Ever since the Trump/Clinton "election" I have thrown out polarized perspectives such as left/right, atheist/christian, anti-vaxx/pro-vax and I am re-training myself to "think" as opposed to hopping aboard the critical theory train of destruction and opposition. It is a ploy and we cannot buy into it. Great observation OP.

My realization came with the christian/atheist thing. Atheists are very "devoted" and "faithful" and often hold strong "beliefs" like Christians do so why not focus on the similarities instead of the differences? Why is very important because they why leads us to the critical theory training that we have all had subtly behind us throughout all levels of education. Critical theory demands destruction of traditional power (white males) and "divisiveness" is one tactic used to achieve that end.

I myself am a skeptic of allopathic medicine but I am not trying to draw a line in the sand here between alternative medicine and the allopathic system, I am trying to build a bridge. The entire reason I am skeptical of vaccination is because of the doctors/medical authorities knee jerk reaction to well pointed and obvious questions that go unanswered due to the fact that the science of vaccination is certainly no where near "settled". If the scientists where like "um, we are not sure so we will look into it and get back to you", that would be a different reaction, but they are ragingly intolerant to vaccination skepticism which makes me think for myself...so the words "pro-vax" or "anti-vax" never come into use with me because they are polarizing terms used to divide us.

Xenophobia is another word that is bullshit. It is natural and healthy to be skeptical and worried about the other tribe stealing your food and your women. If you weren't worried about it the other tribe would take over your tribe and dominate your women and children so the word "xenophobia" is just another bullshit term designed to make whites feel guilty for having their shit together.

Orwell's doublespeak and newspeak is on full display and again, great observation OP.

I believe you've started to transcend the dichotomy of everything that's pushed on us every day. Yes, gmo can be good. Broccoli is the result of selective breeding (thanks r/TIL) and is quite good for you. Putting jellyfish DNA into my apples? Please don't.

yep if you subscribe then automatically you are inserting yourself into a group they already have control over

inserting yourself into a group they already have control over

absolutely...think for yourself and if you can't, get educated so you can...don't just join a group that is going to do the thinking for you!

eading simply by example is best; or guiding without telling someone what to do

This is what I do. Lead by example and then some fearlessness in engaging with people when it comes toime to voice your opinion but without preaching or talking down to people.

But your own awareness is the most important and once you have that its all about how you manipulate (yes full on Machiavellian manipulation!) the people around you. In regards to vaccines I always bring up health freedom and the freedom to choose what medical procedure you or your children will go through or engage with. The fascists want to take that right away from you so it is very important that this "fight" be fought but not with the adverserial approach but looking for common ground...like freedom.

This comment has made my day thoughtpixie and is absolutely reasonable and sane. Those who want to make vaccines (or any medicines) mandatory need to schooled.

Me too. Sometimes I feel like I am taking crazy pills and that is the importance of this fight for those who believe in health freedom, so that others who believe in freedom can know that there are many many people out there who agree with them and that the media's agenda does not defend freedom but pushes propaganda to encourage a type of modern fascism...for our own safety.

And you are absolutely right...it is a conditioned behaviour and that puts "media awareness" into the same priority as health freedom as the masses continue to believe what the MSM wants them to despite logic and reason.

people are super happy to debate the freedom of bearing arms but debating mandatory vaccines, no debate-

I use the "my body, my choice" argument with people as people also seem to think it is their god given right to abort babies at any stage of the pregnancy. Which they mostly do have the right to do...so if "my body, my choice" is an effective argument to abort unborn babies why can't it be used to argue health freedom concerning vaccines to protect babies from unwanted medical procedures?

Great link. It is a lie in the media that anti-vaxxers have contributed to these outbreaks. And yes!... "Education, education, education."

That should be our mantra, and it is, except you have to add "governmental approved academic and corporate captured" to the word education and then education is ok for the general public.

Of course you have herd (sic) that herd immunity with vaccination is bunk...https://youtu.be/_KhofzZ-ke8

Suzanne Humphries is one of my favourite doctors. Her polio and vaccination you tube video is also extremely informative as it rejects the myth that smallpox and polio were "eliminated by the vaccine"...such a huge lie! https://youtu.be/Twch-T-n8Ns

Good post OP.

Am I a per-situation-based vaxer?

I am not a fan of "must vaccinate on schedule", like there is something wrong with a less-aggressive; spread-out inoculation.

My cat was given Rabies, leukemia and FVRCP boosters all in one day. He became very sick and required steroid therapy and hundreds of dollars to get better.

Since then, I have paced-out the boosters and have had no problems...

Kill me now

I never considered if pet anti-vax was a thing.

My problem with the topic is that it is basically one side that mocks people who say anything other than vaccines are 100% safe. Which, of course they're not. People post all the time about various vaccine damages, etc etc.

Consider that vaccinating your pet could be a vector by which to infect you.

I am a person that wants safe vaccines. Some of the current vaccines have questionable ingredients that I do not want to put into my body.

Of course, it’s same reason Trump can endorse candidates for office by saying “loves our vets, strong border, 2nd amendment” and instantly the candidate is a shoe-in for primaries. People are easily swayed by partisan stances.

Move the issues from being polarizing and talk about compromise across party-lines assuming the 2 party system isn’t going anywhere. Similar to how local governments hold town-hall meetings, the will of the people needs to be heard and taken into consideration. The abolishment of PACs and lobbying would essentially take the money out of politics, ensuring that politicians work for our interests, rather than the interests of their constituents (where they earn the majority of campaign funds).

