s illegal to criticise the state of Israel. If you do criticise Israel publicly you can be charged with a hate crime.

I got banned from the labour uk party sub

Me too. I called out the witch hunt against Corbyn without mentioning anything about the billboard, and was banned for supporting the billboard I made no mention of. I was responding to an article written by a Jew calling out Labour members who were using the hype to bring down Corbyn. So essentially I was banned for agreeing with an article that went against the chosen narrative.

I also got an instant ban from r/politics for questioning the narrative around the Skripal incident. No warning, just an instant ban.

The reddit forums are being poisoned by shills and astroturfers.

they are really sensitive about that right now because torys are calling them jew haters for not supporting israel (in situations such as when it machineguns protestors)

I hope these are the last gasps of netanyahus regime.

I understand why Palestine does what it does and I support their cause, but this doesn't mean I agree with their actions. There's no good guys in this conflict just different sides.

I mean, I think I support Hamas more than the State of Israel right now. But honest question: besides throwing rocks and launching the odd dumb rocket that doesn't hit anything, what "terrorist" actions has Hamas even been accused of lately? They seem to be the only group helping the Palestinians.

You do realize Hamas rejects peaceful coexistence in its founding documents and calls for Jihad until they control it. Both sides have issues and thatis the point OP tries to convey.

Both sides have claim, controlled the area at times, and inflicted deaths on each other. There is no Perfect solution. This is amplified by the way Palestine refugees are treated. Unlike other refugees these cannot become part of the country they reside. Thier children live in camps without posibiljty of citizenship.

On the flip side if all Palestines were allowed in Israel they would severly outnumber the Jewish. Even the prior leaders before Hamas said it would be impractical and you might as well erase Israel if that happens.

Cool, so we erase Israel then.

If youre asking this question it means you need to do more reading my friend. You will realise there is no side with moral high ground.

No, but there is occupier and occupied. Oppressor and oppressed. I admit I don't know everything about the situation, but I see that expansionst map of Israel and I feel that tells a lot of the story.

That doesnt justify terror attacks.

I don't think I said it did, but it explains why they happen.

Says the person who has never had their home or land stolen by an invading force and had no army or weaponry to fight back.

Come back and talk to us when you've experienced it.

So if someone beat you in a war and took your land, your next reaction would be to murder someone's grandkids? Attacking innocent people is never justified, the problem is they don't see anyone in Israel as innocent. So how is there supposed to ever be peace.

A "war" requires both sides to have armies, airforces, infantry and, you know...WEAPONS with which to fight.

This is a fn slaughter conducted by xenophobic, racist murderers

I was talking about 48 and 67. Hamas does have an army btw, and they do have weapons and mortars and rockets. Obviously nothing like Israel but that is the nature of warfare, one side will always be superior.

Hamas does have an army btw, and they do have weapons and mortars and rockets

Ok...if you're not going to be serious I'm not gonna play. Smfh.

You're denying what is fact? really how is that even debatable mate.

How is what debatable? That Israel gets 3 billion a year in funding from the US and Palestinians fight Israeli weapons of war with fn rocks?

I can smell your bias from here.

They throw rocks during protests but as i said Hamas has a well armed military wing.

Do they have an airforce? Tanks? RPGs? Anything that could compete with Israel's well funded military?

As i said, they have Kalashnikov rifles, yes they have RPG's - they are very common and easy to find, they have mortars, they have rockets to fire at cities, grenades, everything a well armed militia will have. Obviously they don't have an airforce or armour but you don't need that to create a problem.

but you don't need that to create a problem

Lol...ffs...but you do need them to defeat an enemy determined to eradicate you and your family from your ancestral home.

But thank you for admitting they are in no position to fight a "war" with a modern, xenophobic, racist, murderous regime.

See ya.

Lol...ffs...but you do need them to defeat an enemy determined to eradicate you and your family from your ancestral home.

Yeah tell that to the vietcong and taliban

Palestine is under hostile occupation. They have the right to defend themselves.

displaced Palestinian Christians and Muslims, and radical Islam, would not exist today with out Israel and the soviet Jews who courted it early.

History. The cause is zionism and all the problems that followed it's wake.

I hope more people realize the world isn’t binary, left vs right, Good vs evil is just a manufactured truth.

