Religion is another way to say business. Anytime $$$ is involved, there is no organization that can resist the temptation to increase their bank balance.

The Bible is actually fairly critical of large hierarchical churches. But Mormons and Catholics generally care more about their institutions than anything God has to say.

And they wonder why the younger generation isn't falling in line like the thousand years worth of patrons before them. Like its a fucking mystery. They have enough capital to float themselves for another hundred years or so before they fade into oblivion. It doesn't have to be this way, but they ever so insist.

They're only a hundred years old

I think we can deduce they're speaking about those catholics

Wouldn't big pharma be the ones selling the medical marijuana?

No

But why not?

A lot of pharma companies play on exclusivity. Can't make money jacking prices up when Bill's Bud 'n Bongs in the corner can sell it much cheaper and has better rep.

The short answer is the drug patent system.

Because the plant is incredibly easy grow and if you used said plant correctly it can eliminate tons of different symptoms with no after affects. One of the biggest tactics of pharma is they cure one thing and create 10 others (which they happen to have pills for go figure right?) each doing the same so you’re stuck on this endless cycle, that plant is a one stop shop for most conditions and you wouldn’t necessarily need a middle man to have access to said medicine. In the states it’s legal they have had HUGE drop off in opiates and other pharmaceutical bullshit, plus marijuana is completely affordable on our end when most “ medications” cost an arm and a leg and then actually cost you an arm or a leg.

You said it's incredibly easy to grow. Not true unless you like garbage.. Probably true with what you're used to. What I work with in the Nor Cali hills is not easy by any means. It's exhausting. And we are true to it being perfect. Sun up till sundown solid hard work.

Ha keep you’re smug ass up outta here bro Colo’s got your shit beat and by easy I ment easy compared to learning how to create your own pharmaceuticals obviously if someone like you can do it anyone can learn to.

Watch your pussy ass tone with me dirtweeed loving retard. You'll get slapped down hard out here.

you sound like a loser

“Dirtweed loving retard” hmmm that must’ve took some real mental work on your part to sling up that burner! Damn chuck, You’re probably exhausted now huh? You should go take a nap on your dads dick, bitch tits.

Holy shit I'm not even mad anymore. Go spend 50 on an 1/8 and think about your life. I like you

Lol nobody does that old timer what is this? 2004?

I dislike arguing with stupid little kids with computers. Go ask your stupid mom for part of the money I gave her. It was for for middle school lunch, but oh well

Ah man, the hits just keep on coming! Go ask one of your grand kids to help ya with the whole insult thing dust nuts

You got me laughing. Ouch player. You're late for work again. Kids need french fries ya know... Your baby mama gonna slap you again if she sees you still sitting on that couch talking to me G. Where's my money? Who's hungry? Who laughs at dudes that are still funny? Welp I have to tell ya dude, she's next to me and spreading all the honey. We out here deep heavy weapon reppin try to be the creep. Peace. Word from the gunny

This cat right here man isn’t he clever, your rhymes are the shit man.....said nobody ever. You’re stupid AF man like a coat in that south Cali weather. Karma is a bitch.. nah you just a bitch bruh, don’t slip an get gripped and stripped should stick to your day job lowly dem skills are as wack as your buds old homie.

Don't make me just jump out this wheelchair n slap your grandma, you can't rap for shit or work try to figure out a handsaw. Dippin in raw, northern California Hippie Militia curb stompin your jaw

Bro you’re softer than baby shit. You got too much time on your hands! That’s how I know your green is as wack as your rhymes bruh! Stick to that Cali bullshit. I like the fact you added hippie to militia lol it’s one of the other dip shit!

Removed. Rule 10.

Removed. Rule 10.

Where do you colorado fugazis think you learned how to grow from? But you are right that it is not that difficult to grow, most personal growers dont need acres of plants.

Idk man. You never grew small scale? 1-2 1000 watts is perfect for a 10 plant grow for self use. There is plenty of videos on YouTube and weed forums that tell you everything you need to know.

Yes I've done this and have done hydro and aero. You must be gorilla growin. I simply work from my garage that I basically cut in half for a makeshift grow room.

Ever watched the grow bible DVD? Gives great examples and the book itself is an AWESOME and very informative read.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feral_cannabis Maybe if it's this your smoking on

http://abc7news.com/health/labs-warn-of-dangerous-contaminated-pot-at-dispensaries/2965470/

Also this is becoming an issue. I rather just grow my own knowing what I nutrients and other natural ways to kill pests affecting my crop(If it ever became a problem)

Also I get paid to help people start and teach. Don't be the gatekeeper like the elite. Help people learn.

Give a man a fish he can eat for a day teach a man to fish he can eat for a life time.

I would say the most annoying part is just trimming.

Smartest thing to do is grow your own. Learn all about it. Brew compost tea. Ect.

KNF, IMOs

Calaveras county area here, with our hot dry weather, its really not that hard to grow quality flower, obviously depending on how large a grow. A personal outdoor garden with 10 plants is a hobby, not a full time job.

I know Calaveras county well! I was outside MTN Ranch last year.

Calaveras county government really fucked alot of growers, gave them the go ahead to build and then pulled the rug out a year later.

Exactly. Good friend of mine isn't doing anything there anymore. And still dealing with a lawsuit wit PG@E for that fire a few years ago that burnt everything. Animals included

Dumbfuck move by the county, going to lose a lot of tax revenue and decent paying jobs.

We have our own "conspiracy" theories. It's a land grab. These fees he paid the county was near extortion to grow that much, then they banned it immediately. It goes deeper. There are some folks with big money in power picking up properties as we speak. I'm moving to a different part of the industry now. Much better and safer

Because it's a weed that anyone can grow.

Marijuana isn't a weed that anyone can grow. It's a plant that grows in many places whether you want to or not. Marijuana is a plant, that's all it is, from that perspective it's no different from a daisy or a dandelion. There's parts of the U.S. where it grows naturally because that's all it is, it's just a plant.

Dude do you know what weeds are? They're plants that grow anywhere whether you want them to or not. They're the pests of plants. All you did was agree with the guy you replied to and confirm his point. If not for the law literally anyone would be able to grow it

"Ditch weed" or the more scarier term "FERAL WEED" oooooooooo scary

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feral_cannabis

Just posting to back you up

Non-Mobile link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feral_cannabis

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I'm surprised the wild weed still exists, you'd figure by this point there'd only be domesticated seeds!

It's still there in more wild areas but birds and animals bring in the seed from the wild areas when they're passing by.

They bring it in their shit

definitely not dispensaries are usually privately owned or sometimes owned by the county

Is there some kind of reasoning behind it? I mean if it's prescribed by a doctor you should be able to get it from a pharmacy.

Medical marijuana isn't "prescribed" it's "recommended". Marijuana is still a schedule 1 drug and as such can't be prescribed as medicine. It can't be patented as a drug, and it drug companies generally don't grow medicine as much as they synthesize it. The chemical interactions in weed are too complicated to make a single chemical synthetic drug that does the job, if you look at the history of Sativex and Marinol you'll see why drug companies don't touch it.

Well isn't most it not all of the medical benefits from marijuana the THC inside? If it became legal I don't see why pharma companies don't create edibles or at least pills with the dosage you need that's prescribed. It'd be weird to see Bayer branded weed but they could definitely make pills or something concentrated.

Oh, no. CBD is just as if not more important than thc for pain relieving and epilepsy etc. Thc is the psychoactive part. There's other alkaloids that are of benefit too. Most dispensaries afaik have their weed tested so you can see the levels of certain alkaloids and make your choice accordingly.

I soo hope that the UK (where I'm from) gets its act together. I'm currently on a lot of meds including very strong opiates and using weed would cut my use of these meds drastically. Only issue is a regular supply of the suitable strains.

Is good weed really unattainable in your part of the UK? I've never been anywhere in the world where I couldn't buy some bud on the street downtown, including London and Dublin.

