When my employer matches me at 5 or 6%... i'm taking it.

Ride the wave! It does go down, but it also goes back up

Few companies offer more than .50 cents match for every dollar vested and 6 years is needed for 100% vested time. There are places that match $1 for $1 up to 4% rather than 6%. I just send it to a roth IRA.

Too bad I didn't pitch in $20 Grand to Jeff Bezos 23 years ago. I could of had a 12 Million % return.

My last employer was 1:1 at 6% and no vestment period. Admittedly, never seen such a thing before.

My employer matches dollar for dollar up to 6%. They also put 1% of their own money in a 401k in for us no matter if we sign up or not.

Some employers are trying to be the change. I have a lot of respect for that. The one i'm talking about also paid for your Aflac. Any doctor shit happened, I would get nice checks to cover everything. Saved my ass a few times with my wife's issues.

You do know there are Roth 401k options that tax contributions but not withdrawals, so the opposite of traditional 401k, you need to pick the one better suited to you. When you sign up they make it pretty clear what your options are and how it works. The bigger issue is that 95% of this country are financially illiterate don’t know the basics of retirement accounts.

I didn’t say you were or weren’t. I said 95% of the country is. I work at a broker/dealer, what’s your point?

Nah I agree in part with your premise. People sign up for 401ks all the time without understanding how it works, what they can and can’t do, or what options they have. To me it has more to do with education. I didn’t take any sort of finance type class until college and even then it was never necessary except for that being in my field of study.

You definitely are

Uh... you sure about that? You don't pay capital gains on 401k withdrawals.

I just tried, while i can't take 100% of my roth/401k out, i can still access a percentage on the spot.

sure you can. I took about $10,000 out of mine to buy a house. had to pay normal taxes and a 10% early withdrawl penalty to uncle sam since it wasn't my first home purchase. but anyone who is vested can pull their money out at any time. if you're not fully vested, you lose the employer matching funds. each company's vesting period varies. mine was either 1 or 3 years. don't recall.

It seems like you don't understand a vesting schedule...

Ohhh but matching. Free money, right? For e

How is it a Ponzi scheme when I am 100% vested in my retirement account and can roll it into a self-directed IRA whenever I leave the company? And I don't have to invest in stocks. I can tie it up in cash, invest in a money market fund, etc. You're crazy if you don't take the free money match and deferred taxes.

Seriously though, what is the preferable option for retirement saving? A pension that can be raided and literally go to zero at any time? Putting your cash in the bank to earn 0% return?

No thanks. I'm 41 and have about $155,000 put aside right now. I can tap that for interest-free loans if I ever need the funds, or I can hold it until I'm in my 60s - which is what I plan to do.

Not to mention you're usually investing in Rockefeller or Rothschild funds, big oil, etc.

Many firms have self directed 401k which would allow you to avoid whatever you want

Don’t put your money in a 401k lol the money won’t be there when you retire.. by gold

William Devane, is that you?

Just look at their logos. They are all part of the scam: https://imgur.com/a/Z0RLpLb

r/uselessredcircle

The premise is that you get to put in “tax free” money...only what many don’t realize is that it WILL be taxed later, when you need it most, and from it being a larger amount most likely in a significantly higher tax bracket, let alone capital gains tax.

No, that's the opposite of the premise. You're not supposed to take your 401k as a lump sum, you're supposed to draw from it like a salary, but lower than when you were working so it's taxed at a lower bracket.

If you want all that money the day you turn 60, you shouldn't use a 401k because then you're not taking advantage of the benefits. It's meant to replace a pension, not to be used as an investment portfolio.

Back to the taxed at a higher bracket thing. You may be taxed in a higher bracket but at the same time you're gaining interest on roughly 30 percent more of your money by investing tax free. Over 40 years that could be hundreds of thousands of dollars. I think it probably comes out about the same investing in a standard 401k or a Roth when it's all said and done.

The premise is that you get to put in “tax free” money...only what many don’t realize is that it WILL be taxed later, when you need it most, and from it being a larger amount most likely in a significantly higher tax bracket, let alone capital gains tax.