People try to find simple solutions to complex problems.

There’s a huge difference between left vs. right and good vs. evil.

Sure, but that doesn’t mean I’m wrong.

My point is trying to categorize anything as wholly good or wholly evil is inherently wrong. Life is complex.

I'll definitely call you wrong. Only because it is something that has been philosiphised about for a long time, daoism for instance, but I don't think you have come up with the answers.

There's matter and there's antimatter, that's it. There's light and there's dark, that's it. You can say a thousand colours exist and be right, but it is only light at the end of the day. There's no half truths, it's yes or its no, maybes only exist in your mind, reality perceives it simply as yes or no. On or off. Even the impulses in our brain, the basic functions of a computer, you send the signal or you don't, the neuron fires or it won't.

You miss the point or at least convolute it with left vs right, that shit is 100% manufactured. But the truth of nature is this or that, there is no other.

There's matter and there's antimatter, that's it. There's light and there's dark, that's it. You can say a thousand colours exist and be right, but it is only light at the end of the day. There's no half truths, it's yes or its no, maybes only exist in your mind, reality perceives it simply as yes or no. On or off. Even the impulses in our brain, the basic functions of a computer, you send the signal or you don't, the neuron fires or it won't.

You are right. I should have specified no absolutes in human constructed ideas.

Like I said in another comment, obviously binary systems are binary!

Not sure why you are being downvoted.

It doesn’t really make sense. Unless OP edited he equated left/right and good/evil as both being fabricated.

Yeah I responded on mobile as soon as my flight landed. Would Have to take a closer look.

I think their point was some science based things are binary for lack of a more eloquent explanation.

They claim the world is not binary. I claim it is...

There's a huge difference between a reply which is in context and one which is not.

except for genders

You mean sexes not genders.

both

But really, you are wrong.

maybe. or maybe not

Fortunately, it’s not up to you or me.

well then, we can still be friends even though we might disagree :)

Sounds good to me! America n shit.

beers guns and tits

Gender is sex

I'm pretty sure I can't have sex with a gender. I have sex with bodily parts and human beings though. And sometimes animals but lets not talk about the blacks.

No it’s not.

Sorry, just because you feel like a different gender doesn't make that delusion true.

Gender is not sexy bruh

Are you illiterate? Do you realize sex has more than one definition?

Wanna fuck? We are talking about sex as in male and female.

100% of the time?

99% of the time unless you are an intersex person

So what gender is an intersex person?

A mutated one

Good luck.

I tried to tell someone that you can support black people without supporting blm. Well did people get triggered. It's like everything has to be done through some stupid movement.

what is your issue with BLM?

Blocking traffic? Attacking white people and blaming them all for shit. Not a single person alive today is a slave owner and not a single person alive today was a slave. They silence people from speaking and having a conversation without going full retard and screaming like banshees.

I get black people have it rough in some ways but at the same time don't blame people just based on their skin color. You get mad when you get profiled but now you generalize all white people? Hypocrites.

don't blame people just based on their skin color lol dude not a single person alive today was a slave not accurate and its ~legalised was only about 3 generations ago in some places. BLM goes beyond the US. Getting mad at protesters blocking traffic makes me think you're the kind of person that doesn't support striking.

You need to work on your punctuation. Who is alive today that was a slave? Evidence?

I got downvoted yesterday for saying that I was a moderate but when I grew up liberal it meant being tolerant of other people's viewpoints and got called a trump supporter who supports murder and rape

This is propoganda. You can't have a civil discussion without going to an extreme side to voice your opinion freely. These types of people viciously attack people who merely have a different opinion. When you behave like this you kill the middle ground and create division in the people.

Divide and conquer. We are seeing it happen right in front of us.

But the people actually doing it are those who are misguidedly trying to be the most ‘inclusive. Whole achieve the actual opposite.

You can't judge all liberals from /r/politics anymore than you can judge all conservatives for the Donald subreddit.

Black and white perceptions of things is a byproduct of depression. (not the only cause obviously)

Only a Sith deals in absolutes

But anger and hate is so strong!!!!!

The European invaders (they call themselves Jews) should get out of Palestine (they call it Israel), and any dual citizens should get out of US government. Until then, everyone should boycott Israel and anyone who supports Israel.