Good weed is available, the problem is most dealers don't even know if they've got an Indica or a Sativa, let alone what strain it is. I have a few medical issues and so only buy weed when I can get a strain that would be beneficial.

It really comes down to knowing what percentage THC vs CBD you have/need for your particular treatment, and without proper dispensaries, it's not likely anyone you're buying from will know offhand what exactly they have.

MJ has hundreds of active chemicals.

Read about the endocannabinoid system.

the existence of this system coupled with the "no medical benefit" garbage is just too ridiculous for words.

Well isn't most it not all of the medical benefits from marijuana the THC inside?

No, maybe you should research something before talking out of your ass about it.

google.com

Because MJ is still a scheduled 1 drug. "No medicinal value and high chance of addiction".

That's so funny haha. I mean I get it, I guess. I smoked every day for like 3 years, and quit cold turkey. Don't remember having withdrawal symptoms like I did when taking percs and oxys for like a month everyday.

That's because you don't get addicted to marijuana the same way you get addicted to other drugs. Most drugs, like oxy, nicotine, alcohol, make a person develop physical dependencies which is where a lot of withdrawal symptoms come from. With marijuana you can still get addicted but it's far more mental and is more like a bad habit than an addiction. You might feel heightened anxiety or slight depression if you cut out weed but you're far less likely to develop shakes, have your body shut down, or any of the other symptoms.

Yeah it's definitely mentally addicting. Makes everything easier/more tolerable/more carefree.

I wouldn't say anything negative besides sometimes complacency.

I woke up in the sweats and had some pretty wild dreams when I quit for a few weeks for a drug test.

It's a thing where heavy smokers who stop get super vivid dreams.

Could cigarettes be schedule 1 drug, then?

What do you mean? Weed is way more dangerous than cigarettes and alcohol. You sound like you want to help the drug cartels out!

/s

Probably should be.

Big pharma makes money by being able to patent drugs of their making, jacking the price up and monopolizing it. Marijuana can’t be patented.

Also a threat because its relatively easy to grow a large supply for oneself. Once I started growing my own I never took another pill again. That was 8 years ago. They know everybody would do that rather than run to the pharmacy for their garbage.

Any tips for those looking to start in an illegal state?

Dont talk to ANYONE about it and you will be safe forever. Ive done jail time because of one error, telling the ex wife. Grew for 3 years without a single hiccup in a nice suburb in UT til she gave the tip. Get a good setup and dont use more than about 8kw of lights.

I would really recommend you buy a piece of property for cheap that you can grow on legally and just do outdoor there. Your ladies will thank you for the sunlight.

Get a good setup and dont use more than about 8kw of lights.

LED lights are making this way easier these days.

agree, but they are really expensive and frankly I don't think they have the penetrating power they need. Best indoor I have ever produced was in grown under hps and led mixed lighting. Thats the way to go in my book.

r/microgrowery

I find the best place to get seeds is from Britain, there's a few good sites listed in their sidebar. Get a small growlight off amazon and start off with autoflower plants. After that, work up to bigger things.

Once I started growing my own I never took another pill again.

I don't want to piss on anyone's parade, but it sounds like you're implying that you've replaced all your medicine with kush. I don't think that's quite how that works. Marijuana helps with some conditions, but it's by no means a cure-all. Don't go into snake oil and magical crystals territory.

I didn't imply that cannabis was an immediate cure all for all medical problems. It was what taught me nature can handle anything we take pills for. Cannabis replaced most of my meds, but that doesnt mean I didnt still have to find other plants to do what the ganja couldnt do. Marijuana helps with MOST conditions, and gave me the confidence to look to nature for healing instead of pharmaceuticals. Once I had that confidence I invested the time and research into learning herbology and filled the gap between most and all with other plants. Pills suck, and we dont need pharmaceutical medicine at all, snake oils and crystals aside.

No offense, but I honestly don't buy this alternative medicine stuff with natural remedies only. There's a very good reason why we have pharmaceutical meds, and it's not just about money. There are things you can't cure with herbs, and the things you can cure can usually be cured much more efficiently with synthetic medicine. Like it or not, but the moment where mankind started isolating, concentrating and even synthesizing the medicinal substances commonly found in nature was a huge step forward in medicine. It's partially thanks to synthetic medicine (especially antibiotics) that the average life expectancy soared in the last few hundred years.

Thus, I believe your hatred towards "pills" is misguided. Don't hate the medicine. Hate the companies that charge an arm and a leg for it. Or the shitty healthcare system that won't provide you with the medicine you need for an acceptable price. Without modern medicine, we'd be back in the Medieval times in terms of healthcare, like it or not.

It could be patented.

Thanks for the info, I hadn’t come across this before. Looks like time will tell how the process goes for folks.

"Hold my seeds." - Monsanto

V wrong. All pharma comes from plant compounds

Not really, these days most of the money is in biologics (based in recombinant DNA technology) and synthetic drugs. Many early ones certainly came from plants and may still be in common use today but they are long since out of patent and therefore open to easy competition. This is why you can buy an insane number of different brands aspirin or ibuprofen for example. If marijuana had just been discovered they would be eager to patent it (or at least medication made from isolated compounds) and take advantage of their newfound bounty but since its been obviously in common use for years they can't do that (at least not to the raw, non GMO plant or simple AND common ways of using such as smoking or eating it though they could possibly patent a cannabidiol drug mix of some sort).

Monsanto would beg to differ with you. Read here: Monsanto and Bayer are Manuvering to Take Over

Medical marijuana is considered not profitable to one corporation because one corporation can’t sell all the marijuana. You have to have the growers, the testers, the dispensary which all falls short of the corporate system for profit.

This is a good answer and shouldn't have been downvoted. I think you can make a corporate model on cannabis that is hugely profitable, but that is only because of the inflated prohibition price. Without that there is too much labor involved in the process of seed to smoke.

True, there are corporations that have started to monopolize in the industry (I live in Oregon) but they are strictly at the mercy of the OLCC here. The Oregon liquor control commission ,

OLCC is the fucking monopoly! Grew in Oregon for 3 years on my own land. Had the cops there multiple times, no knock search, 10+ cops. Always without a warrant, allowed to search because of the ommp.

olcc is awful read that if you want to go down a rabbit hole, doesn’t pertain to cannabis, but this master mind identity thief worked for the olcc for years and was brought over to study from Ukraine by a member of Ronald Reagan’s cabinet. Once here after college he began stealing identities and working for state Agencies. 🤔

what a story! yeah thanks for backing me up, OLCC is a crooked bunch of assholes.

Probably in the future, however right now there are legal hurdles that most large pharma don't want to get invovled. The same with growing. This has actual led to many small operations in the business right now.

No...they have no interest in selling marijuana, which can't be patented or priced at extortion levels like their other products

You can grow your own pot. It takes the reliance out of the equation and empowers people to be somewhat medically self sufficient.

Looks like the church is protecting it's financial interests

Sounds like there's a few money changers in the Temple. It's always been like this.

Time to flip some tables.

r/JesusChristReddit

That's completely abnormally used, but absolutely perfect

(╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻

That's completely awesomely used, and absolutely perfect.

And fashion some whips out of rope...

And chew bubblegum...and I’m all out of bubblegum.

Duke Nuke'em? I'll rip your head off and shit down your neck!

I believe Duke did say it, but I was thinking of They Live.

Yes, they live came out in ‘88 before any duke game

There literally are in Mormon temples anyways. They have a cafeteria where you can buy food to eat inside.

Remember when Jesus set up that "Miracle Shop" and charged people thousand shekels for being cured of leprosy and death and shit? /s

I'm not for them, but this doesn't mean it's financially motivated.

Yea, they’re against coffee. I’m assuming they’re against weed too

The day I first tried coffee and weed is the day my faith died.

Sounds like a great breakfast

Now I want coffee and weed for breakfast. Good thing I'm in Denver!