Flake made an interesting point the other day, staying plainly without hesitating that there is not way he could have delayed the FBI investigation if he was up for re-election. That says a lot about the state of politics in our country, and things need to change fast.

" But I’m definitely also not pro-any jab anyone wants to sell the world that cures a problem that may have not even been a big problem before billions of dollars could be made from said problem. "

This. The CDC's own data show that most of the major diseases we get vaccinated for were already on the way out and mortality was near zero before the vaccines were introduced. Am I the only person on Reddit who remembers that chicken pox, measles and mumps were once considered a normal part of childhood? When those vaccines first came out, no one was getting them because the diseases were nothing to worry about. Doctors finally had to start scaring parents with how dangerous these diseases were to get them to vaccinate their kids.

I looked at my kids' vaccination records the other night. My daughter was born in 1988, my son in 1991. My daughter received 17 vaccinations total by the time she was in high school, and my son 21. And now I believe they're somewhere around 70 vaccinations by the time kids reach high school. That's a lot of vaccinations.

Exactly. Immune for life. Vaccines don't work that way. Measles and chicken pox are very similar in appearance but definitely different diseases. Mumps is very different. I've also read that being infected with these diseases and overcoming them without medical intervention provides other health benefits throughout your life.

Of course it is, this makes you pick a side, and the moment you pick a side, it is you against them, you can ridicule them because they are dumb and you know better, thanks to your social media bubble, most of your peers feel the same way.

This eliminates open communication on the topic where both sides would learn something.

I'm pro-choice. :shrug:

obviously this was created artificially by the media and PR campaigns. they did hire PR firms to destroy the reputation of anyone questioning vaccine safety.

check this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pz_td2pcMco#t=25m

they created the anti-vax narrative to discredit the victims and cover-up the massive damage that their unsafe vaccination program has done. just follow the money, as always.

https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/96nvut/vaccination_the_red_pill_and_the_blue_pill/

I always got the impression that this topic was so heated and divided because the idea of vaccine injury is a very scary one. Often with ideas/concepts that induce fear, people get heated and shut down to hearing the possibility (never mind if it’s actually true).

This type divide and reaction often happens with 9-1-1 too. The very mention of an idea that 9-1-1 did not occur how the narrative says it did, many people get angry and shut down conversation. This is because even hearing about such a possibility incites deep fear and loss of possible safety.

Now back to vaccines, IF it were true vaccines did cause damage, that means people could be actively being harmed. That means you could have been hurt by it but we’re fortunate not to be. That means you might have put your own children at risk. That might mean that a child you know might not have ended up messed up if it were the vaccines that did it. Then on top of all of that, there is all sorts of additional foundational shattering issues IF vaccines can cause harm. That means the govt probably knows and gives no fucks about you or your family. That means big pharma does not care and their other products might not be good either. That means the medical system could be so vastly flawed that your health and sense of safety there is shattered.

Thing is, these type questions do come up in the subconscious when faced with theories/possibilities. If any topic itself has a lot of heavy repercussions hidden in the context of possibility, most people don’t want to hear about the theory/possibility as it makes them feel uneasy, angry or fearful though often people don’t fully understand why (because the subconscious processes a lot for us very quickly). Some even then swing hard in favor of the side that most protects their safety and will refuse to even listen for a second to a theory that states otherwise.

When usually listening to a theory or possibility on whatever topic (like what your boss is up to, Lizard People theory, Alien theories, theories on tech or economic development) usually has very little impact on someone’s emotional state (you aren’t going to see lots of people becoming irate when presented with such topics regardless of their possible truth), it’s just treated as a story, a curiosity, or if the person feels there is merit, they might file that info away as something to look into. But this does not happen with topics that insight real fear and shake foundational beliefs. Any major topic that becomes so reactionary on a widespread level, it’s almost always a result of underlying fears associated with that theory potentially being true (and again, it has nothing to do with the actual truth of said theory or lack there of, just the idea of the theory itself can be more than enough to cause such an intense adverse reaction).

This is my own personal theory on these type topics, vaccine safety debate being one of them. I’ve looked into this heavily over the years and did a thesis on it in college.

That being said, I absolutely think that on top of what I mentioned above, the media plays it up even further. It helps keep people fighting without ever being able to get deep on anything so they can at least understand each other.

Move the issues from being polarizing and talk about compromise across party-lines assuming the 2 party system isn’t going anywhere. Similar to how local governments hold town-hall meetings, the will of the people needs to be heard and taken into consideration. The abolishment of PACs and lobbying would essentially take the money out of politics, ensuring that politicians work for our interests, rather than the interests of their constituents (where they earn the majority of campaign funds).

Flake made an interesting point the other day, staying plainly without hesitating that there is not way he could have delayed the FBI investigation if he was up for re-election. That says a lot about the state of politics in our country, and things need to change fast.

eading simply by example is best; or guiding without telling someone what to do

This is what I do. Lead by example and then some fearlessness in engaging with people when it comes toime to voice your opinion but without preaching or talking down to people.

But your own awareness is the most important and once you have that its all about how you manipulate (yes full on Machiavellian manipulation!) the people around you. In regards to vaccines I always bring up health freedom and the freedom to choose what medical procedure you or your children will go through or engage with. The fascists want to take that right away from you so it is very important that this "fight" be fought but not with the adverserial approach but looking for common ground...like freedom.