If there is a judgement day, then I think American believers are in for a big surprise..

I'll trade you all of the Muslim Invaders from Europe, they call themselves refugees and trade you for the Europans, you call them jews. After all at least the later is educated, innovative and productive.

Serious question, because I hadn't heard about this-- are you saying European Muslims leave Europe to live in Palestine/Isreal in great enough numbers to be a problem there?

Forgive him he doesn't know it's AIPAC/Clintons exporting northern Africa into Europe to make room for a Saudi/Israeli imperialism.

How about we use the bankers' money that both ruined the invaders' homeland and pays for their invasion, and we rebuild their country.

Plus, it is about politics not religion. If people want to go worship peacefully in a synagogue or mosque, then go for it.

Anti-Zionist Jew here. You’re absolutely right about all of this. I’m already seeing propaganda flooding my Facebook feed and in comments here on Reddit from people who clearly know nothing about the Arab-Israeli conflict claiming to know everything about it and pretending it’s all a black and white issue. Also, I want to point out that here in the USA, the most ardent supporters of Israel are very lowkey white Christian nationalists who only support Israel because it gives American Jews a place to go out of the sight of non-Jewish Americans. And the main reason they hate Palestine is because of the false narrative against Muslims and PoC here in the USA. People need to wake the fuck up and realize that most of the people who support Israel blindly don’t do so because of a “love of Jews.”

Christian nationalists who only support Israel because THEY DONT WANT JEWS IN AMERICA, they want us to be exiled to Israel “of our own choice.”

It is more insidious than that. They want Jews back in Israel as a precondition for Jesus to return, at which point there is armageddon.

Absolutely, I heard there is a willingness if not an outright plan in Christian circles to seek ways to actually cause the battle of Armageddon and propitiate the Apocalypse. It's crazy.

Also, I want to point out that here in the USA, the most ardent supporters of Israel are very lowkey white Christian nationalists who only support Israel because THEY DONT WANT JEWS IN AMERICA,

This is completely untrue. I'm in the heart of Texas, and most people treat the word "Jew" like they do the word "fuck": They don't understand just why, but they know it's a bad word.

Yeah I think a lot of the American right is at least slightly anti-semitic. Probably because they associate leftist media with jews.

Post WWII Europe though, I think OPs comment makes sense about wanting them exiled "by their own accord." No one really wanted the jews and shoving them into previously colonized territory seemed like a great idea.

Probably because they associate leftist media with jews.

Why, wherever might they have come to such a ridiculous idea (/s)

Post WWII Europe though, I think OPs comment makes sense about wanting them exiled "by their own accord." No one really wanted the jews and shoving them into previously colonized territory seemed like a great idea.

The Balfour declaration was directly attributable to the actions of a clandestine and conspiratorial world Jewry then headed by Lord Lionel Walter Rothschild. It is the reason the US entered into WWII. It is the reason the holocaust death count is so severely exaggerated. It is the reason Churchill would not accept any of Hitler's dozens of treaties for peace. It is why all of institutionally taught history is a farce at best.

Well said.

thanks!

Can’t remember who it was. I think it could have been Andrew Breidbart who made the statement that he supported anti-Semetism because it meant a stronger Israel.

Possibly one of the most idiotic, bigoted statements I have ever heard.

some say that the creation of the state of Israel was the final solution of Hitler. A nazi plan.

Also, I want to point out that here in the USA, the most ardent supporters of Israel are very lowkey white Christian nationalists who only support Israel because THEY DONT WANT JEWS IN AMERICA

That's not true at all. They're rapture fans. They support Israel because they think it'll bring Jesus back.

It’s a mix of both, my guy.

Most people don't actually care about the Jews. It's a false projection to think people care enough about you to hate you. Jewish leaders push that narrative to get support from guys like you worrying that everyone is after you.

I was reading an article yesterday about how Jewish people basically created and run the comic book industry and they claim it was due to anti-semitism. This isn't true. The industry is culturally nepotistic and would give preference to other Jewish people. It's why most super heroes have Jewish roots.

Can you not tell by the fact that I’m anti-Zionist that I don’t listen to/believe anything that Jewish leaders in America say?

Yeah but it's deeper instilled than that.