Kief in the coffee is always my Sunday favorite.

in other news, recent leaks show the Mormon church has over a billion dollar stake in 5 Hour Energy.

yeah, they disagree with something and they will make money off of it. it's pretty obvious the mormon church is anti-drug

Anridrug, yet 1 billion in pharma shares.... Sure, buddy

you know im talking about recreational drugs

They’ve done similar things with the stance on caffeine and their holdings of Pepsi or Coke.

The Mormon church regularly engages in brazen political meddling, a good example being California's Proposition 8.

New York Times -- Nov. 14, 2008:

Mormons Tipped Scale in Ban on Gay Marriage

Pushing Politics from the Pulpit is a no-no.

Maybe the Church should have its religious tax exemptions revoked?

It only pushes social issues, never candidates.

As far as I know, that is allowed right? A religion can push social political issues and remain tax exempt? Seems like a lot of people don't understand the law if that is the case.

I don't understand the law either, but I'm pretty sure it is allowed. The OP has gotten lots of karma from hating on religions.

Sounds like standard reddit-fare actually. Just have to know the right buttons to push, even if the information is misleading.

Being Mormon on Reddit is fun. Almost everyday there seems to be another post on the front page misrepresenting data to trash my religion.

As far as I know, that is allowed right? A religion can push social political issues and remain tax exempt?

"Political Issues" would refer to attempts to influence Legislation, no?

Here's the law:

26 U.S. Code § 501 - Exemption from tax on corporations, certain trusts, etc. --

(c) (3)

• Corporations, and any community chest, fund, or foundation, organized and operated exclusively for religious, charitable, scientific, testing for public safety, literary, or educational purposes, or to foster national or international amateur sports competition (but only if no part of its activities involve the provision of athletic facilities or equipment), or for the prevention of cruelty to children or animals, no part of the net earnings of which inures to the benefit of any private shareholder or individual, no substantial part of the activities of which is carrying on propaganda, or otherwise attempting, to influence legislation (except as otherwise provided in subsection (h)), and which does not participate in, or intervene in (including the publishing or distributing of statements), any political campaign on behalf of (or in opposition to) any candidate for public office

It seems that attempts to Influence Legislation OR to intervene -- pro or con -- for any Candidate would disqualify these from Tax Exempt Status, no?

In any case the "Legislation" statement refers to [subsection (h):

(h) Expenditures by public charities to influence legislation

• (1) General ruleIn the case of an organization to which this subsection applies, exemption from taxation under subsection (a) shall be denied because a substantial part of the activities of such organization consists of carrying on propaganda, or otherwise attempting, to influence legislation, but only if such organization normally—

• (A) makes lobbying expenditures in excess of the lobbying ceiling amount for such organization for each taxable year, or

• (B) makes grass roots expenditures in excess of the grass roots ceiling amount for such organization for each taxable year.

Further clarification provided in subsequent paragraphs (2) Definitions; (3) Applicable Organizations; (4) Organizations with selective options, and ; (5) Disqualified organizations (specifically names Churches and their affiliates)

Prima facie, it would seem that this legislation bars religious organizations and their affiliates from engaging in both propaganda lobby efforts attempting to influence either elections OR candidate elections.

No?

• (1) General ruleIn the case of an organization to which this subsection applies, exemption from taxation under subsection (a) shall be denied because a substantial part of the activities of such organization consists of carrying on propaganda, or otherwise attempting, to influence legislation, but only if such organization normally—

Does say that they are only denied if a substantial part of their activities are for attempting to influence legislation. Does most of the Mormon churches activities attempt to influence legislation? I'm not sure on that since I don't really care one way or the other. Seems like it would be an easy case if it were.

Does say that they are only denied if a substantial part of their activities are for attempting to influence legislation.

Define "substantial", as used in the context of the law.

Does most of the Mormon churches activities attempt to influence legislation?

I do not see "substantial" and "most" as being synonymous.

Do you?

I'm not a lawyer. I'm just a layman saying what I see. Do you have a definition since you seem so informed on the law?

Substantial

Of real worth and importance; of considerable value; valuable. Belonging to substance; actually existing; real; not seeming or imaginary; not illusive; solid; true; veritable.

So does the Mormon church do that? You've been throwing terms at me but haven't actually answered the question.

But with the two party system we're stuck with there isn't much difference there. While they can't name a candidate there's only one choice that strongly opposed gay marriage to keep with the above example.

The church can only directly contribute to non-candidate PACs. They can however direct their Church members to donate to specific candidates, which they do because they are super sheeple.

lol they don't

I'm sure this is because they had invested in heterosexual stock. Big straight.

You seem to be making light of the leaks. Are you disputing them?

I don't doubt that they own the stock. I do doubt that the stock had anything to do with their decision to oppose marijuana. Mormons aren't even supposed to drink coffee, after all.

It's not clear to me that marijuana legalization would have any effect on the revenue of big pharma.

Protip: It won't. The only thing it'll do is lessen the impact on people who get nicked for having a joint.

Decriminalization only ruins the private/for-profit prison industry.

You don't see how an unpatentable plant which can be grown in people's homes and is a viable alternative to many medications owned by pharma companies could have any effect on pharma companies?

Wow.

Yes they are against alcohol. A drug. Yet have no problem with all the drugs they have invested in?

Yet they are against a natural plant which can't be patented and is easily grown... Something which would hurt the investment this "church" made?

Is this really that hard?

Eh... kind of a misleading that they tipped the scale when blacks in California voted overwhelmingly against gay marriage.

Why'd they do that?

Because black people are pretty socially conservative over all.

Homophobia is pretty damn strong in the African American community.

Eh... kind of a misleading that they tipped the scale when blacks in California voted overwhelmingly against gay marriage.

Eh... unlike the Mormons, "the blacks" are not organized under a wealthy highly focused and politically powerful hierarchy, so it seems unlikely that the influence of "the blacks" is comparable to that of "the Mormons".

The statement was that mormons tipped the scale on prop 8. I simply pointed out that blacks not only make up a larger percentage of the California population than mormons, but that they even voted against same sex marriage at a higher percentage than mormons.

They also own Pepsi stocks. It's against Mormon credo to drink caffeine.

This is false. It is ADVISED to not drink caffeine but is not a "commandment" of theirs. I live amongst the mormon community and this is one thing that always gets misconstrued.

Oh sorry. That’s way better. “Don’t drink this stuff. It’s bad for you. Let’s just make money off of it while it’s here tho.”

Damn right baby! Mmm sweet sweet capitalism!

It's seriously frowned on to the point of shunning family members that have had caffeine. Go take a look and have a talk with the fine folks at r/exmormon .

I don't see this at all, while i can't think of a single LDS member that drinks coffee, 90% of the membera i know in my family and at work drink soda/pop with caffeine in it, generally diet coke/dr. pepper/mountain dew. Not that perhaps some one is disappointed, but shunned, seriously frowned on... never seen it with 2 decades of lds church under my belt. Has it happened somewhere, yeah probably, but as a common response, nah, not in my experience in Utah, maybe further away from the base people are harder on each other? i would figure closer to the source/homebase people would be more explicit, not less, but that's my opinion. My mother how traveled around the world as a LDS woman loved the people further away from Utah as they seemed more genuine compares to members in Utah. Always found that interesting.

It's seriously not. And caffeinated drinks are sold at BYU. Church members do plenty of stupid things, but this is quite the exaggeration.

Searched caffeine in ex Mormon. Crazy fucks. They've got caffeinated hot chocolate in a milk jug. Looks more like chocolate milk.

Does that also apply to cigarettes, alcohol and sweet sweet meth?

Yes the word of wisdom does apply to cigarettes(tabacco) and alcohol as is the current teachings. Meth implicitly.

No you are just choosing to interrupt the word however you like, that is what every brainwahsed religious member is doing. You need to get out brother or sister. If you enjoy coffee, try out marijuana or LSD! Both are less addictive and less harmful to your body then caffeine since you are already doing drugs. Stay away from alcohol, and all those other schedule 1-2 drugs though they ruin lives.