You take the money out in small amounts once you reach retirement, when you will most likely be either unemployed or in a lower tax bracket than you were in your prime earning years. This way you're paying less taxes on the money than you would have, after it has been allowed to grow for decades. And you don't pay capital gains taxes on it...

It also isn’t a sure thing, depending on how “lucky” you are with the year you retire, like those around 2008, you could potentially lose everything.

As you get closer to retirement age you should be shifting your portfolio away from risky investments into less risky ones. Then the market crashing right when you retire won't impact you as much.

Every month you are paying in to literal corporations. This is making the rich richer, at your expense. It is no wonder they don’t let you take it out without penalty until age 59, because they are banking on the fact you will be DEAD by then

Even if you die before you can withdraw from it, the money doesn't just vanish... It goes to your family. So what exactly are "they" "banking" on?

Ohhh but matching. Free money, right? For every dollar of a company that matches gives you they statiscally take 99 cents back to cover it. If you don’t work there for at least 6 years you lose their match anyway.

How are they taking this money back?

Also many companies don't have a vesting period... Once my employer match goes in, it is mine to keep even if I quit the next day.

Nicely said. Saved me the time from having to address a "conspiracy" based on financial illiteracy.

I agree with the OP this is a horrifying scam. More of us are being forced to withdraw prematurely. YES it jacks up your tax rate to the roof, then they penalize you an additional 10%. One year I paid over 100,000 in taxes, forced to due to circumstances beyond my control.

The only way you should go the 401K route is if you receive a company match.

The worst travesty of this all is the zero interest rate on savings which miraculously started when the Baby Boom wave was incoming. Even if you saved enough, the fuckers stopped paying interest! So no wonder we have to take money out.

We need a GEEZER MARCH ON WASHINGTON so they can shoot us instead of cleaning us out slowly when we're too old to do anything about it.

100,000 think about the road outside your place going to shit. Or teachers pushing gender fluidity on your children. Now where did that money actually go?

It went to pay interest on the Rothschild's Bank Mafia. In turn it went to their nephews for whores and liquor in Eastern European skank holes.

Ouch you work in finance and accounting and you believe this? My undergrad was finance and grad was an MPA. Hopefully you can get a better grasp on how important a 401k is as you progress in your career.

You can take money out without a "hardship"

A piece of the puzzle you are missing is that the traders and companies can accurately forecast the number, timing, and amount that specific stocks will be purchased regardless of the price.

that is very powerful information that can be used to bet against

I don’t know much about this world or it’s stupid finances but any sort of a scheme that gets you to put money in now in hopes for the future that it will be there sounds like a scam to me. Sure it could work but it may not. Then you have nothing to blame but yourself for falling for it. I have zero savings to my name and that’s OK. I take full responsibility of that. But at least I am not falling victim like it seems like many people are to these retirement schemes. People on this sub think there’s a conspiracy everywhere you turn (and there is most of the time) but think for a second that their finances and retirement accounts are safe. Guarantee there’s going to be some Fuckery down the line to get money out of those to. Just wait-and-see. I had friends in the past gloat about their 401(k)s and Roths and all that bullshit and I’m like yeah but what if you just get hit by a bus tomorrow? Then you don’t see any of that money. And I guarantee you they don’t pay it out to your family when you die. It’s just all unclaimed in a big pool and I’m sure somewhere down the line it gets funneled out into some asshole greedy person‘s pocket. Corruption has leaked into every single facet on this planet. What makes you think for a second that there’s no corruption within your silly little retirement plans?” BUT BUT Its on official paper! Its real! My moneys!” Pleeeeaase.

Investing can be tricky and I think many people will be screwed when they are older. The credit crunch amount is over $1 trillion and student debt is crazy.

100,000 think about the road outside your place going to shit. Or teachers pushing gender fluidity on your children. Now where did that money actually go?

It went to pay interest on the Rothschild's Bank Mafia. In turn it went to their nephews for whores and liquor in Eastern European skank holes.