You can’t presume to know my experience or my beliefs in any way, shape, or form, dude. I grew up staunchly Zionist and reshaped my whole world view when I realized how blind to the truth I had been my whole life. I’ve been ostracized by some family members for my beliefs. I think I’m pretty damn good at not being indoctrinated by falsehoods, though it seems you can’t say the same for yourself.

You can’t presume to know my experience or my beliefs in any way, shape, or form, dude.

Sorry if it seemed that way. No, just from your first comment, you claimed that the right wingers don't want Jewish people around. That's an ingrained belief that Jewish people tell each other but it's not really real. It's an indoctrination comment meant to get Jewish people supporting the cause.

I’ve been ostracized by some family members for my beliefs.

That sucks. I got kicked out by my Step Mom for not being Christian. I know how it feels.

though it seems you can’t say the same for yourself.

Oh stop being so bloody defensive.

Most right wingers barely know shit about the middle east conflict because it's a topic that is mostly censored or biased in US media. Since 9/11 they've supported Israel because AIPAC and the evangical religious leaders teamed up. There's also quite a few Jewish people in the alt-right movement so i'm not even sure where you get this idea from that the right hates Jewish people.

All I’m reading from this is, “It doesn’t happen to me so it isn’t an issue.” Just because YOU don’t experience anti-semitism doesn’t make it a non-issue. It’s certainly not as big of a problem as anti-PoC culture in the US, but it’s still an issue. I’ve had my life threatened where I work simply because I was wearing a Magen David necklace. You don’t just get to tell people what they’re experiencing. I’m not put-upon or defensive, this is just literally my reality. Also, name one fucking Jew in the alt-right, my dude. That’s not a thing. And if there are, they’re probably too stupid to even know what they’re fighting for, and shouldn’t be used as an “example” to prop up your fallacious argument.

You don’t just get to tell people what they’re experiencing.

Neither do you. People get bullied, this isn't just something that happens to Jewish people. I got jumped by skinheads before and got a few broken ribs. At the same time, I've been jumped by natives and black guys too. I almost got thrown off a parkade by rednecks once because they drove by and called us fags.

Everyone has different experiences.

I’ve had my life threatened where I work simply because I was wearing a Magen David necklace.

Call your HR, or the cops. There is already laws in place to deal with that kind of stuff.

Also, name one fucking Jew in the alt-right, my dude.

The term 'alt right' was created by Paul Gottfried, a Jewish guy from New York.

http://www.tabletmag.com/jewish-news-and-politics/218712/spencer-gottfried-alt-right

The term itself is just a buzzword run amok and attached to various factions of US conservatives. How a lot of that extremist shit built up was through different media talking heads, some of which happened to be Jewish.

Here in Canada, Ezra Levant owns RebelMedia which is considered an alt-right anti-semitic outlet. He started out promoting anti Muslim 'hate speech' and spent the last decade conning right wing conservatives to hate anyone that isn't 'white'.

The 'right' wasn't originally anti-semitic and a lot of that white supremacist bullshit is just media hype.

Sounds like whatever feelings you have about Jews, they aren't positive ones.

You don't know me.

I like Jewish people same as everyone else. I'm just not a fan of religion. Judaism happens to fall in that category.

With the Jewish persecution complex, it pisses me off because it's not fair to tell impressionable kids those kinds of lies because they develop a phobia of being harassed.

Here's a good documentary about the way Jewish kids are taught about anti-semitism.

https://youtu.be/XNWF9CeoZdE

It's not really much different than the way Muslim or Christians indoctrinate kids to their faith. I don't care who you are, if you mess with kids, you're an asshole.

Should Israel exist?

I've noticed that despite claims that detractors are racist antisemites, coming to a discussion full of them doesn't seem to yield many bad responses overall. Perhaps the behaviors they observe are what they hate and when a Jewish person shows they don't exhibit them, they are just another human being.

It's how I feel about it all and I think many others are the same way. The lack of vitriol is a good indicator of this.

Israel will fight them

I knew this was going to be s shit on Israel thread from the moment I read the title...

I'd use a hitler analogy to describe the ridiculousness of implying that the greatest evil the world has ever known doesn't deserve all the fight the world can muster, but he wasn't as bad a guy as you think.