If you enjoy coffee, try out marijuana or LSD!

LMFAO.... oh god, my sides. I'm not an advocate against EITHER, but "if you like coffee" "try LSD" is a FUCKING hoot. Holy hell, how can you even suggest that. LSD is not comparable in function and should not be taken with such lightheartedness, regardless of its physical harm being nil. Just stop giving advice, please.

Damn, I already did what he said. am I gonna die?

Then maybe research the substance. I get more high from weed then 50ug of LSD or a half tab. And the 50ug of lsd keeps me level stable and pleasant to others for about a week. Weed keeps me pleasant and stable for like 6 hours :/. Caffine keeps me pleasant and stable for maybe 45mins.

To me besides the obvious over consumption of a substance leading to drastically different effects;

Caffeine; When I was abusing was 1300mg+ a day. My high would last for 5 mins tops after say a full monster, usually the big pop top cans about 3 a day. Was also taking caffeine pills, and drinking pre workout mix. I did not work out I played video games. This would lead to massively unstable moods, rage fits, constant headaches and chest pains, digestive issues not limited too trouble passing, bloody stool, and abdominal pains. You can tell me caffeine does not belong in the drug category and I will continue to disagree. There are OVERDOSES from caffeine consumption recorded yearly.

Weed; At my peek I smoke an 1/8th of flower and half a gram of wax daily averaged over the span of a month. Yes that is about an ounce a week of weed and an oz a month of wax. My budget for weed a month scrapes 700$ in a rec state with medical discounts. This too leads to side effects as some in here are honest enough to recognize. Paranoia in different forms is constant, and the mood stabilization is a double edge sword sometimes. I have literally no appetite sober and only sometimes get munchies when high, again a double edge sword. Also no recorded deaths of overdose by intoxication.

LSD; Now here is the weird one. I have never felt the urge to take more then a single “dose” 100ug. And usually take less 50, or 10. I first starting using it because of micro dose research. But have never been able to actually accurately dose what is really considered “micro” and my “trips” have been less intense then mushrooms ever were or “dangerous”. And the after effects or side effects are non existent. But hey just like marijuana, there are no recorded deaths from intoxication from LSD. Though plenty of psychosis cases.

But hey man they are not even in the same LEAGUE right ?

Then maybe research the substance.

Proceeds to give completely anecdotal evidence.

I'm not sure you understood my point. It wasn't about any of the factors you brought up, I was making a comparison between the conscious altering effects. Any reasonable amount of Caffeine or Weed will not full blown tilt you and keep you up 12 hours like LSD can.

Now of course that's all dependent on dosing, sure...

I also know I sure as fuck wouldn't be taking advice from someone who was dumb enough to abuse "1300+mg a day" of caffeine. I'm sorry to hear about your addiction issues.

It comes from the "Word of Wisdom" in the Doctrine and Covenants. It is not written to explicitly say caffeine as when it was written such knowledge wasn't commonly available if at all, early 1800's i think caffeine was discovered.

The point is anything that could be/is a vice is either extremely tought against use or explicitly forbidden. During younger years in the LDS faith i have never ever ever seen someone lose a temple recommend or be shunned(this is not a common word used by LDS folk) by the leaders a ward, stake or top leadership.

Point is and is pretty simple, if you are addicted or have vices you may not be prepared for might come whatever that is and having vices can ensure some degree of failure, be that smoking or whatever. It is good to be in the most control over your mind and body, i was taught people make mistakes and that's the point of being here, the difference is what you do when and if you recognize the issues.

I was brought up in utah, only 25 miles away from Salt Lake City and generally what I hear about peoples experiences I have never witnessed or heard of unless i was on the internet other then people doing bad things to kids/young adults, but that seems to be a people problem, not the religion.

source: brought up in utah, live in utah, work with 80% of staff being active members of the lds chruch, haven't observed religion for 20+ years. Weird stories are weird.

Non-Mobile link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Word_of_Wisdom

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the interpretations of the word of wisdom has changed over time which is very interesting, particularly what hot drink and mild drink refer to in the text

How so? All I know is coffee & tea are recommended against.

I would suggest you read the wikipedia link above, but as a sample, beer!

The revelation suggests that barley-based mild drinks (such as beer) may be permissible. As recently as 1901, apostles Brigham Young, Jr. and John Henry Smith argued that the revelation did not prohibit beer. However, LDS Church leaders now teach that consumption of any form of alcohol, including beer, violates the Word of Wisdom.

Did not know this! Thanks!

Ok, thanks for that. Also got my info from actual Mormons. They do own Pepsi stock.

That's not totally true. It's not "not advised." There is no stance on caffeine period.

Even that isn't quite true. The word of wisdom never mentions caffeine. The specific wording is "hot drinks are not for the body or the belly" and over the years the definition of "hot drinks" has changed.

For example, hot cocoa and hot herbal tea are fine, iced coffee and tea are not. These days even diet coke or full sugar sodas with caffeine aren't considered off limits for most practicing mormons.

I don't think there's any good reason not to tax churches.

1. Don't give the government a financial incentive to increase church attendance and giving.

2. Churches can currently push for social issues, but cannot campaign directly for candidates and they like it this way. Around 10% of the mormon tithe alone could have funded a mormon backed candidate dollar for dollar against Hillary Clinton before any other conservative interest or church pitched in.

That really is an interesting point. The church could finance its own candidate up to a billion dollars very very easily. Just 10% of their known portfolio is more than 3 times what Hillary spent, which was the most in history.

sounds like money doesnt buy elections entirely. just disinformation campaigns, and the church cant really do that any harder than they already do.

That was one positive I took out of this election cycle. That the system isnt completely rigged and up for sale. It just kinda is!

Dummy, don't offer the challenge or they may try.

I think that tax laws need to be amended to keep churches out of politics. Period. Meaning they can't push policies

I hope you feel the same way about ANY entity(religious and non-religious) receiving either exemption or money from the federal govt staying out of politics.

Then maybe I could watch tv without seeing 1000 ads about the election.

Or headache pills that give you heart attacks

i.e, planned parenthood

As far as I know, the staff and clergy pay income tax. However, the church itself doesn’t pay tax on offerings like other businesses pay sales tax on their revenue. Given the amount of community service local churches provide such as food and clothing donations, I don’t agree with taxing the churches. Plus I feel the government taking religious donations is a violation of the first amendment.

given the amount of community service

We don't audit these activities. The LDS church and the megachurches are tax-shelters money laundering schemes.

government taking religious donations

Money isn't inherently religious, it's a commodity, and the churches need to pay their fair share for access to our public which they benefit from.

All valid points. I come from shit hole Arkansas with a church on every corner. I even attend occasionally to make my mom happy. I have personally witnessed the work and effort small churches provide to the town. Many volunteers give their time and money to help better their communities. I am not an expert on tax law but I realize the people on payroll are paid solely on offerings and those people do actually pay taxes. “Sales tax” and property tax would negatively impact their efforts. I am agnostic atheist and do not believe the fairy tales but I am not so pessimistic as to not see what good things otherwise great people provide to struggling communities.

It's not the small town churches from shit hole Arkansas that's the contentious issue here. It's the multi-billion dollar monoliths that are used by their beneficiaries to launder money behind the 501(c)3 wall.

Most the the mormon church's wealth is not actually in the church itself. They also have a corporation by their same name, and it is taxed as a corporation. This is why they can remain both a church/non-profit and be ridiculously wealthy. The sections of their organization that make the most money are taxed... though they use every legal loophole they can to avoid as much tax burden as they can.

They also have a considerable amount of real-estate, which is privately traded between about a dozen top level members, but isn't actually owned by the church itself, so despite basically being "for the church" it isn't legally responsible for that real estate.