Absolutely this. I can't believe this many people are openly supporting Israel in their latest massacre, or suggesting the Palestinians shot themselves in order to make Israel look bad. I have to believe its vote manipulation in the comments. I want to believe the majority can't actually think that way.

I want to believe

That always causes problems.

Yeah. It's just depressing to think that the majority of people think that way. I hope it's bots or something, but sadly most people really think Israel can do no wrong.

I think that most people who are unafraid to think for themselves understand what is happening around the world, and though we are not the majority, we tend to be those to whom others rely upon for their world view when untainted by propaganda, which itself is beginning to wear thin. Were I a Jew, I would be spending my time distancing myself from the evil elements that my people harbor, because if they don't, then it's going to be harder to tell them apart once we reach critical mass and decide to act in preservation of world peace.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_Internet_Defense_Force

Hamas are only doing what they do in self defense of their homeland. Problem is this isn't a movie and there's a lot of people in an organization so no they're not always going to be noble but on principle I agree with them.

As a fellow white person, of course this is what good g.. boys do. /s

Yes yes, and in all of their movies, when the hero is about to rid the world of evil, they always make him say "if I kill him I'm no better than him". Funny thing is, even though they write the scripts, more problems than solutions come from "being a good go... err... guy".

It's like AIDS, a proficient disease opens the doors for diseases of all kinds by stopping the killing of pathogens.

Exactly.

If you disagree with the politics and military actions of Isreal, it's because you hate Jews and you're a Nazi. Everybody knows that.

On the other hand is Israel not allowed to defend itself? 5 pf "protesters" that died yesterday belonged to hamas military wings. Others were inciting violence and attempting to cross or destroy the border fence. Where do you cut the line?

They can't utilize Jews are the majority in that state.

Haha, an Isael can do no wrong poster. Haven't seen one of these since the last time Israel started slaughtering people.

Did they have their military wings card member on them ?

Yeah here's a picture.

I haven't clicked, but I'll still say nice Photoshop.

Lol just click.

True that test.

On the other hand is Israel not allowed to defend itself?

Yes, against imminent threats, sure. Shooting someone in the back while he is running away is not that.

Five of the "protesters" that died yesterday belonged to hamas military wings.

And they were shot while on their own territory by Isralis military who had no legitimate reason to be there in the eyes of the International Community.

Others were inciting violence and attempting to cross or destroy the border fence.

So, because "others" were doing something which you disagreed with, that gives them the right to shoot just anybody who happens to be in the line of fire?

Where do you cut the line?

Imminent danger. That's the phrase you're going to want to retain. But before you do, learn what it means.

Good use of sarcasm.

Good use of sarcasm.

You should have added "/s", as some sub-humans - crazed fucking Zionists (CFZs) - really do believe what you wrote.

Being against Hamas is wanting people dead. I can't condone all of their tactics, but they're the only meaningful resistance to the fascist Isreali regime making an actual difference in the region.

Hamas are useful idiots. Them being in power gives Israel justification to attack the Palestinian civilians.

Great. Now what?

Here's a fun game: Make a well reasoned, objective comment about middle eastern politics on any fairly centrist news website. Then take the number of replies accusing you of being a Zionist added to the number of replies accusing you of being an anti-Semite divided by the difference between the two. Highest number wins.

So anyone getting an equal number of replies automatically beats anyone else with a score of infinity? Honestly I kinda like this game, Insta-win for anyone berated equally by both parties? I approve.

What's wrong with Israel tho? Im actually serious.. I'm curious

Ethnic cleansing is a good place to start: https://www.veteranstoday.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/ethnic-1.jpg

As someone from a mixed religious family, I really appreciate this message and can attest to it. My uncle and his whole brood are non-Zionist Jews, diehard conservatives who are frankly ashamed of the political state of Israel.

This Israel-Palestine crap is never going anywhere until they just split the country, share Jerusalem, and fucking cut the bullshit.

whats wrong with

a bunch of white people

saying they're entitled

to everything?

everything-

They don't care which side you take either. Just pick a side and fight the other.

We make it so easy to be controlled.

One of the reasons they won't accept Jesus Christ is that he tells them to stop fighting. Moslems are all set with Mohammed -- no problem.

Heh, I wish christians would follow christ too.