Making the actual religious organization pay taxes would actually be a minisculely small pittance compared to the overall group's total wealth. It would do almost nothing.

The LDS church has more than $32 billion invested in the stock market. The church gives around $40 million a year in charity.....

I feel like allowing church's to push political agendas is against the separation of church and state. A church should not be telling people how to vote.

Separation of church and state was meant for the examples of state run or church run of the state like in the Anglican Church in the U.K. It was not meant to say no church could be invested in politics.

I hate religion. I think it's cancer for the weak. But I know where the sentiment from the founders came from in the separation of church and state and it is not what you're alluding.

I agree, religion should not be constrained from political speech or involvement but they should also not be supported through tax breaks. We should not have laws that enforce specific religious morality or that bans religious practice. I don’t give a fuck if your religious beliefs include sobriety or dietary restriction, keep it to yourself and stay the fuck off my lawn with that shit. If I want to smoke some pork or take a few marijuanas it is my own damn business, as long as I maintain productivity as a member of society no one is harmed.

It's that way for a reason. History has shown that it works out poorly as taxes are used to opress unpopular religions. That's why we have the scheme we have today.

But clearly we are seeing the other side of the coin here; the system is clearly being abused for profit. We need to come up with guidlines to differentiate between the religion itself and the massive endowments/PACs/etc. That they control that clearly should not be tax exempt.

Terrible idea

because they hurt your feelings? tons of tax free organizations push social issues, including federally funded ones

I have heard they also maintain controlling stock in a major rail road, and to a lesser extent Wells Fargo. If I had sources I would sight them, however the information comes from both company men, as well as union railroad employees. Perhaps they can’t compete with the Catholic Church, but Mormons have always maintained highly sound business strategy to ensure deep pockets.

It doesn’t have to be a conspiracy. They are invested in pharma because it’s a good investment. Marijuana is against their religion so even if they weren’t invested in pharma they would still campaign against it.

You are entirely right, but it's way more fun as a conspiracy :D

Yeah, I mean maybe there’d be something to this if an inordinate percentage of their portfolio were dedicated to pharma, but is this really a surprise? Of course Mormons are anti-weed, come on.

And any large institution with an endowment, regardless of tax status, will hold a lot of securities. Does everyone think it’s all cash under a mattress,?

You mean the religion that forbids its practitioners from drinking alcohol or caffeine would be against marijuana???!

They do not forbid caffeine. You can drink a Coke or a Pepsi just fine as a Mormon. IIRC, a bishop got in trouble for telling members that they were not allowed to drink caffeine in sodas. It is just coffee disallowed due to it's daily addictive nature.

Should be mentioned that op frequents the exmormon sub and spends an inordinate amount of time pushing that agenda. That's what we're seeing here.

While spreading incorrect information. Here's an explanation about the situation from u/grim_washington:

So here's the logic:

1. The LDS Church owns the domains of several finance companies
2. Therefore the LDS Church owns the finance companies
3. Therefore the LDS Church owns ALL THE MONEY MANAGED BY THE FINANCE COMPANIES.

While I suppose this is possible, it's making a few leaps.

1. The LDS Church owns the domains of several finance companies. proven true -
2. Therefore the LDS Church owns the finance companies. likely, but not proven. It may own a part, or all
3. Therefore the LDS Church owns all the money managed by these companies. Almost certainly false. The requirement is that the company file form 13f if they're managing over 100 million dollars. That does not mean these companies OWN that money. They are literally financial managers - trying to help investors make more money.

These are businesses owned by the church like any other business, and they make profit like any other business. Their assets under management are NOT owned by the LDS church.

The big pharma claim of 1b is coming from this leak of 32b in assets which 17 financial management companies control. You'll note the assumption is that the 32b in funds controlled by these financial companies for their customers is being assumed to be solely the LDS Church. So OP is taking a leap of logic to conclude the LDS Church has 1b invested in big pharma, when the only info we know is that these financial management companies are controlling 2b worth of assets of various customers which may or may not be the LDS Church's money.

Further, the LDS Church was fine with a medical marijuana bill in 2016 - bill SB 89. So the LDS Church isn't even against medical marijuana, they are specifically against the current medical marijuana initiative as they feel it doesn't sufficiently regulate medical marijuana use.

It's just a bunch of misinformation.

Excellent summary.

Yes, the reason they were so against the proposed bill is they felt it was simply a legalization bill in disguise - very easy to abuse.

The LDS church takes in between 7 and 11 BILLION (depending on who you aka) dollars per year in member tithes and fast offerings alone.

Having $32 billion in the stock market is chump change.

Just as toxic as the LDS sub that they hate 🙄

Even if it is against their religion and there is no profit incentivr, they are clearly spending money for political purposes, and money spent in that way should not be shielded from taxes because of their religious status.

If they wany to venture outside of religion and into politics to lobby for their beliefs that is totally fine, but they should have to pay taxes on that money just like everyone else.

Yeah, the conspiracy angle here is ridiculously dumb.

Utah represents a very tiny portion of the pharmaceutical market. Protecting that one state would do very little to preserve the profits of Big Pharma.

Additionally, if they saw medical marijuana as a big threat to part of their investment portfolio they could, you know, just start divesting themselves of that portion of their portfolio.

Instead, like with gay marriage, their campaign initiatives are more likely driven by their ideology.

Shameless self-peddling: https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/8mn1hz/it_stinks_to_high_heaven_when_top_cops_are/

I mean it's a religion made by a scam artist. The Mormon elite are just living his legacy. I really don't know how anybody could be Mormon.

well, things like smith's pedophilia, polygamy and huge holes in his prohpecies are something the church never, ever speaks about. if you grew up in the church or are a convert that never does any research on it, you wouldn't know.

The god makers, 1 and 2. They are a tsoukalos away from ancient aliens.

...what...?

You leave that beautiful man out of this.

It’s brainwashing. If you grow up being told that something is true, and you’re only exposed to an approved narrative, it’s very easy to believe. Your mom, dad, Grandma, grandpa, friends, and everyone you know and respect constantly tells you that they know it’s true. The church strongly encourages members to “bear testimony” to each other often.

Also, the strongest weapon they have IMO, is that they teach you from childhood that there is only one way to know truth, and that is through the “spirit” or “Holy Ghost”. Which basically means good feelings. So logic<good feelings. So to true believing members, no amount of logic can overcome the good feelings they had at church one time.

And any of this is shocking....smh. Thank you though OP for bringing this to light so more and more people can see the evidence of blatant hypocrisy in this world.

My question is why is the “church” buying stock? I thought they were to help the needy and sick not get rich. It’s time to tax the church.

Been a long time coming. Not sure why they aren't taxed in the first place

I mean I can understand why some aren’t. I no longer attend church but when I did the only money we had saved in the church fund was 10k. We had a policy to never keep more then that. All of our money went to pay the preacher and to help the needy. Did he file taxes? I don’t know. That’s completely on him.

Please note: I am not defending the church or their practices, at all. But to clarify, they are a couple of different entities, they are the church, and then they are the corporation. They don't pay taxes as a church, they do pay taxes as a corporation.

All money made off of these investments is taxed. No tithing money was directly used to make the investments (of course all of the money the church has at one point was seeded by tithing but they do now keep the two at arms length).

I think all churches should be taxed, flat out, but until they are, I'm sure the church will legally keep the two entities separate, at least on paper and in the finance books.

Arms length? not possible.

if any money from one goes into the other, both should be taxed.

for real.

every penny of that money should have been spent on charitable works.

By investing the money, they have more money to spend on charitable works, no? It's idiotic to not invest. Come on.

Isn't the Mormon people supposed to not use pharms? Maybe I am wrong but for some reason I have a memory if hearing about no pharms, caffeine, alcohol.

No, Mormons are allowed to use drugs prescribed by their doctor. But caffeine, alcohol, tobacco are all against their creed. However, because they don't drink, smoke, or use caffeine, they also need another way to destress, so many Mormons are also on Zoloft, Xanax, and opiates. Salt Lake City has a huge opiate problem, and one of the highest psych drug prescription rates as well if memory serves.

Thank you for the explanation

You're thinking of Christian Scientists, and then only kind of.

What a bunch of selfish, brainwashed, unintelligent, and ass backwards people. Trying to tell people who find relief in a plant that what they are doing is evil.

I think they should be fucking stoned publicly in the streets..... on some of that high gradee lol. But seriously sounds like they could use a joint or six.

You should be more concerned that genealogy will be sold to insurance companies.

Mormoney more problems

Totaly under rated comment holy shit that's great, I spit out my tea laughing

holy ghost shit

This is gold.

This is SPARTA!

This is weak.

Just like the gold plates!

Then pony up and gild the man

Lmao you’re “going to hell” for that one

Mormon hell. So what is that? I don’t know what the opposite of something completely made up is.

Something not completely made up? I'm just spitballin here

Where you can drink all the coffee you want.

It’s called Outer Darkness. It’s separate from all the other heavens and earth and is where Satan is.

Money laundering Gods who teach them their ancient magiks then send them back to Utah.

Every Organized Religion is just big business. George Carlin (RIP) says it best.

Led by their divine profit

Lol

😂

Mormons love their Zoloft.

It always comes down to money, no matter how religious you are.

Literal blood money

They also recruit the impoverished to their church hard. They want to be your savior, but are really the devil himself. Live near one of the largest Mormon populations in the world and they disgust me. Without a doubt, the most functionally 2-faced groups of people I have ever met.

Ive been in the Mormon church subject to my Mormon parents for years and know the nicest most loving people that participate in the church. They dont “recruit” those in need, they do service for those in need. Maybe you could learn a bit from that?

Its the doctrine and leadership that needs fixing.

Here’s the problem with this theory - even if every Utah patient who could benefit from medical marijuana took it and completely stopped taking a pharmaceutical alternative made by one of these companies, there would be ZERO impact on these share prices. Utah just isn’t big enough (less than 1% of the US population, and healthier than average), AND these companies all make lots and lots of products used for things medical marijuana wouldn’t affect (like shampoo and sunscreen and band aids), AND most of their medicines treat conditions marijuana doesn’t treat, AND a lot of their revenue comes from sales outside the US. I’m sympathetic to the idea that religious organizations get away with things they shouldn’t, but there’s no logic to support this connection.

Op is heavy exmormon, this is just him pushing their agenda with partial truths and a sensationalistic headline. Sad really

What does being an ex Mormon have to do with this?

/u/manvscar is heavy mormon and is frustrated with his fake church being exposed

Yeah bro

Bias. With this particular submission, his bias is evident through the multiple assumptions he makes. Described here in better detail than I can give: https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/8o99tx/the_mormon_church_came_out_hard_against_utahs/e022qgj/

So OP has personal experience in what he is talking about? How dare he!

I'm exmormon and cannot stand the vibe around r/exmormon, for example. A lot of these people get more into anti-mormon advocacy than they ever were into Mormonism. I feel like the best way to be ex-anything is to stop focusing so much time & attention on that thing.

Attention is attention, positive or negative. Either way it still fuels the machine.

That's my point exactly. It's a toxic environment and it obviously fuels his submissions.

So if hating people and religions that are homophobic, raciest and want to see children and sick people suffer for their medicine. Fuck yea count me in.

children and sick people suffer

Right, which is why they are one of the largest humanitarian relief efforts in the entire world.

I don't agree with their stance on legalization, but if you read any of the explanations you'd realize there were some massive assumptions in op's post. https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/8o99tx/the_mormon_church_came_out_hard_against_utahs/e022qgj/

Oh give me a break. This is stupid

How so?

Why? Do you think the antidepressants advertised on I-15 billboards in Utah County are working?

Who knows. Why does this have to do with the Mormon? The idea that the Mormon church is against marijuana because of their stock holdings in drug companies is pretty absurd.

Would you not want to protect your investment in Oil, from these newfangled electric cars? Same idea.

It’s the wrong idea. We’ve tried electric cars before and it didn’t work. Edison desperately tried to make one that is affordable and usable but eventually lost out to the superiority of the ICE. The story will play out the same way this time

So then Volvo is going down the drain? And Tesla? Science is not a stagnant, ideology-driven entity, it will always move above and beyond.

That’s a nice sounding phrase but utterly meaningless.

Tesla has negative cash flow of a billion a quarter? And is not profitable. Who cares about Volvo. As far as I’m aware there isn’t a single electric car that is profitable, chevy loses 8k on every volt it sells.

The only way electric cars will be better than gas cars is if you crush the ICE with onerous regulations. Sorry it’s just facts.

We’ve tried electric cars before and it didn’t work.

bad example.

or you could read about the GM Streetcar bit.

The electric car/streetcar was torpedoed by entities with a vested interest in internal combustion engines.

You believe this conspiratard shit?

Ford killed the electric car, even after Edison invented a brand new battery that was much better than old batteries. Why? Cause it still sucked. It still sucks today in comparison to the ICE. it isn’t a conspiracy it’s engineering.

The odd thing is that this is the first time I have heard of a church owning stocks. Presbyterians do not do this.

Pathetic. Churches should not gamble, which is what stocks are. Just merely educated gambling.

Pay taxes

All religions makes money off of sick people, when you think about it. But if they want to get involved in legislation, they need to start paying taxes or GTFO.

Orfanized Religion: Pulling the wool over your head since will was cool.

i have no doubt this is true. my friend is a dr in utah. says half of the mormon housewivew are pill addicts

What a silly cult

What isn't a cult? No one has the answers, but everyone I know claims to, whether that be religion, political, drug induced, science, etc.

Are the capital gains taxable from the stocks they own?

The church operates as two separate entities. One is a church, one is a corporation. It's the corporation that does all of the investing, and yes, the corporation is taxed like any other.

It's going to take a large go fund me page to even make a dent on the political influence major religious organizations are earning from people that believe donating money to a church is getting them closer to them pearly gates. It's sickening, but at this rate, their power will still grow and everyone else will suffer.

Tithing isn't supposed to be one of those dumb pay to get to the gates thing, it's always been to help struggling members and general upkeep of the buildings. The money from socks is used for the same things along with funding the supplies and help they give to people after disasters.

And why does this not surprise me?

It likely had something to do with both religion and money. Those things are not mutually exclusive.

T-A-X

Don't entirely agree with OP. Mormon Church is extremely conservative. They have their own rules and ways of life. Money isn't the end all be all here.

Just look at Utah's bizarre liquor laws. You can't pour alcohol in front of the customer, it has to be done behind a screen or whatever. You've got polygamy going on in some parts. They don't even drink coffee for crying out loud. They don't behave like this for money, this has nothing to do with money. It's just their way of life.

Add to this their little secret societies where they have these nicknames and meet to talk about the latest social issues they need to tackle.

The fact they own stock in big pharma just means they are smart business people. Mitt Romney didn't get rich for no reason. That doesn't change the fact that they have 10 million rules for living because that's how they roll, and medical marijuana doesn't fit into their commandments.

This is my surprised face.

: |

Why doesn't the church just invest in medical marijuana, then? They have the cash to invest. Marijuana is clearly profitable as a medicine. Why continue on this path?

I don't see how the source is legit. Can someone explain?

It has everything to do with religion, in the sense that religion itself is a mode of social control and a means to profit for those within the clergy. Attention theists: fuck your rules, fuck your lies, and most of all, fuck your god. Swine, the lot of you.

honestly i’m not surprise i believe most of these religious societies have their own personal agenda when it come to politics.

Oh my gosh! So the Mormon Church is protecting it's investments and self interests?!!!?! OMG

To be honest, I don't see anything wrong with that as far as I know, it's fine to oppose marijuana and support traditional medicine. Now I haven't followed the debate and how hard they opposed medical marijuana, so the issue might lie there. I don't know.