For media people, criticism of Israel = end of career.

Even noticing that criticism of Israel ends careers will end a career.

Pattern recognition is anti Semitic.

Remember, you can also not give a shit either way and not be an immoral person. Are we honestly civilized? I live in California. I have seen the concentration camps we locked the Japanese in. Hitler was trying to commit genocide less than 100 years ago. A new world war could start at any time. People are still slaves in Libya. The list goes on. I have a Wife and Kids. I have enough to worry about at home. If some people on the other side of the world want to fight over holy land or whatever I dont care. Joshua trees only grow in 2 places. The holy land and the Antelope valley. I live in the Antelope Valley. This is the real holy land. We planted Joshua trees on the other side of the planet to trick people. Hows that for a conspiracy? Anyway. Like I said. You dont need a narrative if you don't care. Don't feel obligated one way or the other.

What if a want everyone dead?

If you start with yourself everyone will be dead to you, in a way. Unless there is an afterlife and you get stuck as a ghost that can still experience Earth. Maybe stuck in the house you used to live in and annoying loud people move in.

But then we get into the question of what is life

Don't be a dick

Everyone is being a dick, so like, everyone stop being dicks.

Another narrative is saying "Arab" vs "Jew". While the reality is there many Arabic speaking Jew. The conflict is not between Muslim and Jew its between "Palestinian" ( Jew, Muslim or Christian ) and the "Israel" ( a government forced itself by bringing people from around the world and destroying the native homes and restrict their movements)

This the same as ISIS when the call the Muslim from all over the world to join them. And the same of the killing of the native Americans.

Should not change our view of language, religion, or kids.

Which Israeli political party do you support then?

So they don't support an independent Palestine?

you're juat another example

of the worse than useless

white person who professes

coexistence

but is always seen

wringing their hands

at the sight of their cousins

of whom they are supposedly

smarter and more educated than

doing the same things white colonizers

have always done

Sieg heil

Being against Israel is wanting people dead since it's the only safe haven for jews in the ME.

Being against several actions that the Israeli government/military does is however very reasonable.

Israel has offered land to the Muslims 5 times and 5 times they were rejected.

"Here is a dollar"

"But you have 100$"

"Yes, and I am giving you one. You can reject it and still have 0."

Even though it was closer to 25 30%.

You realize that no muslim country offers them land lol. Heck if they really wanted peace why not just live in a country called Israel? You can be muslim in Israel. In fact you can have pro palestine demonstrations there.

The fact is they don't want peace, they want the jews out. They are not interested in working with them.

Both sides do have to change, how ever giving them 50% of the land will do no one good. At best it creates economic chaos with the resettlement of millions of people, established businesses, and public systems already laid in place. At worst is makes an even larger zone for hamas to carryout it's operations.

Thinking that just giving away land is a as simple as that is foolish. "BUT THAT'S WHAT THE BRITISH DID" Yes to a certain degree. However you would be insane to think that palestine then is as infrastructally stable as present day Israel.

To equate african migrants and black people are simply not the same either. There is a striving black jewish community in Israel, mostly from ethopia. They're ideals and values obviously match up with the common Israelis and that is why they are not being expelled.

The link between this mass migration and crime is undeniably evident. In Europe, in North America and apparently in Israel.

Why should any country be made to ACCEPT refugees? Are borders no longer a thing? Or should that only be in judeo-christian societies?

Honestly, Zionists are the biggest anti-semitics that exist, since the people of Palestine are of that same semitic ethnicity.

both sides

Sound familiar? No, not both sides. Only one side is murdering masses of people with American weapons.

Exactly. I hate how if u talk about either side being bad your automatically bad.

It's not Israel vs Hamas. Only a very small percentage of those marching were Hamas affiliated. Most were regular Palestinian citizens tired of living under oppressive occupation. Israel hates all Palestinians and plays up the Hamas thing to try and justify their crimes. Its worth remembering as well that Hamas are a democratically elected political party, though not a very good one (name one who is though i guess)

That’s like saying you can support the president and not be a racist

Hamas is Israel.

Let's all get one fact right. If there is one state solution. All the jews are going to get killed by majority arabs. So jews have no opinion but to fight. Then again they should have sure innocent women and children are not killed.