Past me: "We don't have money for tithing right now. It's the one thing we just can't do."
Bishop: "You must have faith, even if it's your last $5.00, God will find you a way."
Past Me: "Gives $4.00"

Eats Ramen for a month.

Bishop/higher ups: "Alright, we have our goal let's put this into our big pharma stocks and make sure we get that statement out this Sunday in sacrament encouraging tithing, please call x,y,z to share their testimony on tithing."

Blind follower: "Got it, boy this feels good."

Me: "God I'm hungry, *Prays*"

Next paycheck... repeat.

One year ago, I left the church after my diagnosis with Crohn's. They didn't even care to ask how I was in Jan when I went to a "maybe this is a faith thing," bishop meeting. All he cared to ask was do I pay tithing and do I pray, does my husband wear his garments, if not we must buy more.

Uhm, fuck that, glad to be done.

This isn’t a conspiracy, it’s a proven fact.

Only very recently was it proven so (like last week). The LDS church has never been transparent about their finances.

They are also heavily invested in marinol.

I don't know why but, I'm shocked.

Did the church change its stance on the issue? Or has it always been against pot?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannabis_and_Latter-day_Saints#Early_prohibitions

The Mormon Church basically owns the State of Utah.

As a non-Mormon living in Utah, this is fucked up

Tax free tho!!!

This is so fucked up

I have a tough time reading leaks like these. Where is it implied any of this stock is owned by the morman church?

Bro what you don’t know. Is they actually have medical grows. A good friend of mine is a major player in the cannabis industry that lives up in Seattle. Well he’s been an advisor from them on there large scale grows. The ownership doesn’t directly say Church of Latter Day Saints, but they’re theirs for sure. There all about the money

Fuck the Mormon cult

They forbid alcohol and caffeine, why are you people surprised they are against a thinly veiled attempt to get high.

Of course it was about money. All cults are about money.

Mormon church is also big in trucking industry

Not really defending the Mormon church....BUT....I’ve seen this narrative bouncing around several subs. This has nothing to do with the money. The Mormon church uses puts its money in the stock market, real estate, bonds, etc. Their funds are heavily diversified. I’m sure the plan is so they can keep building churches and temples etc until the end of the world...any day now lol.

If the head line read “Mormon church has 3% of their stock market assets invested in American house hold goods companies, including some pharmaceutical companies” that would be a lot more accurate. I totally agree that non profit (ie religious organizations) should not be allowed to use money to lobby or push a political agenda. But in reality that is going to be a tough but to crack. First step is to over turn citizens united. Until then money is free speech, and we are stuck following the golden rule. Those with the gold makes the rules.

Thanks for the stock tips, mate!

It could still have something to do with the cult that doesn’t like drinking or drugs or caffiene.

What do you expect from an organization whose founder raped his own children daily?

Tax the church. Its a business.

But let's not tax them lol ok.

well large medical companies could benefit from medical marijuana research, the moron position is probably based on out of date moral outrage instead of common sense.

But, you know...they’re a Church too.

If anyone is gonna oppose fun stuff like weed/good times, it’s gonna be either Churches, “Parents Against ....” Gropius or rival industries.

Not as much of a conspiracy as BAU.

More money to pay fo they weird white under garments.

Ironic considering Smith had to be smoking something when he came up with this goofball religion.

Welcome to US of A.

Why don’t they just invest in weed?

Indirectly they are

They're invested in corporations that are actively engaged in pushing opioids, and yet somehow they have moral authority to come out against cannabis.
The mormon church needs a good ass-whippin.

Saw this earlier and was like "I should TOTALLY xpost this to r/conspiracy.

Great minds.

So opioids = jesus ?

It's a corporation hiding behind a church.

All for tax purposes. The church is a real estate & $$ holding company.

The only conspiracy here is this conspiracy theory being spammed all over reddit

"Follow the money." -boogie2988

So I feel like this is my field of expertise as I am a mormon/smoker/conspiracy lover and while I do agree that this does like pretty shady you have to keep in mind a few things. 1. The leaders of the Mormon church are experts in their fields, some doctors, some lawyers and they put aside their career to work with the church, those who do it full time get paid a wage that would be a fraction of what they were earning in their careers so they are not personally benefiting from these stocks. 2. As having a number who are experts in the field of medicine it makes sense for them to want to invest in pharma’s researching cures and medicines. 3. The stance against smoking weed is labeled out in the “word of wisdom” where you do not partake in addictive/habit forming substances (in b4 “weed isn’t addictive”). I can say easily that I’m addicted to smoking weed, not from any addictive substances but more addicted to the feeling, it is a demotivator and therefore the church continues to hold its stance against it just as it does with same sex marriage/alcohol etc.

TL;DR Although it looks shady I think their heart is in the right place.

The “living allowance” church leaders are paid was $120,000 in 2014 according to leaked documents. You claim many of them are “leaders in their field” which seems arbitrary but even so $120,000 (which has probably gone up in 4 years) is more than a fraction and it all comes from financial investments according to the church

These guys are basically working 24/7 travelling the world away from their families.

Using the example of Dallin H Oaks he was a justice in the Supreme Court, and then moved over to working full time with the church spending twice as much time away from his family to earn a lot less.

It isn’t a step up so if you are out for personal gain it would be a ridiculous decision. Not saying there’s nothing to see, you can decide for yourself. But (can’t find the source sorry) there’s already been investigations by journalists into the lds churches leaders to see if there was any evidence of money fraud and they take one look at these leaders homes and it says enough.

They don't pay tithing. Its a play on words. Tithing to a general authority means time. The top dogs to represent the church as a job and the time is tithing.

They have a limitless charge card, all travel is 1st class and taken care of.

Genesis 1:29 And God said, “Behold, I have given you every plant yielding seed that is on the face of all the earth, and every tree with seed in its fruit. You shall have them for food."

The bible says all plants are a gift from god.

It is only a problem if you believe the people who claim marijuana cures all sorts of diseases. Big pharma won't be hurt by legal weed.

It already is being hurt, right now.

Is this an American thing? In UK you get prescriptions for free.

You get it not for free but pay for it in Colorado and Oregon just like shopping in a grocer, and the state and feds can't arrest you for it.

Some states like Hawaii have medical dispensaries, but you have to have a prescription.

Well alright

Im in the Mormon church right now subject to my parents and I hate how Mormons preach helping everyone/love thy neighbor yet turn a blind eye to the research behind the extreme benefits of medical marijuana.

They pay capital gains tax on this, right? Right?

No. The gains are donated back to the church.in kind donation.

Oh wonderful.

Yeah. Umm. This isn't really new or anything. Long time ago, the church of matter day saints was firmly against drinking soda. Then, this magical thing happened, the church bought heavily into Coca-Cola stock. After that, soda wasn't bad anymore. And can you guess that any church owned or affiliated restaurants carried coke products.

Hell, the church wouldn't allow black people until they were sued, in the 1980s. Fuck, you couldn't even go into the temple unless you were white enough, ie brown was a no go.

This is part of why I’m a happy r/ExMormon

as an ex-member. I'm glad I'm able to see now the real side of the church.

Surprise, surprise /s

It has everything to do with money. Have you ever seen Big Love?

Its almost like a bunch of asshole pedophiles from upstate New York made a cult to con people out of money.

Oh wait...

It's all about the money.. pathetic to say the least.

Here is the link to the Mormon Church statement on the Utah Legislation initiative to legalizing marijuana.

(http://www.ldsliving.com/Church-Releases-Analysis-of-Statement-on-Medical-Marijuana-Initiative/s/88464?utm_source=ldsliving&amp;utm_medium=email)

I knew it was just a cult but I had hoped it was benign and not a money grabbing one. About time I found out.