I guess we'll never know, since Israel keeps striking out pre-emptively, before they've actually been attacked.

Since Arabs were more welcoming of Jews being expelled from Germany than America was, though, I call bullshit.

We can see the live example in "newly formed" country like Pakistan where minority population has dipped to zero in few decades. Also in arab world, non Muslim male cannot marry Muslim female. That's very welcoming.!!

Pakistan is a good example of what the western empires would like to see happen in Israel and Palestine. That's why they broke the country up similarly to how they broke India into India and Pakistan. Get with the program so people don't have to keep explaining this to you please.

Oh fk u are ignorant. I told you what happens in a muslim majority country to minority. U are talking about western powers blah blah.... That's the topic here

That you don't understand the link between Israel and Western powers is so absurd, it's almost laughable. It's not, because the issue is deadly serious, and you really should know something about this. Go do some homework.

I didn't say i don't understand the link. All i am trying to say is if Israel or Palestine whatever name for single state, gets united. Jews are going to get killed.

Please read up on the history of the region. This is by design at the behest of Western elites, who control their Pakistani puppets.

Hamas exists because Israel has shoved an extra 2 million refugees into the world's largest open air prison called Gaza.

Was that anti semitism?? You can make it up by donating to Israel

Just buy American products, and you're bound to be supporting Israel in ways you aren't even allowed to know.

There's One Side that's significantly worse by any metric.

Nuance died in 2014.

i dont owe anybody's

god

a god damn thing

Hey, can we start over where first of all you admit Hamas is being supported by Saudi Arabia, and various other heavily Islam-influenced nation states and borderless ("globalist") oligarchies; and second of fucking all, admit that Israel isn't directing Islam to seek kill and destroy the first world????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

Say the words: "Saudi Arabia supports Hamas" or say nothing at all; you and me and everybody gets past that hurtle or else we simply do not and more people die.

Say the words or don't, mr. swimmin in the shallow end of an over chlorinated propaganda pool.

As a displaced Palestinian, I couldn't agree more. The discourse in the media is focused on Hamas and the Israeli government. Nobody talks about the innocent people who have no power to change anything and are being pushed around left and right. Nobody talks about the Palestinians who were refugees and are still displaced and have no citizenship status and are stuck in the country they are in today with limited rights. Nobody talks about the people of Gaza who are at the mercy of foreign governments when it comes to travelling to and from Gaza and have to enroll on a register a year in advance to travel outside the country. Most of these people are just like any citizen. They don't care about politics, they just want to live, but in the media they are only painted as casualties of war with no solution to these problems in sight.

Most Palestinians I meet do not support Hamas.

yeah they do. Kata'ib Qassam is widely supported. The politburo is whay people take issue with.

You're speaking out of your ass with this "both sides" bullshit

No they don't. Just stop lying.

I'm Palestinians, jackass. Everyone supports Qassam. The Fath-Hamas conflict is over politburo control. The al Aqsa Martyrs Brigades, Jaish al Mujahideen (another minor Fath affiliate) and Qassam collaborate extensively.

Reminder that Jewish Palestine funded Nazi Germany in exchange for ending a global boycott that would have bankrupted Germany in Hitler's first year...

Using liberal thinking you would be correct.

Im against them both cause I despise both religions that their culture is based on. Judaism is racist and Islam is murderous. They both believe in slavery and neither one wants me giving it to their daughters yet they can rape ours. Fuck em both.

I've just stopped thinking or investing in any of this stuff and I am so much happier just focusing on my own life

Sure I can feel empathy for them but it's not healthy to constantly stress about what people are going through around the world, the human body wasn't designed to deal with a that. Although I am concerned for white farmers in South Africa.

The major difference is one of these parties has a significant amount of power over the other. It is why the two-state solution should be enacted swiftly and we continue to hash out any issues that will arise.

Just wrote a term paper on the subject of Israel and Palestine. If anyone wants a quick read(about 12 pages) just let me know and I can submit it somewhere.

I will once my teacher grades it so he doesn’t think I plagiarized. I’ll send you the link to it, it should be on r/essays by tomorrow or Tuesday.

[removed]

Other than McKinney & Sanders, are any US politicians speaking against israel?