I live in Utah and the Mormon Church has investments to sustain all the properties they own and build worldwide. Church Buildings, Temples, welfare farms and facilities, charities, a handful of colleges besides BYU, Mission Homes, Seminary Buildings, Travel for the General Authorities world wide and the list goes on. Along with the building, upkeep and maintenance of all their properties they also provide a living for all of those in their employ, benefits and retirement. They manage the Church funds frugally and smart with investments like many other churches and organizations. The General Authorities make their own living and were mostly successful before their callings but live modestly. No one is living high on the hog using church funds. The current Prophet has a home in Midway, we lived not far from it. It is a normal modest home for a brain surgeon where they raised their large family. Please stop trying to create conspiracy theories about the Mormon Church. If you would like to look on their website it has all the charities, welfare missions, etc, listed. The Church teaches patriotism, the rule of law, and love of the constitution. Like all parts of society the Church also has it share of shady people who are members. And the break off Mormon groups have their own teachings that don't jive with the Mormon Church or the law. Please don't smear the Church with innuendo. Many of you who have retirement in 401 accounts are also invested in mass group accounts are in the same investments as the ones listed above. It's not wrong. Many of the patriots here and other places are good Mormons and are on the same side as everyone here.

Every for profit church business ultimately only donates to the church for tax purposes and doesn't pay taxes because of the offset.

Of course thechurch non profit doesnt pay either.

https://mormonleaks.io/newsroom/2018/05/30/mormonleaks-compiles-information-connecting-mormon-church-to-32-billion-of-investments/

"Today MormonLeaks™ releases a compilation of information connecting the Mormon Church to 13 companies who collectively owned over $32 billion of shares in the United States stock market at the end of 2017."

This is only 32 billion that has been found.

These companies also donate their profits as contributions to the church.

I suspect the church has 300 to 400 billion parked away in assests like land, buildings, companies, holdings and investments.

In the late 1800s the goal was the for the church to do well and then not ask for tithing. Yet the members continue to pay because they THINK they are BLESSED FOR IT. LOL!

Members do first of all because God commanded the paying of a tithe. The blessings come from obeying any and all commands of God. Some call it Karma, others, you sow what you reap, we call it the law of the harvest. All the same natural laws.

Tithing is a false idea. Its from the old testament. Jesus never cared about tithing but the LDS Corporation church lobrs the tax free donations.

What about all the bad financial woes and failure that happen even though a member does pays tithing. Oh, they call those trials. Financial disasters while following God's rulebook is somehow supposed to help someone spirutuallym. Nobody highlights the failures in Sacrament meeting testiminials shared. Only the good things that a member connects in their own mind that was coincidental but the member self programs to make the rxperience a tithing blessing.

Tithing is just a foolish person bondage parting with their money.

If tithing was a real principle and gave blessings then church going tithe givers should be some of the most happy and successful folks on Earth bathing on blessings and good luck. Yet they are not. Oh that's right ..only the meek shall inherit the Earth...so the bible says Bwahaha..such rubbish!

Utah has highest rate of mental illness in US https://www.heraldextra.com/news/local/utah-has-highest-rate-of-mental-illness-in-us/article_053ef820-584d-5930-953e-c75548be7c5c.html

Which I've always suspected might be connected to the church's stances against homosexuality, caffeine, alcohol, therapy, sex before marriage and logical thinking. So they keep the membership depressed, then invest in Big Pharma. Nice business model.

7k upvotes in 24 hours? average online users, 2k.

sounds legit.....

/s

the mormons clearly have pissed off someone with a massive bot army....

fuck the church and fuck religion.

Thought this was /r/exmormon

I remember this being a thing when I used to hear about the Morman church, it was seen as a sin to have anything with caffeine for a long time. I had Morman friends that would have to comment about how they are not allowed to have soda. I accepted as if they were closer to Quakers or something.

Then one day out of the blue it was okay for them to have Coca-Cola products. A bit specific. I heard later on that the church had established financial ties to Coca-Cola that year.

Richest religious organization in the world

Traditionally, I'd expect the Christian community to be more for medical marijuana than for big pharma. Greed for profit may be popular in mainstream Christianity, but certainly not traditional. Satan wins a large majority of the battles, but he won't win the war!

They're fkin mormons. You kick them off your porch for showing up to talk about religion. You kick them out when they talk about banning pot as well. No different.

they still won't tell me how magnets work.

Not the first time the Mor(m)ons engage in the "theology" of profit.

Back in the 1970s, the Polygamist-In-Chief suddenly decided that Black people "no longer" had the Mark of Cain because the church's racism was jeopardizing BYU'S opportunities to compete in lucrative NCAA competitions.

A billion in pharma stocks is nothing, the average pension fund, wow - just look at some market caps. Plus you can do both. Smoking gun this is not.

Correlation doesn’t guarantee causation. Plus, the fact that an org has lots of money doesn’t mean it’s corrupt.

i paid tree fiddy to get in here and I want to see a fight for the love of Gabe newell!

sweet, something thats Not about Bitcoin

damn good one, will contemplate this one

Regardless of the true intentions and motives of the Mormon community the facts are still the same.

Smoking Marijuana is a toXin to Your lungs, cardiovascular system and a toXin to Your nervous system.

Smoking Marijuana is a danger to the child that a man or a woman produces, causing health problems for the child in its mental and physical development.

Even in children and young adolescent adults, Smoking Marijuana is very dangerous. If You smoke enough Marijuana You cannot operate anything technical and it is dangerous to drive or do anything such as driving or mechanical operations.

You wait for some time to pass while You " Come Down " from Your high. Alcohol is the same, same health risks if You drink large and frequent amounts of alcohol You will risk Your organs health and also is dangerous to the health of a baby in the womb.

However with alcohol - it is totally legal, people do not go to prison or get into any trouble for having an unopened case of beer or an unopened bottle of whiskey in the trunk or back seat.

Therefore people tend to abuse and overdrink and even drink and drive because it is completely legal to possess alcohol.

In Colorado, The 2013-16 period saw a 40 percent increase in the number of all drivers involved in fatal crashes in Colorado, from 627 to 880, according to the NHTSA data. Those who tested positive for alcohol in fatal crashes from 2013 to 2015 — figures for 2016 were not available — grew 17 percent, from 129 to 151.

By contrast, the number of drivers who tested positive for marijuana use jumped 145 percent — from 47 in 2013 to 115 in 2016. During that time, the prevalence of testing drivers for marijuana use did not change appreciably, federal fatal-crash data show.

And the numbers probably are even higher.

State law does not require coroners to test deceased drivers specifically for marijuana use in fatal wrecks — some do and some don’t — and many police agencies say they don’t pursue cannabinoid tests of a surviving driver whose blood alcohol level is already high enough to charge them with a crime.

“I never understood how we’d pass a law without first understanding the impact better,” said Barbara Deckert, whose fiancée, Ron Edwards, was killed in 2015 in a collision with a driver who tested positive for marijuana use below the legal limit and charged only with careless driving.

Marijuana should be more regulated IF the government wants to make it legal, the government should crack down on DUIs just like they do with Alcohol.

Damn son thats really some pro level shit.

I paid tree fiddy to get in here and I want to see fistycuffs gosh darn it!

what time is the Site maintenence today?

i found a rat on this sub-reddit

What in tarnation is reddit gold?

Pay total attention men, this sh-t is gold

Sounds like standard reddit-fare actually. Just have to know the right buttons to push, even if the information is misleading.

Dont talk to ANYONE about it and you will be safe forever. Ive done jail time because of one error, telling the ex wife. Grew for 3 years without a single hiccup in a nice suburb in UT til she gave the tip. Get a good setup and dont use more than about 8kw of lights.

I would really recommend you buy a piece of property for cheap that you can grow on legally and just do outdoor there. Your ladies will thank you for the sunlight.

r/microgrowery

I find the best place to get seeds is from Britain, there's a few good sites listed in their sidebar. Get a small growlight off amazon and start off with autoflower plants. After that, work up to bigger things.