Jill Stein

I agree with you but I support the Palestinians because they are the underdogs by a wide margin.

the whole "Hamas hamas" thing is a red herring. In many ways it's like the "Mah Russia" thing. Gaza is an internment camp from which people are not allowed to live which is blockaded to prevent some of the most basic necessities from reaching the people. If Israel could, they would probably do away with the whole strip - as in making hte people go "poof". All israelis know that and they all wish it could be done just so - "poof!". Withe world [kind of] watching it's a bit difficult, so they keep tightening the belt hoping the hunger, disease and absence of medical help will do slowly that which they feel - unjustly, mind you - prevented from doing a little faster.

Hamas" is the justification provided. Of course, it's not like the people of gaza have a say in who or what rules over them. They are glad to have any kind of organization that provides a semblance of order, just like in any prison camp. hamas, is simply an out-sourced boogey-mean, trotted out now and then to justify the unjustifyable. If tomorrow hamas came out professing eternal love for israel, recognizing it as a jewish state and giving up every single weapon, israel would be compelled to bring in ISIS or some such to keep the charade going. Actually, they did and are trying to do just that, but the hamas security has been fairly effective at catching the ISIS cells.

You know hamas is a made-up boogey-man by the enormous efforts israel makes to prevent reconciliation between it and the PA. No sooner Egypt mediates, that something happens.

It's good to know what this is all about is what I am saying. It is "extermination by other means' and calling it anything else is putting head in the sand.

Watch the anti-semitism, goyim.

Saudis Arabia and Iran spend Billions every year hiring people to indoctrinate white educated liberals against Israel. Im a atheist...

I have only meet four Israelis outside Israel, and all four were sexual harassers (two straight rape).

Two were at professional conferences and had to be flown back.

Jews might be great people, but Israelis seem to be shitty human beings.

Then again, I seem to have only met the worst four imaginable.

Absolutely, I heard there is a willingness if not an outright plan in Christian circles to seek ways to actually cause the battle of Armageddon and propitiate the Apocalypse. It's crazy.

Most people don't actually care about the Jews. It's a false projection to think people care enough about you to hate you. Jewish leaders push that narrative to get support from guys like you worrying that everyone is after you.

I was reading an article yesterday about how Jewish people basically created and run the comic book industry and they claim it was due to anti-semitism. This isn't true. The industry is culturally nepotistic and would give preference to other Jewish people. It's why most super heroes have Jewish roots.

Every race and religion has evil people. I think both of these countries have evil people in power, but also have good people in power leading them. Unfortunately the line between them gets blurred.

By not letting tens of thousands of people, organized by Hamas, crash their border?

The majority of my posts here are very critical of our relationship with Israel, so unless you think it's 'part of my disguise' you may need to reconsider your assumptions.

Regardless, I'm not blind to the fact that a key part of asymmetrical warfare is provoking retaliation upon innocents to crucify your opposition in the global press (see Western engagements in Vietnam) so let's not pretend a portion of those deaths weren't sought by the opposition in Palestine. Israel is clearly garbo for their actions and parts of the Palestinian opposition is trash for using innocents to their own ends. Sorry your revolutionary hashtag campaign isn't working out little fella

Good use of sarcasm.

There's always another side of the story.

How rational would you be if you had weekly rockets flying into your neighborhood?

Both sides suck. You can't blame one and not blame the other.

A "war" requires both sides to have armies, airforces, infantry and, you know...WEAPONS with which to fight.

This is a fn slaughter conducted by xenophobic, racist murderers

The BBC just had the Israeli ambassador on in the UK, but no Palestinian representation to tell their side.

as usually

I will once my teacher grades it so he doesn’t think I plagiarized. I’ll send you the link to it, it should be on r/essays by tomorrow or Tuesday.

Yes, and in any system of law the world over, for good reason. I think you skipped most of my earlier reply.

It's not something that every Jew engages in. The most evil people in the entire world hide behind your religion and you need to take some time to seriously consider the truth within the statement "until good [blank] stand against bad [blank], there are no good [blank]", because once the world at large becomes aware of this in full, they will want to be able to tell the good from the bad, but if you don't give them any way to do so, then, well, you run the risk of being the baby thrown out with the bathwater, to put it in a nice way.

Hey buddy, where'd you link my replies to? I wanna go see what your friends had to say.